Not about the writing. But if they cant match the clothes to the state of the cities, which they have not done, then I think we can rightly worry about the rest of the story and how much effort they have put into it.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
Also the cities look far more decayed than they would really be after 15 years, way to much plant growth. These are the basics who would expect them to get right.
I don't think you understand how trailers work. They are supposed to cherry pick the best bits to make the show look good, while providing a basic premise for the viewer to convince them to watch. If someone in the PR department has chosen the 4 worst minutes of the show to put in a trailer, that really dosn't sell me on the people workng on the show either, if they're going to be so lazy and bad at their jobs that they'll let such a weak trailer for their show be released. It is a bad sign when the bits they have cherry picked looked terrible and the basic premise seems riddled with flaws and plot holes.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
In the show electricity seems to have stopped working, but they have firearms, so combustion still must work. Which means that they would be back to 19th century technology, with steam engines etc. Which means the whole post apocalyptic shtick, with the overgrown cities is rubbish. For most of the history of human civilisation people managed without electricity, and they managed to happily create civilisation. So if electricity stopped working you might see the U.S breakup and the states each becoming their own smaller 19th century style countries. To be honest that premise sounds rather more interesting than watching this.
The whole thing just looks so lacklustre, as I said, with no thought given to the mechanics of the premise. The cast look exceedingly well groomed for a a group of people in their situation, and look more like they stepped off modelling shoot, rather than coming from a society where hard manual labour would be an everyday reality. The whole show seems to be centred round the mystery of the power going out, which will turn out to be some half baked explanation like evil conspiracy with EMP, or aliens, or mystical smoke monsters, and seems to ignore the much more interesting side of looking at how American society would cope and stratify with the end of modern technology.
Good shows like Boardwalk Empire, Game of Thrones and the Walking Dead have trailers that make the shows look impressive. They make you excited and interested and want to find out more. Revolution's trailer does not do that to me.
Because you see them wearing jeans and that one guy wearing an ACDC shirt? If the world ended and you came across a facotry/truck full of jeans you probably would grab a few extra pairs, you wouldn't walk out in whatever you just had on. Also jeans can last a long time if looked after and not washed too often, also they can be repair, new ones can be sewn together from old ones. That guys shirt could have been something he found hidden away one day.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
If you had to make clothes from scratch (or at the very least old sheets) would you come up with a strange new design or just copy the simple idea that is a shirt? It has only been 15 years, clothes last on average 1-2 years (provided you don't wear the same thing everyday) and as I said clothes can be made/stored away.
Within two days, New York city's subways will flood without people around to constantly pump out the water. Its not too inconceivable that plants would take over quickly, especially considering the extra rainfall from a lack of pollution being pumped out. Have you seen "Life After People", buildings would burn out and plants would more easily take them over.
Yeah, it's like judging a album or book by its cover or title... So... A trailer doesnt have to say anything at all about the show, especially with shows...
Have you gone 1 year without all the electric gadgets you use? Even after a day without my computer or iPod i feel strange. Also people are so reliant on machines to make things, the average person has no clue how to do anything. Someone living in a 15th floor apartment wont be able to grow food and will have to leave the city, there is no way to grow food in a concrete field.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mighty 6 platoon
I discussed the whole clothes thing in an earlier post. Game of Thrones was worse than the trailer. I noticed you went on about the whole centered around the blackout thing - thats obviously the whole main point of the show, if you want a show about people growing food in their backyards and selling fish on the street, then find a show about that or make it yourself.
Im sure that a wonderful show where technology magically stops working and is never explained will not piss off more people than a show that does.
If I remember rightly life after people showed building in that level of disrepair after fifty years, not 15 said in the trailer.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
An pollution would cause more rainful, why, because cities and cars create creates urban heat sinks, which cause more water to evaporate into the atmosphere, which need to full somewhere. Also particles from out combustion engines make clouds and water molecules heavier and so they are more likely to full to the ground.
