Stargate College Class! Help!!!

[Jeyla4ever]

Wow...Whistler...you never ceased to amaze me!
I just found this link in the Teyla thread..and I will warn you...I just scanned through the whole posting and I am feeling a little woozy so forgive me if I don't sound very coherent.....

I think you know me enough to know who I will be addressing..Teyla....
A lot of people here have posted many of the great qualities why I feel you should include this character....
So, I don't want to repeat myself...I especially appreciate the different perspective that you got from the males in the thread..it is always important to see how they view a woman and how it affects them when viewing any type of TV show...

But, before I continue..I have to say that I went to the link that you posted earlier from Sony in regards to the comments made towards Teyla....and sadly, I posted there....and I don't anymore..I found nothing intelligent from 99% of the people that posted there and nothing that challenged or intrigued my intellectual thoughts...I can respect other people's opinion, but I expect the same from them towards me as well....and frankly, in the month that I posted there I didn't find any indications of any sort of understanding from this...So, suffice to say that there are people out there with this kind of mentality...I wouldn't put too much importance to it because there just isn't any justification or grounds for their thinking beyond, she is hot or no she is not hot! What the heck does that mean?

Moving on....Teyla is an interesting character which you must include...obvious reason for me...she represent an elite minority that is not represented enough in TV shows, period! I can challenge anyone with this statement...that in itself is a topic right there..controversial..but nevertheless, worth the mentioning...
Second....she is a leader...regardless of whether she is portraying it now or not..that is one aspect of her character that has been introduced to us from day one and the fact that she is part of such a team is because she is there to represent her people and look out and defend her people from the Wraith.
Third...she is a warrior...in every sense of the word she brings a new tactic and new skills and abilities that not only are show a powerful and efficient warrior but also that is just as useful as any weapon that the people from Earth can bring. She represent a different type of warrior, a new and unique way of looking at a female warrior that we in the military are not used to. .. A warrior that on many occasions has saved Atlantis and Sheppard's...all because of Teyla's abilities and these are still been developed in her character as the season progresses.
Fourth....she is an alien...she has come into a new environment and emerged herself completely into a new culture completely different of her own in every sense of the word and all because she knows the importance of receiving and delivering any necessary skills in order to protect her people and those whom she is learning to care for....Not many people are willing to leave all of what they know behind and start a new life for their people...and this is what makes her even more a soulful and intriguing character...she knows very little about these people, yet in the year that she has been with them, not only do they care about her deeply, but are learning to respect her and accept her as one of their own and vice versa...Yet, she has preserved and retained her own values, morals and cultural background while adapting and conforming to those of the people she is learning to adjust to....and I just find this fascinating...

In my opinion, yes, she was put there as the "hot alien babe" for the male figure..but what I respect and enjoy about what the writers have done is that although she is beautiful and does show her beauty and accentuates her curves, they have managed to incorporate those qualities and skills that Rachel has (her dancing skills, and singing skills) as part of her character, thus her sparring scenes, which clearly show her athletic and dancing skills...and most importantly, and Whistler you mentioned this beautifully, Teyla doesn't flaunt her beauty in the show like others in SciFi do...Even when she is wearing her skimpy outfits...she wears them with the same grace and poise that she does when she wears her Athosian outfits or her Team uniform, thus making her an attractive woman, that carries herself with respect and pride without having to excessively sell her appearance.

As far as the other Athosians clothing compare to Teyla's....go back to the scene in Suspicion when the Athosians were going thru the Stargate and Teyla was up in the balcony with Weir....I remember seeing some pretty exposed cleavage.....in those Athosian girls....

Finally, Teyla, IMO is developing into one of the strongest characters in SGA...in the short time that her role has been introduced she has been able to not only battle against her own demons from her own people's perception, but now she is struggling and defending herself and have to prove herself to a new group of people whom she is trying to adjust to and understand while not loosing her own beliefs and her own perception...She has the qualities of a woman who can have it all...and although realistically, there aren't many of those outthere..it can be achieve and we can strive to acquire those leadership skills, and still be as attractive inside as the outside...anything is possible with perseverance, work and determination...I think Teyla has all of the above.......

