What character should go?

[Lahela]

Pleeeeeeease get rid of Keller! She's tedious as a character, she's unbelievable as a CMO, and it appears that the main purpose of the character is to provide a set of XX chromosomes for the XYs to do battle over

[GoSpikey]

Keller should go to Rodney, if the air lock won't have her.

So must stress in my mind that Lah is not a shipper, phew!

[hedwig]

I voted for Woolsey, not because I don't like him, I do, but he'll never measure up to Sam Carter, and only because I strongly believe Sam is the true leader of Atlantis!

I agree. I can't see him being a leader at all.

[Rocky89]

I agree. I can't see him being a leader at all.

Thank you!

[hedwig]

Thank you!

You're welcome! And, I forgot to add that I think Sam was an excellent leader.

[Rocky89]

All the excuses in the world couldn't make me like Sam Carter. I just wasn't impressed. I don't think she's a compelling character, and yes, I do think she's bland and unlikeable. (You do know I'm talking about the character here, not the actress, right?)

I'm not trying to make you love Sam Carter; I'm just trying to make you understand. Let me ask you something, do you even like AT?

Despite the fact that I know I'm about to get surrounded by a forum of Carter supporters and eaten alive I just had to post and tell you how wrong you are. Carter will not be missed, at least no by me. I will miss her as much as a hole in parachute. Don't get me wrong, I liked her up until season 6 and then she just started to get a little too perfect.

Jonas: Dear God the world is ending again
Jack: That's alright, Carter will sort it. Let's go have a beer

Was there nothing Carter couldn't do? I mean dear God that woman just have the biggest brain in the known universe, she can do anything.

Like I said, not a realistic character.

You know, if you posted that over at one of the Pro-Carter boards, or at Samanda, you would have Carter fans all over you. But this is a natural thread, so your safe, anyway, that third part I bolded just proves a point. That's what made so many fans love her all these years, she didn't use her beauty, or other woman attributes, she used her mind, she went into unknown situations, studied the problem, and used her brain to fix it. She become a role-model to young/older men and woman alike. And you're wrong, Carter will in fact, not theory-- fact be missed by a lot, it's undeniable. If you don't believe me, I could list links to other posts on other threads to prove you wrong. They're even some people on this thread who will miss her.

Let me ask you something, hasn't Rodney been doing the exact same thing in the Pegasus galaxy? In some ways he's an even more unrealistic character than Carter because he's doing what she did, just in another galaxy, with all alien techno. Same thing could be said for MacGyver, but I really like him , Hell, Sam is the modern day, female MacGyver now that I think about it.

Originally Posted by Cautious Explorer
That's the problem with Carter. She didn't lose control, she didn't react much at all. That's what I call a bland character. She's as good as gone already, otherwise she would be at the top of my list to be kicked out of Atlantis.

Originally Posted by johnliz4ever
Of course they didn't do that for Torri, they wanted her gone because she complained (And rightly so) that they weren't doing a thing with her character, and what did they do when they brought Amanda over? Well they turned her into...well Elizabeth. She did basically the same as Elizabeth, you can argue with that all you want but 80% of what she did on Atlantis was what Elizabeth could have done.

Well you see that's kind of the problem here; I'm not saying Torri should not have talked to TPTB, but it's what she did wrong before that. She waited, she waited for the writers to come up with something to do with her character, Torri let the writers decide on what to do, so for 3 years, she was whatever the writers wanted her to be. While Amanda-- she actually didn't like the way Carter was at first, so she took the time, to think of what to do with Sam, she made Carter into more of herself, she made her own character. That's why people say: "No one else could have been Carter", "Amanda really is Carter", Amanda would spend hours reading and researching things in the script to make Carter more realistic.

And no, Carter was not Elizabeth, because Carter had much more experience in both the scientific and military area. This has nothing to do with TH, it's about the character, however this changed and as much as Weir tried to rise to those challenges, she couldn't handle them. it's not her fault, she's just not the right person to lead such a military op (because that's what it became in s2). She was too much of an ineffective leader at times, she had absolutely no experience in dealing with security issues or any issues for that matter except negotiating, yet she tells the head of the military contingent to stay in his room and doesn't even ask his advice. Weir and Sheppard were meant to be co leaders (Sheppard was more the leader at times) but they never really got past their differences. I think the PTB tried to show a bit of conflict between them but it didn’t work out IMO. Weir never instilled any confidence in me as to her leadership abilities, and I don't think Sheppard had a great deal of confidence in her.

