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SGAsgard
November 22nd, 2008, 02:10 PM
Remember the first lines in the episode. 'Earth has no ZPM" where did it go? Earth recieved 2 ZPM's from Atlatnis after the Repicators attacked. One went to the Odyssey, adn the other one went to the Outpost. So why can't Earth use it and why did Shepard say, "Earth has no ZPM."

There are only 3 explantions for this


1. It was used up in a battle to defeat the Ori ships that were about to attack, "even though no such battle eoccured @ least on stage in Ark of Truth"

2. The Miliary and IOA don't want to move the ZPM from the Ancient Outpost inroder to use in witht eh Stargate *at least not at this time*.

3. Plot Hole Hell

jenks
November 22nd, 2008, 02:24 PM
Who said that and when?

Shpinxinator
November 22nd, 2008, 02:34 PM
yeah...I don't remember that at all...

rsanchez
November 22nd, 2008, 02:39 PM
I think when he said Earth has no zpm, he meant to say Earth has no zpm it can use to dial the gate to another galaxy. You were right on #2. The ones on the Odyssey and in the Ancient outpost can't be removed, given to the SGC, and then returned, since many things can go wrong in transport or when dialing, or some enemy might unexpectedly attack when our defenses don't have the energy to put up a fight.

I believe Sheppard said that in the first minute of the episode, the only time he got to speak. What he said was (paraphrasing), "Earth has no zpm, which means three weeks in Daedalus, which means five weeks total. We only get these once a year, so I'm saving mine for a special occasion."

FoxyEX
November 22nd, 2008, 08:00 PM
From 3x12 (Echoes)


WEIR: We cannot keep all three ZeeP.Ms from the Replicator take-over, Rodney. We get one. Now, I don’t know how to make it any clearer for you.

McKAY: Well, I felt if I could just outline the reasons for keeping them -- you know, bullet point, very brief ...

WEIR: It was twenty-six pages!

McKAY: I know, but if we hope to persuade Stargate Command ...

WEIR (stopping and turning to face him): OK. So tell me. Who would you deprive of the other ZeeP.Ms? The Antarctic outpost?

McKAY: Well, no, because they need it to power the Chair to protect Earth.

WEIR: OK, how about the Odyssey, then? They’re getting the other ZeeP.M. to help them in their fight against the Ori. Rodney, we have enough power now to raise the shield and cloak the city and dial home. Please, can you start seeing the glass as half full?

Earth most definitely has a Zero Point Module. Plot hole.

KPRROK
November 22nd, 2008, 10:08 PM
I just re-watched it and Shep said "SGC doesn't have a ZPM." Earth does, yes, but not SGC.

Major_Griff
November 23rd, 2008, 02:42 AM
Right, the SGC doesn't have a ZPM. They keep it with the chair at all times in Antarctica. "Why can't they take it to the SGC when they don't need it for the chair?" you might ask. Well, if an attack comes suddenly with no warning, they'd have to transport it back, and who knows how long that would take or if that plane would get shot down. "Well they could beam it back!" you might say. That assumes a BC-304 is in orbit around Earth at all times. The Daedulus and Apollo are always going back and forth between galaxies and the Oddessy usually is off doing something some where in the MW, if it's not currently been taken apart to reproduce the Asgard tech.

ablevins425
November 23rd, 2008, 09:02 AM
Right, the SGC doesn't have a ZPM. They keep it with the chair at all times in Antarctica. "Why can't they take it to the SGC when they don't need it for the chair?" you might ask. Well, if an attack comes suddenly with no warning, they'd have to transport it back, and who knows how long that would take or if that plane would get shot down. "Well they could beam it back!" you might say. That assumes a BC-304 is in orbit around Earth at all times. The Daedulus and Apollo are always going back and forth between galaxies and the Oddessy usually is off doing something some where in the MW, if it's not currently been taken apart to reproduce the Asgard tech.

What would be really smart is to put up Asgard technologically advanced satelites that could be used to beam people around the world, so you wouldn't need the 304.

rick_coppola
November 23rd, 2008, 05:26 PM
I have a HUGE QUESTION!!

The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...

Seriously, u may say that it would take a long time to find, but we do speak ancient and i'm sure there is some kind of search engine.

I know "zpm" is not the same in ancient but you could probably find it under power generators or something... Just because ancients were super smart doesn't mean they had to go one by one on all of their database. it is only logic that they had some way of going to certain part even if they misspelled or if they wrote a word that was mentioned on a part of the article (come to think of it we have something like it GOOGLE!!!).

