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    Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
    And honestly, it's the kind of love Niko HAS to have for Helen, otherwise he would not have spent over a century of his life waiting for her.
    Absolutely. And he's much more selfless than John, because he's waiting rather than trying to manipulate her/events. Personally, I don't think John loves her - it's just a habit he's gotten into, like an obsession. Or if he does love her, it's very selfish, because you don't try to wipe out half the life of someone that you care about.

    Helen does love John and a part of her probably always will, but there's only so much you can take from a relationship that is so abusive (and it is that). He's betrayed her trust time and time again, but she can't let go; probably because he's Ashley's father and she hasn't really let Ashley go yet. She's still grieving and clinging to the memories of her, and John is part of that.

    But I think she was starting to come out of that towards the end of season three. She'll never get over it altogether, but she should be able to learn to live with it. And I think that's where Nikola stands a chance. She cares for him a great deal, but she doesn't trust him. After 100+ years of John, I'm really not surprised. But sooner or later she's going to realise that the man who waited has far more respect and love for her than the one that tried to erase most of her life.

    It isn't going to be easy, and I doubt it's going to happen this season. We should, hopefully, see some movement towards it, but it's going to take time. If season 5 gets a green light, I expect to see something towards the end of that. Yes, the end - Helen has a lot of healing to do, and her friendship with Nikola needs to be firmer. The better the foundation, the longer a romantic relationship will last.

    Nikola Telsa: the boy who waited. It'll happen, because it's too epic not to

    Comment


      And now, because I said it:

      Spoiler:


      Feel free to snurch

      Comment


        I do get where you're coming from Mimzy, but that's not quite what I meant. And I know it wasn't directed at *just* me, but since you quoted that post...

        I don't think it's strange to believe in 'forever' and I didn't say it only happens in teen movies. I too have seen relationships that lasted twice my lifetime and I have nothing but respect for that.
        Me thinking that you can still love someone after having had a long lasting relationship, has nothing to do with having a quitter mentality, it has something to do with my personal idea that love is something very personal and that it's something that just...happens. I know people can love each other for as long as they live, but I have trouble believing that 'it' can't happen again. To me (again: personal believe) it's just as depressing to think that there's only one person in time you could really love even though you're done with said relationship. It's romantic and it's great if love lasts, but to illustrate it using Helen/John, the case I was referring to, I do think it's sad to hold on to something that isn't right and continues to hurt you.

        Having a true soulmate is beautiful, but to me, so is being able to truly love someone else after losing your first love.


        Originally posted by misaditas View Post
        And now, because I said it:



        Feel free to snurch
        Nice!
        Being original is difficult when you can't stop quoting your favorite tv show, For crying out loud!

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          Just want to poke my head up out of lurkerdom and say I'm enjoying reading all the discussion in this thread - people are making really good points here.

          There's so much history between all of the Five we know so little about - one of the things I love most about Helen/Nikola is there is so much unknown, so much left up to interpretation. I loooove couples with long histories, so these two are basically tailor made for me.

          Comment


            misa...i scrunched it. I love it. I wish i could use it in my sig.
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            August 27, 2011 official Teslen ship day....mark your calenders.

            Comment


              Thanks Max. The moment I typed that (it's a Doctor Who reference for those that don't know) my love for Nikola was sealed.

              Comment


                Misa: That is gorgeous and I got the reference

                lillypilly: I'm glad you came out of lurkdom, hope to see you around more
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                Icon and Sig by me.

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                  Originally posted by Elorendil View Post
                  Didn't Nikola say something in a later ep about her shooting him on numerous occasions? .........
                  Yes! I remembered that later and wished I'd included it. He says something in that ep about Helen having shot him more times than he can count or more times than he can remember.... don't remember exact words. But yes.

                  StarSancFar: The only other way she could have distracted him was to...erm kiss him that would have done the trick!
                  That just might do it.

                  misaditas: For all that he's a 150+ year old genius vampire, he doesn't seem to have the first idea about how to woo Helen. The flirty behaviour and innuendo, while funny, is actually quite immature. He's often like a schoolboy with a crush, which is kinda cute but makes me slightly concerned for a long-term relationship. I'd like to see him be more serious about that before it develops further. He needs to grow up (and I love him, I really do, but still...)
                  I think he's capable of more than we've seen, but he doesn't get more serious with Helen because he's afraid if he tried and she turned him down that would be such a blow to him emotionally as well as hurting his pride. just my opinion.


