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dasNdanger
February 23rd, 2008, 11:36 AM
Maybe it's just me, but it seems that TPTB will soon eliminate all Wraith from the Pegasus galaxy. Between their own civil war, the Replicators, a poisoned food supply, and now Michael's planned army, Wraith as we know them are unlikely to survive through next season, or two.

I would hate to see that happen. I would also hate to see a 'humanizing' of them in an attempt to give them an alternate food supply. One of the best things about these guys is their appearance - I love the long, white hair, the nasty teeth, the green skin - the great clothes. :) Physically, they are perfect as is. I also love how they feed on humans, and would hate to see that option taken away from them. Alternative food source? YES. Lose their taste for humans or their appearance? NO.

And I would really hate to see all Wraith - with their queens and hives and biotech and silky hair and black coats - exterminated from the Pegasus Galaxy like the Ori were in SG1.

If the Wraith were eliminated, would it affect your personal enjoyment of the show? I know it would for me because - despite my enjoyment of the other characters - I only got hooked on SGA because of the Wraith (similarly, I watched Star Trek mainly for the Klingons). I love an 'enemy' who is well-developed (as the Wraith are slowly becoming), and who can play on both teams (as Todd and his associates do). Instead of eliminating them, I'd really like to see these guys come into their own through a continued development of Wraith characters, instead of just being cannon fodder until another, more menacing, enemy comes along. And I certainly do NOT want to see them written out of the show.

So - your thoughts. I'm really not sure how much - if any - Wraith-love there is out there, so just trying to figure out how others feel about a possible elimination of the Wraith from the Stargate universe.

das

Icarium
February 23rd, 2008, 11:44 AM
What else could I add here? I totally agree. Certainly, I wouldn't enjoy the show without the Wraith as much as now :( :( :(
But I will wait with 'depression mood' until next week... :S

Icarium

Mitchell82
February 23rd, 2008, 12:01 PM
Maybe it's just me, but it seems that TPTB will soon eliminate all Wraith from the Pegasus galaxy. Between their own civil war, the Replicators, a poisoned food supply, and now Michael's planned army, Wraith as we know them are unlikely to survive through next season, or two.

I would hate to see that happen. I would also hate to see a 'humanizing' of them in an attempt to give them an alternate food supply. One of the best things about these guys is their appearance - I love the long, white hair, the nasty teeth, the green skin - the great clothes. :) Physically, they are perfect as is. I also love how they feed on humans, and would hate to see that option taken away from them. Alternative food source? YES. Lose their taste for humans or their appearance? NO.

And I would really hate to see all Wraith - with their queens and hives and biotech and silky hair and black coats - exterminated from the Pegasus Galaxy like the Ori were in SG1.
I see your point but the only reason the Ori were killed off so soon is because the show was canned and they had to find a way to finish the storyline. I don't think that this is where they are going. The Wraith may be thinned down a bit but killed off? Probably not.


If the Wraith were eliminated, would it affect your personal enjoyment of the show? I know it would for me because - despite my enjoyment of the other characters - I only got hooked on SGA because of the Wraith (similarly, I watched Star Trek mainly for the Klingons). I love an 'enemy' who is well-developed (as the Wraith are slowly becoming), and who can play on both teams (as Todd and his associates do). Instead of eliminating them, I'd really like to see these guys come into their own through a continued development of Wraith characters, instead of just being cannon fodder until another, more menacing, enemy comes along. And I certainly do NOT want to see them written out of the show.

So - your thoughts. I'm really not sure how much - if any - Wraith-love there is out there, so just trying to figure out how others feel about a possible elimination of the Wraith from the Stargate universe.

das

I love the Wraith they are a very unique enemy. I may not like it if they kill them off but they are far from the main reason I watch the show. I watch for the storyline with all the characters and believe even if the Wraith are written off they can still do a damn good job. So yeah I don't want them written off but I won't give up on the show just for that.

GoSpikey
February 23rd, 2008, 01:33 PM
Das, I'm not even going to read this.

They won't kill them all. We really haven't seen much of the Wraith since they tried to attack Atlantis the first time. If they don't come for Atlantis, there's not much fun to it... As the Wraith probably won't attack cos they're too weak and too devided themselves. Don't forget there's probably 5 Hives out there who know that the Lanteans are still out there (Todd's buddies minus the ones who shot his Hive) and yet they don't come.

We see a lot of Todd and Mikey, but Todd isn't directed against the Lanteans, yet, his first goal is the other Wraith, so he doesn't count. Mikey does some damage, but will be stopped some day.

