Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Anuna]

I know! Who else could he have meant? No one! I about choked when I read that interview the first time. Or screamed. Maybe both. If he hadn't said/done stuff like that before, I would have said that he was doing it just to torment fans, but I prefer to think of him as too nice for that. But whether he intended it or not, it still has that torment-y quality (woohoo, alright for making up a word there!) that makes me want to scream every time I read it. Because he had it! He had exactly the kind of situation he was talking about! Ahhh! *pulls on hair in frustration*

You know, I think he is too smart for not knowing what so many people saw on screen. Also, I think he has too much integrity to maliciously yank his fan's chains. I prefer to see this tidbit in this interview as a proof that he was consciously playing Sheppard like someone who loved and then lost. If anyone wants to challenge me and say that he was actually jealous at certain baby daddy, I'll gleefuly say that jealous men don't behave like widowers.

Sparky wins. Period.

[Scary Kitty]

Good afternoon, Sparkies!

T-minus 2 hours to Conversion and Aurora!

[Wormhole]

Good afternoon, Sparkies!

T-minus 2 hours to Conversion and Aurora!

Will try and be here for Conversion.

[Scary Kitty]

Anyway, on the subject of John being jealous of Teyla. At least partly. After our recent discussion of actor motivation etc. I decided to rewatch The Rising with the commentary because it's JF and Martin Wood. Very interesting and getting to hear that dirty laugh of Joe's was worth it. Lots I had forgotten but one comment by JF confirmed what I said about what he was told his relationship with Teyla would be. MW said something about Teyla and John being possibly in a relationship and Joe said that it surprised him that a year later (meaning all of S1 had already aired) people were still asking him about his character's relationship with Teyla. He seemed very puzzled that it wasn't clear. Now I took that to mean he thought it was obvious and he assumed at some point they would get together on the show. So there you go. All of them, and I'm including actors, TPTB, directors, probably the crew just assumed everyone was on board with Sheyla. Maybe not the editors, heh.

Now this many years later, I wonder what he would say. I hope someone asks him at one of the cons he's doing. Even if we don't like the answer, I want to know if he always thought Sheyla would happen and why. I have always wanted someone to stand up and say, "You know Joe, many many people would rather John have had a romantic relationship with Elizabeth. You and Rachel don't have romantic chemistry on screen. Sorry. But you did with Torri. Why didn't they pursue it?" Who's brave out there? Anybody?

Anybody going to the con in Vancouver in April? Somebody ask him, damnit!

Seriously, I could definitely see him changing his mind and deciding to go whole-hog for Sparky in Season 4. Lizzie had been thrown to the wolves, Teyla was off having another man's baby, and he's left with lame Kirking with wenches of the week that never goes anywhere. I can well imagine he got really tired of it and decided to do his own thing.

*snort* I know. It's astonishing to me too. Must be a guy thing. But I know Joe at least doesn't necessarily sit and watch the finished product. I had forgotten also how technically tuned in he is and was reminded in this commentary. He's very interested in every aspect of filming, asked MW a lot of good questions about how things were done and I think will be a great director someday. A couple of times MW talked about how they had disagreed on how to play a scene and Joe's take on Sheppard was better than what the script indicated. At some point I think he lost a lot of clout. Maybe it had to do with his strong reaction at a certain point to cast changes.

Sounds like it to me, too.

[Southern Red]

Heh, he (John) and Elizabeth were/are good friends. Loving someone requires friendship, so there. But don't forget that little interview to Stargate Magazine..... I think it was pretty clear he didn't mean Woolsey there, and Carter is taken, so.....

I love these new wallpapers, especially the Vegas one. I think you're improving with every new wallpaper you make, so keep going!

Thanks. I like doing them.

And I agree, he had to mean Elizabeth. Why use the word boss if it was Teyla? And he said something else in an interview at the end of S5 about not having any romance as usual. That shows he had given up on Sheyla.

I can't remember many of them - it was just the terrible combover that stood out, which isn't even obvious in that pic.





I inferred at the time from that commentary that Sheyla was the long term plan. In the context of a bigger arc, one can view the teething problems in s1 as laying the foundation for a relationship (with shoddy materials, but I digress). It seems at some point they just forgot to keep writing for Sheyla. Maybe that's partly to do with the fact that Torri was the female lead, and Shep's boss, so naturally Weir/Shep were going to have many 'alone' scenes together.

One could say that the two-shots of Joe and Torri make them look so close because Torri is so much shorter than Joe, so he can stand over her rather than beside her (when the camera would have to be further back). But the same applies for Sheyla too. And that Shep and Weir having so many scenes together is because they are the leads, and co-leaders to boot. But Shep and Teyla are in the same team

Somewhere along the way with all their intended ship, then 'there is no ship', they got a bit lost. They should have publicly said 'no ship' but continued to write Sheyla. At least it wouldn't look contradictory if at some point they hooked up. At least they would have had an option in s4

The 'no ship' thing confused the issue IMO. It allowed the actors, directors and editors too much leeway with their scenes. Take the CDT commentary, with the 'so, do you think they did it after that' comment. There shouldn't have been room for that interpretation, yet it's right there on screen



Me likey the second one But you've always been more into Shep than I

I said all along that they didn't seem to be writing for Sheyla. And it was pretty obvious that the actors kept forgetting that they were interested in each other. lol Lack of scenes together didn't help either. They just didn't interact much at all ever.

