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xxxevilgrinxxx
September 15th, 2010, 09:23 AM
quick edit:
Just to clarify - The article was interesting on bringing up so many written versions of military scifi, but I'm aware what the genre is. Just had to go with the unfortunate title left to me by IO9 :p

What Is Military Science Fiction? (http://io9.com/5638146/what-is-military-science-fiction)


Military action has provided fodder for science fiction since the birth of the genre. But just what is military science fiction?

What Is Military Science Fiction? Defining the Violence

Military science fiction is a term that applies to anything science fiction that depicts some element of the armed forces. The stories that involve futuristic (or early) militaries is varied, and encompass a number of styles of science fiction, from tales that features soldiers as characters, to stories that rely on physics, and everything in between.

This wide range brings together an extensive list of stories that might surprise you. When you think of military SF, the books that pop to mind are ones like Old Man's War, by John Scalzi, City of Pearl by Karen Traviss, Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein, A Hymn Before Battle by John Ringo or the Honor Harrington series by David Weber. But what about other books, such as Dune, by Frank Herbert, The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress by Robert Heinlein or Red Mars, by Kim Stanley Robinson, which have the political elements that involve warfare, or stories like River of Gods by Ian McDonald or The Windup Girl by Paolo Bachigalupi that use the military to a limited extent? Where do those fall within the spectrum?

And how do the fictional stories that feature military forces mesh with their real-life counterparts?


more at the link, please read on...

I would have added this to the Stargate forum as it applies, but mil. sci fi is such a huge genre that it fit here.

Thoughts?

Saquist
September 15th, 2010, 11:24 AM
I think that....since Star Trek and Star Wars aren't classifed as Military Sci Fi even though Star Fleet maybe military and the Empire and Rebellion are military means there must be a certain focus on the military and military action which these two genre lack and Stargate has.

thekillman
September 15th, 2010, 11:48 AM
military sci fi is science fiction which deals with the military aspects in sci fi.

Cold Fuzz
September 15th, 2010, 10:33 PM
What Is Military Science Fiction? (http://io9.com/5638146/what-is-military-science-fiction)



I would have added this to the Stargate forum as it applies, but mil. sci fi is such a huge genre that it fit here.

Thoughts?

Something like Babylon 5 would definitely be prototypical military sci-fi. It's got marines, navy (well EarthForce I suppose could be a fusion of the Air Force and Navy), and governmental politics...but set in space and in a vast arena. You've got the military organizations of the other alien races portrayed in B5 as well.

xxxevilgrinxxx
September 16th, 2010, 08:00 AM
military sci fi is science fiction which deals with the military aspects in sci fi.*blinks*
well, yeah :lol:


Something like Babylon 5 would definitely be prototypical military sci-fi. It's got marines, navy (well EarthForce I suppose could be a fusion of the Air Force and Navy), and governmental politics...but set in space and in a vast arena. You've got the military organizations of the other alien races portrayed in B5 as well.

Yep, definitely agree on B5. I also liked the military sci-fi aspect of Aliens as well. I agree that the military aspect is lacking in Star Trek, despite Star Fleet.

Just to clarify - The article was interesting on bringing up so many written versions of military scifi, but I'm aware what the genre is. Just had to go with the unfortunate title left to me by IO9 :p

One of the aspects I've been finding so interesting is that, given that Stargate is so strongly in the military sci fi camp, does anyone else find it interesting that there is as much of the civilian vs military angry type posts as we've seen?

Cold Fuzz
September 16th, 2010, 04:48 PM
*blinks*
well, yeah :lol:



Yep, definitely agree on B5. I also liked the military sci-fi aspect of Aliens as well. I agree that the military aspect is lacking in Star Trek, despite Star Fleet.

Just to clarify - The article was interesting on bringing up so many written versions of military scifi, but I'm aware what the genre is. Just had to go with the unfortunate title left to me by IO9 :p

One of the aspects I've been finding so interesting is that, given that Stargate is so strongly in the military sci fi camp, does anyone else find it interesting that there is as much of the civilian vs military angry type posts as we've seen?

Aliens was some big-time military sci-fi. The personalities we saw with the space marines there, especially Hicks, Hudson, Drake, and Vasquez, were a big part of the movie's appeal. :D

Despite Starfleet's involvement in the Dominion War with DS9, Starfleet is not a de facto military organization. It's an exploration/scientific organization...that happened to need a lot of big guns from time to time. :P

Regarding SGU's civilians & military situation, I never got involved with that on-going online debate because the whole situation's a non-debate as far as I'm considered: The people in the uniforms are in charge. Period.

xxxevilgrinxxx
September 16th, 2010, 05:39 PM
Aliens was some big-time military sci-fi. The personalities we saw with the space marines there, especially Hicks, Hudson, Drake, and Vasquez, were a big part of the movie's appeal. :D....I've collected quite a few of the comics as well, and the Colonial Marines take on a real cool life in those as well

Cold Fuzz
September 16th, 2010, 05:47 PM
I've collected quite a few of the comics as well, and the Colonial Marines take on a real cool life in those as well

Now I'm wondering what Hicks, Hudson, and company were like before they got scragged by xenomorphs...

xxxevilgrinxxx
September 17th, 2010, 07:36 AM
Now I'm wondering what Hicks, Hudson, and company were like before they got scragged by xenomorphs...

Hicks is a fave character :) There weren't a lot of the comics, it seemed to come at a bad time, comic wise, so the art kind of sucked, but still, neat.

Snowman37
September 19th, 2010, 11:18 PM
What is military science-fiction? It is a science-fiction story where a real or fictional military plays a large role. Star Trek and Stargate would be two good examples of military science-fiction TV shows.

