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GateWorld
September 29th, 2015, 10:57 PM
<DIV ALIGN="center"><TABLE WIDTH="450" BORDER="0" CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="7"><TR><TD STYLE="border: none;"><DIV ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Arial, san-serif" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/doctor-who/s9/the-zygon-invasion/"><IMG SRC="http://www.scifistream.com/wp-content/uploads/the-zygon-invasion-160x120.jpg" WIDTH="160" HEIGHT="120" ALIGN="right" HSPACE="10" VSPACE="2" BORDER="0" STYLE="border: 1px black solid;" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888">DOCTOR WHO - SEASON 35 (9)</FONT>
<FONT SIZE="4"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/doctor-who/s9/the-zygon-invasion/" STYLE="text-decoration: none;">THE ZYGON INVASION</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE="1">EPISODE NUMBER - 3507 (907)</FONT>
<DIV STYLE="margin-top:10px; padding:0;">The Earth faces all-out war with the Zygons after a rogue faction of the shape-shifting aliens kidnap Osgood and demand that the 20 million Zygons living in secret on Earth be allowed to live as who they really are.</DIV>
<FONT SIZE="1"><B><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/doctor-who/s9/the-zygon-invasion/">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >></A></B></FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

Sealurk
October 31st, 2015, 02:06 PM
Am I allowed to say that was mediocre and predictable? In fairness I think I'll have to watch it again as I had to keep nipping out but I called most of the 'twists' early... and if I can do that, it's not good.

Also, who the hell trained those UNIT soldiers?!

Blencathra
October 31st, 2015, 02:43 PM
Totally agree, Sealurk. Boring. That's all I can say about it really.

P-90_177
October 31st, 2015, 03:34 PM
I thought it was great. I mean it was a part one so it's all set up, but nothing wrong with it at all. I confess it was missing a little humour but still.

Annoyed
October 31st, 2015, 08:42 PM
Jenna Coleman has a very hot "Evil Villainess" look.

Coco Pops
November 1st, 2015, 02:45 AM
Gosh those UNIT soldiers were dumb..

Where did they hire that lot?

So Zygons are the new ISIS. Notice the black posters?

Dr Who gets political how quaint..

How did Zygon Clara know so much to fool the Doctor like that?

Is Clara dead yet again?

P-90_177
November 1st, 2015, 03:02 AM
Jenna Coleman has a very hot "Evil Villainess" look.

Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed that. :P

Coco Pops
November 1st, 2015, 03:19 AM
Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed that. :P


Me three. She looked amazing doing that evil look.

cosmichobo
November 1st, 2015, 04:47 AM
I enjoyed it... though - I think we've seen plenty of 2 parters this season that didn't need part 1 to simply set up part 2... though this one certainly felt like it was 90% exposition...

Loved the little reference to Harry...

I'm guessing Clara is not dead yet, just as Kate is also not dead... just a bluff... Maybe if the claim was ONLY about Clara... but I'm sure they wont kill Kate off just yet...

P-90_177
November 1st, 2015, 04:58 AM
I enjoyed it... though - I think we've seen plenty of 2 parters this season that didn't need part 1 to simply set up part 2... though this one certainly felt like it was 90% exposition...

Loved the little reference to Harry...

I'm guessing Clara is not dead yet, just as Kate is also not dead... just a bluff... Maybe if the claim was ONLY about Clara... but I'm sure they wont kill Kate off just yet...

I suspect that it was Kate who was actually radioing in the message, after she managed to kill the Zygon... It seems like a very Stewart thing to do...

Annoyed
November 1st, 2015, 05:18 AM
i don't think they're going to kill Clara off anyway. They might strand her an an alternate universe, memory tricks, or some other dodge, but has New Who "killed" any companion who has left the show yet? I don't consider Amy to have been "killed", as she was sent back to a previous time and lived out her life in the past, allowing her to be brought back easily, by a time traveler, anyway.

P-90_177
November 1st, 2015, 05:31 AM
I doubt they'll kill her when she leaves either, but if they were to kill any companion she would be the perfect option. I mean She's the impossible girl who spread her existence through all of time and space... She can show up again whenever they like and it wouldn't make the original Clara's death any less meaningful.

