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Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread
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Heightmeyer's Lemming -- still the coolest Lemming of the forum
Proper Stargate Rewatch -- season 10 of SG-1
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Originally posted by Falcon Horus View PostSo Cooper is leaving... not going to be sad about that, not at all.
Spoiler:Isn't he the one who said it was funny the way they killed off Kate in Doppelganger, in the commentary of that episode?
Well, you can imagine I don't care he goes.
I can remember his big smile when he said it.sigpic
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Originally posted by Falcon Horus View PostI'm not sure... It's been a while since that was mentioned. But to check if it is you'll have to find someone who owns the season on DVD and can check cause I don't have it.sigpic
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There you go... Probie confirms.Heightmeyer's Lemming -- still the coolest Lemming of the forum
Proper Stargate Rewatch -- season 10 of SG-1
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Oh ouch re: the Doppelganger thing.
I'm of mixed feelings re: RCC's departure.
Spoiler:I can't really tell what his influence was in SGA for sure. He did write Runner and Sateda, which are two very good Ronon episodes. And Joe does apparently seem to think that RCC was the only one who really got his character.
But on the other hand, I don't know exactly what hand he had in the whole Elizabeth thing - I'm not sure he was a fan. And Doppelganger seems to indicate that he was more of a Sheyla shipper.
On the SG-1 side, I didn't care for some of the trends he oversaw (heavier emphasis on Sam/Jack, Ori) but then he did give us Vala, who I adore. BW seems to want to do away with the character.
Soooo.......I don't know.Last edited by Killdeer; 20 June 2010, 09:19 AM.- Life after Stargate -Agent Carter * Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. * The Blacklist * Castle * Elementary * GrimmHawaii Five-0 * The Mentalist * NCIS * NCIS:LA * Once Upon a Time * Rizzoli & Islessigpic
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Originally posted by Killdeer View PostOh ouch re: the Doppelganger thing.
I'm of mixed feelings re: RCC's departure.
Spoiler:I can't really tell what his influence was in SGA for sure. He did write Runner and Sateda, which are two very good Ronon episodes. And Joe does apparently seem to think that RCC was the only one who really got his character.
But on the other hand, I don't know exactly what hand he had in the whole Elizabeth thing - I'm not sure he was a fan. And Doppelganger seems to indicate that he was more of a Sheyla shipper.
On the SG-1 side, I didn't care for some of the trends he oversaw (heavier emphasis on Sam/Jack, Ori) but then he did give us Vala, who I adore. BW seems to want to do away with the character.
Soooo.......I don't know.
All I know is: he did Vegas. I love Vegas. Joe thought he got his character. Joe also liked the darker turn so everything he says I don't have to agree with. And RCC's ship preference was pretty obvious. *waves bye bye*
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I have a problem with the word "dark" for those two seasons. Yes Joe played a darker John and there are some episodes very dark but some episodes of the first seasons where also dark.You all know my love for those seasons. Maybe it's for this that I can't see the dark aspect in general. I was too focus or disctract by the stupid inconstencies.
About Robert C Cooper. I already gave my opinion.
Again, the reactions on the french forum are more....how to say it....virulente. Many are happy to see him leave and hope Joe Mallozzi will follow him.lolsigpic
Sig made by nephty and avi by Kris....THANK YOU!
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Originally posted by Probie View PostI have a problem with the word "dark" for those two seasons. Yes Joe played a darker John and there are some episodes very dark but some episodes of the first seasons where also dark.You all know my love for those seasons. Maybe it's for this that I can't see the dark aspect in general. I was too focus or disctract by the stupid inconstencies.
About Robert C Cooper. I already gave my opinion.
Again, the reactions on the french forum are more....how to say it....virulente. Many are happy to see him leave and hope Joe Mallozzi will follow him.lol
There was a lot of dark stuff in the first seasons like Sumner's death, Grodin's death, John's almost death and so on but there was always lightness and humor. In S4-5 the set was lit darker which was their choice on how to make us think the subject matter was darker. And then there was the change in John. It just seemed to be more adult I think rather than something you'd let the kiddies watch unsupervised. Personally, I like the lighter tone.
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostThe French reaction is very interesting. I have mixed emotions about RCC. His eps were well done and well written but I didn't always like the subject. LOL
Originally posted by Southern Red View PostThere was a lot of dark stuff in the first seasons like Sumner's death, Grodin's death, John's almost death and so on but there was always lightness and humor. In S4-5 the set was lit darker which was their choice on how to make us think the subject matter was darker. And then there was the change in John. It just seemed to be more adult I think rather than something you'd let the kiddies watch unsupervised. Personally, I like the lighter tone.
I won't say the character are not mature now. It's normal after 5 years but I can't qualify those seasons like dark. The whole show is light.
A dark show for me it's when something has an impact on the characters in a long time and that we can see an evolution (mental change). This needs a sort of continuity. I'm reading myself and I see that I'm not clear.lol
Let me take a example: Ford death. It's dramatic but it's not dark. It's dark when we can see an impact on the others characters....but after one episode, Ford was forgotten. Continuity makes something dark. Jeez I'm not clear again. I need a translator.lolsigpic
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Originally posted by Probie View Post"Interesting" is not the word that I will choose but if TPTB can read french I think they will be in depression.lol
Exactly.
I won't say the character are not mature now. It's normal after 5 years but I can't qualify those seasons like dark. The whole show is light.
