Neutrino Ion Generators - better than ZPMs?

[Wraith_Boy]

"Nanite" is a very broad term. "Replicator" is an even broader term, completely misused. Asurans are akin to replicators only by the fact they are comprised of microscopic autonomous machines inbuilt with artificial intelligence and root programming.

Neutronium was the basis for Asgard tech. Asgard tech being the most advanced in the galaxy (that was readily available) and was a natural next step for the spider replicators inbuilt with a drive to replicate and for self preservation. Asurans were built in microscopic form and grouped together much like living cells to best perform a function (eradicate the Wraith). The AI the Alterans gave them led the "nanites" to take the form of their creators.

The Alterans do not replicate to increase their numbers. They do not seek out more advanced tech to further their race. They use natural materials for their buildings/ships. They incorporate biological materials into themselves and can blend with biology.

The only reason to suspect a power source like Neutronium is in Pegasus is because of the laws of probability and nature, and that of the hazy history of the Alliance of the Four Races.

Asurans are the exact same as Replicators.

'Progeny':

RONON: How many people live here?

NIAM: Millions.

+

WEIR: No. A few of the nanites managed to survive.

McKAY: Which is all they needed to begin replicating again.

TEYLA: Replicating?

McKAY: This is bad. They’re very similar to an artificial intelligence that SG-1 encountered several years ago that evolved from a tiny block-Replicator into human form. They may even be related somehow.

'The Real World':

McKAY: They've been using organic material to replicate, which has rendered them immune to the EM pulse.

DEX: So now what?

BECKETT: They've started replicating again.

+

McKAY: So they're attempting assimilate her? To transforming her to one of them?

BECKETT: Until they can reach sufficient numbers to form a viable independent entity. I'd say so, yes.

TEYLA: This is how they replicate?

'First Strike':

SHEPPARD: That's not enough.

McKAY: The Replicators are self-replicating robots, which means that they can...

Asurans & Replicators are akin to one another in that they are both self-replicating machines made up of million/billions of nanite cells. They can link with one another, put hands in heads etc, etc.

The only difference is that the MW/IDA versions began in much simpler form. They took the slow route to evolution. They infested Asgard technology & started learning from it. The more knowledge they assimilated, the smarter they got & the more evolved they became. Then they got to a point where they could come together in human form. Even then they were still limited in the knowledge that they had.

The Asurans on the other hand, were born pretty much straight away. To boot, they had the full Lantean knowledge from the start & all their technology & materials that go with it. Therefore what exactly is there to evolve beyond when you have all that & are far more advanced than any other species. The MW ones had to always evolve because the Asgard & humans were upgrading their technology & tactics all the time. Not to mention they didn't know everything. Even Thor has said the Asgard barely scratched the surface of the Ancient database. So if the Asurans already knew all that the Lanteans had, then there would be no need to conquer other species. Simply because they were probably nowhere near the same technological level. Their base level is the exact same as the Replicators & that's to replicate. Asuras was wiped out apart from a few nanites. They began replicating again & now there are millions of Asurans.

It was O'Neill with Ancient knowledge that built the Replicator disruptor weapons that the Asgard began using to kill them. It was through this exact same technology that Area 51 came up with the anti-Replicator guns that we now see in Atlantis.

The Asurans are probably a far more advanced form of the MW/IDA Replicators, but a replicator they still be nontheless!

[Murzin]

ZPMs are so cool because they are so small (as long as you disregard the unrealism). The ability to hold that much power in your hand is much cooler than a big power core.

you are disregarding what the ZPM is. a ZPM is not the container for the power, but rather the mechanisim to TAP into the power which is held somewhere else.

[Mister Oragahn]

you are disregarding what the ZPM is. a ZPM is not the container for the power, but rather the mechanisim to TAP into the power which is held somewhere else.

The power is held in an artificial subspace pocket that the ZPM itself holds.

It's more like a generator that works from a limited supply of ressources, and after that, is depleted.

So it's a bit both, a battery and a generator.

[Mister Oragahn]

I'm bumping this one.

I'm thinking that the neutrino part of the term either refers to a way to transmit energy to systems, somehow, by using neutrinos (which means the capacity to capture and power or deplete neutrinos in no time and over short distances, but shields and spacetime membranes could help), or to radiate extra heat as neutrino (not really useful), or as suggested some time ago (a few posts above), and not that different from option one, each generator recreates a small star, which itself comes with all the effects associated to normal stars, including the release of neutrinos.
Therefore, the ion part could refer to the fusion nature of the artificial star inside the reactor, while the neutrino part could refer to the capacity of the reactors to capture the energies of the expelled neutrinos, along the regular radiations of same star. IIRC, stars loose an important amount of energy through neutrinos, I think it's even greater than the other outputs.
Let's also consider that the Asgards have the capacity to increase the mass of stars. They could possibly increase and maintain the density of artificial stars, while maybe creating artificial neutron stars.

