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Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

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    Originally posted by Pearl of Atlantis76 View Post
    It sure seems that the writers really wanted to doom Sparky and continue with their main plan of pairing John with Teyla, and that is why they elaborated all the events in order to make Elizabeth disappear and they made John not going after her so that everyone would think he did not care about her. But gladly the acting of JF and the pregnancy of RL once again destroyed their plans. I guess that is faith! I mean Sparky is meant to be, no matter if the writers like it or not! No one and nothing will be able to separate them!!!
    I've always believed that it was fate that Rachel got pregnant in Season 4. The writers seemed so set on bringing Sheyla on-screen in Season 4, but the fact that Rachel got pregnant just seemed to mean that Sheyla was never meant to be. If the writers hadn't held up their noses so high and acted as if the fans' opinions didn't matter, they might have received this message and also realized that writing Elizabeth off had been the wrong decision. They didn't necessarily have to acknowledge that Sparky was the OTP, just that Elizabeth should have stayed. Even if they had realized this very late in the season, they could still have had the team mount a rescue mission and bring her back. We would have been happy that we got to see more of Sparky, even if the writers weren't intentionally writing it, and it would have done John's character a lot of justice.

    If Elizabeth had been rescued, it would also have looked very natural for the show, because returning to rescue those in the hands of the enemy would have just been the right thing to do. It would have been much more natural than Carson's return, because although his sudden appearance in "The Kindred, Part 1" was creative and completely unexpected, I can't help but wonder how long the writers had to think to come up with something like that. Carson died in "Sunday"; there's no denying that, and the fact that the writers decided to bring him back due to popular demand demonstrated how they were blatantly trying to cover up a mistake. If Elizabeth had returned, it wouldn't have appeared as obvious.

    A bit of humility might have saved the writers and the show. Too bad that they didn't even have that.
    sigpic
    Please visit sga-rising.com for a Season 6 of Stargate: Atlantis
    View my projects on FF.net || AO3 || YouTube

    (Formerly known as Sparks of Atlantis)

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      Hey all! It's probably been nearly four years since I last posted but I used to be a regular, particularly in this thread. Thanks to the help of a kind mind (Bagpuss!) I was able to reactivate my old account.

      Due to work and RL factors I drifted away form any real fandom interactions for a long time. Recently, when I was sick I decided to binge watch "Once Upon a Time" on Netflix. Anyway, even though I have some major problems with the show, I got hooked and even started wading into the forums. Naturally, I could not resist discussing ships. Once again, I seem to have become intrigued by a pairing that might never be (but I admit that is part of the appeal)

      All this is a long winded way of saying that I started to think about Shep/Weir again. It is certainly not my first ship, but I think it will probably always be my favorite, or at least very near the top. It;s good to be back for a while.

      Signature By Amber Moon

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        Originally posted by Sparks of Atlantis View Post
        I've always believed that it was fate that Rachel got pregnant in Season 4. The writers seemed so set on bringing Sheyla on-screen in Season 4, but the fact that Rachel got pregnant just seemed to mean that Sheyla was never meant to be. If the writers hadn't held up their noses so high and acted as if the fans' opinions didn't matter, they might have received this message and also realized that writing Elizabeth off had been the wrong decision. They didn't necessarily have to acknowledge that Sparky was the OTP, just that Elizabeth should have stayed. Even if they had realized this very late in the season, they could still have had the team mount a rescue mission and bring her back. We would have been happy that we got to see more of Sparky, even if the writers weren't intentionally writing it, and it would have done John's character a lot of justice.

        If Elizabeth had been rescued, it would also have looked very natural for the show, because returning to rescue those in the hands of the enemy would have just been the right thing to do. It would have been much more natural than Carson's return, because although his sudden appearance in "The Kindred, Part 1" was creative and completely unexpected, I can't help but wonder how long the writers had to think to come up with something like that. Carson died in "Sunday"; there's no denying that, and the fact that the writers decided to bring him back due to popular demand demonstrated how they were blatantly trying to cover up a mistake. If Elizabeth had returned, it wouldn't have appeared as obvious.

        A bit of humility might have saved the writers and the show. Too bad that they didn't even have that.
        All that may very well be true, but I'm of the mind that they planned to bring Carson back all along and just used the fans for publicity. I base that on the fact that the Elizabeth fans made just as big a fuss as his fans did and got roundly ignored.

