Flaw in Destiny's shield (Just thinking)

[Replicators]

Since in scientifical studies it is said that energy produced matter, meaning everything you see came from the belly of a star which blew up a very long time ago. If this is the case, any material's out there would dissolve within the sun that created it. Like making a sword in fire, and put it back in the temps that created it, eventually it will melt. Yes, the shields are what prevents this to happen to the ship, however i question the shield's itself. Let's forget the fact we don't even really know if shielding technology of that magnitude is even possible, and even if it is it wouldn't protect against light. When they were near them 2 stars causing gamma ray burst's, i think the ship shouldn't of survived that, because the shielding was transparent, if they can see everything clear from the observation deck then just as much light could get in aswell. Since GRB is nothing but concentrated light, nothing even a solid could deflect it especially a transparent shield.

I'd just like a scientific explanation for this, and please no tinted window stuff because if the light can get past the transparent shield, then it can damage the window regardless of it's material.

I know it's just a tv show, however it is something to think about still in regards to science.

[Crazedwraith]

Since in scientifical studies it is said that energy produced matter, meaning everything you see came from the belly of a star which blew up a very long time ago. If this is the case, any material's out there would dissolve within the sun that created it. Like making a sword in fire, and put it back in the temps that created it, eventually it will melt.

... OK. No. This logic is quite fuzzy. Reason we get material from stars is nuclear fusion. It doesn't convert 'energy to matter' to converts hydrogen, to helium and gets energy out.

But I guess in essence not many materials will survive being chucked into a star, this is true/

Yes, the shields are what prevents this to happen to the ship, however i question the shield's itself. Let's forget the fact we don't even really know if shielding technology of that magnitude is even possible, and even if it is it wouldn't protect against light. When they were near them 2 stars causing gamma ray burst's, i think the ship shouldn't of survived that, because the shielding was transparent, if they can see everything clear from the observation deck then just as much light could get in aswell. Since GRB is nothing but concentrated light, nothing even a solid could deflect it especially a transparent shield.

I'd just like a scientific explanation for this, and please no tinted window stuff because if the light can get past the transparent shield, then it can damage the window regardless of it's material.

I know it's just a tv show, however it is something to think about still in regards to science.

Just because something is transparent to the visible light spectrum, doesn't mean it automatiicaly lets gamma rays through It could be transparent to visible rays but opaque to gamma rays which are much higher energy and frequency.

[JosephGracey]

I think you messed up your whole argument because my teacher said the same thing to me; that since the start of the universe there has been the same total of mass and energy in the universe and that matter can change to energy and vice versa but there will always be the same total amount. What you basically said was that lead is matter so all energy should be able to get through it.

[thekillman]

Since in scientifical studies it is said that energy produced matter, meaning everything you see came from the belly of a star which blew up a very long time ago. If this is the case, any material's out there would dissolve within the sun that created it.

Let's clear up a few things here, cause your sense of physics is very messy.

1: it all started with the big bang. The reason we went for a big bang to explain the universe is simple: this is the point where everything breaks down: 3 of the four fundamental forces are equal in strength, there's no gravity as the infinitesimally small ball of energy has no variations in density, and as a result we can't really speak of "time".

2: the big bang occurs, which is really a fancy way of saying: the infinitesimally small ball expands. You might know this from thermodynamics, but basically when gas expands it cools. During the big bang, space itself expands and the energy "condenses" to a superhot subatomic soup. matter and anti-matter should form equally but due to some weird mechanism this does not happen and matter is victorious.

3: the subatomic soup cools enough for actual atoms to form. Gravity comes into existence, and time becomes somewhat meaningful.

4: the atoms clutter together due to tiny variations in density, and stars form.

5: galaxies etc form.

[Replicators]

Let's clear up a few things here, cause your sense of physics is very messy.

1: it all started with the big bang. The reason we went for a big bang to explain the universe is simple: this is the point where everything breaks down: 3 of the four fundamental forces are equal in strength, there's no gravity as the infinitesimally small ball of energy has no variations in density, and as a result we can't really speak of "time".

2: the big bang occurs, which is really a fancy way of saying: the infinitesimally small ball expands. You might know this from thermodynamics, but basically when gas expands it cools. During the big bang, space itself expands and the energy "condenses" to a superhot subatomic soup. matter and anti-matter should form equally but due to some weird mechanism this does not happen and matter is victorious.

3: the subatomic soup cools enough for actual atoms to form. Gravity comes into existence, and time becomes somewhat meaningful.

4: the atoms clutter together due to tiny variations in density, and stars form.

5: galaxies etc form.

I ain't calling you a liar or anything, maybe i am going off a more simpler explanation of it all, however based on http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=royz6sL19Tw which is a great series. I highly recommend anyone interested in science to watch the series "How the universe works" which is more up to date information.

[Quadhelix]

Since in scientifical studies it is said that energy produced matter, meaning everything you see came from the belly of a star which blew up a very long time ago.

This is a...very, very, very informal way describing what actually happened.

Immediately after the "Big Bang," all of the matter in the universe existed in the form of hydrogen and helium, with trace amounts of lithium. Other elements, such as carbon, oxygen, phosphorus, calcium, and iron, were produced by nuclear fusion in the core of very massive stars or during super novae.