Whistler...I am not even sure if this is what you are looking for..again...a little fuzzy as to the assignment..but I hope this helps...if not...just let me know and I will edit...

[xkawaiix]

Wow Camy, such depth! That was... wow.

[Jeyla4ever]

Wow Camy, such depth! That was... wow.

Thanks...considering that I wrote in the middle of the night...or the morning..I'm not quite sure...anyhow...I did it for Whistler84...I hope this helps....and to state my views on Teyla's character....

[FoolishPleasure]

But, before I continue..I have to say that I went to the link that you posted earlier from Sony in regards to the comments made towards Teyla....and sadly, I posted there....and I don't anymore..I found nothing intelligent from 99% of the people that posted there and nothing that challenged or intrigued my intellectual thoughts...I can respect other people's opinion, but I expect the same from them towards me as well....

After looking the MGM/Sony board and seeing what YOU posted there. . .'nuff said..

I like the characters of both Carter, Frazier, Weir for their beauty and intelligence. I don't strive to be like them (because I could never reach that level) but I admire them for showing women CAN make it in the scientific world, and I look at these characters as positive role models for young girls today.

As for Starbuck, she is an intelligent, brave, but tortured individual. She stands for something else - a female who has been brutalized in the past and has overcome it. Kara is still fighting her demons, but I think she'll make it.

[Jeyla4ever]

[QUOTE=FoolishPleasure]After looking the MGM/Sony board and seeing what YOU posted there. . .'nuff said..

So, you go there too...huh...interesting.....

[Sela]

I think talking about Sam's character is paramount to any discussion of women in the SG-1 universe. The whole subject of women in the military, command issues, relationships between the sexes while serving together - wow, you could do a whole class on Sam's alone.

Would love to see your outlines...are your classes going to taped or videoed? Apologies if that was asked before. Got excited and replied before I read the whole thread. Good Luck to you!

[Sela]

Yes, I was planning on bringing up the infamous quote of "And just because my reproductive organs are on the inside instead of the outside, doesn't mean I can't handle whatever you can handle." I wanted to show how the ptb decided to start off their only female character, and how Sam evolved from that. And why it was not only necessary to have her be military, but also a scientist. Does that personify that ideal that women have to be twice as good as men to get half the respect?

I think that would make for a great class discussion as you also find this dynamic when it comes to racial minority characters on the various shows as well. A discussion on why so-called 'minority characters' (I include women here as a minority character) are portrayed as the "other" or the "exception" rather than the rule.

Also why is there usually only 'one' on any team? Why is there never two women on a team with one in command? We take for granted that three men on a four person team is nothing to blink at - why not three women?

[xkawaiix]

I think that would make for a great class discussion as you also find this dynamic when it comes to racial minority characters on the various shows as well. A discussion on why so-called 'minority characters' (I include women here as a minority character) are portrayed as the "other" or the "exception" rather than the rule.

Also why is there usually only 'one' on any team? Why is there never two women on a team with one in command? We take for granted that three men on a four person team is nothing to blink at - why not three women?

Yeah! That's just like the "Sam Should Have Been Commander of SG1" debate!
...but that's pretty much off topic isn't it?

[PhoenixSong]

Too many posts to read all, so I don't know if this has been pointed out yet, but by deifnition I think you're going to have a hard time calling HP science fiction. The distinction between SciFi and Fantasy can be tough, but HP seems to reply more on "willing things to happen" than it does a set of rules within or outside of our known physical boundaries.

[FoolishPleasure]

[QUOTE=Camy]

After looking the MGM/Sony board and seeing what YOU posted there. . .'nuff said..

So, you go there too...huh...interesting.....

