The Satan Pit (2809/209)

[The Ori]

You could tell they tried it, but it didn't work it was a poor episode too cliched and too begging it. Poor! Tried to make it intense! poor!

[Flyboy]

That's a contrasting and yet so undeveloped view...

[Madeleine]

I enjoyed it for the most part. Did anyone else get an Aliens vibe, with Mr Security Person taking the Lt Gorman role? I liked Aliens.

There was a nice balance between the characters and there was a purpose to each of them. The Captain got his mojo back, hurrah .

I liked the scenes beside the pit, especially when the Doctor said "for once, I'm going to say... lets go back" or whatever it was he said. And the bit where he was in the pit on the rope. Just not the resolution to that bit. Far too talky. And the explanation waaaaay to contrived and convoluted. There was air down here specially so that someone could come down here and survive, but they made this prison in a way such that if anyone ever got halfway down here then Satan would be able to awaken and posess someone, and they put it near a black hole so that if necessary Satan could be made to fall into the black hole, but theye didn't actually drop him into the BH himself, and is my head slightly wonky or is this all rubbish? I don't mind rubbish, but this ep spent several minutes on it, so it was too hard to ignore.

I'm not seeing ship. I'm seeing Daddy/Daughter.

[beale947]

It was good, but not as good as last weeks, personally i believe satan should has been seen earier, like coming out of the pit or something, and the planet falling into the black hole was resoved rather poorly, it would have been better if they had left it spiraling in and they had to get out before it fell into the black hole.

Also, instead of Toby having the devils mind, i think that the devil should have spoken to the doctor instead of making no real attempt of being satan at all. The episode was a real anti-climax, to a brilliant episode last week.

And about next weeks, can we please have less episodes on earth and more episodes on other planets, because if i was with the doctor, i'd be pissed off about always travelling to earth all the time and the reason you went with him, is to see other planets and the future etc.

[Metarock Sam]

What a great episode.
Sure Ther was a slight aniti-climatic fell to it at the beginning since we were all led to believe that the beast was going to jump out of the hole in the ground but he didnt.
Still all the characters where superb like the captain nad so on. So Rose is going to die in battle eh....
its great that they are showing that the Doctor doesnt know everything. That makes the story alot more interesting then an evil being telling him their plans,
loved the references to the Draconians etc. They worked although shame there was no reference to Daemons.
The Beast was so cool a million thanks to the mill for that stunning Specail effect !!! althouhgh it did look like the Balrog of Lord of the Rings it was still cool.

[Darkseid]

My thoughts;

1) The Torchwood referances are getting out of hand as far as I am concerned. How many times do we have to hear about it? It's gone beyond 'fun' for me. I haven't even seen an episode of the show, and I am already sick to death of it...

2) The Oood felt, I dunno, wasted a bit. Here was a visually pleasing monster/creature and then they were simply killed off easily. Of course they were simply puppets. First of the humans and then of Satan. But I would have liked to have seen some of them live.

3) NO SONIC SCREWDRIVER!!! YAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!

4) How did the TARDIS get down to the pit? We all knew he was going to find it and go off to another adventure. But, it looked like it had simply found him and was waiting......(I still like the excuse that 'a Wizard did it'. Any Simpsons referance is OK in my book!)

5) I am really digging the effects/design of things. The creatures in pretty much all the episodes work for me on whatever level they are supposed to. When I saw 'The End of the World', everything looked kinda Farscapie to me. And that worked in that episode. In this one, it was evil being the theme, and it worked too. Bring that in with Cat nurses and The Face of Boe, and it all comes together.

6) I know this is gonna sound odd (or Oood as some would say!) but, if this Creature was the insiration of 'The Devil' in various races through out the Universe (nice Draconian referance I thought) then how come the Time Lords never heard of him? Wouldn't you think that they would have at one point, and the Doc would have at least read about it in an archive? Maybe I am nitpicking too much, but it seems to me that a creature of such evil and destruction would have been documented somewhere other then writings on a wall in a tounge that is lost.

7) I was happy to see Rose do something other then just stand there, which is pretty much all she has done all season. There she is taking charge like she owns the place, filling in for the Doctor when he is needed.

8) I must admit I didn't care for The Doc 'sacrificing' himself by dropping down into the pit like that. I really got a feeling that all he was doing was 'ok, we're all gonna die anyway, better dieing this was then just sitting there...' It just seemed so....I dunno....maryterish.

9) That was one believable looking Devil. Great CG work.

10) There is a part of me that was hoping that when he found the beast he was going to find Vincent Price and would answer only to 'Scratchman'. Now that would have been cool!!

11) Next weeks episode looks....I dunno....a little lamer then I was hoping.

12) All in all, a great story all around. [mod snip - if you do feel utter derision for other posters, please keep it to yourself] This was fairly well thought out, fleshed out, and presented.

