Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Scary Kitty]

SciFi is running Conversion right now as this week's Friday night SGA rerun. Just got done with the scene where Carson has just diagnosed John's condition and he gives Elizabeth the bad news, and she's looking totally shocked and scared and desperate for a solution.

Ah, the angst! *flails*

[Scary Kitty]

Best Sparky Quotes

#1-40

#41 and up...

41. SHEPPARD: You doing OK?
WEIR: Sure, all things considered. (She smiles.) Not bad for a dead woman.
(This mortal Coil)

42. SHEPPARD: They're never gonna make the trade, Kolya. Why don't you just finish this?
KOLYA: I think you underestimate the sympathetic nature of Doctor Weir.
SHEPPARD: Well, then, you underestimate Elizabeth.
(Common Ground)

43. CALDWELL: What do you want?
PHEBUS/WEIR: I want Sheppard.
(The Long Goodbye)

44.

Spoiler:

SHEPPARD: That's it? You're just gonna let me go?
McKAY: That field medic – the one you defied orders to go back and try and rescue. You knew her personally. You were ... involved.
SHEPPARD: Yeah, you know everything.
McKAY (sympathetically): It was a hard choice. Certainly you didn't intend things to go as badly as they did. Things just don't always go the way we plan. We know where to find you.
(Sheppard turns and starts to walk towards the car.)
McKAY: Detective.
(Sheppard stops and turns back as McKay approaches him again.)
McKAY: Remember when I told you I once met another version of you?
SHEPPARD: Yeah.
McKAY: I know you'll probably think this sounds ridiculous, but a little while ago we accidentally opened a rift in space/time – went through to an alternate version of reality. It was very similar to ours in many ways. We met a team much like the one I work with, only you were the leader. You were a hero, saved the world several times over.
SHEPPARD (smiling bitterly): Doesn't sound much like me.
McKAY: I don't think there's much difference between you and that other John Sheppard I met. It's amazing how one incident can entirely alter the course of your life. Still, I like to believe you have the same strength of character. That's why I told you the truth.
(Vegas)

45. WEIR: You and Rodney have been bugging me for a chance at trying a Jumper as a submersible, but you sure went a hell of a long way to make me say yes!
SHEPPARD: Well, you still haven't said it yet.
(Elizabeth smiles again.)
WEIR: I just did.
(Grace Under Pressure)

46. (John takes the radio and activates it.)
SHEPPARD: Elizabeth, where are you?
WEIR (smiling delightedly at Lorne): We're in Jumper Two. We're cloaked, directly above you. Are you alright?
(Condemned)

47. WEIR: You said so yourself – you are the ranking military officer. I can’t chance you getting infected.
SHEPPARD: I can’t chance you getting infected. Bates?
BATES: Yes, sir.
SHEPPARD: Unlock the gym.
BATES: Yes, sir. (He walks towards the console.)
WEIR: Stand down, Bates. (Into comms) You are not in command here, Major.
SHEPPARD: Well, we’ll agree to disagree. Bates, open the door.
(Bates looks at Elizabeth for a moment, then steps forward again.)
WEIR (firmly): Don’t.
(Bates stops again.)
SHEPPARD: Elizabeth, he’s heading right for you.
(Hot Zone)

48. (spoilered for space)

Spoiler:

WEIR: And we’re defenceless – you said so yourself. How do you know going off on some half-assed rescue mission isn’t gonna to bring them all right back here to our doorstep?
SHEPPARD: Maybe it will. But it’s the right thing to do. Why? Because it is!
WEIR: John ...
SHEPPARD: If we’re not gonna do this – and I mean right now – let’s just turn tail and pack up, because they’re coming.
WEIR: You don’t know that.
SHEPPARD: Our people are in the hands of the enemy, Doctor. Do you know what that means? It is just a matter of time before the Wraith figure out that this is the base of our operations.
WEIR: I just need more information. I mean, who knows, maybe we could negotiate a peaceful ...
SHEPPARD: Peaceful? Are you kidding?! We weren’t there for more than a few hours before they showed up.
WEIR: Is it possible they came because of you, and that one of these people you brought back here with you tipped them off?
SHEPPARD: It’s possible.
WEIR: See, that is exactly the kind of snap decision I’m referring to!
SHEPPARD: They’re not all bad people, and, you know, if we’re gonna stick around here, we need friends.
WEIR: OK. I see your point. Now you see mine: I will not authorise a rescue mission unless I am sure there is at least a remote chance of success. I’m not sending more good people, including you, to their deaths.
SHEPPARD: OK.
(Rising)

