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ARealArchaeologist
November 20th, 2009, 08:49 PM
Was what he did better or worse then what you thought it would be? And do you think it is over, or just getting started?

I'm personally torn. Maybe it's that whole personal betrayal vs. sexual betrayal thing, but somehow it was more dirty and underhanded to me to malign an already flawed character. Young doesn't seem to have any way to make his wife believe that he is telling the truth, due to past behaviors, and I think Telford knew that.

And it's never going to be over between these two until one is dead. Or maybe both.

Mitchell82
November 20th, 2009, 09:12 PM
Was what he did better or worse then what you thought it would be? And do you think it is over, or just getting started?

I'm personally torn. Maybe it's that whole personal betrayal vs. sexual betrayal thing, but somehow it was more dirty and underhanded to me to malign an already flawed character. Young doesn't seem to have any way to make his wife believe that he is telling the truth, due to past behaviors, and I think Telford knew that.

And it's never going to be over between these two until one is dead. Or maybe both.

It's about what I figured but the betrayal is just as bad IMO because I think Telford's intention is to force his way into her bed. This is going to be an ongoing thing between untill one of them is dead I agree.

garhkal
November 20th, 2009, 10:48 PM
It did kinda look that what was he is going for, or if nothing else to get her to leave Young.

Arlan
November 20th, 2009, 11:27 PM
Some speculation about where this might be going...

Someone gets murdered in the next episode (Spencer I think). What if Telford is in the body of the person that gets murdered and the murderer is Young. I believe killing one side of the body swap kills them both (if I'm wrong disregard :-) ). Young can get rid of 2 of his biggest thorns at once by taking Spencer and Telford out in one shot!

Pharaoh Atem
November 20th, 2009, 11:28 PM
Some speculation about where this might be going...

Someone gets murdered in the next episode (Spencer I think). What if Telford is in the body of the person that gets murdered and the murderer is Young. I believe killing one side of the body swap kills them both (if I'm wrong disregard :-) ). Young can get rid of 2 of his biggest thorns at once by taking Spencer and Telford out in one shot!

young .....i would hope isn't a murderer

Arlan
November 20th, 2009, 11:30 PM
young .....i would hope isn't a murderer

Men have done worse things in the name of love.

Pharaoh Atem
November 20th, 2009, 11:31 PM
Men have done worse things in the name of love.

well i hope he's not one of them. granted he could get away with it and dicontiue the usage of stones

Shpinxinator
November 20th, 2009, 11:34 PM
I was just glad to see Young beat his a**

senilegreen
November 21st, 2009, 01:19 AM
I was just glad to see Young beat his a**

Agree, though Young is hardly an outstanding officer himself.

Telford should be removed from his position and court marshaled, for abusing his position and endangering the mission.

desertrat1979
November 21st, 2009, 01:59 AM
I think Young got his point across.

ckwongau
November 21st, 2009, 02:27 AM
Young make Telford look like a coward in front of pentagon and IOA offical.But at least know how to mess with Col Young's head.
Becoming friends with Young's wife, make Col Young lose control .

TheScottyDont
November 21st, 2009, 02:49 AM
Some speculation about where this might be going...

Someone gets murdered in the next episode (Spencer I think). What if Telford is in the body of the person that gets murdered and the murderer is Young. I believe killing one side of the body swap kills them both (if I'm wrong disregard :-) ). Young can get rid of 2 of his biggest thorns at once by taking Spencer and Telford out in one shot!

Valla 'died' -burned to death in a body swap by a Prior or Ori, I do believe.

Mirel
November 21st, 2009, 03:51 AM
I don't give a crap what happens because his storyline shouldn't even be in a scifishow.

MattSilver 3k
November 21st, 2009, 04:00 AM
I don't give a crap what happens because his storyline shouldn't even be in a scifishow.

Uhh... yeah, sure...

The Mighty 6 platoon
November 21st, 2009, 04:22 AM
Well both Young and Telford bear some responsibly for this situation. Unfortunately O’Neill cant punish them equally, there’s little he can do to Young but Telford associating with another officers wife is defiantly conduct unbecoming of an officer.

SGFerrit
November 21st, 2009, 04:56 AM
At first I thought, 'ah this isn't as bad as I thought it would be, he's not that bad a guy after all', and then I twigged that it's even worse. If had just slept with Emily pretending to be Young, he would probably have made their relationship stronger when they found out the truth. He's taking a slower but more destructive route, which I was surprised by. I don't think anyone saw this coming, it was either 'he'll pretend to be Young and sleep with her' or 'he's already having an affair with her'.

missmobius
November 21st, 2009, 06:41 AM
Agree, though Young is hardly an outstanding officer himself.

