Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Anuna]

OMG! It's Sparky day!!!!

And since we're talking lyrics, I find these fitting:

Spoiler:

"Ghost Story"

I watch the Western sky
The sun is sinking
The geese are flying South
It sets me thinking

I did not miss you much
I did not suffer
What did not kill me
Just made me tougher

I feel the winter come
His icy sinews
Now in the fire light
The case continues

Another night in court
The same old trial
The same old questions asked
The same denial

The shadows closely run
Like jury members
I look for answers in
The fire's embers

Why was I missing then
That whole December
I give my usual line:
I don't remember

Another winter comes
His icy fingers creep
Into these bones of mine
These memories never sleep

And all these differences
A cloak I borrow
We kept our distances
Why should it follow I must have loved you

What is the force that binds the stars
I wore this mask to hide my scars
What is the power that pulls the tide
I never could find a place to hide

What moves the Earth around the sun
What could I do but run and run and run
Afraid to love, afraid to fail
A mast without a sail

The moon's a fingernail and slowly sinking
Another day begins and now I'm thinking
That this indifference was my invention
When everything I did sought your attention

You were my compass star
You were my measure
You were a pirate's map
A buried treasure

If this was all correct
The last thing I'd expect
The prosecution rests
It's time that I confess: I must have loved you

The song is by Sting and it's one of my favorites. Fits John's POV I think.

[Eri13]

A quick post - for Eri - yes the pigs will fly and I did say that! (It doesn't mean I like the canon! I like my personal one better! )

Okay, pshew! I was seriously afraid something really strange was going to happen!

Helloooo, Sparkies! Anyone here? Or is everyone still recovering from last night's party?

Because tomorrow is the 18th and that means SPARKY DAY!

#1 They have the matching eyes.
#2 They are completely original.
#3 They're always watching over each other.
#4 They'll have beautiful children.
#5 They finish each other's thoughts.
#6 They care about each other.
#7 They make grey BDUs look sexy.
#8 They are both great leaders.
#9 They go together like peanut butter and chocolate.
#10 They take care of the people under their command.
#11 They trust each other to make the right decisions for Atlantis and each other.
#12 Their concept of "personal space" is much more personal than everyone else's.
#13 Their chemistry is hot enough to melt a sun.
#14 They mirror each other's body language!
#15 They like to hang out on balconies together.
#16 Their smiles can light up the entire city. Who needs a ZPM?
#17 They angst about each other yet still manage to get the job done.
#18 They can go from flirting with each other to mutually snarking an opponent into the floor at the drop of a hat.
#19 They would personally risk everything for the sake of the other, but not their principles, no matter the cost.
# 20 Sparky is the obvious ship.
#21 He cheers her up when she is down.
#22 She is there for him even when he's turning into a big, ugly, blue bug.
#23 He risks his life to save her without thought or hesitation.
#24 He cries for her.
#25 Her face lights up when he comes home alive.
#26 He sits on her desk.
#27 She sits by his side in the infirmary while he turns into a bug.
#28 She fights to keep him as her second in command and he defends her honor.
#29 The STARE.
#30 He defends her when Woolsey questions her decisions.
#31: She's with him and he's with her, either way or eye-ther way.
#32: When her name is mentioned somewhere around him he gives a look that he still cares about her.
#33: He understood that she wouldn't want to live as a machine.
#34: She understood he would never want her to give in to Kolya's demands.
#35 He found out when her birthday was so he could give her a surprise present.
#36 She insisted he be promoted so he would still be military commander.
#37 She entered the time field to help rescue him.
#38: She took a chance by asking him on the expedition even though he had a black mark on his record.
#39 They look cute lying on side-by-side beds in the infirmary wearing their matching patient scrubs.
#40 They've turned saving each other into an art form.

Happy Sparky Day!

#41: They're so obvious everyone else notices (that was inspired by that pic of Caldwell watching Elizabeth up above. )

[Anuna]

Okay Sparkies, here is a question - what do you think happened to John's mom? Theories?

[Eri13]

Okay Sparkies, here is a question - what do you think happened to John's mom? Theories?

Hmmm...I would go with two theories:

1) the totally cliched version: Many times with rich sons separated from their dads, the cliched story is that the father's world was extremely stressful on the mother, who resorted to alcoholism to deal with the stress. The father wasn't there for the wife, and though the son (or sons) tried to take care of her, she ended up dying anyway, of the alcoholism or some other related illness. The son then projects his anger at her death on the father and splits from him.