49. SHEPPARD: I'll call you back after the test – how does that sound?
WEIR: You'd better.
(Trinity)

50. CALDWELL: Well, if you'll excuse me, I'm sure you'll both agree that the paperwork on this is going to be a nightmare ... (he smiles wickedly) especially that kiss.
(John and Elizabeth stare at him in horror.)
SHEPPARD: Yes, sir!
CALDWELL: Well, try not to kill each other while I'm gone.
(Elizabeth gives him a half-hearted thumbs-up. He turns and walks away. Elizabeth smiles ruefully at John, then looks away and slides down in the bed in embarrassment.)
(The Long Goodbye)

51. [Cut to a shot of the infirmary with Sheppard on the exam bed, alert in the foreground, Beckett and Weir in the background. Sheppard is staring rather fixedly at the ceiling, looking grim. Cut back to Beckett and Weir.]
BECKETT: You should talk to ‘im. He's hiding it very well, but if I was him? I'd be scared to death.
(Conversion)

Carson totally knows.

[Southern Red]

I agree with many of her points, but she has a number of errors in the content which make it hard for me to be impressed (actor heritage, episode placement)... Still, it's a good concept, and readily expresses some of what made fans angry about the decision to cancel Atlantis.

I totally agree. There are a lot of factual errors of the sort that would have been easy to check. And she makes statements with no factual basis like the bit about San Francisco. I agree with her bits about TPTB and the info on the movie though.

Yeah, the errors in background info kinda tripped me up a bit; I was surprised that with all the research and footnoting into fan reactions, she hadn't double-checked her show info. But even with those mistakes, the fact that it is presented in a more academic format is a good move. I hope she'll continue to work on it.

I also liked the academic format yet my hands itched to reach for my red pencil. Her logic is questionable in a number of places and she frequently states opinion as fact with no examples. If this were labeled as an essay, it would be acceptable but she doesn't really do that. It gives a good overview of fan unrest in a certain sector of fandom but there are also other sectors (like shippers for example) that could write their own summary of events with entirely different conclusions in places. A revision would be a great idea.

[Probie]

Best Sparky Quotes

#1-40

#41 and up...

41. SHEPPARD: You doing OK?
WEIR: Sure, all things considered. (She smiles.) Not bad for a dead woman.
(This mortal Coil)

42. SHEPPARD: They're never gonna make the trade, Kolya. Why don't you just finish this?
KOLYA: I think you underestimate the sympathetic nature of Doctor Weir.
SHEPPARD: Well, then, you underestimate Elizabeth.
(Common Ground)

43. CALDWELL: What do you want?
PHEBUS/WEIR: I want Sheppard.
(The Long Goodbye)

44.

Spoiler:

SHEPPARD: That's it? You're just gonna let me go?
McKAY: That field medic – the one you defied orders to go back and try and rescue. You knew her personally. You were ... involved.
SHEPPARD: Yeah, you know everything.
McKAY (sympathetically): It was a hard choice. Certainly you didn't intend things to go as badly as they did. Things just don't always go the way we plan. We know where to find you.
(Sheppard turns and starts to walk towards the car.)
McKAY: Detective.
(Sheppard stops and turns back as McKay approaches him again.)
McKAY: Remember when I told you I once met another version of you?
SHEPPARD: Yeah.
McKAY: I know you'll probably think this sounds ridiculous, but a little while ago we accidentally opened a rift in space/time – went through to an alternate version of reality. It was very similar to ours in many ways. We met a team much like the one I work with, only you were the leader. You were a hero, saved the world several times over.
SHEPPARD (smiling bitterly): Doesn't sound much like me.
McKAY: I don't think there's much difference between you and that other John Sheppard I met. It's amazing how one incident can entirely alter the course of your life. Still, I like to believe you have the same strength of character. That's why I told you the truth.
(Vegas)

45. WEIR: You and Rodney have been bugging me for a chance at trying a Jumper as a submersible, but you sure went a hell of a long way to make me say yes!
SHEPPARD: Well, you still haven't said it yet.
(Elizabeth smiles again.)
WEIR: I just did.
(Grace Under Pressure)

