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GateWorld
December 14th, 2004, 08:59 PM
<DIV ALIGN=CENTER><TABLE WIDTH=450 BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=7><TR><TD><DIV ALIGN=LEFT><FONT FACE="Arial" SIZE=2 COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s8/815.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/graphics/815.jpg" WIDTH=160 HEIGHT=120 ALIGN=RIGHT HSPACE=10 VSPACE=2 BORDER=0 STYLE="border: 1px black solid" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#666666">DISCUSS ...</FONT>
<FONT SIZE=4 COLOR="#0066BF"><B>CITIZEN JOE</B></FONT>
<FONT SIZE=1>EPISODE NUMBER - 815</FONT>
<IMG SRC="/images/clear.gif" WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=10 ALT="">
A barber from Indiana confronts Jack O'Neill, claiming that he has been seeing visions of SG-1's missions over the last seven years.

<B><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s8/815.shtml">Visit the Episode Guide >></A></B></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

Shipperahoy
January 18th, 2005, 11:57 AM
I believe you guys are getting Citizen Joe today. D'oh! (I'm so sorry I couldn't resist. :D )

Thor's Gunner
January 18th, 2005, 11:59 AM
It was interesting, mainly clips of sg1, but the end was good, jack was quite amusing in parts.

Crazedwraith
January 18th, 2005, 12:03 PM
Sweet episode. A little loose at times but great sattire on the fans throughout. One negging point was the flashback at the end: They really couldn't make dsnny's hair look better?

Aside from that and the slighty ludicrous ending very good for a clip episode.

sshspooky
January 18th, 2005, 12:03 PM
great episode. Dan Castellanetta was brilliant.

Best Line was from Joe's wife, her opinion of the stories:

"Well, the team dynamic's not what it used to be..."


It was a well written episode that told an interesting story, and had a nice ending. Considering what's gonna happen in the last few episodes, this feels like a nice change of pace. now bring on the final 5!

Lightning
January 18th, 2005, 12:04 PM
it wasnt as good as atlantis' "clip" show but i was was hilarious how the show is able to make fun of itself the way it did
Like when one of Joes employees asked him why they hadnt met the furlings yet and that they sounded cute like ewoks
or Joe's wife saying that the stories lacked the character interaction that used to b present

double LOL at how Jack saw visions of Joes life for SEVEN years and didnt find it strange at all !!!

Ajayrious
January 18th, 2005, 12:05 PM
Hillarious episode.. i agree that "clip" at the end was awful, but other than that good show

TheBlueDragon
January 18th, 2005, 12:05 PM
i was about to watch it when the channel (sky one) went black and is still on now through atlantis meanin i miss both

Nee
January 18th, 2005, 12:05 PM
yep i liked the end too was good.
Im not into them clips from previous shows, it was alot better than ones ive seen before.

shaqarava
January 18th, 2005, 12:07 PM
I found it amusing when we found out Jack has been having visions of parts of the life of a babour in Indiana for 7 years and never mentioned it to anyone :D

Fox McCloud
January 18th, 2005, 12:10 PM
Fantastic episode. Very refreshing.

Loved the Furling in jokes, and the Jonas stuff.

Great ep. Loved it all
moebius spoiler
btw you could totally tell the clip of Daniel and Jack looking over the quantum mirror artifacts was new, because Daniels long hair seemed faked, and it looks just like it does in the Moebius pics ;) Tooooo...fasionable....and modern....rather than scruffy s1-3 DJ hair.

Teal'c
January 18th, 2005, 12:10 PM
Brilliant, brilliant episodes. Did I spot Damian Kindler when Joe was running down the street in delight? The funniest parts were the little in jokes for us:
- "When do we get to see the Furlings?"
- "Is she with child?"
- The whole Wormhole X-Treme bit
- "The team dynamic's not what it used to be..."

... and so on. One of the best parts is when Joe broke down after Daniel died. And he joy after he came back in Abyss. Oh, the following is to Shadow:

They do remember Jonas!!! :P

Frankly, Joe was pretty much doing the same thing I'd have done at the SGC :P

captianspiffy
January 18th, 2005, 12:10 PM
I thought this episode was great!!
it was really funny seeing Joe the barber telling all these stories, and how people reacted to the certian episodes he told, like 'Hundred days' when the woman gettin the hair cut asked if she is pregnant, at the end, i think in a way it said what the fans said about certian episodes.

such as when joe's wife mentioned episodes like 'The Light' or 'Sentinal' as some of the more weaker episodes.

how fans can prefer more character driven story lines rather than lots of action and how the character story lines became more weaker by season 5, and joe's reaction to when he found out daniel dies!! or when daniel revisits in 'Abyss' it was great!! how funny was it when he saw wormhole X-treme on the tv and it was canceled after 1 episode!!! lol

i was half expecting to see joe go through the stargate, im not sure y jack ended up telling joe's wife its all true, isnt that a major breach of security.

for flashback episodes, considering much of the main cast werent' even in it!! was a good episode, well done and nicely referenced on things like will we ever see the furlings, the reetou, alternate universes, anubis, etc

i think not only did the episode actually admit it had some great story lines, but also that it had some really bad ones, and the fact joe's friends basically said alot of stuff fan's have said about the series, like how many times can they save the world?!, just interesting to see a show actually have the guts to do that its not something u see everyday i dont think anyway.

thank u!!! :)

captianspiffy
January 18th, 2005, 12:12 PM
moebius spoiler (although how dodgey did daniel's hair look when they did the flashback to tbftgog, tho not actual flashback, it looked so greesy!!!! - hope it dont look that greesy in moebius)

blufeenix
January 18th, 2005, 12:16 PM
Good ep loved the satire and many nods to fans in there :D

Also the bits with tealc cracked me up joe greating him with the arm shake and also when he said didnt u used to be more golden ha funny.

As clip shows go it was very very good

Fox McCloud
January 18th, 2005, 12:18 PM
What i think TPTB were trying to get across with the whole "how many times can the go'ould attack earth" angle in the ep, is them relating to creating new bad guys in S9 and hopefully diverting away from "teh ev1l Gooooold!!!1"

And the Furling part could also be about them relighting old stories.

captianspiffy
January 18th, 2005, 12:25 PM
if we rekindle new plots, lets go deal with the reetou REALLY clear all old threads!! lol

i gotta say tho that
'burns as goa'uld, i can see that!!' how funny is that tho, gotta have a simpsons connection in the ep, i bet RDA must have loved havin homer on set

susanmary_1
January 18th, 2005, 12:36 PM
I had several laugh out loud moments! I thought the scene in the infirmary at SGC was really funny
"Don't worry I won't say anything about your feelings for ..." Carter walks in
"That whole Pete Shanahan thing" Carters face was a picture.
and when he asked Teal'c didn't he used to be a bit more "golden"!
Loads of in jokes for the fans, and I think I spotted a few familiar faces amongst the Grimm Brother removal men.
I loved the way Dan Castellanetta played Joe, you really believed he was devestated when Daniel died. I loved the way that the stories had the same titles as the episodes.
I also got the feeling that maybe they were having a gentle dig at how involved the fans get with the show.
I really, really enjoyed it.

captianspiffy
January 18th, 2005, 12:55 PM
did anyone notice that O'Neill's shoes were some sort of trainer type, platform sneaker type werid shoe, n not a proper dress shoe? least it didnt look that way to me....

Whitster
January 18th, 2005, 01:08 PM
(although how dodgey did daniel's hair look when they did the flashback to tbftgog, tho not actual flashback, it looked so greesy!!!! - hope it dont look that greesy in moebius)

Everyone seems to be moaning about the style of Daniels hair, what about the colour of O'Neills for ****s sake.

shelsfc
January 18th, 2005, 01:29 PM
That was the best clip show they've ever done!

Joe is SG fandom personified! Loved all the stuff people were saying about his stories - the team dynamic isn't what it used to be, Furlings sound cute, like Ewoks - ROFL!! Poor Joe when Daniel died!
Dan Castellanetta played him really well!

Nice that they did actually mention Jonas, but they could have thrown a clip of him in there...:rolleyes:

ROFL @ Jack seeing his life for 7 years and not thinking it was strange...Joe looked chuffed when he said it was relaxing!

Daniel's 'hair' in that flashback :eek:

Cute conversation between Sam & Jack on the phone, and loved the 'I won't say anything about your feelings for...' and 'about the whole Pete Shanahan thing...'

the dancer of spaz
January 18th, 2005, 02:14 PM
That was the best clip show they've ever done!

Joe is SG fandom personified! Loved all the stuff people were saying about his stories - the team dynamic isn't what it used to be, Furlings sound cute, like Ewoks - ROFL!! Poor Joe when Daniel died!
Dan Castellanetta played him really well!

Nice that they did actually mention Jonas, but they could have thrown a clip of him in there...:rolleyes:

ROFL @ Jack seeing his life for 7 years and not thinking it was strange...Joe looked chuffed when he said it was relaxing!

Daniel's 'hair' in that flashback :eek:

Cute conversation between Sam & Jack on the phone, and loved the 'I won't say anything about your feelings for...' and 'about the whole Pete Shanahan thing...'



Good deal! I am SO glad that they've managed to make every episode of this last part of the season A-rate!

mancslad08
January 18th, 2005, 02:17 PM
I found it amusing when we found out Jack has been having visions of parts of the life of a babour in Indiana for 7 years and never mentioned it to anyone :D
That was horrible!! I can't believe that, I SO wished they hadn't put that in.

Jack is now even more of an idiot than I thought he was. I think I may just choose to ignore what they said.

Sam fan
January 18th, 2005, 02:24 PM
Lets just say this now both Daniel and Jack's hair were awful! Lol that in itself made me laugh.

I loved the was that DC was us- all of us in differant forms. The people who think we should just give up now, the people who just want more and more and more.... there were also some really clever questions put in ones that we were all wandering i think it was a really brave step to do this and include teh critisisms and hey you never know a stargate producer could be lurking here right now. I loved the ep- i concidered iit to be shippy- i loved the first scene- how the hell do egg and beer go together? Again I loved seeing Jack at home and the scene with teh gun was SO FUNNY!! lol, his gun wasn't even real? who did he think he was ambushing? When he was meeting the whole team i was in stitches it was sooo funny!! I just loved the whole show 10/10 and well done at least we know they're listening wether they choose to do anything about those things however....

Fox McCloud
January 18th, 2005, 02:26 PM
"Hey...i keep having these....visons....of a Barber...kinda like...getting on with his life..." - Jack
"Your F**** crazy" - Everyone

*1 day later Jack is in a mental institute*

Thats probably why he didnt tell anyone.

mancslad08
January 18th, 2005, 02:28 PM
Meh, didn't like it too much. Bit boring and repetitive. Definately prefered Disclosure for a clip show. Joe got VERY annoying after a while, and as I said, that whole thing about Jack having visions of Joe's life for the past 7-8 years was ridiculous.

4/10

jantreeuk1
January 18th, 2005, 02:34 PM
Sorry just can't see it. As far as I am concerned that was rubbish. I will watch it again as I always give them a second chance but I already knew the story, have the dvds so do not need clips and didn't like Joe, his wife or his son who obviously had a nannite induced growth spurt. I know it picked up on lots of the fans sayings and questions but the first laugh it got from me was about three quarters of the way through when Daniel first came in and exchanged with Jack about his security. I have never given any episode a worse than 'good' but this I would give the 'worst episode ever'. I wasn't expecting great but my hope was that with Rob Cooper writing it might have been saved, but no. I'm sure the last five will see a revival but this one will not be on my regular viewing list. Can we expect a Simpsons based on SG-1 now please?
jan t

JackDaniels
January 18th, 2005, 02:38 PM
That was horrible!! I can't believe that, I SO wished they hadn't put that in.

Jack is now even more of an idiot than I thought he was. I think I may just choose to ignore what they said.

This. I will admit was my only gripe with what was otherwise a really great episode. Flashback episodes rarely have a story to them, let alone characters that you really actually liked and this one, while going through the seasons managed to have an actual story to it.

The part at the end where you realised Jack had been seeing these things for 7 years was lame to say the least (they could have simply explained it as a one way link) and was only saved by "You got game son."

There were so many parts I liked (I was going to try not to mention Daniel's hair in that clip but it was so damned bad that you just have to) so here's a run down of a few:

1. That the gun Joe was using was actually a fake ("But mine isn't!")
2. That he cried when Daniel died
3. How he reacted when he saw he was still alive in 'Abyss'
4. That there were comments on which of his stories were not as good as others (though i have to admit i actually kinda like 'The Light') and that the team had lost its dynamic somewhere along the way.
5. When Joe had to cover his tracks by saying that he would write more stories about the Re'tu, Lara and the furlings. (which i think we all wish for)
6. His greeting to Teal'c and subsequent mention that he wasn't as gold (though if i'm stil mentioning hair, i think it looked better when it was a little shorter!)
7. His guy in the barbers who couldn't pronounce 'Goa'uld'. Damn funny!
8. That it was discovered that Joe's memories had been coming when Jack was writing his reports. It made it much more plausible that he was able to write them down so easily.
9. The wormhole extreme bit was good, and a nice tie in, as you had to wonder whatever happened to the show (though i wonder what martin's doing now?)
10. When Joe greeted Sam and Daniel ('That Pete Shannahan thing?' and 'I'm so glad you're back with SG-1, not that there was anything wrong with Jonas')
11. When discussing that Joe had the Ancient gene "Just know that I'd be willing to sit in that chair in Antarctica and fire those weapons if you need me to!"

I would finally like to add that on top of this being a great clips show and a seriously interesting way of acknowledging that so many things have happened as well as some obvious thoughts of the fans, it was nice for more of the O'Neill Simpsons thing. "Goa'uld as burns' - i still don't get it.

Just two other things to add.

1. I have to wonder what was going through Joe's mind on three other occassions:
1. when Jack had the ancient repositories downloaded into his mind
2. when Jack was in the time loop
3. when he was frozen in antarctica - did Joe just have a couple of months break from the visions?

and finally, did anyone else notice how clearly visible AT's bump was in this episode. You couldn't see nothing in Full Alert, but it was clear as day in Citizen Joe. I have to wonder if they're just going to hide her behind a desk for most of the rest of the series, or if this was filmed further along the line.

and that's all folks!

Matt G
January 18th, 2005, 02:54 PM
There's not really much I can say about this ep other than the fact that it was a big mistake and goes one-on-one with Chimera for worst ep of all time!:(

I'm 50/50 on Jack having vision of an Indiana barber's life and not caring.

You can do better than this guys!

Davinder
January 18th, 2005, 03:23 PM
i was about to watch it when the channel (sky one) went black and is still on now through atlantis meanin i miss both

If it happens again, and it most likely will, pull the power supply from your satalite box, wait a few moments and re-connect it. After a few moments you should be back on air. It's not a sky transmission problem, its a sky receiver problem. ;)

There are several software bugs that cause the box to crash. at one point ours crashed every week at exactly two minutes past eight on a tuesday. bloody typical!!!

ana
January 18th, 2005, 03:27 PM
Good or not I´m dying to see it.
<mod snip>
ana

Sy~
January 18th, 2005, 03:41 PM
I was pleasently supprised by this ep. I thought it was great. Its much better than a politition threathening to shut down sgc. Ahh, happy memories.

The guy who plays Homer, nice guy pretty funny.

Sy~

Davinder
January 18th, 2005, 03:42 PM
Oh yeah, the episode :)

Like preperation H, it was very good on the whole.

A nice, laugh out loud episode that doesn't take itself too seriously before a three and a half parter and the two part season finale.

It relied a little more on clips, unlike it's atlantis equivelent, but I think there was much less reused material than in previous clip shows. Am i right?

It was a nice satire of the stargate fandom and the writers themselves, and it proved that TPTB do listen to our quiet little voices.

I admit that in the first ten minutes I got a bad "changeling" vibe (the only SG-1 episode that made me want to bury my head in a vat of symbiotes) but after a while it grew on me until I was laughing like a nutcase.

And as for Jack not mentioning the visions of a barber for seven years, its quite simple:
As a person who saves the world at least once a year and who's actions more often than not, effect an entire galaxy, it would not be unusual to think that he would phantasise about having a normal life. It would also not be unusual for jack to keep quiet about said visions for risk of being throwin in the special place for nutters who dream about barbers!!

That is my rambling done, I appologise for spelling, attitude and everything, one two many ciders :)

Calicto
January 18th, 2005, 05:05 PM
*waits for COMPLETE summary*

please?

Quinn Mallory
January 18th, 2005, 07:51 PM
For a clip show, this was a great episode. Lots of humour for the hard core stargate fans. I particularly liked that they mentioned some of the more obscure, forgotten episodes (Retu, 100 Days, Politiics). I did feel bad for Joe that his life soured that much and that is the main reason why I disliked that Jack had been seeing visions of Joe (although that sort of makes sense); so Jack saw Joe's life get turned upside down but didn't care to do anything about that? You would figure he might had stop by Indiana on one of his fishing trip to track down and help the guy.

Q

P.S. I didn't think "Holiday" was anywhere as bad as "The Sentinels" and "The Light".

Madeleine
January 18th, 2005, 08:46 PM
I cringed through much of it. I laughed out loud maybe three or four times, there were some really funny lines (The only ones I can remember are "you could try locking your front door" and "Alarm?"). But overall this is an episode I can definitely do without.

Buzz Lightyear
January 18th, 2005, 09:46 PM
I have decidedly mixed feelings about "Citizen Joe".

On the one hand, I agree that the writers were definitely catering to longtime fans with all the inside jokes and sly references regarding the "quality" of the stories. Dan Castellaneta was excellent -- with his natural voice, even!

Yet, as the annual budget-saving clip show, it remains to be seen whether anything significant comes from this episode. Will those two Ancient stone devices play a future role? Will Joe or the naturally-occurring Ancient gene have any importance now that [Atlantis spoiler] we have the ability to give some people the gene artificially?

If nothing really significant comes from this episode, then I would consider it a funny though ultimately forgettable puff piece and a waste of an opportunity to advance the series mythology and story arc in an already shortened season (20 eps from 22). Hopefully, at the very least, the references to the Re'tu, the Foothold aliens, Jonas, and the Furlings, are indicators that some abandoned storylines may yet see new life in season 9. If so, we may forgive them for showing a clip from Wormhole X-treme and for giving Teal'c, Sam and Daniel fewer original lines of dialogue than Joe's two assistants.

tara3583
January 18th, 2005, 10:07 PM
Very funny episode, loved the phone convo between Sam and Jack at the start lol beer in
omlates! and neither on of them having any thing on that weekend.

Loved the furling comment about "cute" and "fuzzy" and ewoks, i think tptb hang out on the
internet alot more than i thought!)

I could hear somtimes Homer's voice coming through and thought it funny that Joe was just
in a vest some of the time.

As a Sam and Jack shipper i loved that lst part
when Joe was telling Jack that he's knows about
Jack's feelings for----- and in walks Sam!

Just one thing wrong' i did miss seeing more of
sg1 through out the storybut other than that i
enjoyed it:)

lordvader
January 18th, 2005, 10:20 PM
That was one of the best episodes EVER !!!!
Dan Castellaneta, WOOOO!!!!!

