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GateWorld
April 18th, 2011, 07:40 AM
<DIV ALIGN="center"><TABLE WIDTH="450" BORDER="0" CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="7"><TR><TD STYLE="border: none;"><DIV ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Arial, san-serif" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/sanctuary/s3/"><IMG SRC="http://www.scifistream.com/wp-content/uploads/metamorphosis-160x120.jpg" WIDTH="160" HEIGHT="120" ALIGN="right" HSPACE="10" VSPACE="2" BORDER="0" STYLE="border: 1px black solid;" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888">SANCTUARY SEASON THREE</FONT>
<FONT SIZE=4><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/sanctuary/s3/" STYLE="text-decoration: none">METAMORPHOSIS</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE="1">EPISODE NUMBER - 314</FONT>
<DIV STYLE="margin-top:10px; padding:0;">Will is uncharacteristically absent from the morning team meeting. His reason for not attending has him literally climbing the walls. (SPACE)</DIV>
<FONT SIZE=1><B><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/sanctuary/s3/">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >></A></B></FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

Spimman
May 2nd, 2011, 07:46 PM
Full comments to come, but...


The part with Biggie and him in the whisky room was awesome, time for the run down, LOL! Biggie was in his element tonight!

Skydiver
May 2nd, 2011, 07:50 PM
yes, the biggie/chuck/will scene was great

suse
May 2nd, 2011, 07:56 PM
So was Kate: Will I have a question:
Can you save us 15% on car insurance??
:lol:

Spimman
May 2nd, 2011, 07:57 PM
So was Kate: Will ahve I a question:
Can you sve us 15% on car insurance??
:lol:

That was awesome! :p

Steff
May 2nd, 2011, 07:58 PM
So was Kate: Will I have a question:
Can you save us 15% on car insurance??
:lol:

Hehe.... great humor in the episode. Love the pace of the whole show. :D

General Jumper One
May 2nd, 2011, 08:00 PM
The part with Biggie and him in the whisky room was awesome, time for the run down, LOL! Biggie was in his element tonight!

one of the best parts of the ep

DragonGate
May 2nd, 2011, 08:26 PM
Okay, my guess to explain the weird first-person camera. Robin Dunne had a bad reaction to the facial makeup, so they tried to reduce how much time he had to wear it. Anybody confirm or deny?

As for the episode, I found the first-person really, really distracting. It's so different from what they normally do, I spent the entire time trying to figure out why. Could have used more chasing escaped and crazy Will. Watched with my mother, she thought Kate was going to be infected from the scratch, too.

Mandysg1
May 2nd, 2011, 08:30 PM
While I'm not a fan of the shakey camera, this episode was much better than last weeks. I like how we got a real team episode...even Chuck was there :) The best moments were the team moments. Loved Henry in this one :D Biggie was awesome and Kate was good too, the humour was excellent. :D

Helen and her many great outfits was played very well, from her trying to hide her concern from Will and the others, to her dramatic encounter with Biggie before she figured out there was a second message. And all I can say is WOW when she was fighting Will the creature, and won! I really liked the choreography of that fight scene. Amanda played it very well :D

*sigh* not sure about next weeks episode with another date night and Abby returning :(

planet_tv
May 2nd, 2011, 08:34 PM
I would have to say this episode was much better then One Night and I really liked that Geico line among other things.

Steff
May 2nd, 2011, 09:07 PM
Favorite Henry line: "You mean like aliens?" hehe... he looks so nerdy innocent.

Rocky89
May 2nd, 2011, 09:10 PM
Very good episode of Sanctuary. :) I thought it was cool to have much of it from Will's POV, just to see how the world around him was changing, and how he was slowly slipping away. I wonder if that's what it's like for a Goa'uld host? The whole episode was really well done, and it was cool to know that Will's mutation came from Hollow Earth, and I also liked how Ranna was able to be of some help, it was brilliant how she used Morse code to send a message. :)

I think that even though it revolved around Will mostly, it was a good team episode, it really should how they feel when one of their own is in trouble, and how it effects all of them when they could lose someone. I loved seeing some attribute and concern in Helen, it showed how much she cares for Will, and how she wouldn't stop to save him. The Helen whumping didn't really bother me because Breach was worse and Will was a mindless lizard. :p Everything going on with Will reminded me of The Fly, I mean both were slowly changing into something else, and and no one could help him. I loved how Henry compared Will to Spider-Man. :p

Does anyone remember the time the cast was on the Jace Hall show, I think they went by there the time this episode was being made, I could tell from the white jacket and blue undershirt she had on. The same from the JH show. :) I liked cheeky Helen at the end, and how she referenced Bruce Willis. :p Overall, it was a great ep (they're all great) and next week looks just as good. ;)

Feast of the Muse
May 2nd, 2011, 09:12 PM
I loved Magnus playing with her lips while examining Will for the first time. And the wink! Too cute.

Not very often do they get to look into the camera and act, and I have to say I enjoyed that aspect of it a lot. Tell me I'm not the only one who loved seeing Helen's pretty blue eyes in all their glory? It was fun to see the Sanctuary from a personal perspective, not just with the pretty, clean-cut camera shots we're used to.

Also, I'm playing catch up and just saw Pavor Nocturnus. I love that Kate shows genuine concern for Will as the situation becomes more serious. That's in keeping with the 'alternate future' storyline and I like that they are consistent with that.

charles582
May 2nd, 2011, 10:04 PM
I think kate likes will alot more than she lets on. you guys think she will ever tell him?

General Jumper One
May 2nd, 2011, 10:19 PM
I think kate likes will alot more than she lets on. you guys think she will ever tell him?

hope she does, for awhile there I thought Will wanted to gobble Kate up instead of the food she was bringing him.

mandogater
May 2nd, 2011, 10:22 PM
First off, I loved the POV stuff, reminded me of one of my favorite episodes of MASH.

The car insurance bit and the part with Will, Biggie and Chuck in the whiskey room was great as well.

As far as the team dynamic goes, this episode is right up there. We saw how Biggie deals with not being able to go help the others on the outside and how everybody dealt with what was happening to Will.

I also liked the bit about Tesla finding all kinds of other data about Hollow Earth encoded in the map. I would have liked a bit more explanation about how he pulled that off and how much did he get.

KayLyne
May 3rd, 2011, 01:47 AM
For me, the Will-vision was cute & interesting - until the opening credits finished, then it became a bit annoying, at least until they got more of the others involved.

Strangely enough, I think my favorite part was the Helen/Biggie scene where he's telling her she needs to sleep and she's telling him that he knows she has to work in times like this. I like the fact that he tells it like he sees it and isn't afraid to get in her face about things. He's probably the only one besides John (is it because of Chris' presence?) who really is able to do that. This is one relationship that I really wish we'd see more of - just these two by themselves where they don't have to temper their normal relationship because others are around. Even that "fly on the wall" moment earlier, where Will was listening in to their convo - I like how Biggie kept pushing her, giving her a little prodding to see the positives. Helen & Biggie have known each other for over 50 years, which is about half the time of Helen & The Five, so it's a nice look at a "halfway" relationship. Then Helen/Henry less than half that, followed by both Will & Kate being "newbies" in the Helen/relationship scale.

I'll also say that the scene at the end with Helen on the bed and looking directly into camera, her eyes were just... yeah. They just somehow cut through me like... yeah, y'all know what I mean! Mesmerizing. I was drowning in those pools.

Anyway...
I'm kind of enjoying the way they keep switching up Kate from "tough girl" to "vulnerable girl" every time we tune in. Out on missions, we see her tough side, while in the Sanctuary and surrounded by those she's come to know as 'family', she's able to show her vulnerable side - like in this eppy where she's attacked by a changed Will. At that point, she was caught in-between. She wanted to feel safe because it was Will, but she never quite got into "tough girl" mode either - because it was Will. This was a nice 'happy medium' that they showed with her this time.

