PDA

View Full Version : why did the goa'uld stop taking slaves from earth in the early middle ages?



slimjim
June 26th, 2012, 10:50 AM
why do we never see planets with people from the renaissance or the enlightenment eras, it wasn't like the Arctic gate didn't still work then?

SF_and_Coffee
June 26th, 2012, 11:00 AM
For one thing, we don't know that they used the Antarctic gate to remove their last slaves. Remember the frozen Jaffa corpse? That would seem to indicate a problem with using the Antarctic gate on any kind of regular basis, or maybe at all. They may well have been using ships to transport them instead, especially given that they were probably moving livestock and other goods in bulk as well so that the humans would have what they needed to make a go of things in their new environment.

For another, it's entirely possible that by then they already had enough slaves seeded on enough worlds, and no one thought it necessary to keep taking them from Earth. Humans breed, obviously, so if you needed more slaves you just let your existing ones do what comes naturally.

Besides, as human culture and society progressed as happened in Europe during the Renaissance and the Enlightenment, fewer people would have been apt to worship strange, human-form gods and therefore the Goa'uld would've had far less leverage for gaining followers who would be willing to relocate to some other world. I always got the impression that rather than taking their slaves by force, the Goa'uld generally conned them into leaving Earth voluntarily by making all sorts of promises, and they only found out they'd walked into slavery once they reached their new home on another world. That would have been a much more difficult proposition during the Renaissance and after than in earlier ages.

slimjim
June 26th, 2012, 11:11 AM
For one thing, we don't know that they used the Antarctic gate to remove their last slaves. Remember the frozen Jaffa corpse? That would seem to indicate a problem with using the Antarctic gate on any kind of regular basis, or maybe at all. They may well have been using ships to transport them instead, especially given that they were probably moving livestock and other goods in bulk as well so that the humans would have what they needed to make a go of things in their new environment.

For another, it's entirely possible that by then they already had enough slaves seeded on enough worlds, and no one thought it necessary to keep taking them from Earth. Humans breed, obviously, so if you needed more slaves you just let your existing ones do what comes naturally.

Besides, as human culture and society progressed as happened in Europe during the Renaissance and the Enlightenment, fewer people would have been apt to worship strange, human-form gods and therefore the Goa'uld would've had far less leverage for gaining followers who would be willing to relocate to some other world. I always got the impression that rather than taking their slaves by force, the Goa'uld generally conned them into leaving Earth voluntarily by making all sorts of promises, and they only found out they'd walked into slavery once they reached their new home on another world. That would have been a much more difficult proposition during the Renaissance and after than in earlier ages.
I suppose they'd have that problem with monotheists from any era, it's pretty hard to imitate a god with literally unlimited power

jelgate
June 26th, 2012, 11:39 AM
Because the Goa'uld had abandoned Earth before then. Remember the rebellion in Egypt

SF_and_Coffee
June 26th, 2012, 01:07 PM
Because the Goa'uld had abandoned Earth before then. Remember the rebellion in Egypt
Remember the people in the episode "Demons", or any of a number of other cultures whose origins would seem to post-date the rebellion in Egypt. It's pretty clearly implied in the show that there were still Goa'uld operating at least sporadically on Earth after that rebellion. Everything from the existence of Celtic- and Chinese-type Goa'uld from eras that occurred later than the timeframe we were given for the rebellion to the existence of Egeria herself (you can Google to see who she is modeled after, basically a Roman goddess from a later period) indicates that the Goa'uld didn't completely abandon Earth until sometime in the Middle Ages.

Hathor_girl
June 26th, 2012, 02:30 PM
According to Anise (in "Crossroads"), Egeria went to Earth some time after starting the Tok'ra, in order to stop the Goa'uld from taking slaves from that planet. Since the Tok'ra was started 2000 years ago (according to the same episode), then maybe she was successful, but it took some centuries to make it trickle down and stop?

SF_and_Coffee
June 26th, 2012, 02:47 PM
According to Anise (in "Crossroads"), Egeria went to Earth some time after starting the Tok'ra, in order to stop the Goa'uld from taking slaves from that planet. Since the Tok'ra was started 2000 years ago (according to the same episode), then maybe she was successful, but it took some centuries to make it trickle down and stop?
Right. Besides, even 2,000 years ago was after the Egyptian rebellion.

slimjim
June 26th, 2012, 03:17 PM
According to Anise (in "Crossroads"), Egeria went to Earth some time after starting the Tok'ra, in order to stop the Goa'uld from taking slaves from that planet. Since the Tok'ra was started 2000 years ago (according to the same episode), then maybe she was successful, but it took some centuries to make it trickle down and stop?
how could the Tok'ra possibly do that?

SF_and_Coffee
June 26th, 2012, 03:47 PM
how could the Tok'ra possibly do that?
What, go to Earth? Or stop the Goa'uld?

