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GateWorld
October 26th, 2013, 11:12 AM
<DIV ALIGN="center"><TABLE WIDTH="450" BORDER="0" CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="7"><TR><TD STYLE="border: none;"><DIV ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Arial, san-serif" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/grimm/s3/ptzd/"><IMG SRC="http://www.scifistream.com/wp-content/uploads/ptzd-160x120.jpg" WIDTH="160" HEIGHT="120" ALIGN="right" HSPACE="10" VSPACE="2" BORDER="0" STYLE="border: 1px black solid;" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888">GRIMM - SEASON THREE</FONT>
<FONT SIZE="4"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/grimm/s3/ptzd/" STYLE="text-decoration: none">PTZD</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE="1">EPISODE NUMBER - 302</FONT>
<DIV STYLE="margin-top:10px; padding:0;">Nick's friends attempt to track him down and reverse what has been done to him -- before he causes any more damage.</DIV>
<FONT SIZE="1"><B><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/grimm/s3/ptzd/">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >></A></B></FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

blueray
November 1st, 2013, 07:20 PM
Another good episode. I liked the fight scenes and how long it took them to finally get Nick. While he was under the influrence, it still showed how strong and fast a grimm is, which finally explains why wesen fear them so much. It was also nice to see him use his super hearing after being cured, and clearly is strong enough to break a cup like that. I like how the group met to figure out a cover, but the whole not telling Nick thing had the obvious flaw that someone at work would mention what happened in that bar. And adding of course them having to interview Juliette, meant that Nick would see and of course hear them do that.

I still was kind of bored with Adlind's story and wish that it wasn't taking up time that would have been to the other storylines. I wonder if there is still going to be more of the aftermath in the next episode, like what is there story about what happened to the other people in the storage yard.

I was surprised that they seemed like they really killed off Eric (but who knows). And that Renard's mother is still alive, I don't know but I thought that she was dead.



Anyhow, great episode.

Hyndara71
November 1st, 2013, 08:54 PM
Seriously? I had never, NEVER before to get away from Grimm. Now I have it! I don't know if I will stay up next week all night to watch the episode live. For what?

Honestly, Nick should confess, they should put him in prison, and Renard with him in the next cell and thow away the keys to both! Bring in another Grimm, this story and the characters are screwed now for me.

Worst episode ever!

IceIsNice
November 2nd, 2013, 09:40 AM
I don't think Eric is actually dead. I wouldn't be surprised if he pops up again later in the season

blueray
November 2nd, 2013, 09:51 AM
I don't think Eric is actually dead. I wouldn't be surprised if he pops up again later in the season

me either. There was no body, therefore probably not dead.

tomstone
November 2nd, 2013, 10:04 AM
Seriously? I had never, NEVER before to get away from Grimm. Now I have it! I don't know if I will stay up next week all night to watch the episode live. For what?

Honestly, Nick should confess, they should put him in prison, and Renard with him in the next cell and thow away the keys to both! Bring in another Grimm, this story and the characters are screwed now for me.

Worst episode ever!

Why, because they are lying to the police? Come on, I am pretty sure that has been done plenty of times in other Series. One special coming to mind is Supernatural. Plus Nick was under the influence of that Drug, so its really not his fault.


I don't think Eric is actually dead. I wouldn't be surprised if he pops up again later in the season

That would have been too easy anyway. He will be out for revenge.

Inquisitor
November 2nd, 2013, 12:33 PM
I think they're going to catch on they're lying. Rosalee and Juliette used the exact same words.

Krisz
November 2nd, 2013, 01:33 PM
I think everyone lying to the police and even Nick himself in the end gives a nice uncomfortable twist to the whole storyline. Being a Grimm and trying to tread a lawful path is the thing and what gives a new dimension to Nick, how is he going to function with these two sides to him? How many moral lines is he going to cross in the name of keeping people 'safe'? It's all a matter of the interpretation of 'doing the right thing', I will enjoy watching this dilemma unfold.

I really don't know what the purpose of the Adlind storyline is at the moment either. It just seems to be going through a thing of how much more disgusting trials the Gypsy queen can think up for her!

The 'death' of Eric and Renard's mother turning up suddenly came out of the blue a bit, but we all know it's not the last we've seen of that nasty piece of work!

