Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[nephtys59]

I kind of wonder if they originally were supposed to have an evil plan. It would have been interesting to watch. I remember occasionally some of you guys have talked about writing stories with Weir essentially plaything the part of Locutus of Borg. I actually had a couple of ideas myself in that regard. If I manage to get far enough on my other piece of work then maybe a could put a few of them down somewhere. It would be an intersting fanfiction challenge.

Oh I remember when Picard was captured by Borg. It was a very moving part of Star Trek TNG, even if it's not my favourite Trek Series. I still remember that tear on his face, telling that Picard was still trapped inside Locutus.
An evil Weir would mean just to copy what has already been done by others.
I think the SGA Rising plan is better.
But if you write a fanfic about that, I would be eager to read it

[Southern Red]

Shouldn't browse Stargate Screencaps on Saturday night. That's what happens ...

Spoiler:

http://a.imageshack.us/img411/2510/motivatorawe.jpg

Very moving. I think each of these is getting better.

I had a bit of a craving for space battles the other day so I decided to watch the end of BAMSR again. And I was thinking about that last scene.

You know, given the way that Elizabeth says "Let's begin." You almost wonder if juts as soon as the cameras stopped, the other replicators in the scene said "Uh...why are you saying it like that? Your tone sort of makes it sound like we have some evil plan here. All we want to do is ascend."

I kind of wonder if they originally were supposed to have an evil plan. It would have been interesting to watch. I remember occasionally some of you guys have talked about writing stories with Weir essentially plaything the part of Locutus of Borg. I actually had a couple of ideas myself in that regard. If I manage to get far enough on my other piece of work then maybe a could put a few of them down somewhere. It would be an intersting fanfiction challenge.

I'm fuzzy on the details but there was a lot of talk at the time about the possibility of "evil Weir". I never really liked it but can see how an interesting story could be done as long as she comes back to herself in the end. It would have been interesting to see how John would handle it, who would trust her and how they would all deal with it. I know Torri said she wanted a definite ending for her. I take that to mean she would rather they have killed her off or brought her back entirely instead of leaving her out there in limbo.

[SMB_BOOKS]

I had a bit of a craving for space battles the other day so I decided to watch the end of BAMSR again. And I was thinking about that last scene.

You know, given the way that Elizabeth says "Let's begin." You almost wonder if juts as soon as the cameras stopped, the other replicators in the scene said "Uh...why are you saying it like that? Your tone sort of makes it sound like we have some evil plan here. All we want to do is ascend."

I kind of wonder if they originally were supposed to have an evil plan. It would have been interesting to watch. I remember occasionally some of you guys have talked about writing stories with Weir essentially plaything the part of Locutus of Borg. I actually had a couple of ideas myself in that regard. If I manage to get far enough on my other piece of work then maybe a could put a few of them down somewhere. It would be an intersting fanfiction challenge.

I'm a big ST:TNG fan, so I do see the correleation with the Borg storyline. Picard's capture, assimilation and rescue was pretty exciting tv, back in the day.

I could go for a story with an evil Elizabeth, if there was a resolution at the end that allowed her to be saved. And, I guess I wouldn't want to see hard-core evil Elizabeth, killing people, etc. But, I wouldn't mind watching her in action, taking out a few wraith hive ships.

[Scary Kitty]

Good afternoon, Sparkies! Happy Sparky!Family Saturday!

As promised

http://a.imageshack.us/img821/6403/motivatorsparks.jpg

Love it! That sentiment is so very true to their spirit.

Shouldn't browse Stargate Screencaps on Saturday night. That's what happens ...

http://a.imageshack.us/img411/2510/motivatorawe.jpg

What do you mean you shouldn't browse it on a Saturday (or any other) night? If that's the result we can expect, then by all means, keep browsing! LOL!

I had a bit of a craving for space battles the other day so I decided to watch the end of BAMSR again. And I was thinking about that last scene.

You know, given the way that Elizabeth says "Let's begin." You almost wonder if juts as soon as the cameras stopped, the other replicators in the scene said "Uh...why are you saying it like that? Your tone sort of makes it sound like we have some evil plan here. All we want to do is ascend."

I kind of wonder if they originally were supposed to have an evil plan. It would have been interesting to watch. I remember occasionally some of you guys have talked about writing stories with Weir essentially plaything the part of Locutus of Borg. I actually had a couple of ideas myself in that regard. If I manage to get far enough on my other piece of work then maybe a could put a few of them down somewhere. It would be an intersting fanfiction challenge.

