It is not cannon unless it makes the final cut

[TheGreatLordGeorge]

Okay, so this is a thread which will lead to many reds and nasty pm's being sent to me but it is somethnig i have to say.

Sam and Jack together is not cannon unless it makes the final cut. Therefore, as of episode501 they are not an item.

[SamJackShipper93]

Don't understand why. As one of the people on the Sam/Jack family forum said (don't remember who, sorry but this had to be said, someone's trying to shoot down our ship!) "The scene was writen, the scene was filmed, and it had every intention of making it into the final cut." Many of TPTB, esp. JM have said that they believe Sam and Jack are together, so why don't you believe that they are?

[SamJackShipLover]

I agree *points at username ... yes I'm a shipper and I still agree*. If it's not in the final cut a scene is not canon. But .... the cut scene from Trio is not the only thing to base their "togetherness" on. And all the commentaries, the cut scene, JM's blog etc., clearcly state that the hints we did get in the actual eps after I guess Threads do mean they are together

[VSS]

I agree *points at username ... yes I'm a shipper and I still agree*. If it's not in the final cut a scene is not canon. But .... the cut scene from Trio is not the only thing to base their "togetherness" on. And all the commentaries, the cut scene, JM's blog etc., clearcly state that the hints we did get in the actual eps after I guess Threads do mean they are together

Well, right.

But to be frank, it's not cannon unless it's weaponry.

[SamJackShipLover]

Well, right.

But to be frank, it's not cannon unless it's weaponry.

Meanie

[VSS]

Meanie

Well, I'm tired of the same old arguments.

In the beginning it was: "I don't want to be hit over the head with Sam/Jack romance stuff."
Then, when it's written more subtly, it's "Now there's no Sam/Jack romance stuff, so there."

Really, if you're not a Sam/Jack shipper, why worry about it? It's not taking any precious screen time away from the things you do like, is it?

[dipsofjazz]

Okay, so this is a thread which will lead to many reds and nasty pm's being sent to me but it is somethnig i have to say.

Sam and Jack together is not cannon unless it makes the final cut. Therefore, as of episode501 they are not an item.

What is the purpose of your thread?

Is it to discuss what is/isn't deemed canon on Stargate? If so, then I agree with you. Canon, to me, is what I see on the screen in an episode or in the dvd movies.

If the purpose of the thread is for you to stick your tongue out and say "neener, neener" to the shippers, then I'm not surprised at the wording of your first sentence, since the childishness of your post will probably irritate some people.

[Skydiver]

i tend to agree. As a factual statement, 'canon' is what you see on the screen.

Which, honestly, means that pretty much every single ship in the two shows aren't real.

daniel/shau'ri
teal'c/ishta
sam/pete
jack/sara
jack/laira

and a few others, sure, they're canon.

And take some alternate universes into account, so is sam/jack. They were married/engaged in at least two that i can recall off the top of my head.

The point is, yes, your statement is factual. It ain't canon unless it's on the screen. But, while your post may point out only one of the many possible ships, i think you're gonna find that the overall majority of fans as a whole see whatever ship they want to see, regardless of it being canon or not. So, don't just pick on the one ship you may have an issue with at this moment in time, please, feel free to list ALL the non-canon ships out there.

[silly sally]

Okay, so this is a thread which will lead to many reds and nasty pm's being sent to me but it is somethnig i have to say.

Sam and Jack together is not cannon unless it makes the final cut. Therefore, as of episode501 they are not an item.

i tend to agree. As a factual statement, 'canon' is what you see on the screen.

Which, honestly, means that pretty much every single ship in the two shows aren't real.

daniel/shau'ri
teal'c/ishta
sam/pete
jack/sara
jack/laira

and a few others, sure, they're canon.

And take some alternate universes into account, so is sam/jack. They were married/engaged in at least two that i can recall off the top of my head.

The point is, yes, your statement is factual. It ain't canon unless it's on the screen. But, while your post may point out only one of the many possible ships, i think you're gonna find that the overall majority of fans as a whole see whatever ship they want to see, regardless of it being canon or not. So, don't just pick on the one ship you may have an issue with at this moment in time, please, feel free to list ALL the non-canon ships out there.

Actually I think it's semi-canon. They shot it, but it didn't make the episode because it ran too long (a.k.a. they didn't change their mind about the scene) they let it be part of the deleted scenes...

[VSS]

i tend to agree. As a factual statement, 'canon' is what you see on the screen.

Which, honestly, means that pretty much every single ship in the two shows aren't real.

daniel/shau'ri
teal'c/ishta
sam/pete
jack/sara
jack/laira

and a few others, sure, they're canon.

And take some alternate universes into account, so is sam/jack. They were married/engaged in at least two that i can recall off the top of my head.

The point is, yes, your statement is factual. It ain't canon unless it's on the screen. But, while your post may point out only one of the many possible ships, i think you're gonna find that the overall majority of fans as a whole see whatever ship they want to see, regardless of it being canon or not. So, don't just pick on the one ship you may have an issue with at this moment in time, please, feel free to list ALL the non-canon ships out there.

Not including the AU S/J I think that S/J is canon, too, primarily because of D&C and WoO and perhaps Threads. Because if we take everything to its logical extreme only Jack/Sara, Sam/Pete and Daniel/Sha're count. We never saw any of the other people in question sleep with each other, did we? It's just implied. (That is what what sets that list apart from all the others, right?). You can see how silly this gets, really fast.

At some point, you have to set a reasonable threshold of proof. Otherwise only married or engaged people count, and that's not real life.

Edit: I mean real life as portrayed on TV!

[Skydiver]

i'm all for letting people see what they want to see. You want a debate, try the 'canon/non-canon' argument with some jack/daniel fans

they are most passionate in defense of thier ship, and most creative is seeing canon where they want to see it...just like every other shipper out there

I personally find sam/jack to be a LOT more canon than, sam/martouf for example, because it was really marty clinging to the last vestages of his love and sam's feelings influenced by the memories of jolinar.

but don't try to tell that to a sam/marty shipper.

I'm all for letting people see what they want to see, just as i see what i want to see, and not waste time with who is 'right' and who is 'wrong'

[VSS]

i'm all for letting people see what they want to see. You want a debate, try the 'canon/non-canon' argument with some jack/daniel fans

they are most passionate in defense of thier ship, and most creative is seeing canon where they want to see it...just like every other shipper out there

I personally find sam/jack to be a LOT more canon than, sam/martouf for example, because it was really marty clinging to the last vestages of his love and sam's feelings influenced by the memories of jolinar.

but don't try to tell that to a sam/marty shipper.

I'm all for letting people see what they want to see, just as i see what i want to see, and not waste time with who is 'right' and who is 'wrong'

In general, I agree. But, TPTB have fanned a lot of flames with this Trio clip, and their various comments.

Edit: It's a strange situation. I've never been in any other fandoms before, but it strikes me as kind of odd.

[Nikki]

It is canon that they have romantic feelings for each other (Divide and Conquer, Beneath the Surface, Window of Opportunity, Grace, Threads etc) but it is semi-canon that they are in a romantic relationship together...there sure are a lot of hints of them being together but all we need is confirmation.

[VSS]

This is more of a human nature observation, than anything.
But when there are so many threads/comments about a situation- both for and against- there's something going on.