And I loved the whole Furlings thing...
It's great that they can laugh at themselves like this :)

kashi
January 18th, 2005, 10:58 PM
I cringed through much of it. I laughed out loud maybe three or four times, there were some really funny lines (The only ones I can remember are "you could try locking your front door" and "Alarm?"). But overall this is an episode I can definitely do without.
Amen to that. Watching this episode was a big waste of my time. SG-1 has seriously deteriorated in season 8. Fortunately Atlantis is making up for it.

Anubis
January 18th, 2005, 11:01 PM
Generally, I'm not a guy that likes clip shows -- infact every clipshow they've done I've not even remotely like, though it certainly changed for Citizen Joe. :)

The great starter with Jack on the phone with Sam (:D) of course, that was excellent moment of *shippyness*, that lasted a few split seconds -- and when Joe burst into Jack's kitchen with the gun, it was really quite funny. :P

I loved the scene where the flashback of Daniel dying showed up, and Joe just burst out crying -- and again when he desended, he went jumping for joy. I understand his reasoning for going in search of Jack, though.

I liked the bit where Joe was talking with his wife and he says "they're battling over Antarctica now, Anubis's fleet is in orbit of the planet."

I found that when Jack said he see views of Joe's life to be a bit .. strange. Jack not saying anything to anyone of these views he would have had for a very long while.


Overall, I generally don't enjoy clip shows at all, they're either a love it or hate it episode -- for me this was a love it. ;) At least all the other less action packed episodes are all out of the way now. :)

Major Tyler
January 18th, 2005, 11:08 PM
It was okay. Definately not a fav.

EYU86
January 18th, 2005, 11:25 PM
One thing bothered me, 7 years ago Joe's son was like 7, maybe 8, then 3 years ago he was like 16...
Or he hit puberty really early :D

AlphaBlu
January 18th, 2005, 11:34 PM
The episode had a few nice pokes at both the fandom and the writers, but was otherwise a largely forgettable episode. It was better than Out of Mind, but, unlike the other clip shows SG-1 has done, it was a bunch of clips with a plot written around them, not a plot with a bunch of clips inserted.

It was as contrived as I thought it'd be, but it wasn't terrible. It hit some good emotional notes, and I especially liked him realising that Anubis' fleet was overhead right at that moment. I'm glad he hit the moments of Daniel's death and Daniel's return... but he never saw Jonas, unsurprisingly. On the bright side Jonas did get a mention, so it's not all bad.

It won't be one I watch again any-time soon. I am thankful they played it now rather than later. Allows us to ignore it and move onto better things...

BYE

IMForeman
January 19th, 2005, 12:29 AM
Stargate has always had something of a penchant for taking a run-of-the-mill clip episode, and making something truly entertaining. None of them, however, has been nearly as entertaining as "Citizen Joe." At times hilariously funny, or suprizingly touching, this episode shows SG-1 through the eyes of a real-life fan of their exploits, magnificently played by Dan "Homer Simpson" Castelanetta. When he collapsed on the front line with a heartfelt "Daniel's dead!!!" I honestly flashed back to how I felt when he died. They do get some quality self-mockery going on at times here, and yet there's also some decent continuity and a pretty effective, if small story. I have to say, I loved every minute of it. :D

"I know you look different with the hair, but didn't you use to be more gold?!?"

-IMF

Davinder
January 19th, 2005, 12:44 AM
For those who want a summery (it must have been a clip show as no one has done one and we are on page 3!)

Jack arrives home with beer and eggs talking to Carter on the phone. As he unpacks his groceries, a nervous looking man stumbles into the kitchen, aiming a gun at Jack, saying that Colonel O'Neill has ruined his life.

Flashback seven years ago, Joe and his wife are at a carboot sale (garage sale for our american cousins). He picks up a small, black stone, when he recives a vivid vision of a man rising out of a golden coffin by a round circular device (we all know it to be Kolrel coming out of the sarcophagus in WTSG at the end of season one)

Joe buys the stone and takes it home. He recives several more visions of a military team called SG-1, traveling through a device called a stargate.

Joe tells the story of SG-1 to his friends and co-workers in his barber shop. They are initially interested in Joes stories, as are his young son.

Joes wife is happy Joe is becoming more creative and says he should write them down. Joe has more and more visions of different points in SG-1's missions. Joe sends his stories for publication, but keeps getting refused.

Joe starts to belive that the stories are real, attempts to contact Colonel O'Neill, but eventually his friends, wife and son start to think that he is loosing his mind. Joe goes balistic when he finds his wife has thrown away his stone. He digs it out of the rubbish to receive a vision of Daniel dying. He breaks down in tears, then runs into the house to deliver the sad news to his wife.

His wife eventually decides they should spend time apart for Joe to sort his life and business out.

Joe becomes obsessed with the visions, and begins trying to gather evidence that his visions are real, including a photo of Colonel O'Neill out of the newspaper and cuttings from things such as the 'flashes in the night sky' seven years ago. He tries to convince his wife who is not impressed, expecially when he shouts saying Anubis is in orbit now and their very existance depended on O'Neill. He told her of the battle in antartica.

His wife walks away, leaving Joe with one other course of action.

He finds O'Neill and enters his kitchen, aiming a gun at him. Jack soon aims his own gun at the intruder who throws his replica away surrendering.
Joe tells jack that he knows he is brigadier general Jack O'Neill, who commands the SGC, he used to command SG-1 but now it is run by Lt Col Samantha Carter. Joe says how Jack was infected with ninites that made him age prematurely, how he likes the simpsons and isn't very good at table tennis.

Jack takes Joe to the SGC and they discover that Joe has the ATA gene which activated the stone, which was an Ancient communication device.
Jack's ATA gene activated an indentical device brought back from the planet where they found the quantium mirror in season one, and ever since, Joe has been experiencing parts of Jack's life. Jack has also been experiencing moments from Joes life, but has never mentioned it.

At the end of the episode, Joe arranges a meeting with his wife, who is not ready to hear more stories about General O'Neill, until Jack arrives and tells her that he has something to say.

Catysg1
January 19th, 2005, 01:11 AM
I realy enjoyed that episode ....for a clip show it's the best....it' light and it's true ..sometimes we just need to hear something else than Go'aoulds in a episode .

The openeing credit was really funny starting with the phone call between Sam and Jack ..very relaxed conversation starting business and finishing about food and drinks and plans for the week end , just to show that Sam and Jack can speak freely about other stuff than work ..To me that conversation was like a hubby and wife talking to each other . ;)

When Joe turns up in Jack 's kitchen ..so funny ..the fake gun

All the flasbacks were great ..was quite happy to see Skaraa...

I enjoyed the satire to the fans too ...like Don't we have anything else better to do ?
Enjoy the moquerie about their own show.
The short clip of wormhole extreme on TV was very good .


The child who still had milk teeth at the beginning of the episode and was probably like 5 ...grew very fast in 3 years ..he was in his teens 3 years later!!!! unless I missed a few years ...but I don't think so ....Bad on that :eek:

The infirmary scene was hilarious ...the feelings and keep them quiet scene ..and Sam's face when Joe started to talk about personnal stuff.
and when he saw Daniel back from Abyss and met him at the infirmary....I liked the Jonas reference too ..he can't be ignored and should be mentionned more often to be honest ...would like Jonas in season 9 .


The Jack having vision of Joe was a bit weird but considering that Jack has been through a lot of things and had stuff did to him over the years ..he may have thought it was a consequence of the stuff he got downloaded in his head along time ago ..Who knows!!!


I also loved that the stories were the titles of the episodes ...but I liked "The light" ..There were a lot of worse episodes than that even in the first 6 seasons .

I liked the reference to the team interaction not being the same anymore ..so hopefully they put all that back from Reckoning 1 ..and carry on with reckoning 2 , Threads and Mobius 1 and 2.

All and All ..A funny and entertaining episode that even my 10 year old daughter enjoyed ....good entertainment ....7/10 because it was still a clip show and I usually miss the Stargate itself . ;)

Caty ;)

Albion
January 19th, 2005, 01:31 AM
Now this is my idea of a clip show. Inventive, amusing, much more than just 'let's throw a bunch of clips in and hook them together with a bunch of people stuck in a room, going over a problem again and again and again in circular discussion, getting nowhere until we solve it in the last 2 minutes of the hour...' (can you tell I loathe Disclosure and Inauguration? <g>).

Above all, this episode was just plain fun with a capital F.

Loved the teaser and Sam and Jack's phone conversation, which had a lovely 'comfortable and familiar old friends' feel to it. Plus it was funny.

Joe was an engaging character to follow and his plight invoked sympathy. He was so engaging that I'll even forgive him for giving Jack and SG1 something to do over the weekend. Thereby negating the fact that Jack was apparently about to invite Sam over for to his place for an omlette surprise, given that neither of them had plans for the weekend. :p ;)

The whole episode was full of laugh a minute moments and wonderful sly in-jokes, reminiscent of Wormhole Extreme and with the no. of clips included, most of which were short flashes, rather than chosen for length, I did get the impression that this particular clip show was less about saving costs for the season than it was about producing a roundup of our heroes' adventures in their final year. (As they thought at the time this was filmed).

The scene in the infirmary was a joy. So many hilarious moments there. Particularly Sam and Daniel's responses to meeting Joe. And, again, all the injokes. But this classic Jack/Daniel exchange had me howling:

Daniel: He broke into your house?
Jack: Yeah
Daniel: Second week in a row
Jack: Mmmmm-hmmmm
Daniel: A-lar-um
Jack: I'm thinking dog
Joe: You could just try locking your front door.

The briefing room scene immediately afterwards was another gem. Loved poor Jack's dismay at the fact that every single one of his reports had been rejected by publishers. LOL! And everyone's reactions to him not finding his own insights into Joe's life over seven years particuarly abnormal.

Daniel's hair in that final flashback...urgh. <shudder> But I can overlook it because that's a sweet little Jack/Daniel scene there, with some nice banter and character relationship in it.

Add in a sweet end scene in which Joe presumably begins to get his life (and wife) back and I was left with a huge smile on my face as the end credits began to roll and the feeling of deep contentment that comes with having just watched a wonderful Stargate episode.

A huge thumbs up to everyone involved. You done good.

Quibbles? Well, now that Jack's solved the mystery of Joe's visions, maybe he ought to take SG1 and go investigate Joe's sleepy little town. There seem to be a heck of a lot of people not aging there in seven years. I'd take an especially close look at the kid who sweeps the floor in Joe's barber shop. Who somehow managed to stay a fresh-faced kid for the entire show. Maybe there's some snake acitivity going on there. ;)

And when Joe suddenly got a flash of Daniel dying and started to howl and cry - unfortunately right at that moment he sounded exactly like Homer Simpson to me and that distracted me from his pain and the poignancy of the moment. All I could think of was that he sounded like Homer bewailing the loss of donuts or something. But that's hardly the actor's fault. <G> And otherwise, he was excellent throughout. Utterly believable.

Okay, now I've read everyone else's opinions:


nd finally, did anyone else notice how clearly visible AT's bump was in this episode.

No. <g> In fact, when she walked into the infirmary, I was struck by how slim she was looking! Wonder if it was an illusion created by her wearing a larger than usual uniform?

And does every episode need to be a chance to explore the mythology? It seem so for some fans. There are plenty of such episodes every season. Can't we just take a few off for a little fun once in a while? It's called variety. I enjoy the mythology episodes. I enjoy the standalones. I enjoy the fun episodes. I think I'd get pretty bored if it was all one or the other every single week.

Oh and how could I have forgotten to mention:

Jack: First of all...Joe...I am not a terrible ping pong player!

ROTFL. Poor Jack - he looked truly deeply hurt by that one.

Oh and:

Joe's friend: They rejected Hathor?!? But...that was gold!!

Okay, now I'm off to watch it again before I remember more hilarity to quote. Could be here all day. <g>


Albion :)

Terok
January 19th, 2005, 02:15 AM
I wasn't too enthralled by this episode, and for me it just doesn't get above OK. But I wouldn't say this was a horrible episode or the worst ever because I found the satire of the show and its fanbase very amusing - The Furlings look like Ewok's, the exchange about Jack's security, Joe's wife naming episodes that weren't good, etc.

Glad I'm not alone in thinking it weird that Jack's been having visions of Joe's life for 7 years and didn't think to mention it.

Easter Lily
January 19th, 2005, 02:47 AM
*looks around suspiciously*

Eeeeeeeek... TPTB are lurking about on Gateworld Forum... they know too much...
Do they have security clearance?
:p

Albion
January 19th, 2005, 03:35 AM
Okay, back after a second viewing and just have to add one more quote that just cracked me up.

Joe: Okay, how about you do your chores and then I'll finish the story?
Joe's son: Chores?! What are we? Amish?!

:D

Albion :) (who thinks she'll probably be remembering moments from this one and chuckling for weeks to come)

David Dawson
January 19th, 2005, 03:36 AM
Loved the repo men "Brothers Grim Repo"......

D

FrankGuthrie
January 19th, 2005, 03:51 AM
It was great that they made fun of the show (fulrings, daniel dying etc...) but overall the episode was boring :(

TheWarrior
January 19th, 2005, 03:51 AM
Not a big fan of clip shows but this was an ok one.

Loved all the little in-jokes etc.

When Joe was telling the story about the astriod about to hit Earth - the one guy says "I've seen this movie - hits Paris!" which is what O'Neill said in Fail Safe :D

Its funny my mum mentioned the fact O'Neill should have an alarm fitted as he is an Air Force General and this week Daniel mentions it!

Lots of funny in-jokes, I was trying to spot them all. Nice use of Wormhole X-Treme as well, and as Hammond predicted it didn't last long on the air!

Also two Simpson references in there - have to wait and see if RDA appears in The Simpsons soon.

Whistler
January 19th, 2005, 05:00 AM
Well, I personally thought this episode was outstanding, Dan Castellaneta was fantastic, and it was full of in-jokes for both SG-1 and the Simpsons, I've noticed most of you didn't notice the Simpsons ones, like the scene with Joe awake in bed, and his wife curled up beside him, and Margerie at the Drugs store and Lenny at the Gas station, I'm sure there were more thant the wife said, but I'm not quite sure.

I loved the first and last scene, and the story really made me laugh out loud, as much as some others might have disliked this episode, I thyink it was fantastic! Well worth seeing again.

Albion
January 19th, 2005, 05:35 AM
As far as Simpsons references go, I just loved Joe agreeing with Jack's analogy of Burns as Goa'uld. Especially the way Jack was on tenterhooks waiting for Joe's verdict and his heartfelt 'Thank you!' when Joe agreed with him. :D

Oh, and I'm with the other poster who actually likes The Light. And Holiday and The Sentinel come to think of it. <g>

I'm definitely smitten with this episode. Watched it four times today and found more things to laugh at with each new viewing.

Albion :)

Hatcheter
January 19th, 2005, 06:10 AM
If anything, I wish they hadn't spent quite so much time on Joe's flashbacks. It was entertaining they way they poked fun at the show and the fans, but did it really deserve two thirds of the episode? Especially once they got back to Jack's house. Everything from that point forward was pure hilarity.

Madeleine
January 19th, 2005, 06:24 AM
Glad I'm not alone in thinking it weird that Jack's been having visions of Joe's life for 7 years and didn't think to mention it.

Although I suppose now we have a canon reason for Jack getting 'dumber' over the past few years: he's been getting visions straight from the brain of an increasingly unstable barber of the barber being repeatedly told the none of the SGC is real :rolleyes:

Albion
January 19th, 2005, 06:50 AM
I did feel bad for Joe that his life soured that much and that is the main reason why I disliked that Jack had been seeing visions of Joe (although that sort of makes sense); so Jack saw Joe's life get turned upside down but didn't care to do anything about that? You would figure he might had stop by Indiana on one of his fishing trip to track down and help the guy.

Why would he even think to? He'd have absolutely no clue that these flashes were real or that Joe existed outside of his own head. I can't see how it would ever occur to him that this was something real he was seeing.

I do wonder why he didn't seem to recognise Joe right off the bat though when he appeared in his kitchen waving a gun around. :D Maybe he did and was just keeping his cards close to his chest.

Albion :)

Lunar
January 19th, 2005, 07:36 AM
I actually quite enjoyed this episode. I found it quite amusing and I liked the (fairly) gentle mickey take of the fans and writers alike by Joe's customers and family. My only gripe really was the fact that for all this time Jack has, whenever he's been writing his reports, had visions of a barber and his life! And he never mentioned it! I mean, it could have been some sort of alien mind control technique... anything. You'd think that with all the bizarre security risks that the SGC encounters he would have felt obliged to say something. That was the only moment where it started to come unstuck for me, a bad script moment that really seemed to flounder. But overall, I thought it was (for a clip show! :P) very good.
ETA: Oh, and the repo men! Did anyone notice their jackets? Grimm Repo. I laughed. :o

Blend
January 19th, 2005, 07:41 AM
I will watch it again as I always give them a second chance but I already knew the story, have the dvds so do not need clips and didn't like Joe, his wife or his son who obviously had a nannite induced growth spurt.


1. Clip shows are normal in the seasons, and if ur a SG fan u know that. They dont care if u need it.. theres always a clip show near the end of the season.

2. You seem to have missed the point that it shows his life for all 8 years. The child didnt have a growth spurt.. he just got older. He would tell the stories as he saw them (aka as they happen). Pretty simple i thought..


Anyway - my comments: I did enjoy this ep. Ill give it a 6.5/10 in context with the rest of the season.. and a 9/10 in context with other clip shows.

EYU86
January 19th, 2005, 07:52 AM
2. You seem to have missed the point that it shows his life for all 8 years. The child didnt have a growth spurt.. he just got older. He would tell the stories as he saw them (aka as they happen). Pretty simple i thought..

You seem to have missed the little words on the bottom of the screen telling how many years ago the event occurred. When it said 7 years ago he was like 7, then it said 3 years ago and he was like 16.

Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman
January 19th, 2005, 08:47 AM
What a great episode! I loved it! I especially enjoyed all the in jokes :D Furlings, Jonas...and that scene in the infirmary (Joe's a shipper! :D:D:D:D) I was laughing all throughout. My favorite part though was when he broke down when Daniel died :D ROFLMAO!!!

It's really a show about the fans not SG-1 :D It was great, I'm gonna go see it again now :D

alz0rz
January 19th, 2005, 10:16 AM
lol hilarious, especially with Jack at the end..

and that little stone looked like the things the foothold aliens had on their chest..

my theory that i came up with before finishing the show was that.. you know how those little devices the foothold aliens had allowed them to access the memory of the likeness .. so see the connection? :D but that was destroyed when i saw the end

but great episode ;)

Furlings.. Jonas.. :)

Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman
January 19th, 2005, 10:46 AM
It's time for some QUOTES! Woohoo!

Hehe, "Brothers Grimm repo" :D I got these myself while watching :D



Sam: How about Monday Morning?

JACK: Nah I have a thing with someone of the CIA.A Johnson someone or other.It's about that whole Kinsey Thing.

SAM: So...any big plans for the weekend?

JACK: Oh yeah. Big. HUGE.

SAM: Yeah...me neither.

JACK: Wha? What are you talking about? I just walked in with a full *something* of ingredients for my world-famous omelette!

SAM: World-famous huh? What's in it?


JACK: Eggs

SAM: I don't think that that actually qualifies as a recipe.

JACK: Oh don't kid yourself, there's a secret ingredient I can't tell you what it is or I'd have to shoot you.

SAM: It's beer isn't it?


*****

Joe: You're Jack O'Neill.

JACK: Yes. Here's a better question. Who are you?