The clothes look pristine, perfectly fitted, that shirt looked perfectly white not even Arial keep clothes that white, they lived on farm, probably growing there own food from the land, dirty, sweaty manual labour. It be nearly impossible for them to have such clean, undamaged clothes, no matter how careful they are looked after. This made even worst by the fact that the characters were kids when this happen, they would not have been to collect clothes that fitted them perfectly before the event happen.
As rightly pointed out, these are pampered, 21st century, Iphone/ipad kids, the likely hood that they make clothes that looked that good after 15 years is low to zero, they would be a lot more basic.
Take Hashima Island as a prime example, even after 30 years of being left to nature it is not as overgrown as it in Revolution, even Chernobyl, where nature is driving has not be taken over by plants to the extent shown in the trailer and it has 25 years of non occupation by humans.
The clothes do not look like they have been repaired, which is part of the problem.
If they want to go down the route of giving themselves pristine clothes, then they need to explain how they got those clothes, where they come from. It perfectly possible that someone has set up a factory to make them in the past 15 years and some sort of trading system exists or that people in there community taught themselves, but they need to show us that or tell us that is what happening in this world,
That reconstruction and rebuilding the world is going on, base not electricity but on other forms of power, which is an interesting story to tell. Especially if they showed someone attempting to create a new computer age perhaps using Charles Baddage difference engine, now that would be cool to see. they have not, all they shown in the film that the world is falling apart.
One of the points of the thread is to speculate and discussed, we are discussing what we see in the trailer and our opinions on the trailer, it's the only material we got to go on for now, but this is a JJ Albrams show, so it unlikely to stay that way for long.Quote:
Sp!der
Major
Re: Revolution ( NBC) : News/Speculation/General Discussion
Yeah, it's like judging a album or book by its cover or title... So... A trailer doesnt have to say anything at all about the show, especially with shows...
If combustion still work, then I would expect to see at least attempts to build combustion engines that do not need electricity to run. Like they did in the early days. An I believe even the US there still a few steam powered boats and trains running.
I might not have gone a year without electronic items, but I have gone a significant amount of time in the military without electronic items, and have managed just fine. Also surprising as it may be to you, but your food comes from the countryside, where quite a few people live. Now you city folk might be baffled be baffled by a life without your ipod, but as someone who lives on the family farm currently, if the power went out, I would have no problem knowing where my next meal came from, because I can look out my window and see the fields of crops and the pens full of sheep, pigs and chickens.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
As unpleasant and problematic as it would be, my family, hell the whole local village, could survive without power. Wouldn't be nice and it would be a harder life, but people here do have the skills. If you looked farther than 6 feet in front of your own face, you'd realise not everybody lives up an apartment block, hooked to their iphone or ipod permanently permanently. Where you live, people might not know how to hunt, or how to slaughter an animal, or how to skin and gut it, but where I live those are common skills. It may be in a situation where the electronics went out that many people in the city would have no idea how to survive, but the fact remains there are still significant groups of people who live in the country who do have the skills to survive and even thrive.
Much like the makers of this show, you appear to have only looked out the window when it comes to considering how people would survive the situation, rather than considering the wider diaspora.
Who said anything about clothes? I was talking about how clean and well fed they look. You work hard, you get dirty, sweaty, your hair gets mussed up. These people look like they've never done a days manual labour in their life.Quote:
I discussed the whole clothes thing in an earlier post.
Any examples? Game of Thrones is a master piece in effective marketing. It has plenty of good exciting trailers. I makes you want to watch the show. I didn't include any trailers before because I didn't want to go off topic, but since you mentioned it I will do now.Quote:
Game of Thrones was worse than the trailer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpJYNVhGf1s
That's how you do a trailer. It takes the best part, effectively introducing the main characters and premise while making the show look as epic and exciting as possible.
Who said anything about a show about selling fish? I talked about how it would be interesting to explore how people would remake civilisation in such an event. Which states might turn into nations, How would they be governed , how would they differ, for instance the more liberal costal states with the more conservative internal states, what might they fight over.Quote:
I noticed you went on about the whole centered around the blackout thing - thats obviously the whole main point of the show, if you want a show about people growing food in their backyards and selling fish on the street, then find a show about that or make it yourself.