Klenotka
November 2nd, 2013, 03:37 PM
I liked it. I liked it a lot :) It is nice to see them to unfold the story slowly and that Nick has, indeed, some effects that will probably last. Maybe he needed this to get his Grimm instincts fully "operational" :)

I felt a little uncomfortable how they all lied in the end but the possibilities! The moral line kept moving in the last season but only Hank was often involved, with Renard just watching from the distance. This time, they all decided to lie for Nick and I like how they are willing to do it for Nick. I hope he can appreciate what they have done for him. The last scene with Nick deciding if he should give in or not, was well done. And how Nick sat to the table with Renard watching...I still think Renard manipulates him. Also, with his mother calling him (we never really knew what happened to her but I also thought she was dead), I think he wants the old fashioned revenge. I think his life and career are as much in stake as others right now but how he locked the video in his table can´t be a good thing.

I think so far, Nick tried to balance his Grimm and cop parts but I guess this brought out his Grimm side more and I think we will see more struggle along the way.

I can´t wait to see how Nick´s abilities will evolve and how this whole thing affects him. How he found out about the dead guy was very unhappy and I think he may be also a little more angry.

I am just sorry he doesn´t live with Monroe anymore :D

Hyndara71
November 2nd, 2013, 06:26 PM
I don't think Eric is actually dead. I wouldn't be surprised if he pops up again later in the season

He IS dead. Dave and Jim confirmed it today, he won't come back. They are actually working on bringing MEM back - however they want to do this after she turned it down to return to Grimm.

IceIsNice
November 2nd, 2013, 07:01 PM
He IS dead. Dave and Jim confirmed it today, he won't come back. They are actually working on bringing MEM back - however they want to do this after she turned it down to return to Grimm.
They said for now he is dead because James Frain is going to Sleepy Hollow, but they also said you never know with Grimm.

Rumor has it that MEM will be back sometime between 303 and 310 based on little hints from David Giuntoli and the EPs. In the article I posted in the main thread today when they were asked about her return, instead of saying they don't know or they are working on bringing her back, they said that it's "top secret" so I think that's a decent sign she will return soon.

Looney
November 2nd, 2013, 09:30 PM
So this is an interesting discussion. I knew the guy who died in the bar was going to end up being the guy who was going to stab Nick in the back. So are people upset with the morality of the situation because the guy with the knife didn't stand a chance against Nick?

I enjoyed the episode, but I am not sure this is going to be a good arc. And if you are looking for the story to be exposed all that needs to happen is any witness from the bar or from the farmhouse seeing Nick when the detectives ask them to come to the station.

IceIsNice
November 2nd, 2013, 09:59 PM
Witnesses don't go down to the station usually. The police usually talk to them at their homes and/or the scene of the crime

Hyndara71
November 3rd, 2013, 03:58 AM
They said for now he is dead because James Frain is going to Sleepy Hollow, but they also said you never know with Grimm.

James has exactly 1 appeareance at Sleepy Hollow so far, he will be in tomorrow's episode, nothing beyond is known. I know there were rumours about him getting there a recurring role as well, and I really HOPE he will. But so far no one told anything about him after 1.06.


Rumor has it that MEM will be back sometime between 303 and 310 based on little hints from David Giuntoli and the EPs. In the article I posted in the main thread today when they were asked about her return, instead of saying they don't know or they are working on bringing her back, they said that it's "top secret" so I think that's a decent sign she will return soon.

Well, Mr. G. loves to lie when he opens his mouth, I don't give a damn about what he's talking about anymore. And I can only repeat what I heard about MEM - aka I read it in an interview a while ago. I don't know why or what happened but she is not interested in coming back. Besides the fact that she's working on another show as well.

One positive fact on 3.02 (and the only one so far): that guy Renard talked to on the phone IS definitely a native speaker. That's how German really sounds. And as there's a conversation you can also hear the difference between native and trained. Sasha did a good job, no meaning, but he sounded a bit ... like he wasn't sure what he was talking about there. Well, at least the structures of his sentences were correct.

blueray
November 3rd, 2013, 05:42 AM
I wonder why MEM doesn't want to return. But assuming that they really can't get her to come back, they could find another actress who looks similar to her to play his mother (lots of shows do this). This actress of course would agree to be a recurring character.