Telford should be removed from his position and court marshaled, for abusing his position and endangering the mission.

How is Telford abusing his position?
If Emily opens the "door" to him then she's the one cheating on Young, NOT TELFORD!!!

Remember to blame the person who took the vows and is breaking those vows, Emily took vows with Young, don't blame the "tool/method" (Telford) who she would use to break those vows with!

Emily should be at the end of Young's anger, and if it's true that Young had an affair with TJ while married to Emily then although Emily is "flirting" with having an affair with Telford and that is morally wrong, it's balanced by the fact that Young cheated on her.

BUT for sure Young taking out his rage out on Telford is totally MISPLACED!!!

missmobius
November 21st, 2009, 06:46 AM
Well both Young and Telford bear some responsibly for this situation. Unfortunately O’Neill cant punish them equally, there’s little he can do to Young but Telford associating with another officers wife is defiantly conduct unbecoming of an officer.

and Scott's conduct while on duty (screwing around) is okay right?

missmobius
November 21st, 2009, 06:47 AM
At first I thought, 'ah this isn't as bad as I thought it would be, he's not that bad a guy after all', and then I twigged that it's even worse. If had just slept with Emily pretending to be Young, he would probably have made their relationship stronger when they found out the truth. He's taking a slower but more destructive route, which I was surprised by. I don't think anyone saw this coming, it was either 'he'll pretend to be Young and sleep with her' or 'he's already having an affair with her'.

why is Emily getting off scott free?

She's a grown woman with a mind of her own, and if she's choosing to cheat on Young (and it's probably not even cheating because are they not separated at this point?)

So if Emily chooses to sleep with Telford it's NONE OF YOUNG'S BUSINESS!!! yeah it may hurt him but it's still not his business.

Asgard4eva
November 21st, 2009, 07:14 AM
this is gonna be a train wreck, its moving beyond realism and back into soap territory I am not enjoying this part of the show

Nindif
November 21st, 2009, 07:31 AM
I think Young got his point across.

The tone of the song following Young flattening-out Telford suggested to me this was the end of the matter from Youngs POV. He's a military officer, not accustomed to expressing emotion etc such as when Johansen tried to get him to open up in the closing scenes, he simply said 'bad day' and proceeded to vent his anger in his own way which worked for him.

However, i must say that during this ep, i found my opinion regarding Telford and his possible motivations swaying from total disrespect to one more open to consideration. His 'meeting' with Emily seemed quite friendly in a non-romantic/sexual way, just friends over to have some beers/socialize. They're both involved in this incredibly unique/unusual situation does it not make sense they would want to get to know one another?

Telford could well have abused his position and exploited Emily, or he could have taken disciplinary action against Young for essentially being victim of rape. Instead he seems to have taken the high road, something which has (not totally by any means) made me re-evaluate my opinion of his character. It was unfortunate the actual explanation of what Telford has told Emily regarding Young/Johanson on the ship did not eventuate, as this could be a key point to revealing Telford's ultimate motivations.

aretood2
November 21st, 2009, 07:37 AM
Well both Young and Telford bear some responsibly for this situation. Unfortunately O’Neill cant punish them equally, there’s little he can do to Young but Telford associating with another officers wife is defiantly conduct unbecoming of an officer.

Does this sort of thing tend to happen when there is no clear chain of command? I mean, it doesn't seem that there is a clear command. Who is in charge? Rush? Young? Telford?


Who is calling the shots?
I am not surprised of this situation. There is no reason why Telford should still be involved imo. Shouldn't he be on some F-302 squad on board a ship or something?


I do belive the Emily and Young did wrong with having sex with Tleford's body. However this doesn't give Telford the right to mess with their relationship. Had the sex not been had, this would not be taking place.

missmobius
November 21st, 2009, 08:27 AM
I do belive the Emily and Young did wrong with having sex with Tleford's body. However this doesn't give Telford the right to mess with their relationship. Had the sex not been had, this would not be taking place.

I guess the same goes for Camile and her partner.

shipper hannah
November 21st, 2009, 08:37 AM
Telford's character just got interesting, in my opinion. I love that he was using his situation with Young to get closer to his wife. There was the implication that he lied to Emily that Young was still sleeping with TJ.

Mirel
November 21st, 2009, 08:38 AM
Uhh... yeah, sure...
..

