Resurrection (213)

[VampyreWraith]

Clarke & even moreso Lexa have many times the experience of those who came down from the Ark living and surviving on the ground. This puts them in a better position to make decisions than Kane, Abby and the other Ark survivor leaders. From what we know about the grounders, I have little doubt that they will see the wisdom of Clarke/Lexa's plan, and understand it. But I rather doubt that the Ark survivors would, as they are not born and bred warriors, as the Grounders are.

Sorry, I didn't see this part earlier when I replied earlier. I'm not so sure that the Grounders would be so understanding of Lexa's actions (running off with Clarke and leaving everyone else for dead, no matter what the reasoning). From what's been said, this is the first time the clans have come together like this. A lot of the Grounders are not particularly fond of the Sky people or the alliance that they have with them. They even argued during an earlier episode and didn't think it was even necessary to send Bellamy in since they weren't sure that plan would even work (before they knew that he was alive and inside the Mountain). I don't think the clans have been on completely friendly terms in the past so there's probably some distrust already there. I think Lexa even mentioned that some other clan (the Queen of the Snow/Ice clan, or something like that, I remember thinking of Frozen when she said it lol) killed her lover, during the episode that they burned Finn's body (I'm not sure if that particular clan is part of this alliance though). We also saw during that episode that the Grounders don't take betrayal lightly. When Lexa's bodyguard was caught trying to mess up the alliance with the Sky People by framing Raven for the poisoning, Lexa had him tortured and killed because of it, even though he said he was doing it to protect her from what he considered a bad alliance that would just bring her more trouble with the other Grounders/Clans.

I kind of think that the some of the Ark people would be more likely to understand since they were used to those kinds of decisions being made on the Ark.

[garhkal]

So basically all of the other leaders are too dumb to sneak out and keep their mouths shut and only Clarke and Lexa know what's good for everyone? And all the other people at the camp are dumb and wouldn't be able to follow a plan that would send them into the woods without looking too suspicious?

Maybe they felt that even talking about it would cause someone to act suspiciously enough to warn the spotter.

From what we know about the grounders, I have little doubt that they will see the wisdom of Clarke/Lexa's plan, and understand it. But I rather doubt that the Ark survivors would, as they are not born and bred warriors, as the Grounders are.

The grounders MAY see the wisdom, but still hold a grudge.
And the Arc people would be more understanding as Abby and kane discussed, when they were under the rubble, that they too made difficult decisions costing lives, for the 'greater good'..

[VampyreWraith]

I think my problem with the whole "if we warn anyone of the missile strike then Mt. Weather will know that there's a spy in the mountain that warned us about it" is that it doesn't really make sense to me, given the situation that Clarke and Lexa were in and the with way things were presented on the show. I mean what kind of behavior would be suspicious enough that would make the spotter think "spy in Mt. Weather" and not something else if some people were seen talking and leaving the village. This might be a writing/plot issue though, and maybe we're just supposed to take it as fact that for some reason people seen leaving the village would be a dead giveaway that the Grounders/Ark People have someone inside Mt. Weather, and that for some reason only Clarke and Lexa have the ability to sneak around and get in and out of the village unnoticed.

And maybe we're not supposed to wonder if maybe Clarke and Lexa aren't thinking things through the right way, if they really think that they can't save anyone but themselves. Or we're not supposed to wonder if maybe Lexa knows that they can get other people out and she's just using Bellamy as an excuse to get Clarke to agree with her, so that she can try to get more control over the other clans or just so she can try to get rid of people she disagrees with or has had issues with in the past.

If we're just supposed to take it as fact that there was no way to warn people and maintain Bellamy's cover, then I would agree that Lexa and Clarke did the right thing.

[Annoyed]

I think my problem with the whole "if we warn anyone of the missile strike then Mt. Weather will know that there's a spy in the mountain that warned us about it" is that it doesn't really make sense to me, given the situation that Clarke and Lexa were in and the with way things were presented on the show. I mean what kind of behavior would be suspicious enough that would make the spotter think "spy in Mt. Weather" and not something else if some people were seen talking and leaving the village.

If I were the MM leader, upon receiving reports of a mass exodus from my target zone, I would suspect that they know the attack is coming instantly. What else are you supposed to think if, as you're about to launch an attack on the enemy's home that would decimate the enemy, the enemy suddenly leaves their home en masse ?

Or we're not supposed to wonder if maybe Lexa knows that they can get other people out and she's just using Bellamy as an excuse to get Clarke to agree with her, so that she can try to get more control over the other clans or just so she can try to get rid of people she disagrees with or has had issues with in the past.

Now that is an idea I hadn't considered.

