Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Pearl of Atlantis76]

I'm not feeling the Teyla-love here....

I guess it is hard to let my love for Teyla to show on an episode in which my biggest feeling is disappointment and maybe a little bit of hate for the character that takes over what it should have been a Teyla character centric episode.

I got to thinking last night after watching TR about John and S4-5. I'm not sure the exact ep when it happened, but at some point he stopped being #1. What other show can anyone think of that the actor who is #1 in the credits is not front and center almost all the time? I don't mean literally all the time on screen, but I mean at the center of the action except when a special show features another character. For example, Hawaii Five O came to mind. There is McGarrett in the middle of things 90% of the time. How about NCIS? Isn't Gibbs at least directing the action by telling the team what to do, interacting with them or having the focus on him with each character separately? They did that with John for awhile, but at some point it became a lot less frequent. I can't think of an ensemble show in which the main actor isn't the main character. SGA changed the focus to McKay to the point that it became blatantly obvious in S4-5.

As far as i can remember SGA is the only show in which the lead actor was put kind of in the shelf, left there almost forgotten, in order to give priority to the new characters that weren’t there from the beginning and that were recently introduced. Rodney is a special case.

Seasons 4 and 5 made SGA lose its own identity, i mean we were used to a certain dynamic on the show, on the first 3 seasons, that was totally lost on the last two seasons and in terms of many things, from characters’ characterization to the set itself (the city lost its vivid colours), not to mention most of the plots of the episodes became worse and worse.

Well, since this is the Sparky thread, don't you agree that the focus is expected to be on either John or Elizabeth? And since some of us don't like John being shipped with Teyla, isn't it logical that we don't want to see her around him? Just a preference. I'm sure there's a character you'd rather not see on screen also. We mean no offense.

Couldn’t agree more!!!!

The same can be said about McKay and Keller. We give them a pretty hard time too. And Sam has taken a beating lately. Why can't we just be honest and say how we feel? It's just an opinion. Maybe we are actually holding back a lot of times so as not to give offense. We're not going to all agree. If the mods think we go too far, they will let us know.

I personally hold back quite a lot sometimes, not only because of the mods but also and in some degree (specially) because of certain members who sometimes do not interpret correctly what i am saying (and that has happened to me more than once) and in order for no one to feel offended, when in the first place it was never my intention to be offensive.

[Southern Red]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Canon Monday!



Oh, I've totally been holding back. There is a wide gulf between what I've been posting, and what I'm actually thinking. And it ain't pretty.

Sing it sistah. And I think any of us who were around for the Weir hatred that was once rampant on this forum tend to hold back for fear of being in any way like those people. We have chosen to take the high road and be gracious as long as it is humanly possible. Though sometimes it's difficult to keep from blasting off. I admire the restraint of this thread and how we are welcoming to everyone unless they bash Sparky or try to tell us we're wrong.

[Luz]

Well if you have watched it before, i think that yeah, there is no need to bother with it, but if you have never watched it, i would suggest you to watch it at least once. I think all the episodes should be watched at least once, no matter how bad they might be.

I've watched up to (and including) Lifeline and that's it, that's when I stopped with this show. This past Sunday I was channel surfing and I caught a bit of an episode on FX. First, there was a scene with Carter, let's just say I'm not a fan of the character and leave it at that. The next scene was with Woolsey, I was already feeling nauseous. And then there was a scene with Keller and McKay sitting on what looked like a bed, do I even wanna know what that was about?

Going by my strong reaction to seeing those people on that show, I'd say I'm not ready to give those last two seasons a chance.

Oh, I've totally been holding back. There is a wide gulf between what I've been posting, and what I'm actually thinking. And it ain't pretty.

Ooh boy, the things I'd love to say. But I'm aware there are a lot of SG1 fans here too and I wouldn't want to step on any toes.