If this is the case, any material's out there would dissolve within the sun that created it. Like making a sword in fire, and put it back in the temps that created it, eventually it will melt.

Not exactly.

First, the heavier elements were produced in the cores of the stars, which had to reach temperatures in the millions of degrees. The Destiny tends to travel in the upper portions, which tend to only reach temperatures in the thousands of degrees. Of course, that's still hot enough to melt any element except (perhaps) carbon, but that's not really the point that you are trying to make.

Second, any element heavier than helium has to have been produced in the core of a very massive star - smaller stars, like the Sun and the stars that Destiny tends to use, never get hot enough to produce any element heavier than helium.

Yes, the shields are what prevents this to happen to the ship, however i question the shield's itself. Let's forget the fact we don't even really know if shielding technology of that magnitude is even possible, and even if it is it wouldn't protect against light. When they were near them 2 stars causing gamma ray burst's, i think the ship shouldn't of survived that, because the shielding was transparent, if they can see everything clear from the observation deck then just as much light could get in aswell. Since GRB is nothing but concentrated light, nothing even a solid could deflect it especially a transparent shield.

Well, this is worth breaking down into two points, which I will address separately:

1. A transparent shield would not protect against gamma ray bursts
2. A transparent shield would allow enough visible light through to destroy the ship, or at least blind anyone near a window.

1:

As Crazedwraith pointed out, it is possible for something to be transparent to one frequency (or "color") of light while being opaque to another color. For example, regular windows are transparent to visible light but opaque to certain frequencies of infrared. In fact, colored glass is transparent to the color of its tint but generally opaque to other colors.

Thus, there is nothing wrong with the idea of a shield that allows visible light through (to allow the crew to see) while at the same time blocking dangerous forms of light (such as X-rays, gamma rays, UV light, etc.)


2:

You do raise a good point that a star probably puts off enough visible light alone to cook any ship with a shield completely transparent to visible light. However, consider Transitions Lenses: in low light environments, they are almost completely transparent, but darken when exposed to light.

Given that Destiny has some degree of control over the properties of its shields, the ship can probably modify them to allow less and less visible light to pass through as the ship gets closer and closer to the star.

1: it all started with the big bang. The reason we went for a big bang to explain the universe is simple: this is the point where everything breaks down: 3 of the four fundamental forces are equal in strength, there's no gravity as the infinitesimally small ball of energy has no variations in density, and as a result we can't really speak of "time".

Actually, the reason that we went for the "Big Bang" as the theory explaining the origin of the universe is because everything is getting farther and farther away from us. "Rewinding" that, we find that about 13.6 billion years ago, everything in the universe was "right here." The process that took the universe from being "right here" to being spread out over billions of light years acquired the name of the "Big Bang."

Also, our models break down when we try to analyze anything before roughly 10^-43 seconds after the Big Bang, so I'm not entirely sure where you are getting that "can't speak of time" thing, because our models break down before we get that far back. The reason that our models break down at this point is because it is the point were gravity merges with the 3 other fundamental forces (that is, there was only one force before 10^-43 seconds; around that point, the one force split into gravity and the electronuclear force).

2: the big bang occurs, which is really a fancy way of saying: the infinitesimally small ball expands. You might know this from thermodynamics, but basically when gas expands it cools. During the big bang, space itself expands and the energy "condenses" to a superhot subatomic soup. matter and anti-matter should form equally but due to some weird mechanism this does not happen and matter is victorious.

This seems generally correct based on what I remember.

3: the subatomic soup cools enough for actual atoms to form. Gravity comes into existence, and time becomes somewhat meaningful.

No.

As I mentioned early, gravity emerged as an independent force around 10^-43 seconds after the estimated beginning of the Big Bang. In another thread, it came up that matter did not form until more than 300,000 years after that.

4: the atoms clutter together due to tiny variations in density, and stars form.

5: galaxies etc form.

If I recall correctly, galaxies would form first, but there may be some controversy on this point.

[Replicators]

@Quadhelix

Thanks for the informative response to my question, i love science and learning about it is so entertaining to me i appreciate positive or negative feedback to what i am trying to explain.

[thekillman]

As I mentioned early, gravity emerged as an independent force around 10^-43 seconds after the estimated beginning of the Big Bang. In another thread, it came up that matter did not form until more than 300,000 years after that.

Ah guess i was going for a few too many simplifications and such. thanks for correcting.

Actually, the reason that we went for the "Big Bang" as the theory explaining the origin of the universe is because everything is getting farther and farther away from us. "Rewinding" that, we find that about 13.6 billion years ago, everything in the universe was "right here." The process that took the universe from being "right here" to being spread out over billions of light years acquired the name of the "Big Bang."

Looks like you're far more of an expert than me... (not an expert, i just consider myself informed on the matter)

[dr.chrismckay]

I believe that the reason the shielding reacts the way it does is that it is tuned to the frequency of the light waves. Eli mentioned that the shield harmonics can be tuned to a variety of different energy frequencies. Light is nothing more than an energy frequency. This allows the shield to operate while in the sun. As to the temperatures of the sun, the coronal-sphere of a sun, it is relatively much hotter than the surface temperature by almost 5700 degrees kelvin. During the episode where they refueled the Destiny from a class O star,the blue super-giant, the shields were weakened considerably. If that is the case, it shows that the shield had the ability to cycle through a variety of energy frequencies.