Looney
November 3rd, 2013, 08:40 AM
Witnesses don't go down to the station usually. The police usually talk to them at their homes and/or the scene of the crime

I only meant it as a means to having the lie fall apart. All they need is for one of the many witnesses to see Nick regardless of the situation. Next big case he solves and he is on the news, BOOM! The whole things falls apart. :D Oh and there are sketch artists. Maybe someone comes down to the station to work with a sketch artist, or to look through mugshots. All vehicles for Nick being exposed among many other possibilities.

It definitely seems like the lie is too big to hide, especially for someone who works with the public and can sometimes be seen in the public eye. I can't imagine how the show will deal with it other than trying to say it was self-defense because the guy had a knife, which seems pretty weak.

IceIsNice
November 3rd, 2013, 09:22 AM
MEM didn't want to/couldn't return because she was cast on "Hostages" while waiting to know if/when she would be back. Actors cant just wait to hear from one show. They gotta work whenever there is an opportunity.

mr_kennedy
November 3rd, 2013, 03:03 PM
There is an easy solution to this other than lying, just tell the truth..... say i was in a barfight someone came at me while i was deranged from a gas leak, i didnt know what i was doing. or something like that ya know it's better than lying i doubt nick would end up in prison idk how safe his job would be but Captain Renard likes him lol :p

Hyndara71
November 3rd, 2013, 04:39 PM
MEM didn't want to/couldn't return because she was cast on "Hostages" while waiting to know if/when she would be back. Actors cant just wait to hear from one show. They gotta work whenever there is an opportunity.

There's more. As much as I know they also tried to get her back during season 2, before she was casted on Hostages. She didn't want, turned them down. I don't see her coming back, sorry.

IceIsNice
November 3rd, 2013, 08:12 PM
Where did you see she didn't want to come back?

m&mnm317
November 3rd, 2013, 11:37 PM
Okay.. for one I would just like to say... I LOVED THIS EPISODE! I'm sorry that you found it a waste of your time, Hyn :S I wonder if you're losing interest in Nick because of your opinions/experiences with David :confused:

As for the ep! Where to start..where to start.. (spoilered for length)

I am SO glad that Hank and Monroe stopped Nick bfore he could do something to that family, or more importantly, the kids.. I wouldn't envy him the guilt if they hadn't. I liked that they showed just how strong a Grimm is in this ep - even if he was juiced up with Zombie juice. It showed why other wesen (especially those like Bud, etc) fear Grimms and have the reaction they do to Nick.

I liked how they had Monroe "track" Nick and had him mention not getting on the ground mainly because of the grass stains :D Also, I wonder if, the way Nick smells, has some sort of Grimmness to it as well as the way his person smells. You know? I mean, I know a lot of us are wondering how the other wesen know Nick is a Grimm and I'm wondering if they can smell it on him as well as the way he reacts (used to) when they woged.

I am SO SO SO glad that they now have Hank and Juliette to add to their merry little band! I mean, they now have Renard too, but he was always sort of in it, just more of a silent partner/manipulator. Hank's line of "I wish I could do that" has me smiling each time. Love it. Also, loved his expression when he realized that he needed to run like a mofo once he had Nick's attention after throwing that statue - cracks me up.

Liked the fight scene between Renard, Monroe, Hank and Nick. Very well done, but I wonder why they (and everyone in a fight scene in every single show on earth) went at him one at a time. Do ya not see how strong and animalistic he's acting right now? Charge at him with all you got!

I'm honestly not sure how I feel about Juliette getting involved. I mean, on one hand, I get it. Nothing would stop me from doing the same thing if it were my husband going through all this. But on the other - did she not see how he was ready to tear the men - his friends - apart? What made her think that injecting him with something would stop him from trying to beat the crap outta her? At any rate, it's done.

I like how protective they all are of Nick.. even Sean to a degree, although I'm pretty sure his protective instincts are out of a plan to use Nick later on down the road.

Monroe and Rosalee - I adore those two! When she's patching him up in the Spice Shop! Adorable. Their dialogue is so wonderful and they make it seem so natural. It's great.