Damn right I'm sure. This is getting stupid

ARealArchaeologist
November 21st, 2009, 08:42 AM
At first I thought, 'ah this isn't as bad as I thought it would be, he's not that bad a guy after all', and then I twigged that it's even worse. If had just slept with Emily pretending to be Young, he would probably have made their relationship stronger when they found out the truth. He's taking a slower but more destructive route, which I was surprised by. I don't think anyone saw this coming, it was either 'he'll pretend to be Young and sleep with her' or 'he's already having an affair with her'.

I agree, and I thought of something that could make it even worse. Telford leads Emily down this "rabbit hole", and then at the end tells her he has zero feelings for her, and only did all this destruction to truly ruin Young's life.

And to add to previous comments. I don't think Emily is innocent, but I think she is just being Telfords friend...for now. I do think Telford is manipulating her and past events have blinded her to this behavior. She won't realize until it is too late.

eliteaceman
November 21st, 2009, 08:46 AM
Telfords stratedgy is to get young motivated to return faster, take more risks, and do what ever it takes.

aretood2
November 21st, 2009, 09:15 AM
I guess the same goes for Camile and her partner.

They had sex?
Other than the kissing what they did was no where as bad
as the telford situation.

leanbarton
November 21st, 2009, 11:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by missmobius
I guess the same goes for Camile and her partner.




They had sex?
Other than the kissing what they did was no where as bad
as the telford situation.

The poster is just assuming. However, if I were put in that position, hugging and maybe kissing would be enough. It would be just too weird to totally make out with a stranger that is really your husband/wife.

Also, it seems Emily has no idea Telford and Young swapped bodies during sex. Telford must be somehwat flattered that she would have sex with his body, so he's looking for more.

amconway
November 21st, 2009, 11:56 AM
I'm already desperately bored of the love quadrangle, appalled by everyone's abysmal behavior (well, except TJ), and fairly shocked that Young seems to be able to switch bodies any time he pleases for private reasons. All semblance of military protocal seems to have gone out the window, both on the ship, and at the SGC.

At least it was balanced by the charming and believable relationship between Camille and her partner.

Nemises
November 21st, 2009, 12:02 PM
How is Telford abusing his position?
If Emily opens the "door" to him then she's the one cheating on Young, NOT TELFORD!!!

Remember to blame the person who took the vows and is breaking those vows, Emily took vows with Young, don't blame the "tool/method" (Telford) who she would use to break those vows with!

Emily should be at the end of Young's anger, and if it's true that Young had an affair with TJ while married to Emily then although Emily is "flirting" with having an affair with Telford and that is morally wrong, it's balanced by the fact that Young cheated on her.

BUT for sure Young taking out his rage out on Telford is totally MISPLACED!!!

My thoughts exactly.

amconway
November 21st, 2009, 12:09 PM
How is Telford abusing his position?
If Emily opens the "door" to him then she's the one cheating on Young, NOT TELFORD!!!

Remember to blame the person who took the vows and is breaking those vows, Emily took vows with Young, don't blame the "tool/method" (Telford) who she would use to break those vows with!

Emily should be at the end of Young's anger, and if it's true that Young had an affair with TJ while married to Emily then although Emily is "flirting" with having an affair with Telford and that is morally wrong, it's balanced by the fact that Young cheated on her.

BUT for sure Young taking out his rage out on Telford is totally MISPLACED!!!

Young committed assult. That's bad. Telford is sniffing around another man's wife while that man is away, possibly in order to do damage to Young. That's also bad. Really poor form as both a man and a fellow officer, no matter what his purpose is. Young's wife is allowing a clearly dangerous situation to develop, and that's bad, too. These people are all selfish and emotionally stunted--also completely uninteresting to me.

missmobius
November 21st, 2009, 01:22 PM
Young committed assult. That's bad. Telford is sniffing around another man's wife while that man is away, possibly in order to do damage to Young. That's also bad. Really poor form as both a man and a fellow officer, no matter what his purpose is. Young's wife is allowing a clearly dangerous situation to develop, and that's bad, too. These people are all selfish and emotionally stunted--also completely uninteresting to me.

I've been at the short end of a spouse who takes on a lover, and although I wish the "other" woman would have had some morals herself (as she was married and also had kids) the blame was TOTALLY my X's not hers.

My X broke his promise/vow to me, she didn't,,, because I never had a "contract" with her,

She only broke her promise/vow to her husband.

I get all kinds of upset when people take out their anger/jealousy on the "other" woman/man and let their spouse/partner get off easy, i.e. Young should have walked into the house and confronted Emily not hit Telford, Telford did not hold a gun to Emily's head to force his way into her home.

Get it right Young, blame your spouse! Oh and the bit that "I was weak" bullcrap, it doesn't fly at all with me!

