Eurondans and Tollan

[EternalAlteran]

I think these two races where underestimated and I'll tell you why:

-The Tollan are known to be able to create a device that produces an unlimited amount of productive energy. (Enigma: Narim tells Carter that the people that got this device from the Tollan used it to create a war that destroyed their planet and that of the tollan)

-The Eurondans where able to create a defense shield that covered their base that was able to last a war that lasted at least a generation. It only needed power to work and if enough power was supplied to it, it could last indefenitly. Also it could last almost indefenitly when no strain was placed on it. (The other side: The Eurondans trade technology with Earth for heavy water, they are using the heavy water to strengthen their defense shield and to win the war) By the way this sounds a lot like the ancient city shield.

If you were to put these two technologies together you would have an everlasting impenitrable barrier

[pbutter]

-The Tollan are known to be able to create a device that produces an unlimited amount of productive energy. (Enigma: Narim tells Carter that the people that got this device from the Tollan used it to create a war that destroyed their planet and that of the tollan)

Well..., Narim was a funny guy..., "unlimited energy".. lol, he though Earth was "primitive" so that is why he used words like "unlimited energy" and "indestructible material".

[s09119]

Well..., Narim was a funny guy..., "unlimited energy".. lol, he though Earth was "primitive" so that is why he used words like "unlimited energy" and "indestructible material".

...Earth was and still is primitive compared to races like the Tollan, Ancients, Asgard, etc.

.000001% of the population having access to alien technology does not make a society "advanced" by any means.

[pbutter]

...Earth was and still is primitive compared to races like the Tollan, Ancients, Asgard, etc.

.000001% of the population having access to alien technology does not make a society "advanced" by any means.

First of all, when did i say Earth was advanced then the Tollan, Ancients or Asgard ?
My point was that, Narim thought Earth was so primitive that he did not think Earthlings would understand what Nuclear Fission/Fusion reaction (or any type of comprable method of enery generation) was and decided to use the term "unlimited", "indestructible" and such.

Second thing, you can keep your hippiesh beliefs to yourself, and not make this thread another "Earth bash" thread, like you have done in the past.
Also, the Tollan are considerably primitive when compared to the Asgard.

[Jaffa Teal'c]

most races are primitive compared to the asgard

[s09119]

First of all, when did i say Earth was advanced then the Tollan, Ancients or Asgard ?
My point was that, Narim thought Earth was so primitive that he did not think Earthlings would understand what Nuclear Fission/Fusion reaction (or any type of comprable method of enery generation) was and decided to use the term "unlimited", "indestructible" and such.

Actually, Narim had quite a high opinion of us; it was Omac that believed we were too "primitive" to understand anything. Narim merely believed that we would be unable to graps most Tollan technology... which was true, was it not? Could S5 Carter have figured out ion cannons or phase-shifting devices? No, of course not. She probably would have an easier time of it now, having seen Merlin's device, but back then she would be hopelessly lost.

Second thing, you can keep your hippiesh beliefs to yourself, and not make this thread another "Earth bash" thread, like you have done in the past.
Also, the Tollan are considerably primitive when compared to the Asgard.

I believe I am guaranteed the right of free speech here, so I'll say what I please, thank for very much. I'm not "bashing Earth" here, either, just stating something fairly obvious. Just because a select few people understand something does not translate into the entire civilization getting to brag about how smart they are. Until more than a few dozen people know how to work any of our cool alien toys, the Tau'ri are just another somewhat-unadvanced race in the universe.

And the Tollan are primitive in some areas, certainly (shields, hyperdrives, etc.), but they seem to have surpassed the Asgard in a few sections (phase-shifting, stargate-construction (the Asgard used Milky Way ones, not their own), and those weapon-disabling devices). Granted, we don't know all of what either race had, but had the Asgard been able to build phase-dhifting devices or things that could disable weaponry automatically, they would've had to be idiots not to eomply them against the Goa'uld, Replicators, or Ori.

[pbutter]

Actually, Narim had quite a high opinion of us; it was Omac that believed we were too "primitive" to understand anything. Narim merely believed that we would be unable to graps most Tollan technology...

Narim called Earth primitive a number of times.