[Pearl of Atlantis76]

I've watched up to (and including) Lifeline and that's it, that's when I stopped with this show. This past Sunday I was channel surfing and I caught a bit of an episode on FX. First, there was a scene with Carter, let's just say I'm not a fan of the character and leave it at that. The next scene was with Woolsey, I was already feeling nauseous. And then there was a scene with Keller and McKay sitting on what looked like a bed, do I even wanna know what that was about?

So I think you should probably give it a try at watching “Missing” next weekend, although it is really not the greatest of the episodes. Don’t worry, I stopped liking Carter as soon as she “stepped foot” on SGA, and if you didn’t like her before on SG1 you for sure you would have hated her here on SGA, but I still believe and suggest you to watch all the episodes (even if fast forwarding) from seasons 4 and 5 at least once. In my opinion things got a little bit better with Woolsey, far from being perfect, but at least more bearable. From what you are describing I think you might be talking about the episode “Search and Rescue”, although that scene you are mentioning of Rodney and Keller seated on a bed, I can’t seem to place it on this episode.

Going by my strong reaction to seeing those people on that show, I'd say I'm not ready to give those last two seasons a chance.

Well if you feel you are not ready to watch the last two seasons I think then you should wait a bit more, but I would suggest you to at least watch “This Mortal Coil”, maybe, well although maybe you would feel even worse since then we lose Elizabeth a second time, although it is a Replicator not the real Elizabeth, so maybe not a good idea after all.

[Scary Kitty]

So I think you should probably give it a try at watching “Missing” next weekend, although it is really not the greatest of the episodes. Don’t worry, I stopped liking Carter as soon as she “stepped foot” on SGA, and if you didn’t like her before on SG1 you for sure you would have hated her here on SGA, but I still believe and suggest you to watch all the episodes (even if fast forwarding) from seasons 4 and 5 at least once. In my opinion things got a little bit better with Woolsey, far from being perfect, but at least more bearable. From what you are describing I think you might be talking about the episode “Search and Rescue”, although that scene you are mentioning of Rodney and Keller seated on a bed, I can’t seem to place it on this episode.

Agreed. Of the replacement leaders, Woolsey was by far the better of the two, in my opinion. In addition to being more like Elizabeth on a professional level (neither scientist nor military), he also seems to fit in more with the "Island of Misfit Toys" vibe that I get from the rest of the ensemble.

[Lt.Colonel John Sheppard]

Agreed. Of the replacement leaders, Woolsey was by far the better of the two, in my opinion. In addition to being more like Elizabeth on a professional level (neither scientist nor military), he also seems to fit in more with the "Island of Misfit Toys" vibe that I get from the rest of the ensemble.

Woolsey did seem to grow a pair during this season but he still wasn't the most qualified to lead the expedition.

[Nolamom]

[JT-2]

Cute manip, Nolamom!!

I'll agree that Woolsey was more tolerable than Sam as leader of the expedition. Sam, as a character, just didn't seem to fit the position. I'm assuming the SG-1 fans wanted to see her be Sam-like, solving science problems and saving the day, not an administrator. There were many episodes where Sam acted exactly the same way Elizabeth would have (which is why I will always call BS on that whole "we don't know how to write for her" crap, cause they wrote Sam just like Elizabeth, just blond).

But Woolsey was believable as an administrator.

[Varda]

*rolls into the thread*

Hi there!
Just wanted to say that tonight our family goes to the country to visit our grandparents... that's quite far away from Moscow: about 800 km or so. I hope I'll be back on Sunday evening
Tough I'm not sure if I have enough time to check the forum regularly...

I wish everybody here nice week!
Please don't forget me that fast

[Scary Kitty]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Smutty Tuesday!

Cute manip, Nolamom!!

I'll agree that Woolsey was more tolerable than Sam as leader of the expedition. Sam, as a character, just didn't seem to fit the position. I'm assuming the SG-1 fans wanted to see her be Sam-like, solving science problems and saving the day, not an administrator. There were many episodes where Sam acted exactly the same way Elizabeth would have (which is why I will always call BS on that whole "we don't know how to write for her" crap, cause they wrote Sam just like Elizabeth, just blond).