Season three TPTB seemed to realise that Weir wasn't really qualified for the job and tried to fix their mistakes but then they didn’t really know what to do with her and I guess the seeds were sown to get rid of her. I don't know whether I can put all the blame on the writing and I do think the actor puts their own stamp on the character and Torri's portrayal of Weir just never appealed to me.. I loved Jessica's portrayal and she instantly came across as a strong capable leader even though she had the same credentials obviously as Torri's Weir. Torri did get a handle on the character, but it wasn't enough and yes bad writing didn’t help but it wasn’t the entire problem.

The idea of having a civilian leader was quite novel but didnt really fit in with how the ptb were taking the show and therefore Weir had an uphill battle proving her worth. She was against military action and preferred negotiation but there wasn't really a place for negotiation so again it didnt leave her character with many options to shine... The only episode where Weir really stood out for me was in The Long Goodbye, where she was given something that seemed to bring her to life and she wasn't Weir... so if Weir does come back in season 5 the only thing I would be interested in seeing, is her in an evil role for a couple of eps. This would really give Torri something to sink her teeth into which she really seems to want and it would be an interesting development for her character

Originally Posted by Cautious Explorer
As to AT, hectic schedule or not, it's the performance that matters. I thought it was lacking. I certainly hope she wasn't giving 110%, because I'd like to think she could do better. But not everyone's taste is the same and I suspect that I simply don't like AT's acting style. It doesn't mean she's bad or good. She's just not to my taste.

Originally Posted by johnliz4ever
I have to praise Amanda for leaving because they were destroying her character. I'm sure she went over to SGA thinking it would be a new opportunity and a chance to explore different parts of her character, obviously when she got into the heart of the show she found out that her character was nothing more than someone to fill in space between Rodney/John scenes.

They definitely did not destroy her, like I said, it was all because she had so much other things going on. Most people forget the whole story, she was shooting the two SG-1 movies, filming for 2 weeks in the arctic, shooting Sanctuary, as well as Atlantis, being a mom, and all while going back and fourth. In time, she would have turned a lot more people around. And she definitely was not space to fill in.

Originally Posted by johnliz4ever
I'm sorry but if you say that again I might loose it. Torri went to TPTB a lot and asked if they were killing her character and ever time they said 'No of course not, we love you' and than after she'd filmed the final scene of the season she got called up the Mallozzi's office and told that she was loosing her job. Just think about that for a moment. That moment she was told she was loosing her job, her friends, a show that she had dedicated 3 years of her life to was gone and it wasn't her decision. That must have been bloody painful for her and it was excruciating for her fans, if she had chosen to leave it wouldn't have hurt so much.

Amanda choose to leave, she choose to put an end to a character she had for 11 years. I'm sure the decision hurt her but at least it was HER decision and I'm sure you guys are hurting too, I have no doubt about that but until you favorite actress/character is pushed out of a show that you love don't come to me saying that we can't possibly know how much you hurt because you are wrong. We know a heck of a lot more than you do.

Very good, you make a few good points here, but I think that's what people have issues with. They let Torri go just like that. But when Amanda wanted to go they fought hard and long to keep her. I'm sorry for saying this, but I'm glad they fought so hard to keep her, and you know what else, she even cried after her last phone call with JM. A lot of fans of at Samanda felt so bad for her. But you're right, I know you're hurting, and we are too.

Let me tell you somehting, ever since I heard Amanda was coming to Atlantis, I read some mean comments online from users who are just jerks. Not just online, but in magazines and stuff. Every comment I read, I felt sick, and mad because she's the kind of person who shows up for work happy with a smile on her face, ready to make things happen, because she genuinely cares about her fans, you want the fans to be happy, I only wish more celebs were like her, and I wish everyone would see her for the sweet and kind hearted person she is. Amanda herself even said she's read a few mean things online too, even here . I can't imagine how bad and hurt Amanda must have felt reading those mean comments, she did say she's read "some discouraging things", and "Internet forums can be bad for your health". But she didn't let that get to her, because she knows she has a lot more Pro-fans than anti's. And then when she made the choice to leave, she was crying after her last phone call. What about her, what kind of pain was she in? Also I found out on this thread, the other day the IOA was letting Sam go-- I can post the link if you want. So I may not know how bad you were hurt, but you cannot even imagaine how hurt I was too! Everything I wrote up there isn't even close in describing how I felt. It's never easy to see your favorite character/actress go. I guess that's what sorta makes us the same.