New villain is needed to entertain us in between Wraith episodes. :)

PG15
February 23rd, 2008, 06:52 PM
They are the villains of this show, and thus, they will be defeated one day.

I don't see the problem here.

dasNdanger
February 23rd, 2008, 08:50 PM
They are the villains of this show, and thus, they will be defeated one day.

I don't see the problem here.

Well, the problem is that the Wraith are already defeated in nearly every meeting with the Lanteans so far - it gets a bit old after a while. There are alternatives to defeat - a truce, an alliance, a resolution to the feeding problem. All would make for more interesting scenarios than a simple 'defeat - woot! We won!' end to the Wraith.


My take is that the Wraith will not be eliminated from the SGA universe, the writers just want to severely minimise their presence. This would not disappoint me.

This would not disappoint me, either. Minimize their presence, and let other baddies rise up (ones most of us wouldn't mind seeing killed off), and then use the Wraith more effectively...make their appearances more profound, more meaningful, more developed - which brings me to your other comment:


Here is the problem with the Wraith: there is only ONE charismatic/entertaining Wraith, that being Todd. We need more than one interesting and regularly recurring Wraith. The writers have not developed the Wraith arc adequately enough even after 4 seasons of SGA. I'd bet that deep down, the writers grudgingly acknowledge this.

We have not seen one other regularly recurring Wraith who is tough, greedy, crazy, smart, has mysterious motives or is just plain entertaining.

Let me be clear, Todd as a character is very good, being a Wraith doesn't even come into it. Keep Todd, but put the bulk of the Wraith arc on the backburner. Bring on Michael, he wants to establish a new order in Pegasus. He is a blank slate as far as a story arc goes; here's a chance for a fresh long term arc to be developed.

Couldn't agree with you more - with the exception of Michael. I no longer see Michael as Wraith - and so I don't think he should be the other face of the Wraith, but be developed on his own.

But I, too, would love to see more Wraith strongly developed - yes - put the cannon fodder-Wraith on the back burner, and introduce more individual Wraith to develop. Todd is a given, but I would love to see James Lafazanos return as a re-occurring Wraith character, though I don't know if that's possible. But he was very good, too...and there is at least one of his characters who is still 'alive' out there - the Wraith from Condemned. He would be a nice counterpart for Todd - One all superior and 'civilized' and slimy as a snake (and it's SO obvious), and the other a little rougher around the edges, but ultimately the more gentlemanly - and perhaps the more deceitful - of the two. Or they could just create new, interesting Wraith characters. I mean, we've had at least three re-occurring Genii characters, and they're not nearly as interesting as the Wraith (but they are MUCH more fun to kill off!).

Getting back to Michael - yes - he can develop his new way, see how that goes. Clean slate, as you say. No objection to that as long as it doesn't spell an end to all Wraith. But a galaxy is a big place, so he could certainly try things his way...until he needs to be annihilated, too. :rolleyes:

Thanks, everyone - enjoying your comments! Keep 'em coming!

das

Sparrow_hawk
February 23rd, 2008, 09:00 PM
Aaaiiiiii! Eliminate the Wraith? You should never even THINK nasty, depressing thoughts like that.

Like you, das, I got hooked on SGA for the Wraith. I saw the last few minutes of the Seer, then went back and picked up the rest of the episodes. Would it affect my enjoyment of the show if the Wraith were eliminated? Definitely! To be honest, I would probably stop watching SGA.

I confess that I have a soft spot for villains. Nothing makes me happier than a great villain or anti-hero mixed into a plot. The Wraith fit the bill perfectly. They are visually stunning and their life-draining attack is truly creepy. They are a novel concept that still has a great deal of potential.

Feeding on humans is IMO an essential part of their nature. Taking away their "need to feed" would render them essentially impotent as villains.

Todd is a great character and I still haven't completely figured out what he is up to -- which is as it should be. Michael is a great character in his own right. He reminds me of a lot of tragic, doomed anime villains, driven by horrendous events in their past to create what they believe is a better world. This often involves wiping mankind off the face of the earth so the planet can get a fresh start. Michael believes that the galaxy would be a better place with the Wraith gone and with him in control. So he is working to kill them off.

Rather than minimize the Wraith's role I would like to see the writers continue to feature them in story arcs as they do now. But, please, NOT humanized. And I would enjoy seeing the occasional reluctant alliance between Wraith and Lanteans. But not TOO often.

Rant ended.

Blistna
February 23rd, 2008, 09:17 PM
First off, I purposely only read the first post here -- so if i repeat something, sorry!