                  DutchIndeed: I love to hear Amanda or Jonathon talk about how they see he relationship between Helen and Nikola. And especially AT has been explaining quite a lot at cons and interviews.
                  I'm looking forwards to seeing how S4 turns out when it comes to their (friend)ship
                  Spoiler:
                  I agree. What JY says on the dvd and what AT has said also is very interesting about their relationship, but it makes me feel really uncertain at the same time because they both acknowledge there are deep feelings and tension there but I think AT in particular feels if they actually got together it would ruin the tension and that's what makes it so intriguing.
                  Thanks for the transcript. Reminds me of something - I didn't like MW calling Tesla an oaf and saying Magnus has way better taste than that. HUH?! Jack the Ripper is better taste?? Uhhh.. not in my book.



                  And just want to toss in .02 on the soulmate/love of one's life topic. I believe it's possible to find a love like that, but not everyone is that lucky. For those who don't have that, something is better than nothing. Just being realistic.
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                    Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                    Absolutely. And he's much more selfless than John, because he's waiting rather than trying to manipulate her/events. Personally, I don't think John loves her - it's just a habit he's gotten into, like an obsession. Or if he does love her, it's very selfish, because you don't try to wipe out half the life of someone that you care about.

                    Helen does love John and a part of her probably always will, but there's only so much you can take from a relationship that is so abusive (and it is that). He's betrayed her trust time and time again, but she can't let go; probably because he's Ashley's father and she hasn't really let Ashley go yet. She's still grieving and clinging to the memories of her, and John is part of that.

                    But I think she was starting to come out of that towards the end of season three. She'll never get over it altogether, but she should be able to learn to live with it. And I think that's where Nikola stands a chance. She cares for him a great deal, but she doesn't trust him. After 100+ years of John, I'm really not surprised. But sooner or later she's going to realise that the man who waited has far more respect and love for her than the one that tried to erase most of her life.

                    It isn't going to be easy, and I doubt it's going to happen this season. We should, hopefully, see some movement towards it, but it's going to take time. If season 5 gets a green light, I expect to see something towards the end of that. Yes, the end - Helen has a lot of healing to do, and her friendship with Nikola needs to be firmer. The better the foundation, the longer a romantic relationship will last.

                    Nikola Telsa: the boy who waited. It'll happen, because it's too epic not to
                    There had BETTER be a season 5. I'm so worried because the Syfy network likes to defy logic and cancel all its good shows. Someone needs to throw out the loonies running the entire NBC/Universal company >_<

                    Because I agree - it'll take a while for anything really serious to happen between the two of them, because BOTH of them have trust issues. I'm getting the feeling that after *THAT* moment we saw in the Breakfast TV feature, Niko might still be wary of allowing himself to believe that Helen really has feelings for him (I mean, the shock on his face is so obvious). I think that's what he might have done at Oxford and was crushed when he found out that she only saw him as a friend (and speaking from personal experience, it really does make you very wary -_-). So they both definitely have trust issues to work out.

                    But, I think that Niko having trust issues would actually end up being really good for their relationship because it would give Helen a taste of what Niko has had to go through for all these years. I'd like for her to understand at least a little bit how hard it was for him to wait for her by having to wait herself for him to be ready to trust her. And I think it would make their relationship that much stronger because they'll each have more respect for what the other went through.

                    Originally posted by DutchIndeed View Post
                    I do get where you're coming from Mimzy, but that's not quite what I meant. And I know it wasn't directed at *just* me, but since you quoted that post...

                    I don't think it's strange to believe in 'forever' and I didn't say it only happens in teen movies. I too have seen relationships that lasted twice my lifetime and I have nothing but respect for that.
                    Me thinking that you can still love someone after having had a long lasting relationship, has nothing to do with having a quitter mentality, it has something to do with my personal idea that love is something very personal and that it's something that just...happens. I know people can love each other for as long as they live, but I have trouble believing that 'it' can't happen again. To me (again: personal believe) it's just as depressing to think that there's only one person in time you could really love even though you're done with said relationship. It's romantic and it's great if love lasts, but to illustrate it using Helen/John, the case I was referring to, I do think it's sad to hold on to something that isn't right and continues to hurt you.

