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Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

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    Originally posted by Anuna View Post
    Speaking of smiles....

    http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x...1/sci9py-1.jpg

    I know Elizabeth smiles beautifully in "Tao" and "BiS". Also in "The Rising". How about other people? If I recall correctly, Ford smiles a lot. Teyla too. Point me to some good clips?
    Elizabeth has some wonderful smiley moments. I can't go back for caps now (would take too long) but you've already picked out the broad smile in "Tao of Rodney". She does it also in "Trinity" when she's amused at how enthusiastic Rodney is over the discovery of the Ancient weapon. Both were full-fledged smiles with teeth. I remember both vividly because Torri has perfectly straight, large teeth and you can't help but notice.

    She also gives John a ton of flirty smiles. "Intruder" (coffee scene) "Inferno" (hot babe scene). One of her best for John is the one she gives at the end of "The Hive". She also does the same sort of smile in "Epiphany".

    And if you want some really beautiful Elizabeth smiles (though they might make you sick) check out "Irresistable". She smiles constantly there. So does Rachel, actually.

    As for Rachel: Um, Teyla smiles a lot around Ronon. You get a cute one in Echoes as she's meditating with him. Also, I think in Sateda? And perhaps Trinity, when they're together. She smiles nicely in "Intruder" when John and Elizabeth get back. Teyla smiles a lot, actually. She has some beautiful, sad smiles in "Critical Mass" which Charon.

    Ford, I don't remember much. I want to say maybe Childhood's End?

    Originally posted by Anuna View Post
    Ooo, more of those smaller linky things. I can see those. The general link SK gives above gets blocked.

    Can someone link any Liz/John pictures through the deep links?
    Visit SGArising.com to read our virtual continuation of the Atlantis series!

    Comment


      Aw, you guys are awesome. *makes notes* Let's hope my computer won't let me down this time
      I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Anuna View Post
        Yeah, you must be right! But on a serious note, it's somehow in character for John. He's a private person. He's slow. He doesn't show much, he doesn't put his tender emotions on display, which is why he can seem awkward in emotional situations. But at the same time I think he's not confused about how he feels.
        Yep. I have no doubt that what happened between him and his family may have had something to do with why he's built that wall and keeps his distance. Maybe he thinks he's cursed... everyone he loves dies or is otherwise taken from him, so it's safer simply to keep his feelings locked inside and not reveal them to others. Poor John.
        (This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
        Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Anuna View Post
          Yeah, you must be right! But on a serious note, it's somehow in character for John. He's a private person. He's slow. He doesn't show much, he doesn't put his tender emotions on display, which is why he can seem awkward in emotional situations. But at the same time I think he's not confused about how he feels.
          I've always seen John as someone who cares more deeply than most people. It must be the Irish because my husband's family is like that, particularly the men. They even joke about it and cry at the drop of a hat. John probably hates that about himself and tries (like in Adrift) to hold it back with limited success. I love the little moment at the end of GiTM
          Spoiler:
          just when he steps forward and we get that devastated look on his face. He glances around for a split second at the others. I always saw that as John hoping they weren't paying any attention to him because he just knew he couldn't completely hide what he was feeling. And thank God the writers didn't have anyone stay behind with him or try to comfort him. He needed that moment alone and it was a perfect Sparky moment.
          sigpic

          Visit us at SGA Rising for our version of season six.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Scary Kitty View Post
            Yep. I have no doubt that what happened between him and his family may have had something to do with why he's built that wall and keeps his distance. Maybe he thinks he's cursed... everyone he loves dies or is otherwise taken from him, so it's safer simply to keep his feelings locked inside and not reveal them to others. Poor John.
            Yes, I agree. He had learned to be very cautious about giving his heart, but he can't stop himself from caring and being connected to the people.
            I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Anuna View Post
              I know Elizabeth smiles beautifully in "Tao" and "BiS". Also in "The Rising". How about other people? If I recall correctly, Ford smiles a lot. Teyla too. Point me to some good clips?
              I love teh Lizzie smile, no matter what kind it is -- the flirty with John smile, the happy smile, or the I'll-smile-because-I'm-polite-but-Lucius-is-freaky smile.

              John's smiles are win, especially since he's a private person I love that he smiles so much in s1-s3. Yeah, you don't get that too much in s4 or s5 from what I hear.

              Ford's smiles are adorable. My favourite I think is in the "Letters From Pegasus" videos.

              Teyla has such a lovely smile, she does it a lot in "Irrestistable" and with Ronon in "Echoes". It's very warm, serene, and a bit subtle.