I agree that hiding the fact that he - essentially - killed someone from Nick was a bad idea, but I like how they showed him finding out and showing his reaction to it. Breaking the mug was a great way to show his strength his increasing. And what is with the whole turning-blue-when-heart-rate-slows-down thing? WTF is up with that?? Is it an after effect from the zombifying? Or is it just another Grimm thing that Nick can now do (like all of the sudden being able to flip when he was fighting the reapers in season 1?)? I hope they explain it soon..

My whumper's heart is appeased :D The scratches and scrapes from the fights; the whimpers when the cure is ravaging his system; the winces when he's back to normal but sore from attempting to decimate Oregon - love them all!

I'm actually okay if Nick doesn't turn himself in.. It advances the story arc (whatever that may be) and it adds a bit more drama to the show and to Nick's actions. Not to mention the guilt he's going to be feeling from all the damage he's done while under the influence, not only to strangers but to his friends.

I'm sure there's more, but I'll have to wait until I'm finished watching the ep a second time through to know for sure :D ;)

m&mnm317
November 3rd, 2013, 11:43 PM
I know what I forgot - Adalind!! Although, I'm pretty sure that says it all right there, :lol:

I find her story line boring and I couldn't care less about her.. I think it's because she's pregnant.. I love her when she's not pregnant and when she is a hexenbiest; when she is pregnant, though - not a fan.. Don't know why.

As for Eric - I thought that soemone had said that James wasn't going to be back on Grimm? Whether he will or won't be is irrelevant, however, since it doesn't stop me from thinking that his death was too neat. I'm thinking that he wasn't actually killed in that fire. Or maybe he was but the writers want to leave things open-ish for if they want to bring him back? Which is entirely possible since no one seems to stay dead in this show ;)

GrimmMom! I wish they'd bring her back because having her for that one (or two, depending on how you look at it) episode (or was it three? lol) wasn't enough and mentioning the email wasn't helpful either... If they were going to do that - they shouldn't have brought her in at all, imo..

Edit: I keep remembering things I meant to add, lol..

As for the German - does Sacha sound that bad when he talks? Because to a non-native, meaning me, he sounds hot :lol: And that includes when he speaks French or Latin as well.. Maybe it's just because I like foreign languages and find them attractive in and of themselves? I dunno..

Sean's mom - I never really thought about her.. I mean, she could have been dead, or they could have just been estranged - either way. I wonder if they plan on physically bringing her in to the show or just leaving her as a voice..

And why does it always seem that when Nick kills a guy, they're always "bad" guys? I mean, Halda in the first ep of the series - major bad guy; the guy in the bar, had a knife and was planning on killing him so that makes it okay? I mean, I think the only reason knife guy planned on killing Nick was because of how outrageous he was acting.. I dunno.. that's just me though.

Callista
November 4th, 2013, 03:23 PM
There is an easy solution to this other than lying, just tell the truth..... say i was in a barfight someone came at me while i was deranged from a gas leak, i didnt know what i was doing. or something like that ya know it's better than lying i doubt nick would end up in prison idk how safe his job would be but Captain Renard likes him lol :p
I actually think they didn't need to lie, too. I mean, did they prosecute all those other people who were affected by the zombie problem for attacking the police and whatever mayhem they may have gotten up to? It seems they could pretty easily have just told the truth and said Nick had a stronger reaction to the "disease" and that would release him of any liability.

Other than that, I liked the episode.

Also, Nick now has the worse case of sleep apnea ever!!!

m&mnm317
November 4th, 2013, 04:18 PM
I actually think they didn't need to lie, too. I mean, did they prosecute all those other people who were affected by the zombie problem for attacking the police and whatever mayhem they may have gotten up to? It seems they could pretty easily have just told the truth and said Nick had a stronger reaction to the "disease" and that would release him of any liability.

Other than that, I liked the episode.

Also, Nick now has the worse case of sleep apnea ever!!!

The difference is that those in the shipping yard didn't kill anybody, Nick did.

Callista
November 5th, 2013, 11:58 AM
The difference is that those in the shipping yard didn't kill anybody, Nick did.

Yeah, but I still don't think he'd go to jail for it in this case. Again, it depends on what they decided was the cause of the outbreak and if the authorities came to the conclusion that the people suffering from zombie disorder really were out of their minds temporarily through no fault of their own. He may have lost his job, though. (Although, this being Portland, probably not....that's kind of Portland's dirty little secret.) And, it may have led to complications if doctors wanted to figure out why he had a stronger reaction.