Emily is not such a nice person, if she honestly is "done" with Young, she should make it perfectly clear, file for separation/divorce and tell him she will be seeking out new relationships. i.e. tell Young to move on!

And I don't care how persuasive Telford would be, it's up to Emily to hold her ground if she intends to continue with her marriage with Young.

ARealArchaeologist
November 21st, 2009, 01:42 PM
All we know is that she is friendly with Telford at this point. We don't know that she has had any sexual relations with Telford. I really think at this point she is taking comfort in a new friend, and yes it is a male one, but that is of little importance. It's what will happen in the future, with Emily filled with misinformation (whatever Young did before, he is not doing it now).

amconway
November 21st, 2009, 01:46 PM
I've been at the short end of a spouse who takes on a lover, and although I wish the "other" woman would have had some morals herself (as she was married and also had kids) the blame was TOTALLY my X's not hers.

My X broke his promise/vow to me, she didn't,,, because I never had a "contract" with her,

She only broke her promise/vow to her husband.

I get all kinds of upset when people take out their anger/jealousy on the "other" woman/man and let their spouse/partner get off easy, i.e. Young should have walked into the house and confronted Emily not hit Telford, Telford did not hold a gun to Emily's head to force his way into her home.

Get it right Young, blame your spouse! Oh and the bit that "I was weak" bullcrap, it doesn't fly at all with me!

Emily is not such a nice person, if she honestly is "done" with Young, she should make it perfectly clear, file for separation/divorce and tell him she will be seeking out new relationships. i.e. tell Young to move on!

And I don't care how persuasive Telford would be, it's up to Emily to hold her ground if she intends to continue with her marriage with Young.

We don't know that she's engaging in anything more than an inappropriate friendship with Telford. At this point, the only ones we know are doing something truly wrong are Telford and Young. That doesn't mean that what you are saying isn't true, but we don't know that right now.

Azzers
November 21st, 2009, 01:48 PM
<rant>

People complain about all sorts of character's on this show, but honestly I don't have a problem with any of them except for Telford. I don't mean the man, I mean the character.

His behavior is, for the lack of a better word, cartoonish. He seems to have no internal motivations at all and is instead entirely consumed by some sort of fixation of Young. Yes, so he didn't get to go on the Icarus mission. AND?!? It's not like there's a case of mistaken fault here. Well that might be sufficient reason to want to be part of the ongoing mission, but it only barely explains the hatred of Young and gets really flimsy the second he starts actively trying to undermine Young's marriage.

And last I checked, if a commander is replaced prior to a mission, they don't keep the replaced commander around to second guess the decisions of his replacement while the mission is in progress. Besides, after the last aborted mission, I find it impossible that O'Neill wouldn't replace Telford, because it couldn't be more plainly obvious that Telford and Young hate each other which is extremely counter-productive and he can't replace Young. I'd also think Jack's personal opinion of Telford would have fallen through the floor when he learned of Telford starting the experiment and then running when things looked out of hand. Speaking of which (forgetting Jack entirely), wouldn't you get court-marshaled for abandoning your command in the line of fire so to speak? And I don't think the IOA would have any reason to care so I'm not sure you could use them as some sort of reason to stop Jack.

I actually like Lou Diamond Phillips, but they need to overhaul his character fast because even an antagonist needs to be understandable. The best villains are the ones who you can sympathize (or empathize is even better) with their motivations but totally disagree with their methods. Telford on the other hand is just some guy who seems to be around to screw with everything for no adequate reason.

And honestly, this complaint is nothing a few more reveals wouldn't fix, they're just going too slowly with them in regards to his character. Still, I'd caution against Telford doing much more in the antagonism department unless they're willing to pay off with his firing. A realistic show can't have unrealistic character situations. It completely messes with everything else. I believe everyone else is genuine in their own way. Telford feels like a plot device.

</rant>

The Mighty 6 platoon
November 21st, 2009, 02:25 PM
and Scott's conduct while on duty (screwing around) is okay right?

Never said it was but it is (at least in the British army) against Values and Standards to mess around another soldiers wife. The fact that Telford is a colonel means who should be held to an even higher standard.

Jhary
November 21st, 2009, 02:37 PM
it woud be good when O´Neill commandate to an jump follow team

Nindif
November 21st, 2009, 03:39 PM
<rant>

I actually like Lou Diamond Phillips, but they need to overhaul his character fast because even an antagonist needs to be understandable. The best villains are the ones who you can sympathize (or empathize is even better) with their motivations but totally disagree with their methods. Telford on the other hand is just some guy who seems to be around to screw with everything for no adequate reason.

