Season 4 & Dr. Weir Discussion Thread ( Spoilers)

[JesterDala]

If she's incompetent, as you say she is all the time, it's the fault of the people who write the show. Take your complaints to them. While you're at it, tell them to get a backbone and actually learn that women can be feminine and powerful, like Weir without having to beat the crap out of people. It seems they can't write women without a weapon, as proven by the fact that the best ep for Weir was probably The Long Goodbye. It's like they go "OMG! Woman. That scene's going to make her emotional! Quick! Give her a gun and let her shoot something." Works well with Teyla and Carter being warrior/military, which I think is why the writers prefer them. They don't know how to negotiate themselves, so they have no idea how to write negotiation for Weir, and by the time they finally try to do it, they've missed a dozen other opportunities to do it.

In bold - it's what I've been thinking the entire discussion. Because Atlantis is a sci-fi show, the writers will incorporate the more physical characters into the stories more often simply because of the nature of the show. Which I think is a contributing factor to her fewer number of eps this coming season. IMO, the character of Elizabeth Weir had so much more potential but was wasted because of a twisted perception the writer's have. Women in sci-fi (women in general, for that matter) don't have to constantly be fighting with the big boys to prove themselves. They're just as much of a competant person if they can't do the physical things others can do. Bottom line, it wasn't her job to.

If that makes you like her less, that's fine. As long as the S4 & Dr. Weir thread stays on topic, you can express your opinion, whether it be pro or con.

[vaberella]

Oh, come on. You enjoy the provocation. I for one can't understand why if someone hates a character so much they'd choose to write about her constantly, to the point of taking up almost a page and colour coding your answers, enlarging font, etc. It's provocative, it's the online equivilent of yelling at people, and it's at the point where it looks like obsession. I've admitted I don't like Teyla. I also find Ronon boring. But I can find much better things to do with my time than going into every thread there is to tell people why THEY shouldn't like them. It's a waste of time.

You don't like her? We know that. It's your perogative. It's also the perogative of the people who like her to like her. You've said you won't change your view, so constantly beating on the "this is why I hate her" drum isn't going to change the views of others.

If she's incompetent, as you say she is all the time, it's the fault of the people who write the show. Take your complaints to them. While you're at it, tell them to get a backbone and actually learn that women can be feminine and powerful, like Weir without having to beat the crap out of people. It seems they can't write women without a weapon, as proven by the fact that the best ep for Weir was probably The Long Goodbye. It's like they go "OMG! Woman. That scene's going to make her emotional! Quick! Give her a gun and let her shoot something." Works well with Teyla and Carter being warrior/military, which I think is why the writers prefer them. They don't know how to negotiate themselves, so they have no idea how to write negotiation for Weir, and by the time they finally try to do it, they've missed a dozen other opportunities to do it.

I see class is in session for GateWorld Elementary. How did I know, I would have to deal with drama eventually in regards to my posts?! I have to deal with presumptions and assumptions about my post and about my likes and dislike, as though these people are me. A person can post or have a discussion in peace without being hit in the face by claims and accusations and always by the same group. ~sigh~

And just for clarification, I probably like her more than most her fans, since I talk about her so much. Did you ever think of that? I think not.

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As for your comment in bold, I must ask...are you a fan of the character Dr. Elizabeth Weir?! If you are...then that would mean the writers do know how to write for women for the female characters of SGA to have fans, but also female fans at that. I don't think the writers wouldn't have been successful if they didn't do something right. I have to say these kind of claims do tend to annoy me, as I find it to be a slap in the face to those who fans of the females of SGA for someone to say the writers can write women, let alone women in power. Obviously they can. There are a multitude of factors that play a role and I find that the above accusation plays little to no role.

[Southern Red]

Oh, come on. You enjoy the provocation. I for one can't understand why if someone hates a character so much they'd choose to write about her constantly, to the point of taking up almost a page and colour coding your answers, enlarging font, etc. It's provocative, it's the online equivilent of yelling at people, and it's at the point where it looks like obsession. I've admitted I don't like Teyla. I also find Ronon boring. But I can find much better things to do with my time than going into every thread there is to tell people why THEY shouldn't like them. It's a waste of time.

You don't like her? We know that. It's your perogative. It's also the perogative of the people who like her to like her. You've said you won't change your view, so constantly beating on the "this is why I hate her" drum isn't going to change the views of others.

If she's incompetent, as you say she is all the time, it's the fault of the people who write the show. Take your complaints to them. While you're at it, tell them to get a backbone and actually learn that women can be feminine and powerful, like Weir without having to beat the crap out of people. It seems they can't write women without a weapon, as proven by the fact that the best ep for Weir was probably The Long Goodbye. It's like they go "OMG! Woman. That scene's going to make her emotional! Quick! Give her a gun and let her shoot something." Works well with Teyla and Carter being warrior/military, which I think is why the writers prefer them. They don't know how to negotiate themselves, so they have no idea how to write negotiation for Weir, and by the time they finally try to do it, they've missed a dozen other opportunities to do it.

That last part is exactly what I think also.

Did anyone ever think that maybe they wrote her the way she is on purpose intending to show what happens when a leader gets in over their head? And somewhere along the way they got too deep into the war scenario and decided the whole shebang needed to be militarized. Thus the comment that a change had to be made or some such.