Anyway...I like the Wraith, but I don't think they are going away. I think they are going to be less of a concern...i think they new hybrids will be worse of a threat (like others have said...he is smarter, and I think it was because he was with us for a short while). Also, he has "help"....

But, with that said, their bio-tech wont go away because of Micheal -- he knows wraith tech, why would he make different ones? But really, Season Four/Five will probably be like season 7/8, where the goa'uld became less of an enemy, and the replicators become more of a problem...but in this case, its' the Wraith are less of a problem, and Micheal and his hybrids become more of a problem.


But I do think that Todd will survive. And I think he will be our greatest enemy in the end -- I mean, he worked with us, knows how we think -- hell, he alone might know where Earth is (he was at earth, and who knows...maybe he put acvtivated his tracking device...and the spoiler tag could have posible spoilers for season five or the rest of the season)I am 100% sure Micheal does.

So...yea.

dasNdanger
February 23rd, 2008, 11:17 PM
Aaaiiiiii! Eliminate the Wraith? You should never even THINK nasty, depressing thoughts like that.

Like you, das, I got hooked on SGA for the Wraith. I saw the last few minutes of the Seer, then went back and picked up the rest of the episodes. Would it affect my enjoyment of the show if the Wraith were eliminated? Definitely! To be honest, I would probably stop watching SGA.

Yeah, I'm afraid that would happen with me, too. Back when I watched Star Trek Voyager, there was this one episode where Janeway made a god-like decision (against the advice of others), and it totally turned me off of the show, and I never watched again. I watch TV to be entertained - not pissed off or worse - depressed - so I won't invest my time and energy in a show that robs me of joy. And right now, the Wraith bring me joy. :D


I confess that I have a soft spot for villains. Nothing makes me happier than a great villain or anti-hero mixed into a plot. The Wraith fit the bill perfectly.

My biggest 'problem' is that I don't see them as villains! I see them as antagonists...yes, but not true villains. A villain is someone evil to the core (as Michael may now be - as Kolia was), but the Wraith do not fit that bill simply because they are acting - not on hate or evil impulses - but on the instinct to feed, and to survive. They are just a different species. Are they creepy and scary? Yes. But I can't see them as villains any more than I can see spiders as 'evil', just because I happen to be afraid of them.


They are visually stunning and their life-draining attack is truly creepy. They are a novel concept that still has a great deal of potential.

Visually stunning - totally agree. The most stunning of all was Steve - really wish they'd bring someone like him back. His air of conceit and confidence was perfect...I just love to look at him - truly a work of art.

I don't find their feeding to be creepy. I find it rather fascinating. It is their most basic need...their whole reason for fighting, for attacking, for hunting. When they feed they are fulfilling their goal, fufilling their reason for emerging from the hive in the first place. It reminds me of the day I was sitting at my kitchen window, and a beautiful hawk swooped down and took out a pigeon in my back yard. I could have felt sorry for the pigeon, but I didn't. I sat there watching - fascinated - as the hawk fed upon the pigeon - the way it looked around, keeping a sharp eye out for danger...the way took care of its own needs and means of survival.

So...yeah - the feeding thing doesn't creep me out. It SCARES me - wouldn't want to be on the sucking end of that hand - but I simply see it as their means of survival, and nothing sinister in it at all.


Feeding on humans is IMO an essential part of their nature. Taking away their "need to feed" would render them essentially impotent as villains.

Exactly. Find an alternative food source, perhaps - but never take away their complete 'need to feed'. Even with an alternative food source, a Wraith could still DESIRE to feed on humans, a desire that he'd have to work very hard to suppress if he wished to peacefully co-exist with humans. I said elsewhere that I would not mind seeing such a turn - if only a FEW Wraith decided to accept this alternative. But would hate to see the majority become vegetarians, or something...that would be silly.


Todd is a great character and I still haven't completely figured out what he is up to -- which is as it should be. Michael is a great character in his own right. He reminds me of a lot of tragic, doomed anime villains, driven by horrendous events in their past to create what they believe is a better world. This often involves wiping mankind off the face of the earth so the planet can get a fresh start. Michael believes that the galaxy would be a better place with the Wraith gone and with him in control. So he is working to kill them off.

Yeah - Todd is still hard to read, but I love him anyway. And Michael is certainly a tragic character - no matter what he does, I still feel an amount of pity for him. However, I do not like his plans for the Wraith, and so - in that regard - I don't feel the same towards him - or his future - as I feel towards Todd.


Rather than minimize the Wraith's role I would like to see the writers continue to feature them in story arcs as they do now. But, please, NOT humanized. And I would enjoy seeing the occasional reluctant alliance between Wraith and Lanteans. But not TOO often.