</rant>

agreed. And i felt 'Life' went some ways to developing this complexity in his character in regards to his motivations rather than Telford simply being nothing more than a one-dimensional plot device which can be developed later in future episodes.

amconway
November 21st, 2009, 05:32 PM
it woud be good when O´Neill commandate to an jump follow team

You might want to say that again another way. It's not clear what you mean. Do you mean that you'd like to see O'Neill use the stones? If so, I suspect that won't happen. It would be a security risk for one, and for another, Jack really wouldn't want to do that if there's any way to avoid doing so.

ARealArchaeologist
November 21st, 2009, 06:15 PM
<rant>

People complain about all sorts of character's on this show, but honestly I don't have a problem with any of them except for Telford. I don't mean the man, I mean the character.

His behavior is, for the lack of a better word, cartoonish. He seems to have no internal motivations at all and is instead entirely consumed by some sort of fixation of Young. Yes, so he didn't get to go on the Icarus mission. AND?!? It's not like there's a case of mistaken fault here. Well that might be sufficient reason to want to be part of the ongoing mission, but it only barely explains the hatred of Young and gets really flimsy the second he starts actively trying to undermine Young's marriage.

And last I checked, if a commander is replaced prior to a mission, they don't keep the replaced commander around to second guess the decisions of his replacement while the mission is in progress. Besides, after the last aborted mission, I find it impossible that O'Neill wouldn't replace Telford, because it couldn't be more plainly obvious that Telford and Young hate each other which is extremely counter-productive and he can't replace Young. I'd also think Jack's personal opinion of Telford would have fallen through the floor when he learned of Telford starting the experiment and then running when things looked out of hand. Speaking of which (forgetting Jack entirely), wouldn't you get court-marshaled for abandoning your command in the line of fire so to speak? And I don't think the IOA would have any reason to care so I'm not sure you could use them as some sort of reason to stop Jack.

I actually like Lou Diamond Phillips, but they need to overhaul his character fast because even an antagonist needs to be understandable. The best villains are the ones who you can sympathize (or empathize is even better) with their motivations but totally disagree with their methods. Telford on the other hand is just some guy who seems to be around to screw with everything for no adequate reason.

And honestly, this complaint is nothing a few more reveals wouldn't fix, they're just going too slowly with them in regards to his character. Still, I'd caution against Telford doing much more in the antagonism department unless they're willing to pay off with his firing. A realistic show can't have unrealistic character situations. It completely messes with everything else. I believe everyone else is genuine in their own way. Telford feels like a plot device.

</rant>

I totally agree, Telford is over the top. And your reasoning is why I like Rush. You don't have to agree with him or his methods, but there is something compelling about him. I want to know more about him, and I don't hate him for any of his choices, sometimes I even find myself agreeing that it is the best way to go.

the fifth man
November 21st, 2009, 07:54 PM
I was just glad to see Young beat his a**

Same here. I got a good laugh out of that.:)

jcainhaze
November 21st, 2009, 10:59 PM
I was hoping he would stomp on him a few times when he was down.

shipper hannah
November 22nd, 2009, 05:45 AM
I'm already desperately bored of the love quadrangle, appalled by everyone's abysmal behavior (well, except TJ), and fairly shocked that Young seems to be able to switch bodies any time he pleases for private reasons. All semblance of military protocal seems to have gone out the window, both on the ship, and at the SGC.


I don't think you're necessarily supposed to like what the characters are doing. They're meant to be flawed.

beafly
November 22nd, 2009, 08:08 AM
flawed != interesting

... at least for some of us.

missmobius
November 22nd, 2009, 09:20 AM
flawed != interesting

... at least for some of us.

If I want flawed all I have to do is look around me, I watch TV (especially SciFi) to escape reality :)

amconway
November 22nd, 2009, 09:40 AM
I don't think you're necessarily supposed to like what the characters are doing. They're meant to be flawed.
Flawed yes, dull, no.

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 11:06 AM
My opinion on Telford is the only reason he is showing interest in Young's wife is to try to sabotage Young's relationship with her. I think it was implied by her last comment and angry reaction that Telford has told her that Young is continuing his affair with TJ. I think Telford’s conduct is reprehensible and possibly against Military Code. Young could tell General O’Neill the next time he sees him, but there may be an unwritten rule that officers are suppose to handle it on their own and not tell command. I don’t know.

Punching Telford out was definitely a case of assault, but imo, Telford deserved it and Young showed amazing restraint stopping when he did. Given the time that military personnel are routinely forced to be away from their spouses I strongly suspect that Telford’s actions would be viewed with the utmost contempt by his fellow military. Once word gets out why Young beat him up, Telford’s reputation should greatly suffer. It wouldn’t surprise me that given how vindictive and mean Telford has been to both Young and Grier that he is already not well liked.

