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Blistna
November 19th, 2009, 07:55 AM
During the podcast, Gateworld brought an interesting point up that I thought about and dismissed, which is why did Rush mention 4 ppl died, when he clearly didn't do that during Water? What if he knew, or suspected, how Scout would react, and was hoping he would do another "reboot" but with more information so they can be saved?

What do u guys think?

DigiFluid
November 19th, 2009, 08:01 AM
I don't think the comparison is valid.

In "Water", he was keeping Young and Scott focused on their task while on the ship TJ was dealing with a different problem. In "Time" the deaths were directly related to why Young, Scott, and Greer were on the planet. It was a kind of, "hurry the f up, guys."

Hallowed are the...
November 19th, 2009, 08:06 AM
I think it is pretty obvious that Rush is both a master manipulator and has a knack for self-interest. So the idea of him dangling death and danger in front of Scott, an affable and noble if a little gullible, soldier in order to prompt a specific result is not far fetched.

Also, when Eli interjected to tell Young more of the truth during "Water" Rush was preturbed. This time he was almost insistent that the details be broadcast.

However, as Chloe and the other deaths were not essential personnel Rush had little self-interest in doing so. It all goes back to his insistence on considering the greater good: I do think Rush wants the right thing to happen for as many people as possible - he just wants to make certain they happen for him first.

In that way I absolutely think Rush was very deliberate in saying what he said and when he said it. In fact, I think that about EVERYTHING that he says or does - even the Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid quote had a purpose.

Mongoletsi
November 19th, 2009, 08:18 AM
I do think Rush wants the right thing to happen for as many people as possible - he just wants to make certain they happen for him first.
It's not a bad philosophy; make sure you, and as many other people as possible are taken care of. The question is; in a Rush or A.N.Other situation, with both being of equal "worth", but Rush gets to decide... what would he do?

What would YOU do?

As I get older, I'm getting tougher. Ultimately, it's all very noble sacrificing yourself for somebody else, but you'd be dead.

thekillman
November 19th, 2009, 09:05 AM
i think it was double victory. rush told them that to hurry up. but also, knowing that the solar flare was due and well, all going offworld knew what would happen in a set amount of time. it was their backup, and i believe rush more or less meant, "forget the creatures and send a message back in time"

especially seeing as catching these creatures at night (when they're active and hunting) is suicide in itself.

FallenAngelII
November 19th, 2009, 09:34 AM
If he wanted Scott to do a reboot, he would've just told him to do a reboot. I mean, there was no reason for him to dance around it. In fact, that should've been their Plan B to begin with: If all else fails, send another KINO to the past.

Why would Rush be afraid of directly asking for a reboot? Or want to manipulate Scott into doing one? If Rush is so self-centered, he'd want Scott to return with the antidote no matter what. Because even with the reboot, that Rush died when that Scott failed to return with the antidote (presumably), thus dooming everyone on that!Destiny to disease-induced death.

Lightning Ducj
November 19th, 2009, 10:40 AM
During the podcast, Gateworld brought an interesting point up that I thought about and dismissed, which is why did Rush mention 4 ppl died, when he clearly didn't do that during Water? What if he knew, or suspected, how Scout would react, and was hoping he would do another "reboot" but with more information so they can be saved?

What do u guys think?


No, in "Water", Young and Scott had a task and the bugs on board were only indirectly related and would've been a distraction (or worse, Young may have abandoned the search for water for the immediate threat of the bugs)

In "Time", the deaths of the Lt.James, Chloe, etc... were directly related to the task at hand. It was important for Young to know the timing of the situation was very critical to keep any more from dying. I thought it was touching of Rush that he paused before mentioning Chloe...and he used her nickname. Rush understood the impact of what he had to say and seemed to be trying to be a bit sensitive about it.

I don't really see Rush as being any more manipulative than anyone else. As Eli said "everybody is lying".

Lahela
November 19th, 2009, 12:35 PM
TJ lied to Young in Water too... I agree that it was just an update on what was, in essence, their ("they" being the team on the planet) current situation and the need to get a wriggle on.