Pharaoh Hamenthotep
November 1st, 2015, 05:43 AM
Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed that. :P

Indeed..

I say kill off "boring, Doctor-wannabe" Clara and keep evil Zygon Clara :cool:

They could kill her since she's leaving anyway, it's probably unlikely though...

Teddybrown
November 1st, 2015, 09:57 AM
I guessed wrong, I thought the other lady with Clara (did we ever get her name?) was the zygon...

Looking forward to part 2

Sealurk
November 1st, 2015, 11:22 AM
I guessed wrong, I thought the other lady with Clara (did we ever get her name?) was the zygon...

Looking forward to part 2

The other lady was Jac, played by Jaye Griffiths (anybody remember Bugs? She was Ros). Hoping she's not actually dead, I quite liked her character. Actually, I think that's starting to happen quite frequently - "I like this character... aaand they're dead."

I've since watched the episode again, and after the second viewing I do have to say... it's still as bad as I thought it was first time. There are certainly some great things about it, but lots of things just don't make sense.

That said, I do have a bit of an oddball theory. I doubt they'd do it and I haven't thought it through fully so it may not even make sense, but if I'm right it could potentially ruin next week's episode so I'm going to spoiler it here. Read at your own risk.

The Doctor isn't the Doctor, he's a Zygon. His mannerisms and speech patterns were slightly off and he keeps referring to 'himself' in the third person (doesn't he at one point say "that's what the Doctor does"?). It would also explain the otherwise glaring plothole - why has the Doctor elected to take a slow, vulnerable plane when he has a TARDIS? Because a Zygon presumably cannot get into or fly the TARDIS.

The political aspect of the episode was very heavy-handed. Different cultures integrating into society, radicalisation, extremist splinter groups and more - very current, very daring to tackle... but I felt it was far too unsubtle. Yes, it needs dealing with, and yes science fiction is often a fantastic way of dealing with subjects we as a society may or may not be comfortable dealing with head-on but it felt like I was being clubbed over the head with it all. And honestly - I watch Doctor Who because I want an escape from the heavy real world issues!

P-90_177
November 1st, 2015, 01:27 PM
The other lady was Jac, played by Jaye Griffiths (anybody remember Bugs? She was Ros). Hoping she's not actually dead, I quite liked her character. Actually, I think that's starting to happen quite frequently - "I like this character... aaand they're dead."

I've since watched the episode again, and after the second viewing I do have to say... it's still as bad as I thought it was first time. There are certainly some great things about it, but lots of things just don't make sense.

That said, I do have a bit of an oddball theory. I doubt they'd do it and I haven't thought it through fully so it may not even make sense, but if I'm right it could potentially ruin next week's episode so I'm going to spoiler it here. Read at your own risk.

The Doctor isn't the Doctor, he's a Zygon. His mannerisms and speech patterns were slightly off and he keeps referring to 'himself' in the third person (doesn't he at one point say "that's what the Doctor does"?). It would also explain the otherwise glaring plothole - why has the Doctor elected to take a slow, vulnerable plane when he has a TARDIS? Because a Zygon presumably cannot get into or fly the TARDIS.

The political aspect of the episode was very heavy-handed. Different cultures integrating into society, radicalisation, extremist splinter groups and more - very current, very daring to tackle... but I felt it was far too unsubtle. Yes, it needs dealing with, and yes science fiction is often a fantastic way of dealing with subjects we as a society may or may not be comfortable dealing with head-on but it felt like I was being clubbed over the head with it all. And honestly - I watch Doctor Who because I want an escape from the heavy real world issues!

Interesting theory actually... You could be right.

Matt G
November 1st, 2015, 02:32 PM
1. Yes, the UNIT soldiers were idiots.

2. But I am starting to like Jac...and yeah...sure they talked about the possibility of Clara being a Zygon ages back...though it's obvious that she only got doubled in this ep.

3. Interesting point about the Doctor being a Zygon...I'm wondering if Sealurk is half right...the Doctor's using the plane so that he can potentially pose as a Zygon who can't accsess the TARDIS!