That's interesting, that's good science fiction, not some such for whatever half baked deus ex machina the writers come up with.
Completely agree with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mighty 6 platoon
Just a note on the filthy torn clothes verses clean ones. The Amish seem to do just fine. Hard work or no. If you take care of your clothes, they'll last.
Watched the trailer a while ago and I am not looking forward to this at all. For one, it's premise is questionable at best; I'm trying to wrap my head around the whole thing, like the whole thing with the electricity going out (how can a plane spin exactly), the ability to generate electricity (surely there must be something that prevents an electric charge from being generated because if they didn't, windmills would be generating electricity right now) and society 15 years later. (I agree with everything knowles2 said, this seems less reasonable and more follow the tropes with stuff like vegetation and wear being the norm in sci-fi shows.)
The main focus of this show from watching the trailer is obviously going to be about the mythology and the characters (because what else will hook viewers after watching The Voice?) and both of those factors seem underdeveloped based on the trailer. The characters don't have that sort of appeal that Fringe has and they seem almost one dimensional in nature, (possibly a fault of the director of Iron Man helming this project.) though there may be something in the series, I doubt that there will be anything of that nature since the characters shown don't have anything that'd make me care about them. I don't know what type of mythology doesn't revolve around secret logos and groups communicating each other (which they do in this show.), the ultimate questions may revolve around what's the purpose behind the blackout, how do they generate electrical charges and what purpose do these three have but even then, there's nothing deep to the mythology at hand that'd keep anybody interested.
Plus there's stuff like the over-the-top action, forced thematics and plot holes abound. (How do governments fall due to the lack of electricity, how does anything rise up? I know we take technology for granted but it's not something that society would entirely change for.) It seems like the director of Iron Man is trying to focus on the concept, the action and the mythology rather then the society, the characters or even the inner workings of the show itself; that alone will be the shows undoing because action, concept and mythology a show does not make.
I know people out there will be anticipating it because it has J.J. Abrams name and because it will hopefully resurrect sci-fi but honestly, there are better ways to resurrect sci-fi (like coming up with good ideas.) and just because it has J.J. Abrams does not mean it'll be automatically good. Many people are also hoping this show will resurrect NBC but it won't, instead it will contribute to the grave which Comcast keeps digging for it; series like this are going to be the reason why NBC is still in bad times, alongside the comedies it tries to force along (most of which just seems like an attempt to replicate the NBC of the 90's by seeing what sticks out of all of the comedies), the stuff Comcast think will work and the lack of support that will come from veteran shows ("30 Rock", "Parks and Recreation", "The Biggest Loser", "The Office", "Law & Order SVU", "Babar") that will leave the network in this or the next year.
If you watch the released scene (not the trailer) you see a light in the street explode in sparks, most likely a surge, if a plane engine did the same, it could spin out of control.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
Power goes out, people run out of food, start looting and killing each other, police and armed forces get overwhelmed (they lose the tech too), what use is a government then? They have no power and the economy would disappear, sitting in a fancy hall and coming up with laws serves no one, they would probably flee.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
So you mean to tell me that the way they do the blackout is by adding more energy? There would have to be a ridiculously large power source that's either alien or conspicuously common and for them to use that energy around the world is implausible, even with an electrical interference field. Additionally if they were overloading it then there would be some sort of electrical area out there that's built to handle any energy surge no matter how big or small.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
What they did in the show was remove all the electricity; so tell me, to remove all the electricity do they oversurge it or neutralize it or do they find a way to prevent the electrical charge from happening? (Note: Energy can be generated by friction, most of us human beings consist of electricity or an electrical current, also windmills.)