Either way, it's what Anise said.

Brother Freyr
June 26th, 2012, 06:36 PM
Remember that the goa'uld didn't care about Earth any longer. It was initally important to them because humans made good hosts, but its importance waned after the goa'uld populated the galaxy with humans. Earth lacks natural resources important to the goa'uld, and earth is (supposedly) physically distant from the goa'uld empires. Basically, earth was a backwater planet in an uninteresting fringe of the galaxy. That's the line of thought we were fed in some of the episodes. It doesn't really hold up to scrutiny. I think we're supposed to just accept it without thinking too much about it. ;)

SF_and_Coffee
June 26th, 2012, 06:43 PM
Repeat after me: "Suspension of disbelief." But yeah, we got some conflicting material in canon, that's for certain. No big deal, or at least not enough to bring down the overall level of enjoyment, and those of us who like to play 'fill in the blank' can always spin our own yarns to weave into the more threadbare portions of the backstory.

McAvoy
June 26th, 2012, 08:30 PM
Remember that the goa'uld didn't care about Earth any longer. It was initally important to them because humans made good hosts, but its importance waned after the goa'uld populated the galaxy with humans. Earth lacks natural resources important to the goa'uld, and earth is (supposedly) physically distant from the goa'uld empires. Basically, earth was a backwater planet in an uninteresting fringe of the galaxy. That's the line of thought we were fed in some of the episodes. It doesn't really hold up to scrutiny. I think we're supposed to just accept it without thinking too much about it. ;)

Actually makes sense. After hundred and hundreds of years of no contact with Earth, the Goa'uld basically forgot about them. The Egyptian rebellion just removed a permanent foothold on Earth and once that was done, various Goa'uld may have came by to bolster their slave population but none of them had a reason to stay there.

I mean think about it, if Earth was valuable, Ra wouldn't have left in the first place. He would have crushed the rebellion and would have been the end of it.

It also shows how long it has been since the last time the Goa'uld was near Earth as Earth's population is one of the more densely populated planets in the galaxy which would have been interesting for the Goa'uld for a practically unlimited slave pool, not to mention Earth's technology was getting to the point that it may threaten them.

We have seen other planets where they rebelled against the Goa'uld too and they never came back.

slimjim
June 27th, 2012, 03:11 AM
What, go to Earth? Or stop the Goa'uld?

Either way, it's what Anise said.
the Tok'ra can only sabotage things, they can't make the system lords stop doing anything if they really want to

Skadi
June 27th, 2012, 06:06 AM
the Tok'ra can only sabotage things, they can't make the system lords stop doing anything if they really want to

Well, we know they have kept the System Lords fighting each other, setting one up against the other, for centuries or millennia. We have not heard that much about actual sabotage, but it makes sense they do that too. Remember, they are infiltrators, slowly working themselves into positions where they can both spy on the System Lords, and influence their decisions. Advisors, minor system lords, etc. That is what we have been told they do.

Egeria, according to mythology, was an advisor to Numa Pompilius (roman king in mythology). Perhaps she had put herself into a position where she 'adviced' some Goa'uld, like Ra, and slowly convinced him taking slaves from Earth was bad (whispering in his ear in bed, or something, perhaps). It took centuries, and meanwhile she secretly spawned Tok'ra. When she was discovered and had to flee, maybe Ra or whomever had convinced themselves it was their idea that slaves from Earth were bad. Too cumbersome to go and get, too difficult to dicipline, not 'in' - whatever.

Regardless, as SF_and_Coffee and Hathor_girl said, that is what Anise said. The Tok'ra does a lot of infiltration, they have their ways ;)

Anoobian
August 10th, 2012, 10:37 PM
Actually makes sense. After hundred and hundreds of years of no contact with Earth, the Goa'uld basically forgot about them. The Egyptian rebellion just removed a permanent foothold on Earth and once that was done, various Goa'uld may have came by to bolster their slave population but none of them had a reason to stay there.

I mean think about it, if Earth was valuable, Ra wouldn't have left in the first place. He would have crushed the rebellion and would have been the end of it.

It also shows how long it has been since the last time the Goa'uld was near Earth as Earth's population is one of the more densely populated planets in the galaxy which would have been interesting for the Goa'uld for a practically unlimited slave pool, not to mention Earth's technology was getting to the point that it may threaten them.

We have seen other planets where they rebelled against the Goa'uld too and they never came back.

I dunno. Ra in the movie wasn't much of a fighter and looks like he only had a few gliders. The whole leaving Earth thing doesn't make any sense.

If anything, Earth would have been pounded into submission UNLESS the Asgard had something to do with them leaving Earth. IE Stargate implying that Norse mythology emerged around that time.

But do the Goa'uld/Asgard assume the identity of the Gods or were they the Gods and the myths inspired from them?