You know, ever since I heard Woolsey was taking over, hearing on GW he's the new leader, and seeing pics of him with the SGA cast-- I like him, I do, but all I can think is "No, that's wrong, Sam should be standing there, not him" "Sam Carter is the real leader, not Woolsey" IMHO, Same thing when I see Robert. I'm going to tell you something, but first let me STRONGLY, STRONGLY EMPHASIS!!! that I do not agree at all with the anti-Sam threads/comments, because I just don't get it, I could do this 100 years, I could meet 1000 anti-Sam/Amanda people, read 1000's of anti-Sam/Amanda threads, and I'll never understand how anyone could ever say such trash about her, I just don't get it, and no one can ever make me. But I guess I can kinda understand a little better how you guys feel.

Originally Posted by Cautious Explorer
You don't like Weir, I don't like Carter. What's the difference? I'm not trying to change your mind and you're not going to change mine. We each have a right to our opinions.

I actually agree, you said it, you like Weir, I like Carter. You're a Weir fan, I'm a Carter fan, is there anything wrong with that? No. I'm just saying, you shouldn't have to bash a character to make a point. And yes, we do have the right to our own opinions, you think you're right, I think I'm right. Maybe, we're both right?

[Linda06]

Like I said before I just want to hold on to Sam tight, hug her and never let her go and tell her I love her You can love her all you want, I have no/0 problem with her Pro-fans, but she's mine .

(((Amanda looking at me)))

+ + : Move over Jack, I found a real man!
:Whaaaaaaat?. How did I lose her?........ Oh yeah.



Thank you so much too . I was also worried, but she proved to me once again why Sam is such a great character. I'm so going to miss her.

No worries....I love Sam but um.....not in that way

I do have my reservations about Woolsey taking over though.....I hope i'm wrong again but i just don't see how this is gonna work

[hedwig]

I wish I could green you again. You just became my friend on this thread. Btw, who did you vote for?

Even if you couldn't "green" me again, thanks for the thought. Not sure I understand the "who did you vote for?" unless it was who I would vote off the show. And that would be Woolsey. Just don't think he's cut out for a leadership role. I've been a Sam Carter fan ever since I "discovered" SG1, which was only about 5 years ago. I didn't get to see it when it was on Show Time, and then the cable company I was with at the time didn't have SciFi, so when I switched cable companies I played catch-up by starting nearly in the middle of the series and then getting to go back and see earlier stuff. Needless to say, I was hooked. And as I said, been a Sam fan since I first started watching. Would love to be able to go to a convention or two, but sadly that isn't possible ... yet!

[Rocky89]

Even if you couldn't "green" me again, thanks for the thought. Not sure I understand the "who did you vote for?" unless it was who I would vote off the show. And that would be Woolsey. Just don't think he's cut out for a leadership role. I've been a Sam Carter fan ever since I "discovered" SG1, which was only about 5 years ago. I didn't get to see it when it was on Show Time, and then the cable company I was with at the time didn't have SciFi, so when I switched cable companies I played catch-up by starting nearly in the middle of the series and then getting to go back and see earlier stuff. Needless to say, I was hooked. And as I said, been a Sam fan since I first started watching. Would love to be able to go to a convention or two, but sadly that isn't possible ... yet!

Agreed, I like Woolsey, but IMHO I don't think-- I know he'll never be the leader Sam was. I know what you mean, I didn't start watching SG-1 because of Amanda, I actually started watching it because of RDA, because I liked him a lot on Macgyver. But the more I started watching SG-1, the more she grew on me. Amanda not only does a amazing job as Carter, she is Carter. I mean she's super smart, cool, funny, and hot. No other actress could have come close to playing Carter as Amanda has IMO. I could write paragraphs, and pages on how much I love her, which is kinda what I did here . I'm not kidding, look at more old posts from Samanda, they speak for themselves and her I even made 3 awesome sigs dedicated to her. Oh, and I'm glad I now have an ally here.

[Skydiver]

Let's take it easy on your own personal interpretations of what might or might not have happened behind the scenes.

You weren't there, you don't know what really happened. And rumor mongering does no one any good

[Reiko]

So don't go around saying she's bland or unlikeable.

» You're talking about Amanda here. We were talking about the character of Carter.

While Carter on the other doesn't lose control.

» Presisely part of the problem. She suffers from MS syndrome; she's too perfect. She simply just fails to interest me. THere's nothing deep with the character, nothing to keep me hooked, she's smart and pretty and ... zzzzzzzz.

Let me ask you something, do you even like AT?

» This is not about Amanda. This is about Carter. And, boy, if you think they're one and the same, I suggest you step back and sort the differences for awhile.

But this is a natural thread, so your safe, anyway, that third part I bolded just proves a point.