At first, I was a bit disgruntled with them bringing up the need try to contact Hollow Earth so soon after the whole story arc had been wound down, but as it unfolded, I realized they put in just enough of a minimum reference to it that it wasn't going to become a huge plotline once again. Now I'm actually hoping we get a bit more Helen/Ranna "unauthorized" communication coming soon. Those two were fun to watch battling wits. And the idea of Ranna sending morse code - it was almost like a Tesla moment.

The Biggie/Chuck/Will drinking scene was fun, and quite unexpected.

The Helen whumping at the end was kind of expected, but as was with Breach, it's fun to see her being able to take some lumps and get right back up and give them too, and in this case, having enough sense to grab the tranq darts. I'm guessing Will has no recollection of that part of things, since he was completely taken over by then.

Inquisitor
May 3rd, 2011, 04:33 AM
I'd like to see Helen inject her DNA into the spores, making the entire cast Helen Magnus. That would be a fun episode to watch.

Spimman
May 3rd, 2011, 05:31 AM
This episode was great all around. I really enjoyed seeing the show from Will's perspective. It gave us a look into Will's emotions as he dealt with his possible death\transformation. It gave us a view of his friends as they struggled to comfort him (and humor came out eventually). It gave us a rare insight into life behind the scenes with Biggie, which was incredible. The plot really hooked me in right away, wondering how they would come to grips with the crisis. The POV camera style was fitting for this episode and was effectively used, I almost didn't notice after the first commercial break because it seemed more naturally done than some I've seen. All in all a really fun and enjoyable episode for me! :)

MelissaAdams
May 3rd, 2011, 07:50 AM
Well I have to say I expected the episode to rock and it surpassed my expections :-) It looked fantastic in the promo and it was truly fantastic in real life.

I admit there were a couple scenes when the first person POV was a little 'hard' to follow and made a little goofy for instance when Will was fighting with Helen and the others...it was supposed to be like that but jumping around makes a real person goofy and it transferred when you're watching literally through someone else's eyes.

Before I get into the specific episode let me say that if SyFy had waited for their move to Mondays for this episode instead of last weeks they would have had a WHOLE new level of viewers because this had just enough care, concern, mystery and action to entice people to watch again. It literally reminded me WHY I loved this show from the first moment I watched it, this is what Sanctuary is folks so have folks watch this episode if you're trying to turn em. :D

As for the specifics of the ther episode as others have said it was a great team episode and despite the superb acting that Robin Dunne did it was really the team interacting for me that sold this episode. You could literally feel their confusion and their concern every time someone else was in 'his' sight, it was wonderful.

The Biggie/Will/Chuck whiskey room scene was fantastic as everyone said. It's nice to see what the 'support staff' do why the team is out getting all the glory then telling Will about the song and dance was nice and him actually seeing it from Henry and Kate...I wonder if it will make him think twice the next time that he is on the capture and in the action? LOL Probably not.

One of the best feelings of the entire show was Helen of course but it wasn't anything she did, but her refusal to give up on him. She's had to have lost proteges to perhaps things like this before and yet this...this she was unwilling to just give up, leave him to his fate. I admire that in her, in the way that Amanda portrays her and is one of the best aspects that make me love the character.

I will say one of the most surprising things I found out and maybe I had it wrong was that Will's dad was alive. Wasn't he raised in foster care, how would that be possible if his father was alive or did I miss up reality and fan fiction reality somewhere? LOL

The best scene for me though, outside the chandelier thing of course which I loved...(It's on a winch, there's a control panel under the staircase)...I kept expecting her to say DUH fellas at the end of that, but anyways. The best scene for me was the one where Will overheard Biggie & Helen talking, her frustration that she had no treatment, nothing was working and yet when she came in and said there was something else she'd like to try there was no hesitation...NONE as he held out his arm to her even though he knew that she didn't believe it would work. The trust portrayed there was just AMAZING!!!!


One of the BEST episodes of the series, truly WONDERFUL job folks. Kudos, BIG KUDOS to the Sanctuary team.

dipsofjazz
May 3rd, 2011, 07:58 AM
I enjoyed this episode.
I don't normally like the shaky-cam but I think it worked here, especially when it got more and more misty as Will changed.
This was a nice team episode, which is why I think it was so much better than last week.
I loved the Biggy/Chuck/Will whisky drinking scene. I was also nice seeing Henry and Kate being funny as well as worrying about Will.

Was the dream scene showing us that Will was 'leaving' and the creature taking over? I liked the visuals for it.

Helen looked fabulous in all her outfits.
The humour was back in this episode, nicely mixed in with the more serious elements.

siles
May 3rd, 2011, 08:24 AM
Seriously, another crappy Will episode? I simply couldn't watch this without doing something else at the same time too (yeah it was that boring); How come they didn't keep Will isolated until they had resolved the issue? Biggie, giving him alcohol? He had no idea how it will react with the infection! Chuck/Will/Biggie scene kinda tacky IMHO Will should have been kept isolated in the infirmary until they could have cured his disease.
Will is fast becoming my least favorite character on "Sanctuary" and I don't know why TPTB insist on giving him so much screen-time (He's starting to remind me of Daniel in S9-S10 SG-1)
My ratings prediction 0.6 mil!

Galileo_Galilee
May 3rd, 2011, 08:38 AM
Well, Will is really ahead of the game now. He is two for two.

jckfan55
May 3rd, 2011, 09:11 AM
My 2 cents:

I thought the shaky cam/Will vision was just a tad overdone, but I could get the effect they were going for. as dipsofjazz said, it really showed the progression of Will's change.

I liked the Biggie/Chuck/will scene mostly for the idea of it--Biggie must do something besides take care of the Sanctuary. I also liked that he finds the capture recaps annoying. :D

Helen was her talented and dedicated self trying to cure Will & looked great doing it. ;) I liked seeing some colors on her. It occurred to me with Will's transformation that we might start seeing colors differently through his eyes.

As for Helen's confrontation with Big Guy, it is good that he knows her well & can challenge her. I don't know about the "putting on a show" comment. Was she really putting on a show? Or did that line just work as the spark Magnus needed to "get" the message from H.E.?
I'm embarrassed to say, I let myself be drawn right away from that at the time they got the message. Maybe part of me was thinking "good, they have to solve it themselves." :D

As much as I was not a major fan of Hollow Earth overall, I did like that there was fallout from that mission.

overall, a good episode.

Klenotka
May 3rd, 2011, 09:23 AM
I liked this episode. It was much, much better than last week and this is the Will I love. Last week, he seemed to be a little OOC but, ironically, here, he was more himself....for the most part :D
I think the shaky cam thing was a perfect idea for this kind of a story because we could have seen and lived what was Will going throught. Some of the stuff was really intense.

I loved how, despite this being an episode about Will, it was a great team episode. Everybody had a moment with everybody. Kate was perfect, fighting with her feelings that she isn´t used to, and Henry, first geeking out, later worried and scared.
Magnus and Biggie had great scenes together, and I can´t even decide if I loved more scenes between her and Will or her and Biggie.

And, of course, the Biggie/Will/Chuck whiskey scene was fantastic, especially after Will saw the "song and dance" routine by himself :D

It was nice to see some hint of Will´s background with his dad and I would love to hear more about what happened between them. I guess Will´s dad didn´t believe that Will´s mum was killed by a creature and now when they have a proof, it might change few things.

I am also glad they didn´t solve it miracelously in two seconds but spent the whole episode with attempts to find a cure and even in the very end, Will wasn´t perfectly OK.
But I would love if he had some after effects, like that wall climbing or something :D It could be fun :)

And did they explain why did it take so long for the spores to attack Will? It´s been probably few weeks since they visited the Hollow Earth?

P.S. "Oh, no" for Abby from me, too :( I hope she will be less annoying next time.

Celandine
May 3rd, 2011, 12:47 PM
This episode was much better than last weeks, but still only so-so for me. I did appreciated the 'Will-cam' for the perspective of his transformation and some scenes wouldnt have made sense if filmed normally (i.e. when Kate is asking him to point yes/no on the pad of paper to questions she's asking him). This, at least, was good.