                    Having a true soulmate is beautiful, but to me, so is being able to truly love someone else after losing your first love.




                    Nice!
                    Ah, okay, I misunderstood. LOL


                    EDIT: btw, misa, I LOVE the "boy who waited" thing. And the banner
                    "YOU'RE EASIER THAN THE U.S. CONGRESS."~Nikola
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                    Sig by ME!!!

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                      And honestly, it's the kind of love Niko HAS to have for Helen, otherwise he would not have spent over a century of his life waiting for her.
                      ^^ agrees

                      Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                      Absolutely. And he's much more selfless than John, because he's waiting rather than trying to manipulate her/events. Personally, I don't think John loves her - it's just a habit he's gotten into, like an obsession. Or if he does love her, it's very selfish, because you don't try to wipe out half the life of someone that you care about.

                      Helen does love John and a part of her probably always will, but there's only so much you can take from a relationship that is so abusive (and it is that). He's betrayed her trust time and time again, but she can't let go; probably because he's Ashley's father and she hasn't really let Ashley go yet. She's still grieving and clinging to the memories of her, and John is part of that.

                      It isn't going to be easy, and I doubt it's going to happen this season. We should, hopefully, see some movement towards it, but it's going to take time. If season 5 gets a green light, I expect to see something towards the end of that. Yes, the end - Helen has a lot of healing to do, and her friendship with Nikola needs to be firmer. The better the foundation, the longer a romantic relationship will last.

                      Nikola Telsa: the boy who waited. It'll happen, because it's too epic not to
                      I think John does love her, but in a very obsessive way, he knows he's hurt her and done wrong, and just wants to make up for it. I don't think he's being purposelly selfish, he's just sooo desperate to fix things, when they're too broken to do so. Helen has moved on a lot more than she had at the start of the seaon, and I think it's (like you said) because she's healed a little bit from Ashley's death, but she's still holding onto the one last fragment of her daughter, which is the father. By holding on, I mean emotionally, and maybe not even intentionly, but she deffinately still loves John a tiny bit, people love their first love's forever, right? I mean there's a deep connection....

                      'Nikola Tesla: The boy who waited' IS EPIC! Nice Dr Who refernece!

                      Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                      And now, because I said it:



                      Feel free to snurch
                      LOVE IT! *snurched*

                      Originally posted by lillypilly View Post
                      Just want to poke my head up out of lurkerdom and say I'm enjoying reading all the discussion in this thread - people are making really good points here.

                      There's so much history between all of the Five we know so little about - one of the things I love most about Helen/Nikola is there is so much unknown, so much left up to interpretation. I loooove couples with long histories, so these two are basically tailor made for me.
                      HI! *waves warmly* So, you're one of the many lurkers, eh? Nice to see you delurked! And there is a lot that we don't know about them, their history. Other than the tidbits of info that they talk about, but I'd reallly like to see an ep with them on an adventure back in the days!

                      Originally posted by NumberSix View Post
                      I think he's capable of more than we've seen, but he doesn't get more serious with Helen because he's afraid if he tried and she turned him down that would be such a blow to him emotionally as well as hurting his pride. just my opinion.

                      Spoiler:
                      I agree. What JY says on the dvd and what AT has said also is very interesting about their relationship, but it makes me feel really uncertain at the same time because they both acknowledge there are deep feelings and tension there but I think AT in particular feels if they actually got together it would ruin the tension and that's what makes it so intriguing.
                      Thanks for the transcript. Reminds me of something - I didn't like MW calling Tesla an oaf and saying Magnus has way better taste than that. HUH?! Jack the Ripper is better taste?? Uhhh.. not in my book.