A dark show for me it's when something has an impact on the characters in a long time and that we can see an evolution (mental change). This needs a sort of continuity. I'm reading myself and I see that I'm not clear.lol
Let me take a example: Ford death. It's dramatic but it's not dark. It's dark when we can see an impact on the others characters....but after one episode, Ford was forgotten. Continuity makes something dark. Jeez I'm not clear again. I need a translator.lol
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Originally posted by Probie View PostOh I forgot this one. I don't like this episode not just for Kate death (a stupid idea again but not the first and unfortunately not the last).
I can remember his big smile when he said it.
Originally posted by Killdeer View PostOh ouch re: the Doppelganger thing.
I'm of mixed feelings re: RCC's departure.
Spoiler:I can't really tell what his influence was in SGA for sure. He did write Runner and Sateda, which are two very good Ronon episodes. And Joe does apparently seem to think that RCC was the only one who really got his character.
But on the other hand, I don't know exactly what hand he had in the whole Elizabeth thing - I'm not sure he was a fan. And Doppelganger seems to indicate that he was more of a Sheyla shipper.
On the SG-1 side, I didn't care for some of the trends he oversaw (heavier emphasis on Sam/Jack, Ori) but then he did give us Vala, who I adore. BW seems to want to do away with the character.
Soooo.......I don't know.
Originally posted by Probie View PostI have a problem with the word "dark" for those two seasons. Yes Joe played a darker John and there are some episodes very dark but some episodes of the first seasons where also dark.You all know my love for those seasons. Maybe it's for this that I can't see the dark aspect in general. I was too focus or disctract by the stupid inconstencies.
About Robert C Cooper. I already gave my opinion.
Again, the reactions on the french forum are more....how to say it....virulente. Many are happy to see him leave and hope Joe Mallozzi will follow him.lol
Originally posted by Southern Red View PostThe French reaction is very interesting. I have mixed emotions about RCC. His eps were well done and well written but I didn't always like the subject. LOL
There was a lot of dark stuff in the first seasons like Sumner's death, Grodin's death, John's almost death and so on but there was always lightness and humor. In S4-5 the set was lit darker which was their choice on how to make us think the subject matter was darker. And then there was the change in John. It just seemed to be more adult I think rather than something you'd let the kiddies watch unsupervised. Personally, I like the lighter tone.(This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.
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Originally posted by Southern Red View PostOh, you are very clear. And we never saw any character loss have an impact on anyone. For example, Peter Grodin was very close to Elizabeth. He was essentially her assistant. Why did we never hear her say how much she missed him or how Chuck was doing a good job but she still missed Peter? Then we had Rodney writing a book about Elizabeth yet after she was gone he's all excited about possibly getting her job and giving Sam flowers. I could go on and on. If it hadn't been for Joe's face acting we never would have seen anyone show any change at all after losing her or anyone else. I feel a rant coming on but it's all been said before and can be summed up by badwritingbadwritingbadwriting.
Thank goodness for Joe's mad acting skillz, it's the only thing that kept me sane in Seasons 4 and 5.(This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.
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BSG is dark. It's almost too dark to watch, so definitely not everyone's cup of tea, and as much as i enjoyed it, I'm glad it didn't go beyond four seasons. SGA doesn't even come close to that kind of feeling when you watch, and perhaps, the darkest aspect of SGA is John and his change over the last two seasons - he lost his boyishness, his cheerfulness, we saw him in a different light, different circumstances, and we see him do things we didn't expect from John in s1 - s3. Just think 'Miller's crossing' and whet he did there. Although I always saw a potential for ruthlessness in him, that episode was definitely a jaw dropping moment for me. And I think Eri made a great point on her LJ when she mentioned that Vegas John isn't that much different than our John. The only really significant difference is Atlantis, and everything Atlantis stands for, for our John - the duty, home, friendships, a mission that's greater than him, and in turn he is a better man for it - everything that makes our John a hero can be summed up with 'Atlantis'.
Anyway, i don't want to lose my point - the darkest aspect of new and not improved SGA is John, because of the way JF chose to play him, and because of few other things, including moments like 'Miller's Crossing', or his initial reaction to Teyla's pregnancy; but I think the way JF played him is the main and biggest reason. Sometimes the episodes were 'light', and there were funny moemnts, but JF always kept the sadder, darker undertones.Last edited by Anuna; 20 June 2010, 12:24 PM.I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.
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Originally posted by Anuna View PostBSG is dark. It's almost too dark to watch, so definitely not everyone's cup of cake, and as much as i enjoyed it, I'm glad it didn't go beyond four seasons. SGA doesn't even come close to that kind of feeling when you watch, and perhaps, the darkest aspect of SGA is John and his change over the last two seasons - he lost his boyishness, his cheerfulness, we saw him in a different light, different circumstances, and we see him do things we didn't expect from John in s1 - s3. Just think 'Miller's crossing' and whet he did there. Although I always saw a potential for ruthlessness in him, that episode was definitely a jaw dropping moment for me. And I think Eri made a great point on her LJ when she mentioned that Vegas John isn't that much different than our John. The only really significant difference is Atlantis, and everything Atlantis stands for, for our John - the duty, home, friendships, a mission that's greater than him, and in turn he is a better man for it - everything that makes our John a her can be summed up with 'Atlantis'.
Anyway, i don't want to lose my point - the darkest aspect of new and not improved SGA is John, because of the way JF chose to play him, and because of few other things, including moments like 'Miller's Crossing', or his initial reaction to Teyla's pregnancy; but I think the way JF played him is the main and biggest reason. Sometimes the episodes were 'light', and there were funny moemnts, but JF always kept the sadder, darker undertones.
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