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Galileo_Galilee
April 26th, 2011, 04:15 PM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create drama, but ignore the issue of it between the earth and the Destiny. The Destiny is billions of light years away from earth. If it takes only 390 years to get to the nearest star system, which they should easily have charted and figure out, they should pay attention to how it would affect the people on the Destiny.

If it takes only 390 years to get to a star that's just a few light years away, then it would take millions or even billions of years to when one is billions of light years away.

To that end, somehow the star gates and the communication stones are able to ignore this effect.

I for one, would love to see the writers address this problem.

Because in order to ignore this effect, the gates and stones have to be time travel devices as well (without having to use a solar flare).

Nth Chevron
April 26th, 2011, 04:31 PM
The Stargates for one, use a subspace wormhole, the same as FTL but more likely a special kind of interaction between the wormhole and the space for the nigh instantaneous travel.

As for the stones, we have ZERO idea on how they work, i suspect the writers used them to bring the Ori to our attention and then had no more plans, but needed them again to accommodate Claudia Blacks pregnancy.

By now i think its one of those things that will never get explained :)

Like the ship in 'Grace', the Furlings, fate of the Wraith etc etc

N.C

morbosfist
April 26th, 2011, 04:39 PM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create drama, but ignore the issue of it between the earth and the Destiny.Time dilation has absolutely nothing to do with this episode.

TJ's problem is the foreknowledge of a condition she will eventually suffer from. Time travel (not dilation) is the means by which she got that info. Time dilation is the result of near-light travel, not physics-bending FTL.

Galileo_Galilee
April 26th, 2011, 05:21 PM
You missed it then. Because they said it would take the Novus ships several hundred years to reach the nearest star because they didn't have any FTL. They brought this up because the Novus man said they had a cure, and it was in the archives. But they only had a third of the archives, so there was no guarantee that they would find the cure, so they had to find the Novus ships, and that's how they brought the issue up.

morbosfist
April 26th, 2011, 05:57 PM
You missed it then. Because they said it would take the Novus ships several hundred years to reach the nearest star because they didn't have any FTL. They brought this up because the Novus man said they had a cure, and it was in the archives. But they only had a third of the archives, so there was no guarantee that they would find the cure, so they had to find the Novus ships, and that's how they brought the issue up.First, it had nothing to do with them reaching the nearest star, it was how long it would take them to reach the colony world. Again, that has absolutely nothing to do with time dilation. It means the Novans are traveling at speeds likely on par with 304, at best. The issue is not and never was about time dilation, it's about space and how freakishly big it is. Finding the Novans was never an option. They have no way to know where their ships are.

Galileo_Galilee
April 26th, 2011, 06:25 PM
Yes, they do. They have very advanced tech that can at least attempt to find the course they took. They can begin with the take off points on the planet.

Puddle-Jumper
April 26th, 2011, 07:24 PM
Yes, they do. They have very advanced tech that can at least attempt to find the course they took. They can begin with the take off points on the planet.

Ya it didn't make much sense why they wouldn't at least spend a few weeks looking

morbosfist
April 26th, 2011, 09:36 PM
Yes, they do. They have very advanced tech that can at least attempt to find the course they took. They can begin with the take off points on the planet.Which means absolutely nothing. So they took off from one point on the planet. Then what? Do you know exactly what path they took out of the atmosphere? Course corrections made over at least a decade if not more?

Again, space is freakishly big. Finding one or a few itty bitty ships in it, even narrowing it down to a path between two worlds, is like trying to find a needle in a haystack the size of Earth. And that's probably an understatement. Those ships will never be found.

D Toccs
April 26th, 2011, 09:40 PM
It means the Novans are traveling at speeds likely on par with 304, at best.

A 304 that can cross a galactic void in just 3 weeks? I don't think so.
The Novan space ships are probably more in line with the ships from Lifeboat, in more ways then one.


Finding the Novans was never an option. They have no way to know where their ships are.

Well they know which planet they are heading to and the speed that the ships are traveling. There's no reason why they couldn't just make several stops between Novus and the Colony World and scan the area.
The only crew member who would be against devoting a few weeks to finding the Novus ships, would be Rush.

morbosfist
April 26th, 2011, 11:03 PM
A 304 that can cross a galactic void in just 3 weeks? I don't think so.
The Novan space ships are probably more in line with the ships from Lifeboat, in more ways then one.In terms of sublight, not FTL.


Well they know which planet they are heading to and the speed that the ships are traveling. There's no reason why they couldn't just make several stops between Novus and the Colony World and scan the area.
The only crew member who would be against devoting a few weeks to finding the Novus ships, would be Rush.Because it wouldn't be weeks, it would be years.

Familiar quote: "Space," it says, "is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mindbogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space, listen..."

