Terra Nova - The True Purpose of Terra Nova.(S1 Spoilers/Spec)

[LtColCarter]

Actually, that might not be the case.

First, the continents of today are not the same as they were 85 million years ago. We also do not know if the rift places a traveler in the same space, but at a different time. It's possible that it could place a traveler in a different location, such as you start in New York but wind up in what is present day Nebraska, only 85 million years ago.

And even if the location was exactly the same (eg. New York), there is a very good possibility that the land mass on which the starting point in 2149 is located could well be submerged in the Atlantic, be the top of a mountain range in Europe, or not even have http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGcDed4xVD4

This also speaks to whether or not the population of Terra Nova could go to a particular site and find a specific metal. Continental Drift means that they cannot be sure of finding anything without doing a standard kind of mineral survey.

And assuming they do find something, if they remove a particular non-renewable resource (in sufficient quantities) from the ground in 85 million BC, then it will not be there to be mined in 7,000 BC, 1900 AD or in 2149. It will be gone and history would have been changed.

regards,
G.

I agree with what you've said here...except the last paragraph. The show already established this was an alternate time line. So, it wouldn't affect the future...at least not our future.

[Gollumpus]

There are sitting in a future metropolitan area. They also have knowledge of where mines were located in the future.

Actually, that might not be the case.

First, the continents of today are not the same as they were 85 million years ago. We also do not know if the rift places a traveler in the same space, but at a different time. It's possible that it could place a traveler in a different location, such as you start in New York but wind up in what is present day Nebraska, only 85 million years ago.

And even if the location was exactly the same (eg. New York), there is a very good possibility that the land mass on which the starting point in 2149 is located could well be submerged in the Atlantic, be the top of a mountain range in Europe, or not even have been created in 85 million BC. Plate Tectonics have caused massive land shifts over the centuries.

This also speaks to whether or not the population of Terra Nova could go to a particular site and find a specific metal. Continental Drift means that they cannot be sure of finding anything without doing a standard kind of mineral survey.

And assuming they do find something, if they remove a particular non-renewable resource (in sufficient quantities) from the ground in 85 million BC, then it will not be there to be mined in 7,000 BC, 1900 AD or in 2149. It will be gone and history would have been changed.

regards,
G.

[morrismike]

yes. i agree with you.



an alternate possibility is the sheer possibility of resource acquisition.


in essence, Terra Nova could do the same to Earth as they did in 2149, and that way sustain the earth. so in stead of "abandoning ship", it would be leeching TN earth to fuel 2149 Earth.


so no 'starting over" but "continuing on".

The part you are missing is that earth is doomed by population. Go back into the past, build a civilization. Make clean power while the population is low. Earth has a head start, clean power, and doesn't have 3 billion deadbeats to deal with. How does this not turn out great? They'll likely be sparefaring within 500 years.

[morrismike]

Yup. I agree with your position. It is the Occam's Razor answer.

SPECULATION TIME. (Apologies, I'm too sleepy to do a good job of this.)

The only way Terra Nova is in the same time stream is if the settlement is on a patch of land which is completely isolated from the larger land masses existing at that time. This suggests that if it is in the same time line, then something would have to occur to remove all physical evidence of the settlement ever existing. Finally, it would have to have been a very short-lived settlement which had a limited impact. It all comes down to space, time and resources. This explains a number of things:

1.) The problem exists of killing a butterfly (or a dinosaur, or eating a plant) in the past and drastically changing the future because the sample is removed from the gene pool. There's no way around this unless all of the animals and plants are already isolated from the larger bio-mass and are/were already doomed to extinction (as in sooner rather than later). If these organisms already could not add to the genetic diversity of their various species then them dying out would not make any difference to the future. This suggests that the land mass associated with Terra Nova is isolated and will in some manner, be destroyed, perhaps sliding under the water with the change in continental plates (cue Donovan: "Way down below the ocean..."). It also suggests to me that the colony likely did not spread any further than their current land mass. If they had, then the butterfly effect would come into play in a major way.

2.) Resource acquisition. There is only so much butter in the larder. You can't send yourself a pound of butter on Monday, expect to use that same pound through the week, and expect to get your original pound back on Friday.

What the heck does that mean?