I believe I am guaranteed the right of free speech here, so I'll say what I please, thank for very much. I'm not "bashing Earth" here, either, just stating something fairly obvious. Just because a select few people understand something does not translate into the entire civilization getting to brag about how smart they are. Until more than a few dozen people know how to work any of our cool alien toys, the Tau'ri are just another somewhat-unadvanced race in the universe.

That free speech crap is not going to work here. You purposely deviated the thread by stating "Earth was and still is primitive" like you had done in the other Earths' accomplishments thread, by saying that the 303/Prometheus was made by the Goauld.

And the Tollan are primitive in some areas, certainly (shields, hyperdrives, etc.), but they seem to have surpassed the Asgard in a few sections (phase-shifting, stargate-construction (the Asgard used Milky Way ones, not their own), and those weapon-disabling devices). Granted, we don't know all of what either race had, but had the Asgard been able to build phase-dhifting devices or things that could disable weaponry automatically, they would've had to be idiots not to eomply them against the Goa'uld, Replicators, or Ori.

The Asgard could have easily built a phase-shift device if they wanted to, because they have achieved far greater feats in the past. And the Asgard did have weapon-disabling devices, Thors hammer was such a device, it transported SG1 to another location without their weapons.

[s09119]

Narim called Earth primitive a number of times.

...just as often as he made clear that he still respected the Tau'ri and liked them, especially Samantha Carter. He used the word casually, not out of spite or anger like Omac did.

That free speech crap is not going to work here. You purposely deviated the thread by stating "Earth was and still is primitive" like you had done in the other Earths' accomplishments thread, by saying that the 303/Prometheus was made by the Goauld.

It's a valid remark to make, though, isn't it? Your argument was that Narim's word can't be trusted because he deliberately used false wordings due to our being primitive... my response is that we are primitive. And I don't believe the other thread is involed here, but since you're twisting my words... I said that the 303 was mostly Goa'uld technology and its final systems were made operable by one. I never said they built it themselves...

The Asgard could have easily built a phase-shift device if they wanted to, because they have achieved far greater feats in the past. And the Asgard did have weapon-disabling devices, Thors hammer was such a device, it transported SG1 to another location without their weapons.

Thor's Hammer removed the weapons, it didn't disable them. There is a difference there. Taking something away is fairly simple, it seems, as beaming or similar technologies are somewhat common. In my opinion, though, the ability to change the inner workings of any weapon to make it incapable of firing instantaneously is more impressive in this application.

And just because the Asgard were advanced in one area doesn't mean they were advanced in other ones... genetics, anyone?








Back on-topic, I think any war between these two would be a stalemate. The Tollan would just sit back and let their defenses take out any Eurondan attacks, and the Eurondans would just send wave after wave of drone ships into their cannons. Neither of them appeared to have any end-all weapon (okay, maybe the Tollan could just bombard them with their phase-bomb...) that would guarantee victory.

[apollo22]

did anyone notice the similarity of the shield generator of the Eurondans and the shield generator that hathor had in the episode where she captures sg1 and tries to implant oniell with a symbiote. possible theft

[s09119]

did anyone notice the similarity of the shield generator of the Eurondans and the shield generator that hathor had in the episode where she captures sg1 and tries to implant oniell with a symbiote. possible theft

Hathor had a shield generator...? This is news to me, I'll have to rewatch the episode.

Was there any indication that the Eurondans had encountered the Goa'uld before?

[pbutter]

It's a valid remark to make, though, isn't it? Your argument was that Narim's word can't be trusted because he deliberately used false wordings due to our being primitive... my response is that we are primitive.

When did i say that ?
When did i say he can't be trusted ?
I said he used words like "unlimited energy" and "indestructible material" because he thought we/Earth would not understand a deeper scientific explanation.

I said that the 303 was mostly Goa'uld technology and its final systems were made operable by one. I never said they built it themselves...

Well, everyone, including the thread starter disagreed with you on that, didn't they.

Thor's Hammer removed the weapons, it didn't disable them. There is a difference there. Taking something away is fairly simple, it seems, as beaming or similar technologies are somewhat common. In my opinion, though, the ability to change the inner workings of any weapon to make it incapable of firing instantaneously is more impressive in this application.