Wayston
September 19th, 2010, 11:45 PM
in my book sci fi is sci fi :)

sure eg starship troopers has a military sci fi aspect, but it is also a story about a futuristic society, so it's "political sci fi"? meh... we don't go pigeon holing fantasy stories into military fantasy or political fantasy or whatnot. Ultimately it's all just a marketing label designed to draw fans of particular genres...

Snowman37
September 20th, 2010, 12:42 AM
Personally, I don't like to pigeonhole stories to genres.

Artemis-Neith
September 20th, 2010, 01:29 AM
Military Science Fiction requires the combination of Science Fiction and the military/soldiers in a way it is known in our world. Therefore I'd like to as the New BSG series as well. And like in nearly all stories from books, or TV/film which were mentioned so far, I don't think, that Star Treck fit to the genre, really. The series never put (mere) soldiers in the focus, like all SG series did (and do), or B5, or BSG, and others did. I've seen (nearly) all episodes of the 4 ST series, but the only series I could take soldiers apart from not soldiers, was the last "Enterprise", but with the other 3 series soldiers, and not soldiers were the same. On the other side the structure from Star Fleet is in the same way organised like we know it in our days from the military, so there are military aspects in ST, but it is not exactly the same as in more strict "Military Science Fiction" shows, for my taste. In one or the other way quite a lot (as to say nearly all) of Science Fction series we have today on our TV, shows strong aspects of the military in different ways.

Flyboy
September 20th, 2010, 02:41 AM
Military Science Fiction is, imo, defined by not merely a presence of soldiers or space battles, but the core focus being how war and combat is conducted in futuristic or alternative environments.

SaberBlade
September 20th, 2010, 11:13 AM
Military Science Fiction is, imo, defined by not merely a presence of soldiers or space battles, but the core focus being how war and combat is conducted in futuristic or alternative environments.

I agree. The presence of military personnel in scifi is nothing new but it should take more than just a few soldiers for it to become military science fiction.

For me, examples would be; Starship Troopers, Space: Above and Beyond, Clone Wars (CG series), Babylon 5, SeaQuest or Battlestar Galactica and Wing Commander (movie based on game). Things have involve the military as a whole rather than a few guys trapped somewhere (like Predator).

Super Carl
September 20th, 2010, 12:09 PM
Military Science Fiction is, imo, defined by not merely a presence of soldiers or space battles, but the core focus being how war and combat is conducted in futuristic or alternative environments.


I agree. The presence of military personnel in scifi is nothing new but it should take more than just a few soldiers for it to become military science fiction.

For me, examples would be; Starship Troopers, Space: Above and Beyond, Clone Wars (CG series), Babylon 5, SeaQuest or Battlestar Galactica and Wing Commander (movie based on game). Things have involve the military as a whole rather than a few guys trapped somewhere (like Predator).

That's hitting the nail on the head. It's not enough that there's a military, it has to be about the military. Stargate does this perfectly. Star wars is not exactly about the military, well some of it, but a lot of star wars books, and episodes 3-6 are about a military organization at some capacity. But Clone wars definitly is about the military.

xxxevilgrinxxx
September 20th, 2010, 01:46 PM
That's hitting the nail on the head. It's not enough that there's a military, it has to be about the military. Stargate does this perfectly. Star wars is not exactly about the military, well some of it, but a lot of star wars books, and episodes 3-6 are about a military organization at some capacity. But Clone wars definitly is about the military.

That is it exactly, and why Star Trek doesn't qualify.

Crazy Tom
September 20th, 2010, 03:00 PM
I don't know whether SG is really military science fiction, even in the early seasons, because while it heavily features the military, the emphasis is not on how to outflank a horde of Jaffa, or how to storm a Ha'tak properly, but on the "planet of the week"/exploring strange new worlds.

SaberBlade
September 20th, 2010, 04:20 PM
I don't know whether SG is really military science fiction, even in the early seasons, because while it heavily features the military, the emphasis is not on how to outflank a horde of Jaffa, or how to storm a Ha'tak properly, but on the "planet of the week"/exploring strange new worlds.

For me, SGU is more military than SG1 or SGA. While it is heavily based on the military, the main focus of show isn't. A civilian, an alien and a scientist (who has been in combat but at the same time is more valued for her brains) and then there is Jack, who was more military in the movie than than the series.

Same thing happened in SGA. Sheppard was a pilot first (like Sam was a scientist first), then Rodney and eventually two aliens while being run by civilians. SGU is strictly military. They are in command, there is a chain of command, orders must be followed, there is no civilian authority involved (despite Wray crying about it every other episode) and the man in charge of everything does come off as being a tough colonel as opposed to Jack, as he's a guy you'd want to go fishing with and John is a guy you'd watch a ball game with.

AlbinoMonkeyC
September 20th, 2010, 04:46 PM
Military Sci-fi IS my sci-fi!!!

Saquist
September 22nd, 2010, 06:08 AM
I don't know whether SG is really military science fiction, even in the early seasons, because while it heavily features the military, the emphasis is not on how to outflank a horde of Jaffa, or how to storm a Ha'tak properly, but on the "planet of the week"/exploring strange new worlds.

I think it's about how often you're carrying a weapon, using it and going into combat...Like Space Above and Beyond, Starship Troopers, DOOM
but not aliens because that wasn't the whole point.

Not Wing Commander it's a pilot flying series only
not Babylon 5 it's a EPIC SAGA of galactic proportion on a non military station
Not Seaquest the point was subarmarines not combat.

I think BSG comes close to being Sci Fi military.