Was Kate feeding Will 'Chef Boyardee' ravioli's? Soz, it immediately came to mind when seeing it. Think I might have a can left in my pantry. :P

I loved that the whole team was back together in this one. It's only been a few eps, but it seemed like it was long overdue. I hope we get many more like it before the season is over.

Will's metamorphosis had me going back to the old black and white 'monster' movies I used to watch on Svengoolie on Saturday afternoons. Soz, again. This is what came to mind when I saw the final creature Will had become. :P

Creature from the Black Lagoon (http://famousmonstersoffilmland.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/wpcreat4800.jpg)

Demoniser
May 3rd, 2011, 12:48 PM
- First person view was tacky, irritating and a waste.

- The reactions of the other characters to Will and his predicament were just a tad fake and out of place. Seriously they work with freaky creatures all the time. In addition to that Henry is a Werewolf/Lycanthrope and Biggie is more of less the abominable snowman. The reactions were just silly in context.

- Anti Climax ending anyone.

- Henry/Will and the chandelier was good, but come on, you could see he was going to fall a mile off.

- Hollow Earth input into the episode seemed a bit rushed and wasteful.

Not one of the best episodes imo, and neither was last weeks.

I find that episodes that centre around Will are only good when he's using that analytical brain of his to solve a mystery.

Wheres some Tesla, now thats an interesting character to watch.

Celandine
May 3rd, 2011, 12:52 PM
- Henry/Will and the chandelier was good, but come on, you could see he was going to fall a mile off.

I did wonder where he put the lightbulb once he started climbing. And yes, he was talking to Henry at the time. :P

Feast of the Muse
May 3rd, 2011, 12:57 PM
And did they explain why did it take so long for the spores to attack Will? It´s been probably few weeks since they visited the Hollow Earth?


Helen stated that his cells were having their DNA rewritten one at a time. At that rate, it makes sense that he didn't show symptoms for a few weeks.



- Anti Climax ending anyone.


I disagree. Think about what he was saying to Helen. She's told him before that she has learned not to get too close to people. Here he is telling her that he sees himself slipping away, and all the people he loves becoming distant. He's describing her life in fast forward. You can tell if you look in her eyes - she knows exactly what he's talking about. I say again, you enjoy the show so much more if you can catch the subtlety of the characters.

Klenotka
May 3rd, 2011, 01:52 PM
I disagree about the anti-climax, too. I think it was very good and much better than, for example, the terrible Warriors where they had like ten seconds for Will to get over it and he was completely OK during two minutes in that episode.
I think the gradation here was very well done, and to watch it from Will´s POV made it more interesting because we were able to live the metaporphosis through his eyes (because we saw only what he saw).

The only thing I didn´t like is that it didn´t leave any effects on him. It would be great if he had, I don´t know, problems with bright light or something as an after effect.

jckfan55
May 3rd, 2011, 02:00 PM
I disagree. Think about what he was saying to Helen. She's told him before that she has learned not to get too close to people. Here he is telling her that he sees himself slipping away, and all the people he loves becoming distant. He's describing her life in fast forward. You can tell if you look in her eyes - she knows exactly what he's talking about. I say again, you enjoy the show so much more if you can catch the subtlety of the characters.

Yes, those subtle moments are often my favorite.

Kilgharrah
May 3rd, 2011, 02:12 PM
Well, I can say that OF COURSE I liked that episode coz the last week's episode didn't set the bar that high. Even though I thought the first-camera thing was annoying and the episode was all about Will, I liked that we got to see a lot less of Will's face. This person is so annoying just to look at. Not to mention the whole episode when we saw nothing but his annoying face (One Night).
His mutated form looked soooo stupid. I was expecting something better and more effort.
Was amazed by the way of contacting Ranna. I can't see why she would care about what happens to Will though.
Biggie certainly adds some fun to this episode.
This time we saw more and more of everyone other than Will which made me notice more and more of the good stuff of these actors.

meredithchandler73
May 3rd, 2011, 02:27 PM
(This was a response to Demoniser: "Anti Climax ending anyone")


I disagree. Think about what he was saying to Helen. She's told him before that she has learned not to get too close to people. Here he is telling her that he sees himself slipping away, and all the people he loves becoming distant. He's describing her life in fast forward. You can tell if you look in her eyes - she knows exactly what he's talking about. I say again, you enjoy the show so much more if you can catch the subtlety of the characters.

Overall, I enjoyed the episode. My thoughts, in no particular order:
--I didn't have a problem with all of the Will's POV shots. I felt it was especially effective when we realize that Will can no longer speak. Watching from behind his eyes as he freaks out felt more visceral to me than if the camera was on Will and he started grunting and thrashing around. Also, seeing Helen Magnus/Amanda Tapping looking at us straight on - be still my heart!
--The humor in the episode was pretty great. The gecko joke. Biggie's look to Will when Henry and Kate gush about the latest mission. Helen's incredulous reaction to Henry explaining what Will was doing climbing the walls. Helen: "It's on a winch! There's a control panel under the staircase!" Henry: "Yeah, I probably should have known that."
--Some great character moments: Discovering what Biggie does while the others are off on a mission he can't be part of. (Interesting how Biggie lets Will into his inner circle with Chuck.) Kate is obviously uncomfortable around Will but she stays to feed him. Helen refusing to give up on Will.
--I liked the callback to Hollow Earth - both that it was where Will contracted the spores that caused his transformation, but I also liked the clever way they were able to get the help they needed from Ranna. As I had mentioned in the Pax Romana thread - Ranna is a compassionate person. She would help if she could. And I like her confidence in Helen's intelligence and resourcefulness. Her message was just one word - and Helen knew just what to do.

KayLyne
May 3rd, 2011, 02:49 PM
I think the thing that began annoying me the most with the Will-vision camera is that it was set to have too much tunnel vision instead of a normal person who has more of a peripheral vision. It looked like we were seeing it through binoculars. Even the lens closures to indicate eye blinks were too slow.

EvenstarSRV
May 3rd, 2011, 02:57 PM
I enjoyed this episode.
I don't normally like the shaky-cam but I think it worked here, especially when it got more and more misty as Will changed.


I really enjoyed the effect as well, the way it incorporated Will's transformation into filming of the episode, including returning to the 'normal' filming style when he'd completely turned into the creature. It reminded me a bit of Instinct and how the POV filming style allowed us to see the Sanctuary team from an outsider's perspective, in this case showing us glimpses of Helen and Biggie and their relationship that Will normally doesn't get to see.



Was the dream scene showing us that Will was 'leaving' and the creature taking over? I liked the visuals for it.

That's how I interpreted that scene, esp since he lost the ability to communicate and became violent after waking up from it.

Overall I really enjoyed this episode, it was Will-centric but also had a nice team dynamic and I liked that we got to see slightly different angles on the other characters and their interactions. It was great to see what Biggie and Chuck do while the team goes off on their ops, seeing Helen and Biggie's working dynamic esp the way he both supports and challenges her, and seeing the softer side of Kate as she tries to deal with potentially losing Will, esp the scene in his office with Henry.

And while I'm glad for a break from the Hollow Earth storyline, the use of it and Ranna here worked for me, acknowledging the storyline without dwelling on it. I do hope that communication with Praxis remains difficult going forward, since I can see it becoming a crutch for the writers to use to get the team out of trouble if used too often.



I disagree. Think about what he was saying to Helen. She's told him before that she has learned not to get too close to people. Here he is telling her that he sees himself slipping away, and all the people he loves becoming distant. He's describing her life in fast forward. You can tell if you look in her eyes - she knows exactly what he's talking about. I say again, you enjoy the show so much more if you can catch the subtlety of the characters.