[stargater1990]

Since we now have the entire Asgard knowledge base, if we can work out the technical details and the infrastructure needed, would it be more viable for us to manufacture neutrino ion generators (which were used to power Asgard ships etc) in order to ensure a constant (and compatible) supply of power source for our ships and even Atlantis, than wasting our time and energy finding ZPMs that are scattered throughout the galaxies?

of course it would be more viable b/c zpms are just so rare that to put them on a ship that could be destroyed at any given time is just reckless.

however on the other hand a nig could be about the same as a naquada generator and then our only choice will be to use a zpm.

[thekillman]

IMO a Neutrino Ion Generator utilizes ion-neutrino interaction. its said that naquahdah can interact with neutrino's. or it uses neutronium as a neutrino catcher. though its more asgardish to have a mini-star

[Mister Oragahn]

IMO a Neutrino Ion Generator utilizes ion-neutrino interaction. its said that naquahdah can interact with neutrino's. or it uses neutronium as a neutrino catcher. though its more asgardish to have a mini-star

Well, naqahdah will logically have a better interaction with neutrinos due to its higher density, but it's not going to be sufficient. Where is it said that naqahdah reacts with neutrino in some kind of meaningful way?

[thekillman]

dunno. neutronium is even denser so..

[PotluckoftheGods]

Said it in te real world, they had trouble wiping out the nanites with an emp cuz they had organic parts, that was how wier beat them, with her pushing her immune system. It really was the center of the plot for an entire episode. Lol?

Even if they use "organic parts," they still have to reassemble them into Replicator cells. So instead being composed of the usual neutronium, they would consist of carbon, oxygen, and other elements that are found in the human body. Like the spider Replicators on the Russian sub, they would be structurally the same, just different in composition.

In "Progeny," Niam says that as the first Asuran nanites evolved rapidly in the Lantean laborotories, bonding into more and more complex systems that mimicked organic systems, but they were never actually organic.

I think this is one of those instances where we have to just take the "they're using organic parts so our old solution won't work" argument as a dramatic device and move on.

[EternalAlteran]

Finding neutronium would be wasting time since it is so rare and scattered throughout the galaxies.

Stargate Atlantis Outcast quote

LEE: So – "pre-assembled masonry panels" – that was a code word we used a few months back to identify shipments of neutronium.


Eart most defenitly has access to neutronium.

By the way it is key to asgard technology, so building a new 304 can't do without. By the way who said it was fuel by neutronion. (Neutrino is an elementary particle and ion is an atom or molecule which has lost or gained one or more valence electrons, giving it a positive or negative electrical charge.

[nx01a]

I think it's important to define the terms used here.

Neutronium is a term originally used in science fiction and in popular literature to refer to an extremely dense phase of matter composed primarily of neutrons, and an extremely dense phase of matter resembling the neutron-degenerate matter postulated to exist in the cores of neutron stars in real world physics.

Neutrinos are elementary particles that travel close to the speed of light, lack an electric charge, are able to pass through ordinary matter almost undisturbed and are thus extremely difficult to detect.
All definitions thanks to Wikipedia.

The use of neutronium as a neutrino-catcher is a great idea, thekillman.

[s09119]

Okay, a ZPM simply cannot be beaten in terms of raw energy (with the exception of Arcturus, which we know doesn't work in the long run). It contains an entire universe that it's tapping energy from. Plain and simple, nothing else is going to be able to touch it except a device like Arcturus.

[Unbreak]

People in atlantis made the Arcturus device work, they were going to destroy another universe, but it was working =p

And the carter from a alternative universe, got a solution for that, sending small amounts of exotic matter to a lot of universes, so that the effects would be minimal on them.

[Mister Oragahn]

I think it's important to define the terms used here.

Neutronium is a term originally used in science fiction and in popular literature to refer to an extremely dense phase of matter composed primarily of neutrons, and an extremely dense phase of matter resembling the neutron-degenerate matter postulated to exist in the cores of neutron stars in real world physics.

Neutrinos are elementary particles that travel close to the speed of light, lack an electric charge, are able to pass through ordinary matter almost undisturbed and are thus extremely difficult to detect.
All definitions thanks to Wikipedia.

The use of neutronium as a neutrino-catcher is a great idea, thekillman.

With, again, the slight problem that SG's neutronium shows nothing of the density where a thin layer of such a material would make much of a difference against any other conventional material.
You'd still need ridiculous thicknesses to stop neutrinos.
That's why I believe a technobabble field does the job - if neutrinos are to be catched of course.

[Maedhros_Sea]

or we can use the Asgard beam to make zpms out of thin air

THERE ARE NO FREE RIDES IN LIFE. None. You could create a mechanism like the ZPM, but it would be like one that is already burned out.

You also can't create Naquadah or other strategic materials without paying some cost. The ability to manipulate material at the atomic level and reconstruct it into the form you need is very impressive.

But it must come from somewhere. The energy needed would far exceed the energy required to make the material through conventional means. Making Naquadah would take more power than the created material could yield through ineffeciencies in the process.

You can't just ask for a ZPM from your Food Replicator.