Between the dimly lit set, the menacing background music, and of course, that uber-hot leather jacket they had Torri in (), I certainly got the feeling that they were trying to make it look like there was something dark and dangerous going on.

I wouldn't have minded an 'evil Weir' storyline, as long as it was a temporary thing and that at the end, we'd get the real Weir back. Kind of like the 'Locutus of Borg' thing with Picard on TNG, or even like TPTW's original plans for Prior!Daniel in S10 of SG-1 (reportedly, he was going to remain 'evil' for about six episodes before being brought back; they ended up going with just the one episode).

I'm fuzzy on the details but there was a lot of talk at the time about the possibility of "evil Weir". I never really liked it but can see how an interesting story could be done as long as she comes back to herself in the end. It would have been interesting to see how John would handle it, who would trust her and how they would all deal with it. I know Torri said she wanted a definite ending for her. I take that to mean she would rather they have killed her off or brought her back entirely instead of leaving her out there in limbo.

Though I'm gonna bet that if given the choice between a final death and coming home alive for Weir, Torri would've chosen coming home alive.

I'm a big ST:TNG fan, so I do see the correleation with the Borg storyline. Picard's capture, assimilation and rescue was pretty exciting tv, back in the day.

I could go for a story with an evil Elizabeth, if there was a resolution at the end that allowed her to be saved. And, I guess I wouldn't want to see hard-core evil Elizabeth, killing people, etc. But, I wouldn't mind watching her in action, taking out a few wraith hive ships.

That would've been pretty cool.

[Infinite-Possibilities]

I've often wondered whether or not if Torri enjoyed working as a villian for "The Long Goodbye." It certianly gave her the opportunity to do many things she didn't otherwise in the show. If I recall corrently it was the only "real" action scenes I remember her being in. Other than running around.

[Southern Red]

I've often wondered whether or not if Torri enjoyed working as a villian for "The Long Goodbye." It certianly gave her the opportunity to do many things she didn't otherwise in the show. If I recall corrently it was the only "real" action scenes I remember her being in. Other than running around.

There were a lot of ways they could have worked some more action into her characterization. Going off world more for example. I'm not one of those who wanted only "team" episodes. Where did it say when this show began that it was going to be team oriented? I always thought it was about exploring the city. And Weir was a huge part of that. But that whole plan, along with John's ATA gene is somewhere in the sewers of Atlantis.

[Anuna]

*sighs* I often use the example of TNG to point out the massive fail of SGA. A decent sci fi show doesn't leave the leader in hands of the enemy (compare Picard's and Elizabeth's capture). As interesting as this possibility is, I doubt very very much the PTB would deliver a decent, Elizabeth worthy story that would leave the fans (who cared about her) satisfied (but the issue of PTB never setting their foot down and making a point that she is a leader and essentially the viewer should have that knowledge inside the head and not question her every move is something PTB failed to do, despite all those times John stood up for her. it's like the characters around loved her, because she was the light and moral compass and helped the other characters shine in her presence, but PTB never really gave her credit for it).

Anyway, I have an excellent fic rec, for anyone who would like to read a story partially using this idea of evil Elizabeth. It's John centered, amazingly written but very very sad - Sennacherib, by witchofthedogs. Not really shippy, it's a gen story that takes into consideration all the things we love about SGA, including John's bond with Elizabeth. If you want a happy ending, better skip this one. However, if you can handle the sadness, it's definitely worth reading.

[Scary Kitty]

I've often wondered whether or not if Torri enjoyed working as a villian for "The Long Goodbye." It certianly gave her the opportunity to do many things she didn't otherwise in the show. If I recall corrently it was the only "real" action scenes I remember her being in. Other than running around.

I seem to recall reading about Torri really enjoying the stunt work she did with BamBam for TLG. So I would guess she liked the opportunity to do something a bit different.

There were a lot of ways they could have worked some more action into her characterization. Going off world more for example. I'm not one of those who wanted only "team" episodes. Where did it say when this show began that it was going to be team oriented? I always thought it was about exploring the city. And Weir was a huge part of that. But that whole plan, along with John's ATA gene is somewhere in the sewers of Atlantis.

Heck, the very title of the series implies it. "Stargate SG-1" spells it out very clearly that that series was about the SG-1 team, with Stargate Command serving as a mere backdrop. But "Stargate Atlantis" implies that it's about Atlantis the city, as well as the expedition to explore it. The stories may sometimes be viewed through the lens of Team Shep, but it's not supposed to be all about Team Shep all the time. At least, that's what I always thought.

