Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[nephtys59]

I liked it too, but I couldn't help but think Katie was a little naive. I've ended up not hating McKeller (it grew on me, a bit like a wart or a boil), but it really bugged me how they wrote it. McBrown was a little more natural.

I was not a fan of Katie as well.
She was a scientist, damn it, and she behaved like a school girl at her first crush.
As to Rodney wanting to get serious with her, it seemed a little too rushed to me and surely I couldn't find a reason why Rodney would spend his life with that kind of woman.
I believe he chose "reverse gear" with her, just because he acted like a fool during the quarantine alert and he realized he wasn't mature enough for a serious relationship.

As to Rodney - Jennifer, well ... I liked their relationship and how it started and the way he told her "I love you" was very tender to me. So don't kill me, but I'm a McKeller fan

The "Running Up That Hill" video is priceless and is now one of my favourites.
I can't wait to be on holidays starting next week because I have in mind a couple of Sheppard-Weir videos I really would like to complete ... and I want to write fics too!

[nephtys59]

I've always said that had I not ever gotten connected with fandom I'd be thinking that Sparky would surely have happened if Torri had stayed on the show. And I'd be wondering who she p'd off to get herself fired. Because I don't see how you can possibly watch the show and not think that they were supposed to be together in the end.

Damn right!

[Falcon Horus]

Every city in America has a 4th of July parade with bands, clowns, kids on decorated bikes, beauty queens, politicians in convertibles and people on horses. The fireworks come at dark ranging from the big displays in the cities to a few guys trying to lose a finger on the street.

And play 1812 by Tchaikovsky in one form or another, that was originally written for the Russian victory over Napoleon Bonaparte.

Which cracks me up beyond reason... You know the US using a Russian composition for their independance day.

[Lythisrose]

Mainly an observer of this thread, but love the idea of bringing back Elizabeth (I am one of those who didn't realize how much she added to the show till she was gone!) and your Season Six is a terrific idea!
But (there's always a but, isn't there? )
I must admit, since you are already discussing McKeller, I'd like to add a few thoughts on how that will work with your project.
But read only if you want to read an anti-McKeller rant:

Spoiler:

I am one of those who absolutely despise the McKeller ship, in fact I almost stopped watching Season 5 because of it - it literally sickens and repulses me, all I can see is some pervy older guy (looking at you M.Gero) getting it on with a young girl. I realize this is my own personal bias, but I've heard others express similar distaste for the pairing. Not because it sprang out of the blue - I'm a fan of pairings that have NO basis in canon so I don't need alot of buildup, but because they have absolutely no chemistry together, IMHO of course. And I think McKay is an attractive and interesting character - hook him up with someone closer to his age and maturity, please.
(I know the actors had a hard time believing they were shipping the two, even though they are good friends in real life)
I would, honest to God, have a hard time watching your Season Six if this pairing is on screen. Perhaps if kept VERY much to the background it would be OK, but Rodney is actually one of my favorite characters and it disturbs me to see him written as the avatar for the writers fantasies.
Is it truly necessary to go with canon and have this relationship continue?
It seems you are already making major changes and the Bridge writers certainly had no problem ending potential or real relationships season to season. I know that ending McKeller on an amicable basis and having Jennifer end up being a competent physician and team player (I don't mind the character in that role at all!) would help myself and potentially others to enjoy another Season of SGA.
So very, very sorry for this rant, but it just kept building up every time I read another post on the subject and reminds me of everything I miss about classic SGA

[Southern Red]

And play 1812 by Tchaikovsky in one form or another, that was originally written for the Russian victory over Napoleon Bonaparte.

Which cracks me up beyond reason... You know the US using a Russian composition for their independance day.

Complete with cannons. Yay for overlooking canon background. This reminds me of fandom. LOL

