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View Full Version : Children Of Earth: What if it were a Doctor Who story?



Coco Pops
October 4th, 2009, 11:47 PM
Was that title a play on the movie "Children Of Men?" I keep wondering that.

But here lies my question. I know Torchwood is geared to a different audience, the episodes being more adult and such, but when I watched the first series the "more adult" stuff just seemed to revolve around sex and smut.

Anyway I digress... I'm wondering if the COE story had been a Doctor Who story would it have been written any differently, and would the Doctor have been able to save the day?

Just wondering what opinions, thoughts you guys might have.

COE isn't available in Australia yet either on TV or DVD stupid TV networks and licensing stuff. w*nk**s

Ashizuri
October 5th, 2009, 09:00 AM
Considering how clever the Doctor is, and that the solution to defeating the 456 was a simple "reverse the polarity" situation, I imagine the Doctor would have saved the day quite early on. Take out Stephen's death and rework Day 5 into something less bleak and hopeless and it could have been a Who story. Really, the only thing that made it a little too dark for Who was Stephen's end and the fact that the good guys didn't win, the bad guys lost. I mean, CoE was just a darker retelling of the Christmas Invasion.

Interestingly enough, my biggest issue with CoE was that, as a part of the much larger whoniverse, stories that take place on a global scale only work (IMO) if all the character's are working together, like in The Stolen Earth/Journey's End. The entire time I was waiting for Sarah Jane to show up, because you can bet that when her pint size protege's all stopped and started speaking in unison she'd have whipped out her sonic-lipstick and her alien detecting watch and helped team Torchwood save the day. *shrugs*

Dakota Bob
October 7th, 2009, 01:18 PM
If Children of Earth was a DW story, the amount of complaints the BBC would get would make them cancel the show, a story that dark for a show that has a large audience of younguns would not end well.

Coco Pops
October 7th, 2009, 08:16 PM
If Children of Earth was a DW story, the amount of complaints the BBC would get would make them cancel the show, a story that dark for a show that has a large audience of younguns would not end well.


Actually DW has a higher death toll then Torchwood.. I think COE would fit in there with some tweaking.

DigiFluid
October 7th, 2009, 08:20 PM
Actually DW has a higher death toll then Torchwood.. I think COE would fit in there with some tweaking.

That's because Doctor Who has about 30 seasons on Torchwood ;)

Zarius
October 9th, 2009, 02:05 PM
COTE has nothing on the infamous hand-crushing scene in Attack of the Cybermen...except maybe that little nose-bleed at the end;)

Coco Pops
October 9th, 2009, 08:47 PM
That's because Doctor Who has about 30 seasons on Torchwood ;)


Even the last 4 series of the New Doctor Who combined have a higer death toll then Torchwood. In "rose" for example there must have been hundreds of dead folk in that shopping mall when the dummies came to life.

Coco Pops
October 9th, 2009, 08:48 PM
Also how would the Doctor have dealt with the aliens of COE?

Pitry
October 10th, 2009, 03:30 PM
the problem with taking CoE and reworking it for Doctor who would have been exactly that - the Doctor HAS to save the day. Otherwise he's not the Doctor.

It could have been used as a great platform to show the Doctor's character as failing, as someone who is less than a hero.... but then you can;t do that and keep Doctor Who the same show. I mean, they have no problem whatsoever showing the Doctor is imperfect, but that's different to actually failing. And the Doctor's mistakes effect the whole universe, but on a different scale than what we see on Torchwood - when he fails big time, it's never shown on a personal level. I think this is the main reason we can never see more thn memories or glimpses of the Time War - the war IS Doctor Who's Children of Earth - and it would be very difficult to keep on making Doctor Who if its shown.

Coco Pops
October 11th, 2009, 06:01 AM
the problem with taking CoE and reworking it for Doctor who would have been exactly that - the Doctor HAS to save the day. Otherwise he's not the Doctor.

It could have been used as a great platform to show the Doctor's character as failing, as someone who is less than a hero.... but then you can;t do that and keep Doctor Who the same show. I mean, they have no problem whatsoever showing the Doctor is imperfect, but that's different to actually failing. And the Doctor's mistakes effect the whole universe, but on a different scale than what we see on Torchwood - when he fails big time, it's never shown on a personal level. I think this is the main reason we can never see more thn memories or glimpses of the Time War - the war IS Doctor Who's Children of Earth - and it would be very difficult to keep on making Doctor Who if its shown.



I like your thinking.

But on the other hand I like the idea of flaws. Making Dr.Who unbeatable and that he has to win all the time just keeps the Doctor in the realms of the impossible. He'd be a far more realistic character if there were a few failures. There are times when he can't save everyone but the sad stuff happens off screen as you say.

And I'd love it if they showed the time war and what happened that made it such a bad war and how far it had spread across the universe. Even the Gelf knew about the war in series 1 as did the Nestene... I don't think it was all the Doctor's fault you cant blame the failuure of the Time Lords to win on his shoulders alone. But I'd like to see that on screen.