Again - totally agree. Don't want to OVERdo the alliance thing (unless it becomes a permanent alliance, without the need to 'ask' for help each time one or the other needs something). Certainly don't want the Wraith humanized. They must keep that gorgeous hair, those wonderful clothes, those beautiful TEETH! :D But more importantly, they need to keep their edge...so even when making alliances, I want to see a bit of danger in their eyes. But no more of the betrayal stuff from Allies - again, that aspect of the Wraith has already been explored - let's see them uphold their end of the bargain (as Todd has been doing), and see what develops from there. I love the idea of the different Wraith factions - this allows us to be friends with some, and enemies with others. Just as long as all of our allied Wraith don't keep getting killed off, as like what happened in The Seer, when Todd's hive went boom. :(

Thanks for your thoughts!



First off, I purposely only read the first post here -- so if i repeat something, sorry!

Anyway...I like the Wraith, but I don't think they are going away. I think they are going to be less of a concern...i think they new hybrids will be worse of a threat (like others have said...he is smarter, and I think it was because he was with us for a short while). Also, he has "help"....

But, with that said, their bio-tech wont go away because of Micheal -- he knows wraith tech, why would he make different ones? But really, Season Four/Five will probably be like season 7/8, where the goa'uld became less of an enemy, and the replicators become more of a problem...but in this case, its' the Wraith are less of a problem, and Micheal and his hybrids become more of a problem.

But I do think that Todd will survive. And I think he will be our greatest enemy in the end -- I mean, he worked with us, knows how we think -- hell, he alone might know where Earth is (he was at earth, and who knows...maybe he put acvtivated his tracking device...and the spoiler tag could have posible spoilers for season five or the rest of the season)I am 100% sure Micheal does.

So...yea.

I wouldn't mind Michael and his hybrids becoming more of a problem - as long as the Wraith continue to exist, and show up every so often (both as ally, and as threat). In the end I hope Todd doesn't become our greatest enemy, simply because EVERYone expects him to - they say he's the next 'Ba'al' (sp?). But isn't that just rehashing SG1 plots? It seems too boring and redundant to me. I would much rather see Todd defy ALL expectations, and prove himself our greatest ally - THAT would have a much greater impact, I feel, because we are all expecting him to turn on the Lanteans at any moment. So, it would be the unpredictable course to have him remain our friend, instead of rising to be our ultimate enemy.

But - I suppose that depends on the writers...and, to some extent, the actor's influence. Most actors prefer the role of villain, and would jump at the chance to have his character rise to be the most wicked of them all. So...well...even if Todd does turn on the Lanteans, I'll still love him...just it'll hurt a little more to watch the shows.


Thanks for your comments!

das

ciannwn
February 24th, 2008, 06:43 AM
but I would love to see James Lafazanos return as a re-occurring Wraith character, though I don't know if that's possible. But he was very good, too...and there is at least one of his characters who is still 'alive' out there - the Wraith from Condemned.

I'd love to see James Lafazanos play this character again as well. One good thing about the Wraith makeup, though, is that the same Wraith can be played by different actors. The 'Condmend' Wraith could be brought back if they found an actor with the same height and build.


I would also hate to see a 'humanizing' of them in an attempt to give them an alternate food supply. One of the best things about these guys is their appearance - I love the long, white hair, the nasty teeth, the green skin - the great clothes. Physically, they are perfect as is. I also love how they feed on humans, and would hate to see that option taken away from them. Alternative food source? YES. Lose their taste for humans or their appearance? NO.

Maybe Wraith will be able to adapt Michael's technology so they can eat ordinary food without becoming too human in appearance. It's unlikely that they'd want to be human looking hybrids if they could get lunch without going that far.

What puzzles me is the colour of Michael's hair. In 'Michael' I thought the expedition dyed it but it started turning white again. It's now back to being dark even though all the Wraith who were humanised with Beckett's retrovirus kept their original hair colour.

GoSpikey
February 24th, 2008, 03:07 PM
They are the villains of this show, and thus, they will be defeated one day.

I don't see the problem here.

The problem being that Das and me thunk Wraiths? :P

JSPuddlejumper
February 24th, 2008, 03:28 PM
Keep Todds/Baals (same thing in SG1) faction alive for old time sakes.

Get rid of the rest of the trash.

