The Anti Season 4 Thread (Spoilers). For complaints and misgivings ONLY.

[Easter Lily]

I think the problem with Teyla is a systemic one... the way in which TPTB write women in this franchise leaves a lot to be desired.
As others have said, the problems started right from Day One. I don't think they really knew what to do with her and the Athosians. The potential was always there to use that connection, to really "exploit" her "alien" qualities for some good story telling. But they didn't use it to their benefit. Frankly speaking they've left a lot of stuff too little too late.
Personally I don't mind the pregnant arc except I'm not sure of where they're going with that and I sense that they're not entirely sure about that either.

I haven't been on GW much lately but even though I've been away for a few months, it seems that we keep coming back to the same problems over and over again. I can't help feeling that they are putting sticking plaster on all the problems that have beset the show but haven't dealt with the fundamental issues of storytelling and characterization. Chopping and changing characters isn't the answer obviously because the show is limping along from one episode to the next. The lack of consistency is showing in something like Trio, when three characters make such demeaning and derisory comments about a colleague who has proven to be a valuable asset in many a tight spots.

While I continue to be mostly entertained, I am very disappointed by the lack of direction that continues to plague the show. I feel it much more in S4 than I have ever felt in previous seasons (although the trend began in S2).
I don't just want to be entertained... I want to be challenged too. That's the reason why I watch scifi and not Two and a Half Men.

[g.o.d]

Wrong thread.

He's right. I would do a same thing

[jenks]

Wrong thread.

No it's not.

[Integrabyte]

What is up with this Kindred episode? After so much time they suddenly remembered Teyla's people? Come on, not even Conan can last so long in captivity . Hang on, Conan and Kanaan rhyme, innit? . Amazing cock up from TPTB. They think that with a couple flashes from Missing we'll feel all good and ignore the time they filled between? Gimme a break

[Falcon Horus]

What mistakes? Mallozzi can do no wrong (Speaking of that, does any one have that twelve commandments of tptb list? It was here in the anti thread way back when but i'm too lazy to find it)

The 10 Commandments of TPTB:

Spoiler:

1 I am the PTB, your God who brought you out of the land of bad TV, from the house of soap-opera’s. You shall have no other PTB’s before Me

2 Do not manip an image or any likeness of what is in the heavens above

3 Do not swear falsely by the name of the PTB

4 Remember the hiatus and keep it holy

5 Honor Joe Mallozzi and Paul Mullie

6 Do not kill the show

7 Do not watch other shows

8 Do not download

9 Do not bear false witness against the pro’s

10 Do not covet the return of beloved characters

OK, in spite of the fact that I've actually enjoyed the last two episodes for the most part, I think this is probably the most appropriate place to post something that Midway made me think about - again.

<snip for length>

What do you all think?

Teyla has been neglected since day one. She was supposed to be an interesting character and they screwed her over like wow.
If your name isn't Sheppard or McKay, you just don't get the development you need.

I highly doubt, and I find that very sad cause Teyla is after Kate my favorite character, that there's any way to safe her. I'm afraid she'll end up next on the chopping block. I don't know when or how... but they will continue to neglect her.

When TPTB said they were finally going to have her developed in season 4, I thought ... Finally! But they didn't ... they just made up a story to get rid of the Athosians, whom we hadn't seen since... when was the last time we saw them? They gave Teyla her token episode, which she hadn't gotten since The Gift in season 1 and that was it...
Look, we still know who she is! - Yeah right, try selling that to someone else who believes your ever word!

Now, I'm happy for Rachel having the kidlet... Though I'm less thrilled with how TPTB have handled the pregnancy in the show. It just plain sucks. TPTB have no freakin' idea what to do with the character. They keep telling themselves they know, but they don't.... not a clue, with any of the characters for that matter or the show.

I can predict what will happen in season 5 ... Sheppard and McKay will grab all the screentime and stories, and nothing is left for anyone else. And we're not Rachel, who is happy with what they have for season 5, but it's widely known that expressing you're not too happy with what they give you, will cut the lifespan of your character in half, or something along those lines.

