Icarus Base attack

[Gmandex]

Why didn't the Hammond use it's Asgard beam weapons to take out the three Ha'taks? Why would the crew just let the Ha'taks demolish the Icarus Base?

[thekillman]

it was an ambush. whatever the case, the attackers were well-informed, managing to take out the APBW's and finding the base in the first place

[DaMulta]

Maybe that ship didn't have the beam weapon installed. We also don't know how much more advanced the enemies have gotten from the last movie of SG-1.

[Rise Of The Phoenix]

It just wasn't dealt with in Air.
Like the guys above have said there are two likely culprits, either the Plasma beam weapons were knocked offline in the initial attack or they weren't yet installed on the Hammond, apparently Joe Malozzi has said Air takes place shortly after the Atlantis finale, since it wasn't finished then and ready to engage the Wraith it's likely it still wasn't in a completely finished state, you know basic essentials for field work.

We still haven't been told exactly how they're produced or whether Earth has a matter converter outside of Odyssey so maybe they just don't the tech available on Earth with Odyssey being away on it's secret mission during Enemy At The Gate, although it did seem quite easy for Sam to modify Odyssey's transporters in Unending, so perhaps it's a case of the specs or whatever is needed to provide a template to construct them just wasn't available, not sure of a definitive reason TBH that's about all I can think of right now.

[RepliVeggie]

The ship wasn't finished. It didn't even have the shields our other ships have obviously. No Ha'tak not even Anubis' advanced ship could dent the shields.

[joeynox]

in the trailers they showed jack in the base sitting next to a wall during the attack but i didnt see him in the show on the base .

[Azriel]

The ship wasn't finished. It didn't even have the shields our other ships have obviously. No Ha'tak not even Anubis' advanced ship could dent the shields.

I highly doubt they'd install one type of shield only to then replace it with another type, it would make no sense. Those were Asgard shields, no doubt. As for why they were taking a lot of damage, well not using their APBWs didn't help, I suspect the most likely explanation was they were knocked offline in the opening stages of the battle, it's a little bizarre this is never stated on screen though.

As for the shields taking damage like that, bear in mind Hammond was ambushed, probably took initial damage before she got her shields up, she probably also had to hold position between the Hatak and the planet in order to 1). Shoot down attacking gliders and 2). Run interference in order to soak up some of the enemies weapons fire in order to protect Icarus base. This would require them to essentially sit there instead of taking evasive action.

It's also worth noting that a 304 has gone up against 3 Hatak before (Off the Grid) with similar results, in fact Odyssey took damage a lot sooner then Hammond.

Just some thoughts. But with the exception of the APBWs, I would say the Hammond was more or less finished. What puzzles me though are the unusually long travel times to a destination 21 LY away and the pink coloured HD window.

[the-alguroan]

the hammond stood there for six minutes after getting hit by the premitive attack, and the numerous gliders, which in my book is a partal win. just wish the hatack fleet had been bigger and they stated a reason for not using the APBW.

[Duke Flipside]

The Hammond definitely had Asgard shields, as halfway through the attack Sam reported "Our shields are holding". As for the beam weapons... If it's true that this is just after Enemy at the Gate, then the Hammond could have reasonably been pressed into service without them; the Odyssey might still be on that mysterious "top secret mission", and the Daedalus/Apollo/Sun Tzu might still be undergoing repairs. The Hammond's not going far, and it's only taking a few civilians to a secret base nobody knows about; all it needs is a basic interstellar hyperdrive (rather than the faster intergalactic drives). Worst case scenario the shields only have to hold out long enough for it to scurry back to Earth and the umbrella of the Atlantis drones. It's not like anybody's going to be blowing up planets...