Introduce a whole knew enemy from another dimension or universe into Pegasus.

jelgate
February 24th, 2008, 05:46 PM
The problem being that Das and me thunk Wraiths? :P

I didn't know that was possible:S

GATEGOD
February 24th, 2008, 05:54 PM
The day the writers kill off the Wraith is the day I stop watching. It was somewhat stupid in my eyes for the system lords to be basically wiped out and to be replaced with a completely new evil enemy that we just now find.. even though the system lords has been going on for so many years, now that the humans are here it ends in 8 years.. yea.. right. So just as they 'limited' the Goa'uld I pray that they don't kill off the Wraith. They already added the replicators to SGA as they did to SG-1. They probably will add the ori or some evil enemy that no one has ever heard of later down the line, but please leave the wraith...

dasNdanger
February 24th, 2008, 09:27 PM
I'd love to see James Lafazanos play this character again as well. One good thing about the Wraith makeup, though, is that the same Wraith can be played by different actors. The 'Condmend' Wraith could be brought back if they found an actor with the same height and build.

Yes - but could another actor pull off the 'drool'??? :P


Maybe Wraith will be able to adapt Michael's technology so they can eat ordinary food without becoming too human in appearance. It's unlikely that they'd want to be human looking hybrids if they could get lunch without going that far.

Well - cure or not - they certainly can't make Todd look human or else everyone will be going, "Hey - wait...Halling's a...WRAITH??" Talk about confusing those who don't obsess about the show as deeply as we do... :)


What puzzles me is the colour of Michael's hair. In 'Michael' I thought the expedition dyed it but it started turning white again. It's now back to being dark even though all the Wraith who were humanised with Beckett's retrovirus kept their original hair colour.

I think it's because he kept experimenting until the retrovirus finally worked. He only seems to have one spiracle on his face now, too...so...no longer an albino life-sucking bugman, but a human with Wraith DNA. :(

das

YutheGreat
February 24th, 2008, 11:39 PM
I doubt they will wipe out the Wraith anytime soon. The Wraith were given the spotlight after the Replicators were defeated. I suspect that the writers want SGA to contend with 2 powerful enemies. SG1 contended with Replicators and Goauld. Now SGA will have to contend with the Wraith and the Hybrids.

Also Michael has some victories against the Wraith but when word spreads on who poisoned there food supply and Todd gets his cure up and running. The Wraith as a whole will flock to Todd. Todd will command the full force of the Wraith to combat Michael and his horde of Hybrids.

Not since the Ancients will the entire Wraith race fight as one against the abomination called Michael. All of them will be under the command of Todd. What a great day that will be to be Todd?

My post is slightly like that of a megalomaniac it is because the System Lord in me wishes to come out hehehe.

Platschu
February 25th, 2008, 12:05 AM
I think they should keep the Wraith as a neutral alien force. If Atlantis can cure their hunger, than they won't cull people, so maybe this move can open an other way for the Wraith to be in the newest episodes. They can live "happily" together. ;)

SG13-NightOps
February 25th, 2008, 01:24 AM
If the Wraith were eliminated, would it affect your personal enjoyment of the show?

Would depend on what they replace them with. *shrugs*

wise one
February 25th, 2008, 02:22 AM
yes let us destroy an enemy that first started the show....

i was being sarcastic btw

Myles
February 25th, 2008, 02:50 AM
They are the enemy, they will be defeated. I'm sorry to ruin your hopes and dreams, but it's what eventually happens to enemys on TV shows. But I don't think they'll be completely eliminated, just forced out of power like the Gouald.

GoSpikey
February 25th, 2008, 04:47 AM
Stargate Atlantis = Wraith.

They should stick around.

dasNdanger
February 25th, 2008, 06:20 AM
They are the enemy, they will be defeated. I'm sorry to ruin your hopes and dreams, but it's what eventually happens to enemys on TV shows. But I don't think they'll be completely eliminated, just forced out of power like the Gouald.

I am not concerned about 'defeat' - I am concerned about annihilation...much different. To lose power is one thing, to be wiped out of existence (or physically altered) would totally suck eggs.

If the latter were to happen, it would kill my enjoyment of the show. It would be like if Star Trek eliminated all Klingons (my favs in that universe) - it just wouldn't be the same for me. So, I'm wondering if other people feel the same way, and I see that many would be equally disappointed if the Wraith were eventually written out of the show. Good to know I'm not alone in this.

das

dasNdanger
February 25th, 2008, 06:24 AM
I doubt they will wipe out the Wraith anytime soon. The Wraith were given the spotlight after the Replicators were defeated. I suspect that the writers want SGA to contend with 2 powerful enemies. SG1 contended with Replicators and Goauld. Now SGA will have to contend with the Wraith and the Hybrids.