Personally, I trust TPTB in this instance. They created a character, established somewhat perfunctory credentials for her, and asked us to accept their decision to put her in charge. I've never really wondered about that, as I have never wondered if Rodney is really smarter than Zalenka or why Caldwell is just a glorified bus driver. I accept the characters at face value and go with it.

[Celcool]

Oh, come on. You enjoy the provocation. I for one can't understand why if someone hates a character so much they'd choose to write about her constantly, to the point of taking up almost a page and colour coding your answers, enlarging font, etc. It's provocative, it's the online equivilent of yelling at people, and it's at the point where it looks like obsession. I've admitted I don't like Teyla. I also find Ronon boring. But I can find much better things to do with my time than going into every thread there is to tell people why THEY shouldn't like them. It's a waste of time.

You don't like her? We know that. It's your perogative. It's also the perogative of the people who like her to like her. You've said you won't change your view, so constantly beating on the "this is why I hate her" drum isn't going to change the views of others.

If she's incompetent, as you say she is all the time, it's the fault of the people who write the show. Take your complaints to them. While you're at it, tell them to get a backbone and actually learn that women can be feminine and powerful, like Weir without having to beat the crap out of people. It seems they can't write women without a weapon, as proven by the fact that the best ep for Weir was probably The Long Goodbye. It's like they go "OMG! Woman. That scene's going to make her emotional! Quick! Give her a gun and let her shoot something." Works well with Teyla and Carter being warrior/military, which I think is why the writers prefer them. They don't know how to negotiate themselves, so they have no idea how to write negotiation for Weir, and by the time they finally try to do it, they've missed a dozen other opportunities to do it.

What else can I say but "right on"! *applauds*

That last part is exactly what I think also.

Did anyone ever think that maybe they wrote her the way she is on purpose intending to show what happens when a leader gets in over their head? And somewhere along the way they got too deep into the war scenario and decided the whole shebang needed to be militarized. Thus the comment that a change had to be made or some such.

Personally, I trust TPTB in this instance. They created a character, established somewhat perfunctory credentials for her, and asked us to accept their decision to put her in charge. I've never really wondered about that, as I have never wondered if Rodney is really smarter than Zalenka or why Caldwell is just a glorified bus driver. I accept the characters at face value and go with it.

That's it. I also never questioned her actions, the writers had a story to tell, who else would they use most to tell it then the leader? With her making perfect decisions all the time it would get boring. She may have made some bad decisions but they always wrote it in the way that she always had best intentions at heart and did it with the support of her subordinates. They made those decisions together.

[Chrysalis]

And just for clarification, I probably like her more than most her fans, since I talk about her so much. Did you ever think of that? I think not.

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As for your comment in bold, I must ask...are you a fan of the character Dr. Elizabeth Weir?! If you are...then that would mean the writers do know how to write for women for the female characters of SGA to have fans, but also female fans at that. I don't think the writers wouldn't have been successful if they didn't do something right. I have to say these kind of claims do tend to annoy me, as I find it to be a slap in the face to those who fans of the females of SGA for someone to say the writers can write women, let alone women in power. Obviously they can. There are a multitude of factors that play a role and I find that the above accusation plays little to no role.

You have missed the point completely. We all know you can't stand the character. You've said it over and over. Why do you spend all your time moaning about her instead of writing positive things about the characters you like, who will actually be part of season four? Surely you have better things to do with your time than write essays about why the character is wrong and needed to be dumped. She's gone for crying out loud.

As for your second comment -- I don't think I'll be the only one who has problems when it comes to comprehension there. You're 'talking' around in circles.

I personally have NO ISSUE with Weir. I like the character. I like that she's a civilian. I like that she and Sheppard aren't butting heads all the time. All the things you hate about her? I like them. What I'm saying is that all of you anti Weir people are all "Oh she's a crap negotiator, the others think she's a joke" I seem to remember you saying in another thread that Teyla and Ronon were rolling their eyes at her in one of the eps when she tranlated something from Ancient. Um. I don't know what you were watching, but I didn't see that. YOU are the one who has an issue with the character, and as I said, if YOU seem to think she's so crap, you should take it up with the writers instead of telling everyone else that she's a **** character and they shouldn't like her.

It's impossible to be a Weir fan around here these days. I'm sick of having to hide my sig in case someone sees it and gets on my case, just because they think it's fun to shoot fish in barrels or the like.

My two favourite characters are gone. It's the same for a lot of the anti people. Your two favourites are still there. Go and celebrate that instead of rubbing it in for all the people who've lost their favourite characters.

And since this thread is supposed to be discussing Weir and season four (I don't want to argue with you about semantics. This is in the season four section of the board, therefore it is a season four thread) all of this dragging things up from past seasons to try to convince people that Weir is the spawn of satan is pretty much a waste of time.

[Skydiver]

this mod's PERSONAL opinion

i'm so bloody sick and tired of you guys bickering and fighting that i'd love to ban the lot of you.

my professional opinion....i don't have a few hours to spend wading through this to see if people stayed within the rules they not only agreed to when tehy joined this forum but also HAVE BEEN MEMBERS LONG ENOUGH TO KNOW. so i'm shutting it down.

when it gets open is when me or one of the other mods have time to AGAIN look over your posts because so many of you are frakking incapable of following the rules and respecting others.