Well said, I was thinking along the same lines at her expression in that last scene.

majorsal
May 3rd, 2011, 02:58 PM
i liked the ep. :D

i liked it a LOT more than last weeks :S, but it seems buffy-the-fbi-agent is back next week :rolleyes:


comments in random order:

*i liked the camera-from-will's-perspective effect. i thought it was done well too.

*the will-biggie-chuck stuff was funny, especially with how kate and henry did exactly what biggie and chuck said they would, which was talk non stop about their adventure. nothing wrong with that at all, but lonely for the peeps not able to go. :p

*this was a tighter script and worked well.

*laughed when will wanted to keep some of his abnormal abilities. :p

*once again, henry gets excited by the idea of aliens! :p

*my mom likes kate the most now, just after helen of course. :p

*the gekko remark was funny.

*helen whumpage! :D

*will should have been able to keep some of his abnormalness. :p


my fave and least fave part are in the same scene: helen getting upset at biggie about will's condition.

loved seeing amanda playing helen losing some control :), but... it felt forced for me. i know these ppl are friends, they've spent quite a lot of time together and feel a family bond, but i just couldn't see helen feeling it *that* strong for will, when i haven't seen her feel it that strong for anyone else, especially those that she's known longer. it just felt false for me, like it was a show to let the viewers know how much she cares.

Feast of the Muse
May 3rd, 2011, 02:58 PM
As I had mentioned in the Pax Romana thread - Ranna is a compassionate person. She would help if she could. And I like her confidence in Helen's intelligence and resourcefulness. Her message was just one word - and Helen knew just what to do.

Yep, Helen and Ranna seem to share and appreciate each others' resourcefulness. Remember when Helen and Biggie conspired to catch the crooked Triad girl? The key to unlocking the whole thing was Helen misspelling a word in the header of an email. I can't believe it took her so long to get back around to studying the message, actually. I thought the "putting on a show" line was a little convenient, until I remembered that Helen had put on a show not long ago (and probably many times before). It had to have been bubbling around in her mind while she was brainstorming for a cure.

majorsal
May 3rd, 2011, 03:41 PM
Strangely enough, I think my favorite part was the Helen/Biggie scene where he's telling her she needs to sleep and she's telling him that he knows she has to work in times like this. (snipped)

another thing about that scene...

when helen was yelling at biggie, about how she reacts to things like this, instead of sitting in the corner and whimpering (can't remember her exact wording)... when she said all that, my immediate reaction was 'me too!!', in how i'm handling the no sam/jack confirmation. :p

i found her reaction to be a telling scene, b/c it helps to explain how she got to where she is in her life. she's not a quitter.

(but i'd still like to see her not giving up on finding closure with her daughter)

(((helen)))

MidwifeOnBoard
May 3rd, 2011, 03:51 PM
My 2 cents for what they are worth:

I enjoyed the ep overall, but still I feel like S 3.5 is not living up to the bar set in 3.0. I like Andy Mikita's direction most of the time (he directed some of my favorite SG1 eps) but I felt it was really intrusive and distracting this time around.


The Will-vision literally made me dizzy. Too much. I don't mind seeing part of the story from Will's POV, but the shaky-cam stuff was overdone. I'm also not a huge fan of the documentary-style talking into the camera stuff. It was a novelty with the office, but now that everyone is doing it, it's lost its bite.

LOVED the teamybits. So funny! Just enjoyed they obvious camaraderie so much. It's very obvious they had a blast shooting this. Though it also seemed kind of obvious that they had some kind of ongoing joke with the steadicam operator. I'd love to see the outtakes from this episode. :lol:

Magnus is getting soft. This is the second time she couldn't bring herself to shoot someone she loves when they were a danger to the planet at large. Interesting.

And she did look great. Wardrobe did pretty good this time. Well, except that ugly cardigan with the leggings. ;) :P

JanSam
May 3rd, 2011, 03:59 PM
I really enjoyed this one :D. I like the use of Will's POV camera; it is different look and gives the episode a whole new feel. I'm in the minority because I also liked its use in Instinct. Great use of the whole cast. I especially liked how we got to see a glimpse of the inner workings of the Sanctuary and the different character interactions.

I'd really like to see more of Helen and Biggie's relationship as they must know each other very very well. I took the comment of "putting on a show" to mean Helen didn't need to hide her feelings from him because he knew her better and knew it was affecting her. Helen seems to keep her emotions locked down and not let anyone in and Biggie was letting her know he was onto her.

Off to watch it again. :D

majorsal
May 3rd, 2011, 04:08 PM
As much as I was not a major fan of Hollow Earth overall, I did like that there was fallout from that mission.



you know, i was thinking about how much i LOVE space shows (surprised? :p), and i think this 'hollow earth' storyline is sanct's way of going to another planet. and it kind of was...

i just think there was something kind of meh-ish about it :S, but not the 'idea' of it. :p

Feast of the Muse
May 3rd, 2011, 04:43 PM
Magnus is getting soft. This is the second time she couldn't bring herself to shoot someone she loves when they were a danger to the planet at large. Interesting.


I've been thinking about this. Someone said that she showed more attachment to Will than she ever has, and I agree. But I don't think it was about Will personally. I think she would have been just as headstrong and unwilling to give up if it had been Kate (I pick her as the new girl). It wasn't about who was the victim, it was about Helen not losing another person she was responsible for. She's still processing Ashley's loss and I don't think it will be resolved any time soon. She's like a warrior going through self-doubt - a danger to herself and others until she gets back on her psychological feet. She sees her crew as 'her kids' (especially now that her own nest is empty) and she'll do anything to save them - even if that's pushing further and further into a place of endangering everyone else.

KayLyne
May 3rd, 2011, 04:56 PM
Magnus is getting soft. This is the second time she couldn't bring herself to shoot someone she loves when they were a danger to the planet at large. Interesting.


Yeah, I found that part interesting as well. I could understand her reluctance with Ashley, but previously with Adam, and now here with Will, I was confused at her reluctance - especially when she could have at least just wounded him somewhere to hold him back after she lost her tranq gun.

I also find it interesting that she seems to have absolutely no problems with shooting (and even killing) her longtime love - Druitt.

majorsal
May 3rd, 2011, 05:17 PM
more notes:

i liked the scene where will woke up and lost his voice and panicked big time. i liked it even more when he woke up and ended up attacking kate. i don't thnk it was just the creature taking over, but will freaking that he was losing himself, like a slow death. that dream, i think, represented that fear.

and what's wrong with mothers on this series? helen's the only mother, but we've got daddy magnus and now dad zimmerman. how about a mom!? :p

(that's where i wish helen would have had a mom *alive*, b/c the daddy magnus is too close to sam-jacob for me)

MidwifeOnBoard
May 3rd, 2011, 05:39 PM
Yeah, I found that part interesting as well. I could understand her reluctance with Ashley, but previously with Adam, and now here with Will, I was confused at her reluctance - especially when she could have at least just wounded him somewhere to hold him back after she lost her tranq gun.

I also find it interesting that she seems to have absolutely no problems with shooting (and even killing) her longtime love - Druitt.

Exactly!! This is what I was thinking. Her hesitation to even wound him perplexed me.