Any Air Force Military please chime in if you happen to know what would really happen if something similar happened in real life. I would be curious to know.

JRDTECH
November 22nd, 2009, 11:35 AM
and Scott's conduct while on duty (screwing around) is okay right?

Scott didn't lie and manipulate anyone, like Telford did to Young's wife by telling here Young and TJ were still together behind her back. The only possible motive I can think for Telford's behavior is what if TJ and Telford were a couple and TJ cheated on Telford with Young. And not Telford is exacting his revenge. I really hope that's not the case though....that would be just too much soap opera BS.

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 12:01 PM
Scott didn't lie and manipulate anyone, like Telford did to Young's wife by telling here Young and TJ were still together behind her back. The only possible motive I can think for Telford's behavior is what if TJ and Telford were a couple and TJ cheated on Telford with Young. And not Telford is exacting his revenge. I really hope that's not the case though....that would be just too much soap opera BS.

I am not certain but I think Young may have replaced Telford as Icarus base commander. I think someone earlier posted that fact.

We know that Telford is going to be very pissed that he was made to look like a coward (deservedly) by Young in front of the Pentagon brass and that his experiment failed and nearly killed everyone on the Destiny. I don't think they know yet that Russ staged the whole thing. Once Telford finds out he will be even more resentful. Given Telford's apparent vindictive nature, that may be motive enough to try to hurt Young and what better way than to sabotage his relationship with his wife. There may be more earlier bad blood between them as well that hasn't been revealed yet.

I agree that if they reveal that TJ was involved with Telford that it would be far too soapy. I doubt that they will go there.

If anyone remembers from earlier episodes how Telford fits in to the whole SGU command structure please post as I can't remember if it was already explained. To my remembrance it hasn’t been clearly laid out yet.

KlaxxonBlue
November 22nd, 2009, 12:16 PM
Why Telford has not been reassigned, is beyond me.

I can't imagine that Jack is ignorant to what is happening between Young and Telford. Having him there is just exacerbating the situation. :mckay:

KlaxxonBlue

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 12:35 PM
What if Telford wanted Young to lose control and assault him? Maybe his visit to Emily was planned with the purpose of provoking a jealous reaction from him. Assaulting another officer and lying that it was him instead of Volker when he changed bodies could certainly make Young look bad in the eyes of the Pentagon Brass. It could further tarnish their opinion of him and result in the loss of his earth visitation privileges. It certainly would be a double whammy to Young. Telford could claim he just spent time with her as a friend. Although, I think those in command may suspect his motives and not believe him. We will have to see if they go down this route or not.

Wildrose-Wally
November 22nd, 2009, 03:50 PM
@ Blackhole

You either are watching a different show, or you have Colonel Young and Lieutenant Scott mixed up , please re-watch the show from the beginning to get the facts and names right.

Thank you very much. :)

mjwalshe
November 22nd, 2009, 04:27 PM
I don't give a crap what happens because his storyline shouldn't even be in a scifishow.

why? its not all rayguns and robots a lot of criticaly and fan aclaimed SF has relasionship aspects take Molly and Case in Neuromancer and Miz and Sharrow in AGADB.

Aurora24
November 22nd, 2009, 05:35 PM
Telford is really, really starting to annoy me. I wonder how he got put in charge of the Icarus base, let alone originally being meant to be put in charge of the mission through the 9th chevron, given the fact that he's a petty, vindictive coward. I'm amazed that he was still allowed anywhere near the LRC stone after running away during the failed attempt to dial earth. I'm glad Young had him placed under guard when he switched bodies with Scott. And it shows what a total jerk Telford really is when he went to Emily afterward and either outright lied or implied that Young was still having an affair with TJ. I was glad Young beat the crap out of him at the end of the ep. I'd love to see what would happen if Telford tried to report Young for assaulting him, I don't think O'Neill wouldn't exactly be sympathetic.

Colonel Sharp
November 22nd, 2009, 05:45 PM
Telford: I'm starting to love to hate this guy.

Myles
November 22nd, 2009, 06:17 PM
You know, this seems like crazy talk, but what if Telford is actually trying to do the right thing here?

Maybe he went back to the house at the end of 'Earth' to confess about what happened earlier. Perhaps Young's Wife appreciated the honesty and this actually built a friendship(NOT affair). The man has been in her husband's body and vice-versa, it's not like that isn't a good place to start a conversation.