If the people of Terra Nova are in the original timeline, and they continued to live long and prosper in the past, they would start to dig up their own ores and use them for their own purposes (or to send to the future?). If those metals, in their natural state, were not where they were when humans in the original timeline first dug them up, then that is something which could have a significant affect on technological and societal evolution. The history of how and why Copper Age cultures developed in one region of the world could be altered. How might the history of the USA be changed if they did not have access to large quantities of iron ore? Also, any concentration of 85 million year old metal artifacts (assuming any were found) would have been very hard to explain. Yes, it's 85 million years. However, "coprolites" from the Cambrian period (540 million years ago) have been found...

Therefore, the people of Terra Nova either did not do it, or any resources mined by them were in a location which the original timeline could not exploit. This suggests that Terra Nova would have to have limited impact on the land around it, and likely does not expand past their home land mass, for 2149 not to be affected.

3.) The land mass on which Terra Nova exists is likely destroyed. One method would be by continental shifting and it is then submerged under an ocean for the people of 2149. This could be a possible reason why no artifacts from the settlement were ever found by modern archaeologists in 2149. However, this does not explain why there would be no evidence of a sizable, technologically advanced culture, which would have had a significant affect on its environment had it any amount of time to develop and expand. This suggests that they did not exist for an extended period of time.

Another means by which evidence of the settlement and the land mass is destroyed is by a meteorite. It would not have to be *The Big One*, but it would have to be a significant one. I suggest that if the Terra Nova colony were in the original timeline, then it is destroyed by a meteor. And I suspect it is coming within the X number of seasons left in the series.

Way to go out with a bang.

regards,
G.

There are sitting in a future metropolitan area. They also have knowledge of where mines were located in the future.

[thekillman]

yes. i agree with you.



an alternate possibility is the sheer possibility of resource acquisition.


in essence, Terra Nova could do the same to Earth as they did in 2149, and that way sustain the earth. so in stead of "abandoning ship", it would be leeching TN earth to fuel 2149 Earth.


so no 'starting over" but "continuing on".

[Gollumpus]

Interesting theory, but it's a different timeline. We know from the pilot that utilizing the time portal created an alternate timeline that everyone sent back to Terra Nova lives in; they and 2149 live in entirely separate realities.

Yup. I agree with your position. It is the Occam's Razor answer.

SPECULATION TIME. (Apologies, I'm too sleepy to do a good job of this.)

The only way Terra Nova is in the same time stream is if the settlement is on a patch of land which is completely isolated from the larger land masses existing at that time. This suggests that if it is in the same time line, then something would have to occur to remove all physical evidence of the settlement ever existing. Finally, it would have to have been a very short-lived settlement which had a limited impact. It all comes down to space, time and resources. This explains a number of things:

1.) The problem exists of killing a butterfly (or a dinosaur, or eating a plant) in the past and drastically changing the future because the sample is removed from the gene pool. There's no way around this unless all of the animals and plants are already isolated from the larger bio-mass and are/were already doomed to extinction (as in sooner rather than later). If these organisms already could not add to the genetic diversity of their various species then them dying out would not make any difference to the future. This suggests that the land mass associated with Terra Nova is isolated and will in some manner, be destroyed, perhaps sliding under the water with the change in continental plates (cue Donovan: "Way down below the ocean..."). It also suggests to me that the colony likely did not spread any further than their current land mass. If they had, then the butterfly effect would come into play in a major way.

2.) Resource acquisition. There is only so much butter in the larder. You can't send yourself a pound of butter on Monday, expect to use that same pound through the week, and expect to get your original pound back on Friday.

What the heck does that mean?

If the people of Terra Nova are in the original timeline, and they continued to live long and prosper in the past, they would start to dig up their own ores and use them for their own purposes (or to send to the future?). If those metals, in their natural state, were not where they were when humans in the original timeline first dug them up, then that is something which could have a significant affect on technological and societal evolution. The history of how and why Copper Age cultures developed in one region of the world could be altered. How might the history of the USA be changed if they did not have access to large quantities of iron ore? Also, any concentration of 85 million year old metal artifacts (assuming any were found) would have been very hard to explain. Yes, it's 85 million years. However, "coprolites" from the Cambrian period (540 million years ago) have been found...

Therefore, the people of Terra Nova either did not do it, or any resources mined by them were in a location which the original timeline could not exploit. This suggests that Terra Nova would have to have limited impact on the land around it, and likely does not expand past their home land mass, for 2149 not to be affected.