One, they don't know how fast the ships are travelling. They can get drive schematics, but that tells them little. How long did ship burn its engines upon exiting atmosphere? Is it running on minimal power to conserve fuel and just coasting? Two, even with exact speeds, how can they know their exact course? You can't update a home flight-plan mid-journey. They make one course correction and that's a variation they'll never compensate for. It would take forever to find them, and Eli knows this. Finding something in the void is incredibly difficult even if you have a narrowed idea of where to look, and before you cite Carter finding Atlantis by the same method, those sensors are a lot more advanced than what Destiny has. Not to mention the fact that Destiny has to spend seven hours for each distinct jump, which means you've got a recipe for a lot of wasted time.

Konrad9
April 27th, 2011, 12:38 AM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create drama, but ignore the issue of it between the earth and the Destiny. The Destiny is billions of light years away from earth. If it takes only 390 years to get to the nearest star system, which they should easily have charted and figure out, they should pay attention to how it would affect the people on the Destiny.

If it takes only 390 years to get to a star that's just a few light years away, then it would take millions or even billions of years to when one is billions of light years away.

To that end, somehow the star gates and the communication stones are able to ignore this effect.

I for one, would love to see the writers address this problem.

Because in order to ignore this effect, the gates and stones have to be time travel devices as well (without having to use a solar flare).

I have absolutely no idea what the hell you are trying to say.

How does a 390 year "distance" have anything to due with the Destiny?

How does a 390 year "distance" translate to millions or billions of years? Millions or billions of years for who/what ship?

Why wouldn't the gates and the stones ignore it? Dilation only effects things in states of extreme relative motion.

Greenfire32
April 27th, 2011, 09:18 AM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create dramaThat never happened, but ok then.
The Destiny is billions of light years away from earth. If it takes only 390 years to get to the nearest star system, which they should easily have charted and figure out, they should pay attention to how it would affect the people on the Destiny.
Are you applying real world science to a fiction television show? No wonder you're disappointed...
I
To that end, somehow the star gates and the communication stones are able to ignore this effect.
Not really. The Stargate itself creates a wormhole and essentially "cuts out" the space in between two points. Take a piece of paper, fold it in half, and punch a hole through the open edge. Now open the paper and observe what you have--two points on the opposite ends of the paper. One is Earth, the other is Destiny. Now take a pencil and draw a line from one point to the other. You should notice that it took some time to reach your destination (a couple of seconds for this demonstration). This is the time delay and, when applied to a vast distance, is what is responsible for time-dilation.

Fold the paper again and stick a pencil through the hole. Notice any time delay? You shouldn't. Because you didn't take any time to cross the distance between the two points, because there is no distance between the two points. This is how a Stargate works.

Now, the stones on the other hand we know literally nothing about. I suspect it works similar to a Stargate, however, to overcome the time-dilation problem you outlined. Without some sort of instantaneous travel, the stones would have to send data (human consciousnesses) across a distance, and therefore, be subject to the effects of time.

I for one, would love to see the writers address this problem.
You're implying that they don't know what they're writing about in a fiction television show?

Because in order to ignore this effect, the gates and stones have to be time travel devices as well (without having to use a solar flare).Again, paper and hole punches.

Zed.P.M.
April 28th, 2011, 11:50 PM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create drama, but ignore the issue of it between the earth and the Destiny. The Destiny is billions of light years away from earth. If it takes only 390 years to get to the nearest star system, which they should easily have charted and figure out, they should pay attention to how it would affect the people on the Destiny.

If it takes only 390 years to get to a star that's just a few light years away, then it would take millions or even billions of years to when one is billions of light years away.

To that end, somehow the star gates and the communication stones are able to ignore this effect.

I for one, would love to see the writers address this problem.

Because in order to ignore this effect, the gates and stones have to be time travel devices as well (without having to use a solar flare).

Absolutely no idea what you're talking about...

erotavlas
April 29th, 2011, 05:29 PM
It's funny how they used time dilation as a plot device to make things difficult on TJ in order to create drama, but ignore the issue of it between the earth and the Destiny. The Destiny is billions of light years away from earth. If it takes only 390 years to get to the nearest star system, which they should easily have charted and figure out, they should pay attention to how it would affect the people on the Destiny.

If it takes only 390 years to get to a star that's just a few light years away, then it would take millions or even billions of years to when one is billions of light years away.

To that end, somehow the star gates and the communication stones are able to ignore this effect.

I for one, would love to see the writers address this problem.

Because in order to ignore this effect, the gates and stones have to be time travel devices as well (without having to use a solar flare).

No they don't have to be time travel devices. The writers get around the problem by inventing concepts like hyperdrive, subspace, etc. that take the traveller outside normal space time, thereby bypassing the effects of relativity.

Python
May 2nd, 2011, 03:08 PM
And yet not inventing a concept like long range sensors, something used in just about every other sci-fi show to date (including SGA and SG-1, I had thought), which could have detected the colony ship immediately.

GoodSmeagol
May 2nd, 2011, 04:13 PM
And yet not inventing a concept like long range sensors, something used in just about every other sci-fi show to date (including SGA and SG-1, I had thought), which could have detected the colony ship immediately.

Deadalus had long range sensors, but hadda be enhanced by Carter, then drop out of hyperspace every so often to scan.
If the colony ship was giving off a lot of EM... THEY BE DEAD! cause the drones would find them.
Low EM = low chance to find