Mainly an observer of this thread, but love the idea of bringing back Elizabeth (I am one of those who didn't realize how much she added to the show till she was gone!) and your Season Six is a terrific idea!
But (there's always a but, isn't there? )
I must admit, since you are already discussing McKeller, I'd like to add a few thoughts on how that will work with your project.
I am one of those who absolutely despise the McKeller ship, in fact I almost stopped watching Season 5 because of it - it literally sickens and repulses me, all I can see is some pervy older guy (looking at you M.Gero) getting it on with a young girl. I realize this is my own personal bias, but I've heard others express similar distaste for the pairing. Not because it sprang out of the blue - I'm a fan of pairings that have NO basis in canon so I don't need alot of buildup, but because they have absolutely no chemistry together, IMHO of course. And I think McKay is an attractive and interesting character - hook him up with someone closer to his age and maturity, please.
(I know the actors had a hard time believing they were shipping the two, even though they are good friends in real life)
I would, honest to God, have a hard time watching your Season Six if this pairing is on screen. Perhaps if kept VERY much to the background it would be OK, but Rodney is actually one of my favorite characters and it disturbs me to see him written as the avatar for the writers fantasies.
Is it truly necessary to go with canon and have this relationship continue?
It seems you are already making major changes and the Bridge writers certainly had no problem ending potential or real relationships season to season. I know that ending McKeller on an amicable basis and having Jennifer end up being a competent physician and team player (I don't mind the character in that role at all!) would help myself and potentially others to enjoy another Season of SGA.
So very, very sorry for this rant, but it just kept building up every time I read another post on the subject and reminds me of everything I miss about classic SGA

Thank you so much for being honest and saying all this. Believe me, speaking only for myself, I agree with you on McKeller. But in the initial planning stages we discussed it and decided to grit our teeth and stick with canon. It will definitely be kept in the background. We are bringing back a number of formerly "dead" characters and didn't feel we could completely throw canon out the window in every instance. Plus, as you see, some of us like the pairing.

We here on the Sparky thread are trying to come up with a viable S6 that stays with canon up to the point of EatG and not make it into a totally shippy season. We ultimately plan to focus on Sparky but also plan to develop Teyla/Kanaan as it should have been on the show rather than breaking them up as the Legacy books are doing.

Give our stories a chance. I think you'll like them and won't have to choke back the nausea too much. Please continue to give feedback. We appreciate the input from those who aren't completely addicted to Sparky.

[Lythisrose]

Complete with cannons. Yay for overlooking canon background. This reminds me of fandom. LOL



Thank you so much for being honest and saying all this. Believe me, speaking only for myself, I agree with you on McKeller. But in the initial planning stages we discussed it and decided to grit our teeth and stick with canon. It will definitely be kept in the background. We are bringing back a number of formerly "dead" characters and didn't feel we could completely throw canon out the window in every instance. Plus, as you see, some of us like the pairing.

We here on the Sparky thread are trying to come up with a viable S6 that stays with canon up to the point of EatG and not make it into a totally shippy season. We ultimately plan to focus on Sparky but also plan to develop Teyla/Kanaan as it should have been on the show rather than breaking them up as the Legacy books are doing.

Give our stories a chance. I think you'll like them and won't have to choke back the nausea too much. Please continue to give feedback. We appreciate the input from those who aren't completely addicted to Sparky.

Thanks for your response, (and I went ahead and put most of my post under spoilers in case people don't really want to read anti-McKeller stuff), I know you are all such talented writers and am really looking forward to reading your season. That is pretty much the only quibble I have.
And while I'm not "completely addicted" to OTP Sparky (I see pairings for John everywhere, unfortunately ), one can't deny the Spark is definitely there every time they are onscreen together!

[nephtys59]

I am one of those who absolutely despise the McKeller ship, in fact I almost stopped watching Season 5 because of it - it literally sickens and repulses me, all I can see is some pervy older guy (looking at you M.Gero) getting it on with a young girl.

McKay a "pervy older guy"? I'm really shocked, did I watch a different show???
I don't think there is so much age difference between McKay and Keller (what? 10 years, maybe?), but even if there was, what's wrong with that?
This is not the first time I see people react really badly to couples with age difference, we're in 2010 for crying out loud.
I believe we should keep an open mind towards such relationships (regardless age or gender), when the two involved are willing and really in LOVE.
And, believe me, LOVE is the key to almost everything.
I don't believe Sparky Season 6 will turn around McKeller ship, maybe it will be taken in consideration because at the end of Season 5 it was canon, and everybody here wants to follow canon as much as possible to be coherent with what SGA was on screen.

[Falcon Horus]

Complete with cannons.

That is so cool.

We appreciate the input from those who aren't completely addicted to Sparky.

Like 50/50 or so...

[Lythisrose]

McKay a "pervy older guy"? I'm really shocked, did I watch a different show???
I don't think there is so much age difference between McKay and Keller (what? 10 years, maybe?), but even if there was, what's wrong with that?
This is not the first time I see people react really badly to couples with age difference, we're in 2010 for crying out loud.
I believe we should keep an open mind towards such relationships (regardless age or gender), when the two involved are willing and really in LOVE.