Still...liked this ep a lot! :D

cosmichobo
November 1st, 2015, 02:34 PM
Yes, it almost felt like we were watching NCIS or something, rather than our universe travelling Doctor...

My brain processes didn't really flag this as an issue though... rather, it just started collating past episodes that had tackled "modern" issues...

Why the hell did Kate go on her own?! Yes, UNIT forces stretched... but... And... yes, now you mention it, I totally agree she's offed the Zygon and then assumed its role...

If they hadn't "cloned" Clara, I'd go with the Doctor/Zygon theory... but I don't think they'll both be Zygoned. Mind you... face-to-face Capaldi/Capaldi... would be a great image.

tomstone
November 2nd, 2015, 09:34 AM
I am surprised this Episode was even allowed to Air with whats going on in Europe or the World in general. I liked it, I was ripped out of the story alot though when I noticed the social commentary and the political play in this Episode. It is a thematic the UK and Europe have to confront, still having it in the entertainment feels just annoying. Thats like Twillight talking about abortion.

P-90_177
November 2nd, 2015, 02:08 PM
I am surprised this Episode was even allowed to Air with whats going on in Europe or the World in general. I liked it, I was ripped out of the story alot though when I noticed the social commentary and the political play in this Episode. It is a thematic the UK and Europe have to confront, still having it in the entertainment feels just annoying. Thats like Twillight talking about abortion.

It's what Sci-Fi does best.

cosmichobo
November 2nd, 2015, 05:14 PM
Most of DS9 felt to me like it was a political statement of some kind or other...

Flyboy
November 3rd, 2015, 09:09 AM
I have to say... I loved this episode.

I loved the political themes echoing real life issues, and the little benefits digs.

But most of all, I loved seeing proper hard UNIT tech. Unmanned Combat Aerial Vehicles, overseas UNIT installations, safe houses, the whole lot. It was Christmas for me ^_^

Coco Pops
November 3rd, 2015, 07:35 PM
I have to say... I loved this episode.

I loved the political themes echoing real life issues, and the little benefits digs.

But most of all, I loved seeing proper hard UNIT tech. Unmanned Combat Aerial Vehicles, overseas UNIT installations, safe houses, the whole lot. It was Christmas for me ^_^



What about the church scene? Did you like that?

Flyboy
November 4th, 2015, 02:10 AM
What about the church scene? Did you like that?

I'm not as scathing of it as some people are. I read a very interesting article which highlighted just how much mind****ery must have been going on at that point and it shows that UNIT soldiers are human, not robots, which is important. I think it was a powerful scene, especially as it WAS possible, even if only remotely so, that their loved ones had been kidnapped. My only beef with the scene is the MANNER in which the section entered the church (weapons down).

cosmichobo
November 4th, 2015, 03:47 AM
Yes... I felt it was crazy they would go in completely at ease...

GodAtum
November 7th, 2015, 08:07 AM
Apart from it being a rip off of Men in Black, i did not like the plot at all. Surely there are millions of habitable planets the Zygons can go to?

Flyboy
November 7th, 2015, 09:36 AM
Apart from it being a rip off of Men in Black, i did not like the plot at all. Surely there are millions of habitable planets the Zygons can go to?

... MiB rip off?

How on earth did you get that?

GodAtum
November 7th, 2015, 12:56 PM
... MiB rip off?

How on earth did you get that?

Aliens hiding among humans, with an organisation trying to keep them secret.

Flyboy
November 7th, 2015, 01:25 PM
Aliens hiding among humans, with an organisation trying to keep them secret.

That's hardly an original MiB concept, and in fairness to Doctor Who the approach that they took was particularly unique with a very specific DW backstory propping it up...

Annoyed
November 7th, 2015, 01:31 PM
Political commentary is no stranger to Science Fiction, and it can make for a very nice additional aspect to a show. RDM's "Battlestar Galactica" certainly had plenty of political commentary, and the recently concluded "Continuum" was built around differences in political/governmental systems, and if you ask me, was a direct warning and prediction for the U.S.