But Woolsey was believable as an administrator.

Exactly. The Sam we saw in Atlantis just... wasn't Sam. Woolsey, on the other hand, has been portrayed as a bureaucrat all along, so he fit into the position like a hand in a glove.

*rolls into the thread*

Hi there!
Just wanted to say that tonight our family goes to the country to visit our grandparents... that's quite far away from Moscow: about 800 km or so. I hope I'll be back on Sunday evening
Tough I'm not sure if I have enough time to check the forum regularly...

I wish everybody here nice week!
Please don't forget me that fast

That sounds like a lovely trip! Have fun visiting your grandparents, and we'll see you when you get back!

[Brie]

Have a great trip Varda

For once it has too much Keller and then it is that kind of episode in which the focus is only in one or two of the characters and I don’t like it much. I prefer the episode to focus in all the characters, I prefer when the team is all there most of the time.

I also prefer the team episodes, I mean I do think that there are a few great episodes with one character as the main focus such as ‘Before I sleep’ (Elizabeth) and ‘Common Ground’ (John) but we get to see a lot of the other characters and no one takes over anyone else if that make sense?

So, I shouldn't even bother then.

As many have said, you should watch all of the episodes at least once and then decide which episodes you like, and there are a lot of great episodes in the final two season, there is…eh…ok, maybe not really great but some good once like ‘This Mortal Coil’, ‘Ghost in the Machine’ (though the episode would have been better had Torri done it but it was still ok and I get why she didn’t), ‘Remnants’ and ‘Vegas’ and a few more.

I was just thinking to myself how I need to buy some good alcohol to get through Missing. I'll need the hard stuff to get through Trio and Brain Storm, though. To me those are the lowest of the low.

Those episodes are more painful to watch than just bad because I can deal with bad or poor, but they are simply painful to watch which makes it hard to watch.

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j55/Nolamom/Shippiness/atl_416_021manip.jpgriginal

I love that manip Nolamom

[Sparky She-Demon]

I take it, that from the discussion going on, seasons 4 and 5 leave something to be desired?

[Brie]

I take it, that from the discussion going on, seasons 4 and 5 leave something to be desired?

The truth is that it all depends on who you’re asking. For me personally it did but it’s also something that you have to feel for yourself, who knows, maybe for you it’s something else that was lacking or maybe you wouldn’t feel that something is missing for you, I would still tell you to take the chance and watch season 4 and 5 at least once and then decided how you feel and you might also get a lot of questions we know that you’ve asked and things that you’ve wondered about answered.

[Sparky She-Demon]

The truth is that it all depends on who you’re asking. For me personally it did but it’s also something that you have to feel for yourself, who knows, maybe for you it’s something else that was lacking or maybe you wouldn’t feel that something is missing for you, I would still tell you to take the chance and watch season 4 and 5 at least once and then decided how you feel and you might also get a lot of questions we know that you’ve asked and things that you’ve wondered about answered.

Yeah, I probably should get my hands on them.

[Southern Red]

*rolls into the thread*

Hi there!
Just wanted to say that tonight our family goes to the country to visit our grandparents... that's quite far away from Moscow: about 800 km or so. I hope I'll be back on Sunday evening
Tough I'm not sure if I have enough time to check the forum regularly...

I wish everybody here nice week!
Please don't forget me that fast

Have a great trip. We won't forget you.

Spoilers for OT.

Spoiler:

I just got back from the dentist. Due to eroding gums I've had bonding done on most of my teeth. Expensive and not fun. This time was in the lower front. I can eat on either side, just not in the middle.

And Mr. SR just got back from the eye doc. He has cataracts in both eyes and will be having surgery soon. I'm telling you, getting old is not for sissies.