Okay, I think my rant is over now... Sorry, I don't usually write all that much. I'm just sick and tired of being strung up like stupid fan. I'm not stupid, damn it. I pay frakkin' attention!

[mcbarr]

If your name isn't Sheppard or McKay, you just don't get the development you need.

Even those don't get proper development. It's funny how TPTB mishandle even their favorites.

[Killdeer]

Teyla has been neglected since day one. She was supposed to be an interesting character and they screwed her over like wow.
If your name isn't Sheppard or McKay, you just don't get the development you need.

I highly doubt, and I find that very sad cause Teyla is after Kate my favorite character, that there's any way to safe her. I'm afraid she'll end up next on the chopping block. I don't know when or how... but they will continue to neglect her.

When TPTB said they were finally going to have her developed in season 4, I thought ... Finally! But they didn't ... they just made up a story to get rid of the Athosians, whom we hadn't seen since... when was the last time we saw them? They gave Teyla her token episode, which she hadn't gotten since The Gift in season 1 and that was it...
Look, we still know who she is! - Yeah right, try selling that to someone else who believes your ever word!

Now, I'm happy for Rachel having the kidlet... Though I'm less thrilled with how TPTB have handled the pregnancy in the show. It just plain sucks. TPTB have no freakin' idea what to do with the character. They keep telling themselves they know, but they don't.... not a clue, with any of the characters for that matter or the show.

I can predict what will happen in season 5 ... Sheppard and McKay will grab all the screentime and stories, and nothing is left for anyone else. And we're not Rachel, who is happy with what they have for season 5, but it's widely known that expressing you're not too happy with what they give you, will cut the lifespan of your character in half, or something along those lines.

Okay, I think my rant is over now... Sorry, I don't usually write all that much. I'm just sick and tired of being strung up like stupid fan. I'm not stupid, damn it. I pay frakkin' attention!

I'm not sure it's so much how much screentime they give her, as what they do with it.

I've been thinking about this since I posted last night. I know their options were limited with the pregnancy and all, but the truth is Teyla is still playing support. I'd be interested in your screentime numbers for S4 when you get done with them, because I'd be willing to bet that Carter and Keller got more screentime in the episodes they were in than Teyla did. I think you're right that they really don't know what to do with her.

However, and this is what's got me concerned - even in episodes where Teyla played a large part, like Missing and Spoils of War, I don't think we really found out anything about her that really developed her character or made her more interesting. I don't think Ronon has gotten a lot more screentime than Teyla, but I think they've used that screentime to develop him more as a character. While Teyla to a great extent, in spite of Rachel's acting skill, is still rather stiff and one-note. Possibly even more so this year.

I'm not sure screentime by itself will help at this point. Frankly, I think they need to drop the focus on Teyla's personal life next year, and focus on her as a member of the team. They need to work from that angle, and start building her up as a team member, start justifying her presense on the team, rather than having her stand around in the background on missions.

One thing that has me concerned is that the writers seem to equate development with personal life, and that's not necessarily the case. (In fact, I think they almost destroyed Sam when they started focusing on her personal life in S7). Not that we can't learn about a character's background, but the most important thing is to establish them as an important credible presense in their role on the show. They made that mistake with Keller - they gave us too much background information on her too fast, trying to make her a sympathetic character, rather than simply focusing on establishing her as a credible presense in the expedition. With Teyla, we really don't need more stories about the Athosians. They're really not that interesting anyway (IMO). Honestly, while I like Teal'c, I never really enjoyed his Jaffa episodes either. I enjoyed his episodes more when he was acting as part of the team. And I think they need to do the same with Teyla. Focus on her as a team member. Give her stories as a team member, a team member who is native to the Pegasus Galaxy.

Think about it. Sheppard and McKay have all sorts of interesting things happen to them on missions (Sheppard gets changed into a bug, for instance. Rodney gets hit with an ascension machine, although he wasn't technically on a mission at that time.) But for Teyla to have a story, they think they need to make it about the Athosians, or about her personal life. Why not have her be the one that something happens to on missions?

I'm not sure if that makes any sense or not.