I don't think it's so much the age difference per se, but the difference in maturity. To me, Mckay comes across as an (albeit somewhat neurotic) established, mature middle-aged professional, whereas Jennifer is in a different stage of life altogether. She is just so little-girlish on this show. (Now Kaylee from Firefly was even younger, but oh so much wiser, and I don't think I'd have a problem with that at all) And, I stress, this is my own personal bias towards this pairing. I physically react when I see them together as a couple, and not in a positive way. I cringe. And I think McKay is an attractive man. This hurts my perception of him as a character. When he was with Katie, I had no such feeling for some reason.
(and, BTW, these replies are VERY hard to make the way the forum is acting)

[nephtys59]

I don't think it's so much the age difference per se, but the difference in maturity.

I'm a fan of differences, especially when they bring together persons that are not supposed to get along.
I love the McKay character and reading the term "pervy" made me angry.

She is just so little-girlish on this show. (Now Kaylee from Firefly was even younger, but oh so much wiser, and I don't think I'd have a problem with that at all)

Unexperienced and with little self-esteem? Yes
Girlish? No, IMHO.

(and, BTW, these replies are VERY hard to make they way the forum is acting)

I didn't insult you at all, I just expressed my opinion with the same strength you expressed yours (pervy, repulse, etc.). Period. Don't know what this has to do with forum rules.

[Southern Red]

Thanks for your response, (and I went ahead and put most of my post under spoilers in case people don't really want to read anti-McKeller stuff), I know you are all such talented writers and am really looking forward to reading your season. That is pretty much the only quibble I have.
And while I'm not "completely addicted" to OTP Sparky (I see pairings for John everywhere, unfortunately ), one can't deny the Spark is definitely there every time they are onscreen together!

Thanks. We see that spark too. LOL

McKay a "pervy older guy"? I'm really shocked, did I watch a different show???
I don't think there is so much age difference between McKay and Keller (what? 10 years, maybe?), but even if there was, what's wrong with that?
This is not the first time I see people react really badly to couples with age difference, we're in 2010 for crying out loud.
I believe we should keep an open mind towards such relationships (regardless age or gender), when the two involved are willing and really in LOVE.
And, believe me, LOVE is the key to almost everything.
I don't believe Sparky Season 6 will turn around McKeller ship, maybe it will be taken in consideration because at the end of Season 5 it was canon, and everybody here wants to follow canon as much as possible to be coherent with what SGA was on screen.

Let's not try to tell someone their opinion is wrong. We welcome all ideas here and will never want to make someone feel they can't be completely honest without having to justify what they think. You know how we hate it when other ships do that to us.

[nephtys59]

Let's not try to tell someone their opinion is wrong. We welcome all ideas here and will never want to make someone feel they can't be completely honest without having to justify what they think. You know how we hate it when other ships do that to us.

No right to defend my favourite characters, I understand.
Next time someone will write that Elizabeth was sexually harassing a younger Sheppard and I will have to smile and be merry.
JG is writing about a poly-amorous psyco-Sheppard and I have to sing lullabies in her honour.
McKay is considered a pervy and I have to dance in happiness.

Guess I'm not the right person to be around GW anymore ... I apologize to you and any other Sparky who think I acted improperly.

[Falcon Horus]

No right to defend my favourite characters, I understand.

Sarcasm does not become you.

You can defend your favorite character but not tell the the other person that they are wrong and you are right. Every one has a right to their own opinion, and everyone's opinion is worth pretty equal - neither right nor wrong.

[Lythisrose]

OK, I am truly sorry I offended with the words I used. McKay is one of my favorite characters. I do have a very strong reaction and those are the impressions I had. I am glad that I was able to express my dislike for the pairing here, though, as it was a major area of contention in the fandom and continues to be so for me, at least.
I don't want to be the one to create hard feelings on your thread - it is one of the most well-written, thoughtful, entertaining and enlightening threads on this board and I wholeheartedly support Sparky and Season 6! Common ground?
(also the comment about replying was in reference to how difficult it is to create a reply when the box won't let you scroll without returning you to the top of your comment -arrggggg)

[Falcon Horus]

...as it was a major area of contention in the fandom and continues to be so for me, at least.

I think for a lot of people it's still a major issue. I don't think it'll be forgotten so soon, not as long as there are SGA-fans left alive.

(also the comment about replying was in reference to how difficult it is to create a reply when the box won't let you scroll without returning you to the top of your comment -arrggggg)

I have no problems. Weird.