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View Full Version : This time round, a mistake TPTB CANNOT make!



Empress Vajnraa
October 4th, 2008, 08:10 PM
With this series, the TPTB (the ones in charge of making the Stargate shows), they have to plan the stories a head of time from season to season.

I don't mean write each episode a head of time for every season, I just mean they should have a general idea of where the story arcs will go down the line, so they don't end up making mistakes like:

*last minute find-ancient-weapon-a-thon to beat the baddies
*make the enemy seem too human, or too weak like they did with the Wraith
*prevent at least some plot holes

and of course, these arcs could be tweaked if needed to change things based on adverse fan-reactions to things, or break out characters/things that were more popular than anticipated.

morjana
October 4th, 2008, 09:09 PM
With this series, the TPTB (the ones in charge of making the Stargate shows), they have to plan the stories a head of time from season to season.



Uhm...Stargate SG-1 had that opportunity as well for the first four seasons. When Showtime ordered SG1, they originally ordered 44 episodes - TWO seasons -- on the get-go. Halfway through the first season, Showtime ordered two additional seasons.

The majority of TV series don't have that type of luxury when it comes to planning their story arcs.

A majority of the NEW US TV series for the Broadcast networks have a nine episode order...and if the ratings are good for the first couple of episodes, they might get an order for another four episodes. Some series get a full season order. Some, like Raising The Bar (for some unexplained reason) get an order for a second season. (Go figure.)

StoyBoy720
October 4th, 2008, 09:23 PM
With the development that's going into it, there's no doubt in my mind that Universe will get its full 20 episodes straight from the get-go. Past that, it's anybody's guess how long it will stay on the air. It may get 5 seasons, it may get less. I'm sure there will be general plans made up in the series bible for seasonal arcs past the first season. I'd guess if the show gets an abrupt ending, another DVD movie would cap everything off, as with the previous shows.

General Yogi Bear
October 4th, 2008, 09:27 PM
I really can't think of that many shows that have several seasons pre-planned before starting to shoot. I think Babylon 5 may have been pre-planned. I would think most shows dont plan beyond 2 seasons because they have alot of work to do making the current season.

Jangles
October 4th, 2008, 11:01 PM
I think the creators of Fringe said in an interview they had an idea about were that show was going to end whither it be in one season or seven seasons or whatever, so some pre-planning does happen I would think. To tell the truth, I think they aught to plan tv shows like they are writing a book with each episode like another chapter in the story leading to a definite end. I really think they need to plan a show to run for a certain amount of time and then end it and if the show is popular enough, recreate it by coming at it another way. It seems to work for anime anyway. Most anime I have seen run for one season of 12 or 24-26 episodes and a movie or two.

I think they could make a live action tv show planned to run for 3 or 4 seasons and then end it. It would force the writers to make better storylines without as much filler as the time would be more valuable. It seems to me that is what they did for Battlestar Galatica, ending in 4 seasons, and I honestly can't think any useless episodes of that show. Some slow ones for sure, but all had good story or character info. Now the problem with BSG is that they took so long in between seasons that I lost track of it and lost interest.

But yeah, some preplanning before hand would do a world of good. I know when I do my writing it helps to have an idea of where I am headed. Sometimes I even come up with an ending for something and work backwards, meeting somewhere in the middle.

General Yogi Bear
October 4th, 2008, 11:17 PM
Pre-planning is a two edge sword. The planning could be good or it could be bad. If it was bad in the middle of season you might have to change everything. The guald story in SG-1 lasted 8 years. Watching week after week felt like a long time, when i was watching season 5 back in 2000-01 the show felt like it was stalling, i couldnt figure out where they were going with it and than the episodes Summit and Last Stand happen and I thought the guald were going to be defeated for good but it didnt happen so I took a break from the show for a while (mostly because i didnt know they had gone to sci-fi and two i was tired of it) But than i started to watch again and things picked up in season 6 and than lost city in season 7 and the final defeat of the guald and replicators in season 8. Atlantis has been alot more fast paced story wise (only took 1 and a half season to defeat the replicators) either that or me getting older makes time go faster. ha

TheHumanElement
October 5th, 2008, 12:34 AM
To tell the truth, I think they aught to plan TV shows like they are writing a book with each episode like another chapter in the story leading to a definite end. I really think they need to plan a show to run for a certain amount of time and then end it and if the show is popular enough, recreate it by coming at it another way. It seems to work for anime anyway. Most anime I have seen run for one season of 12 or 24-26 episodes and a movie or two.


I agree with the idea of breaking the season up into chapters. Unfortunately, I read somewhere that the Sci-Fi channel doesn't want each episode to build up into a larger more complex story. Sci-Fi wants each episode to be a stand alone episode independent of other stories. That's why the series always has so much "filler" stories that address random plots each episode each season. SciFi wants the show to be able to attract a larger audience as the show progresses. They believe that story intensive shows which require viewers to watch previous episodes to get background story are to intimidating to new viewers and discourage new viewers from jumping in mid-season or mid-series. So I think the problem is with the Sci-Fi channel, not necessarily Stargate.