2) My theory: Off the top of my head, given the way John is, here's what I could see having happened.

John's Mom's supported his personal dreams and his desire to split from his father's way of doing things. John respected and loved his mother. But he can't stay in his father's house, and leaves to get away (to college or wherever). His mother gets sick, but he's hesitant to return to her because he'd have to face his father.

His mother dies while he's away. He is plagued by the guilt of this, feeling like perhaps there's something he could have done, had he just not left her alone. I would see his mother being kind, but perhaps not that strong.

For me, this would explain John:

Spoiler:

Why he is so incredibly determined not to leave anyone behind, and yet why he can't commit to anyone. He doesn't want to be hurt by growing too close, yet he won't bear the guilt of letting someone die.

He tries to fill the void with a woman who he can take care of, maybe someone like his mother, but it doesn't work. She leaves him (which is alright--it's not him leaving her) and he exiles himself away from people.

When he signs on to Atlantis, he's confronted with a woman who's not like his Mom, so he's comfortable sharing power with her. But I'm sure you can draw parallels throughout the series of how everyone on Atlantis could trace back to what happened with his Mom. What would be interesting would be the parallel to the illnesses Elizabeth suffers, both in TRW and her injuries in "Adrift". Might also explain the attitude in Adrift, where he is okay with stopping her suffering by not reactivating the nanites--unlike his Mom, Elizabeth is strong and he knows what she wants--she's not someone he takes care of or has to protect. Which is why her loss is different, and yet in the end it becomes the same, because he still has to let her go/leave her and that hurts as much.

Another theory? If his mother was attacked by someone--robbed, perhaps, and killed? After he'd left home, as in theory #2. Would explain the crazy reaction to Kolya in TS/TE. And the same principle--had he not left home, he could have protected her and saved her life.

[perkin127]

hi guys just popped in to shamelessly promote my sparky vids on youtube

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=iMLju8AgQ0A

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=9WD0ojyt5Fc

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Oz2Z-0...watch_response

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LC741e...watch_response

hope you like

[Southern Red]

Okay Sparkies, here is a question - what do you think happened to John's mom? Theories?

I'll never top Eri's theories. I think whatever happened he thinks if he had done something different he could have saved her. Just like sometimes kids of divorce blame themselves. It's deep seated with him and he can't shake it, but he's spent his life trying to make up for it.

hi guys just popped in to shamelessly promote my sparky vids on youtube

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=iMLju8AgQ0A

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=9WD0ojyt5Fc

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Oz2Z-0...watch_response

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LC741e...watch_response

hope you like

Oooh, a Sparky day present! Thanks. Those were great. Clean Hands was my fave.

[Scary Kitty]

Page 2?!? WTH?!? This will never do!

HAPPY SPARKY DAY!!!!!

I feel the need for captions;

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...yBeastjpeg.jpg
Can't exactly put it into words but something about this set screams 'Sexy beast!" Wonder if that's what she called him? look on his face says alot!

But of course she calls him that! Especially in bed. (Hey, it's smut day too! How's that for timing?)

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k211/nogigglingmajor/What.jpg
Caldwell: Seriously? Him...and you?
Yep!
(around a mouthful of food) What?

*dies laughing* Oh John, you are such a goofball!

[Scary Kitty]

OMG! It's Sparky day!!!!

And since we're talking lyrics, I find these fitting:

Spoiler:

"Ghost Story"

I watch the Western sky
The sun is sinking
The geese are flying South
It sets me thinking

I did not miss you much
I did not suffer
What did not kill me
Just made me tougher

I feel the winter come
His icy sinews
Now in the fire light
The case continues

Another night in court
The same old trial
The same old questions asked
The same denial

The shadows closely run
Like jury members
I look for answers in
The fire's embers

Why was I missing then
That whole December
I give my usual line:
I don't remember

Another winter comes
His icy fingers creep
Into these bones of mine
These memories never sleep

And all these differences
A cloak I borrow
We kept our distances
Why should it follow I must have loved you

What is the force that binds the stars
I wore this mask to hide my scars
What is the power that pulls the tide
I never could find a place to hide

What moves the Earth around the sun
What could I do but run and run and run
Afraid to love, afraid to fail
A mast without a sail

The moon's a fingernail and slowly sinking
Another day begins and now I'm thinking
That this indifference was my invention
When everything I did sought your attention

You were my compass star
You were my measure
You were a pirate's map
A buried treasure

If this was all correct
The last thing I'd expect
The prosecution rests
It's time that I confess: I must have loved you

The song is by Sting and it's one of my favorites. Fits John's POV I think.