Also Michael has some victories against the Wraith but when word spreads on who poisoned there food supply and Todd gets his cure up and running. The Wraith as a whole will flock to Todd. Todd will command the full force of the Wraith to combat Michael and his horde of Hybrids.

Not since the Ancients will the entire Wraith race fight as one against the abomination called Michael. All of them will be under the command of Todd. What a great day that will be to be Todd?

My post is slightly like that of a megalomaniac it is because the System Lord in me wishes to come out hehehe.

I actually LOVE your idea - if only at the end, Todd turns to Sheppard, and says, "John Sheppard, I am your father."

:D


das

GoSpikey
February 25th, 2008, 07:14 AM
I actually LOVE your idea - if only at the end, Todd turns to Sheppard, and says, "John Sheppard, I am your father."

:D


das

:lol: :lol: :lol:

That sounds vaguely familiar, but I can't point where from... :D

BlueJay
February 26th, 2008, 02:13 AM
I would love to see James Lafazanos return as a re-occurring Wraith character, though I don't know if that's possible. But he was very good, too...and there is at least one of his characters who is still 'alive' out there - the Wraith from Condemned. He would be a nice counterpart for Todd - One all superior and 'civilized' and slimy as a snake (and it's SO obvious), and the other a little rougher around the edges, but ultimately the more gentlemanly - and perhaps the more deceitful - of the two. Or they could just create new, interesting Wraith characters.
das

This would be a good character to bring back, but only if it was james because lets face it, nobody does a wraith smile like james does.
I don't know if he's still alive but the scientist from allies would also be an interesting character to bring back. Did michael ever say if there were other survivors from the planet? He acted all superior as a wraith, was a human, and then rewraithed, -which could explain physical differences if another actor played him- how would he react to being rejected by other wraith? Would he take michaels route? How would he act around the team now?

It would be foolish of the writers to eliminate the wraith. They haven't been fully developed yet, there are so many aspects of them that can still be explored. That said, their numbers do need to decrease. There are to many of them for the resources of pegasus to sustain them. Cutting down their numbers would lessen infighting and create a greater chance of an alliance with atlantis. New reocuring characters would also be more likely if there were less of them out there to run into. Any solution to the feeding problem would also be easier to distribute if their numbers were reduced.

i'm not explaining it well. many things would just be easier if there were less of them. They'd be more likely to survive in the long run.

If the wraith were wiped out completely i know i wouldn't enjoy the show much anymore. Since first saw them in rising it was, -there freaky looking, this is going to be fun! and now there are some great characters in todd and michael, the show would suffer if they were lost.

Sparrow_hawk
February 26th, 2008, 07:48 AM
This would be a good character to bring back, but only if it was james because lets face it, nobody does a wraith smile like james does.
***************************
It would be foolish of the writers to eliminate the wraith. They haven't been fully developed yet, there are so many aspects of them that can still be explored. That said, their numbers do need to decrease. There are to many of them for the resources of pegasus to sustain them. Cutting down their numbers would lessen infighting and create a greater chance of an alliance with atlantis. New reocuring characters would also be more likely if there were less of them out there to run into. Any solution to the feeding problem would also be easier to distribute if their numbers were reduced.

i'm not explaining it well. many things would just be easier if there were less of them. They'd be more likely to survive in the long run.



I agree with you on the casting -- James does a magnificent Wraith! I just watched "Poisoning the Well" again to get ready for "Kindred", and was impressed all over again by Steve.

I also agree that the number of Wraith needs to be reduced, for the same reasons that you mention. The writers seem to be taking the plot in that direction. The war with the replicators eliminated a few. The civil war continues behind the scenes. Michael is killing them off with the Hoffan drug. Heck, even Todd agrees. He seems to be fine with the idea of eliminating any Wraith not allied with his hive. Or so he tells Sheppard and Co. ...

I'm not sure completely peaceful coexistence between human and Wraith is possible, but I think it might open the door to a diplomatic solution to the conflict between Atlantis and the Wraith.

BlueJay
February 27th, 2008, 12:48 AM
Peace between humans and wraith could be possible but difficult. If both sides agreed to a cease fire after a cure was found, it would still need to be enforced as there would be plenty of people on both sides who would be unwilling to let the past go. Humans who had suffered for generations and those wraith who viewed themselves as being far superior to humans. It would take a long time for the past to be resolved.

Interaction between the two species would be difficult as the wraith have kept people technologicaly inferior. Based just on culture, which we need to know more about, things would be difficult. How would a human and a wraith interact with each other. I can't see them allowing humans on their ships or taking a stroll down the main street of a town on market day.
How about a conversation down at the local pub?