They tried to force BSG to follow this standalone format. They did for awhile after the Galactica fleet escaped New Caprica, but as a result BSG lost ratings so Sci-Fi let BSG return to a complex story structure format.

The entire reason both BSG and STA are being canceled is so that each franchise can create a new show that'll attract new viewers to the show. Stagate has the Universe spin-off and BSG has the Caprica spin-off.

I prefer more complex stories where each episode builds the overall series into a much larger storylines.

Agito
October 5th, 2008, 03:53 AM
Never posted on the forum before so Hi there \o/

I personally like big story arcs and it shows when good planning goes into it, although I wasnt a huge fan of the series, but Season 3 of Enterprise still remains one of my favourite seasons of any sci fi show purely because the whole season was just one big story arc with I think only one "filler" episode in between. Am a huge fan of Farscape and both Stargates but when its planned correctly it can lift even the most poorly executed show.

kymeric
October 5th, 2008, 08:58 AM
With this series, the TPTB (the ones in charge of making the Stargate shows), they have to plan the stories a head of time from season to season.

I don't mean write each episode a head of time for every season, I just mean they should have a general idea of where the story arcs will go down the line, so they don't end up making mistakes like:

*last minute find-ancient-weapon-a-thon to beat the baddies
*make the enemy seem too human, or too weak like they did with the Wraith
*prevent at least some plot holes

and of course, these arcs could be tweaked if needed to change things based on adverse fan-reactions to things, or break out characters/things that were more popular than anticipated.

They probably know that there is a 5 year tv life to the new show and hopefully have a end-of-season2 smash up to plan for the inevitable season 2 blahs every show gets. Frankly i hope they hire a couple characters with the knowledge they will be killed off in year X. You need a big season premire and finalle and a big mideason 2 parter to keep momentum, and you need to toss in some character eps inbetween to save money and move plots along.

And dont forget season 3 is where you introduce a new baddie, season 4 is where you kill the old one off.

knowles2
October 5th, 2008, 10:09 AM
The very idea of stargate destiny is that the ship is on e pre planned unchangeable course. To me this means that a series long arc is a must have.

They need to planned for a five years only series. They know they will not get more than five years so they should plan for five seasons. With space left in the story for scifi renew after the fifth season.

In fact I would like them in the very first episode to make it that they cannot return home for five years. May be that the reason they sent such a young crew in the first place, is that it is a five years long mission with little hope of returning before that.


Just a little story extension idea: May be the crew figure out as their five years course is reset, the ships AI allows a small manual override and this allows the team an the opportunity to rescue a friend left behind and finish off a enemy they left undefeated.


Obviously if they cancel it before the fifth season then just end the show with the ship destruction and the crew all dying. I just do not see SGU feature film length material.

Obviously a few filler episodes along the way has got to be planned into the time line, as the author of the Babylon five series did, this is to allow for the many unknowns which happens in a tv series.

And if scifi thinks complicated stories are not popular, may I suggest they take a little look at such little shows as Heroes and the even smaller show that is Lost. By smaller I actually mean shows which are way bigger than anything SCIFI got airing.

If they do not want to go that complicated then follow Babylon five format where overall the story is a lot simpler compared to the above but still pretty complex.

akren
October 5th, 2008, 12:41 PM
I agree with what has bene said previously, stand alone storylines or ini-arcs are also fun, but look @ the likes of Babylon Five, that was planned out from the beginning & i think it has enhanced their storyline & it shows in the qaulity of the story & depth/development of the characters. DS9 was also another good example of a superior show that not only took the StarTrek franchise to a new level, but had a massive, orver-arching storyline that also tied in with stand-alone stories & smaller, but no less important, sub-plots. :)

wintering
October 5th, 2008, 09:00 PM
I'm new to the whole Stargate thing so I hope you guys don't mind my asking, but what does TPTB stand for? I've seen many people use it to refer to the show runners but I don't know if it specifically stand for something.

thekillman
October 5th, 2008, 11:36 PM
well i say they should plan it out generally. but constitency is the main prpb

General Yogi Bear
October 6th, 2008, 12:16 AM
What we really need in this show is more Replicator stories. Am I right people? Weeeeeeee!
Long live the Replicators.

spinny magee
October 6th, 2008, 12:38 AM
Well it's always good to plan ahead so you have enough time to fix and notice these mistakes you have pointed out.General Yogi honestly Replicators have been done to death i mean i liked them but when they appeared on SGA i didn't. I don't think fans would welcome Replicators into SGU

Jangles
October 6th, 2008, 03:42 PM
I don't think we need to see the Replicators again but I have always found a pure tech based race kinda cool.

GraceONeill
October 7th, 2008, 12:42 AM
I think it would be a lot better if they planned it all out before they at least got too far in. This would prevent many slight mistakes they have made with character personalities and such before.