13) Now, if the prediction of Rose dieing in Battle comes true, that would be cool. She has a lifetime to find a battle to die in, but if it happens, it will show me that continuity is something in this new series!


My new favorite story of the new series; The Impossible Planet/Satan's Pit.

[Matt G]

1. Liked the Doctor countering the Beast's speech.

2. Liked Rose acting in the Doctor's stead.

3. Interesting idea before the Beast - like the Doctor I'm iffy on something coming from 'before' time.

4. Not so sure about Rose going into little girl mode.

5. Liked "Black holes, my people practically invented then".

Overall, solid ep, solid two parter.

[Flyboy]

Actually being before time is totally plausable.

When you get down deep enough to the quantum level you can find places where time does not exist.

Time is relative to gravity. Gravity does not exist deep on the quantum level. Now this doesnt prove much. But what it DOES prove is that the universe can exist on certain levels without time.

We dont know everything about the origins of the universe, but if time is dependent on gravity, and gravity is dependent on several factors on the quantum level working in ensemble, then in theory, these facotrs may not have begun functioning together straight after the universe's creation.

Be aware that what I just said, unlike some of my other sciencey posts REALLY pushes an idea to the limit, what I just said has no basis in science other than the fact that its an out there theory based on an actual theory. There is no evidence that time took... time to exist....

[HyperCaz]

I was disappointed with this one. I was tempted to stop watching it but I liked the ending. And while I agree the shipping was a bit too much, I just have to say this as a shipper -

SQUEE!!!

[ShadowMaat]

Just because there's some significance behind the representation of the devil doesnt mean there's a God.

No, but if there can be a personification of pure unadulterated evil, I think there should be a personification of pure unadulterated good. I crave balance.

And I detest the idea of the Doctor as a God substitute. I prefer the Doctor as the Doctor. Plain and simple.

As for the whole bit in the Pit with the Doctor talking at the Beast, my first reaction was, "Oh no! If Satan is in Toby's body, maybe Toby is in Satan's body!" I was waiting for Satan to open his mouth and say, "Doctor! It's me! Toby! KEEL MEEEE!!!" Heh. Although probably not that dramatic.

[knowles2]

Actually being before time is totally plausable.

When you get down deep enough to the quantum level you can find places where time does not exist.

Time is relative to gravity. Gravity does not exist deep on the quantum level. Now this doesnt prove much. But what it DOES prove is that the universe can exist on certain levels without time.

We dont know everything about the origins of the universe, but if time is dependent on gravity, and gravity is dependent on several factors on the quantum level working in ensemble, then in theory, these facotrs may not have begun functioning together straight after the universe's creation.

Be aware that what I just said, unlike some of my other sciencey posts REALLY pushes an idea to the limit, what I just said has no basis in science other than the fact that its an out there theory based on an actual theory. There is no evidence that time took... time to exist....

its sound like a theory, also base on quantum string theory, their is a theory that the universe was produce in something like the eleventh dimension and that it was created by a collision between two membranes in this dimension and that according to this theory matters is just the wave produce by the collision and that wave is traveling on the surface of the membrane. So the devil could of been talking about before time started in this universe and that he just came from a another membrane universe . Also in this theory have tried to explain why gravity is so weak in this universe by saying that gravity is not created in this universe but it seeps threw from this eleventh dimension and we only get a tiny fraction on it in this universe. Also this theory also explain what cause the big bang in the universe. Also this theory is could allow us to create our own universe, that if we could somehwo controle the membranes that excist in the elenventh dimension. This would not impose dangers in our universer because the universe that we created would create it own space.

Well I think that the theory states it was explain in a channel four documentery a few years ago, at that time it was one the cutting edge of quantum string theory. Infact that was a good programme that explain quite nicely the whole area of quantum phisics and was quite interesting to watch to.

[Willow'sCat]

That's a contrasting and yet so undeveloped view...

Lol!

I don't have a problem with the beast being the first evil before time blah... (although I kept thinking about Buffy) and I am glad they didn't go into what the beast really was or what it was meant to represent. You can get really bogged down when you delve into that kind of story.

I'm seeing Daddy/Daughter.

You know I get that; (why do I keep thinking of Buffy ) but that IMO is not what the writers are going for. *sigh*

I am a little tired of The Doctor's talk about humans, he wasn't always as nice about us. Although in Age of Steel he does take the mickey so maybe there is a balance. I just don't want him to fawn over us so much.

[P-90_177]

I LOVED both parts of this. I my opinion it was the best ep of the season so far. The shipping was done well and despite knowing that in the end they'll all find a way out I still felt a little fearful for them which is the sign of a truly great ep.
By the way, did anyone else notice the P-90's?

[knowles2]

yes

[cjp240573]

Ok, was a good episode and all that but if the Doctor did not make it back and Rose ended up going back to Earth. What year would it have been? They did not tell us how far in the future it was.... any ideas?

CJ