                      And just want to toss in .02 on the soulmate/love of one's life topic. I believe it's possible to find a love like that, but not everyone is that lucky. For those who don't have that, something is better than nothing. Just being realistic.
                      I agree. And about MW, how dare he! lol, Magnus' taste isn't all that good so far - Jack the Ripper, then that Olaf guy!! Hopefully she'll get a slap on the head by Biggie and change her taste! Then she'll she that NIKO is right there waiting for her!!

                      Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                      There had BETTER be a season 5. I'm so worried because the Syfy network likes to defy logic and cancel all its good shows. Someone needs to throw out the loonies running the entire NBC/Universal company >_<

                      Because I agree - it'll take a while for anything really serious to happen between the two of them, because BOTH of them have trust issues. I'm getting the feeling that after *THAT* moment we saw in the Breakfast TV feature, Niko might still be wary of allowing himself to believe that Helen really has feelings for him (I mean, the shock on his face is so obvious). I think that's what he might have done at Oxford and was crushed when he found out that she only saw him as a friend (and speaking from personal experience, it really does make you very wary -_-). So they both definitely have trust issues to work out.

                      But, I think that Niko having trust issues would actually end up being really good for their relationship because it would give Helen a taste of what Niko has had to go through for all these years. I'd like for her to understand at least a little bit how hard it was for him to wait for her by having to wait herself for him to be ready to trust her. And I think it would make their relationship that much stronger because they'll each have more respect for what the other went through.
                      *fingers crossed for season 5!*
                      Agree with the trust issues thing, obv. Helen becasue of John and maybe the job she's in. And Niko with just been having to wait so long and really not sure if the feelings are reciprocated.

                      I had a think today (dangerous ) and i thought about the Canada Breakfast Interveiw thingy -

                      Spoiler:
                      Niko's face looked slightly angry, not sure if it was towards Helen, but if it was, maybe she did something really bad to him, hurt him in some way, emotionally. And the kiss was her desperatley trying to apoligize. Meh, but then her saying "Go, Nikola!" made me think that maybe Niko was angry at something someone else did, like someone put Helen in that situation in danger and he had to leave....

                      I'll shut up now
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                      Comment


                        I think by this point John doesn't care whether he comes off as selfish - he just wants Helen back no matter what the cost. But I don't think it's in the sense of "I love you and I can't imagine myself without you" now, but more in a possessive way, like she's some kind of trophy. He seems to assume that he will always have some sort of control over Helen so that she will inevitably go back to him in the end. It's like he doesn't believe she will ever have the capacity get over him or something, which if you really think about it, is more egotistical than any of the dumb things Niko does. IDK. That's just what it looks like to me.

                        and about the Breakfast TV thing
                        Spoiler:
                        Yeah, at the end he did look a bit angry. I think it was partly a mass amount of confusion too. But in the other clips they showed it looked like he and Helen had been arguing about whatever the situation was, like maybe she wanted him to go but he was refusing to leave her.

                        And AT did say that the villain in the ep throws Helen around a lot (something about being slammed into a desk ), so maybe Niko found out and was pissed about that.

                        Because no one touches his Helen and gets away with it...
                        "YOU'RE EASIER THAN THE U.S. CONGRESS."~Nikola
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                          Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                          Well, I do have the bonus of being British (Oldham? Really? Oh, I don't think so!) so her language is not a problem, but it is her motivation that I don't quite get. What I'm thinking is something disconnected from the story arc somewhat, a little like Awakening was. Whether they'll be on their own or at the Sanctuary has yet to be decided (right now I'm trying to shut Tesla and Baal up over a werewolf fic)
                          Completely off topic but you mentioned Ba'al again *gaze* and I just have to ask because it's another of my very guilty pleasures...
                          Spoiler:
                          Do you like Sam/Ba'al fic or know of any good ones? Don't get me wrong, Sam/Jack is my preferred ship of choice, I adore that pairing, but every now and then when I leer look at Ba'al I want to read Ba'al/Sam fic


                          Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                          And honestly, it's the kind of love Niko HAS to have for Helen, otherwise he would not have spent over a century of his life waiting for her.
                          I agree I think Niko has definitely spent his lifetime in love with Helen. Even if she was misguided with Mr Unmentionable I'm hopeful she's finally seeing what's right in front of her waiting (Niko!!)