I do think Renard will use that recording against him later, especially since Nick is the only one he showed it to and lied to everyone else about what happened to it.

m&mnm317
November 5th, 2013, 12:09 PM
Yeah, but I still don't think he'd go to jail for it in this case. Again, it depends on what they decided was the cause of the outbreak and if the authorities came to the conclusion that the people suffering from zombie disorder really were out of their minds temporarily through no fault of their own. He may have lost his job, though. (Although, this being Portland, probably not....that's kind of Portland's dirty little secret.) And, it may have led to complications if doctors wanted to figure out why he had a stronger reaction.

The problem lies that they (being the cast) would have to take the chance that the authorities wouldn't find him guilty and that the worst that would happen would be Nick losing his job. I don't think many of them were willing to take that chance, least of all Renard.


I do think Renard will use that recording against him later, especially since Nick is the only one he showed it to and lied to everyone else about what happened to it.

Yeah, me too. I think he'll use it against Nick whenever Nick's feeling particularly ornery and refuses to do what Sean wants. As for lying to everyone else about it - technically Hank knows. They both alluded to the fact that hank knew where it went - since he went straight to the captain - Renard merely refused to admit it outright, probably for legal reasons later on down the road.

Hyndara71
November 5th, 2013, 04:19 PM
Where did you see she didn't want to come back?

I read it in an interview earlier this year. She was asked there about Kelly and Grimm. There she definitely said she wouldn't come back on her own decision. But she didn't give a reason why. The secret Grimm-story seems to hit again. Whoever leaves, he or she is keeping silence about the why :(

Hyndara71
November 5th, 2013, 04:50 PM
Okay.. for one I would just like to say... I LOVED THIS EPISODE! I'm sorry that you found it a waste of your time, Hyn :S I wonder if you're losing interest in Nick because of your opinions/experiences with David :confused:


Actually the Nick-storyline was the positive thing during the episode - well, mostly. The end surely not.
No, I'm pissed about Monroe's OOC, about Renard being able to manipulate the complete GrimmGang (at least also Nick) and, yes, of course about the offscreen killing of Eric.
The episode didn't feel like Grimm, half of it I was crying during the original run because I felt so bad and sad being not able to enjoy it and feeling like someone had hit me with a hammer in the same time.

Sorry, I somehow understand that Dave and Jim wanted to end Eric's storyline somehow after James had issues with the time schedules. I have no idea why they felt the need to but I understand that they wanted. But they did the same, Stargate-writers did back then with Kolya: killing offscreen (I don't count the shooting as actually killing) for no reason, just to get rid of him. There are not only Nick or Renard-fans among the Grimmsters, Eric has a huge fanbase himself. I've talked to some of them during the last days, and everyone felt the same way I did. In the end, there was no reason. Jim and Dave blew it, completely. Instead of an awesome feud between the brothers with Nick in the middle (probably as prize for the winner) we saw ... a short news-report with the information from Michael, that the writers also have to write everything visible on Grimm. Well, the news-report didn't even looked like a news report over here, or at least not on the continent. The effect would have been the same if they had written the headline in English. This death was absolutely point- and useless and a huge mistake.

Personally I'm not sure if I will stay up during the night this week to watch 3.03 live. Maybe it's enough when I get it later during the weekend from the one who's sending me the file. And about that I'm again not the only one. It wouldn't make me wonder if 3.03 will crash ratings-wise. There are so many in the fandom right now feeling like this isn't the same show it was till May, and there are many who are simply feeling betrayed.

I knew the tone would change with the exchange of 3/4 of the writers-crew. But right now Grimm is going to be the next Titanic if they cannot fix what they'd already damaged after only two episodes.

About Nick killing that guy in the bar: It was clear self-defence, and it should be clearly visible. At the bar Nick attacked no one, he only went after that family later, and there he only scared the hell out of them. Okay, without Hank and Monroe showing up there I'm pretty sure Nick would have killed the complete family. And I really want to know why he suddenly changed.
But at the bar he only protected himself. I mean, the bar tender he left untouched, only got the rifle from him. The dead guy came after Nick and most likely would have killed him if Nick wouldn't have reacted. True, the hit at his chest (what I think is the cause of death) was exactly the wrong point but at least Nick wasn't sane in this moment. And if he would be at least a little bit clever he would go to Parker and let her test his blood. There still should be remains of the vernom in his system. And with that the only real problem would be how this drugs came into his body. But for that there are also explanations.