[RepliVeggie]

I dunno if those were the Asgard shields. If they were then even 6 hours of Ha'tak fire wouldn't damage the shields. Those shields can take Wraith hive fire without much trouble. Ha'tak ships are about the least advance war ships in the SG Universe (pun not intended at first)

[Quadhelix]

I dunno if those were the Asgard shields. If they were then even 6 hours of Ha'tak fire wouldn't damage the shields. Those shields can take Wraith hive fire without much trouble. Ha'tak ships are about the least advance war ships in the SG Universe (pun not intended at first)

...except that, as already noted, the Hammond fared better than Asgard-shield-equipped Odyssey under similar conditions ("Off The Grid").

After all, "least advanced" doesn't necessarily mean "harmless."

[Buba uognarf]

The ship wasn't finished. It didn't even have the shields our other ships have obviously. No Ha'tak not even Anubis' advanced ship could dent the shields.

I dunno if those were the Asgard shields. If they were then even 6 hours of Ha'tak fire wouldn't damage the shields. Those shields can take Wraith hive fire without much trouble. Ha'tak ships are about the least advance war ships in the SG Universe (pun not intended at first)

Sorry but thats rubbish. We've seen Ha'tak weapons damage 304 shields before, in Off the Grid and the episode where the Odyssesy is captured. The Hammond lasted probably about 10-12 minutes against 3 Ha'taks which is actually quite impressive considering how long it takes Ha'taks to blow each other up.

For comparison in 'The Last Man' the Phoenix e.g. Hammond was virtually crippled by 3 Hives in less than a minute and half with only sporadic fire from each ship. So knowing this we can say that Hives have roughly 8'ish times the firepower of a Ha'tak which is probably about right.

Also remember our ships are all underpowered anyway so its perfectly feasible for 3 Ha'taks to heavily damage a 304 in 10-12 minutes.

The beams probably weren't installed yet as the initial attack from the Ha'taks didn't appear to be doing anything to the Hammond.

[EternalAlteran]

Well the beams were probably not installed, because there is no other reason why they weren't used. If the Ha'taks were closer to the planet than the Hammond, then it would make sense that they weren't used. Because a shot hitting the planet could cause the same event the Staff Canons did.

As for the shields, they are probably the Asgard shield on the other vessels. They were holding for most of the time without any damage to the ship. There were no sparks on the brigde and there was no damage to the exterior of the ships.

I though it was very strange that the Hammond only fired it's railguns once on a glider. They could have fired it constantly at the Ha'taks gliderbays.

[Azriel]

As stated, 304s can soak up the damage, but not forever. In Allies, the Daedalus hung in a firefight with 2 Hiveships for about I'd say 10 or so minutes, granted she took initial damage but I'm assuming her shields weren't initially damaged given how long they held to begin with. In Last Man, Phoenix stood toe to toe with 3 Hiveships for probably half that time. In Off the Grid, Odyssey took nearly 10% damage in the opening seconds of the battle. To the best of my knowledge, I cannot recall a single episode where we've held in a battle for longer then 20 minutes (Be All My Sins... may be an exception?).

I also refer to my earlier point about the Hammond most likely needing to sit in a stationary position (or near enough) between the enemy and the planet.

[Buba uognarf]

As stated, 304s can soak up the damage, but not forever. In Allies, the Daedalus hung in a firefight with 2 Hiveships for about I'd say 10 or so minutes, granted she took initial damage but I'm assuming her shields weren't initially damaged given how long they held to begin with. In Last Man, Phoenix stood toe to toe with 3 Hiveships for probably half that time. In Off the Grid, Odyssey took nearly 10% damage in the opening seconds of the battle. To the best of my knowledge, I cannot recall a single episode where we've held in a battle for longer then 20 minutes (Be All My Sins... may be an exception?).

I also refer to my earlier point about the Hammond most likely needing to sit in a stationary position (or near enough) between the enemy and the planet.

Massive exaggeration of Asgard shields.

I haven't actually timed Allies but in 'The Last Man' the Phoenix lasted about 1 min 20 seconds before she crashed and was largely disabled in the first volly.

The battle in BAMSR was very short, Rodney even made a comment on the plan not taking more than a minute.

Basically the 10+ minutes the Hammond lasted against 3 enemy ships was infact pretty good.