                          Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                          Absolutely. And he's much more selfless than John, because he's waiting rather than trying to manipulate her/events. Personally, I don't think John loves her - it's just a habit he's gotten into, like an obsession. Or if he does love her, it's very selfish, because you don't try to wipe out half the life of someone that you care about.
                          Agreed.

                          But I think she was starting to come out of that towards the end of season three. She'll never get over it altogether, but she should be able to learn to live with it. And I think that's where Nikola stands a chance. She cares for him a great deal, but she doesn't trust him. After 100+ years of John, I'm really not surprised. But sooner or later she's going to realise that the man who waited has far more respect and love for her than the one that tried to erase most of her life.
                          Agree with bolded - although I think she does trust Nikola, just that she knows him so well she's cautious... if that makes any sense Niko def. has way more respect and love for her.

                          If season 5 gets a green light, I expect to see something towards the end of that. Yes, the end - Helen has a lot of healing to do, and her friendship with Nikola needs to be firmer. The better the foundation, the longer a romantic relationship will last.

                          Nikola Telsa: the boy who waited. It'll happen, because it's too epic not to
                          Yep *nods in agreement again*

                          Originally posted by misaditas View Post
                          And now, because I said it:

                          Spoiler:


                          Feel free to snurch
                          Awesome

                          Originally posted by DutchIndeed View Post
                          I do get where you're coming from Mimzy, but that's not quite what I meant. And I know it wasn't directed at *just* me, but since you quoted that post...

                          I don't think it's strange to believe in 'forever' and I didn't say it only happens in teen movies. I too have seen relationships that lasted twice my lifetime and I have nothing but respect for that.
                          Me thinking that you can still love someone after having had a long lasting relationship, has nothing to do with having a quitter mentality, it has something to do with my personal idea that love is something very personal and that it's something that just...happens. I know people can love each other for as long as they live, but I have trouble believing that 'it' can't happen again. To me (again: personal believe) it's just as depressing to think that there's only one person in time you could really love even though you're done with said relationship. It's romantic and it's great if love lasts, but to illustrate it using Helen/John, the case I was referring to, I do think it's sad to hold on to something that isn't right and continues to hurt you.

                          Having a true soulmate is beautiful, but to me, so is being able to truly love someone else after losing your first love.
                          You and I think the same, my dear

                          Originally posted by lillypilly View Post
                          Just want to poke my head up out of lurkerdom and say I'm enjoying reading all the discussion in this thread - people are making really good points here.

                          There's so much history between all of the Five we know so little about - one of the things I love most about Helen/Nikola is there is so much unknown, so much left up to interpretation. I loooove couples with long histories, so these two are basically tailor made for me.
                          You should de-lurk more often and join in the discussions

                          Originally posted by StarSancFar View Post
                          HI! *waves warmly* So, you're one of the many lurkers, eh? Nice to see you delurked! And there is a lot that we don't know about them, their history. Other than the tidbits of info that they talk about, but I'd reallly like to see an ep with them on an adventure back in the days!
                          That would be a good ep!

                          Originally posted by StarSancFar View Post
                          I had a think today (dangerous ) and i thought about the Canada Breakfast Interveiw thingy -

                          Spoiler:
                          Niko's face looked slightly angry, not sure if it was towards Helen, but if it was, maybe she did something really bad to him, hurt him in some way, emotionally. And the kiss was her desperatley trying to apoligize. Meh, but then her saying "Go, Nikola!" made me think that maybe Niko was angry at something someone else did, like someone put Helen in that situation in danger and he had to leave....

                          I'll shut up now
                          Like yourself, I've been thinking about that interview (also dangerous )...
                          Spoiler:
                          I think rather than anger it's maybe just the urgency of their situation - whatever that situation may be... mixed in with the fact he obviously wasn't expecting her to plant one on him I don't think it's an apology kiss... I think more of a goodbye / good luck sort of kiss?
                          *ponders*
                          Do you think Helen wants him to leave for his safety? I mean, he's a vampire again... and there's animosity between praxians/vampires... yes? I can't remember the details... but is that why they were in Hollow Earth? In which case, if they're all breaking out surely if they found out about Niko (a vampire being around) they may direct some of their anger about the past towards him... hence his life in danger... hence Helen wanting him to go into hiding or something? Which would also work with her kissing him if she thinks she may not see him for a long while, or she may not get another chance if he's found?!