I doubt they'd run out of food, it may take longer but we have farms that can grow this stuff and we have ways of delivering it that don't require electricity.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
Because of the situation at hand; even if they lose the tech, the guns they have still work and they can find ways to utilize the tank shells without having electricity; they're not completely powerless if they lose the tech.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
Well a government is there to set rules, manage zoning, maintain the community, just make sure that the city is running in an orderly fashion. There was government back when there wasn't electricity, hell there was communication back when there wasn't electricity through the usage of an old trusty horse. Sure, there wasn't one unified government like we have now but the ideology of government still existed and several unions were doing fine with such government.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
Again, they have ways of enforcing it; it's just that the producers decided to ignore that because the government collapsing would be cooler.Quote:
Originally Posted by escyos
Unless you can see into the future, how about we wait and see what their explanation/reason for the blackout is before saying what they did, and trying to poke holes in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
Please enlighten us as to how without power or technology, they will feed 300 million people. Once the canned and wrapped food runs out (and it will be hoarded by those who like to take advantage), the farms are gonna have trouble doing that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
The guns ordinary citizens and militias have still work. And they dont rely on a vast communications network.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
And back when there wasnt electricity, there wasnt 300 million people and a civilization that relied on electronic communication. That trusty old horse is fine for the few in the country who can ride and look after one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
Enlighten us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombies Rise from the Sea
[QUOTE=Ukko;13346602]Unless you can see into the future, how about we wait and see what their explanation/reason for the blackout is before saying what they did, and trying to poke holes in it.
Fema as plans to secure such sites in America, without large scale communication infrastructure, as this would require in an atomic war scenerio. Of cause large sections of society would have to be adapted to run without electricity, and quickly, tough but not impossible.Quote:
Please enlighten us as to how without power or technology, they will feed 300 million people. Once the canned and wrapped food runs out (and it will be hoarded by those who like to take advantage), the farms are gonna have trouble doing that.
Unsurprisingly less developed nations would find this change much easier to cope with, it be nice to see what happening in places like Africa.
Civilians would have to go up against well trained and armed army guys. You imagine for several days or a few weeks at least the population would think it just a normal blackout or a terrorist attack using electromagnetic field and that the government will be returning power shortly. In that time the Government would gather people quickly to access how to run our current infrastructure without electricity, deploying army troops in all major cities and food rashioning would come in.Quote:
The guns ordinary citizens and militias have still work. And they dont rely on a vast communications network.
expect announce that steam engines would be rapidly built and that government would sieze the relevent factories and infrastructure to get that operational.
Combustion engines would still work, you just need a different ignition system, if the government can maintain order for a few weeks and produce plans to get the country back up and running there more likely most people would support them.Quote:
And back when there wasnt electricity, there wasnt 300 million people and a civilization that relied on electronic communication. That trusty old horse is fine for the few in the country who can ride and look after one.
We can only judge by the quality of the trailer, which show several cliché storyline (secret organisation, boy defends dad, dad dies because of boy, mysterious communications with person face hidden, secrete object that needs protecting,). The Airline crash scene look silly and was clearly design for visual impact rather than realism, which for me this story needs.
Easy, though there may not be electricity to operate those combines or those automated canning machines; we can easily work the machines that were made before electricity and operate the machines ourselves. I mean all the machines do is take out the hard work, all we need to do is do the hard work. As for the 300 million people well some of those people can work at the factories the same way they work at Foxxcon, there are a lot of people; I'm sure most of them would appreciate doing the work just to get some benefit out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
Just because there isn't any electricity doesn't mean there's a way to get the work done.
I already mentioned that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
Who said anything about a vast communications network? I wasn't thinking about any communications network when thinking about the situation at hand and even then, the people that make up the armed forces, army, military and navy won't be utterly powerless without communication; they won't be overwhelmed by people with guns that don't have communication. Sure, they can't coordinate globally but they can initially communicate locally (during the blackout) then work their way up to global communication, don't assume they're powerless because they're cut off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
That's because it's easier and quicker, not because it opened up new ways to communicate with each other. The trusty mail system thankfully still exists (though being increasingly ignored by the new generation) and there would be little change as to how people communicate with each other with the exception of making it harder to discover other people and places to discuss (like this forum).Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
Where I live there is a suburban city which has paths specifically designed for horses, most of the city even revolves around a horsing theme. Though they may be country-oriented, they often expand into the most suburban (and industrial) of areas and from the people I've met, they mostly use their horses rather then their cars because they're acquainted with them and serve most of the same purpose.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
I think I'm beginning to understand why the people behind Revolution made society the way it is; people have forgone steam propulsion technology, paper-based communication methods and even stuff like horses for things like cars, electrically powered engines and the internet, so much so that they'd mostly be unable to transition to the ways of old, thus leading to a world where pony express mail, hand operated machinery and even steam trains are barely existent.