It's gotta be because John appears to be unkillable. :lol:

Chelle DB
May 3rd, 2011, 09:18 PM
Will is fast becoming my least favorite character on "Sanctuary" and I don't know why TPTB insist on giving him so much screen-time
I wouldn't quite go as far as saying Will is my least favourite character on Sanctuary but I do have to wonder why he's getting so much screen time. :(

I really enjoyed this one :D. I like the use of Will's POV camera; it is different look and gives the episode a whole new feel. I'm in the minority because I also liked its use in Instinct. Great use of the whole cast. I especially liked how we got to see a glimpse of the inner workings of the Sanctuary and the different character interactions.
I'd really like to see more of Helen and Biggie's relationship as they must know each other very very well. I took the comment of "putting on a show" to mean Helen didn't need to hide her feelings from him because he knew her better and knew it was affecting her. Helen seems to keep her emotions locked down and not let anyone in and Biggie was letting her know he was onto her.
Off to watch it again. :D

Agree with your entire post...re the highlighted part...I'd love to see more Biggie/Helen interaction with a bit of fun too...like maybe Helen and Biggie in the whiskey room having too much to drink and lots of laughter. :)

i liked the scene where will woke up and lost his voice and panicked big time. i liked it even more when he woke up and ended up attacking kate. i don't thnk it was just the creature taking over, but will freaking that he was losing himself, like a slow death. that dream, i think, represented that fear.
Yep...that scene was one of my top scenes. :)
I won't bore anyone too much...watched the ep in the wee hours of the morning so I will have to re watch for all the little nuances.
But the things that I enjoyed are:
~ Hearing the chatter come from the meeting and Helen talking about one/some of the abby's being over fed and Kate's response. :)
~ When Will walked in on Biggie, Kate and Henry talking about him and them trying to cover it up and although I don't get the "gekko" reference to insurance I loved when Kate and Biggie high five'd each other and the laughter and Biggie ruffling Will's hair - cute! :)
~ I loved Henry's enthusiasm with Will's new ability and then when Helen told him about the built in winch...funny. :)
~ Biggies concern for Helen when she confirmed they were all clean from infection. :)
~ The idea of Biggie locked out by Magnus - naked! :P
~ The fun in the whiskey room...love two face guy...miss him. Love the whole "song & dance" thing. :)
~ Kate feeding Will.
~ When Will lost his ability to speak or read and went nuts - very cool. :) (incidentally one of the few times if not the first, I've ever seen Kate with her hair tied back - looks good. :))
~ The morse code message from Ranna...very cool! :)
~ The fight scene between Helen and Will...not a fan of fight scenes but this was short and sweet.

If I have to be honest, I'd say this ep was pretty good. I actually enjoyed it though the shakey camera effect was getting a little bit too much by the end, but I just loved the whole team being the center of the story, as I was quite concerned that this would be yet another Will centered ep, which it almost did become, but the whole team played it so well that the best parts were those that involved everyone...including Will. :)
Such a HUGE turn around from last weeks flop.
I think the only thing negative I have to say of this ep is the one thing that I seem to have an issue with most eps...how on earth do they all seem to get up from taking such a beating? Both Helen and Kate were hit hard enough to knock a grown man out yet they both walked away as if they only got a slap across the face. Aside from that niggling little thing, I really enjoyed the ep. :) Definitely worth watching more than once. :)

Oh and just wanted to say that I loved how Will sounded like Barney at the end, knowing that RD played Barney...was kinda cool too. :)

sholva1
May 3rd, 2011, 10:56 PM
it was ok

Feast of the Muse
May 3rd, 2011, 10:59 PM
Oh and just wanted to say that I loved how Will sounded like Barney at the end, knowing that RD played Barney...was kinda cool too. :)

I'm sorry - WHAT? *is confused*

Chelle DB
May 4th, 2011, 01:27 AM
Magnus is getting soft. This is the second time she couldn't bring herself to shoot someone she loves when they were a danger to the planet at large. Interesting.
And she did look great. Wardrobe did pretty good this time. Well, except that ugly cardigan with the leggings. ;) :P
I love the legins and cardy look...kinda cute. :)
As for Magnus getting soft, I said that ages ago when she hesitated to shoot Ashley and John and Adam. She hesitates a lot.

I'm sorry - WHAT? *is confused*
It was either in the webisodes or the second episode of the first season where Ashely showed Will a video of Helen's previous protege, Barney. He was played by Robin Dunne...though I did hear that they wanted RDA to play him. :P Now that would have been fun. :D But yeah, Barney is the protege before Will came along. :)

MidwifeOnBoard
May 4th, 2011, 04:04 AM
At least now we know why the shaky-cam was so nauseating: Article on filming this ep (http://www.redeyechicago.com/entertainment/tv/redeye-sanctuary-how-robin-dunne-filmed-metamorphosis-20110502,0,7523410.story). And that barely contained laughter was the cast trying not to laugh their heads off with Robin as Will-Robot.

kes
May 4th, 2011, 05:39 AM
I really like this ep. Not top 5 but it was good.
I love the POV. I love that they did something different even knowing that a lot of ppl were going to b*tch about it. I get it, shaky camera (I happen o like it). But it didnt really shake that much.
Attention to detail, his view starts to change as he changes. It gets blury (sp) on the sides, awesome :D

Was it just me or was AT looking extremely hot in this ep? Her eyes were just BAM!

The one thing that doesnt fly well with me is the message from Hollow Earth, she replies so why didnt she just say the plant guy's name right away? What's the difference from saying "I cant talk to you, kill subject" from "I can't talk to you, search Gooban(?)"?

Overall, I'm not a Will fan but I liked it.

Curious about his dad.

helenmagnus23
May 4th, 2011, 05:45 AM
I just saw this eps and i have to say it was so awesome! i loved every scene and the way it was shot to going back and forth between Will's Pov and regular view it was pritty cool!

The character internaction was awesome seeing them react differantly durring each stage of Will's change from it being fun to life threatning but then being fun again i liked that.

I love how Helen never gave up on him she knew if she couldnt find the cure Hollow earth would have one and i love how Rana got the message to Magnus gotta love the morse code best invention ever!:D I loved the scene with Biggie ,Will and Two face lol! chillin with a few glasses of whiskey while the team is out hunting :D

I love how kate looked after Will and when he was in the shu and she didnt know how to handle seeing a freind locked away becase of what he turned into that would be hard.

I loved the scenes between Helen and Will and i like how she hesitated in shooting him it would be the hardest thing in the world to shoot a close freind or even family if the situation called for it i love how Magnus handled it and the scene between them at the end it was sweet and so funny Amanda and Robin are so awesome!:D

Aweome eps and i loved how we got to see through Will's eye's it was so differant and i really love that i love how they try new things i really loved it .Awesome work Team Sanctuary!

Klenotka
May 4th, 2011, 06:42 AM
As for Magnus getting soft - remember the episode Requiem? (I just love episodes with Will and Helen and I even don´t like Helen! :D). It was also mentioned in later episodes - she didn´t have a protegé for decades so I think with Will, it is really extremely personal because she wants to make him her successor.
From what I understand, she is pretty much sure that will die one day and that she thinks it will be sooner than later. She can´t die from an old age but she can be shot, die from an illness and she wants to have someone ready to continue in her work.
And, as I understand it, she has been following Will since he was 8 and his mother was killed. So I think it is the same case as if she would be forced to kill Ashley. And I am sure she feels the same way to Henry.
I don´t think she would eventually hesitate to kill him - I am sure Will wouldn´t want to live like this.

It looks like I am one of the few people who loves Will´s episodes (and who has Helen as one of the least favorite :D). One Night was just a bad episode overall but Will is my favorite character and I am glad he got the "dad" hint in this episode since the issue of his parents was never really solved.

I think it´s just a coinciednce that he had two episodes in row - and this one was more about team so it wasn´t exactly "his" :)

jckfan55
May 4th, 2011, 10:59 AM
loved seeing amanda playing helen losing some control :), but... it felt forced for me. i know these ppl are friends, they've spent quite a lot of time together and feel a family bond, but i just couldn't see helen feeling it *that* strong for will, when i haven't seen her feel it that strong for anyone else, especially those that she's known longer. it just felt false for me, like it was a show to let the viewers know how much she cares.

maybe, but this wasn't just about her losing someone it was about her failing to save him. That has to be hard on Magnus.

KayLyne
May 4th, 2011, 11:20 AM
The one thing that doesnt fly well with me is the message from Hollow Earth, she replies so why didnt she just say the plant guy's name right away? What's the difference from saying "I cant talk to you, kill subject" from "I can't talk to you, search Gooban(?)"?
It's my understanding that any type of help or suggestion that Ranna would have explicitly written would have been filtered by the Council (or whatever that oversight board was called) and not been sent through, so Ranna knew she had to make it really cryptic and put her solution to the problem in the only way she knew to get it past them, and one that Helen would figure out - morse code.