3.) The land mass on which Terra Nova exists is likely destroyed. One method would be by continental shifting and it is then submerged under an ocean for the people of 2149. This could be a possible reason why no artifacts from the settlement were ever found by modern archaeologists in 2149. However, this does not explain why there would be no evidence of a sizable, technologically advanced culture, which would have had a significant affect on its environment had it any amount of time to develop and expand. This suggests that they did not exist for an extended period of time.

Another means by which evidence of the settlement and the land mass is destroyed is by a meteorite. It would not have to be *The Big One*, but it would have to be a significant one. I suggest that if the Terra Nova colony were in the original timeline, then it is destroyed by a meteor. And I suspect it is coming within the X number of seasons left in the series.

Way to go out with a bang.

regards,
G.

[Steelbox]

Hmmmm...we shall see. That seems a bit to creative for anyone in the TV industry to come up with now days...

Why thank you! I'll take that as a compliment.

Elaborating a little. Why do they need that meteoric iron? Any material they need can easily be requested from 2149. Unless they exhausted the mineral on earth. Also what they seam to mine is just little comparing on what Terra Nova would need or even earth.

[LtColCarter]

They could, but not the Taylor and company future. Now they build a portal back to 2149. There must be some powerful people in 2149 and the idea of going 85 miliion in the "past" and have to redo theire empire all over again is not a briliant idea to them. Now if they can build a portal back to 2149, they can espabilish an commerce back and forth they get even more rich and in the end since you can come and go freely the people will not not be all that interested in presenving the "past"and doing it "right".

Hmmmm...we shall see. That seems a bit to creative for anyone in the TV industry to come up with now days...

[tomstone]

They could, but not the Taylor and company future. Now they build a portal back to 2149. There must be some powerful people in 2149 and the idea of going 85 miliion in the "past" and have to redo theire empire all over again is not a briliant idea to them. Now if they can build a portal back to 2149, they can espabilish an commerce back and forth they get even more rich and in the end since you can come and go freely the people will not not be all that interested in presenving the "past"and doing it "right".

That was my guess too. It would explain Miras "Control the Past, Control the future". Whoever controls the Portal on the other Sidse ultimatly can blackmail his way to the most powerful Person of all time.

In the end I am not sure if it is that easy to build a way back. On the Pilot I posted that the Gate was inbetween 2 particle accelerators and I am pretty sure that is what powers the travel. So to build a way back they would theoretically have to build the same, wouldnt they?

[Steelbox]

Interesting theories...and I see how they could play out. However, I don't think they would control the future if its an alternate timeline.

They could, but not the Taylor and company future. Now they build a portal back to 2149. There must be some powerful people in 2149 and the idea of going 85 miliion in the "past" and have to redo theire empire all over again is not a briliant idea to them. Now if they can build a portal back to 2149, they can espabilish an commerce back and forth they get even more rich and in the end since you can come and go freely the people will not not be all that interested in presenving the "past"and doing it "right".

[TheRandomOne]

The show did establish that they traveled back in time to an alternate Earth. Beyond that...everything is speculation.

For all we know the Ice Age could happen sooner & the Extinction event could even happen sooner

[LtColCarter]

Speculating is half the fun, isn't it?

That it is!

[the fifth man]

Speculating is half the fun, isn't it?

[LtColCarter]

or the other way round, 2149 knows that Terra Nova get's destroyed/failed somehow but doesn't want to tell them they're wasting their time building a new future so they use the excuse of an alternative timestream.

My bet's still is that they are in an parallel universe, perhaps one running that never saw humans develop - so far I've seen nothing to support the time travel answer, other than there are dinosaurs there (maybe the extinction event never occurred in this universe?).

The show did establish that they traveled back in time to an alternate Earth. Beyond that...everything is speculation.

[Ian-S]

or the other way round, 2149 knows that Terra Nova get's destroyed/failed somehow but doesn't want to tell them they're wasting their time building a new future so they use the excuse of an alternative timestream.

My bet's still is that they are in an parallel universe, perhaps one running that never saw humans develop - so far I've seen nothing to support the time travel answer, other than there are dinosaurs there (maybe the extinction event never occurred in this universe?).