46. (John takes the radio and activates it.)
SHEPPARD: Elizabeth, where are you?
WEIR (smiling delightedly at Lorne): We're in Jumper Two. We're cloaked, directly above you. Are you alright?
(Condemned)

47. WEIR: You said so yourself – you are the ranking military officer. I can’t chance you getting infected.
SHEPPARD: I can’t chance you getting infected. Bates?
BATES: Yes, sir.
SHEPPARD: Unlock the gym.
BATES: Yes, sir. (He walks towards the console.)
WEIR: Stand down, Bates. (Into comms) You are not in command here, Major.
SHEPPARD: Well, we’ll agree to disagree. Bates, open the door.
(Bates looks at Elizabeth for a moment, then steps forward again.)
WEIR (firmly): Don’t.
(Bates stops again.)
SHEPPARD: Elizabeth, he’s heading right for you.
(Hot Zone)

48. (spoilered for space)

Spoiler:

WEIR: And we’re defenceless – you said so yourself. How do you know going off on some half-assed rescue mission isn’t gonna to bring them all right back here to our doorstep?
SHEPPARD: Maybe it will. But it’s the right thing to do. Why? Because it is!
WEIR: John ...
SHEPPARD: If we’re not gonna do this – and I mean right now – let’s just turn tail and pack up, because they’re coming.
WEIR: You don’t know that.
SHEPPARD: Our people are in the hands of the enemy, Doctor. Do you know what that means? It is just a matter of time before the Wraith figure out that this is the base of our operations.
WEIR: I just need more information. I mean, who knows, maybe we could negotiate a peaceful ...
SHEPPARD: Peaceful? Are you kidding?! We weren’t there for more than a few hours before they showed up.
WEIR: Is it possible they came because of you, and that one of these people you brought back here with you tipped them off?
SHEPPARD: It’s possible.
WEIR: See, that is exactly the kind of snap decision I’m referring to!
SHEPPARD: They’re not all bad people, and, you know, if we’re gonna stick around here, we need friends.
WEIR: OK. I see your point. Now you see mine: I will not authorise a rescue mission unless I am sure there is at least a remote chance of success. I’m not sending more good people, including you, to their deaths.
SHEPPARD: OK.
(Rising)

49. SHEPPARD: I'll call you back after the test – how does that sound?
WEIR: You'd better.
(Trinity)

50. CALDWELL: Well, if you'll excuse me, I'm sure you'll both agree that the paperwork on this is going to be a nightmare ... (he smiles wickedly) especially that kiss.
(John and Elizabeth stare at him in horror.)
SHEPPARD: Yes, sir!
CALDWELL: Well, try not to kill each other while I'm gone.
(Elizabeth gives him a half-hearted thumbs-up. He turns and walks away. Elizabeth smiles ruefully at John, then looks away and slides down in the bed in embarrassment.)
(The Long Goodbye)

51. [Cut to a shot of the infirmary with Sheppard on the exam bed, alert in the foreground, Beckett and Weir in the background. Sheppard is staring rather fixedly at the ceiling, looking grim. Cut back to Beckett and Weir.]
BECKETT: You should talk to ‘im. He's hiding it very well, but if I was him? I'd be scared to death.
(Conversion)

Carson totally knows.

52.EVERETT: I don't need to explain myself to you, Doctor, and I don't need your cooperation.
SHEPPARD: But you could probably use mine. [EVERETT glares.] Sir. So with all due respect, please answer Doctor Weir's question.
EVERETT: Is that a threat, Major?
SHEPPARD: No, sir. I understand you need to establish a clear chain of command. But if you cut Doctor Weir out of the loop, you'll only alienate the people whose trust and respect she's earned, which is everyone on the base. [He pauses.] Including me. (The Siege 2)

[Anuna]

I totally agree. There are a lot of factual errors of the sort that would have been easy to check. And she makes statements with no factual basis like the bit about San Francisco. I agree with her bits about TPTB and the info on the movie though.



I also liked the academic format yet my hands itched to reach for my red pencil. Her logic is questionable in a number of places and she frequently states opinion as fact with no examples. If this were labeled as an essay, it would be acceptable but she doesn't really do that. It gives a good overview of fan unrest in a certain sector of fandom but there are also other sectors (like shippers for example) that could write their own summary of events with entirely different conclusions in places. A revision would be a great idea.