Then, like with Scott did with him, Telford experienced a memory of Young's. Except, unlike Scott's memory of Telford, his momery of Young's was the dream of Young and TJ kissing on the Destiny. He thought it was real, so he told Emily out of respect, rather then to get at Young.

Yeah... crazy theory, I know.

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 07:15 PM
@ Blackhole

You either are watching a different show, or you have Colonel Young and Lieutenant Scott mixed up , please re-watch the show from the beginning to get the facts and names right.

Thank you very much. :)

Thanks. I did interchange the two names when I first started writing my post and didn't catch it as I continued. The names in the posts have been corrected.

What facts do I have wrong? I indicated that I am not sure how Telford and Young fit together in the Icarus command structure. If you know, I would appreciate the clarification.

Wildrose-Wally
November 22nd, 2009, 09:02 PM
Young was picked by General O'Neil to be the SG team commander for the away mission trough the 9 chevron gate. He turned that opportunity down and became the Icarus base commander.
Telford then became the SG away team commander, but due to the circumstances never got to go anywhere except back to earth, while Young "took his place" aboard the Destiny.

ARealArchaeologist
November 22nd, 2009, 09:16 PM
You know, this seems like crazy talk, but what if Telford is actually trying to do the right thing here?

Maybe he went back to the house at the end of 'Earth' to confess about what happened earlier. Perhaps Young's Wife appreciated the honesty and this actually built a friendship(NOT affair). The man has been in her husband's body and vice-versa, it's not like that isn't a good place to start a conversation.

Then, like with Scott did with him, Telford experienced a memory of Young's. Except, unlike Scott's memory of Telford, his momery of Young's was the dream of Young and TJ kissing on the Destiny. He thought it was real, so he told Emily out of respect, rather then to get at Young.

Yeah... crazy theory, I know.
I never thought of the residual memories angle, but it was just introduced this week. Maybe he does think he is doing the right thing...but I think the writers are taking the evil route on this one.

ARealArchaeologist
November 22nd, 2009, 09:18 PM
Scott didn't lie and manipulate anyone, like Telford did to Young's wife by telling here Young and TJ were still together behind her back. The only possible motive I can think for Telford's behavior is what if TJ and Telford were a couple and TJ cheated on Telford with Young. And not Telford is exacting his revenge. I really hope that's not the case though....that would be just too much soap opera BS.

I wondered about a TJ/Telford connection, she did know it was Telford in the body of Young, before he even said anything. It could also just be that Telford had feelings for her, or simplest that he just plain hates Young.

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 09:42 PM
Young was picked by General O'Neil to be the SG team commander for the away mission trough the 9 chevron gate. He turned that opportunity down and became the Icarus base commander.
Telford then became the SG away team commander, but due to the circumstances never got to go anywhere except back to earth, while Young "took his place" aboard the Destiny.

Where was Telford when the Icarus attack/evacuation occurred? Was he on Earth?

Wildrose-Wally
November 22nd, 2009, 10:23 PM
Telford was on Icarus when the George Hammond arrived with their passengers. When the base was attacked, he was in a 302 defending the base, picked up by the Hammond and brought back to Earth.

Blackhole
November 22nd, 2009, 11:12 PM
Telford was on Icarus when the George Hammond arrived with their passengers. When the base was attacked, he was in a 302 defending the base, picked up by the Hammond and brought back to Earth.

Thanks for the clarification. I didn't pay much attention to his character in the first episode. I remember thinking he didn't seem to have much of a role. I will have to watch the episode again.

jcainhaze
November 23rd, 2009, 01:12 AM
Telford must really be an idiot. I mean I know he's not real or anything but if someone was that unlikable it would very unwise to mess with another commander's wife regardless of his marital history. The marital history is none of Telford's business. I know Young isn't exactly a knight in shining armour but I'm still hoping to see Telford on the receiving end of more abuse.

Col. Von Neumann
November 23rd, 2009, 01:16 AM
I don't know about the rest of you, but, IMO, hearing about and seeing Telford getting beaten about is one of the greatest things. He deserves every bit of it. Even if he didn't sleep with Young's wife, he was trying to turn her against him.

FallenAngelII
November 23rd, 2009, 05:39 AM
Young probably acted without thinking. He probably didn't intentionally use Telford's body for technical rape. Telford most probably made up a malicious lie while pretending to be Young's wife's friend either just to make Young's life miserable or to get her to leave him so that he can horn in on her or possibly both. Because as far as we know, there's no possible way for him to know that Young and TJ are still sleeping together.