*****

JOE: What didn't you like about it?

Charlene: Don't get me wrong, it was excitinig.It's just that personally I like stories more about interpersonal relationships and a little less about things blowing up.

*****

Joe: Ok, how about you do your chores and then I'll finish the story?

Andy: Chores? What are we? Amish?

*****

Joe: IT's NOT CONFUSING, IT'S COMPLEX!

Client:[seen the shaking razor blade in Joe's hand] yeah...edge of my seat the whole time.

*****

Charlene: [...]You're seeking immortality through creativity.

JOE: Honey, we can't afford a sports car.

CHARLENE: It's good thing. At least you won't be having an affair with a younger woman.

*****

BErt: The Asguard? Those little grey guys! Right!

*****

Bert: What about the Furlings? Are we ever gonna hear about them?

*****

Gordy: Furlings? That sounds cute. Like Ewoks.

*****

Cindy: That poor woman [LAira] Do you think she was with child?

JOE: You'll just have to wait until the sequel.

****

Gordy: See. I'm not sure you should have sent in this one about Seth. It wasn't one of your best.

Bert: They rejected "Hathor"?! Oh but it was gold!

****

Andy: Dad! You gotta see this!

TV: Prepare for an Xtreme adventure!... [Wormhole Xtreme trailer] :D

Andy: There's no such thing as original thought anymore.We're all just regurgitating the same old ideas
welding them into a giant melting-pot of mediocrity.


*****

client: Hey what happened to that lawsuit you guys were having against that show? What was it called again?

JOE: Wormhole Xtreme. Nah. I was cancelled after only one episode.

Gordy: Bad ratings

Bert: I liked it.

*****

JOE: SG-1 finds out there's a giant asteroid headed towards Earth.

CLIENT: I saw the movie. It hits Paris.

*****

CLIENT: Look, no offence but how many times can these people save the world from Apophis?
What's it up to now? five, six times?

JOE: This is about Anubis. Apophis is dead!

CLIENT: WHat's the diff?

******

CHarlene: Honey I need to talk to you.

JOE: just a second, I'm in the zone.

*****

JOE: Once I publish a story, land an agent, things will get better.

CHARLENE: 326 That's how many rejection letters you've received.

JOE: You only need one 'yes'.


******

JOE: You haven't even read them all!

CHArlene: I read "Holyday", "The light", "Sentinel"

JOE: Ok, I admit those may have been a few misteps.

****

JOE: On the whole they're getting better aren't they

CHARLENE: I don't know

JOE : What do you think the problem is? Tell me.

CHARLENE: Well for one, it seems to me like the team interaction isn't what it used to be in the beginning

******

JOE: NO! *Sobbing histerically* He can't be gone! He's dead. Daniel's DEAD.

*****

Gordy *sweeps and sweeps*

Bert: Gordy, you're wearing out the floor.

****

Mailman: Call them up. Tell them what you know. If it's true...

Joe: are you kidding? I'd disappear in a heartbeat.Believe me. If the government didn't get me the NID is sure to. I've seen it happen. D'you remember Armin Sellick?

*****8

JOE: *sees scene from Abyss with Daniel and Jack in cell* YES! Yahhahaha! yes! YES! Charlene! You won't believe it! Honey it's incredible! Daniel's still alive!

******

JOE: Charlene, I don't nee a shrink.

******

Joe: Jack O'NEill is head of Stargate Command.

Charlene: THERE IS NO STARGATE COMMAND!

******


Joe: Oh my God! They're figthting in Antartica! For Earth's very survival!Anubis' fleet is in orbit above us right now!

CHARLENE: Joe, stop. It's not real!

Joe: You don't understand! If Jack can't find a way to use the Ancients weapon technology in time we're all dead!

CHARLENE: Good by Joe.
****

Jack: OK look. This obviously isn't your forte. [...] I know your gun isn't real. However mine is ((a gun in the kitched drawer? Paranoi? Justified I believe :D ))

****

Joe: You're Brigadier General Jack O'Neill, head of Stargate Command at Cheyenne Mountiain. You used to command SG-1 which is now lead by Lt. Col. Samantha Carter[...] You have a thing for the Simpsons, Fishing, Mary Steenburger, the colour peridot and you're a terrible ping-pong player.

Jack: Have we met?

Joe: My name is Joe Spencer I'm a Barber [..] tell me it's real.

Jack: First of all Joe, I'm not a terrible ping-pong player.

*****

Joe: between you and me, I totally see the analogy. Burns as Goa'uld.


Jack: Thank you!

Joe: And don't worry, I won't say a word about your feelings for...

Jack: Shhh

Joe: This is such an honor! I don't know how to thank you for everything you've done for this planet. There are not enough words.

Sam: It's nice to meet you too...

Jack: Joe Spencer

Joe: I was particularly impressed that time you blew up that sun.

Sam:...well thank you. I had a little help.

Joe: and as far as that whole Pete Shanahan thing goes...*Jack stops him*
Dr. Jackson! Can I just say, Thank goodness you're back! Not that Jonas was a bad guy. But after all you've been through together you belong here with SG-1!

Daniel: Thank you... Jack?

Jack: He's a barber.

Daniel: Walk into your house?

Jack: yeah...

Daniel: Second week in a row.

Jack: Mmmh hmm

Daniel: Alarm.

Jack: I's thinking 'dog'.

Joe: You could try locking your front door.


******

Sam: Initial tests show that Joe posesses the same Ancient gene that you do.

Joe: And I want you to know, if you ever need me to work that chair device in Antartica in the defence of the planet, I'm there.

Jack: Thank you.

*****

Joe *to Teal'c* I know the hair makes you look different but didn't you use to be more Gold colored?

****

Joe: that's why it was so easy to write the stories! It was like someone had already done the job.

Jack: And you say they all got rejected?

****

Sam: Shouldn't General O'Neill have been able to see elements of Joe' life as well?

Daniel: theoretically, yes he would.

Jack: Bowling league? Thursday night?

Joe: You saw that?

Jack: You got game son.

Daniel: Wait a minute Jack. You've been seing parts of the life of a barber in Indiana and you never mentioned it?

Jack: yeah...

Daniel: you didn't find that the least bit odd?

Jack: Actually no. I found it quite relaxing.

Elite Anubis Guard
January 19th, 2005, 10:47 AM
i loved this for a clip(ish) ep. It was so funny having homer on-of all the guests they coulda used.

It was interesting seeing this guy put up with the visions and it was also interesting seeing ordinary people with the ATA gene. And the simpsons references where great.

It was also funny to see the writers take the mick out of some of the episodes, and jonas aswell, and the whole saving the world thing. Brilliant episode, my favorite clip episode from any show so far!

Tok'Ra Hostess
January 19th, 2005, 10:48 AM
What a blast! Hilarious! As one who once drove everyone around her to dispair from her constant state of fic reading/writing rapture, I could totally relate to Joe. :p

And didn't he make the ultimate fanboy?

You guys are getting better and better with the clip shows. Kudos.

animoid
January 19th, 2005, 10:53 AM
Time for a reaaally long (sorry, got carried away) review of:

"Citizen Joe" - The Lost Chronicles of SG-1

When watching "Citizen Joe" for the first time, I was instantly reminded of Star Trek Voyager's episode "Muse", where Torres crashlands on a planet and has to assist a playwright to please his patron so he will turn away from his warplans. So she creates a story by incorporating aspects of her life on Voyager into the play, and in the end the patron is pleased.
What happens in "Citizen Joe" seems much more negative at first: When Joe appears at Jack's house, he claims that Jack has ruined his life. Indeed, things didn't go quite well for him. But this is Stargate, and by the end of the episode we get the feeling that things will change again, this time maybe for good.

But the main similarity in the two episodes is their take on metadrama, the demonstration of storytelling itself. And they both do a real good job.
Artists sooner or later start talking about art. Strange? Well, not really. We all like to talk about ourselves, and art is a form of self-expression. When dramatists write about drama, it's called metadrama - a play within a play.

"Citizen Joe" is not only a great piece about the power of drama in the Stargate world, but a demonstration of the impact that fiction can have on us.

It shows how close the characters have grown to us over the years, that we can care about them in a similar way we can care about real life people.
It also shows what makes a compelling show: interesting plot, conflict, motivation - the essence of good storytelling. As Joe defends it: "it's not confusing, it's complex."
Throughout the episode a lot of little things are mentioned, some of them the same little things you often read here (GW forum) and elsewhere in the net. The fan reaction (astonishment, affection, admiration, but also criticism and dislike) to writer's decisions was nicely displayed by the various people in Joe's environment: his son, his wife, his customers and finally, also SG-1. He comes as close to the characters as you can get, with nothing in between, he can comment directly on their actions, feelings, relationships, even their (lack of) make-up. And gets a few puzzled looks in the process..
We as an audience can voice our opinion through the internet, but the interaction with the characters on a more direct level is left to the writers. So partly it's about what the fandom demands when they are writing letters, mounting campaigns, writing fanfic or reviews: being the muse. Participation. But as we can see, TPTB are aware of us, and they have intertwined our -sometimes very differing- opinions into an lighthearted yet insightful episode, thereby allowing us to join the story itself.

Elite Anubis Guard
January 19th, 2005, 10:53 AM
quotes, this episode was great for quotes, it was a really funny episode, this is what makes me love sg1 so much.

i thought it was just like jack to not think about imaging a barbers life wierd and the door thing-omg, you should try locking the front door. :D


one of my favorite episodes!

animoid
January 19th, 2005, 10:55 AM
Other stuff that didn't fit anywhere specific:

Continued beautiful use of footage without getting the feeling of a clipshow. I liked this style when they used it on Atlantis and they have adopted it well.
It was great to see some freakin' Goa'ulds again, even if it was just footage. Gotta miss the glowy eyes...

Hey, they even mentioned Jonas. :)

More funny things included Jack's line about his ping pong skills (heh, we know how that went), Dan Castellaneta in his Homer Simpson pose on the couch, then the line about people breaking into Jack's house (D: "Second week in a row. Alarm." Jack: "I'm thinking dog." Joe: "You could try locking your front door."). Also, good to know that Wormhole X-Treme now rests in the dark, deep hole where it belongs.

As a sidenote, I thought it was an interesting observation on the profession of writing: how a tv show can affect its writer when it slowly sneaks into his day-to-day routine and affects his family life as he becomes more obsessed with his characters and plots...

However, there are a few aspects I was not so fond of, particularly the explanation of how Joe could get the juicy details from O'Neill's (bullet-point free :D ) reports. While he could have known Jack's feelings when he was sitting over his reports, he couldn't have known about "the whole Pete Shanahan thing",
or the amount of gold on Teal'c's skin, as this certainly wouldn't be included. Unless O'Neill spent some time thinking about it. But I wont quibble over semantics, they managed to include a prop back from season 1 and made good use of the ancient gene.

What was with that telephone thing at the beginning? Remember Cassie's birthday in "Rite of Passage": Sam had to *buy* a cake instead of baking it herself, but now she knows the housewive's secret ingredient for omelettes? I couldn't believe it...

And the last scene...aaaargh. It's always the same: they're sitting at a public place and Jack is about to tell the story of "It's all true, you know. Yadda yadda". No-one has learned anything. On the other hand, the scene certainly looks nicer in the park than in the SGC, so I'll go with esthetics this time.

mancslad08
January 19th, 2005, 11:12 AM
That was one of the best episodes EVER !!!!


Errrrr.... no.

sueKay
January 19th, 2005, 11:31 AM
I LOVED this episode!!!!!!

Now we know why Jack's been progressively dumber! He must have thought he was a wacko!

It must have been kind of like Teal'c in Changeling.

LOVED Dan Castellanetta!!!!!

I'd give this episode 8/10!

darman
January 19th, 2005, 11:41 AM
i'm thinking that that whole thing with people looking the same after all those years might be a simpsons joke in itself

Major Clanger
January 19th, 2005, 12:00 PM
I'm really surprised at how many people loved it!!!
As a clip show, I suppose it isn't the worst - but... oh how much I hated this ep. It could be part of the general lethargy and apathay I'm feeling towards Stargate this season, but for me this was worse than Prometheus Unbound.

But I'm glad it has so much support. And Jack did look lovely at the end.

Galluslass
January 19th, 2005, 12:04 PM
I like this ep alot.

In fact, I looked upon it as a definate nod from the writers towards us. :D
Hell, some lines were straight out of this forum!!

Wasn't too keen on Dan Castana-whatsits at first, but he really grew on me. Boy, he looks like Burns outta the Simpsons!!! :rolleyes:

As I watched it, it seemed as if that's how it would be if one of us guys ever got onto the set of SG - the shippers got the Pete Shanahan line, the DJers got the 'you belong in the team' line, the Jonas fans got their mention and of course the 'teamsters' would lament the lack of 'interaction in the team that there used to be'...

Loved the scene with Joe's distress at Daniel's death - hell, no one actually DID that in the actual episode and so it was like the writers were giving us the reaction some of us wanted. OK, me then. ;)

Well written and a damned good Clip show. Thumbs up to TPTB. :D :D :D
You guys in the US will love it.
7/10 for me.

Tok'Ra Hostess
January 19th, 2005, 12:09 PM
I just had a d'oh! moment. Just realised why Jack, in the never-before-seen flashbackie clip seemed so out of it when he was telling Daniel that Apophis wasn't dead after all; he was having a Joe vision! :D

Did anyone else catch that or am I just really slow?

Also, I don't have a problem with Jack not reporting having Joe visions, because he probably had most of them while he was relaxing with a beer. :p

But it makes you wonder: did Jack see Joe telling everyone his stories? Did Jack imagine that Joe was his muse?

jantreeuk1
January 19th, 2005, 12:17 PM
You seem to have missed the little words on the bottom of the screen telling how many years ago the event occurred. When it said 7 years ago he was like 7, then it said 3 years ago and he was like 16.


Exactly I didn't miss the point at all just thought child went from young (looked about 6 or 7) to about 17 in the time span which cleverly included clips from the point Daniel found the stone to present, ie about 6 years. By the way the new clip could have had Daniel with his arm in a sling to make it more authentic.

And yes I am well aware that Stargate has clip shows every season and I will watch said shows several times and really like Disclosure which at least had some of the cast telling the story. And am well aware there is a need for it financially.

However for the first time I feel cheated. Not because Dan didn't do a good job with what he did or that some of the lines weren't funny, but because I found three quarters of it exceedingly boring. Something my long suffering friends (yes I can relate to Joe) at work found quite surprising today!

Harlan
January 19th, 2005, 12:43 PM
Can't believe it !
A few hours ago, I saw Bruce Woloshyn (the Stargate Digital
Effects Superviser from Rainmaker) in "The Gift" [Atlantis 1.18]
===> See my post HERE (http://forum.gateworld.net/showpost.php?p=281728&postcount=83)

And now, I just saw Bruce in another cameo.
This time he's in "Citizen Joe" ! My God he's everywhere :D !

http://img137.exs.cx/img137/8832/woloshyn39ma.jpg

http://img146.exs.cx/img146/4181/woloshyn1xa.jpg

Dana_Jeanne
January 19th, 2005, 12:54 PM
Okaaay. I just finished watching this and I'm afraid I have absolutely nothing good to say about it all.

Jack's been having visions for 7 years about a barber in Indiana and yet he not only never said anything, but he didn't recognise his 'vision' when it showed up in his kitchen with a toy gun???

Someone said somewhere: either ship or get off the pot. The writers are playing games with Jack and Sam, and it's really getting old. Something Brad Wright promised was resolved and done with in D&C has turned stagnant and smelly. I don't care how they finish it, I wish they'd just do it, so we can get back to stories about the Stargate and the team, WHOEVER they end up being at this point, going through it. And leave the love lives of everyone out of the show!

Daniel talks too fast and seems to have acquired a strange habit of jerking and twitching. He's also turning into a sarcastic mini-jack and that's not a Daniel I recognise.

I don't llike episodes centering on guest characters, even if it is a clip show---especially if it's a clip show. I could care less about Joe and his family.

So Joe now has the ancient gene, too. Wow. Something that started out as mystical and totally awesome back in Fifth Race, Maternal Instinct and Meridian is now just a silly, convenient plot device. What a shame.

2 out of 10 only because Daniel was actually in this one.

When you send me my red squares, at least sign your name.

Dana Jeanne

Lt. Elliot
January 19th, 2005, 12:57 PM
Finally saw "Citizen Joe" Today. I'm ready to put out my opinion.
Things I Liked:
1. The weren't that many clips and they functioned well (as in "Letters to Pegasus" did)
2. A nice story with a happy ending in my opinion.
3. WORMHOLE X-TREME! We see it yet again!
4. I loved watching the clip of "The Lost City" with the battle over Antarctica - I was looking for MM's ship though!

Things I Didn't Like:
1. Joe's mention of the Simpsons and Mr. Burns as a Goa'uld in the end.
2. The episode tended to move slow from about the middle to close to the end.
3. The reaction of the people in the shop - I've hardly ever heard bad-mouthing of Stargate!
4. Joe naming all his stories after the actual titles of the shows.

Good Quotes/Moments:
1. The pronunciation of "Goa'uld" in the barbershop! Funny!
2. Joe's reaction to seeing Daniel in "Abyss".
3. Joe's other reaction to the battle while in the park.
4. "You got game, son!" I don't believe he's seen Joe's life and hasn't told us!!

So, I'd give it a 7/10. Pretty good for a "clip show", but nothing like "Letters to Pegasus".

Next Week: "Reckoning, Part 1"! Bring on the next 5. "Reckoning, Pt 1 and 2", "Threads", "Moebius 1 and 2"

Nurgle
January 19th, 2005, 12:58 PM
While I enjoyed this ep, there's one thing I don't get. If the stones only worked when Jack/Joe were in proximity to them, then how did Joe know about Anubis? Somehow, I doubt Jack had it in his pocket when he went to Taonas, or when he was frozen....

mancslad08
January 19th, 2005, 01:07 PM
Okaaay. I just finished watching this and I'm afraid I have absolutely nothing good to say about it all.

Jack's been having visions for 7 years about a barber in Indiana and yet he not only never said anything, but he didn't recognise his 'vision' when it showed up in his kitchen with a toy gun???

Someone said somewhere: either ship or get off the pot. The writers are playing games with Jack and Sam, and it's really getting old. Something Brad Wright promised was resolved and done with in D&C has turned stagnant and smelly. I don't care how they finish it, I wish they'd just do it, so we can get back to stories about the Stargate and the team, WHOEVER they end up being at this point, going through it. And leave the love lives of everyone out of the show!

Daniel talks too fast and seems to have acquired a strange habit of jerking and twitching. He's also turning into a sarcastic mini-jack and that's not a Daniel I recognise.

I don't llike episodes centering on guest characters, even if it is a clip show---especially if it's a clip show. I could care less about Joe and his family.

So Joe now has the ancient gene, too. Wow. Something that started out as mystical and totally awesome back in Fifth Race, Maternal Instinct and Meridian is now just a silly, convenient plot device. What a shame.

2 out of 10 only because Daniel was actually in this one.

When you send me my red squares, at least sign your name.

Dana Jeanne
Completely agree with everything you said. This episode was a horrible piece of crap.

As clip shows go, I'd say it was better than say, Politics, but that's it. Disclosure is still my favourite there because that actually had important plot points in it! As opposed to this which just has some guy (who I didn't even like) going around, acting like an idiot. I was bored after 10 minutes.