              Ronon's not really my type in attractions, but I melt every time he grins. It's beautiful.

              Whenever Carson smiles I squee and resist the urge to squeeze his dimples. ^^

              Comment


                Originally posted by Southern Red View Post
                I've always seen John as someone who cares more deeply than most people. It must be the Irish because my husband's family is like that, particularly the men. They even joke about it and cry at the drop of a hat. John probably hates that about himself and tries (like in Adrift) to hold it back with limited success. I love the little moment at the end of GiTM
                Spoiler:
                just when he steps forward and we get that devastated look on his face. He glances around for a split second at the others. I always saw that as John hoping they weren't paying any attention to him because he just knew he couldn't completely hide what he was feeling. And thank God the writers didn't have anyone stay behind with him or try to comfort him. He needed that moment alone and it was a perfect Sparky moment.
                ITA, and I also think that because he cares so much, once he's been hurt, he can't ever let it go. His marriage failed; he never gets married or commits to anyone again. He separated from his family; he doesn't stay close to them. He gets chastized for defying the military code; he goes off to Antarctica where he can't cause trouble and doesn't have to deal with anyone.

                Flipping that coin and going to Atlantis was taking that chance to reset his life and get close to people again. Go figure, he loses Ford but has to keep protecting the rest of his family. But after Ford, he's a little less carefree, a little less young that he was before. We see how his feelings get hurt in "Epiphany" when he thinks he's been abandoned. How desperate he gets when Elizabeth is threatened in "The Real World".

                And then the whopper in his Atlantis life, he loses Elizabeth again (and again and again) who was the one person who took the chance on him, and he's changed again. Coupled with Carson's loss (and Teyla's kidnapping, perhaps) it's just too much. So we get the super changed John from S4-S5, who is just going through the motions.

                You know what's really sad? Teyla gets a happy ending. Rodney gets a happy ending. So long as Ronon chases the Wraith, he's happy, so Ronon stays status quo.

                John is the only person in Atlantis worse off than when he started. That stinks.

                Um, save for
                Spoiler:
                popsicle Elizabeth, of course.


                *sporks TPTB for the second time this week*
                Visit SGArising.com to read our virtual continuation of the Atlantis series!

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Eri13 View Post
                  You know what's really sad? Teyla gets a happy ending. Rodney gets a happy ending. So long as Ronon chases the Wraith, he's happy, so Ronon stays status quo. John is the only person in Atlantis worse off than when he started. That stinks.
                  *sporks the ptb* That's a really significant thing to do to your "main" character. (Because I'm one who believe Atlantis could and should have had an ensemble cast.) Especially when you bring up the scene in "Rising", Eri, where he's flipping the coin on the hill. So was going to Atlantis the wrong choice or the right one? Was it for the better, because of all the love he's experienced there? Or was it for the worse, due to the fact that he ultimately ends up losing in the end?

                  Comment


                    You know, they say "what doesn't kill you makes you tougher". I don't think it works for John. I think he can only wonder why it didn't kill him. Sometimes I wonder if he's even remotely religious, or if not religious, does he believe in God. Now, why would God give someone a burden so heavy to carry? I can imagine him asking those questions and looking for answers.

                    Most of the time we keep saying that TPTW sacrificed Elizabeth, but along with her they did the same to John. Sometimes the time doesn't heal wounds. They only hurt less, but still keep hurting.
                    I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.

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                      Originally posted by Reiko View Post
                      *sporks the ptb* That's a really significant thing to do to your "main" character. (Because I'm one who believe Atlantis could and should have had an ensemble cast.) Especially when you bring up the scene in "Rising", Eri, where he's flipping the coin on the hill. So was going to Atlantis the wrong choice or the right one? Was it for the better, because of all the love he's experienced there? Or was it for the worse, due to the fact that he ultimately ends up losing in the end?
                      I'm loving this discussion.

                      It depends how you define loss in life and what really counts. Having a life like John's - full of intensive ups and downs, a roller coaster, carrying so much responsibility with grace and honesty and so much care, loving so deeply and loosing... in my opinion it's a gift, a precious but also a painful gift. It might take years for John to go over all those things. he might even forgive himself, and if he succeeds, then he can be glad for all those things he had and experienced, because eventually, we lose everyone. The only thing we will always have are our memories... so the only life worth living is the life worth remembering.
                      I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Reiko View Post
                        *sporks the ptb* That's a really significant thing to do to your "main" character. (Because I'm one who believe Atlantis could and should have had an ensemble cast.) Especially when you bring up the scene in "Rising", Eri, where he's flipping the coin on the hill. So was going to Atlantis the wrong choice or the right one? Was it for the better, because of all the love he's experienced there? Or was it for the worse, due to the fact that he ultimately ends up losing in the end?
                        I think it depends on what kind of life you wish to lead. If you don't want to get hurt, then you live a safe life, where you more than likely don't experience anything either.