I would like to see more human wraith interaction, it's just going to take a while.

dasNdanger
February 27th, 2008, 05:44 AM
Peace between humans and wraith could be possible but difficult. If both sides agreed to a cease fire after a cure was found, it would still need to be enforced as there would be plenty of people on both sides who would be unwilling to let the past go. Humans who had suffered for generations and those wraith who viewed themselves as being far superior to humans. It would take a long time for the past to be resolved.

Interaction between the two species would be difficult as the wraith have kept people technologicaly inferior. Based just on culture, which we need to know more about, things would be difficult. How would a human and a wraith interact with each other. I can't see them allowing humans on their ships or taking a stroll down the main street of a town on market day.
How about a conversation down at the local pub?

I would like to see more human wraith interaction, it's just going to take a while.

And a good show will develop that interaction slowly. SGA has done that - first two seasons the Wraith were not allowed full development as individuals, and even with Lafazanos' very powerful performances, they were just all too brief. The intro of Michael and Todd has changed that, but I'm still not sure where TPTB are taking these guys...it seems they still view these great characters as expendable, and keep their focus on the big stars. I guess we will only see a good, permanent Wraith character if they decide to bump one of them up to a 'starring' role. Not sure they will. Todd would be the perfect canidate, but so far there's not even the slightest hint from TPTB Todd could become SGA's 'Worf'.

This season we've seen Todd on the human's turf, we know how they are going to treat him - and any Wraith - that comes around as an ally. They will be kept in a cell, chained, and followed around by an armed guard. We got that. Now, let's see how the Wraith treat a human guest on their turf. I think this now could be done because 1. Not sure the Lanteans will allow Todd, or any other 'friendly' Wraith with hacking abilities, back on Atlantis for a while, and 2. Hopefully Todd will be able to keep his current hive alive and well, thus moving some of the human/Wraith interaction back onto a hive ship.

If a solution to their feeding problem is found, then yes - there will still be major problems. Will someone like Ronon EVER forgive the Wraith for what they've done, even if it was in the name of their own survival? Doubt it. Will the Wraith ever be able to see humans as equals, worthy of respect and of the freedom to build their societies? Hard to say...it won't happen overnight.

The thing that needs to be determined is WHY the Wraith wanted dominance of the galaxy. If it was to protect their food supplies, then - with that need removed - will they still be determined to remain the top dogs in the PG? If they can feed on anything they want, their needs will change - they may need to find a way to become traders...but what do the Wraith have to trade? Technology. Will they part with it? Hard to say.

There are so many directions these guys could be taken. For the most part, I personally want to see them REMAIN WRAITH (same appearance, same desire and ability to feed on humans) - and either control their influence by reducing their numbers, or find an alternative food source that will allow some Wraith (those who wish to do so) the opportunity to gain nutrition from normal food so that they are no longer dependent on a human diet alone. Still...I would never want to see them lose that desire and ability to feed on humans...that's what makes them so great, especially when they need to interact with humans the way Todd has been doing.

I mean, just image what's going on in his mind. He said that Teyla would make a lucky Wraith a 'very tasty meal' - so we can assume those thoughts HAVE gone through his mind before. Hee...wonder what he's thought about McKay. :) And already he's fed on Sheppard with great pleasure, so I'm sure whenever those two are in the same room, Todd must be recalling what a wonderful meal Sheppard was. It's like being on a diet and only eating half of a delicious steak, then having to look at the other half without being allowed to touch it. You know what it tastes like - you know how good it is - but you know that if you break down and eat it, you will ruin your diet. In Todd's case, his 'diet' includes not feeding on the box of Lantean chocolates that he keeps finding himself right in the middle of...must be really tough at times.

das

ciannwn
February 27th, 2008, 06:58 AM
If they can feed on anything they want, their needs will change - they may need to find a way to become traders...but what do the Wraith have to trade? Technology. Will they part with it? Hard to say.


It's difficult to think what they could trade with. Fabrics could be one possibility although it depends on what they are made of. :D

jasminaGo
February 27th, 2008, 07:23 AM
I read all the posts and noticed that most said that they'll stop watching the show if the Wraith are killed off. Good news for them is that the Wraith will probably be defeated at the very end. The bad news are that there is only one more season that is garantied.