*sighs* I often use the example of TNG to point out the massive fail of SGA. A decent sci fi show doesn't leave the leader in hands of the enemy (compare Picard's and Elizabeth's capture).

Or even my perennial favorite, Babylon 5.

Spoiler:

In Season Four, our Big Damn Hero, Captain John Sheridan, was captured and tortured by the corrupt Earth government for a handful of episodes before being rescued. His friends weren't about to leave him behind, either.

As interesting as this possibility is, I doubt very very much the PTB would deliver a decent, Elizabeth worthy story that would leave the fans (who cared about her) satisfied (but the issue of PTB never setting their foot down and making a point that she is a leader and essentially the viewer should have that knowledge inside the head and not question her every move is something PTB failed to do, despite all those times John stood up for her. it's like the characters around loved her, because she was the light and moral compass and helped the other characters shine in her presence, but PTB never really gave her credit for it).

You should post that over in the Elizabeth Weir thread. Seriously. Because that says it all so perfectly.

Anyway, I have an excellent fic rec, for anyone who would like to read a story partially using this idea of evil Elizabeth. It's John centered, amazingly written but very very sad - Sennacherib, by witchofthedogs. Not really shippy, it's a gen story that takes into consideration all the things we love about SGA, including John's bond with Elizabeth. If you want a happy ending, better skip this one. However, if you can handle the sadness, it's definitely worth reading.

*wibbles*

[VampyreWraith]

I had a bit of a craving for space battles the other day so I decided to watch the end of BAMSR again. And I was thinking about that last scene.

You know, given the way that Elizabeth says "Let's begin." You almost wonder if juts as soon as the cameras stopped, the other replicators in the scene said "Uh...why are you saying it like that? Your tone sort of makes it sound like we have some evil plan here. All we want to do is ascend."

I kind of wonder if they originally were supposed to have an evil plan. It would have been interesting to watch. I remember occasionally some of you guys have talked about writing stories with Weir essentially plaything the part of Locutus of Borg. I actually had a couple of ideas myself in that regard. If I manage to get far enough on my other piece of work then maybe a could put a few of them down somewhere. It would be an intersting fanfiction challenge.

Yea the way Elizabeth said lets begin. I thought she had some evil plan in store for the galaxy. I wouldn't have minded evil Weir as long as she came back to her old self at the end of the story arc. I would have preferred if she didn't die though, but if she did die(really die) as her old self saving others I would've bought it, even though it would've been really sad.

Oh I remember when Picard was captured by Borg. It was a very moving part of Star Trek TNG, even if it's not my favourite Trek Series. I still remember that tear on his face, telling that Picard was still trapped inside Locutus.
An evil Weir would mean just to copy what has already been done by others.
I think the SGA Rising plan is better.
But if you write a fanfic about that, I would be eager to read it

I love TNG, it's my favorite Star Trek series. I really liked the Picard/Borg storyline and First Contact.

I'm a big ST:TNG fan, so I do see the correleation with the Borg storyline. Picard's capture, assimilation and rescue was pretty exciting tv, back in the day.

I could go for a story with an evil Elizabeth, if there was a resolution at the end that allowed her to be saved. And, I guess I wouldn't want to see hard-core evil Elizabeth, killing people, etc. But, I wouldn't mind watching her in action, taking out a few wraith hive ships.

Agreed, I wouldn't have wanted her evil, evil.

Good afternoon, Sparkies! Happy Sparky!Family Saturday!



Love it! That sentiment is so very true to their spirit.



What do you mean you shouldn't browse it on a Saturday (or any other) night? If that's the result we can expect, then by all means, keep browsing! LOL!



Between the dimly lit set, the menacing background music, and of course, that uber-hot leather jacket they had Torri in (), I certainly got the feeling that they were trying to make it look like there was something dark and dangerous going on.

I wouldn't have minded an 'evil Weir' storyline, as long as it was a temporary thing and that at the end, we'd get the real Weir back. Kind of like the 'Locutus of Borg' thing with Picard on TNG, or even like TPTW's original plans for Prior!Daniel in S10 of SG-1 (reportedly, he was going to remain 'evil' for about six episodes before being brought back; they ended up going with just the one episode).




Though I'm gonna bet that if given the choice between a final death and coming home alive for Weir, Torri would've chosen coming home alive.