                        On Atlantis, John at least met Elizabeth, Rodney, Teyla, Ronon and everyone else. In Antarctica, he got, well, snow. And even if he lost people, he at least got the chance to love them, and they to love him in return.

                        Will it be considered a 'good' life? With so much loss (and going on an expedition like this, there actually probably should have been more) it probably won't be considered 'happy', per se, but it will be a lived life.

                        Sheltered & safe or out there and living? That's probably exactly what that coin toss was about.

                        And in the end, I would hope, given his character, that John would say it was worth it to have known and loved Elizabeth (and the others) for the short time he did rather than never.
                        Visit SGArising.com to read our virtual continuation of the Atlantis series!

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                          I think it's hard to tell that he thinks it was 'worth it' on and external level, but I think we know on his emotional level that this is what is true. And as much as I think he'll regret that he wasn't able to save them, I don't think he ever regrets going there in the first place. I wouldn't call his a happy ending at all -- it's practically tragedy material. But I think he's fully satisfied with his choice and the experience of loving and being loved in return.

                          Comment


                            "The greatest thing you'll ever learn
                            Is just love
                            and be loved
                            in return"


                            The version from "Mouling Rouge" still gives me goosebumps.
                            I'm not weird, I'm limited edition.

                            Comment


                              Hows this for an ending:


                              Keller is swimming out on the east pier. The Daedalus comes in to land. Rodney radioes that she is in the way but Colonel Skinner lands on her anyway because thats how he rolls.

                              Blah blah blah crisis in ep, resolved by McKay inverting the doohickey. Carter announces that she is gay and thats why her and jack never hooked up and she was secretly in love with keller too. Ronon consoles her. They bond over their feelings for keller and ......

                              ...................................


                              I wouldn't mind if the end scenes (irrespective of the rest of the ep) touched on the final scenes of Rising. Perhaps all of them having a toast, being happy, and then Shep goes to the side and flips a coin. The reason is left open to interpretation, and the last shot is the coin landing head up. What appears to be a fade out is actually a morph to Lifeline Elizabeth in a stasis pod dun dun dun........ Cue movie
                              sigpic

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Eri13 View Post
                                You know what's really sad? Teyla gets a happy ending. Rodney gets a happy ending. So long as Ronon chases the Wraith, he's happy, so Ronon stays status quo.

                                John is the only person in Atlantis worse off than when he started. That stinks.

                                Um, save for
                                Spoiler:
                                popsicle Elizabeth, of course.


                                *sporks TPTB for the second time this week*
                                *reams TPTW a new *ss*ole with a chainsaw*

                                Originally posted by Reiko View Post
                                *sporks the ptb* That's a really significant thing to do to your "main" character. (Because I'm one who believe Atlantis could and should have had an ensemble cast.)
                                Yet another reason why Joe Flanigan is no doubt glad that the long nightmare of the last two years is finally over. He was supposed to be the "star," the guy with his name at the top of the cast list. His character was supposed to be the hero, way smarter than he lets on and gifted by chance with a gene that allowed him to play with cool alien technology. But by the end, Sheppard's been turned into a cardboard cutout who walks around, looks stupid, and shoots stuff while TPTW play with the shiny new thang.

                                I've always seen Atlantis as being more suited to being an ensemble piece. I mean, the very title just screams it. But Atlantis was supposed to be about more than just one piddly off-world team. It was supposed to be about the city and the expedition exploring the secrets of the Ancients.

                                Originally posted by Reiko View Post
                                Especially when you bring up the scene in "Rising", Eri, where he's flipping the coin on the hill. So was going to Atlantis the wrong choice or the right one? Was it for the better, because of all the love he's experienced there? Or was it for the worse, due to the fact that he ultimately ends up losing in the end?
                                "Tis better to have loved, and lost, than never to have loved at all."
                                (This is legal notice that any attempt to censor or delete, for the purpose of oppressing fair and open discussion, any statement made by me will be considered a violation of my right to free speech as guaranteed by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, and will be dealt with in accordance with federal law.)
                                Sparky is on screen. Therefore, it is canon. Elizabeth is still out there. And John WILL bring her home.

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