Season 7 was a ridiculous joke, and S8 started the same. The last 5-6 episodes though have been quite good (excluding Prometheus Unbound with Claudia Black: another awful character that TPTB have stupidly made sex-obsessed (in a VERY VERY childish and immature way), what is this The OC?

Luckily the remaining episodes of the season look to be quite good, so fingers crossed.

Everyone keeps moaning about Daniel's hair 'not looking right' in the flashback scene... erm, what about Jack's GREY hair????

I'll say it again, the whole 'Jack's been having visions for 7 years' made this already bad episode even worse.

PLEASE PLEASE LET SG-1 FINISH AT SEASON 9!!!!... While it has an ounce of quality left in it!!! I really dread to think what Season 9 is going to be like with little Jack, no Sam for a bit, Daniel aka Jack-Lite. Ben Browder (they should have brought back Jonas), and that horrible character Vala, no Hammond and no Janet.

Ugly Pig
January 19th, 2005, 01:09 PM
It's not confusing, it's complex!


PIGGY'S USELESS OPINION
of 'Citizen Joe'

Hm. I guess the writers decided to combine this year's clip show with this year's "humor" episode. And it works! The entire episode is really one big gag, but it's a great one. Bordering on self-parody, the show has as at least as many references to itself as 'Wormhole X-Treme' - which, we now learn, was cancelled after one episode (Heh heh heh!).

And the self-references don't stop there - far from it! As Joe tells his friends and family about the adventures of SG-1, he promises follow-ups to the Furlings, the Re'tu and Laira (though he doesn't reveal the answer to whether or not she was "with child"). ;)

I'd been looking forward to seeing Dan Castellaneta on the show, and he doesn't disappoint. Gotta wonder, though, why Jack doesn't notice that Joe Spencer the barber resembles the guy who does the voice of Homer Simpson? Especially after Joe reminds him of his Simpsons obsession (and even refers to the Simpsons reference in 'Lost City'!).

Random observations!
- Nice funny tie in with last week's episode when Daniel says it's the second week in a row that someone has broken in to Jack's house... :)
- References to Jonas, Pete, Hathor, Seth and, uh, Mary Steenburgen.
- Flashback to a time in which Daniel had his classic season 1 / season 2 long hair. Nicely done.
- So, admit it - who reacted pretty much the same way Joe did when they saw 'Meridian'? Come on, show of hands...
- So does this mean it was the NID who killed the reporter in 'Secrets'? Nice that they finally adressed that particular plot point which has not even been mentioned since it happened. (Missed opportunity: Joe was his source! We never did find out who it really was.)

Fun all around! A good thing too, because judging by the spoilers, it will probably be getting pretty serious from here on and through the rest of the season. Bring it on!

jantreeuk1
January 19th, 2005, 01:21 PM
While I enjoyed this ep, there's one thing I don't get. If the stones only worked when Jack/Joe were in proximity to them, then how did Joe know about Anubis? Somehow, I doubt Jack had it in his pocket when he went to Taonas, or when he was frozen....

It was mentioned Joe probably got the information when Jack was writing his reports with the stone sitting upstairs at the SGC, rather than actually going through the action, remember Jack was miffed that all the stories he/Joe had written were rejected.

Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman
January 19th, 2005, 01:21 PM
yeah...that guy Armin something who got killed. He was a reporter so he probably had ties with magazine editors and stuff. Maybe he came across one of Joe's stories and had previous knowledge of something going on (them pesky journalists know too much) and decided to investigate. Joe could very well be his unknowing source :D

Since they cancelled Wormhole Xtreme, maybe Joe could write a new series...closer to the truth ;) "Gate to The Heavens, the adventures of an Army team, GTH-1, as they travel to other planets and face the evil, Gor'alds and their leader Zeus!" Or something :D

the dancer of spaz
January 19th, 2005, 01:28 PM
...Daniel talks too fast and seems to have acquired a strange habit of jerking and twitching. He's also turning into a sarcastic mini-jack and that's not a Daniel I recognise...

Dana Jeanne

I know what you mean. Michael Shanks has great diction, and he delivers the lines in a very cool way, to say the least, but sometimes I have to rewind the tape or DVD, or strain to understand what he's saying. :o

Mostly, I notice Daniel talks too quickly when he's either explaining something with complicated historical references, or when he's being witty. Both are great parts of Daniel's character, however, so I just take the "fast-talking" as a part of Daniel's character. From what I've seen, MS talks at a normal pace. :D

Frostfox
January 19th, 2005, 01:58 PM
I enjoyed it. Not stellar but fun.

Liked Brother's Grimm Repro (a double pun - bonus points for that).
There is a great shot of Joe lounging in a chair in his vest where he is posed just like Homer.
The team banter was smashing and just for a moment, I really thought Jack was about to admit his love for Selma!

I think the writers were pretty even handed in their lampooning of the fans and of their own writing over the years.

Citizen Joe's no Benny Russel, but he was fun non the less.

Nurgle
January 19th, 2005, 02:20 PM
It was mentioned Joe probably got the information when Jack was writing his reports with the stone sitting upstairs at the SGC, rather than actually going through the action, remember Jack was miffed that all the stories he/Joe had written were rejected.

Good point, but flawed. Since Joe didn't always know how the "story" ended, it seems more likely he was experiencing it in real-time.

Ugly Pig
January 19th, 2005, 02:23 PM
I loved how you'll only be able to get all the jokes if you're a real Stargate geek. Like, how when Joe started telling the 'Fail Safe' story, the guy he told it to used the same 'I've seen the movie, it hits Paris' joke that Jack did back then. And how all Joe's "stories" had the same titles as their respective episodes did... :)

Ugly Pig
January 19th, 2005, 02:24 PM
Good point, but flawed. Since Joe didn't always know how the "story" ended, it seems more likely he was experiencing it in real-time.
It takes time to write a good report too, you know. :p

Watters87
January 19th, 2005, 02:59 PM
Great episode. Season 8 just keeps getting better and better. Dan Castellaneta did an excellent job as Joe. An excellent scene is where Joe is slouching on the couch and you hear and see the flashbacks.

[Full Alert and Threads] Have they changed Kerry's job from being in the SGC Oversight Committee to her working in the CIA because Jack at the beginning says he has meeting with a Johnson person about Kinsey.

Stargate Agent
January 19th, 2005, 03:38 PM
This was a great episode but one thing stood out as something why the show is suffering.

In the episode Joe's wife says "the team interaction isn't what it used to be " THAT pretty much describes season 8 thus far. Offworld missions are very few and far between!!!

The storys are thus getting weaker and weaker!!!!!!!

This was a good episode tho...

Ace
January 19th, 2005, 06:26 PM
I wonder what the range is on those Ancient Long Range Communicators? I.E. the stones... If it's Galaxies, which I suppose it could be because it's all having to do with the mind and the subconscious, they should take one of the stones to Atlantis.

Atlantis and the SGC could be in constant communication as long as they wrote down what they needed to say. I think the way Daniel explained it, was that it could communicate it through feelings and emotions, right? Not sure, I'll have to go and take a second look.

But that would sure come in handy! Talk about stumbling across some valuable piece of technology...looks like the SGC achieved thier standing orders alot earlier than we thought they did.

Ace

Brassguy
January 19th, 2005, 07:16 PM
poor martin!

Wormhole X-Treme got cancelled after the first episode!

And if this Joe guy viewed all jack's mission reports and images of the missions, why nothing about martin loyd, etc.


Martin is kind similar to Joe in many ways. Only Joe is no alien.

Joe thinks that someone ripped HIM off, lol.

What is Martin doing now then? He stayed to be with the tv show, but they tell us that it was soon cancelled.

EllieVee
January 19th, 2005, 07:36 PM
I thought a lot of it was very funny. The mockery of fans was very gentle, particularly the team interaction comment. I didn't have a problem with Jack having visions. My problem with it comes at the end when Jack meets Joe's wife (whose name escapes me for the moment). From what Jack says I think we're expected to believe that she gets told that it's all true. It's the same problem I had with Pete being told about the program. Whatever happened to everything being such a secret? Are they going to confirm the program exists with everyone who accidentally comes across it from now on as a way of breaking it to the public quietly?

Buzz Lightyear
January 19th, 2005, 07:59 PM
Good point, but flawed. Since Joe didn't always know how the "story" ended, it seems more likely he was experiencing it in real-time.

Real-time? Highly unlikely. Missions often took many hours, if not days to complete. If Joe experienced the missions in real time, he'd become positively catatonic. OTOH, it takes a much shorter time to write a nice concise report. Remember that Jack is only writing his reports from his own perspective and he might not actually know all the details himself.

Mr. Seven
January 19th, 2005, 10:09 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I'm sorry, I just can't stop laughing. This show was hilarious.

"Don't get me wrong, Jonas is a good guy, but..."

"If you ever need me in the weapons chair in Antartica..I'm there!"

This was great. Not only the lines, but the wardrobe changes of Joe. When he starts to spiral down a bit, he goes into the wife beater t-shirt under his unbottoned shirt. Then finally to just the beater.

Oh man I have to watch this again and go to the best parts.

kashi
January 20th, 2005, 01:04 AM
If the device only worked when they were in proximity of it, that means that he would have seen O'neill writing mission reports, not actually visions of the events as they occured. Major plot flaw. I'm very disappointed with this episode.

Albion
January 20th, 2005, 01:30 AM
While he could have known Jack's feelings when he was sitting over his reports, he couldn't have known about "the whole Pete Shanahan thing",

I was thinking this yesterday, but then I realised that he would have. Jack would certainly have mentioned Pete and his relationship to Sam in his report on the Orisis incident in Chimera. As for Tealc's 'colour change', it would depend what caused it. "Spoke to the medical staff today about Teal'c's 'condition'. They assure me this skin pigmation change is perfectly normal for a Jaffa of Teal'c's age...." :D Even if that one didn't appear in a Jack report, Joe was clearly also getting a visual - he knew what Jack looked like right from the start and asked the Air Force officer on the phone to describe him to see if the description matched his vision. So asking Teal'c about his colour seems naturally more to do with having seen him over the years, than anything written about him.

Actually, I think we're getting the wrong end of the stick here. I believe (would have to recheck the episode, but pretty sure I'm right here) that the fact that Joe was taking information from Jack's reports was only relevent to explaining how Joe knew about Jack's offworld exploits, away from the base and the stone. It wasn't intended to be a full explanation of Joe's visions, simply the offworld element. Obviously, Joe was also able to access Jack's thoughts and emotions. Which makes sense since we're talking about a psychic link. This is proven because Joe knew that Jack has a thing for fishing, Mary Steenbergen, and the colour peridot - hardly things Jack would be putting in his reports. Also that Joe was able to write fictional narrative into his stories which also wouldn't be in military reports - what Jack was feeling when he left Laira for example. Joe could have been speculating there, but it's more likely he got that information direct from Jack's brain. So I think it would be a mistake to assume that the only information source for Joe was what Jack wrote down in his reports. Obviously it was a combination of reports and Jack's thoughts and feelings that went into making Joe's visions.

This could also explain the seeming discrepency re. the battle in Antartica. That didn't happen offworld, but right here on earth. So perhaps that time, Joe was getting the information directly from Jack's thoughts and feelings, in real time. Of course, there's still the proximity thing - it's unlikely Jack took the stone with him when he went to Antarctica. But maybe that can be explained by the psychic link between Jack and Joe strenghtening as time and years went by and they both grew familiar with the other's brain patterns. Perhaps as the years went by that link grew stronger naturally, meaning that the stone was less and less necessary as a conduit. Enabling Joe to sense Jack over a greater distance than he'd been able to at the start of the link.

One neat detail I liked, btw, was Joe's first vision not being from the Pilot. It would have been way too co-incidental that Joe picked up the stone at exactly the same moment Jack was recalled to duty.


What was with that telephone thing at the beginning? Remember Cassie's birthday in "Rite of Passage": Sam had to *buy* a cake instead of baking it herself, but now she knows the housewive's secret ingredient for omelettes? I couldn't believe it...

I'm not sure I understand your point here. You mean that Sam knew Jack's 'secret ingredient' was beer? That doesn't make her a cooking expert. It makes her a Jack expert. ;) She knows this guy backwards, including his love of beer. <g> So I don't find that particularly odd.

Christine, the 'something' in your quote of the telephone conversation is 'handful'. 'A handful of ingredients'. (Having played this scene endlessly for two days with a big goofy smile on my face, I know it back to front :D )


Have they changed Kerry's job from being in the SGC Oversight Committee to her working in the CIA because Jack at the beginning says he has meeting with a Johnson person about Kinsey.

Don't know about that, but I didn't pick up on this reference. If it's a reference to Kerry - cute! I have my doubts it is though. Jack's talking about meeting this Johnson person on Monday morning. Threads is three weeks away. It would be a heck of a long time to Monday. So I suspect it's just a case of them using the same name.


Albion :)

ElanaM
January 20th, 2005, 04:04 AM
Will those two Ancient stone devices play a future role? Will Joe or the naturally-occurring Ancient gene have any importance now that [Atlantis spoiler] we have the ability to give some people the gene artificially?

......


I know some have said that the plot did not advance but I saw a couple of things which have an impact later:

a as mentioned, Jack referring to meeting 'Johnson' on the Monday - Kerry Johnson;

b the fact that the stone Joe bought was found in Egypt and we know they go to Egypt looking for a ZPM in Mobeius. To me, they are taking a gamble that if one piece of Ancient technology was around in ancient times then there could be more on Earth just waiting to be uncovered..

Albion
January 20th, 2005, 04:08 AM
As I say, I think the episode timeline is hinky for it to have been a reference to Kerry Johnson. But it would definitely be a cute moment if it was. Jack all 'Geez, I have this dang meeting with Johnson, wish I could get out of that...' mode, is amusing given the viewers have foreknowledge of his future relationship with 'Johnson' and Jack doesn't. Would be a cute little detail there.

Albion :)

Mr. Seven
January 20th, 2005, 04:16 AM
SPOILERS RDA said something about a CIA Agent in Stargate: Behind the Gate Lowdown. He said-----
HIGH LIGHT BELOW TO READ

That they are going to show that Jack has been sleeping with a CIA Agent...

animoid
January 20th, 2005, 04:52 AM
So I think it would be a mistake to assume that the only information source for Joe was what Jack wrote down in his reports. Obviously it was a combination of reports and Jack's thoughts and feelings that went into making Joe's visions.
[...] But maybe that can be explained by the psychic link between Jack and Joe strenghtening as time and years went by and they both grew familiar with the other's brain patterns.


Sounds right to me. But still...I don't want to nitpick too much (because I rather like how the episode works regarding the link), but theoretically Jack should have had visions about Joe's various activities regarding his writing/the magazines, his attempts to contact Air Force, his troubled marriage...

This is why I found it odd when Jack admitted that he had visions for 7 years. Yes, about a barber in Indiana, but not a *normal* barber.



One neat detail I liked, btw, was Joe's first vision not being from the Pilot. It would have been way too co-incidental that Joe picked up the stone at exactly the same moment Jack was recalled to duty.

This was explained. Jack touched the stone in Daniel's office after returning from the mission where they found the quantum mirror. By touching it, he activated "his side" of the link. Even if Joe had picked up the stone around the time of the Pilot, he wouldn't have seen any visions because there wasn't anyone (yet) with an ancient gene to activate the other one.



I'm not sure I understand your point here. You mean that Sam knew Jack's 'secret ingredient' was beer? That doesn't make her a cooking expert. It makes her a Jack expert. ;) She knows this guy backwards, including his love of beer.


Probably. I will put it another way then: the beer thing was so obvious that Sam doesn't even have to know the slightest bit about cooking to figure it out. Satisfied? ;)

saxamoophone
January 20th, 2005, 06:05 AM
As far as Jack being "dumb" for not knowing Joe....if you look back at the episode, when he says "I'm Joe, a barber" jack has this expression that its' all starting to make sense (the dreams that is).

But keep in mind, if this is a device made by the ancients, it's very possible it was up to the user to control the device, hence, jack probably only saw the visions when he wanted to (so it's not like he was dreaming about joe all the time)

MajorSam
January 20th, 2005, 06:40 AM
k. I don't know if this has already been said, but if the Stargate program ever came out, wouldn't there be a massive problem!? They would have to get rid of ALL of Joe's written work, convince him not to tell ANYONE about it all. But then there's everyone he told. All of the people in his town (especially the hair salon people) All of the magazines and everyone taht he sent too (what, over 400 letters etc. he sent?) Especially with Joe going on about it being real the whole time, if they found out it WAS real...

Sure if the program went public people would find out a lot more, but all the specific mission reports and stuff would definately be classified...

.:Lemon:.
January 20th, 2005, 07:49 AM
I only just watched this episode yesterday and haven't had a chance to comment on it yet. I realy enjoyed it and I think it's probably my favourite of season 8. I think Stargate does really interesting clip shows. Most shows just put a bunch of clips together, but SG-1 has some good stories behind it and I really enjoy them (with perhaps the exception of disclosure). Anyways, Citizen Joe was a very good ep and I loved Joe played by Dan Castalenella, I thought he did a great job :p Some good humour in the ep aswell :D

Teal'c
January 20th, 2005, 07:53 AM
As I say, I think the episode timeline is hinky for it to have been a reference to Kerry Johnson. But it would definitely be a cute moment if it was. Jack all 'Geez, I have this dang meeting with Johnson, wish I could get out of that...' mode, is amusing given the viewers have foreknowledge of his future relationship with 'Johnson' and Jack doesn't. Would be a cute little detail there.

Albion :)
He doesn't meet her in Threads, he's already in the middle of a relationship with her by then.

Albion
January 20th, 2005, 08:07 AM
This was explained. Jack touched the stone in Daniel's office after returning from the mission where they found the quantum mirror. By touching it, he activated "his side" of the link. Even if Joe had picked up the stone around the time of the Pilot, he wouldn't have seen any visions because there wasn't anyone (yet) with an ancient gene to activate the other one.

Yes...I wasn't pointing it out as a nitpick that wasn't explained in the episode. I was saying it was a nice detail that they did it that way, which I enjoyed, because it made more sense. Seems you agree with me there. ;)


Probably. I will put it another way then: the beer thing was so obvious that Sam doesn't even have to know the slightest bit about cooking to figure it out. Satisfied?

Still not sure I understand what point you were making - especially as this statement seems to contradict your last one - but I'm not fretting over getting it explained, no. So, yes, very satisfied, thanks. :D

Teal'c - very true. Of course we have no way of knowing just how long the relationship has been going on until we see the episode, so it may still not fit in with this reference. But it certainly makes it more likely to have been a reference to Kerry, I agree. Although weren't the initials of Johnson's organisation mentioned by Jack different to the organisation Kerry is part of? EDIT: Just read Mr. Seven's post. Perhaps then, the name and initials of the organisation has been changed over the course of scripts drafts. Not unknown. Looks likely it was Kerry he was talking about then. So...she's CIA, huh? <g> Even more intriguing.
Albion :)

BJdavidLS
January 20th, 2005, 10:45 AM
Just wanted to let you know about a goof (or whatever they're called)
I believe no-one posted it before.

In the 31st minute when Joe wants to prove to his wife that O'Neill is real, he says: "Jack O'Neill is head of Stargate Command"
and about 20 seconds later
"Oh my God! They're figthting in Antartica! For Earth's very survival! Anubis' fleet is in orbit above us right now!"