Okay...Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko
- The establishment of various government offices around every city to enforce laws.
- Using the pony express to communicate with the white house.
- Having strict guidelines for the people they do employ to enforce those offices.
- Actually making sure those laws would work in today's times. (people do rebel if the laws are unfair)
And for the situation itself.
- The setting up of a system that'd allow food to come in an easy manner.
- Providing the basis for the reconstruction of ancient technology that is now practical.
- Gaining public appeal by sympathizing with the situation.
- An adjustment of the taxes to compensate for today's times.
- The initial lack of war and formation of a union between countries.
Securing sites isnt a problem (unless malitias turn up or farmers dont allow it), producing enough for, and distributing to 300 million people is the problem. Look at the mess that was Katrina. FEMA would also need communications.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
If the TV's still worked, the folks in Africa would probably be pointing and laughing.:p
I think you're underestimating how heavily armed the American populace is.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
Yes, their training will give them an advantage, but their technological advantage goes out the window, and they're vastly outnumbered and unable to receive orders. They would be just as clueless as the civilians. The impression i got from the trailer was that this is something that just happens, click. No time to prepare.
To produce plans for a fix that quick, and get the country back up and running, they would need the kind of efficient communications that they've just lost. The government can do what it does now because it has the means to do so.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
Combustion engines would also need fuel. Theres some fun panicking.
Firstly, the bolded parts arent clichés, and the communication with person whose face is hidden, well, your doing that now with me right now and everyone else on here. Secondly, there is nothing wrong with clichés. Any half decent writer knows this. Its the execution that matters, and until we see the show, we cant judge the execution.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
Thats how TV and movies work, both being visual mediums and all.
Okay technically they are not cliches, but they are way over use plot devices and to include so many in a single trailer is close to being unforgivable, I will still end up watching it but base of the trailer I am not expecting much.Quote:
Firstly, the bolded parts arent clichés, and the communication with person whose face is hidden, well, your doing that now with me right now and everyone else on here. Secondly, there is nothing wrong with clichés. Any half decent writer knows this. Its the execution that matters, and until we see the show, we cant judge the execution.
The trailer execution is average, again compare to trailers we have from Games of Thrones, or the excellent trailers released for Walking Dead, and even Fallen Skies had better trailers than this.
Saying it a visual medium, does not give the writers excuses for not being creative or resorting same or similar plot devices. Only lazy writers, producers and directors do that. Good ones find new and exciting ways to expand the medium and show the audience something they have not seen before.
We clearly have to different view points on human nature, but I believe that we tend not to panicked, we tend to remain calm and we tend to work together to solve problems. An if such a disaster did happen, we would not see the level of destruction that we saw in the trailer. But hopefully the writers will show use how all that occurred during the show and provide reasons. I actually think chaos, if there is chaos would be relatively short live and government would bring back order relatively quickly.
Hopefully the show will show a little of what happens in the rest of the world as well.
Pick up any book or show me a any TV show and i'll point out multiple overused plot devices. Like i said before, its the execution that matters, and untill we see the show, we just dont know.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
There are few shows made that can match the quality of those ones. But pointing out those shows and your above words; Zombie apocalypse, Alien invasion/apocalypse and warring kingdoms/kings, incest and politicking are certainly nothing new or original. But GoT, WD and FS are examples of top quality execution.Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
People go crazy enough when we have the means to properly recover and rebuild after a disaster. If you, quite literally, flip a switch and "turn off" civilization one night, people are going to panic (understatment).Quote:
Originally Posted by knowles2
I totally agree with that. I think that things would get pretty ugly quickly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukko