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Vincent and the Doctor (3110/510)

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    #16
    Worst episode of the series... barely above fear her and love and monsters!

    Why could vincent see the alien? and why could vincent seem that amy had lost rory?

    both these things are not explained... instead we get ridiculous lipservice to the art community! Focus on sorting your plot out before pushing your agenda thank you!
    A word of advice... there are creatures that live between this dimension and the next, fiendish creatures that feast on the suffering of an entire world to satiate their eternal hunger. Support the Gateworld Cantina or suffer the fate of all who fall into the clutches of the 'Eladrith Ynneas'

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      #17
      Originally posted by The_Carpenter View Post
      Worst episode of the series... barely above fear her and love and monsters!

      Why could vincent see the alien? and why could vincent seem that amy had lost rory?

      both these things are not explained... instead we get ridiculous lipservice to the art community! Focus on sorting your plot out before pushing your agenda thank you!
      Actually the reason he could see the alien was explained, in a way. He sees the world compleatly differently to everyone else and its viewing this world on a different plane of reality tat meant he could see the alien.
      If found, is probably lost on the way to Azaroth or the Pegasus Galaxy
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        #18
        Originally posted by Draygon View Post
        Actually the reason he could see the alien was explained, in a way. He sees the world compleatly differently to everyone else and its viewing this world on a different plane of reality tat meant he could see the alien.
        Hardly you can't show someone how you see the world by holding their hand, besides that scene in my (utterly logical interpretation) is vincent visualising how he would paint that scene, not how he sees it, he is Human and will not see things differently to anyone else (excluding colour blindness, which would not have the effect shown in this indulgent piece of dren)
        A word of advice... there are creatures that live between this dimension and the next, fiendish creatures that feast on the suffering of an entire world to satiate their eternal hunger. Support the Gateworld Cantina or suffer the fate of all who fall into the clutches of the 'Eladrith Ynneas'

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          #19
          Originally posted by The_Carpenter View Post
          Hardly you can't show someone how you see the world by holding their hand, besides that scene in my (utterly logical interpretation) is vincent visualising how he would paint that scene, not how he sees it, he is Human and will not see things differently to anyone else (excluding colour blindness, which would not have the effect shown in this indulgent piece of dren)
          The episode gave me the impression that he perceives the world differently, or at least he looks at it harder than others and thus can see things others don't. I think it also hinted that he may have some degree of synesthesia - doesn't he say he hears colours?

          While I agree I would have liked a slightly more explicit explanation for how he can see the beast when nobody else can, and I'm usually the type to demand well plotted, logical science fiction stories, I think this episode works on the merits of its acting and emotion alone, and I found it to be a pleasant change from the norm.
          And now it's time for one last bow, like all your other selves. Eleven's hour is over now... the clock is striking Twelve's.
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            #20
            Originally posted by Sealurk View Post
            The episode gave me the impression that he perceives the world differently, or at least he looks at it harder than others and thus can see things others don't. I think it also hinted that he may have some degree of synesthesia - doesn't he say he hears colours?

            While I agree I would have liked a slightly more explicit explanation for how he can see the beast when nobody else can, and I'm usually the type to demand well plotted, logical science fiction stories, I think this episode works on the merits of its acting and emotion alone, and I found it to be a pleasant change from the norm.
            Vincent's not the only genius to have seen things outside the realm of other humans. Shakespeare was able to see past the Doctor's psychic paper. I think it doesn't take too big a leap to think that genius like Shakespeare and Van Gogh undoubtedly had the ability to see and think about things in ways that I know I couldn't possibly comprehend. Some of the art painted by Van Gogh and some of the works written by Shakespeare...I see them and read them and can only scratch my head in wonder at what inspires them and see things in the way that they did.

            Was anyone else overjoyed as I was when the TARDIS console printed out pictures of the Doctor's first and second incarnations? Wonderful touch I thought. This is the second appearance of an image of the 2nd Doctor (his first image being in The Eleventh Hour) but the third appearance of an image of the 1st Doctor this series (the first image being in The Eleventh Hour and the second image in The Vampires of Venice). I wonder what the thinking is behind the recent images of the Doctor's first incarnation turning up so much? Is it just nostalgia or will there possibly be a future plot line somehow involving the Doctor's first incarnation? If it's just nostalgia then I'm super cool with that. Always like seeing nods to the past...but if they could somehow work in the involvement of the 1st Doctor into a storyline...WOW!
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              #21
              Early on in the episode. Just after The Doctor accepted Vincent's "offer" to let them stay at his place. The Doctor comments that it's a "very starry night". The comment caused me to think about the Don McLean song Vincent before the actual Van Gogh painting Starry Night. Of course the song is about Van Gogh too so I had my own little nice moment ... even though that connection was probably not intended.

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                #22
                Originally posted by The_Carpenter
                Worst episode of the series... barely above fear her and love and monsters!