At the time Weir was head of SGC and not O'Neill. Did they forget about her?? :D
I doubt that Joe already saw him as head of SGC at the time or he would have known about the Antarctica battle before that.

Ace
January 20th, 2005, 01:00 PM
Just wanted to let you know about a goof (or whatever they're called)
I believe no-one posted it before.

In the 31st minute when Joe wants to prove to his wife that O'Neill is real, he says: "Jack O'Neill is head of Stargate Command"
and about 20 seconds later
"Oh my God! They're figthting in Antartica! For Earth's very survival! Anubis' fleet is in orbit above us right now!"

At the time Weir was head of SGC and not O'Neill. Did they forget about her?? :D
I doubt that Joe already saw him as head of SGC at the time or he would have known about the Antarctica battle before that.


Or he saw it as Jack was writting his report about the Antarctica battle in which he was already the head of the SGC

Ace

sshspooky
January 20th, 2005, 02:52 PM
the what he saw thing is certainly confusing people but I think I can clear it up slightly.

when Joe was seeing things he was hooking in to Jack's thoughts and memories, not his eyes, so when he was seeing things happening, he was seeing Jack's memories which were on his mind at the time while he was writing the reports. When Joe was writting it was as if Jack's words from his reports were coming in to his head.

What we have to seperate ourselves from is thinking that what Joe was seeing was either happening real time or he wasn't seeing it, when really he was seeing it but after the event.

also, as far as his boy's age goes:

when first season he is about 8. 4 and half years later he was 12 or 13. then he was 13 or 14 the last time he appears. while he may look slightly older that doesn't really matter as some people look older the others at different ages, and his voice was quite high pitched, so it isn't something to really poke holes in.

mancslad08
January 20th, 2005, 04:11 PM
poor martin!

Wormhole X-Treme got cancelled after the first episode!

And if this Joe guy viewed all jack's mission reports and images of the missions, why nothing about martin loyd, etc.


Martin is kind similar to Joe in many ways. Only Joe is no alien.

Joe thinks that someone ripped HIM off, lol.

What is Martin doing now then? He stayed to be with the tv show, but they tell us that it was soon cancelled.
Someone's obsessed with Martin :D

Tok'Ra Hostess
January 20th, 2005, 04:19 PM
Jack would certainly have mentioned Pete and his relationship to Sam in his report on the Orisis incident in Chimera.

Not to mention all those other reports that Jack wrote about "that whole Pete Shanahan thing" - you know, the unofficial ones, the ones that ended up crumpled into wads in his wastebasket. :D

I bet we see mucho ship fic in the near future about Jack writing reports. :p :p :p

Skydiver
January 20th, 2005, 04:36 PM
this was rather funny

yep, they were, imho, poking fun at fans...but i enjoyed it

i chuckled more than once

arc/plot development 3
quirkyness 8
humor.....depends on your sense of...but i give it a 7

BJdavidLS
January 20th, 2005, 09:37 PM
Or he saw it as Jack was writting his report about the Antarctica battle in which he was already the head of the SGC

Ace


No, no, no. Can't be.
The last report he wrote befor Antarctica he wasn't head of SGC yet. And I believe Antarctica was the first report he wrote as head of SGC, so Joe couldn't have know about it before the episode of Antarctica, which apparently he had right when he wanted to prove Jack is real.

Anyway, I liked the episode. Kind of different.
Almost like watching something else. Joe was the star :)

Carbito
January 21st, 2005, 12:55 AM
lol, this may have already been pointed out but in the "daniel is dead" scene it sounded like Joe was using his Homer Simpsons voice!

Nathan
January 21st, 2005, 04:26 AM
"Bowling league Thursday nights?"
"You saw that?"
"You got game son!"

Also I loved what he did when he first met Teal'c, then asked him if he was more "gold" before. :)

GREAT episode!

Nathan
January 21st, 2005, 04:29 AM
No, no, no. Can't be.
The last report he wrote befor Antarctica he wasn't head of SGC yet. And I believe Antarctica was the first report he wrote as head of SGC, so Joe couldn't have know about it before the episode of Antarctica, which apparently he had right when he wanted to prove Jack is real.

Anyway, I liked the episode. Kind of different.
Almost like watching something else. Joe was the star :)
He still had to do mission reports. Daniel said he must have had the visions while Jack was writing the reports. Joe then said that must have been why it was so easy it was as though someone else was writing them. Jack then said "all got rejected huh?"

So even though he wasn;t head of the SGC early on he still had to officially record and report them.

KayMan2k
January 21st, 2005, 12:32 PM
I am not sure if this was mentioned yet... when they first showed Joe working in his barber shop, you see a calendar turned to August 1997 - or as you probably know - the month and year of when SG-1 premiered on Showtime :).

Whistler
January 21st, 2005, 12:43 PM
the what he saw thing is certainly confusing people but I think I can clear it up slightly.

when Joe was seeing things he was hooking in to Jack's thoughts and memories, not his eyes, so when he was seeing things happening, he was seeing Jack's memories which were on his mind at the time while he was writing the reports. When Joe was writting it was as if Jack's words from his reports were coming in to his head.

What we have to seperate ourselves from is thinking that what Joe was seeing was either happening real time or he wasn't seeing it, when really he was seeing it but after the event.

In that case the caption saying "Last Year" would have been incorrectly placed, correct? Unless they are saying that New Order takes place in the past aswell?

the dancer of spaz
January 21st, 2005, 12:44 PM
I am not sure if this was mentioned yet... when they first showed Joe working in his barber shop, you see a calendar turned to August 1997 - or as you probably know - the month and year of when SG-1 premiered on Showtime :).

That's cool! That means they wanted to have as much accurate detail as possible... Ah, continuity. ;)

Although... You just KNOW they did that, because they knew that fans would see it. :D

I guess, they shouldn't expect any less from the likes of us. :P

Buzz Lightyear
January 21st, 2005, 06:43 PM
If the device only worked when they were in proximity of it, that means that he would have seen O'neill writing mission reports, not actually visions of the events as they occured. Major plot flaw. I'm very disappointed with this episode.

Plot flaw? No. Creative license? Yes.

This is a tv show, a visual medium. What would you rather watch? An action clip or Jack sitting at a desk, scribbling away? :rolleyes:

Filipino
January 22nd, 2005, 02:01 AM
I think this episode was done to poke fun at the very obsessive fans. The type of fans that dwell so much on details & take the show too seriously. Like when DJ died Joe the Barber cried or when Jackson made his appearance in Jack's cell.

I find it quite nice of them to acknowledge that they had some so-so episodes.

Mio
January 22nd, 2005, 12:54 PM
One thing I wondered about:

Does Joe know anything about the inner workings of advanced Ancient stuff?

Jack was ON the base when he had the Ancient repository of knowledge in his head. Joe had to have learned something....

...Oh well.

jantreeuk1
January 22nd, 2005, 03:34 PM
That's cool! That means they wanted to have as much accurate detail as possible... Ah, continuity. ;)

:P
But when we first see Joe in the past he is buying the stone and has a flash to Within the Serpents Grasp, we then see him at the barbers shop for the first time. So strictly speaking it couldn't have been August 1997 but about a year later.

My other slight nitpick is that Joe wrote Hathor which would have been long before Jack picked up the stone. OK Jack could have referenced Hathor when she came in later but didn't quite fit time line.

However on second viewing has grown on me slightly. Still worst epi ever but quite clever and considerably better than some other sci-fi shows I've watched. You know I think I would have preferred it without so many clips or maybe it was just that they always seem to pick the same ones.

jan t

Aadizookaan
January 22nd, 2005, 04:05 PM
"Goa'uld as burns' - i still don't get it.


Ok, let me try to impart some of my understanding of this misunderstood topic...lets go over some identifiable similarities.

The Goa'uld are evil - Mr. Burns is evil(ish);

The Goa'uld portray gods and believe they have a divine right to rule the galaxy - Mr. Burns thinks he's god and rules over Springfield;

The Goa'uld have Lotars and Slaves - Mr. Burns has a Lotar (Mr. Smithers) and Slaves (Homer and the gang at the Nuclear Power Plant); and

The Goa'uld have sarcophagai to bring them back to life and repair injury - Mr. Burns has been brought back to life (ok, he hasn't died but has come real close) and he heals pretty darn quick.

So, can you understand the parallel O'Neill tries to convey. Now put the entire Simpson Universe on top of the Stargate Universe and there you go!

Goa'uld as Burns. Clear as mud??? Yes, I have too much time on my hands. :p

Mio
January 22nd, 2005, 04:53 PM
Ok, let me try to impart some of my understanding of this misunderstood topic...lets go over some identifiable similarities.

The Goa'uld are evil - Mr. Burns is evil(ish);

The Goa'uld portray gods and believe they have a divine right to rule the galaxy - Mr. Burns thinks he's god and rules over Springfield;

The Goa'uld have Lotars and Slaves - Mr. Burns has a Lotar (Mr. Smithers) and Slaves (Homer and the gang at the Nuclear Power Plant); and

The Goa'uld have sarcophagai to bring them back to life and repair injury - Mr. Burns has been brought back to life (ok, he hasn't died but has come real close) and he heals pretty darn quick.

So, can you understand the parallel O'Neill tries to convey. Now put the entire Simpson Universe on top of the Stargate Universe and there you go!

Goa'uld as Burns. Clear as mud??? Yes, I have too much time on my hands. :p

Also, The Simpsons are on their 16th season, and Stargate SG1 is on it's 8th.

Since The Simpsons is only half an hour, while Stargate is a full hour, you get...

Almost equal time.....

Coincidence?! I think not!

alz0rz
January 22nd, 2005, 05:09 PM
Also, The Simpsons are on their 16th season, and Stargate SG1 is on it's 8th.

Since The Simpsons is only half an hour, while Stargate is a full hour, you get...

Almost equal time.....

Coincidence?! I think not!

Stargate is on ~43-45 minutes without commercials :D hard to believe if you would watch the commercials it would take you almost 20 minutes to get through them entirely :S

Mio
January 23rd, 2005, 03:42 AM
Stargate is on ~43-45 minutes without commercials :D hard to believe if you would watch the commercials it would take you almost 20 minutes to get through them entirely :S

I know.

The ultimate solution:

Buy a TiVo. For every hour of TV, wait 15 minutes before sitting down to watch

This way, Instead of watching Stargate at 8, or 9, or whenever it comes on, I sit down at 8:30, to get uninterupted SG1 and Atlantis.

airfro
January 23rd, 2005, 04:47 AM
Ok, let me try to impart some of my understanding of this misunderstood topic...lets go over some identifiable similarities.

The Goa'uld are evil - Mr. Burns is evil(ish);

The Goa'uld portray gods and believe they have a divine right to rule the galaxy - Mr. Burns thinks he's god and rules over Springfield;

The Goa'uld have Lotars and Slaves - Mr. Burns has a Lotar (Mr. Smithers) and Slaves (Homer and the gang at the Nuclear Power Plant); and

The Goa'uld have sarcophagai to bring them back to life and repair injury - Mr. Burns has been brought back to life (ok, he hasn't died but has come real close) and he heals pretty darn quick.

So, can you understand the parallel O'Neill tries to convey. Now put the entire Simpson Universe on top of the Stargate Universe and there you go!

Goa'uld as Burns. Clear as mud??? Yes, I have too much time on my hands. :p
they both are old
they both pop up randomly
they both suck
they are both snakes (burns one in the hallowen special)

OfF3nSiV3
January 23rd, 2005, 11:57 AM
does anybody think that the ending was crap? come on..i don't think jack would tell something classified to the wife..and what happened to joe? with his knowledge will he work on SGC?

sabrina
January 23rd, 2005, 12:13 PM
Rather a lame script (also one I'd call a monage of clips from previous eps). I agree the military would not so easily admit to "Joe" nor his wife his visions were real. If so, they'd have to relocate them under the witness protection program (or similar).

The stories of SG-1 are becomming shallow and somewhat boring (sad to say and IMO). Surprisingly, Atlantis stories have improved tho' I do feel the story lines tend to repeat themselves.

With Ben Browder coming aboard SG-1, new life may well be breathed into the series (one can hope, can't I?)

jantreeuk1
January 23rd, 2005, 02:58 PM
Apparantely the wig MS was wearing was nicknamed 'Whiskers' by MS (see the TV Zone special.
And I am very relieved it was a wig.

mancslad08
January 24th, 2005, 05:33 AM
Rather a lame script (also one I'd call a monage of clips from previous eps). I agree the military would not so easily admit to "Joe" nor his wife his visions were real. If so, they'd have to relocate them under the witness protection program (or similar).

The stories of SG-1 are becomming shallow and somewhat boring (sad to say and IMO). Surprisingly, Atlantis stories have improved tho' I do feel the story lines tend to repeat themselves.

With Ben Browder coming aboard SG-1, new life may well be breathed into the series (one can hope, can't I?)
Agreed. Very lame script, very lame episode.

I think that season 7 was VERY shallow. And at least half of season 8 is the same

KatG
January 24th, 2005, 11:47 AM
I rather enjoyed this episode. There were a lot of inside jokes and much satire. Not only did they take a gentle dig at fandom but at themselves and the Simpsons as well. Well done imo.

shipper hannah
January 30th, 2005, 12:04 PM
i loved this ep it was so funny... joe was like one of us...
i do think that the air force wouldn't have told joe and his wife about the world's most secret secret so easily though....
apart from that it was the best clip show... :D

Qasim
February 5th, 2005, 11:58 AM
The connection between Jack and Joe was established BEFORE Jack touched the stone in a much later episode then "7 Years ago". The scenes from season 1 for instance should not have been seen by Joe because the link was not established at that time.

IMForeman
February 5th, 2005, 12:59 PM
The connection between Jack and Joe was established BEFORE Jack touched the stone in a much later episode then "7 Years ago". The scenes from season 1 for instance should not have been seen by Joe because the link was not established at that time.

The connection didn't transmit in realtime, though... it only was active when Jack was writing his reports... and you know Jack and paperwork. He could have caught up on a huge backlog during early Season 2.

-IMF

bioevilfan
February 10th, 2005, 03:42 AM
Just saw the episode 5 mins ago and I found it to be the best clip show yet. But the only thing I don't buy is that Jack has not said anything about Joe in the past 7 years. If a person can see what the other is doing then Jack would not have found Joe's life relaxing. For all he did was write about the missions, work in a boring job and have family problems. And if at any point Jack saw stuff related to the stargate then we all know he would have gotten worried and told someone. So I just don't buy his reason for not saying anything because it would have shown parts of the SGC or not have been very interesting.

david2708
February 10th, 2005, 07:54 PM
I actually liked Citizen Joe. One of only three decent ep of the 15 I've seen of this season.
Funniest part for me was when Joe went hysterical when he learnt about Daniel's season 5 death.
Most cringeworthy was the begining when Sam and Jack spoke on the phone about how he fried his eggs or something. It perfectly showed what us non-shippers have always known: their romance is a complete sham and the laboured, infunny dialogue in that beginning scene just bore it out.
The end was strange. I get the feeling some nerdy script editor threw in the....but wouldn't Jack then know about Joe's life?....when he saw the final draft.
I can picture the writer quickly scurrying away to the corner of the room for a quick add on at the end about Jack knowing.

Sunkissed_stargate_traveller
February 10th, 2005, 08:10 PM
^ Totally agree - the fact that Jack should have seen Joes life was just patched on the end.

The rest of the ep wasnt too bad imo ... the "what about the furlings?" bit and the other fan type comments were v funny :D

darkbhudda
February 12th, 2005, 03:57 AM
Worst - Episode - Ever

Worst Clip Show ever

I felt quite ill watching it.

The worst part is I went to Gateworld.net to vote it as absolute drivel, but the US don't get to suffer through this garbage until the 18th.

How can I warn our poor brothers across the pacific ocean?

When it started, I thought great, another episode on Earth (SARCASM).
It's called STARGATE people not SuburbiaGate not EarthGate and certainly not CrapEpisodeFillerCrapClipCrapGate.

They must have blown up too many forests in previous seasons and so run out of locations.

jyh
February 14th, 2005, 07:15 PM
did anyone notice that O'Neill's shoes were some sort of trainer type, platform sneaker type werid shoe, n not a proper dress shoe? least it didnt look that way to me....


YESS!!!! In fact, that whole final scene, w/ O'Neill walking toward Joe & his wife at the park... he walked funny (because of the shoes??), he looked heavy... In fact, it almost didn't look like RDA at all except for his face when he got close.

Otherwise, it was a great episode. If Jack had been 'seeing' Joe's life all these years, why didn't he say anything when Joe confronted him in his kitchen? Joe knew Jack's name... Jack must have known Joe's.

Tok'Ra Hostess
February 15th, 2005, 04:55 AM
If Jack had been 'seeing' Joe's life all these years, why didn't he say anything when Joe confronted him in his kitchen? Joe knew Jack's name... Jack must have known Joe's.

The whole premise makes great 44 min fluffy SF viewing but doesn't stand up to even casual scrutiny. :rolleyes:

To be fair, though, the images we were given of Jack's "visions" were a close up of someone's nose hairs, and an arm bowling. :p I don't recall how Joe came to know what Jack looked like; I can't imagine Jack describing his face in his own reports.

Also, I think that Jack might have gotten less "visions" and possibly only when he was near sleep(so he might have thought he was dreaming). Jack's mind has been touched by both the Ancients and the Asgard. I suspect the Asgard had to re-wire a few circuits when they took the Ancient knowledge from Jack the first time(5th Race), and who knows what his scrambled eggs look like since New Order.

Joe, OTOH, was actively, consciously channeling Jack from the moment he decided to buy the device at the yard sale.

Bobthespirit
February 18th, 2005, 04:09 PM
Ugh. Unbelieveable. They have two fewer episodes this season and they *still* feel the need to do a clip show?

How much money do they need to save, exactly?

Major Fischer
February 18th, 2005, 04:21 PM
Ugh. Unbelieveable. They have two fewer episodes this season and they *still* feel the need to do a clip show?

How much money do they need to save, exactly?

I don't know, ask the cast and crew how much in total they got in raises for working the eighth year on a show, when at least one of the them with a big pay check didn't want to be there?

Kull
February 18th, 2005, 04:35 PM
God I cannot believe how bad this is. What are they thinking? I mean are the deliberately sabotaging the show? Half an hour into the show and not even one original SG1 shot except the opening sequence..................

greytop
February 18th, 2005, 04:48 PM
Bad. Typical clip show.

Inauguration was much better than this one.
Five frowns.
:( :( :( :( :(

Major Fischer
February 18th, 2005, 04:50 PM
I actually don't think it's bad because it's a clip show, there really aren't all that many clips in it, but I find it difficult to watch because I have a family background in mental illness and I couldn't laugh at the gags because I found Joe's mental deterioration so hard to watch.

There is a West Wing episode that deals with CJ's father that I similarly admire for it's structure and guts, but had difficulty watching.

airdish
February 18th, 2005, 05:02 PM
And stargate has jumped the shark. Jack's been seeing things for seven years and doesn't say anything??? and they give no real reason why! this show was hella weak.

Bobthespirit
February 18th, 2005, 05:05 PM
This episode was pretty funny, but it's still kind of lame that they had to do a money-saving episode like this when they had a 20 episode season.

