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Aerilon
December 4th, 2009, 06:02 AM
For things that may not add up, for people to speculate over. The main one that I have, thus far, is The Trickster / Gabriel, so I'll start with him.

Back in season 3, episode 11, he kept killing Dean, to give Sam a taste of what it would be like to live without his brother, even though Gabriel supposedly already knows that Sam and Dean's fate is to become the vessels for Lucifer and Michael.

Anyone got an explanation or conclusion for this?

starg8fans
December 4th, 2009, 10:41 AM
For things that may not add up, for people to speculate over. The main one that I have, thus far, is The Trickster / Gabriel, so I'll start with him.

Back in season 3, episode 11, he kept killing Dean, to give Sam a taste of what it would be like to live without his brother, even though Gabriel supposedly already knows that Sam and Dean's fate is to become the vessels for Lucifer and Michael.

Anyone got an explanation or conclusion for this?

Going back to the transcripts, the lesson the Trickster/Gabriel tried to teach Sam:

This obsession to save Dean, the way you two keep sacrificing yourselves for each other? Nothing good comes out of it, just blood and pain.Dean's your weakness. The bad guys know it too. He's gonna be the death of you Sam. Sometimes you just gotta let people go...
Sounds to me as if the Trickster wants Lucifer to win, and that he's trying to convince Sam to accept his brother's death.

SheppAddictedFangirl
December 4th, 2009, 11:36 AM
For things that may not add up, for people to speculate over. The main one that I have, thus far, is The Trickster / Gabriel, so I'll start with him.

Back in season 3, episode 11, he kept killing Dean, to give Sam a taste of what it would be like to live without his brother, even though Gabriel supposedly already knows that Sam and Dean's fate is to become the vessels for Lucifer and Michael.

Anyone got an explanation or conclusion for this?

Not necessarily an error. They are destined to become vessels because Dean shed blood in hell. The first seal was broken before the Angels figured out that plan for Dean and Castiel was sent to stop that from happening, but was too late.

The continued kill off of Dean in season 3 happened before that, so the Trickster didnīt know by then that they would have to play much larger roles later. According to Castiel, none of them knew about it before it happened, and Trickster/Gabriel wasnīt much in contact with the others anymore, right?

I agree with stars, he just wanted Sam to accept Deanīs sacrifice and let it be.

Aerilon
December 5th, 2009, 03:15 PM
Sounds to me as if the Trickster wants Lucifer to win, and that he's trying to convince Sam to accept his brother's death.That being the case, he wouldn't have known about Dean going to Hell? Thus the whole 'this is your destiny' thing doesn't add up.

Besides the fact, Gab told our boys that he doesn't care who wins, he just wants the fight to be over.


Not necessarily an error. They are destined to become vessels because Dean shed blood in hell. The first seal was broken before the Angels figured out that plan for Dean and Castiel was sent to stop that from happening, but was too late.Again, if everything was set in stone, then the Angels and Gabriel etc would have known everything that was going to happen.

Anyway, this thread ain't just for me, its for all (think of it as a little bit of fun). :)

starg8fans
December 5th, 2009, 03:24 PM
That being the case, he wouldn't have known about Dean going to Hell? Thus the whole 'this is your destiny' thing doesn't add up.

Besides the fact, Gab told our boys that he doesn't care who wins, he just wants the fight to be over.

Again, if everything was set in stone, then the Angels and Gabriel etc would have known everything that was going to happen.

Anyway, this thread ain't just for me, its for all (think of it as a little bit of fun). :)

Well, Gabriel was cut off from heaven, so maybe he didn't get the destiny memo... And I would take whatever Gabriel says with a pinch of salt. IMHO he's become too used to being a Trickster to really speak what's on his mind.

Another thing that doesn't add up for me is all the way back in the Pilot. Why did Dean come back, just in time to save Sam from the fire? They had just said good-bye for good, and Dean had driven off. I guess you could claim that he had some kind of premonition, but it was never addressed on the show.

LizzieAnne
December 6th, 2009, 06:50 AM
Well, Gabriel was cut off from heaven, so maybe he didn't get the destiny memo... And I would take whatever Gabriel says with a pinch of salt. IMHO he's become too used to being a Trickster to really speak what's on his mind.

Another thing that doesn't add up for me is all the way back in the Pilot. Why did Dean come back, just in time to save Sam from the fire? They had just said good-bye for good, and Dean had driven off. I guess you could claim that he had some kind of premonition, but it was never addressed on the show.

I need to think all that through a bit more before I answer the Gabriel stuff...but I know the answer to your Pilot question. Even though I didn't get the special features on my Season 1 boxset :rolleyes: apparently some people got them. There's a missing scene that explains the reason Dean came back.

A (deleted scene) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkIDyHfa_s) shows the reason Dean returned to save Sam from his burning bedroom: his watch stopped, the car radio send static and that's why he turned the car around, sensing something was wrong. Later on, we learn that in the days before the fires, signs crop up in an area, cattle deaths, temperature fluctuations, electrical storms.

starg8fans
December 6th, 2009, 10:52 AM
I need to think all that through a bit more before I answer the Gabriel stuff...but I know the answer to your Pilot question. Even though I didn't get the special features on my Season 1 boxset :rolleyes: apparently some people got them. There's a missing scene that explains the reason Dean came back.

A (deleted scene) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkIDyHfa_s) shows the reason Dean returned to save Sam from his burning bedroom: his watch stopped, the car radio send static and that's why he turned the car around, sensing something was wrong. Later on, we learn that in the days before the fires, signs crop up in an area, cattle deaths, temperature fluctuations, electrical storms.

Thanks for this explanation, Lizzie! As one of the region 2 deprived viewers, I never saw that missing scene. Too bad it didn't make it into the ep, it would have explained a lot of things.

Andron
December 6th, 2009, 01:04 PM
I need to think all that through a bit more before I answer the Gabriel stuff...but I know the answer to your Pilot question. Even though I didn't get the special features on my Season 1 boxset :rolleyes: apparently some people got them. There's a missing scene that explains the reason Dean came back.

A (deleted scene) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkIDyHfa_s) shows the reason Dean returned to save Sam from his burning bedroom: his watch stopped, the car radio send static and that's why he turned the car around, sensing something was wrong. Later on, we learn that in the days before the fires, signs crop up in an area, cattle deaths, temperature fluctuations, electrical storms.

Nice find! On which DVD set was this deleted scene?

LizzieAnne
December 6th, 2009, 01:48 PM
Nice find! On which DVD set was this deleted scene?

Apparently Season 1 but I can't verify that as I'm assuming it's the region 1 boxset. I have region 2.

Andron
December 6th, 2009, 01:54 PM
Apparently Season 1 but I can't verify that as I'm assuming it's the region 1 boxset. I have region 2.

I actually own the region 1 DVDs. Haven't watched them in while (so I can't remember if the deleted scenes are on the set), just lent them to a friend to convert her into a SPN fan :D

queen_hathor
December 6th, 2009, 01:58 PM
A (deleted scene) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkIDyHfa_s) shows the reason Dean returned to save Sam from his burning bedroom: his watch stopped, the car radio send static and that's why he turned the car around, sensing something was wrong. Later on, we learn that in the days before the fires, signs crop up in an area, cattle deaths, temperature fluctuations, electrical storms.
Oooh, nice find! :D


I actually own the region 1 DVDs. Haven't watched them in while (so I can't remember if the deleted scenes are on the set), just lent them to a friend to convert her into a SPN fan :D
Another convert? That's what we like to hear! :D