If we're just supposed to take it as fact that there was no way to warn people and maintain Bellamy's cover, then I would agree that Lexa and Clarke did the right thing.

I do take that as a given. Perhaps I have a more cynical view of people in general than you do, but I really don't see how Clarke/Lexa could have warned the general population without tipping off the Mountain men to a spy's presence, either by the resulting large scale exodus, or some boneheaded action from one or more of the people.

[VampyreWraith]

I didn't mean that they would be able to get everyone out without arising suspicion or even that they should try to warn everyone about the missile (and I don't remember saying that they should warn everyone), but at least some people, like maybe the other clan leaders. At least some (if not most) of them would have been in and around that building that Clarke and Lexa were talking in, since they were supposed to be there for that meeting. Gathering the ones that they could easily get to together, and telling them that they needed to leave quickly because there was immediate danger, but that they couldn't warn everyone at large since it would reveal Bellamy, who was poised to take down the acid fog machine and only needed a little more time to do so, and then they could take down the Mountain Men and avenge the fallen, blah, blah, blah; would have gotten them to sneak out without any major fuss. Or even lying to them and telling them that they needed to secretly move the meeting because they received information that there were spies in the village that posed a danger to them or something. Once they were out, then they could have looked for a way to get more people out discretely, if that was even possible or even tried to find the spotter (the Grounders used to be really good at sneaking around the woods and killing people last season).

Clarke knew that they were targeting the village because of the meeting, so even staging some kind of argument/fight ending with all the leaders leaving, so that the meeting couldn't be held that day would have postponed the missile strike. Grounders arguing with each other or arguing with Clarke wouldn't have been too out there/suspicious.

I don't think Clarke should have been walking through camp telling people to run for their lives that a missile was coming or anything like that, but Clarke could have ordered Kane back to Camp Jaha for whatever made-up reason, and if he had left that wouldn't have been suspicious. Even if Lexa didn't want to get the clan leaders out for whatever reason, she could have ordered Indra or someone to send even more people out into the woods to make sure there that there were no Mt. Weather spies lurking about, saying that she or whoever else, demanded more perimeter security or something like that (I think that Indra even ordered Octavia and some others out into the woods because she was worried about this herself).

I don't mean to imply that they could have done everything that I mentioned, or that if they did, it would have saved everyone. It's the idea that warning or getting anyone else out (anyone not everyone) of the village would cause some kind of mass panic and send everyone running so that the Mt. Men would think that there was a spy in the mountain, that I have a problem with. You keep mentioning a mass exodus and warning everyone, but I'm not saying that they should have warned everyone about the missile and gotten everyone out. Lexa convinced Clarke that they couldn't warn anyone at all, and that they should just run away and leave everyone behind (but Clarke couldn't leave her mother behind, once she saw that she was there).

[Annoyed]

lol.. we certainly see this differently. My response is : And what about the "big mouth" factor? Assuming she's considering your option, telling a few other leaders on both sides, could Clarke/Lexa bet their people's future on no one telling their loved one, who tells their loved one...

I wouldn't, 'cause I think its a forgone conclusion that someone who had been told would have spilled the beans.

Totally unrelated.. I see you have your location listed as NY. What part? I'm in western NY.

[VampyreWraith]

That's why I suggested lying/telling half truths to people to get them out lol. Even if someone ran their mouth, they would think that they were leaving because of something other than missiles. I think it would be mostly clan leaders and maybe their Seconds or something in the village anyway (other than the people who live there). They mentioned an army in the woods, so I think most of the people from the other clans would be there.

I'm in New York City.

[jelgate]

That's why I suggested lying/telling half truths to people to get them out lol. Even if someone ran their mouth, they would think that they were leaving because of something other than missiles. I think it would be mostly clan leaders and maybe their Seconds or something in the village anyway (other than the people who live there). They mentioned an army in the woods, so I think most of the people from the other clans would be there.

I'm in New York City.

Well that pretty much discredits your whole argument.



I think you are underestimating the Grounders intelligence. They would know something is up when the leaders were there. Not to mention the Mt, Weather soldier spying

[VampyreWraith]

Well that pretty much discredits your whole argument.



I think you are underestimating the Grounders intelligence. They would know something is up when the leaders were there. Not to mention the Mt, Weather soldier spying

And why is that? What's viccodin btw? Is it like Vicodin?

And all the spotter would see are some Grounders looking around the village or in the woods for something/someone. It would have pretty much been the same as when Indra said she couldn't find Lexa and Clarke and Kane said maybe they went into the woods and they should get people to check (or something like that). Lexa and Clarke were the only ones the spotter actually cared about being in the target area, and them going missing is what would have caused problems if people started screaming out their names while looking for them. But Mt. Weather already fired the missile before things got to the screaming out names point on the show.