Loved the 'Burns as gua'uld' reference, liked "NOOO! DANIEL'S DEAD!!"

Hopefully Reckoning, Threads, and Moebius will be really good, have some actual good action, and save the season.

Cinephilic TV Addict
February 18th, 2005, 05:06 PM
the only things good about this episode are -

1) Joe's acting really wasn't bad at all - I enjoyed HIM, no one else.

2) The direction/cinematography wasn't that bad.

3) The music from past stargate episodes.

I absolutely hate the stargate producers now - anyone catch the little nuances they through in to justify the changes they've made in the last few years? That made me soooooooooooooo mad. They're trying to justify turning a good show bad. Ug - that was pathetic.

I have to rate it bad - that was a cheap shot at people with intelligence.

Bobthespirit
February 18th, 2005, 05:06 PM
And stargate has jumped the shark. Jack's been seeing things for seven years and doesn't say anything??? and they give no real reason why! this show was hella weak.

I don't see how one really bad episode jumps up to 'jumping the shark'. Wait for the two two parters coming up to say that.

Though season 8 has been of generally lower quality, I think the new characters will revitalize the show. And they might have some ACTION next season!

spg_1983
February 18th, 2005, 05:08 PM
so what happens to joe now? how can he just go back to his life after all this? for one everyone thinks he's crazy, but he knows he's not. maybe he can become the base barber!

-Jules-
February 18th, 2005, 05:12 PM
lol Am I really the only one who enjoyed it? :o Ok, so some parts were kinda corny, but it kept me laughing! :D

(((<,< >,> they must be reading our posts...their 'fan questions' were just like ours! :eek: :cool: :p)))

spg_1983
February 18th, 2005, 05:16 PM
lol Am I really the only one who enjoyed it? :o Ok, so some parts were kinda corny, but it kept me laughing! :D
no im with you i enjoyed it

Seshat
February 18th, 2005, 05:56 PM
lol Am I really the only one who enjoyed it? :o Ok, so some parts were kinda corny, but it kept me laughing! :D

(((<,< >,> they must be reading our posts...their 'fan questions' were just like ours! :eek: :cool: :p)))

I'm with you -- I laughed throughout and really enjoyed it! :D :D I just love it when the writers make fun of themselves and the 'seriousness' of the show.

ShimmeringStar
February 18th, 2005, 05:57 PM
Mixed feelings from me too. :S Parts of it I liked, some parts made me laugh. Oh so true, that line they had the wife say regarding the team interaction not being the same as it use to be… :p But I don’t know, maybe it’s just me… something about it rubbed me the wrong way, a few parts seemed more than just gentle digs at fans & I’m not sure I liked that. :( I agree with those that have said that with this being a shorter season, the story arcs and the fans might have been served better with a different type of episode. Oh well… at least there’s a few more eps still remaining for us in the U.S. & from the spoilers it seems like they'll be a bit more like what we are use to seeing…

IMForeman
February 18th, 2005, 06:18 PM
lol Am I really the only one who enjoyed it? :o Ok, so some parts were kinda corny, but it kept me laughing! :D

(((<,< >,> they must be reading our posts...their 'fan questions' were just like ours! :eek: :cool: :p)))


Nope, you're not alone. I loved this episode. Best Clip Episode ever.

-IMF

Major Fischer
February 18th, 2005, 06:33 PM
One good thing. Carter found her uniform jacket again. I had begun to wonder if she'd just lost it.

Of course, there is a reason for wearing it NOW, but still.

Daniel's_twin
February 18th, 2005, 06:47 PM
An interesting episode. I laughed, I cried, I gaped. :D

Overall, not their best flashback episode, but very well-done. It was interesting to see how they worked Joe's life into the woodwork of Stargate. Also interesting to see the Daniel-wig. :cool:

Jace021903
February 18th, 2005, 07:35 PM
I watched this one twice--I missed a lot the first time around due to kidlet interruptions.

Not bad. It won't be a top ten favorite or anything but I did get some enjoyment out of it.

Some observations...

The clip show features a barber-- ;)

The kid must have been older than he looked to start with--run a lawn mower? :eek: He looked like he jumped from about 6 to 14 in a couple of years.

The very first mention of CIA person Johnson.

At times, I felt the humor was very close to mockery of the fans, but the actor who played Joe kept it from going completely over the line.

I adore having the whole team together--I wanted more. sigh

I saw a bit of a bump on Amanda. :)

Daniel's hair in the flashback- :eek: He never looked that greasy.

I cringed a bit when it was revealed that Jack was also having visions and had never said anything--too close to Dumb Jack for me.

As a fan of Pete, I feel compelled to add this final point: ;)

Jack in full uniform gave out information regarding national security in a public park full of people. :p


Jace

Daniel's_twin
February 18th, 2005, 07:39 PM
Even if Everyone who watched this episode rated it awful, shippers everywhere are very happy with the infermery scene where Joe tells Jack that he won't tell anyone how he feels about Sam. :cool:

Kelso
February 18th, 2005, 07:54 PM
It was entertaining... though I prefer the political clip shows.

keppiezbt
February 18th, 2005, 08:07 PM
i liked how the writers took pot shots at themselves when joe's wife said "well, i read the light, holiday, and sentinal" and joe was like ok so some of it wasnt the best.

i found that to be HILARIOUS!

keppiezbt
February 18th, 2005, 08:10 PM
This episode was pretty funny, but it's still kind of lame that they had to do a money-saving episode like this when they had a 20 episode season.

Loved the 'Burns as gua'uld' reference, liked "NOOO! DANIEL'S DEAD!!"

Hopefully Reckoning, Threads, and Moebius will be really good, have some actual good action, and save the season.

reckoning is AMAZING

Jolinarsam
February 18th, 2005, 08:50 PM
I absolutely LOVED this episode! Every other line was something I've read on this forum! I think that's the most I've laughed for any Stargate episode ever, because I could relate to all of it. Someone not as involved in the fandom probably didn't get all the jokes, but I really want to thank TPTB for this nod to the fans.

I loved all the references: Wormhole X-treme, Sam/Jack, Pete, crying over Daniel's ascension, Armin the reporter, NID, O'Neill with 2 l's, Furlings/Ewoks, Hathor, the decline in team interaction...I could go on and on. Although I don't know why they said 'Seth' and 'Holiday' were subpar. I personally loved those eps.

Loved when the guy getting his hair cut said "Come on, there must be other things we can talk about besides SG-1." And the guys just stare at him. And when everyone gets confused about the Jaffa, Joe says "It's not confusing, it's complex!" I've had the exact conversation trying to explain how to say Goa'uld. ;)

Wish they would have answered stuff, like the Laira issue and the Furlings, instead of just saying that's for the sequel. But other than that, Daniel's greasy hair, and Jack seeing Joe for 8 years and not saying anything, it was a great ep.

I actually liked the clips for once. It was nice to see the good old episodes that I miss so much. And they didn't seem to take over the ep. It's too bad that some of you didn't like the ep. But I thought it was a great way to let the fans know they are at least listening and can laugh at themselves. :)

NovaLuna42
February 18th, 2005, 09:09 PM
I really liked this episode. It was a great tribute to the fans. We've all had those coversations/thoughts before, the furlings... Goa'uld... Daniel dying...

I loved the writers taking jibes at themselves with all his stories being rejected and how they acknowledged the loss of team dynamic.

Aside from the horrible greasy wig they had on Daniel and Jack's suddenly having been seeing into the life of a barber for the last eight years. And his odd security breach (I mean come on a public park!!!) I found the episode to be funny and pretty darn good for a clips episode.

keshou
February 18th, 2005, 09:20 PM
I actually enjoyed this one. Not a lot of depth compared to the shows that followed it (Atlantis and BSG) - but I'd rank it as one of the better clip shows they've done.

I thought it was a fairly creative concept to come up with the Ancient stone - discovered way back in S1 - that established a psychic connection between Joe the Barber and SG1.

TPTB did a good job of poking a little fun at themselves as well as the fans and this was one episode I felt was really written for "fandom" as opposed to the "viewers". It DID sound a lot like stuff you see on these forums every day. When will the Furlings come back? Is Laira with child? The team dynamic's not what it used to be. Daniel's dead. :( No, he's alive! :) And Wormhole Xtreme was cancelled after one episode. :p

I thought Dan Castellaneta really made the episode. His portrayal of Joe kept my attention and I really felt for the guy losing his business, his wife, his life. If a less talented actor had been playing Joe I'm afraid I would have been rolling my eyes more often than not. Instead I thought his passion for the adventures of SG-1 was endearing. His confrontation with Jack was a classic. "I'm not a bad ping-pong player" Hee!

Jack not mentioning the visions of Joe is a little out there, but with Jack I almost believe it.

What's up with the lingering crotch shot on old Joe sprawled in his underwear on the sofa? Note to Andy Mikita: If you're going to do one of these in S9 I have some candidates to suggest. ;)

First glance at the wig on Daniel. Really, I think Daniel washed his hair in S1 - didn't he??

So - not an episode I'll rush to rewatch but for a clip show I thought it was pretty entertaining. :D

Osiris-RA
February 18th, 2005, 09:29 PM
Citizen Joe was pretty cute. It doesn't have a lasting effect but good for a hours worth of entertainment.

I see the writers kind of making fun of themselves though and I wonder - do they take it seriously anymore? And in regards to the actors though they did make me laugh this time around, they seem to have been charicaturizing themselves for the past 8th season. Maybe they're getting tired, maybe the juice has been sucked out, beats me. All I know is the characters have been thrown off course with Sam being the lead, Jack being waaayy in the lead and Teal'c getting hair (I'm nitpicking, zip it. :p ) The Goa'uld have been diluted to one big bad a$$ Goa'uld/Ancient/Nazi/Super duper uber baddie who is not really interesting me. I miss Apophis, I miss Hathor, Heck, show me Bastet, I'll give you points for Bastet, but please, enough with the Super Soldiers. Give something I can have feelings for instead of yelling at the screen whenever I see it, "Super Soldier!! [email protected]#p, Shoot it!!! Die, you clomping freak of nature, DIE!!!"

But back to Citizen Joe, very nice, amicable. As Miss Marple might say,

"I have eyes, dear, I can see when the energy has gone out of things for you. I understand you might be feeling tired and that's quite allright, but whatever you do, please, try and keep your eyes on the road, I have a dreadful fear of speeds over 55 and you don't seem to have been concentrating. I do hate it dreadfully when you nod off whilst driving and ...Dear?"

;)

LoneStar1836
February 18th, 2005, 10:04 PM
For some reason I actually enjoyed this one as opposed to some other episodes this season. And it was a clip show. :S I’m not all giddy about it, but at least PU is not in jeopardy of having to relinquish its spot as worst episode of the season and maybe of the entire series. (Just my humble opinion of course. :P )

The in-jokes were funny. Though I’m not sure how taking a fun jab at how the show has declined with the team interaction is quite that funny. Hehe, even Joe was miserable during most of season 7. (Yes, I know why he was actually miserable, but S7 didn’t cheer him up. ;) ) And yes Kes, I too can think of others in S9 that such camera angles are more appropriate for. :D

Guess why I didn’t find the opening chit chat between Sam and Jack amusing or the little comment in the infirmary. :rolleyes:

Someone’s been injecting human growth hormone into their child. I know they grow up fast, but not that fast. :D I won’t even go there with Jack seeing images of a barber’s life for 7 years and not saying anything. Wonder how much he saw though? Maybe a little free entertainment. ;) Maybe that's why he didn't say anything. *slap* Don’t go there. This is a family show. :D That's Fox Mulder's territory. ;)

Overall good enough episode to entertain me for an hour until SGA. It didn’t leave a sour taste even though it had some scenes and story points that I didn’t care for. Now bring on Reckoning and the rest of the season. :D


One good thing. Carter found her uniform jacket again. I had begun to wonder if she'd just lost it.
Hehe. I noticed that, too. Seems SG-1's clothing has been getting lost in the wash, but was found for this ep. :D

vikingjedi
February 19th, 2005, 12:04 AM
Another good episode IMO. Thats 4 in a row now.

Somehow they've got to end this horrible idea they stole from Xena in "Gemini" with the replicators having a new leader that looks exactly like Sam. Its just not going to work.

Shivan
February 19th, 2005, 06:13 AM
This episode was awesome. SEASON 8 is really picking up. I've keep my fingers crossed for exactly this to happen. That last few shows have been great Stargate SG:1 shows.

:)

-Jules-
February 19th, 2005, 06:45 AM
Even if Everyone who watched this episode rated it awful, shippers everywhere are very happy with the infermery scene where Joe tells Jack that he won't tell anyone how he feels about Sam. :cool:
*squee* yes! lol I also liked the part where he sees the part when Daniel dies and he starts crying. I thought that was really guided toward the fans as well. *sniff* I cried in that episode too...although not that much! :rolleyes:

Lexx
February 19th, 2005, 06:49 AM
Strangely enough, I liked this one. I was prepared to hate it, but I found it more interseting than both "It's Good To Be King" and "Full Alert". Of course, it wasn't without it's faults (Joe's kid growing abnormally fast in three years, Jack having visions of a barber ever since season 2 and not telling anyone, Daniel's nasty flashback wig), but overall it was pretty good. They even mentioned the Furlings! At this point I'm taking anything I can get regarding my precious Furlings.

Ragnarok13
February 19th, 2005, 06:56 AM
IMO, the beginning was ok with jack, a a six pack, and a wack job with a gun(which turned out to be fake) then the whole flash back thing was preety good (serpents venom, i think, the one with the asteriod, hathor,etc.) then it got pretty weird when joe freaked out cause he saw daniel die and when he was alive. the end was pretty good when gen. O'neill (sorry if miss spelled) edmitted he saw joes life for 7 years and said nothing. i think 1 of the best lines in that scene was "Jack: bowling night on thursdays? ,joe: yes, Jack: you got game." and i liked it when jack explained the whole thing to joes wife. all IMO

P.S. i think the best line was "employee w/newspaper: so what about the furlings, when will we hear somthing about them?, employee2 fulings, lol, they sound cute, like ewoks"

Vega
February 19th, 2005, 10:11 AM
A decent episode. I really enjoyed the meta-humor. I believe the best part was when Joe broke down over Daniel. The worst part: Danny's fake hair. It looked ridiculous. Best line: "The Team doesn't seem to have the same dynamic anymore." Very amusing that Jack never said anything about having flashes of Joe's life. I also enjoyed the remark about Jonas. Why wasn't General Hammond mentioned? That annoyed me. The Wormhole X-Treme bit cracked me up, and I loved the fact that the stories were the same as the episode titles.

keb414
February 19th, 2005, 10:26 AM
A very unsatisfying episode. Except for the teaser and Act V, there was nothing original about it. Just an easy way out to view clips from past episodes. Did like the teaser though -- especially reference to "CIA" and "Johnson."
What's with the hall phone at SGC for telephone conversations? Daniel was using it too in a previous episode. What gives?

nell
February 19th, 2005, 10:40 AM
I thought that Citizen Joe was terrific. I just suspend my disbelief on this show and enjoy the ride. I thought that the writers/producers and actors were having a blast poking fun at themselves and the series as well as an attempt to acknowledge some loose ends, e.g. Jack's feelings for Sam(yippee), and set up a new development, e.g. Johnson(I assume this is the new woman interest). Joe was Jack's "alter" on Earth. Joe lived an average life with the excitement of his Stargate visions. Jack lived a dangerous and adventurous life with the "relaxation" of his barber-life visions. :)

Ramne
February 19th, 2005, 10:57 AM
I liked it, was fun to watch. I loved when they were trying to pronounce Goa'uld.

Zoser
February 19th, 2005, 11:31 AM
did anyone notice that O'Neill's shoes were some sort of trainer type, platform sneaker type werid shoe, n not a proper dress shoe? least it didnt look that way to me....
Yes, I thought a general should have a spit shine with his dress uniform.

AncientOne
February 19th, 2005, 12:19 PM
I have to say I really liked this episode. Yeah it was a kind of a clip episode, but it was done so well. I really enjoyed it. I liked Joe and his obsession with Stargate. LOL! I know it was the writer's little dig at the fans and themselves. I really liked how he was rooting through the garbage and found the stone, seeing Daniel dying. His devastated reaction reminded me how a lot of people felt when Daniel died. And his jubilee at seeing Daniel alive again. I laughed a lot during this episode. I loved it when he met the team and their reaction to him. The toy gun. The conversation with Jack. Burns as Goa'uld. Thanking Sam. Jonas. The arm grabbing with Teal'c. LOL, all of it. I would really like to see Joe Spencer again. Dan was great. I wonder what Joe went through during Window of Oppurtunity. Jack being relaxed at seeing visions of Joe's life for 7 years was just great. Kind of explains that blank look Jack would get on his face sometimes. LOL!! One of the best things I liked about this episode is the fact that the people who became enthralled in Joe's "stories" cared so much about the characters and what was going on. It was like coming here and talking to any one of you. It easily became a favorite Stargate episode for me.

LMichelle
February 19th, 2005, 12:31 PM
I had a sinking feeling all week that this was going to be a clip show. :eek: And it was, but with a twist. Dan Castenaletta did a great job with the ep, since it was all about him. I liked everyone trying to pronounce Goa'uld, Joe telling his son SG-1's adventures as a bedtime story. The last ten minutes were my favorite. I wished there was more SG-1 in it 'cause that's why I watch the show. It was okay, but nothing great.

A few nitpicks:

Should Jack be talking with Joe and his wife outside in a park? :eek:

Charlene liked interpersonal stories. How come she didn't read Secrets and Forever In A Day? :p

His son went from 6 to 16 in a couple of years. :rolleyes:

Bad wig on Daniel. *shudders* Rivaled only by Megan Leitch's blonde one in "Past and Present."

Joe could have talked more about Daniel and Sam. I don't even remember Jonas being mentioned. Huh?

Let's get back to going off world.

AncientOne
February 19th, 2005, 12:36 PM
I don't even remember Jonas being mentioned. Huh?


When he meets Daniel he says something along the lines of, "I'm so glad you're back with SG-1. Not that Jonas was bad or anything. But after everything you all have been through you belong here."

acdj31
February 19th, 2005, 01:37 PM
I like this ep better the Disclosure. Loved the inside jokes including the ones about the Furlings. Like how his storytitles where the same as the show titles. Like it how he got upset and depressed when Daniel died. :( Loved the end with him in the SGC talking with everyone. :D

The only thing I didn't like was Daniel's hair in the flashback at the end, to weird looking. :( And when did Jack touch the stone; right after "The Serpent's Lair" ?

Bandersnatch
February 19th, 2005, 01:53 PM
Howdy Campers!

Well, now, "Citizen Joe" turned out to be a good show after all -- and I'll say this just to get it out of my system: I told ya so! And those of you who also kept an open mind about this show may share in the moment of gloat ... okay, times up. On with the show....

* Dan Castellanetta is a pretty good straight man actor, although he's a bit hairy... I don't think I've ever seen him except for behind the scenes for the Simpsons -- although I know he's done some work on other shows. He worked well with the principles -- very well with Mr. A. I think it was great that they got him into the show since so many of the cast and crew members are fans of the Simpsons. But, than again, what isn't to love about it?

* The clips worked very well. They showed some of the best highlights over the past seven years. I got a lump in my throat when the scenes from "Meridian" and "Abyss" came on -- I think it's the music. (It reminds me of the ending song for the movie "Moulin Rouge" and that gets me sniffling EVERY time.) And then the piece from Heroes 2.... It's neat to see how the characters, and actors for that matter, have changed and developed.