                          I also come with a gift I wrote this a little while ago and edited it whilst I was on holiday. It's a bit epic (4,000 ish words)... and I'm spoiler warning for S3 cliffhanger.
                          Spoiler:
                          That Helen has gone back in time

                          Reads and reviews always appreciated

                          The Stolen Dress
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                            Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                            I think by this point John doesn't care whether he comes off as selfish - he just wants Helen back no matter what the cost. But I don't think it's in the sense of "I love you and I can't imagine myself without you" now, but more in a possessive way, like she's some kind of trophy. He seems to assume that he will always have some sort of control over Helen so that she will inevitably go back to him in the end. It's like he doesn't believe she will ever have the capacity get over him or something, which if you really think about it, is more egotistical than any of the dumb things Niko does. IDK. That's just what it looks like to me.
                            Sorry double post but just saw this This makes sense to me.

                            and about the Breakfast TV thing
                            Spoiler:
                            Yeah, at the end he did look a bit angry. I think it was partly a mass amount of confusion too. But in the other clips they showed it looked like he and Helen had been arguing about whatever the situation was, like maybe she wanted him to go but he was refusing to leave her.

                            And AT did say that the villain in the ep throws Helen around a lot (something about being slammed into a desk ), so maybe Niko found out and was pissed about that.

                            Because no one touches his Helen and gets away with it...
                            Bolded - my thoughts too see my post above this
                            Spoiler:
                            It would be nice to see Niko being pissed about someone hurting her and maybe being a little protective / concerned. I'm intrigued to know about their arguing... perhaps with them being alone he'll be more open about his concern for her?
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                            Comment


                              Originally posted by lastrequest View Post
                              Completely off topic but you mentioned Ba'al again *gaze* and I just have to ask because it's another of my very guilty pleasures...
                              Spoiler:
                              Do you like Sam/Ba'al fic or know of any good ones? Don't get me wrong, Sam/Jack is my preferred ship of choice, I adore that pairing, but every now and then when I leer look at Ba'al I want to read Ba'al/Sam fic
                              Spoiler:
                              Um, yeah I know of Sam/Baal fic. Mostly because I write it *toes the floor*

                              Everything I've done is on my LJ


                              Carry on!

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by NumberSix View Post
                                Spoiler:
                                I agree. What JY says on the dvd and what AT has said also is very interesting about their relationship, but it makes me feel really uncertain at the same time because they both acknowledge there are deep feelings and tension there but I think AT in particular feels if they actually got together it would ruin the tension and that's what makes it so intriguing.
                                Thanks for the transcript. Reminds me of something - I didn't like MW calling Tesla an oaf and saying Magnus has way better taste than that. HUH?! Jack the Ripper is better taste?? Uhhh.. not in my book.
                                Spoiler:
                                As much as I ADORE Martin Wood, that comment made me frown as well. Better taste?! Seriously?




                                Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                                Ah, okay, I misunderstood. LOL
                                Oh phew! I read it back and got worried it seemed harsh and that wasn't my intention.

                                Originally posted by StarSancFar View Post

                                I agree. And about MW, how dare he! lol, Magnus' taste isn't all that good so far - Jack the Ripper, then that Olaf guy!! Hopefully she'll get a slap on the head by Biggie and change her taste! Then she'll she that NIKO is right there waiting for her!!

                                Mention Olaf and your point is made.

                                Originally posted by Mimzy View Post
                                I think by this point John doesn't care whether he comes off as selfish - he just wants Helen back no matter what the cost. But I don't think it's in the sense of "I love you and I can't imagine myself without you" now, but more in a possessive way, like she's some kind of trophy. He seems to assume that he will always have some sort of control over Helen so that she will inevitably go back to him in the end. It's like he doesn't believe she will ever have the capacity get over him or something, which if you really think about it, is more egotistical than any of the dumb things Niko does. IDK. That's just what it looks like to me.
                                Yes. What she said. *nods*
                                Being original is difficult when you can't stop quoting your favorite tv show, For crying out loud!

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