Went there for a peek a few weeks ago after I saw you complaining about it in another thread. Rather pointless to talk to the 12 year olds at that site.

I think that would make for a great class discussion as you also find this dynamic when it comes to racial minority characters on the various shows as well. A discussion on why so-called 'minority characters' (I include women here as a minority character) are portrayed as the "other" or the "exception" rather than the rule.

Also why is there usually only 'one' on any team? Why is there never two women on a team with one in command? We take for granted that three men on a four person team is nothing to blink at - why not three women?

I've wondered why TPTB don't use more women on the teams - even if they didn't want to use them as soldiers, they could show them as scientists, etc. Carter and Frazier always worked well together. And it would be nice to see a "minority" woman leading a team for a change.

[Jeyla4ever]

[QUOTE][QUOTE=FoolishPleasure]

Went there for a peek a few weeks ago after I saw you complaining about it in another thread. Rather pointless to talk to the 12 year olds at that site

.


Finally, something I can agree with you on...so true...so glad you wrote and not me...it was just a terrible experience..period!

I've wondered why TPTB don't use more women on the teams - even if they didn't want to use them as soldiers, they could show them as scientists, etc. Carter and Frazier always worked well together. And it would be nice to see a "minority" woman leading a team for a change.[/QUOTE]

You are definetly getting a green ( I think this is what you guys call it)from me on this one!
Maybe you and I can find some common ground afterall.....

[chyron]

Too many posts to read all, so I don't know if this has been pointed out yet, but by deifnition I think you're going to have a hard time calling HP science fiction. The distinction between SciFi and Fantasy can be tough, but HP seems to reply more on "willing things to happen" than it does a set of rules within or outside of our known physical boundaries.

Already covered plus links to the sci-fi, hard sci-fi and soft sci-fi articles on the wikipedia.

[Whistler84]

Okay, random (but I think important) question to address when talking about sci-fi females of Stargate. Now, this is specifically my opinion, so please don't take this as me somehow stating a fact of any sort. But I've noticed that the women of Stargate aren't the usual beauty you see on television these days. None of them, in my opinion, (specifically based on looks alone) are drop dead gorgeous. To me, they're the type of pretty you'd encounter in real people you see everyday.

It's their personalities and their characters that make them beautiful to me. For instance, Weir has become the most gorgeous character for me (like ever, right under Scully), but this has to do more with her character than her looks. I'll admit, if I were to have been shown a pic of Torri Higginson a couple of years back, I wouldn't have thought she was "all that." Pretty, but nothing to lose sleep over. Same thing with Rachel Luttrell, Amanda Tapping, and Teryl Rothery. They're all pretty, but not OMG-SHE'S-SO-GORGEOUS type of way!! In fact, just based on looks, I'd have to say Claudia Black would get the Most Gorgeous of Stargate Women Award. Again, this is just my subjective opinion.

My point is (and I do have a point) that when you compare Stargate to other shows, their standards of beauty are on a level of their own. Take Lost, for example. There, you've got a group of deserted people, with no plumbing, no soap, and the same six pairs of clothing to last their lifetime on the Island. Yet, all the women are model-worthy and have unnaturally well-conditioned hair!!!! I love Lost, but dude, c'mon! People stranded on a deserted island should not look that freakin' hot!

Based on a typical, westernized perspective of women and beauty, compare the women on Lost (or Mutant X, or Desperate Housewives, or any other pop culture show), to the women of Stargate, and one can see a difference. On Stargate, there's more natural beauty. Am I right?

My question to you (both the women and the men in the audience) is, when you first started watching Stargate, did you notice that the women there were not all "drop-dead-gorgeous-model-worthy"? (Again, if someone disagrees with this and thinks they were, that's fine. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and all.) What did you think about their looks? Did you think that reflected in your preferences for them (i.e. are you more willing to like a pretty female character, than one you don't particularly find attractive?) What, do you think, made the Stargate creators attempt to go down this route instead of the route you see in "Lost"?