* The comment about "immortalization by creativity" kind of peeked my interest. I never thought of writing in that way before but it makes perfect sense. I never thought that was why I write -- but maybe it is.

* The interaction between Joe and his wife was great. It drove home the cliche, opposites attract.

* The opening with O'Neill and Cater on the phone was cute. Have to love a man that changes brands of beer every episode :)

Overall, I was really pleased with this show. It wasn't over the top wacky and it certainly wasn't a dry, bunch of politicals sitting around a table talking about the fate of the SGC. Come to think of it, wasn't this the only clip show that didn't involve the fate of the program? It was fun, light hearted, and didn't feel like a clip show. Again, it showed how the SG-1 family has changed, grown, and evolved into what we know and love. It even highlighted some of the cares and concerns of the fans -- the team dynamics aren't what they used to be. It was a creative way for TPTB to show that they do listen to us, even if they can't (won't) change what's to come.

So, Citizen Joe... Woo-Hoo!! :D

greytop
February 19th, 2005, 02:01 PM
The opening with O'Neill and Cater on the phone was cute. Have to love a man that changes brands of beer every episode :)
He probably gets what's ever on sale. If I drank, I know I would. :p

Daniel's_twin
February 19th, 2005, 02:01 PM
Overall, looks like CJ was a success. :cool:

acdj31
February 19th, 2005, 02:19 PM
What's with the hall phone at SGC for telephone conversations? Daniel was using it too in a previous episode. What gives?
I was wondering that too, don't they have phones in their office.

lord-anubis
February 19th, 2005, 02:34 PM
i loved this ep it was a good clip ep and the last few mins of the ep were the best.

walter_MacChevron
February 19th, 2005, 02:37 PM
Man...i wish all episodes were like "It's Good to be King" everything Joe said in this episode was true.....bring back the "team, were off world and *random problem* happened! Let's try to tie this to mythology and possibly contact one of our allies with a sad part at the end!!!" episodes. Man, i miss season 3

taupecat
February 19th, 2005, 03:22 PM
My $0.02.....

1) Best clip show ever. Okay, maybe that's not saying a whole lot, but if you're going to do a clip show, at least it was an interesting one with a plot and everything.

2) Dan Castellenata was great. Very convincing as Joe. Of course, I *still* say Bruce McGill should have played Joe, but no one on the show asked me...

3) So now that Homer Simpson's been on Stargate, when does Jack O'Neill get to be on The Simpsons?

4) Best line of the ep:
Daniel: Broke into your house? Second week in a row. Alarm!

5) Loved all the fan nods and acknowledging some of the dropped plot threads. And of course there were a few Simpsons nods.

6) RDA was obviously loving shooting this ep.

Seshat
February 19th, 2005, 03:29 PM
...It wasn't over the top wacky and it certainly wasn't a dry, bunch of politicals sitting around a table talking about the fate of the SGC. Come to think of it, wasn't this the only clip show that didn't involve the fate of the program? It was fun, light hearted, and didn't feel like a clip show. Again, it showed how the SG-1 family has changed, grown, and evolved into what we know and love. It even highlighted some of the cares and concerns of the fans -- the team dynamics aren't what they used to be. It was a creative way for TPTB to show that they do listen to us, even if they can't (won't) change what's to come.

So, Citizen Joe... Woo-Hoo!! :D...

I agree with everything you said in your post! I laughed more at this ep than I did at Wormhole Extreme, and that's saying something.

IMHO the point of the show was that it was a fond tribute to the last seven and a half years of Stargate (after all, when this ep was written a season 9 was not certain). In fact, it reminded me of a comic roast -- anything or anyone made fun of was done so lovingly and with tongue firmly in cheek! The writers poked fun at themselves, the 'seriousness' of scifi, the over-the-top dramatics, the extremely varied and often polar opposite fan opinions, the actors, well, you name it. I loved it! :D :D

Meg_Ann
February 19th, 2005, 03:48 PM
Okay, like many of you, this episode was kind of love-hate. Best episode? Not by a long shot. But worst episode? I'm not so sure. There have been some... not good episodes. Even as a clip show, which I'm usually not so much a fan of, it wasn't that bad.

I don't want to rehash everyone else's thoughts, so I'll try to find some things I liked and disliked that haven't been mentioned... which is difficult. Lol.

-The kid had some weird aging problem. They probably wrote the script for an older actor in the beginning. Cut the lawn? That kid was somewhere around 6-8! Unless he's using a safety scissors, I really don't know what they expected.

-I didn't think the kid (Andy's) aging was that bad. He didn't look that old. But Gordy (the teen helping in the barber shop) clearly should have aged. I mean, what the heck?

-Jack never saw in all his Joe-flashbacks (the premise of which, I hated as soon as they said it) that Joe was trying to find him. I hated that whole idea. I actually liked the show a LOT more before they tried to spring that on me. I refuse to believe that. Completely refuse.

-Some of the flashback sequences were damn near perfect. And some they should have had, but didn't. I'm afraid I couldn't even concentrate on what Joe was going through after the Meridian flashback. I was ready to cry.

-Okay, I didn't think that 'Holiday' and 'The Light' were that bad. There were worse episodes they could have named. I mean, they chose those two over, I don't know, but there were others. Speaking of, I was looking through past episodes to find some to replace those two, and I was struck at how awesome all of the earlier episodes are. What happened?

-I think that towards the later part of the show Joe started to seem not be believeable? I know he was supposed to act irrational and I know that his life was supposed to be consumed by SG-1, but I can't see him absolutely being unable to NOT talk about them to everyone he encounters. I mean, I manage to not talk about the show every five seconds. Almost.

-I loved some of the slips to the fans. Just loved them. If they had been more prominent (ie, Wormhole X-Treme), I probably would've liked this episode better.

-In conclusion, decent episode. Not great, but then again I'm starting to come to expect just 'decent' episodes from SG-1. I mean, Seasons 7 and 8 have some really bad episodes. I'm going to go watch my brand new Season 3 box set.

lionel_pendergast_rocks
February 19th, 2005, 03:55 PM
In the episode that aired last night in the US, which was 'Citizen Joe', the episode ends, well it doesn't just end, some other stuff happens, but thats not the point, as i was saying, the episode almost ends with us finding out that for the past seven years, O'Neill has been having visions of this Joe Spencer of Indiana, and thought nothing of it, much less told anyone. I have two problems with this: One, its just weird, and although it was funny at the time, its, well, weird, but, and this is my second point, wouldn't O'Neill have thought something weird was going on if he had seen a man, thousands of miles away, writing stories based on his mission reports? I mean, O'Neill said he knew that Joe went bowling on thursdays, among other things, but he would've had to have seen more than that. Gah, ok, anger is out. Overall, the ep was ok, but, well, the title of the thread says it all.

Jolinarsam
February 19th, 2005, 04:52 PM
The kid had some weird aging problem. They probably wrote the script for an older actor in the beginning. Cut the lawn? That kid was somewhere around 6-8! Unless he's using a safety scissors, I really don't know what they expected.

I thought the little kid was sweet. He says Goa'uld better than most of the actors on the show. ;) Loved when he said "So the Goa'uld won't put any more bombs in Rya'c's teeth?" So cute.

Also liked when Joe cried at Daniel's death. It wasn't just a story to him. He believed Daniel to be a real person.

I never really thought about it before, but this ep got me wondering what that would actually feel like to know something like SG-1 was going on while you're going about your regular day. That scene in the park with his wife really brought that home. I would have been freaking out if I was Joe knowing that a huge battle with aliens was going on in Antartica and no one else knew or believed me. :o

bravesmom63
February 19th, 2005, 05:25 PM
Enjoyed this ep. Watched it twice. Laughed my butt off at all of the inside jokes. Everyone else has covered the things I liked/disliked about it, so I won't bore you with a repeat. Best clip show they've done, IMHO.

JediTrilobite
February 19th, 2005, 05:27 PM
I just want to know what they're doing with Joe. Maybe they'd offer him a job at the SGC to keep him quiet.

DownFallAngel
February 19th, 2005, 05:44 PM
I just want to know what they're doing with Joe. Maybe they'd offer him a job at the SGC to keep him quiet.

Maybe he could be an on base barber or something....just toying with an idea here people! :D

Jolinarsam
February 19th, 2005, 06:04 PM
Did anyone else catch this continuity mistake? The first time Joe talks to his wife in the park, there is a black jeep parked behind her. A few shots later it is now a black truck. Then it turns back into the jeep! Here are some screencaps:

http://www.stargatesg1971.com/citizenjoe/caps/image2460.html
http://www.stargatesg1971.com/citizenjoe/caps/image2477.html
http://www.stargatesg1971.com/citizenjoe/caps/image2487.html

Zelazny
February 19th, 2005, 06:56 PM
I agree with everything you said in your post! I laughed more at this ep than I did at Wormhole Extreme, and that's saying something.

IMHO the point of the show was that it was a fond tribute to the last seven and a half years of Stargate (after all, when this ep was written a season 9 was not certain). In fact, it reminded me of a comic roast -- anything or anyone made fun of was done so lovingly and with tongue firmly in cheek! The writers poked fun at themselves, the 'seriousness' of scifi, the over-the-top dramatics, the extremely varied and often polar opposite fan opinions, the actors, well, you name it. I loved it! :D :D

Here, here! :D

I thought this was a very entertaining episode. I liked it. I do believe it was better for those of us fans that are regular watchers, and not so much for the whenever I happen to catch it fans, since it was basically an episode that grabbed one of us watchers and documented how one of us gets into the show, becomes attached to it, and so on. Yet, on the other hand, it was also for the casual fan, as it does go through a lot that has happened over the last seven years. :D So, I guess it really was for both sides of the fan spectrum. ;)

The little things in the ep were what mattered, atleast to me. Joe's reactions to what was happening to SG-1, especially Jack, since that is who he was linked with, were the best part of the show. The show was great, just plain great. :)

Oh, and from what I see, I think this show is going to end with either Sam and Jack finally getting together or leaving it open ended enough that it could happen. Sorry to anti Jack/Sam shippers, but that is just how I think it will go, especially how in this episode it tells us that the thing between Jack and Sam isn't just on Sam's side, which some people have said. Oh, well. Just my opinion, people! :) Oh, loved the dig at Pete from Joe, even if he was cut off from what he was going to say by Jack. :D

Oh, and Seshat, love the sig. It is very well done. Did you make it?

Major_Griff
February 19th, 2005, 07:09 PM
Ever think that maybe none of his visions included when Joe was telling or writing the stories? Jack only had these visions wile at the SGC, meaning not off world and not at home.

bravesmom63
February 19th, 2005, 07:36 PM
Even if Everyone who watched this episode rated it awful, shippers everywhere are very happy with the infermery scene where Joe tells Jack that he won't tell anyone how he feels about Sam. :cool:

Actually, he didn't name any names. My hubby said that to pay true homage to the internet fans, both Sam and Daniel should have walked into the infirmary. ;)

Andy Alcatraz
February 19th, 2005, 08:45 PM
Do you honestly expect us to answer these questions?

White Knight
February 19th, 2005, 08:49 PM
Maybe they'll put him in some database of people with the Ancient gene, so that if they need someone to use the weapon in Antarctica or some other Ancient tech, they can call him if no one else is available.

He'd probably do it, too.

Ancient 1
February 19th, 2005, 08:57 PM
Maybe he could be an on base barber or something....just toying with an idea here people! :D
What else could he be?

LordAnubis
February 19th, 2005, 09:14 PM
In the episode that aired last night in the US, which was 'Citizen Joe', the episode ends, well it doesn't just end, some other stuff happens, but thats not the point, as i was saying, the episode almost ends with us finding out that for the past seven years, O'Neill has been having visions of this Joe Spencer of Indiana, and thought nothing of it, much less told anyone. I have two problems with this: One, its just weird, and although it was funny at the time, its, well, weird, but, and this is my second point, wouldn't O'Neill have thought something weird was going on if he had seen a man, thousands of miles away, writing stories based on his mission reports? I mean, O'Neill said he knew that Joe went bowling on thursdays, among other things, but he would've had to have seen more than that. Gah, ok, anger is out. Overall, the ep was ok, but, well, the title of the thread says it all.
I totally disagree with you dude. Not only was this one of the most enjoyable, believable, and entertaining Earth-based episodes I've seen in a long time, it was also well-acted and very clever. Every season has one of those "flashback/clip" episodes, but this was done so cleverly, and it was hilarious. I love the guy who played Joe; he's Mr. Everyone. It was very well done and I thought the ending was very much in line with O'Neill's personality.

You're also reading too much into it. I don't know if Jack actually saw Joe writing the "stories", but could have seen him typing or telling a story. Joe was actually picking up on Jack's reports, which is how he got so much detail, plus he could see things happening as they happened in Jack's mind. I think Jack saw similar things in Joe's life, but didn't realize what he was seeing, or was, in a weird way, thinking it was a fantasy of a family and life he wished he had.

Joe wanted adventure and something different; his life was mundane and uneventful. He longed for the adventure he saw in Sg-1's missions. Jack, conversely, longed for the mundane family life that he no longer had. It's irony, to some degree.

I loved the ending! :)

Bastet11191967
February 19th, 2005, 09:52 PM
[QUOTE=taupecat]My $0.02.....

4) Best line of the ep:
Daniel: Broke into your house? Second week in a row. Alarm!
QUOTE]

I loved Joe's answer about locking the door. For a clips show, I thought it was good. However, with all the magazine submissions that Joe sent out, I'm surprised that the Air Force didn't pay much attention to them.

Julez
February 20th, 2005, 01:17 AM
i was about to watch it when the channel (sky one) went black and is still on now through atlantis meanin i miss both


I taped both - I can mail ya the video tape if you would like. I'm in the US, so I'm not sure if you can play it on your VCR.

Julez
February 20th, 2005, 01:20 AM
Now for my opinion...

"Citizen Joe" was a good episode, but I got tired of all the flashbacks. Loved the ending!

Zoser
February 20th, 2005, 08:28 AM
I was prepared to really like this episode (hooked on spoilers) and thought at first they were just gently poking fun at the rabid fans (me) and I did enjoy the in-jokes but started to feel skewered. Maybe I'm just getting thin skinned in my old age, but making the person who watches religiously and buys the boxed sets displayed as a fool for caring is rather like biting the hand that feeds you.
And as for his reaction to Daniel's death, isn't he channeling Jack's reaction? Isn't it Jack's pain he is feeling, the pain he refuses to show.
I will not belabor the plot holes. I have rather mixed feeling over this episode.
Shouldn't some SF spit shine O'Neill's shoes?

Zoser
February 20th, 2005, 08:34 AM
I thought the little kid was sweet. He says Goa'uld better than most of the actors on the show. ;) Loved when he said "So the Goa'uld won't put any more bombs in Rya'c's teeth?" So cute.

Also liked when Joe cried at Daniel's death. It wasn't just a story to him. He believed Daniel to be a real person.

I never really thought about it before, but this ep got me wondering what that would actually feel like to know something like SG-1 was going on while you're going about your regular day. That scene in the park with his wife really brought that home. I would have been freaking out if I was Joe knowing that a huge battle with aliens was going on in Antartica and no one else knew or believed me. :o
Wasn't it poison in Ry'ac's teeth?
Just nit picking - sorry.

Zoser
February 20th, 2005, 08:44 AM
One other thought on Jack's visions of Joe's life. Joe had these intense visions of Jack when handling the stone. Jack only touched the stone once (turning it on). So perhaps his visions were seldom and less intense.

Ugly Pig
February 20th, 2005, 09:15 AM
One other thought on Jack's visions of Joe's life. Joe had these intense visions of Jack when handling the stone. Jack only touched the stone once (turning it on). So perhaps his visions were seldom and less intense.
That makes sense. Joe had direct contact with his stone at all times, Jack didn't.

Jolinarsam
February 20th, 2005, 10:13 AM
That makes sense. Joe had direct contact with his stone at all times, Jack didn't.

Which is why I don't understand why they couldn't take out the whole thing about Jack seeing Joe's life. To receive info, you would have to be touching the stone. But to send you just have to activate it and be nearby. That way they could have avoided this whole unbelievable thing with Jack not telling anybody he was seeing some guy's life for 7 years and then not recognizing him when he comes in his house. That would make much more sense to me anyway.

Jolinarsam
February 20th, 2005, 10:20 AM
Wasn't it poison in Ry'ac's teeth?
Just nit picking - sorry.

Well, that's what the kid said. I think it was a kind of poison bomb. When he bit down on his tooth it would break and all the poison would spread out through the base, acting like a bomb.

NightGloom
February 20th, 2005, 11:56 AM
This was actually a pretty well done clip show, since it made sense for the clips to be there. I thought it was funny, it got a little boring at times, but I did like all of the jokes.

Hex.FTB.enabled
February 20th, 2005, 12:21 PM
Ok. I think what I had to do when coming to an opinion of this show is recogize it for what it was: a clip show. So that means I'm prolly gonna be somewhere around a mental shrug for this ep. But is was a mental shrug+

Simply having Homer Simpson himself in the same scene as Jack was cool. But most of the best lines had me thinking that the writers browsed through sites like this forum and compiled and episode around them: how to pronounce Goa'uld (the snake people. hee.), the team interaction's isn't what is used to be, The Furlings sound cute and fuzzy, Wormhole X-Treme only surviving one ep, etc. I loved is reactions to Daniel's death/return.

I only really had one thing buzzing at me: Even if he did find it soothing, I didn't believe for a second that Jack would spend 8 years getting visions of someone elses life without saying a word.

All in all SG-1 in the present had some great scenes (Alarm?, Jack and the gun). So, a very entertaining tribute to the past 8 years.

Oma Desala
February 20th, 2005, 12:29 PM
Beisdes learning about the new Ancient device, I will chalk this one up to a filler episode. I was expecting more much then this. Maybe next week. :)

greytop
February 20th, 2005, 12:30 PM
At least Joe agreed that Burns coulod be a Gou'ald.

Seshat
February 20th, 2005, 02:09 PM
Actually, he didn't name any names. My hubby said that to pay true homage to the internet fans, both Sam and Daniel should have walked into the infirmary. ;)
Hah! I was thinking the same thing as your hubby! Not that the writers would ever go there (or that I want them to), but it would have been even funnier that way. ;) :D


Oh, and Seshat, love the sig. It is very well done. Did you make it?
Yup, it's what I do. ;) ;) (Hours and hours in Photoshop, but it was a labor of love. :D )

DarkQuee1
February 20th, 2005, 02:22 PM
And as for his reaction to Daniel's death, isn't he channeling Jack's reaction? Isn't it Jack's pain he is feeling, the pain he refuses to show.
I will not belabor the plot holes. I have rather mixed feeling over this episode.
Shouldn't some SF spit shine O'Neill's shoes?


No. We were told he was reading Jack's reports, not channeling Jack's feelings. I thought that was a gentle (or not) ribbing of some fan's reactions.

J.

DarkQuee1
February 20th, 2005, 02:25 PM
There seemed to be a continuity error in this ep (we're getting a number of them this year. Threads' "4 years" more of Jacob, rather than the six it actually was, as another example )

The stones activated when they both picked them up, and that was after at least "Politics" (yes, they got them in TBFTG, but the flashback showed Daniel with no sling, so it had to be after Politics). And Joe was getting his info from Jack's reports. Yet, he knew about Argos and the nanites. Which was months before Jack would have handled the stone. That report would have been long since filed away (if Jack even wrote it, considering his situation). How did Joe know?