[Falcon Horus]

Even those don't get proper development. It's funny how TPTB mishandle even their favorites.

True.

I'm not sure it's so much how much screentime they give her, as what they do with it.

I wasn't really talking about screentime, but for a purely selfish reason, I wouldn't mind seeing more of Teyla.

...but the truth is Teyla is still playing support.

Oh yes, she most definitely is more support than main.

I'd be interested in your screentime numbers for S4 when you get done with them, because I'd be willing to bet that Carter and Keller got more screentime in the episodes they were in than Teyla did. I think you're right that they really don't know what to do with her.

Well, I'm getting there... need to finish season 3 (4 more episodes until its end).

However, and this is what's got me concerned - even in episodes where Teyla played a large part, like Missing and Spoils of War, I don't think we really found out anything about her that really developed her character or made her more interesting. I don't think Ronon has gotten a lot more screentime than Teyla, but I think they've used that screentime to develop him more as a character. While Teyla to a great extent, in spite of Rachel's acting skill, is still rather stiff and one-note. Possibly even more so this year.

I don't think, other than Kanaan, who came out of nowhere and would never have existed if Rachel hadn't been pregnant or if they had decided to shoot around it, we have learned anything new about her. And she's also no longer a member of the team who goes off to have fun in the Pegasus Galaxy (if we're lucky). Teyla has become even more a background character than she already was and more screentime or words/lines won't make a difference to change that.

Frankly, I think they need to drop the focus on Teyla's personal life next year, and focus on her as a member of the team. They need to work from that angle, and start building her up as a team member, start justifying her presense on the team, rather than having her stand around in the background on missions.

Yup, I think that would open up some interesting cans... preferably without worms in them.

Give her stories as a team member, a team member who is native to the Pegasus Galaxy.

That would be nice.

Think about it. Sheppard and McKay have all sorts of interesting things happen to them on missions (Sheppard gets changed into a bug, for instance. Rodney gets hit with an ascension machine, although he wasn't technically on a mission at that time.) But for Teyla to have a story, they think they need to make it about the Athosians, or about her personal life. Why not have her be the one that something happens to on missions?

For now, you'll have to read fanfic to see stuff happening to her, cause I don't think we will see it any time soon on the show.

[parisindy]

You've seen him in more films than I have. I've only seen Billy Elliot and Nickolas Nickleby. But he made a great impression, very talented actor.

funny cause Nickolas Nickleby is the onei haven't seen.. is it good?

[marielabbott]

Even those don't get proper development. It's funny how TPTB mishandle even their favorites.

Funny in a really sad, sad way.

funny cause Nickolas Nickleby is the onei haven't seen.. is it good?

I really like it. It is a bit sentimental in spots. Dickens can be that way sometimes. But Jamie is terrific in it and I really enjoyed it.

I'm going to see Jumper this afternoon--I better go or I'll miss the previews.

[Falcon Horus]

I just watched Sunday and I had to chuckle at Carson's memorial. He had a bigger turn-up of people dead than Carter had alive when she arrived in Atlantis.

[mcbarr]

I was watching The Road Not Taken a couple of days ago, and not only AU Sam ends up dead, but we also find out Lorne is the leader of SG-1 in the screwed up parallel Earth. Lol, certain things are not meant to be.

PS - If I'm not mistaken, AU Sam was married to McKay in that ep.

[silly sally]

I was watching The Road Not Taken a couple of days ago, and not only AU Sam ends up dead, but we also find out Lorne is the leader of SG-1 in the screwed up parallel Earth. Lol, certain things are not meant to be.

PS - If I'm not mistaken, AU Sam was married to McKay in that ep.

Actually was divorced. I've never understood why it wasn't Shep the SG-1 leader?

[Erised]

There is no direction for Teyla, so let's get rid of her!!! *TPTB's hysterical laughs*

Like with Weir

Teyla is the only decent female character left. If she goes, I go.

[Killdeer]

Teyla is the only decent female character left. If she goes, I go.

I don't think she's going anywhere. I'm just scared of what they've got planned for her.