Will Renard use the recording? Definitely. And if not he, there are more than enough Royals. One of them getting lucky and the recording from Renard and Nick is screwed. It would have been better IF Nick would have tell the two detectives the truth. I don't believe that Juliette and Rosalee, or Hank (who also lied about Nick) would have such big troubles.

Ice, interesting that the police is coming to the witnesses. Here it is the opposite, you have to go to the precinct.

IceIsNice
November 5th, 2013, 04:59 PM
Ice, interesting that the police is coming to the witnesses. Here it is the opposite, you have to go to the precinct.
Oh, really. Yeah here police usually come to the people, but sometimes people go to the precinct to maybe identify someone in a police lineup or something.

blueray
November 5th, 2013, 06:05 PM
I too not sure that they needed to lie, the truth for the most part would have worked. The story could have been Nick got effected somehow while on the case (he was already following a led, which took him away from portland). He then attacked the bar, its clear that most of it was self defense, the guy that was killed pulled a knife. He than went on to scare but didn't harm that family. Then Renard and Hank say that they intervened and caught him in the barn. Rosilee and Juliete of course where there to cured him. They would of course leave Monroe out because it would be hard to explain why he was there. They would also not mention the plane crash at all, and pretend not to know anything about that.

That being said it would probably lead to an investigation and an even more drawn out story. So I can see why the writers had the characters lie.

Hyndara71
November 6th, 2013, 03:01 AM
That being said it would probably lead to an investigation and an even more drawn out story. So I can see why the writers had the characters lie.

I don't see a problem with this, and Monroe could have been there because he was the one who called Hank about his missing roommate and convinced that he would go with the others.

Klenotka
November 6th, 2013, 11:58 AM
Well, *I am* a fan and I am not losing interest at all. On the contrary. I am hyped by the possibilites this offers. And that Renard manipulates the gang and Nick? He always played two (or more) sides. All he cares about is his own well being, probably a revenge and to get rid of as many members of his royal family as possible so he can take their place. And maybe not even that. We don´t know what his motives are but he certainly was never a guy who would avoid any manipulation in order to get what he wanted.
I for one want the show to go even darker for Nick and others. I want to see some consequences of their actions, I want to see Nick struggling with his inner Grimm (and occassionally losing it), I want to see Nick being a Grimm for a while. I just feel like they didn´t really reach the potential yet. One moment, it is all doom and gloom and in another they are cool friends and a great gang. There has to be a conflict to achieve drama.
I am just glad that the boring Juliette amnesia is over but I also hope in some consequences. Why wasn´t Juliette mad at Nick at all? It was all his fault. They were a happy couple in the end again. i don´t want Juliette to be a damsel in distress again when they finally found her something to do.

I can´t wait to see the following episodes :)

blueray
November 6th, 2013, 01:27 PM
I agree, I really want to see more darkish Nick and his struggle with his inner grimm. Maybe we will get that as a consequence of the zombie thing.

m&mnm317
November 6th, 2013, 01:48 PM
Actually the Nick-storyline was the positive thing during the episode - well, mostly. The end surely not.
No, I'm pissed about Monroe's OOC, about Renard being able to manipulate the complete GrimmGang (at least also Nick) and, yes, of course about the offscreen killing of Eric.
The episode didn't feel like Grimm, half of it I was crying during the original run because I felt so bad and sad being not able to enjoy it and feeling like someone had hit me with a hammer in the same time.

Sorry, I somehow understand that Dave and Jim wanted to end Eric's storyline somehow after James had issues with the time schedules. I have no idea why they felt the need to but I understand that they wanted. But they did the same, Stargate-writers did back then with Kolya: killing offscreen (I don't count the shooting as actually killing) for no reason, just to get rid of him. There are not only Nick or Renard-fans among the Grimmsters, Eric has a huge fanbase himself. I've talked to some of them during the last days, and everyone felt the same way I did. In the end, there was no reason. Jim and Dave blew it, completely. Instead of an awesome feud between the brothers with Nick in the middle (probably as prize for the winner) we saw ... a short news-report with the information from Michael, that the writers also have to write everything visible on Grimm. Well, the news-report didn't even looked like a news report over here, or at least not on the continent. The effect would have been the same if they had written the headline in English. This death was absolutely point- and useless and a huge mistake.