You know, I think he is too smart for not knowing what so many people saw on screen. Also, I think he has too much integrity to maliciously yank his fan's chains. I prefer to see this tidbit in this interview as a proof that he was consciously playing Sheppard like someone who loved and then lost. If anyone wants to challenge me and say that he was actually jealous at certain baby daddy, I'll gleefuly say that jealous men don't behave like widowers.

Sparky wins. Period.

Sounds like a bumper sticker. If all his angst did have to do with Teyla, then he's a pathetic loser and we all know John Sheppard is not pathetic.

So again. Sparky wins. Period.

Will try and be here for Conversion.

Me too depending on the state of my roast beast I am making for din din.

[Scary Kitty]

You know, I think he is too smart for not knowing what so many people saw on screen. Also, I think he has too much integrity to maliciously yank his fan's chains. I prefer to see this tidbit in this interview as a proof that he was consciously playing Sheppard like someone who loved and then lost. If anyone wants to challenge me and say that he was actually jealous at certain baby daddy, I'll gleefuly say that jealous men don't behave like widowers.

Sparky wins. Period.

What SR said. We need to turn that into a bumper sticker.

[Scary Kitty]

By the way, previously unreleased promotional pics from the Season 3 cast photo shoot have been posted. There's at least one new shot for each cast member, and a couple of the entire cast. *drools*

[Flowerbud]

I haven't seen season 4 and 5, but how exactly did John behave? From reading all the posts here, someone wrote that a Sheyla fan asked at a con why John was so harsh to Teyla after she hooked up with Kanaan. His answer that he was jealous doesn't make sense to me. Was John mean to her or just the usual John and Teyla ignoring each other that they did in earlier seasons?

[Erin87]

You know, I think he is too smart for not knowing what so many people saw on screen. Also, I think he has too much integrity to maliciously yank his fan's chains. I prefer to see this tidbit in this interview as a proof that he was consciously playing Sheppard like someone who loved and then lost. If anyone wants to challenge me and say that he was actually jealous at certain baby daddy, I'll gleefuly say that jealous men don't behave like widowers.

Sparky wins. Period.

I do prefer to see it that way too. Cause any other way just extremely sucks.

It definitely does. Whether they like it or not. Yay Sparky! And I'm liking this bumper sticker idea I keep hearing.

[Erin87]

By the way, previously unreleased promotional pics from the Season 3 cast photo shoot have been posted. There's at least one new shot for each cast member, and a couple of the entire cast. *drools*

Yeah, those were definitely drool worthy.

[Flowerbud]

You know, I think he is too smart for not knowing what so many people saw on screen. Also, I think he has too much integrity to maliciously yank his fan's chains. I prefer to see this tidbit in this interview as a proof that he was consciously playing Sheppard like someone who loved and then lost. If anyone wants to challenge me and say that he was actually jealous at certain baby daddy, I'll gleefuly say that jealous men don't behave like widowers.

Sparky wins. Period.

ITA. JF is a straight shooter.

[Scary Kitty]

I haven't seen season 4 and 5, but how exactly did John behave? From reading all the posts here, someone wrote that a Sheyla fan asked at a con why John was so harsh to Teyla after she hooked up with Kanaan. His answer that he was jealous doesn't make sense to me. Was John mean to her or just the usual John and Teyla ignoring each other that they did in earlier seasons?

John was angry with Teyla for going out on missions when she knew she was pregnant, thus endangering her, her baby, and the team. In many respects, it's like how John reacted in The Gift when he wanted her to see Heightmeyer; he was looking out for Teyla as her team leader, and nothing more. Other than that, it was the same ignoring each other like in previous seasons.

In light of what we've seen in JoeF's performance in Seasons 4 & 5 and his more recent comments, most of us have taken his "jealous" comment to mean that John wasn't jealous of Kanaan, he was jealous because he couldn't have his own family with Elizabeth. Sparky wins.

[Scary Kitty]

T-minus 1 hour to post-a-thon!

[Flowerbud]

John was angry with Teyla for going out on missions when she knew she was pregnant, thus endangering her, her baby, and the team. In many respects, it's like how John reacted in The Gift when he wanted her to see Heightmeyer; he was looking out for Teyla as her team leader, and nothing more. Other than that, it was the same ignoring each other like in previous seasons.

That's definitely not jealousy, but more like a commander doing his job.

In light of what we've seen in JoeF's performance in Seasons 4 & 5 and his more recent comments, most of us have taken his "jealous" comment to mean that John wasn't jealous of Kanaan, he was jealous because he couldn't have his own family with Elizabeth. Sparky wins.

Maybe, being the well-mannered guy that he seems to be, JF said what the questioner wanted to hear to satisfy her ship. But to a neutral person like the magazine interviewer, he did not have to give the answer he did. So, yay! Sparky wins.

[Scary Kitty]

That's definitely not jealousy, but more like a commander doing his job.

Exactly, and it's clear that's how it was intended to be seen. But certain people claimed that he was being 'mean' to her, which we all know is utterly ridiculous.

Maybe, being the well-mannered guy that he seems to be, JF said what the questioner wanted to hear to satisfy her ship. But to a neutral person like the magazine interviewer, he did not have to give the answer he did. So, yay! Sparky wins.

In-very-deed.