Is anybody else going crazy over this? because i am...

jelgate
November 23rd, 2008, 05:31 PM
I have a HUGE QUESTION!! The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...Seriously, u may say that it would take a long time to find, but we do speak ancient and i'm sure there is some kind of search engine. I know "zpm" is not the same in ancient but you could probably find it under power generators or something... Just because ancients were super smart doesn't mean they had to go one by one on all of their database. it is only logic that they had some way of going to certain part even if they misspelled or if they wrote a word that was mentioned on a part of the article (come to think of it we have something like it GOOGLE!!!).Is anybody else going crazy over this? because i am...Having the knowledge and resources to make a ZPM are two separate things

Major_Griff
November 23rd, 2008, 06:17 PM
What would be really smart is to put up Asgard technologically advanced satelites that could be used to beam people around the world, so you wouldn't need the 304.

Yes, that would be cool!

Ranlier
November 24th, 2008, 09:09 AM
I have a HUGE QUESTION!!

The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...

Seriously, u may say that it would take a long time to find, but we do speak ancient and i'm sure there is some kind of search engine.

I know "zpm" is not the same in ancient but you could probably find it under power generators or something... Just because ancients were super smart doesn't mean they had to go one by one on all of their database. it is only logic that they had some way of going to certain part even if they misspelled or if they wrote a word that was mentioned on a part of the article (come to think of it we have something like it GOOGLE!!!).

Is anybody else going crazy over this? because i am...

Rick, go to your ZPM thread... I posted my theory explaining your questions.
http://forum.gateworld.net/showpost.php?p=9287492&postcount=6

F Stop
November 24th, 2008, 03:18 PM
I have a HUGE QUESTION!!

The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...

Seriously, u may say that it would take a long time to find, but we do speak ancient and i'm sure there is some kind of search engine.

I know "zpm" is not the same in ancient but you could probably find it under power generators or something... Just because ancients were super smart doesn't mean they had to go one by one on all of their database. it is only logic that they had some way of going to certain part even if they misspelled or if they wrote a word that was mentioned on a part of the article (come to think of it we have something like it GOOGLE!!!).

Is anybody else going crazy over this? because i am...

Really good question. I've wondered the same thing in the past. Makes for a more interesting story as is though.

FallenAngelII
November 24th, 2008, 03:21 PM
If the ZPM is at the outpost and cannot be moved at any time in case of a surprise attack, does this mean there are ATA carriers at the outpost trained and prepared to defend our planet if such an attack comes, on the ready at all times, all days of the year?

Ltcolshepjumper
November 24th, 2008, 03:36 PM
Right, the SGC doesn't have a ZPM. They keep it with the chair at all times in Antarctica. "Why can't they take it to the SGC when they don't need it for the chair?" you might ask. Well, if an attack comes suddenly with no warning, they'd have to transport it back, and who knows how long that would take or if that plane would get shot down. "Well they could beam it back!" you might say. That assumes a BC-304 is in orbit around Earth at all times. The Daedulus and Apollo are always going back and forth between galaxies and the Oddessy usually is off doing something some where in the MW, if it's not currently been taken apart to reproduce the Asgard tech.

What I don't get is, why does the Odyssey still need it's ZPM? The Ori have been defeated. Unless Earth is currently fighting another Ancient-level enemy (which is unlikely) the Odyssey is just wasting the ZPM. Another thing- the Antarctic outpost is rarely used. According to some treaty mentinoed in New Order, there are supposed to be no military forces or occupation of the outpost. Now, why can't the IOA move the chair and drones to the SGC? The IOA knows no one else is going to use the outpost but the US. At the very least, the SGC can't use the ZPM to power the gate as well as using the chair. And it's possible because they were able to move it in The Road Not Taken.

Major_Griff
November 24th, 2008, 03:56 PM
If the ZPM is at the outpost and cannot be moved at any time in case of a surprise attack, does this mean there are ATA carriers at the outpost trained and prepared to defend our planet if such an attack comes, on the ready at all times, all days of the year?

Presumably, I don't see why that would be a problem. I know there's only a handful of people who have the gene and most of them are on Atlantis, but you only need three people to do eight hour shifts to have some one ready for 24 hours.


What I don't get is, why does the Odyssey still need it's ZPM? The Ori have been defeated. Unless Earth is currently fighting another Ancient-level enemy (which is unlikely) the Odyssey is just wasting the ZPM. Another thing- the Antarctic outpost is rarely used. According to some treaty mentinoed in New Order, there are supposed to be no military forces or occupation of the outpost. Now, why can't the IOA move the chair and drones to the SGC? The IOA knows no one else is going to use the outpost but the US. At the very least, the SGC can't use the ZPM to power the gate as well as using the chair. And it's possible because they were able to move it in The Road Not Taken.