NumberSix
May 4th, 2011, 11:26 AM
Definitely better than last week's episode. (but I still want Tesla and Druitt back)

Liked:
Henry when he's telling Will about the job he has for him.
The bond between the characters as they cope with the potential loss of Will while trying to help him.
Biggie sharing his whiskey stash with Will and letting him in on how others view the team when they return from a mission, and the look Biggie gives Will when Henry and Kate enthuse about what happened.

Disliked:
The connection from Biggie telling Helen to stop putting on a show to her figuring out the hidden message seemed contrived.
Next week looks like another dose of Abby.

kes
May 4th, 2011, 02:45 PM
It's my understanding that any type of help or suggestion that Ranna would have explicitly written would have been filtered by the Council (or whatever that oversight board was called) and not been sent through, so Ranna knew she had to make it really cryptic and put her solution to the problem in the only way she knew to get it past them, and one that Helen would figure out - morse code.
Why not just kill the connection? I can see the Council not wanting a link with the outside. But stopping her from telling Gooban but allowing Kill. Doesnt fly with me.

majorsal
May 4th, 2011, 02:56 PM
It was either in the webisodes or the second episode of the first season where Ashely showed Will a video of Helen's previous protege, Barney. He was played by Robin Dunne...though I did hear that they wanted RDA to play him. :P Now that would have been fun. :D But yeah, Barney is the protege before Will came along. :)

i thought you meant barney the dinosaur! :p

suse
May 4th, 2011, 03:34 PM
Oh and just wanted to say that I loved how Will sounded like Barney at the end, knowing that RD played Barney...was kinda cool too. :)

:lol: I noticed that too.

RealmOfX
May 4th, 2011, 04:03 PM
Why not just kill the connection? I can see the Council not wanting a link with the outside. But stopping her from telling Gooban but allowing Kill. Doesnt fly with me.

Kes, they kill people that they think are traitors. No outside contact is their MO. If Ranna had put that message out in the open they would have labelled her a traitor and killed her. Pretty damn good reason not to do it in my book.

meredithchandler73
May 4th, 2011, 06:52 PM
Kes, they kill people that they think are traitors. No outside contact is their MO. If Ranna had put that message out in the open they would have labelled her a traitor and killed her. Pretty damn good reason not to do it in my book.

I think the point is that if there is supposed to be no outside contact with Hollow Earth, why did they respond at all? If they were going to allow a reply, it seems their senate would have wanted something like, "Do not contact us" or "Contact is forbidden" or something like that. Actually, I think it's more about not trusting their knowledge to surface dwellers. And if that was the case, the reply makes more sense. Ranna would have been allowed to say, "Stop calling. Kill subject." That wouldn't be sharing any Hollow Earth knowledge, it would seem a prudent action to take (the creature would be dangerous if allowed to mature and create more spores to reproduce), and the brusque tone of the message would appear to the senate as if Ranna was following instructions.

Skydiver
May 4th, 2011, 07:00 PM
i would think a response was tolerated only because, if they kept hammering at it, it'd kinda shoot holes in the whole 'the surface is full of warring factions' etc.

hard to deny the existence of a people that keep ringing up on the phone

Julian
May 4th, 2011, 07:31 PM
A lot better than the previous episode, but I did find some things in the story hard to believe, namely that "Ranna" would receive and reply to their message so fast and that she could send something in morse code so quickly as well.

Also I didn't really like the whole Biggie: "Stop putting on a show" Helen: "What did you say?! Of course! -runs to re-read 'Ranna's' message-" bit. So cliche...

General Jumper One
May 4th, 2011, 07:35 PM
A lot better than the previous episode, but I did find some things in the story hard to believe, namely that "Ranna" would receive and reply to their message so fast and that she could send something in morse code so quickly as well.

Also I didn't really like the whole Biggie: "Stop putting on a show" Helen: "What did you say?! Of course! -runs to re-read 'Ranna's' message-" bit. So cliche...

Why wouldn't they be able to, they are way more advanced than we are.

suse
May 4th, 2011, 07:54 PM
Why wouldn't they be able to, they are way more advanced than we are.

I always laugh when things like Morse code are used. They had to have been keeping an eye on above to know it. The chances of the dots and dashes meanning the same thing. It's a different alphabet!

Feast of the Muse
May 4th, 2011, 08:20 PM
When was the last time they had regular communication with the surface? Morse Code is about the same age as Helen.

Chelle DB
May 4th, 2011, 09:32 PM
i would think a response was tolerated only because, if they kept hammering at it, it'd kinda shoot holes in the whole 'the surface is full of warring factions' etc.
hard to deny the existence of a people that keep ringing up on the phone
Yep...can you imagine what would happen if ET kept trying to call us here from his "home"? I seriously doubt any government would let that call go unanswered but they certainly wouldn't share that knowledge with the rest of the world. :P
I actually liked how hollow earth handled the phone call from upstairs...and I liked the whole secret message in the text thing...very cool. :)

mandogater
May 4th, 2011, 09:41 PM
I always laugh when things like Morse code are used. They had to have been keeping an eye on above to know it. The chances of the dots and dashes meanning the same thing. It's a different alphabet!

Remember Helen's dad is there as an ambassador. He could very easily have translated the message for them.

Feast of the Muse
May 4th, 2011, 09:56 PM
Remember Helen's dad is there as an ambassador. He could very easily have translated the message for them.

That's true! Are we just assuming Ranna was the one on the other end? Oh darn, gonna have to watch it again for a fact check. :D

dee
May 4th, 2011, 10:59 PM
Yeah, I found that part interesting as well. I could understand her reluctance with Ashley, but previously with Adam, and now here with Will, I was confused at her reluctance - especially when she could have at least just wounded him somewhere to hold him back after she lost her tranq gun.

I also find it interesting that she seems to have absolutely no problems with shooting (and even killing) her longtime love - Druitt.
In the real world you NEVER shoot to wound, never. No one in their right mind would shoot to wound. 95% of the time you will miss ( think bystanders) no matter how well you can shoot, because hitting a stationary target as most shooters are trained and a hitting a moving target are like two differant worlds, Unless of course you shoot clay. when the gun comes out your intent is to kill (otherwise owning a gun is not for you) and we all know that Helen dosent want to kill anybody. and yes I do carry and trainig, training, training. yes I allso notice that about Druitt.

dee
May 4th, 2011, 11:15 PM
can I say x-men Toad. Im stuck between liking and hating the the part with the big guy and Will getting drunk. Drinking whisky seems way to out of place for biggie and I would think it wouldnt mesh with his spiritual type beliefs. maybe if he was an amature wine maker then maybe it wouldnt hit me as much. I could see John drinking his scotch, Tesla drinking his wine but not big guy drinking alcohol. smoking somthing yes, drinking alcohol no. p.s. I preffer scotch.

Chelle DB
May 4th, 2011, 11:33 PM
I dunno...I'm kinda glad he likes his whiskey...I'm hoping one day I'll get to the Sanctuary and have a drink with the bug guy...but I prefer scotch liqueur. :D
Seriously though, I liked that he had something secret like the whiskey room. I don't see the difference between smoking something or drinking it as in regards to his spiritual beliefs. :)

AresLover452
May 4th, 2011, 11:48 PM
Full comments to come, but...


The part with Biggie and him in the whisky room was awesome, time for the run down, LOL! Biggie was in his element tonight!


yes, the biggie/chuck/will scene was great

That was easily my FAVE funny part of the entire episode!! And then Biggie saying he had to climb up all the way to Chucks window to have chuck let him back inside! lmao!! CLASSIC!!



So was Kate: Will I have a question:
Can you save us 15% on car insurance??
:lol:

I watched that part a few dozen times!! it was so awesome and the way Agam did that was just.... HILARIOUS!!