                Why could vincent see the alien? and why could vincent seem that amy had lost rory?

                both these things are not explained... instead we get ridiculous lipservice to the art community! Focus on sorting your plot out before pushing your agenda thank you!
                Agenda? as if the entirety of your post wasn't enough, the utterance of that word in this context shows nothing but a broken mind. a lack of comprehension. I question why you would even try to enjoy anything at all if even the most basic of tips from a languid practicality to an expressive and subjective artistry can be so disastrously misconstrued as an "agenda".

                And, furthermore, this perception isn't even accurate to begin with - the plotline is reasoned, and explanations are provided. the doctor mentioned that Vincent "sees things differently". it can be because of any multitude of reasons - mutation, his troubled mind, any number of things. the point is that van goghs perceptions differed from that of the average human being and it doesn't - shouldn't - need to hold your hand in addressing this point.

                there is an element of subjectivity and there is an element of objectivity in reality, don't mislead yourself into believing otherwise.
                Last edited by Joachim; June 5, 2010, 08:00 PM.

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                  #23
                  I came into this episode not expecting much i was pleasently suprised, a nice stand alone episode
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                    #24
                    It was a very good episode, not the usual action-packed DW episode, but more emotional and looking back at van gogh's life. The whole thing with seeing the beast, was interesting in the sense of it is entirely possible he could see the beast. I mean he was going crazy wasn't he and it is possible when you lose your mind, you do see the world and reality in a totally different light (that concept has been used in other programmes). Plus Van Gogh is an artist, he's suppose to think outside the box, so he may be able to perceive things differently, similar to how shakespeare was able to see through the psychic paper. Interesting to see the Doctor still feeling guilt over Rory and mentioning him once. I think that theme will run through to the last episode, the Doctor's guilt, people telling Amy she's sad at losing someone and Amy not knowing who she lost.

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                      #25
                      That was beautifully filmed, and the bit where the sky turned into the painting was lovely.

                      Richard Curran was a bit of a find: someone who could act such a part so well and looked right.

                      Some good lines:

                      "Amy, Rory - I mean Vincent"

                      "Is this how time normally passes? Really slowly and in the right order?"

                      "That one's mustard, that's ketchup."

                      Madeleine

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by Joachim View Post
                        Agenda? as if the entirety of your post wasn't enough, the utterance of that word in this context shows nothing but a broken mind. a lack of comprehension. I question why you would even try to enjoy anything at all if even the most basic of tips from a languid practicality to an expressive and subjective artistry can be so disastrously misconstrued as an "agenda".
                        I don't know if "agenda" is quite the right word, but I have to agree with the basic idea. I've got no problem with Doctor Who promoting figures like Dickens, Shakespeare and van Gogh - it's great if they can get people, especially kids, interested in their work, but this episode was ridiculous. The Shakespeare episode basically just had the Doctor going "Oh, you're brilliant!" every now and then, and Shakespeare saved the day in the end, but this felt like a bloody informercial at times. A particularly sentimental one at that. The Doctor and Amy fawning over him, Bill Nighy's speech, etc. Very OTT. For me it was very distracting, and really took away from whatever good points the episode had.
                        Last edited by Naonak; June 6, 2010, 06:52 AM.

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Naonak View Post
                          I don't know if "agenda" is quite the right word, but I have to agree with the basic idea. I've got no problem with Doctor Who promoting figures like Dickens, Shakespeare and van Gogh - it's great if they can get people, especially kids, interested in their work, but this episode was ridiculous. The Shakespeare episode basically just had the Doctor going "Oh, you're brilliant!" every now and then, and Shakespeare saved the day in the end, but this felt like a bloody informercial at times. A particularly sentimental one at that. The Doctor and Amy fawning over him, Bill Nighy's speech, etc. Very OTT. For me it was very distracting, and really took away from whatever good points the episode had.
                          The Doctor fawns over every person he meets. And you're right it is good if you can get kids interested in the work or person of such magnitude as shakespeare or Van Gogh. But that's difficult in the case of art because kids see art and don't really think of them as special. This episode makes it clear to anyone why they are.
                          Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

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                            #28
                            I'm kindof surprised there isn't more activity for this episode....

                            I really enjoyed it. Probably my fav. of the season thus far. I don't really like change.. at all. lol It's taken me a lot getting used to the new Doctor and Amy.. but this I think is the first episode where I really started to like them.

                            I'll have to rewatch them all again... I'll probably appreciate the episodes more... I tend to do that. I'll watch in hopes that I will enjoy a show... and then go back and rewatch from the beginning once I'm hooked.

                            Yeah it didn't add much to the overall storyline, but as a stand alone, I thought it was nicely done.

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                              #29
                              Basically...

                              Fantasticly enjoyable and frankly lovely episode.


                              "Five Rounds Rapid"

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                                #30
                                I think the fact that van Gough saw the world in a different way is a good explanation as to why he could see the creature, but i also like to think that the writers left the question unanswered on purpose for fans to just speculate and suggest imaginative ideas as to why he could see the creature.
                                As i said in my first post, a good standalone episode and it kept the season on a good form

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