        Originally posted by Royal_Nonesuch View Post
        Hey all! It's probably been nearly four years since I last posted but I used to be a regular, particularly in this thread. Thanks to the help of a kind mind (Bagpuss!) I was able to reactivate my old account.

        Due to work and RL factors I drifted away form any real fandom interactions for a long time. Recently, when I was sick I decided to binge watch "Once Upon a Time" on Netflix. Anyway, even though I have some major problems with the show, I got hooked and even started wading into the forums. Naturally, I could not resist discussing ships. Once again, I seem to have become intrigued by a pairing that might never be (but I admit that is part of the appeal)

        All this is a long winded way of saying that I started to think about Shep/Weir again. It is certainly not my first ship, but I think it will probably always be my favorite, or at least very near the top. It;s good to be back for a while.
        Well, hello stranger. You may be surprised that I'm still around after all these years. What else do I have to do? Apparently nothing. Welcome back. Sparky is still the biggest het ship around these parts.
        sigpic

        Visit us at SGA Rising for our version of season six.

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          Originally posted by Southern Red View Post
          ...I'm of the mind that they planned to bring Carson back all along and just used the fans for publicity. I base that on the fact that the Elizabeth fans made just as big a fuss as his fans did and got roundly ignored.
          Second that for the full 100%!

          And I was actively involved in the SEW-campaign so I know we did our best to make ourselves heard and seen all the same as those involved in the SCB-campaign.

          ****

          Also, won't be here for the postathon as I'm not in the right state of mind to be watching SGA today, and I'm shifting in my schedules so the timing is not ideal for me at the moment.
          Heightmeyer's Lemming -- still the coolest Lemming of the forum

          Proper Stargate Rewatch -- season 10 of SG-1

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            Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Lazy Sunday and 5 hours and 20 minutes until Tao of Rodney! And welcome back to Royal_Nonesuch!

            Originally posted by JT-2 View Post
            I'm pretty sure I'll be available tomorrow for the post-a-thon, which is great because Tao of Rodney is my favorite episode.
            Yay! I'll be looking forward to your awesome snark!

            Originally posted by Southern Red View Post
            All that may very well be true, but I'm of the mind that they planned to bring Carson back all along and just used the fans for publicity. I base that on the fact that the Elizabeth fans made just as big a fuss as his fans did and got roundly ignored.
            I have to agree with this as well. TPTW just didn't care about Elizabeth.

            Originally posted by Falcon Horus View Post
            Also, won't be here for the postathon as I'm not in the right state of mind to be watching SGA today, and I'm shifting in my schedules so the timing is not ideal for me at the moment.
            Awww, we'll miss you! *hugs*
            (This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
            Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Raelis View Post
              I have a question for fandom veterans. Does a Sparky fic rec list exist? Not just a list with a few recs, but, like, a big, comprehensive fic rec list with all the 'classics' and 'must-reads' and fics sorted outn by popular tropes (baby!fic, first time!fic, fic based on specific episodes, etc)? 'Cause I've searched, but I haven't really found anything, which made me think I might have been looking in the wrong places. (I did find a few of McShep fic rec lists, though! And some nice long Sam/Jack and Jack/Daniel lists. But they're not quite what I was looking for, obviously.) I've found that such rec lists are a real treasure for any fandom newbie.
              Hi Raelis. I discovered fan fic only about 9 months ago and have been completely hooked ever since. I have mainly been reading Sparky fic on Fanfiction.net. To go with my complete sadness of sparky I have a sadness of writing lists and I have a list of all the ones I have read and loved so that I could find them again.

              If you want I can send a list of a few (there are about 50 or so though) but you need to let me know what you are looking for exactly - do they need to be complete? Long or short? Rating? Let me know.
              sigpic

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                I think it is fairly obvious that TPTW had no care for Elizabeth despite the strength of her character but I really am at a loss as to why. I have started watching it again (!) because I bought the whole lot on blu-ray the other day but this time I am dragging the husband along for the ride. He even said he didn't want to watch after what they did to Weir.

                Anyway, just another sign of their complete lack of respect for her, the front of the boxset id of the Stargate and the city - fine. The back of the box is the fifth season cast - not including anyone who was in it before or more often. Elizabeth is only on one of the inner boxes! That kind of made me mad - almost to the point of wanting to send it back - a bit crazy I know. I didn't though.