Ooooh... that sent chills down my spine. You're right, that is sooo fitting for John, especially now.

[Scary Kitty]

Okay Sparkies, here is a question - what do you think happened to John's mom? Theories?

I'm with SR: Eri's theories on this are top-notch.

There's also another cliché explanation that could work, that perhaps it was a sudden accident of some kind. Maybe Momma Sheppard and John were in a car; Mom died, John survived. The whole "survivor's guilt" idea certainly fits him. And perhaps his inability to deal with it helped lead to the split from his father and brother.

[Reiko]

Happy Sparky Day!!

Vote! Vote! Vote! They are up for elimination!

[Southern Red]

I'm with SR: Eri's theories on this are top-notch.

There's also another cliché explanation that could work, that perhaps it was a sudden accident of some kind. Maybe Momma Sheppard and John were in a car; Mom died, John survived. The whole "survivor's guilt" idea certainly fits him. And perhaps his inability to deal with it helped lead to the split from his father and brother.

Or maybe John was driving the car. Good one.

And since it's Sparky Day, I had some thoughts about that old chestnut "show don't tell". We know that these writers have commonly done the latter and not the former. It's been extremely obvious in the case of Sparky.

Spoiler:

They told us that Elizabeth was John's boss and then showed him sitting on the corner of her desk and flirting with her. They told us John's love interest would come from another source and then showed Elizabeth as the only woman he ever gave a gift, tried to cheer up when she was down, singled out repeatedly for attention, and cried over. They told us they weren't deliberately filming any scenes with the two of them that hinted at deeper feelings than friendship, but they showed them in intimate conservation in the moonlight, repeatedly, with romantic music playing, and showed him agreeing to allow his body to be used by an alien pretending to be her husband, and showed her welcoming him home with a hug that he responded emotionally to. Somehow I think what they showed us was a lot louder than what they told us. I had some other ideas about things they told us about John's feelings but never actually showed us, but I want to focus solely on Sparky and leave other ships out. Essentially the entire episode of GiTM shows us exactly how John felt about Elizabeth. They don't need to tell us anything else.

[Scary Kitty]

Happy Sparky Day!!

Vote! Vote! Vote! They are up for elimination!

Voted!

[Scary Kitty]

Or maybe John was driving the car. Good one.

Oooh, yes! And both Dad and brother Dave blamed John for it, even if he wasn't found at fault. That's deliciously angsty.

And since it's Sparky Day, I had some thoughts about that old chestnut "show don't tell". We know that these writers have commonly done the latter and not the former. It's been extremely obvious in the case of Sparky.

Spoiler:

They told us that Elizabeth was John's boss and then showed him sitting on the corner of her desk and flirting with her. They told us John's love interest would come from another source and then showed Elizabeth as the only woman he ever gave a gift, tried to cheer up when she was down, singled out repeatedly for attention, and cried over. They told us they weren't deliberately filming any scenes with the two of them that hinted at deeper feelings than friendship, but they showed them in intimate conservation in the moonlight, repeatedly, with romantic music playing, and showed him agreeing to allow his body to be used by an alien pretending to be her husband, and showed her welcoming him home with a hug that he responded emotionally to. Somehow I think what they showed us was a lot louder than what they told us. I had some other ideas about things they told us about John's feelings but never actually showed us, but I want to focus solely on Sparky and leave other ships out. Essentially the entire episode of GiTM shows us exactly how John felt about Elizabeth. They don't need to tell us anything else.

*bows in worship* Actions speak louder than words. Absolutely!

And not just the writers...

Spoiler:

could JoeF and Torri have known and been deliberately playing it that way, but publicly denying it (or at least playing coy) whenever they were asked, to deflect attention and keep fans guessing... Hmmm. Food for thought.

[Luciana]

And another snurchable sig.

[perkin127]

I'll never top Eri's theories. I think whatever happened he thinks if he had done something different he could have saved her. Just like sometimes kids of divorce blame themselves. It's deep seated with him and he can't shake it, but he's spent his life trying to make up for it.



Oooh, a Sparky day present! Thanks. Those were great. Clean Hands was my fave.

wow i didnt even realise it was sparky day, that was good timing
, i love hands clean as i think the lyrics fit so well