Agreed. I must say, I was very confused with San Francisco bit. Someone care to explain? Other than that, the way she wrote it is quite inspiring, I could do something like that focusing on Elizabeth and John. I used to kick ass in social psychology essays.

Other than that, I think I'll be vidding soon. I'm planning to do a vid to "Darling pretty" by Mark Knopfler and "The Wrestler" by Bruce Springsteen. The second one is just calling for "Vegas" and S4/5 clips with flashbacks to Elizabeth. What an amazing song, totally John - fitting.

[Southern Red]

Agreed. I must say, I was very confused with San Francisco bit. Someone care to explain? Other than that, the way she wrote it is quite inspiring, I could do something like that focusing on Elizabeth and John. I used to kick ass in social psychology essays.

Other than that, I think I'll be vidding soon. I'm planning to do a vid to "Darling pretty" by Mark Knopfler and "The Wrestler" by Bruce Springsteen. The second one is just calling for "Vegas" and S4/5 clips with flashbacks to Elizabeth. What an amazing song, totally John - fitting.

Oh do write the essay. I promise not to grade it. LOL But I'd be glad to beta. And no, that's not the same thing. We definitely need the definitive Sparky essay.

Since she mentioned DADT (don't ask, don't tell) I guess the San Fran bit was some sort of gay reference. But the fact that it is John's hometown is not established in canon. When he went back for this dad's funeral the cars had Maryland plates. Granted he said this was "one of" the houses he grew up in, but wouldn't a funeral be in your main hometown? I don't know the person who wrote this so I can't speculate on her motivation. But frankly, I'm at the point where if one more person implies that John Sheppard is gay, I will beat them with my purse. Did they watch the show?

[Probie]

Did you ever meet Joe Flanigan and Torri Higginson at a convention? I ask this because I dreamed that I met Joe Flanigan at a convention held in my house (I do not know why it is in my house. My brain is sick lol) and I speak french with him. If only it could be true ...

[Anuna]

Oh do write the essay. I promise not to grade it. LOL But I'd be glad to beta. And no, that's not the same thing. We definitely need the definitive Sparky essay.

Since she mentioned DADT (don't ask, don't tell) I guess the San Fran bit was some sort of gay reference. But the fact that it is John's hometown is not established in canon. When he went back for this dad's funeral the cars had Maryland plates. Granted he said this was "one of" the houses he grew up in, but wouldn't a funeral be in your main hometown? I don't know the person who wrote this so I can't speculate on her motivation. But frankly, I'm at the point where if one more person implies that John Sheppard is gay, I will beat them with my purse. Did they watch the show?

*headdesking*

*more headdesking*

Isn't it established that John is a Kirk? Did we and some other people out there even watch the same show, or is there a completely different version of SGA?! If John's hometown was established in canon, the I would know. (actually, is anyone's hometown established in canon? We do know Carson's from Scotland and Radek is from Czech Republic, we know Teyla is Athosian and Ronon is from Sateda. And that's it, correct me if I'm wrong.).

Oooo - kay. I shall try to write a sparky essay for you all. But I will need help and beta reading

[Scary Kitty]

Good afternoon, Sparkies! Happy Sparky!Family Day!

Your fic rec for today is:

Indelible Stains (Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV), by hope_tang.
Summary: There are some marks you can never wash away. There are some memories you can never forget. There are some people you can never lose.
Don't let the scary beginning fool you, there's a very happy ending.

Happy Sparky reading!

[Scary Kitty]

I also liked the academic format yet my hands itched to reach for my red pencil. Her logic is questionable in a number of places and she frequently states opinion as fact with no examples. If this were labeled as an essay, it would be acceptable but she doesn't really do that. It gives a good overview of fan unrest in a certain sector of fandom but there are also other sectors (like shippers for example) that could write their own summary of events with entirely different conclusions in places. A revision would be a great idea.

Heh, you and me both. It's got some good bones to build on, but it definitely needs some more meat to broaden its scope of the fandom.

Agreed. I must say, I was very confused with San Francisco bit. Someone care to explain? Other than that, the way she wrote it is quite inspiring, I could do something like that focusing on Elizabeth and John. I used to kick ass in social psychology essays.