Totally Loved all the Biggie/Helen moments. it was a nice look at how they can been around each other, how deep their friendship really is.

jckfan55
May 5th, 2011, 08:45 AM
I watched that part a few dozen times!! it was so awesome and the way Agam did that was just.... HILARIOUS!!


yes. perfectly done.

kes
May 5th, 2011, 02:31 PM
Kes, they kill people that they think are traitors. No outside contact is their MO. If Ranna had put that message out in the open they would have labelled her a traitor and killed her. Pretty damn good reason not to do it in my book.

No outside contact, exactly. Why allow any message at all? Kill subject is a solution. Not the best but a solution. Either not responding or say no contact allowed. She replied twice!
Now if in future eps Ranna got in trouble because of it. Cool.

RealmOfX
May 5th, 2011, 02:52 PM
No outside contact, exactly. Why allow any message at all? Kill subject is a solution. Not the best but a solution. Either not responding or say no contact allowed. She replied twice!
Now if in future eps Ranna got in trouble because of it. Cool.

You talk like Ranna and the senate are of one mind but as was shown they are not. Ranna chooses to work within the system and was shown to bend the rules as she saw fit. In this case, Ranna wanted to help, she had to break the rules to do so, it is in character with what we have been shown of the people of Hollow Earth.

KayLyne
May 5th, 2011, 03:02 PM
You talk like Ranna and the senate are of one mind but as was shown they are not. Ranna chooses to work within the system and was shown to bend the rules as she saw fit. In this case, Ranna wanted to help, she had to break the rules to do so, it is in character with what we have been shown of the people of Hollow Earth.

Plus, I think they gave Helen a little latitude and allowing the messages because
1) her father is with them in Hollow Earth
2) she was basically the one to heal Kanan and save Hollow Earth (and all of Earth, for that matter)

Feast of the Muse
May 5th, 2011, 03:14 PM
Plus Ranna is at least 'respecting' the Senate's desires. She tells them in both messages that the communication is forbidden, but she isn't going to not help them. Brilliant that she could slip one word in morse code under the radar and trust that Helen would find her answers there. That also indicates that Ranna knows they got the extra information out of the Hollow map. Did they discuss that in Pax Romana?

kes
May 5th, 2011, 03:24 PM
You talk like Ranna and the senate are of one mind but as was shown they are not. Ranna chooses to work within the system and was shown to bend the rules as she saw fit. In this case, Ranna wanted to help, she had to break the rules to do so, it is in character with what we have been shown of the people of Hollow Earth.

No, I dont mean she didnt want to help. I ment that it doesnt make sense to me the whole connection and reply. Why didnt they cut her off after the 1st reply?
Like I said, if she got in trouble for replying again good, but if not. I didnt like the solution, that's all.

MidwifeOnBoard
May 5th, 2011, 03:32 PM
Plus Ranna is at least 'respecting' the Senate's desires. She tells them in both messages that the communication is forbidden, but she isn't going to not help them. Brilliant that she could slip one word in morse code under the radar and trust that Helen would find her answers there. That also indicates that Ranna knows they got the extra information out of the Hollow map. Did they discuss that in Pax Romana?
I'm going to have to rewatch the non-shaky cam stuff in this ep, because I didn't get the logic jump in that convo with biggie where she figured out the message that Ranna was sending her. I did a double take thinking 'what? How? Huh?'

Feast of the Muse
May 5th, 2011, 03:58 PM
I'm going to have to rewatch the non-shaky cam stuff in this ep, because I didn't get the logic jump in that convo with biggie where she figured out the message that Ranna was sending her. I did a double take thinking 'what? How? Huh?'

She basically gave her a specific person to look up in the encyclopedia de Praxis. :P

EvenstarSRV
May 5th, 2011, 04:40 PM
No, I dont mean she didnt want to help. I ment that it doesnt make sense to me the whole connection and reply. Why didnt they cut her off after the 1st reply?
Like I said, if she got in trouble for replying again good, but if not. I didnt like the solution, that's all.

At the end of Pax Romana, Ranna said that she and the Senate were open to the idea of future interaction with the surface, but that it was going to take some time. Perhaps, the Senate approved the initial reply of 'kill subject immediately' as part of that initial cooperation. Then when Henry told them it was Will who was affected, Ranna/Gregory wanted to help while the Senate didn't, so she embedded the hidden clue allowing her to help the Sanctuary team while seeming to follow the Senate's wishes.


I'm going to have to rewatch the non-shaky cam stuff in this ep, because I didn't get the logic jump in that convo with biggie where she figured out the message that Ranna was sending her. I did a double take thinking 'what? How? Huh?'

Biggie accuses Helen of 'putting on a show' in her attempts to save Will, ie continuing to work when she knows there's no hope. That phrase leads Helen to believe that Ranna was doing the same in her message to kill Will, ie putting on a show of not offering another option to save Will (likely according to the Senate's direction) while secretly providing the Sanctuary team a clue to the solution.

majorsal
May 5th, 2011, 05:09 PM
something i saw the first time, but just now, while i'm rewatching it do i know for sure that they did this...

after will wakes up from being sedated (after realizing he can't talk anymore), and kate writes down on the pad of paper 'yes' and 'no'... from will's perspective, it's just scribbling. he can't read the words anymore, he can't comprehend the meaning.

i liked that little touch. :)

KayLyne
May 5th, 2011, 05:14 PM
something i saw the first time, but just now, while i'm rewatching it do i know for sure that they did this...

after will wakes up from being sedated (after realizing he can't talk anymore), and kate writes down on the pad of paper 'yes' and 'no'... from will's perspective, it's just scribbling. he can't read the words anymore, he can't comprehend the meaning.

i liked that little touch. :)
Guess I didn't notice that the first time, then again, I was probably also very dizzy watching the Will-vision by that point. However, wouldn't it have been easiest for him just to shake his head yes or no? Even easier than pointing at the correct answer.

Rocky89
May 5th, 2011, 05:18 PM
something i saw the first time, but just now, while i'm rewatching it do i know for sure that they did this...

after will wakes up from being sedated (after realizing he can't talk anymore), and kate writes down on the pad of paper 'yes' and 'no'... from will's perspective, it's just scribbling. he can't read the words anymore, he can't comprehend the meaning.

i liked that little touch. :)

I also noticed that also. :) That moment must have been scary for Will, not being able to talk anymore, or understand things, or not being able control the things he does. This whole episode reminded me of The Fly, expect Will was being like a lizard.

Feast of the Muse
May 5th, 2011, 05:21 PM
Guess I didn't notice that the first time, then again, I was probably also very dizzy watching the Will-vision by that point. However, wouldn't it have been easiest for him just to shake his head yes or no? Even easier than pointing at the correct answer.

I did love that they screwed up the text so that it looked like Will only saw scribbling. Just like with Helen though, taking some sort of action was more a way for Kate not to feel helpless in the situation than anything else.

Julian
May 5th, 2011, 05:35 PM
That also indicates that Ranna knows they got the extra information out of the Hollow map. Did they discuss that in Pax Romana?
That's also something I found a bit :/ Lot of assumptions being made here

Skydiver
May 5th, 2011, 07:44 PM
biggie tells her 'stop putting on a show'

to which helen gets mad, then stops and has her lightbulb moment of 'ranna was putting on a show with her ott curt reply' which got her to go to henry to ask to see the message again, which led them to the interferrance and she told him to slow it down and we hear the dashes and dots

it's not done yet, but here's the pertinent part of the transcipt

\ is Biggie
~ Helen
* Henry

~Leave me alone.
/Stop putting on a show.
~How dare-- what did you just say?
/We are all of us in pain.
~No, no, no. You just said, "stop putting on a show."
/Yes.
~Of course. Of course she would do something like that. Come on.