That would've been pretty cool.

They should have done that with Prior Daniel, that ended too quickly. It would've been good to have a temporarily evil Elizabeth, who got to return home at the end.

There were a lot of ways they could have worked some more action into her characterization. Going off world more for example. I'm not one of those who wanted only "team" episodes. Where did it say when this show began that it was going to be team oriented? I always thought it was about exploring the city. And Weir was a huge part of that. But that whole plan, along with John's ATA gene is somewhere in the sewers of Atlantis.

Elizabeth needed to have an episode where she went offworld to negotiate. The SGA novel Casualties Of War had Elizabeth do that and it worked well. I don't see why that couldn't have happened on-screen.

*sighs* I often use the example of TNG to point out the massive fail of SGA. A decent sci fi show doesn't leave the leader in hands of the enemy (compare Picard's and Elizabeth's capture). As interesting as this possibility is, I doubt very very much the PTB would deliver a decent, Elizabeth worthy story that would leave the fans (who cared about her) satisfied (but the issue of PTB never setting their foot down and making a point that she is a leader and essentially the viewer should have that knowledge inside the head and not question her every move is something PTB failed to do, despite all those times John stood up for her. it's like the characters around loved her, because she was the light and moral compass and helped the other characters shine in her presence, but PTB never really gave her credit for it).

Anyway, I have an excellent fic rec, for anyone who would like to read a story partially using this idea of evil Elizabeth. It's John centered, amazingly written but very very sad - Sennacherib, by witchofthedogs. Not really shippy, it's a gen story that takes into consideration all the things we love about SGA, including John's bond with Elizabeth. If you want a happy ending, better skip this one. However, if you can handle the sadness, it's definitely worth reading.

Agree, especially with the bold.
Thanks for the fic rec.

[nephtys59]

This is short and sweet. Hope you like it better than the last one I posted:
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6236709/1/Heated_Arguments
The author is also on LJ.

[VampyreWraith]

This is short and sweet. Hope you like it better than the last one I posted:
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6236709/1/Heated_Arguments
The author is also on LJ.

I liked that one, it is short and sweet, and well written.

[Flowerbud]

Forgive me, I still haven't figured out how to quote multiple posters in one post yet.

SR, the window in color would be great. I will look around the net.

I've noticed the similarities between Atlantis's design and Frank Lloyd Wright's work as well. I wouldn't be at all surprised if there was some inspiration going on.

Looking back at that picture of the stained glass windows in the gateroom that nephtys posted, I was thinking that using a stained glass window as a sort of framing element in a cover design might work very well.

That would look very attractive.

My laptop is in the shop once again and am posting on another person's computer. Such fun and interesting conversations going on in the thread and again, though I have some time, don't really have the equipment to hang out and post.

Re: Elizabeth's role. Negotiating and understanding/working with different cultures was something the team sucked at. They created some disasters in first contact situations. Elizabeth really needed to be on those missions. Also, her fascination with the Ancients would have tied in nicely with stories relating to Ancients mythology and slowly revealed more about the their battle with the Wraiths and what really happened. I wasn't satisfied with TPTB's explanation of why they lost the war.

ST:TNG is one of my all time favorite scifi shows. Now, those PTB were able to show diplomacy, leadership, and the significance of the capture of one's leader. I totally agree SMBooks, the Borg and Picard's capture and assimilation were great episodes. They show the reruns on BBCA, and those episodes hold up really well. Riker, the second in command, did a good job when he had to take over, but he still struggled and questioned his judgement at times, but there was never a trace of a question of leaving the leader behind.

Goodnight all.

[VampyreWraith]

mulitquote is the little " symbol with the + next to it. hit it on all the posts you want to qoute and on the last one hit reply with quote. Took me awhile to get used to it. I'm not good at seperating sentences within one quote. lol



Add: LOL I was looking at this and I wondered why i didnt just write that its this symbol "+ in the bottom right corner of the post, lol. I've been out of it lately cuz i havent been able to sleep at night.

[Southern Red]

This is short and sweet. Hope you like it better than the last one I posted:
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6236709/1/Heated_Arguments
The author is also on LJ.

That was a good one. I saw that coming. LOL

[Erin87]

Love the Primum Movens poster, Eri! It looks fabulous.

Great Missing Moments, Kris!

And the discussion on proper treatment of your leader made me try my hand at my first ever motivational poster (thanks for the link SR).

Spoiler:

Because darn right that's how it should have been. *nods emphatically*