» Not really - you are definately less "safe" out here. I disagree, but alas that's not the point.

And you're wrong, Carter will in fact, not theory-- fact be missed by a lot, it's undeniable.

» Implied talk like that will get you modded and snipped. But since you're a Carter fan, I guess you're safe.

She was too much of an ineffective leader at times, she had absolutely no experience in dealing with security issues or any issues for that matter except negotiating, yet she tells the head of the military contingent to stay in his room and doesn't even ask his advice. Weir and Sheppard were meant to be co leaders (Sheppard was more the leader at times) but they never really got past their differences. I think the PTB tried to show a bit of conflict between them but it didn’t work out IMO. Weir never instilled any confidence in me as to her leadership abilities, and I don't think Sheppard had a great deal of confidence in her.

» Wait a second - I cannot emphasize how much I disagree with those bolded statement. With Weir gone, I truly doubt Sheppard will ever have another leader he could have as much faith, trust, and confidence as he did with Weir. They were coleaders, and it worked well.

I'm sorry for saying this, but I'm glad they fought so hard to keep her, and you know what else, she even cried after her last phone call with JM. What about her, what kind of pain was she in?

» Oh, I understand. JM is a big, mean man.

Let me tell you somehting, ever since I heard Amanda was coming to Atlantis, I read some mean comments online from users who are just jerks.

» Once again, I have issues with Carter, not Amanda. But chances are, I'm probably one of those "users that are just jerks".

[Jumper_One]

» Presisely part of the problem. She suffers from MS syndrome; she's too perfect. She simply just fails to interest me. THere's nothing deep with the character, nothing to keep me hooked, she's smart and pretty and ... zzzzzzzz.

did you watch SG-1?

» Wait a second - I cannot emphasize how much I disagree with those bolded statement. With Weir gone, I truly doubt Sheppard will ever have another leader he could have as much faith, trust, and confidence as he did with Weir. They were coleaders, and it worked well.

I'd disagree but I think you're right, especially since Woolsey replaces Sam. no matter how much he'll change Shep's never gonna trust him the way he trusted Weir and Sam imo

[Rocky89]

» You're talking about Amanda here. We were talking about the character of Carter.

I'm just trying to point out both sides. It's how I work.

» Presisely part of the problem. She suffers from MS syndrome; she's too perfect. She simply just fails to interest me. THere's nothing deep with the character, nothing to keep me hooked, she's smart and pretty and ... zzzzzzzz.

I have to agree with my friend Jumper_One, have you ever seen SG-1? I need to think about that statement for a while because I'm confused.

» This is not about Amanda. This is about Carter. And, boy, if you think they're one and the same, I suggest you step back and sort the differences for awhile.

Of course I know thery're not the same person, but some people are blaming Amanda for things that are just dumb.

» Not really - you are definately less "safe" out here. I disagree, but alas that's not the point.

I said that because this isn't exactly a "Pro" or "Anti" thread, so we can talk about anyone which ever way we want. But keep it PG .

» Implied talk like that will get you modded and snipped. But since you're a Carter fan, I guess you're safe.

Thanks......I think.

» Wait a second - I cannot emphasize how much I disagree with those bolded statement. With Weir gone, I truly doubt Sheppard will ever have another leader he could have as much faith, trust, and confidence as he did with Weir. They were coleaders, and it worked well.

Yeah, but at times it seemed John was more in charge.

» Oh, I understand. JM is a big, mean man.

I meant she was crying because she had ended a big part of her life that lasted 11 years, that's why she was crying. Didn't you read her interview?

» Once again, I have issues with Carter, not Amanda. But chances are, I'm probably one of those "users that are just jerks".

I'm going to have to quote myself here- I actually agree, you said it, you like Carson, I like Carter. You're a Carson fan, I'm a Carter fan, is there anything wrong with that? No. I'm just saying, you shouldn't have to bash a character to make a point. And yes, we do have the right to our own opinions, you think you're right, I think I'm right. Maybe, we're both right?

[Laura Dove]

» Presisely part of the problem. She suffers from MS syndrome; she's too perfect. She simply just fails to interest me. THere's nothing deep with the character, nothing to keep me hooked, she's smart and pretty and ... zzzzzzzz.

did you watch SG-1?

Weren't we supposed to be talking about Atlantis in this thread? As much as you miss SG-1, it doesn't make Carter's character better in SGA.

I really hope Amanda Tapping can do better, because in SGA she barely displays 2 or 3 facial expressions, one of them being plain neutral emotionless face.

[stclare]

I still will go with Larrin and/or Keller if she becomes nothing but a plot device for love interests