So while Telford's actions may not be illegal and seem less morally objective at first glance, when you look at the intentions behind the actions of the two, Telford is clearly the morally inferior one.

garhkal
November 23rd, 2009, 04:16 PM
What if Telford wanted Young to lose control and assault him? Maybe his visit to Emily was planned with the purpose of provoking a jealous reaction from him. Assaulting another office and lying that it was him instead of Volker when he changed bodies could certainly make Young look bad in the eyes of the Pentagon Brass. It could further tarnish their opinion of him and result in the loss of his earth visitation privileges. It certainly would be a double whammy to Young. Telford could claim he just spent time with her as a friend. Although, I think those in command may suspect his motives and not believe him. We will have to see if they go down this route or not.

That may be.. BUT we won't know till later on.
And how do you expect them to revoke his privileges to visit earth other than confining the body he in habits to quarters in the SGC?

Wayston
November 25th, 2009, 04:34 AM
Yeah I also got the feeling that Telford's actions were to provoke a reaction from Young to discredit his command. Visiting Young's wife was completely inappropriate, especially doing it over and over again (the visiting that is :)). He's not even supposed to know about personal data like the wife's adress as he has neither the right nor the need to know...

natyanayaki
November 25th, 2009, 03:24 PM
I think Telford and Young are equally wrong in this situation. While Young's wife is no Saint, I think both these men are using her. If Young actually loved his wife, then he would want her to move on, live her life...at least for now, since there's no real indication, when or if ever they'll be able to return home. While Telford's body was used in a horrible way, he should not be using Young's wife to get to Young, and honestly, how can Telford even think that he has the right to take command of the ship, he is not stranded on the ship.

Blackhole
December 4th, 2009, 01:30 PM
I think Telford and Young are equally wrong in this situation. While Young's wife is no Saint, I think both these men are using her. If Young actually loved his wife, then he would want her to move on, live her life...at least for now, since there's no real indication, when or if ever they'll be able to return home. While Telford's body was used in a horrible way, he should not be using Young's wife to get to Young, and honestly, how can Telford even think that he has the right to take command of the ship, he is not stranded on the ship.

You make an interesting point about Young and his wife, whether he should nobly walk away and allow her to move on. IMO, I don't think the right thing to do is all that clear. Obviously Young really loves his wife and wants to stay with her. He regrets his affair and wants very much to make amends and try to fix things up with her. I think he has the right to try. It probably comes down to how much she loves him. After a time if she does decide to move on, then he should respect her decision and let her go.

Girlbot
December 4th, 2009, 01:32 PM
I think that the bad blood between Telford and Young probably started a long time before , and now it's a bitter battle and Young's wife is caught in the middle of two ten year olds.

Dusk
December 8th, 2009, 04:07 AM
This is going to be an ongoing thing between untill one of them is dead I agree.

Haha, death is the only option?

Young's actions in my opinion are completely acceptable. Except, of course, that he continues to care for a wife who is either too naive or too much of a flirt to realise she is being played.

natyanayaki
December 12th, 2009, 02:35 PM
You make an interesting point about Young and his wife, whether he should nobly walk away and allow her to move on. IMO, I don't think the right thing to do is all that clear. Obviously Young really loves his wife and wants to stay with her. He regrets his affair and wants very much to make amends and try to fix things up with her. I think he has the right to try. It probably comes down to how much she loves him. After a time if she does decide to move on, then he should respect her decision and let her go.

I don't think it's so obvious that Young loves his wife, to be honest. There's a difference, I think, between loving one's spouse, and loving the idea of having a spouse. Young's "love" seems totally selfish to me, I think I'd be more sympathetic if he would give her a bit more space, even if he doesn't walk away...if he were a bit more understanding, and I haven't seen that at all. IMO, based on what we've seen so far it's all about Young, for Young. I find it to be selfish and manipulative love. And btw, just because Emily got into bed with Young (while in Telford's body) it doesn't mean they've reconciled, that she's forgiven Young. Many spouses who have been cheated on (especially women) have a hard time letting go of the emotional connection they have to a spouse, and the spouse who did the cheating is able to manipulate the situation to get their spouses into bed.

Btw, I wanted to state that I'm not simply sympathetic to Emily because she's the woman, if Telford and Young were women, and Emily was a man...I'd feel the same way.

Matt G
December 16th, 2009, 02:45 PM
I definately get your point about "loving the idea of having a wife" however there's more evidence that Telford was lying to Emily about Young and TJ's affair continuing than there is that Young is abusing Emily - hell people here have even argued that Emily is abusing Young by insisting that he should have quit the military for her.

At the moment I'm giving both Young and Emily the benefit of the doubt.