Ashizuri
October 12th, 2009, 09:04 AM
the problem with taking CoE and reworking it for Doctor who would have been exactly that - the Doctor HAS to save the day. Otherwise he's not the Doctor.

I always thought, that while the Doctor always saves the day, he always loses as well. I mean, you can't look at Doomsday or Journey's End and say that the Doctor 100% won, not with the way things ended. Children of Earth was very similar, in that in the end the day was saved, but the good guys can't really count it as a win.

I think the main difference between the Doctor and Team Torchwood, particularly in CoE, was the Torchwood was completely removed from the main story and action for most of CoE, they were passive witnesses to the event whereas the Doctor, usually even when he seems like he has nothing left to fight for, would have fought to the death.

So I think, in making this a Doctor Who episode(s), they would have made the Doctor fight, because that's what he does, so even when he didn't 100% win he still would have been a hero.

Coco Pops
October 12th, 2009, 07:29 PM
I always thought, that while the Doctor always saves the day, he always loses as well. I mean, you can't look at Doomsday or Journey's End and say that the Doctor 100% won, not with the way things ended. Children of Earth was very similar, in that in the end the day was saved, but the good guys can't really count it as a win.

I think the main difference between the Doctor and Team Torchwood, particularly in CoE, was the Torchwood was completely removed from the main story and action for most of CoE, they were passive witnesses to the event whereas the Doctor, usually even when he seems like he has nothing left to fight for, would have fought to the death.

So I think, in making this a Doctor Who episode(s), they would have made the Doctor fight, because that's what he does, so even when he didn't 100% win he still would have been a hero.



And the Doctor would have found a way to have a face to face with the aliens and given them a chance to retreat.. He always gives the bad guy a chance...

Clone Doctor would have just found a way to get ride of them.

Ashizuri
October 13th, 2009, 08:52 AM
And the Doctor would have found a way to have a face to face with the aliens and given them a chance to retreat.. He always gives the bad guy a chance...

Clone Doctor would have just found a way to get ride of them.

Exactly. The Doctor would have found a way, he 's one of the most proactive characters that has ever been created. He would not have sat around in an old warehouse and watched the action through some nifty contact lenses and then cried "there's nothing we can do" when the bad guys put him in his place. IMO, CoE made team Torchwood look a bit silly and incompentent, though the three of them looked exceptionally lovely while being mostly useless.

Coco Pops
October 13th, 2009, 08:41 PM
Exactly. The Doctor would have found a way, he 's one of the most proactive characters that has ever been created. He would not have sat around in an old warehouse and watched the action through some nifty contact lenses and then cried "there's nothing we can do" when the bad guys put him in his place. IMO, CoE made team Torchwood look a bit silly and incompentent, though the three of them looked exceptionally lovely while being mostly useless.


Actually you raise a good point. Was there any way the aliens could have been defeated?

Ashizuri
October 14th, 2009, 09:09 AM
Actually you raise a good point. Was there any way the aliens could have been defeated?

Well, Jack did defeat them in the end, and I'm relatively sure that, considering it only took him a few minutes in Day 5 to figure out how to do it, if the government had just asked for Torchwood's help in the beginning instead of blowing them up, they could have found a way to reverse the polarity radio waves without having to sacrifice a child.

I personally didn't think they aliens were very well thought out. I mean, they can control children through their DNA/blood, can kill humans almost instantly, and have beaming/teleportation capabilities as well as a keen knowledge of Earth's time zones and children's play time and yet they had to ask us for children? It always kind of confused me as to why they didn't just gather a load of kids together and beam them up.

I know it probably seems like I'm completely trashing on CoE, but I really did like bits of it.

Pitry
October 14th, 2009, 12:52 PM
the Doctor would have lost something, definitely. But it can't ever be something as personal and as much his fault as it ended up - Jack lost his grandson, his daughter, his lover and even more important - a certain faith in humanity, seeing humanity at its darkest hour etc.

This thing can happen to the Doctor. Already did, infact, and I'm sure Gallifreyans at the end weren't noble, sweet people, either. But the thing is we didn't see it on screen. It can still happen to the Doctor and he'd be the Doctor - but the show won't be Doctor Who anymore... that's sort of what I meant.

As for the aliens thpught out or not, I have to admit I think it doesn't matter - the aliens are hte mcguffin. The real story was about people - Torchwood, Frobisher, the government - the aliens were just an excuse, so does it really matter whether they were thought out well or not :)

Coco Pops
January 30th, 2010, 01:19 AM
I think last night ws day 4 and in my interpretation the aliens seem nothing more then the galactic "neighbourhood bullies" Like someone said in th episode if they had stood up to them the first time around this would not have happened. They seem like the galactic bullies.

Sure on their first visit they only took 12 kids and give a cure to some flu thing, but how do aliens know aobut an Earth flu unless they had planted it there in the first place in order to secure their prize?

Which makes them little more then thugs and bullies. And bulles most of the time will back down if you stand up to them.

