Matter through an event horizon SPOILERS for 38 Minutes and SG-1: 100 Days

[zen.monki]

So, after the arrow and part of the rope was through the EH, Teal'c followed shortly with the rest of the rope. Durring htat time, the arrow was still waiting to be transmotted through the wormhole. Once Teal'c followed with the rope, the entire object was transmitted to the destination stargate. The arrow exitted first, leaving at the same velocity as it enterred the wormhole, embedding itself into the rock. Teal's soon followed with the rest of the rope and he was able to pull himself up to the arrow. Therefore, not contradiction.

I seem to recall that after Teal'c fired the arrow, he tugged backward on it to make sure it was secure. Does anyone else remember this too?

(I can remember stuff like this but not the everyday things that would actually benefit my life! Well, then again, SG is a big benefit in my life. )

[Ugly Pig]

Unless you performed the same trick they did in 48 Hours to jumpstart the EH and spit out the stuff in the buffer.

Which begs the question I just asked in the episode thread- why didn't they do that here?

Because it was not the same situation. In 48 Hours, Teal'c was transmitted through the wormhole and received by the target gate, just not rematerialized. They hooked up the DHD and made the gate finish the proccess.

However, in 38 Minutes, the Puddle Jumper was not transmitted through the wormhole to the target gate. Remember, the problem they were dealing with was that the the gate wouldn't send anything through until the whole ship had passed through the event horizon. So there was nothing in the buffer of the target gate to rematerialize.

[hokiewalrus]

Good job Pig, you took my answer

Although I did have one other question. As the situation got more and more dire, they kept pushing people through the event horizon for safety's sake or to spare them or whatever. Obviously there is a finite about of ship that's through the gate, so eventually you could have more people through the EH than can physically occupy the space that's dematerialized. What happens when you eventually transmit through the gate?

I was hoping the puddle jumper would come through the gate and everyone would be squished into the cockpit with their faces pressed against the glass ala Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure

[puddlejumper747]

I know I'm a little late here, but anyway...

1)When does an object that passes throught the event horizon actually dematerialize? (If you stick your hand through and hold it there, what happens to your blood circulation/etc...? And how could they pull Ford's entire body out of the event horizon?)

2)How stuck was the puddle jumper in 38 minutes anyway? From what I remember, the pods looked like they were barely even touching the stargate.

3)If the bug thing was paralyzing Sheppard, then shouldn't it have been affecting his entire nervous system (brain/spine) all at once? He was moving his head/neck around pretty well even though he was getting numb in his hands/feet. Or was the bug thing just draining energy from his body much slower/differently than the wraith so he wasn't aging but just getting weaker? (Where am I confused?)

4)And most importantly, where did the door that closed off the back half of the puddle jumper actually come from anyway?!?! It couldn't have just slid out from the walls, b/c it covered the entire bay and the puddle jumper walls are not wide enough to hold them when they retract!

So, yea. Any ideas?

[puddlejumper747]

Oh, and one more thing. Why did the wormhole appear INSIDE the puddlejumper? Shouldn't it have just been wrapped around it like the entire ship was one solid object? Then they could have walked to the forward half, the inside of the wormhole would have looked cool, the entire situation could have been fixed within minutes, and we wouldn't be having discussions about possible continuity errors in Atlantis. So what if TPTB would have had come up with a different storyline? Maybe they could have just started the episode from the beginning and played it through fully with no flashbacks, more scenes, and only 10-15 minutes of puddle jumper stuck in the gate (which would make the ancients look smarter anyway).
So does this mean everytime the puddlejumper enters the stargate, everyone inside suddenly sees the forward half of the ship disappear and a big blue wall rushing at them? I don't like that. The inside should really be sealed off from the gate like a shut container. It would look cooler anyway. Oh well...