I agree with SR. Anuna, you totally need to do that essay!

Since she mentioned DADT (don't ask, don't tell) I guess the San Fran bit was some sort of gay reference. But the fact that it is John's hometown is not established in canon. When he went back for this dad's funeral the cars had Maryland plates. Granted he said this was "one of" the houses he grew up in, but wouldn't a funeral be in your main hometown? I don't know the person who wrote this so I can't speculate on her motivation. But frankly, I'm at the point where if one more person implies that John Sheppard is gay, I will beat them with my purse. Did they watch the show?

I wonder if maybe the San Fran bit came from John's reference to Stanford University in Outcast? Of course, Stanford isn't in San Fran proper, though it is in the Bay Area. Still, I think you're right on the funeral in one's hometown idea. Hmm...

Oooo - kay. I shall try to write a sparky essay for you all. But I will need help and beta reading

You know where to find me.

[Erin87]

Since it is still Sparky!Family Day where I'm at, I present you all with my newest story: Family, Friends, and the Occasional Stargate. All the info about it's in the author's note so I'm not going to go into it here at the risk of sounding like I'm repeating myself.

Enjoy!

[Southern Red]

*headdesking*

*more headdesking*

Isn't it established that John is a Kirk? Did we and some other people out there even watch the same show, or is there a completely different version of SGA?! If John's hometown was established in canon, the I would know. (actually, is anyone's hometown established in canon? We do know Carson's from Scotland and Radek is from Czech Republic, we know Teyla is Athosian and Ronon is from Sateda. And that's it, correct me if I'm wrong.).

Oooo - kay. I shall try to write a sparky essay for you all. But I will need help and beta reading

And Rodney is Canadian, but as for towns, no clue.

Good afternoon, Sparkies! Happy Sparky!Family Day!

Your fic rec for today is:

Indelible Stains (Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV), by hope_tang.
Summary: There are some marks you can never wash away. There are some memories you can never forget. There are some people you can never lose.
Don't let the scary beginning fool you, there's a very happy ending.

Happy Sparky reading!

I absolutely love that fic.

Heh, you and me both. It's got some good bones to build on, but it definitely needs some more meat to broaden its scope of the fandom.



I agree with SR. Anuna, you totally need to do that essay!



I wonder if maybe the San Fran bit came from John's reference to Stanford University in Outcast? Of course, Stanford isn't in San Fran proper, though it is in the Bay Area. Still, I think you're right on the funeral in one's hometown idea. Hmm...



You know where to find me.

And I guess in The Rising when John tossed the coin that was the Golden Gate Bridge in the background, though I'm not entirely sure. Anyway, JM said the San Francisco thing was an homage to Star Trek.

Since it is still Sparky!Family Day where I'm at, I present you all with my newest story: Family, Friends, and the Occasional Stargate. All the info about it's in the author's note so I'm not going to go into it here at the risk of sounding like I'm repeating myself.

Enjoy!

*runs off to read*

[gateraid]

For those of you who don't spend any time in the S5 Complaints and Misgivings thread (or haven't been there recently), Lucylee posted a link to a fantastic essay over on LJ discussing many of the issues we've had with the decisions made in Seasons 4 and 5. Give it a read, I think you'll be blown away.

http://community.livejournal.com/swirlygate/6359.html

I agree with most of the comments expressed here re that 'essay'. It's opinion, stated as fact. Some valid, some not. I also thought the san fran thing was a reference to starfleet command, rather than John Sheppard starring in StarGayte Atlantis. It also makes for a recognisable shot at the end, with the bridge. Now if Shep & Lorne had been having a candlelit dinner for two on the balcony, gazing out at the bridge, well yes that would have been a big hint.

There were also a good number of theories not touched on - that JK/JS actually replaced EW/TH as the female lead, rather than CB/PM as the doctor; the emphasis on effects and so on, to name a few.

[Southern Red]

Since it is still Sparky!Family Day where I'm at, I present you all with my newest story: Family, Friends, and the Occasional Stargate. All the info about it's in the author's note so I'm not going to go into it here at the risk of sounding like I'm repeating myself.

Enjoy!

I'm back and it was fabulous. Can't wait for more.

[Erin87]

I'm back and it was fabulous. Can't wait for more.

Thanks! Glad you liked it. Any ideas for more?