                But I remember TPTW going on about how they were bringing Carson back for the fans but they never made a peep about Elizabeth. Now, don't get me wrong we loved Carson in this house but I asked my husband the other day that if he had the choice of having Beckett or Weir back he agreed and said he would rather Weir.

                I know that so much time has now passed since the show ended but the fact that people are still writing about it now makes me wonder... why couldn't they do it? I think the audience would be there. This thread proves it. I would totally be up for it if they were to rectify their mistakes.

                Anyway, enjoy the post-a-thon tonight. I am jealous as I love the Tao of Rodney but we are still halfway through Rising right now and I can't make him skip ahead - can I?
                sigpic

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                  Hello everyone!

                  I’m hoping to be here for the post-a-thon tonight because ’Tao of Rodney’ isn’t only a great Sparky episode but it also gave Rodney some redeeming moments.

                  But for me it's mostly about Sparky:

                  sigpic

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                    Well, hello stranger. You may be surprised that I'm still around after all these years. What else do I have to do? Apparently nothing. Welcome back. Sparky is still the biggest het ship around these parts.
                    Hi Red! I absolutely remember you. It doesn't surprise me one bit that the ship still getting a fair amount of traffic is this one. It was/is awesome. Maybe when they get around to making an Atlantis movie the writers and producers will have got their collective heads out of their posterior and bring back Torri and give us some Sparky!

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                      Originally posted by Annelantis View Post
                      Hi Raelis. I discovered fan fic only about 9 months ago and have been completely hooked ever since. I have mainly been reading Sparky fic on Fanfiction.net. To go with my complete sadness of sparky I have a sadness of writing lists and I have a list of all the ones I have read and loved so that I could find them again.

                      If you want I can send a list of a few (there are about 50 or so though) but you need to let me know what you are looking for exactly - do they need to be complete? Long or short? Rating? Let me know.
                      Thank you very much, Annelantis! Actually, I am not so much in need of fic recs as I am simply interested if a Sparky fic rec list exists. I remember when I first got into the fandom, I had a hard time finding good fic because I wasn't able to find any rec lists - and rec lists are the first thing I look for when I get into a new fandom. I was thinking more of newbies who have the same problem. And the SG-1 rec lists on this site made me think it'd be cool if there was a similar one for Sparky.

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                        Originally posted by Annelantis View Post

                        I know that so much time has now passed since the show ended but the fact that people are still writing about it now makes me wonder... why couldn't they do it? I think the audience would be there. This thread proves it. I would totally be up for it if they were to rectify their mistakes.
                        Originally posted by Royal_Nonesuch View Post
                        Hi Red! I absolutely remember you. It doesn't surprise me one bit that the ship still getting a fair amount of traffic is this one. It was/is awesome. Maybe when they get around to making an Atlantis movie the writers and producers will have got their collective heads out of their posterior and bring back Torri and give us some Sparky!
                        On the subject of the movie, JM had this to say recently on his blog:

                        msstargate writes: “My question for the Mailbag…with the economy finally picking up, any chance we see the long awaited SG1/Atlantis movie or movies?”

                        Answer: Economy aside, I’m sorry to say that the chances of seeing either of those movies is beyond remote. The sets are long gone and the actors have moved on. From the studio point of view, it wouldn’t make sense to spend the money to rebuilt all the sets for a one-off movie. And given the demise of dvd (once a terrific source of revenue particularly with regard to Stargate), it makes even less financial sense to do the movies. Instead of a “one and done” movie, a new t.v. series that would allow the production to amortize the costs of the expensive sets over several seasons would make more sense. A new series would also leave the door open to appearances by former Stargate alums as well. It’s simply a question of if and when MGM wants to breathe life back into its most successful television franchise.


                        Originally posted by Raelis View Post
                        Thank you very much, Annelantis! Actually, I am not so much in need of fic recs as I am simply interested if a Sparky fic rec list exists. I remember when I first got into the fandom, I had a hard time finding good fic because I wasn't able to find any rec lists - and rec lists are the first thing I look for when I get into a new fandom. I was thinking more of newbies who have the same problem. And the SG-1 rec lists on this site made me think it'd be cool if there was a similar one for Sparky.
                        I find FanFiction.net to be very unreliable as to quality of fics. The best site I know of is Command Dynamics. This site has a lot of bad fics, but if you check under "series" and "top tens", you will find some excellent stories. You can also search on a number of other topics.
                        sigpic

                        Visit us at SGA Rising for our version of season six.