Taking something away using beaming technology, that transports matter from one spot to another is simpler than something that disables a primitive weapon ?.... lol.. , Say no more.., you're bias is clearly showing.

And just because the Asgard were advanced in one area doesn't mean they were advanced in other ones... genetics, anyone?

The Tollan could live for 200 years.. so what. The Goauld could live for thousands of years, the Jaffa hundreds..

Back on-topic, I think any war between these two would be a stalemate. The Tollan would just sit back and let their defenses take out any Eurondan attacks, and the Eurondans would just send wave after wave of drone ships into their cannons. Neither of them appeared to have any end-all weapon (okay, maybe the Tollan could just bombard them with their phase-bomb...) that would guarantee victory.

You are fixated on my posts.., aren't you...
You failed to notice that this is not a who's more powerfull/VS thread.

[JSPuddlejumper]

"Tollan are known to be able to create a device that produces an unlimited amount of productive energy"

No such thing can ever exist in the fake or real world, ever.

Think about that, unlimited energy, that would be greater 'output' than the universe could produce, in SG1 case I would suppose the multi-verse.

Tollans are very advanced, but not to the level of the Great Races.

I remember the "indestructable" material Tollan cannons being easily destroyed by 1 Ha'tak.

There was a lot of exaggeration on in the early seasons of SG1, especially regarding the capabilities of the Ancients, but they were not the only ones obviously.

I do not think Asgard ever bothered to make stargates. Why? O'Neill calls Thor, he is there in a few seconds (from another galaxy). Asgard ships are unmatched in speed. But without a doubt, if the Asgard wanted to create stargates, they would be able to.

Now with the Asgard database, Earth has the best ships and will easily surpass the Tollans in overall tech much faster than you would think.

Ex: Earth scientist creating a ARG immune human form Replicators. IOA creating a ARG immune insectoid MW replicator in AoT. A feat that is unrivalled even amongst the great races.

[fugiman]

Ex: Earth scientist creating a ARG immune human form Replicators. IOA creating a ARG immune insectoid MW replicator in AoT. A feat that is unrivalled even amongst the great races.

Just for the record we don't know for a fact that they couldn't but what I like to think is that the Ancinets realized how stupid of an idea it was to make an almost unbeatalbe enemy that could not be destroyed with out destroying the galaxy so they just let them be ARG vunrable


This just shows how arrogant us Earth humans are to think that we can control replicators. I mean haven't we faced them enough to know that the ARG is a good thing?

[s09119]

When did i say that ?
When did i say he can't be trusted ?
I said he used words like "unlimited energy" and "indestructible material" because he thought we/Earth would not understand a deeper scientific explanation.

He knew Sam was smart enough to figure out a hell of a lot, and he obviously knew that she was Earth's most esteemed scientist. Why would he have to dumb something like "unlimited energy" down for us when we were already working with things like fission and fusion anyway?

Well, everyone, including the thread starter disagreed with you on that, didn't they.

Actually, quite a few people supported the idea that the 303 is not entirely a human achievement, I suggest you go back and check (and sicne when do I care what the thread starter thinks? Half the time they end up drpping out of the conversation anyway... no offense to this thread's starter).

Taking something away using beaming technology, that transports matter from one spot to another is simpler than something that disables a primitive weapon ?.... lol.. , Say no more.., you're bias is clearly showing.

It disabled Goa'uld weaponry, as well, and the Tollan claimed it could disable any weapon that passed by it. Goa'uld weaponry is not primitive, now is it? This isn't bias, just analysis.

The Tollan could live for 200 years.. so what. The Goauld could live for thousands of years, the Jaffa hundreds..

What does this have to do with anything...?

You are fixated on my posts.., aren't you...

Eh, you said something I disagree with. This is what the forum is here for.

You failed to notice that this is not a who's more powerfull/VS thread.

Actually it is... it's the Tollan versus the Eurondans, as I recall... Therefore the Tollan's relative advancement is debatable, is it not? My only point was that advancement is relative, Earth for example is not very advanced at all, but the SGC is.

[SoulReaver]

Thor's Hammer removed the weapons, it didn't disable them.

but the asgard also had a weapons disabler (at the entrance of the cave where that unas-goa'uld was trapped), it disabled Teal'c staff weapon iirc