[VirtualCLD]

Well, as far as the last comment is concerned, the Event Horizon should appear inside the puddle jumbper, not "around" it. As far as we know, as soon as matter enters the event horizon, it becomes "dematerialized". This means the front half of the puddlejumper is no longer a solid object. It has been broken down into base particles ready for transmission through the wormhole to the destination stargate. I think that has been made pretty clear through out the stargate universe (McKay also mentions something like this when referring to retrieving the two airmen in the front half of the pj). There simply is noplace for the front half of the puddlejumper to exist as a solid object once it crosses the EH.

[puddlejumper747]

Well I kind of thought that there was a small "threshhold" area inside the gate that allowed the object to enter before beind dematerialized. Like when Daniel Jackson stuck his head through in the movie and opened his eyes before being sucked through. And when Jack stuck his hand back inside it in Shades of Grey but it didn't dematerialize either. So maybe the objects are also rematerialized in a "threshhold" just on the other side of the event horizon before stepping through (although this last part can be disregarded without destroing my core theory). Thus if the iris is closed, they can't get through far enough into the safe zone and are permenantly de-materialized once again, and thus essentially cease-to-exist. Maybe the event horizon was showing up inside simply b/c they had been sittting there for so long? I don't know anymore; I'm probably just over-analyzing again...

[puddlejumper747]

Also I thought we knew that as soon as an object was dematerialized it should be transmitted through the wormhole. Thus the potential for having an object on both sides at once still exists, and the "threshhold theory" has still another continuity advantage in the Stargate universe.

[aschen]

They never stated that the entire object must be through the Stargate. This is also the first time that we've seen them putting such a large object through the Stargate. The only other thing we've seen (and SGA borrowed this term) was when Teal'c "threaded the needle," and that went right through. So long as a solid body of matter is sitting in the event horizon, it will not rematerialize on the other side. It's not such a great idea to be sending pieces of incomplete whole matter through the gate when.

[Ugly Pig]

It's not such a great idea to be sending pieces of incomplete whole matter through the gate when.

Indeed. Imagine if you stuck your hand into the event horizon of an outgoing wormhole and then pulled it back. If the gate had allready sent the part you stuck in and it was on the other side of the wormhole, you wouldn't get it back as wormholes are one-way. You'd lose your hand. If that was how the gate system worked, you'd have to enter the gate veeeerrrrryy carefully, making sure your movement was completely smooth (no jerks or anything) and 100% headed straight-forward.

It's a good thing the gate system works the way it does.

[VirtualCLD]

So theoretically, based on this episode, if you were to put a plank of wood halfway into EH, then you walked across the plank of wood into the EH, would you come out the other stargate, or would the stargate wait for the rest of the plank to enter the EH? Basically, I'm trying to set up a similar scenario with being trapped in the rear of a PJ, only this time there is no walls or cieling, just a "floor".

[Ugly Pig]

I'm guessing you'd come out of the connected gate and fall flat on your ass due to lack of plank.

[danielctull]

I'm guessing you'd come out of the connected gate and fall flat on your ass due to lack of plank.

But walking a plank would be just like walking through the gate in a PJ? Just with a lack of walls and roof, you still aren't connected to it in anyway.

Maybe It's an energy thing. Was it the goa'uld body shields that would let in smaller objects like rocks being thrown or something? Maybe the gate is like that, theirs maybe a cut off point in momentum at which stuff cant pass through. This would explain O'Neill's arm and the arrow/rope. The PJ is huge and thus a bigger momentum.

Just an idea.

[Ugly Pig]

What about this, then: If your foot (or any other part of you) is actually touching the plank as you go through, then yes, the gate will wait to send you through until the plank is fully submerged in the event horizon because you are "connected" to it. If you lift your foot in such a way that it's not actually touching the plank, the gate will recognize you as a separate object and send you through regardless of the plank.

Well, that's what I think would happen. Since when are we walking through the stargete on a plank anyway?

[danielctull]

I think you could be right, Ugly Pig. So all they had to do was tell Weir to put down some blue gym mats and jump with both feet in the air. Simple!