Heck, also take 'Starbuck' from BSG for a prime example. A lot of complaints against her, including one from my own brother, was that she wasn't pretty enough to be 'lead women.' Television demands a standard of beauty, and I've often seen that if a woman doesn't live up to that standard, her character is treated far more critically and harshly.

Ultimately, I'm asking, does how a woman look on television affect your judgement of her character? Did how Sam, Weir, Teyla, Fraiser, and Vala look, effect your preference for them? Both originally, and after you got to know their characters.

Please be honest. I need brutal honesty!

[SnoggingPicard]

Whistler, you are dead on right. Stargate is such a great series for so many reasons, and part of that is the realism of the characters. Yes, all of them are not shabby looking people, but you can tell when the roles were cast, that they weren't looking for models. They were looking for someone who could BE Weir, who could BE Teyla, and who could BE Sam. For me, none of these characters are dependent on their looks and that is part of what makes them strong. They are all capable of holding their own in a verbal/scientific/physical sparring match, have marvelously complex personalities, unique senses of humor, and wonderful, varied relationships with the other characters. It really is their personalities that are so beautiful and attractive -- in the guys and the girls on the show.

I'd like to call attention to the thread on Gateworld if I may that is called "Top 25 Babes in Stargate". It's pretty obvious why it's there. What I think is interesting is how people are rating their choices. Guys and girls continually pick Sam Carter, Weir, and Teyla as the top three, not Vala or Osiris (who are more "drop dead gorgeous" as you put it). Why is that? All of them say things like, "I like a girl with a brain"; "She's sexy and smart"; "She can kick ass"; etc, etc, etc. Most of the postings don't even address physical beauty, and if they do, mostly they are in conjunction with personality, which is the more important factor in the choices. This says soooo much about why we love these characters, and I think it says a lot about the acting and writing ability of the franchise.

That comment about Starbuck in BSG really shocks me. I think that she is absolutely beautiful, but now that I'm looking at it with this idea in my head, I'm thinking of why I love that character so much. And that's just it -- I love her CHARACTER. When I watch Starbuck, I don't think to myself, "Gee, I wish I could have blond hair and be tall and be in shape". I think "I wish I was that confident and funny and brave and devoted." Same thing with all of the characters on Stargate. I wish that I had more of Teyla's quiet, calming introspection, more of Weir's formal, brilliant presence, more of Sam's intelligence, more of Vala's rambunctiousness, more of Dr. Frasier's empathy. These are the parts of the characters that I really admire and love, and eventually I think we even lose interest in what they look like. I'm not saying you can't physically admire any of the actors, but I would rather have a great one-liner from Sheppard to Rodney or one of his puppy-dog expressions to Weir or Teyla than, say, a scene where he doesn't have a shirt -- the former is his character, the latter is just the icing on the cake. I like the characters a lot, and nothing makes me happier when they do or say something that makes me say, "Wow! Teyla just served you!" or "You tell him Dr. Weir!" Those moments are what really make them great creations.

Hope that that made some sense and it helps you out a bit, Whistler. Basically, I agree with you yet AGAIN. You are always so right, that it's hard not to! Keep us updated on your class!

[Purpleyin]

I've wondered why TPTB don't use more women on the teams - even if they didn't want to use them as soldiers, they could show them as scientists, etc. Carter and Frazier always worked well together. And it would be nice to see a "minority" woman leading a team for a change.

I'm still hoping for a return of Miko (LFP) and/or Simpson (38 Minutes)... Though it's nice they've kept Heightmeyer around and Cadman seems favoured enough to return. Still, it'd be nice for them to put in some more recurring female characters, or use the ones they already have *cough*Sora*cough*...

Mind you this isn't restricted to female recurring characters, since Bates, Stackham and other male recurrings from S1 are awol in S2 - but there aren't that many female character to start with, so it's more disconcerting to not see a decent character come back and get developed...