Good question, The Odyssey really does not need a ZPM to take the few LA mother ships it would come across, so I don't know why that ZPM isn't at the SGC. As for why they don't move the outpost, I imagine they other countries in the IOA like having the most powerful weapon on Earth in neutral ground and not in the U.S.

Anon
November 25th, 2008, 08:35 AM
zpm was used in the attack of anubis, DUH

Major_Griff
November 26th, 2008, 04:54 PM
zpm was used in the attack of anubis, DUH

The first ZPM earth got, but after the Ancients briefly retook Atlantis in the Return, we had three ZPM's one stayed on Atlantis, one went to the outpost and one went to the Odyssey to help fight the Ori. DUH

DragonLadyK
November 26th, 2008, 07:25 PM
Remember the first lines in the episode. 'Earth has no ZPM" where did it go? Earth recieved 2 ZPM's from Atlatnis after the Repicators attacked. One went to the Odyssey, adn the other one went to the Outpost. So why can't Earth use it and why did Shepard say, "Earth has no ZPM."

Someone already mentioned that SGC doesn't have a ZPM but the Outpost does.

I think the big picture here is that McKay and Keller were on personal leave at the time and Sheppard was discussing personal leave. Risking Antartic storms and a day's flight to bring the ZPM to the SGC just isn't something the military is going to do for personal leave. Now if Atlantis is beseiged by Wraith and they need to move a boatload of reinforcements, yes, then it would be worth the risk just as weekly check-ins are considered worth the drain on the Atlantis ZPM.

But for personal stuff? People have to use Caldwell's bus.

DragonLady

Quadhelix
November 27th, 2008, 04:55 PM
The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...
This is logic is about as sound as a screen door on a submarine. Yes, we have access to the Ancient database. So what? If you gave Aristotle the blueprints for a Nuclear bomb, could he build one? Of course not! He would not have access to the infrastructure necessary to refine the appropriate raw materials, construct the components of the bomb from those materials, and then assemble those components into an actual bomb.

tricky
November 27th, 2008, 05:29 PM
This is logic is about as sound as a screen door on a submarine. Yes, we have access to the Ancient database. So what? If you gave Aristotle the blueprints for a Nuclear bomb, could he build one? Of course not! He would not have access to the infrastructure necessary to refine the appropriate raw materials, construct the components of the bomb from those materials, and then assemble those components into an actual bomb.


But we have something that your theoretical ARistotle doesn't: context! The humans on this show have some knowledge of Ancient tech, theories and history. We know a great deal about them. Heck, we've even managed to get some of their stuff to work for us! I'm not saying that McKay could build one if you gave him plans (heck, he can't even make sense of his theories he wrote out when he was ascending), but he might be able to work out enough of the info to get a Earth based ZPM program started.

If they said it took some rare element, process or component to make a ZPM, I'd buy that. But to say they left no record of something as crucial to their culture as a ZPM, while they seem to have no problem leaving things like the "ascendotron" "easy bake replicator oven" and "home bomb tumor maker" lying around, sorta seems a little backwards, no?

nx01a
November 27th, 2008, 07:55 PM
We don't need a ZPM. We can make those Asgard ion generators, in theory with the knowledge from the Asgard Core and their matter creation device. Definitely not as much power, but it's alot more than naquadah generators on overload.

KlaxxonBlue
November 29th, 2008, 08:00 AM
I have a HUGE QUESTION!!

The Ancients created the Zpm's right? and We have controled the Ancient database for what, five years now? ISTN'T IT ABOUT TIME THAT WE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE SOME???!!! The replicators did...

Seriously, u may say that it would take a long time to find, but we do speak ancient and i'm sure there is some kind of search engine.

I know "zpm" is not the same in ancient but you could probably find it under power generators or something... Just because ancients were super smart doesn't mean they had to go one by one on all of their database. it is only logic that they had some way of going to certain part even if they misspelled or if they wrote a word that was mentioned on a part of the article (come to think of it we have something like it GOOGLE!!!).

Is anybody else going crazy over this? because i am...

OMG.. I feel your pain here. This has got to be the stupidest thing in the entire series. They went to Pegasus looking for ZPM's and now.. They have a full blown war on their hands. :(

Just give us the GD ZPM's PLEASE!

KlaxxonBlue