THEY HURRY INTO HENRY'S LAB

~Henry! Can you pull up that message that Ranna sent?
*Okay. Uh...
~Is that the whole thing?
*Yeah. Why?
~There's an underscore here at the end of the first sentence. Why would she do that?
*I don't know. Maybe she's a bad typist.
~She typed it in cuneiform. Clearly this was intentional. I think she's trying to tell us something.
*"Forbidden communication under. You don't think...
~Wasn't there some interference when the message came through?
*Yeah, but I screened it for binary data. We got everything she wrote.
~What if the interference <i>is</i> the message?
/Like a sound file?
*I don't know. Anything she sent would have been scanned by their outgoing data filters. I think the Senate would have caught that.
~Play it for me.
*It's just gonna sound like static, so...
~Slow it down. Morse code.
*You've got to be kidding me.
~Ranna would have known that the data filters wouldn't be looking for something so primitive. Henry--
*I'm on it.
~Yup.

Skydiver
May 5th, 2011, 07:46 PM
Guess I didn't notice that the first time, then again, I was probably also very dizzy watching the Will-vision by that point. However, wouldn't it have been easiest for him just to shake his head yes or no? Even easier than pointing at the correct answer.

magnus said that his synapses were being rewritten, he literally couldn't comprehend her and communicate anymore

suse
May 5th, 2011, 07:56 PM
Remember Helen's dad is there as an ambassador. He could very easily have translated the message for them.

Not *that* fast.

Skydiver
May 5th, 2011, 08:19 PM
i do think, had they wanted to empathize will's lack of comprehension, in addition to him seeing 'yes' and 'no' as gibberish, he could start hearing their voices saying gibberish as well.

or maybe it was that he could hear english...but just couldn't comprehend it anymore

Steff
May 5th, 2011, 08:40 PM
Not *that* fast.

Complex code busting software?

Feast of the Muse
May 5th, 2011, 08:53 PM
Complex code busting software?

And the initial contact by way of a frequency that I HIGHLY doubt they could even transmit on Seafarer's antenna? I'm going to look into that. BBL *waves*

kes
May 5th, 2011, 11:48 PM
At the end of Pax Romana, Ranna said that she and the Senate were open to the idea of future interaction with the surface, but that it was going to take some time. Perhaps, the Senate approved the initial reply of 'kill subject immediately' as part of that initial cooperation. Then when Henry told them it was Will who was affected, Ranna/Gregory wanted to help while the Senate didn't, so she embedded the hidden clue allowing her to help the Sanctuary team while seeming to follow the Senate's wishes.




To many perhaps. But hey I really liked the ep and that bit doesnt ruin it for me.

Abnormal
May 7th, 2011, 10:24 AM
I did not like it that much. It was a decent episode, but I expect more from the show. There was no real suspense to me and I felt like the solution came out of the blue like two minutes before the end (how convenient!), which I found quite disappointing. I mean don't get me wrong, the whole thing was okay, but I just hope what follows is not going to look like One Night (I found it so boring that I didn't even watch the entire episode, 1st time I can't finish an episode of Sanctuary), and Metamorphosis: I need more action, more real tension and more actual interactions between Hollow Earth and the Surface.

EH-T
May 7th, 2011, 10:27 AM
Have to say it kinda sucks that we in Canada are now several days behind so by the time I join the discussion, it all has been said.


I liked this episode a lot. I was worried about the Will-cam. I like that Sanctuary tries different things and while I liked Instinct, I do find it hard to watch because of the shaky cam. This was not as bad as I had feared.

While it was another Will centered episode this time it was Will interacting with the characters we know and love.

Loved the joking at first followed by genuine concern. Loved Henry geeking out about Will's abilities and aliens. Loved that, even at the end, Will could have some fun with it (wanting to keep some of his powers).

Found it interesting that Kate was so present in caring for Will. Are they laying some groundwork for ship? Just trying to include Kate in the family? Show her softer side? Is it because she is the girl? Would just be interested to know what they had in mind.


Liked seeing more of the relationship between Helen and Biggie. His encouragement and confrontation when needed.

Loved the final scene between Helen and Will. Fabulous emotion showed by AT.

I'm with the majority in being somewhat apprehensive about next week's episode being a repeat of One Night. Here's hoping Abby comes across much better.

mathpiglet
May 7th, 2011, 04:12 PM
Anyway, I enjoyed the Blue Jays mention. It was negative but since they were on the losing end of a no-hitter today, I suppose they deserve it.

*Sigh*

Enjoyed the episode though. The first-person POV worked for this story line.

anjelia
May 8th, 2011, 07:28 AM
I watch the episode last night and I have much love, see the episode from the point of view of Will was great. Then see his descent into hell in his eyes was unbelievable and very sad to see him gradually turn into something horrible ... It was sad.

Basically I dont like Kate but here it was great she took care of Will. The scene where she gives to eat to Will was very beautiful, I really love their chemistry.

Then the scene I love most is the one where Henry and Kate are in the office is talking about the fact that Kate has never lost anyone. Henry's face in that scene was just bursting heart I'm sure he was talking about Ashley. Btw I Miss Her =(

Then the eyes of AT are just beautiful

Professor_S
May 15th, 2011, 07:29 PM
First off, I loved the POV stuff, reminded me of one of my favorite episodes of MASH.


I would *totally* green you for this if I could; but, alas, being a probie, I cannot. So instead, *high five* :D I know exactly the episode you're talking about! And YES it was definitely one of the best episodes of M*A*S*H ever.

Steff
May 15th, 2011, 10:28 PM
I would *totally* green you for this if I could; but, alas, being a probie, I cannot. So instead, *high five* :D I know exactly the episode you're talking about! And YES it was definitely one of the best episodes of M*A*S*H ever.

Ditto.

dosed150
May 21st, 2011, 07:31 PM
the POV camera reminded me more of peep show, a british sitcom, although they dont go whole episodes with POV shots just occasional scenes

Morigane50
May 22nd, 2011, 11:57 AM
I found this episode very original and innovative because it was from the point of view of the character enduring the situation. It reminded me of Kafka's Metamorphosis that I studied in High school and which gave me nightmares.
I found very moving the progressive descent to hell for Will and the other being helpless whitnesses. at the beginning nobody is really worried and they are all pretty sure that Magnus is going to find a cure immediately, and then the progressive decline of Will's health . I was touched, because for me it was a metaphore of a sickness like a cancer where the beloved one is little by little detriorating and his or her body changing .
That was really well done in the episode , I liked the shaky camera , it gave such reality , and we could feel what the character was enduring , his labor breathe and worries untill the scene of the nightmare where we suppose Will knows that is going to dy and then the scene of the panic where all the characters showed so worried faces . I loved the team interaction . Really a great episode with a huge work from the actors .

Matt G
June 22nd, 2011, 02:39 PM
1. POV cam was very wierd...did Robin have limited availability for this ep?

2. Didn't think things would go 'quite' as far as it did.

3. Can't blame Will for wanting to keep some of the tricks.

4. Liked Biggie's behind the scenes look.

Decent enough ep.

RealmOfX
June 22nd, 2011, 03:26 PM
1. POV cam was very wierd...did Robin have limited availability for this ep?


No. Robin actually filmed this ep with the camera stuck on top of his head.

Skydiver
June 23rd, 2011, 05:17 PM
about the only thing using the POV cam might have done would be save a few bucks in the makeup budget

Huaracocha
June 23rd, 2011, 05:42 PM
Perhaps more about making things a lot easier to shoot from a continuity and actor's time in make up perspective than saving cash. At first I didn't really like the 1st person POV and was hoping the gimmick would end early in the episode but I fell into it. Gotta say it was well done and gave the episode a quite interesting and different twist.

blueray
September 20th, 2011, 10:36 AM
i liked this episode, but the pov at first was cool but it got kind of old. that being said i do give Robin props for having the camera on his head.

i would have liked if they had it at the beginning when will walks in and they are all looking at him and of course henry's what happened to you? lol. that wouldn't have been as good without the camera thing. but the rest of the ep could have been normal camera.