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                          Thanks mcuh for that info. I didn't realize the sets were gone, that is actually pretty sad. I see what JM is saying there, but I have to believe there are ways to get this stuff done that are financially feasible.

                          I've been out of the lop for a long time, but I heard an interview with Joe Flanigan recently where he started to dish a little. It sounds like things weren't great between the producers/writers and the cast. Has there been more of that coming out lately?

                          Thanks a lot
                          Royal

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                            Originally posted by Southern Red View Post
                            On the subject of the movie, JM had this to say recently on his blog:

                            msstargate writes: “My question for the Mailbag…with the economy finally picking up, any chance we see the long awaited SG1/Atlantis movie or movies?”

                            Answer: Economy aside, I’m sorry to say that the chances of seeing either of those movies is beyond remote. The sets are long gone and the actors have moved on. From the studio point of view, it wouldn’t make sense to spend the money to rebuilt all the sets for a one-off movie. And given the demise of dvd (once a terrific source of revenue particularly with regard to Stargate), it makes even less financial sense to do the movies. Instead of a “one and done” movie, a new t.v. series that would allow the production to amortize the costs of the expensive sets over several seasons would make more sense. A new series would also leave the door open to appearances by former Stargate alums as well. It’s simply a question of if and when MGM wants to breathe life back into its most successful television franchise.
                            Thanks for bringing that over. As much as we would love to see a movie I get what JM are saying, from the financial pov it would make more sense to do a whole new show then brining back any of the older once, however if they would decide to do a new show then I do hope that they will really sit down and look at what went wrong with the last shows and really think each episode and storyline through before they start filming, I mean sure it can’t be perfect because that’s impossible but they should at least look into it and the fanbase and show more support for the cast and crew.
                            sigpic

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                              Originally posted by Southern Red View Post
                              I find FanFiction.net to be very unreliable as to quality of fics. The best site I know of is Command Dynamics. This site has a lot of bad fics, but if you check under "series" and "top tens", you will find some excellent stories. You can also search on a number of other topics.
                              Thanks! Command Dynamics is indeed an excellent site. And it has more than a thousand stories!

                              I agree about FanFiction.net. Thi site does have some gems, but for the most part I try to avoid it, unless something is specifically recced to me.

                              I wish there were more Sparky fics on Archive of Our Own - I find this fic depository very user-friendly,and the quality of writing over there is overall pretty high (much better than ff.net. anyway). There are some Sparky writers there, but not enough for my liking.
                              Last edited by Raelis; 27 January 2013, 11:16 AM.

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                                Originally posted by Royal_Nonesuch View Post
                                Thanks mcuh for that info. I didn't realize the sets were gone, that is actually pretty sad. I see what JM is saying there, but I have to believe there are ways to get this stuff done that are financially feasible.

                                I've been out of the lop for a long time, but I heard an interview with Joe Flanigan recently where he started to dish a little. It sounds like things weren't great between the producers/writers and the cast. Has there been more of that coming out lately?

                                Thanks a lot
                                Royal
                                Not just recently, but for years now, JF has been openly disdainful of the way Torri and Paul were treated, especially Torri. At every con, any time her name comes up he goes off on how badly she was treated. He has said a lot of critical things about TPTB, including how he was cut out of the loop when he protested some of their decisions. Oh yeah, he's still pissed, and it takes very little to get him off on the subject. He has consistently said that the actors were treated very badly.

                                Originally posted by Brie View Post
                                Thanks for bringing that over. As much as we would love to see a movie I get what JM are saying, from the financial pov it would make more sense to do a whole new show then brining back any of the older once, however if they would decide to do a new show then I do hope that they will really sit down and look at what went wrong with the last shows and really think each episode and storyline through before they start filming, I mean sure it can’t be perfect because that’s impossible but they should at least look into it and the fanbase and show more support for the cast and crew.
                                Any new show decisions will be made by MGM, and it's doubtful the original writers, producers, etc will be involved. These kinds of show biz decisions rely very little on fan opinion. They will go by whether they think it is marketable and what the general trends are at the time. It's almost certain they would go with a younger cast, and either re-imagine the concept by going back to the beginning or push it into the future. I doubt we'll ever see the original cast again, except maybe McKay or some of the characters from SG-1. They don't think they did anything wrong and never will. They have been very dismissive of the online fanbase from the very beginning.
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                                Visit us at SGA Rising for our version of season six.

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