And who is the brains of Torchwood. surely with all their past encouters and stuff they would have realised if you inverted the silly radio signal you could drive the aliens off....

And didn't the Doctor establish that mind control is impossible to the level where one will kill themselves. He made that point with the Sycorax...

Ashizuri
February 1st, 2010, 08:37 AM
And didn't the Doctor establish that mind control is impossible to the level where one will kill themselves. He made that point with the Sycorax...

He also warned them that Earth was a defended planet, which it kind of turned out not to be. I think you have to completely disregard anything in Doctor Who for CoE to work.

Coco Pops
February 1st, 2010, 05:18 PM
He also warned them that Earth was a defended planet, which it kind of turned out not to be. I think you have to completely disregard anything in Doctor Who for CoE to work.


True...... But maybe the Sycorax didn't tell anyone else that warning and kept it to themselves. Or maybe Torchwood blew their ship up before they even got a chance to tell anyone else... Or maybe they just did not believe him, but left anyway, after all saying we got defeated by one lone man with a sword would possibly seen as "losing face" in the alien community....

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned it, and I possibly might have but it really bugs me that in thei first encounter they took a small group of kids in exchange for a flu vaccine. Hindsight is wonderful but didn't anyone at the time wonder how the aliens know about and can cure an Earth virus like the flu.......... Unless they planted it sometime ago themselves in order to present their trade and do their whole standover act....

Blue Shadowdancer
February 1st, 2010, 09:37 PM
I personally didn't think they aliens were very well thought out. I mean, they can control children through their DNA/blood, can kill humans almost instantly, and have beaming/teleportation capabilities as well as a keen knowledge of Earth's time zones and children's play time and yet they had to ask us for children? It always kind of confused me as to why they didn't just gather a load of kids together and beam them up.

I got the impression that they could have beamed up the children themselves perfectly easily, but they wanted us to gather up all the children for them, and make us partly responsible, especially in the eyes of the public. It's a fear tactic, and sets a precedent for us to obey their orders when they come back for more children.

Coco Pops
February 2nd, 2010, 12:48 AM
Was their ship hidden by some kind of force field or such?

Ashizuri
February 2nd, 2010, 08:20 AM
True...... But maybe the Sycorax didn't tell anyone else that warning and kept it to themselves. Or maybe Torchwood blew their ship up before they even got a chance to tell anyone else...

The Sycorax ship was destroyed by Torchwood and the Doctor said something about humans being the worst monsters of all. I was talking about the Doctor defending Earth, which he didn't in CoE.

nx01a
February 2nd, 2010, 03:08 PM
If it were a DW story, the Doctor would have detected the signal used to control the kids via TARDIS technology, gone to confront the 456 rep to give it a final chance, and Jack/current companion/random episode co-star would ultimately have to push the button to send the counter-signal [minus child conduit] from the TARDIS to destroy the 456 rep and get the others to leave Earth alone.
Remember: the Doctor turns people into weapons. ;)
Oh, and all the children of Earth would have started singing something from Lady Gaga.
"You know that I want you and you know that I need you! I want it bad! A bad romance!"

Coco Pops
February 2nd, 2010, 08:26 PM
If it were a DW story, the Doctor would have detected the signal used to control the kids via TARDIS technology, gone to confront the 456 rep to give it a final chance, and Jack/current companion/random episode co-star would ultimately have to push the button to send the counter-signal [minus child conduit] from the TARDIS to destroy the 456 rep and get the others to leave Earth alone.
Remember: the Doctor turns people into weapons. ;)
Oh, and all the children of Earth would have started singing something from Lady Gaga.
"You know that I want you and you know that I need you! I want it bad! A bad romance!"


OMG..... I so want to see that version of COE..... That's brilliant. :) Especially the ending with the lady gaga song.

Alan
May 15th, 2010, 07:41 AM
The Doctor would have dealt with the 456 in a far quicker fashion. He's got the advantage of having over 900-years space/time travel experience and the big plus of his TARDIS to take him to the 456's homeworld. He'd be able to deal with them at the source.

Coco Pops
May 15th, 2010, 09:10 PM
The Doctor would have dealt with the 456 in a far quicker fashion. He's got the advantage of having over 900-years space/time travel experience and the big plus of his TARDIS to take him to the 456's homeworld. He'd be able to deal with them at the source.

Whilst using the sonic screwdriver to reverse the polarity of the neutron flow :)

Alan
May 16th, 2010, 04:05 AM
Whilst using the sonic screwdriver to reverse the polarity of the neutron flow :)

Lol. Yeah, that and a kettle and a piece of sting and a wind-up mouse. :P

Coco Pops
May 16th, 2010, 05:48 AM
Lol. Yeah, that and a kettle and a piece of sting and a wind-up mouse. :P

Wow. The Doctor's a lot like MacGyver...

Alan
May 16th, 2010, 08:46 AM
Wow. The Doctor's a lot like MacGyver...

He is, isn't he...on a much bigger scale though. A universal scale.