Personally I'm not sure if I will stay up during the night this week to watch 3.03 live. Maybe it's enough when I get it later during the weekend from the one who's sending me the file. And about that I'm again not the only one. It wouldn't make me wonder if 3.03 will crash ratings-wise. There are so many in the fandom right now feeling like this isn't the same show it was till May, and there are many who are simply feeling betrayed.

I knew the tone would change with the exchange of 3/4 of the writers-crew. But right now Grimm is going to be the next Titanic if they cannot fix what they'd already damaged after only two episodes.

About Nick killing that guy in the bar: It was clear self-defence, and it should be clearly visible. At the bar Nick attacked no one, he only went after that family later, and there he only scared the hell out of them. Okay, without Hank and Monroe showing up there I'm pretty sure Nick would have killed the complete family. And I really want to know why he suddenly changed.
But at the bar he only protected himself. I mean, the bar tender he left untouched, only got the rifle from him. The dead guy came after Nick and most likely would have killed him if Nick wouldn't have reacted. True, the hit at his chest (what I think is the cause of death) was exactly the wrong point but at least Nick wasn't sane in this moment. And if he would be at least a little bit clever he would go to Parker and let her test his blood. There still should be remains of the vernom in his system. And with that the only real problem would be how this drugs came into his body. But for that there are also explanations.

Will Renard use the recording? Definitely. And if not he, there are more than enough Royals. One of them getting lucky and the recording from Renard and Nick is screwed. It would have been better IF Nick would have tell the two detectives the truth. I don't believe that Juliette and Rosalee, or Hank (who also lied about Nick) would have such big troubles.

Ice, interesting that the police is coming to the witnesses. Here it is the opposite, you have to go to the precinct.

Now, I'm not trying to offend but I don't understand how Eric had that big a fan-base when he was barely on the show.. At any rate, I can understand his fans being upset with how the writers handled his story ending (and I agree that it would have been great to see Nick caught between the two brothers), but the only problem I had with his death was now neat it was.. It's like they're leaving it as a possibility to be open in case they want to bring him back..

They feel betrayed?? By who? How? Because he show has changed tone? That's going to happen when you have different writers. And, personally, I like the change. Granted, I could do without too many more TBC episodes but I like the tone the show is taking on.

What have they damage? Because, as far as I can tell, there's nothing that's been damaged. At least not to me. I saw no such problems with Monroe's character (in fact I enjoyed him as usual in this ep); I didn't see Renard manipulating anyone more than he usually would and I think that the writers having him do what he did means that there can be more drama later down the road.. Which is a good thing because it's a drama show.

I'm sorry.. I guess I just don't understand how so many people can have such a problem with the show. I mean, when you compare now to season 1 or even some eps of season 2? I'd much rather watch now. Heck, I've already watched 3.02 about 4 times or so; there are very few episodes that can wake up my muse but this was one of them.. 3.02 is the reason I've been able to put out 3 more chapters of my Grimm fic, Ashes and that I'm working on a fourth.

m&mnm317
November 6th, 2013, 01:49 PM
I agree, I really want to see more darkish Nick and his struggle with his inner grimm. Maybe we will get that as a consequence of the zombie thing.

I can definitely see that being an interesting arc.

I'm also interested to see how Nick's conscience handles the guilt (or potential guilt) of what he did while he was a zombie.

Klenotka
November 7th, 2013, 12:13 PM
I can imagine when you are really, really inside the fandom, it may seem like fans are unsatisfied. But fans of anything are always unhappy. They complain. But they keep watching.

I can´t imagine Eric being *that* favourite that thousands of people would quit watching. He was a great bad guy but he was hardly there and I can´t wait to see Alexis Denisof who is also fantastic. He is a great actor as well and I am sure he will enjoy the role.

I haven´t seen any OOC behaviour for Monroe either. How was he OOC? He was old good Monroe...