J.

Cinephilic TV Addict
February 20th, 2005, 02:28 PM
I'd say I definitly liked Homer Simpson as an actor, except when he cried about Daniel's death (completely not funny, overdramatic crap - but not his fault, that would be the writer's fault) and then celebrated later (same thing).

However, what really rattled my very bones with anger was the CHEAP shot they took against people who call the show bad nowadays. It was when the wife said she liked more 'relationship' style stories than 'explosion' type stories.

If the stargate crew would open up their eyes they would see two things - 1) Their 'relationship' stories are god-awful television that should be left for soap operas and other junk, or TV shows that may actually be good but are geared toward this dimension. The stargate staff is NOT geared towards this area, and they do it horribly.

And, 2) The first five seasons (their quote-on-qoute 'explosion' episodes) had much better inter-character relationships than anything we've seen in the last three years.

So, it was no fault of the actors, but that one cheap shot alone ticked me off completely - the producers should go on the air and pubicly apologize - they have no right to justify their MISTAKE with taking a good TV show and turning it into crap.

My favorite part of the episode was simply hearing many of my favorite musical motifs from past episodes.

Oh, and it is not believable or funny at all that jack hasn't said anything about his visions of joe's life. that was just dumb.

Hex.FTB.enabled
February 20th, 2005, 02:28 PM
There seemed to be a continuity error in this ep (we're getting a number of them this year. Threads' "4 years" more of Jacob, rather than the six it actually was, as another example )

The stones activated when they both picked them up, and that was after at least "Politics" (yes, they got them in TBFTG, but the flashback showed Daniel with no sling, so it had to be after Politics). And Joe was getting his info from Jack's reports. Yet, he knew about Argos and the nanites. Which was months before Jack would have handled the stone. That report would have been long since filed away (if Jack even wrote it, considering his situation). How did Joe know?


J.

Maybe Jack was a little behind on his reports. He hasn't exactly been Mr. Paperwork ("I have a desk?") :D

DarkQuee1
February 20th, 2005, 02:36 PM
Maybe Jack was a little behind on his reports. He hasn't exactly been Mr. Paperwork ("I have a deskk?") :D


Not that far behind! <<g>> I just think it was yet another continuity glitch. They're getting sloppy.

J.

keshou
February 20th, 2005, 03:02 PM
No. We were told he was reading Jack's reports, not channeling Jack's feelings. I thought that was a gentle (or not) ribbing of some fan's reactions.
J.
I had the impression that Sam and Daniel decided Joe was getting the detailed information about the team's off-world adventures - when Jack had no proximity to the stone - as Jack wrote his reports at the SGC.

As long as Jack was in proximity of the stone - at the SGC - I deduced that Joe could channel the thoughts and images directly from Jack. Otherwise how would Joe have known that Jack liked Mary Steenburgen, the color Peridot, Jack's feelings for Sam, about Pete Shanahan, etc? I doubt any of that was written up in Jack's reports.

Perhaps anything Jack thought about at the SGC - Daniel's death, feelings for Sam, Daniel appearing in Baal's gravity chamber - Joe could channel. I don't think Jack ever put Daniel's appearance in Baal's gravity prison in his reports. Hammond sure seemed surprised when Jack mentioned he'd seen Daniel (in Full Circle).

Jack certainly picked up Joe's thoughts and images about bowling on Thursdays and clipping his nose hairs. :eek: None of that was written down. Guess Joe had the stone with him a lot. ;)

Actually it doesn't pay to examine the logic of this too closely, does it? :p

MrBojangles
February 20th, 2005, 04:27 PM
Jack certainly picked up Joe's thoughts and images about bowling on Thursdays and clipping his nose hairs. :eek: None of that was written down. Guess Joe had the stone with him a lot. ;)

Joe carried it in his pocket all the time.



Actually it doesn't pay to examine the logic of this too closely, does it? :p
Nope. It'll make your head hurt. :(

KatG
February 21st, 2005, 08:23 AM
What's up with the lingering crotch shot on old Joe sprawled in his underwear on the sofa? Note to Andy Mikita: If you're going to do one of these in S9 I have some candidates to suggest. ;)



I think that was actually a homage to Homer Simpson, who Castellenata voices.

KatG
February 21st, 2005, 08:37 AM
However, what really rattled my very bones with anger was the CHEAP shot they took against people who call the show bad nowadays. It was when the wife said she liked more 'relationship' style stories than 'explosion' type stories.

If the stargate crew would open up their eyes they would see two things - 1) Their 'relationship' stories are god-awful television that should be left for soap operas and other junk, or TV shows that may actually be good but are geared toward this dimension. The stargate staff is NOT geared towards this area, and they do it horribly.

And, 2) The first five seasons (their quote-on-qoute 'explosion' episodes) had much better inter-character relationships than anything we've seen in the last three years.

So, it was no fault of the actors, but that one cheap shot alone ticked me off completely - the producers should go on the air and pubicly apologize - they have no right to justify their MISTAKE with taking a good TV show and turning it into crap.



The "relationship" line from Joe's wife was simply a homage to the faction of internet fandom who say exactly the same thing all the time. It doesn't necessarily mean that the writers feel that it's true. And some people, including me, do like the "interpersonal relationships".

Gatetrixer
February 21st, 2005, 01:40 PM
Few things about Citizen Joe that have been commented about.

Andy the kid aging so much: maybe TPTB have the "soap opera" syndrome about kids. Just jump them to teenage, leaving out the middle years.

Jack's gait in the park(and his shoes). Looked like any number of time I've seen MacGyver walking along in his humungous tennies. Same gait. Can't really distinguish what the shoes looked like, tho.

Jack's talking to Charlene in the park about the stargate (maybe). Is that any worse than shouting outside a gas station to Maybourne about the NID etc?

Gordy the floor sweeper: No he didn't age, tho we don't know how old he's supposed to be.. BTW I think he represented any number of young male fans, not because he didn't age, tho, just think it's a homage.

Don't take this episode seriously as far as continuity etc. Did you take "The Other Guys" seriously and really think SG would ever have someone like Felger there? I hated those eps, but liked this one.

Mac
February 21st, 2005, 03:45 PM
:)
I was prepared to really like this episode (hooked on spoilers) and thought at first they were just gently poking fun at the rabid fans (me) and I did enjoy the in-jokes but started to feel skewered. Maybe I'm just getting thin skinned in my old age, but making the person who watches religiously and buys the boxed sets displayed as a fool for caring is rather like biting the hand that feeds you.
And as for his reaction to Daniel's death, isn't he channeling Jack's reaction? Isn't it Jack's pain he is feeling, the pain he refuses to show.
I will not belabor the plot holes. I have rather mixed feeling over this episode.
Shouldn't some SF spit shine O'Neill's shoes?

Dearest Zoser,
Perhaps this episode is a gentle cautionary tale. To become involved with and care about the characters and the stories does not make you (or me) a fool. To have them take over your life, however, leaves you with no life of your own. Lucky Joe! For him, the SGC turns out to be real.......but the stories are still not HIS life.

I'd say I'm a fairly rabid SG fan myself (I, too, have all 7 seasons on DVD), and I loved the episode, even though I probably missed a few references while laughing hysterically. It IS easy to get deeply involved when a show is this well done, so please try to just enjoy laughing at yourself (I did), and don't take acknowledgment of your passion as an insult.


BTW,
I loved "Holiday" & "The Light", etc..............Joe's wife has no taste!

Contondant
February 22nd, 2005, 01:42 PM
I thought this was a great episode. I enjoyed watching Joe's interpretation of the events and I thought the clips were kept short enough so as to not comprise the entire episode thus, not making it strictly a clip episode per say. Very tasteful!

My favorite bits were:
"First of all... I'm am not terrible at Ping-Pong" -Jack (or something along those lines)
and
"I totally get Burns as Goa'ould" -Joe (and Jack's reaction to this!)

Brendan
February 22nd, 2005, 08:40 PM
My favourite part:

Joe: By the way, I totally see the connection. Burns, Goa-uld!
Jack: THANK YOU!!

Nice little referance to Lost City one season ago. :D

SmartFox
February 22nd, 2005, 08:44 PM
Didnt read what everyone had posted but just saw this ep (out of town on friday) and didnt really like it. The whole a civillian knowing the truth about the Stargate has been done already. It had some funny parts but i was contemplating just fast fowarding my tape and watching before i sleep.

Brendan
February 22nd, 2005, 09:30 PM
Didnt read what everyone had posted but just saw this ep (out of town on friday) and didnt really like it. The whole a civillian knowing the truth about the Stargate has been done already. It had some funny parts but i was contemplating just fast fowarding my tape and watching before i sleep.

Your right, aside from a few nice moments I didn't much like it either. It was just another RDA Lite episode as I like to call 'em. That means that it's an episode written because of RDA's cut backs. YES, YES, I know RDA was in the episode but really... come on for how long? Ten minutes? That hardly qaulifies. It was just another of the annual flashback episodes. I'm really getting bored with the flashback episodes.

Daniel's_twin
February 23rd, 2005, 05:05 AM
Your right, aside from a few nice moments I didn't much like it either. It was just another RDA Lite episode as I like to call 'em. That means that it's an episode written because of RDA's cut backs. YES, YES, I know RDA was in the episode but really... come on for how long? Ten minutes? That hardly qaulifies. It was just another of the annual flashback episodes. I'm really getting bored with the flashback episodes.

Oh, come on. Like I said, this definitely wasn't their best flashback, but it is interesting to see how they will incorporate flashbacks into an episode. Plus, it gives people who haven't been around for a while a chance to see what's happened before. :cool:

Captain-Peregrine
February 23rd, 2005, 06:45 AM
I thought the end was great. Joe was definatly up there with the grade "A" fans, lol. And I thought it was wonderful when we found out that O'Niell had been having visions of Joe's life for seven years and he found it relaxing. That was great! All in all, a pretty good clip show--one of the best I've seen on any show, and certainly the best I've seen on Stargate! :D Yeah, I wouldn't mind seeing Joe again.

Captain-Peregrine
February 23rd, 2005, 06:50 AM
There seemed to be a continuity error in this ep (we're getting a number of them this year. Threads' "4 years" more of Jacob, rather than the six it actually was, as another example )

The stones activated when they both picked them up, and that was after at least "Politics" (yes, they got them in TBFTG, but the flashback showed Daniel with no sling, so it had to be after Politics). And Joe was getting his info from Jack's reports. Yet, he knew about Argos and the nanites. Which was months before Jack would have handled the stone. That report would have been long since filed away (if Jack even wrote it, considering his situation). How did Joe know? J.

He probably knew because Jack was the one who had touched it, so Joe could see whatever happened to Jack(or had happened, if he thought about it), but he could only know what happened to the others through Jack's reports. So it makes sense that Joe would know about Jack from the beginning, but would only know of the others since after he touched the stone.

hermajesty
February 23rd, 2005, 07:24 AM
One other thought on Jack's visions of Joe's life. Joe had these intense visions of Jack when handling the stone. Jack only touched the stone once (turning it on). So perhaps his visions were seldom and less intense.
Thats a very good theory. I noticed the same plot hole when i watched it ... but i'm willing to overlook it because the rest of the episide was great. I don't normally like clipshows, but this one was great - and i think we can all identify with joe's obsessiveness ;)

Poor Joe when Daniel died. ((((Joe)))) Noone else thought Daniel even existed, so no sympathy for Joe. I really liked that part - and i don't think it was OTT, especially as Joe believed the 'stories' were true. I've been known to scream NOOOOOOOO at the tv and rant about it for weeks when major characters die.


Maybe he could be an on base barber or something....just toying with an idea here people!
Lol, that would be great.

Metarock Sam
February 23rd, 2005, 10:31 AM
A great episode and im sure I remeber Jack saying in one episode dreaming about being a barber and stuff like that.

oldgater
February 23rd, 2005, 07:09 PM
This is my first post and probably my last since I have only been spurred ito action by the "episode" citizen joe.

I have watched sg-1 since it first aired and have dilligently purchased every season on disc. Season 8 has been bad but I toughed it out and waited optimistically. But after citizen Joe I am giving up on Sg-1 completely.

The episode focused on a complete nobody. If i want to see a barber telling stories I have one down the road i can go and see! Sg-1 used to be sci-fi action and adventure with intelligent storylines,a cut above other sci-fi shows. But after the pile of crap that was citizen joe I am compelled to stop watching stargate entirely and I do not want that episode in my dvd collection.

The episode should really have been titled "Citizen Joe gets put in a rubber room"

Brendan
February 23rd, 2005, 08:55 PM
This is my first post and probably my last since I have only been spurred ito action by the "episode" citizen joe.

I have watched sg-1 since it first aired and have dilligently purchased every season on disc. Season 8 has been bad but I toughed it out and waited optimistically. But after citizen Joe I am giving up on Sg-1 completely.

The episode focused on a complete nobody. If i want to see a barber telling stories I have one down the road i can go and see! Sg-1 used to be sci-fi action and adventure with intelligent storylines,a cut above other sci-fi shows. But after the pile of crap that was citizen joe I am compelled to stop watching stargate entirely and I do not want that episode in my dvd collection.

The episode should really have been titled "Citizen Joe gets put in a rubber room"

Dude, hold on! Just wait until you see the next three episodes! Reckoning Parts 1 & 2 and Threads. If you thought season 8 has been bad, just like I have, then you'll be completely blown away by these three episodes. These episodes are SG-1 at it's best! I haven't seen a truly great episodes since season 7's Lost City. In fact Reckoning Part 2 has easily entered my top ten favourite SG-1 episodes and Threads is just outside it... probably the top 20.

Please man watch these episodes and if they don't change your mind about season 8 then well... I don't know what to say.

Contondant
February 24th, 2005, 01:33 AM
Wow, more people than I thought really disliked this episode! Funny, how I completely loved it.

For one, it's been said it was yet another RDA-light episode. I disagree. In fact, he's the fulcrum on which the episode turns. In terms of "light", this episode was much lighter on the other members of SG1. This episode didn't have that much RDA, focusing more on Joe, but the scenes when RDA was present were the best and really demonstrated some great O'Neillisms, which is what this show is really about for me :D . As a strict comparison to most of season 8 episodes, I thought there was more RDA on the whole (excepting certain earlier episodes).

I'd be interested to know just how much of the episode was dedicated to the "clips". I'd be willing to bet it's somewhere around 5 minutes, maybe 8 max. For a 42 minute episode, that's not bad. I could be wrong, but I truely thought the clips were kept purposefully short and sweet and far between.

I think from time it's important to remind the viewer that although SG1 is sci-fi, it's based in a very real world and in that world there are a whole LOT of normal people who don't know about the SG. A little perspective on reality is important... show how most people would react to suddenly finding out about the SG. It also brings to mind how people on earth have bought into the various cover stories for events I never imagine the government would be able to cover up. The part of this episode when Joe described the "truth vs. cover-story" was very interesting to me.

I just watched "Emancipation" yesterday. Although a classic episode in it's story telling, it's a story which can only be done so often without the exploits of such trips becoming the topic of discussion back on earth. I think the earth based episodes make the off-world episodes seem that much more realistic... the team still has to come home and deal with results/fallout of their off-world actions.

My 0.02$.

Bastet11191967
February 24th, 2005, 06:25 AM
A great episode and im sure I remeber Jack saying in one episode dreaming about being a barber and stuff like that.

I read the "official" review, and the comments on Stargate fans does hold true, to an extent. My brother and niece end up having to sit through Stargate Monday Night every second week they come to visit (LOL). As far as Joe's employee applying for a job at Piggly Wiggly, it might make sense if the town Joe lived in was located very close to the Indiana-Kentucky border. Regarding "Citizen Joe," I had thought initially that this particular episode was going to suck bigtime. While it may not be one of the greatest, I enjoyed it too. After all, it was from a different point of view. While it does seem odd that Jack never mentioned anything, perhaps he had written off as "wishful thinking" on his part. After all, how many times has he had his fishing trips in Minnesota interrupted or cancelled by work-related matters? For those of us who are too connected to our workplaces and had sometimes gone without a real vacation, it is understandable.

Jolinarsam
February 27th, 2005, 10:31 AM
Did the scene near the end where Joe says to Daniel that he belongs on the team seem familiar to anyone?

Just the way he said it reminded me of Pierre Bernard's rant on Conan O'Brien where he says the team is better without Daniel. Maybe it's just me, but I thought it was funny that the writers could have been firing back at Pierre with Joe's statement. ;)

yasureubetcha
February 28th, 2005, 10:44 PM
I was laughing so hard through this whole episode...I thought, "Hey, a geeky bald guy who knows all about the Stargate program! Didn't we do this...twice?" So from the teaser-thing, I wasn't looking forward to it. After watching it, though, I wouldn't have missed this one for anything!

It said everything the fans like to say...down to "About Pete Shannahan..."

They even bashed a couple eps, which was hilarious. And the Daniel thing was awesome.

The "plot," if one can even use that word within 10 miles of this ep, was nonexistent. The resolution is...Jack goes and explains the STARGATE to his wife? Yeah right. Worst ending ever...but still a great ep, because plot wasn't important to the ep, and neither were the clips, really. Which was good, because the ones they had weren't really any of the good ones, IMO. The humor was everything, and it was awesome. From the beer-omlette in the beginning to the fan-stuff that was throughout, it was HILARIOUS!

zats
March 13th, 2005, 07:16 AM
This ep was...silly. Not one of my favorite eps--it came across to me as a bit of a throwaway. The fact that I think it was mostly a chance for the writers to poke fun at the more rabid fans niggles a bit, but I'll live. And they made it sweet enough that I really can't be too mad. The scenes with Joe at the SGC were hilarious--even more so after it occured to me that his reactions were basically what mine would've been. Which apparently dooms me for inescapable dweebhood. Oh well. I'll live.

The "...and I won't say anything about your feelings for..." part was silly, as was the "...and about Pete..." bit.

I liked the fact that they went through and made fun of the series as a whole: it was like they spoofed it shades of "Wormhole X-Treme!" but actually made it funny. (And I loved that they made "Wormhole X-Treme!" part of the ep).

Joe's wife was so much like my parents and more tolerant friends (read: the ones who let me bable about SG and don't walk away while I'm talking) that it almost wasn't funny.

Almost.

Last word: an episode that should've annoyed the hell outta me and didn't, for a variety of reasons but mostly because it didn't take itself too seriously. :D

Sha're
March 25th, 2005, 01:05 PM
Yeah alot of people really dont like this episode. IMO I found this to be one of the best "clip shows" - really it was just a nod and a wink to the fans. Bringing Dan Castellenata in play Joe was the right choice, I warmed to him throughout this show. And like a few other people the part where Joe see Daniel dying and screams nooooo - just reminded me of all the times I've shouted and raged at the TV ;)
When taken on its merits as a clip show - I think it fairs quite well, I laughed, got a lump in my throat, sympathised, and recalled a few converstaions I've had about the show that are scarily familiar.

Kimba
March 25th, 2005, 01:29 PM
I quite enjoyed this episode. It got confusing at time with the flashbacks but it wasn't too bad. Being a writer myself, I tend to watch the episodes for its creativity and writing rather that the film direcition.