Blistna
November 19th, 2009, 05:44 PM
I see what some people are saying, and it makes sense. :-) But who knows!

AVFan
November 19th, 2009, 05:45 PM
I really doubt Rush would sacrifice himself even for an alternate version of himself. Rush does what's best for Rush.

KEK
November 19th, 2009, 05:49 PM
Been said already but yes, in Water telling Young would have slowed him down and might even have convinced him to come back, whereas if anything in Time telling him about the deaths would make them complete their mission even faster.

EllieVee
November 19th, 2009, 11:55 PM
I really doubt Rush would sacrifice himself even for an alternate version of himself. Rush does what's best for Rush.

Rubbish. Rush does what's best for the ship.

Where on earth in anything that he says or does do people get that he's self-centred and selfish? There is nothing to support that.

Mongoletsi
November 20th, 2009, 04:08 AM
Rubbish. Rush does what's best for the ship.

Where on earth in anything that he says or does do people get that he's self-centred and selfish? There is nothing to support that.
I think what happened was that in the pre-airing publicity material, Rush' bio implies he's got a secret, selfish agenda, and therefore insist that everything he does is for his own benefit.

Everything he has done so far seems to have worked out, and also it's hard to fault any of his decisions.

EllieVee
November 20th, 2009, 04:14 AM
I think what happened was that in the pre-airing publicity material, Rush' bio implies he's got a secret, selfish agenda, and therefore insist that everything he does is for his own benefit.

Everything he has done so far seems to have worked out, and also it's hard to fault any of his decisions.

No, his bio says he has his own motivations. There's nothing in there to say that it's a secret, selfish agenda and that everything's for his own benefit. Indeed, his actions suggest the opposite.

Mongoletsi
November 20th, 2009, 05:29 AM
No, his bio says he has his own motivations. There's nothing in there to say that it's a secret, selfish agenda and that everything's for his own benefit. Indeed, his actions suggest the opposite.
See? Even I, cynical opposer of some of the more idioitic notions around here, have sucumbed to the notion.

It's odd/depressing/worrying that folk have obviously decided the "own motivations" line means everything he does is to the detriment of the rest of the "crew".

blackluster
November 20th, 2009, 10:02 AM
I don't think Rush would have wanted the reboot because it would be an even bigger gamble than the one they were currently facing. Rush would understand better than anyone on the ship the insane number of variables that could go wrong in staking their lives on a message through time. Between that and the recovery of one of the animals, getting a land squid was the best option, even if everyone on the away team died and they had to send more people. Rush would have done that, Scott on the other hand couldn't bare the thought of losing both Chloe and Young, so he staked their futures on the gamble.

Captain Obvious
November 20th, 2009, 10:13 AM
No, his bio says he has his own motivations. There's nothing in there to say that it's a secret, selfish agenda and that everything's for his own benefit. Indeed, his actions suggest the opposite.

" His own motivations" could very well mean he has his own personal code and standards he follows, AKA " Always think of the greater good..." from water. Rush is a True Humanist, the needs and lives of the many being far more important than the individual. The reason he always says everyone needs him is because they actually do, and he gives himself completely to the ship and crew needs, forgoing sleep and rest in an unselfish desire to continue the mission and protect the crew.

Magnecite
November 21st, 2009, 08:05 AM
" His own motivations" could very well mean he has his own personal code and standards he follows, AKA " Always think of the greater good..." from water. Rush is a True Humanist, the needs and lives of the many being far more important than the individual. The reason he always says everyone needs him is because they actually do, and he gives himself completely to the ship and crew needs, forgoing sleep and rest in an unselfish desire to continue the mission and protect the crew.

I think Rush's motivation may stem from a more personal cause. He mentioned an afterlife being possible referring to ascension. He's had a tragic loss. It may be he is looking to correct something. He's on the Ancients ship with access to who knows what. When they were flying towards the sun he seemed uncaring of his own demise. I don't subscribe to the suggestion he knew they would survive. Whatever his reasons I don't really think he's a True Humanist, he may develop into one but I don't think that's what's driving him at the moment.