Personaly as a die-hard SG1 fan, I can't get over the fact that the Wraith weren't in that show. I think they are the best created vilian in the Stargate francise. It's refreshing cause they can't be put in the totally evil category, they don't kill people because it's fun, but because they need to survive. It's the most basic instinct in all living creatures. Their behavior can be explored more deeply, and they can be understood better, like 'till The Seer I didn't know that the Wraith had a sence of humor, or they could be sarcastic. Tod's character is a great opportunity for that. I really hope TPTB dedicate more attention to it.
And I really, really hope that Atlantis is picked up for a few more seasons, so that we can get as much Wraith as possible:wraith37: .

YutheGreat
February 27th, 2008, 07:49 AM
Even in the long shot if the Wraith get beaten as the dominant power in PG and Michael take over. Todd can lead the Wraith in the kind of Campaign like how Baal did after he was beaten in the battle for Dakara. Not the cloning thing I mean fight with a little more strategy rather than just being the Galactic Strong Man. They Launch Gurilla raids and win.

If this happens how would people react what is your opinion?

BlueJay
February 27th, 2008, 09:20 PM
In Todd's case, his 'diet' includes not feeding on the box of Lantean chocolates that he keeps finding himself right in the middle of...must be really tough at times.

das

:):)

funny as

you just had to mention chocolates because of that cut dialogue scene between todd and rodney.

i do hope its on the dvd.

dasNdanger
February 28th, 2008, 04:27 AM
It's difficult to think what they could trade with. Fabrics could be one possibility although it depends on what they are made of. :D

I would love to learn that the Wraith could spin the finest of silks from the palm of their hands. :) Might be something worth trading for - Wraith silk...rare, soft and light as air, warm in the winter, cool in the summer - it would be fantastic!


I read all the posts and noticed that most said that they'll stop watching the show if the Wraith are killed off. Good news for them is that the Wraith will probably be defeated at the very end. The bad news are that there is only one more season that is garantied.

Personaly as a die-hard SG1 fan, I can't get over the fact that the Wraith weren't in that show. I think they are the best created vilian in the Stargate francise. It's refreshing cause they can't be put in the totally evil category, they don't kill people because it's fun, but because they need to survive. It's the most basic instinct in all living creatures. Their behavior can be explored more deeply, and they can be understood better, like 'till The Seer I didn't know that the Wraith had a sence of humor, or they could be sarcastic. Tod's character is a great opportunity for that. I really hope TPTB dedicate more attention to it.
And I really, really hope that Atlantis is picked up for a few more seasons, so that we can get as much Wraith as possible:wraith37: .

I agree - the Wraith are the best character (friend or foe) created in the SG franchise. They are so complex, and so much has yet to be revealed about them. And now with characters like Todd, you can really see them as individuals, and that makes more of a connection between them, and the audience. Heck, they could end up being even better than Klingons, IF the SG PTB play their cards right.


Even in the long shot if the Wraith get beaten as the dominant power in PG and Michael take over. Todd can lead the Wraith in the kind of Campaign like how Baal did after he was beaten in the battle for Dakara. Not the cloning thing I mean fight with a little more strategy rather than just being the Galactic Strong Man. They Launch Gurilla raids and win.

If this happens how would people react what is your opinion?

I think if Todd rose up to be some sort of Wraith leader, and defeated another ENEMY (like Michael), then fans would be thrilled. If he went after the Lanteans...well...not so sure fans would like that right now. We seem to love Todd as Todd - the guy who's playing both ends against the middle, and not quite sure what he's up to. He's like Captain Jack Sparrow in the first Pirates movie - you just can't figure the guy out. Jack became less interesting in the next two movies because we were starting to figure him out, and knowing all the answers made him less entertaining (for me).

So, I guess I'm saying that I love Todd like he is right now - and I'm not sure I want to know EVERYthing about the guy - leave a little mystery...leave an open door so we never totally figure Todd out...let him sail off into the sunset like Jack did in POTC 1 - and leave the rest to our imaginations...


:):)

funny as

you just had to mention chocolates because of that cut dialogue scene between todd and rodney.

i do hope its on the dvd.

Yeah, me too. Just so funny - and if it wasn't filmed (not sure it was, or if it was just in script form), then maybe they'd weave it - or soemthing similar - into an episode later on.

(Of course, I'm also a HUGE chocolate fan, so chocolate analogies come easy for me... :p )

das

DanielleG
February 28th, 2008, 09:43 AM
I am actually getting bored with the Wraith, I think they are cool and would love to see more of them but can't they have a new Alien Enemy besides the Wraith and the Replicators, I do like Replicators also.

dasNdanger
February 28th, 2008, 05:39 PM
I am actually getting bored with the Wraith, I think they are cool and would love to see more of them but can't they have a new Alien Enemy besides the Wraith and the Replicators, I do like Replicators also.


Well, I'm just getting excited about them! I think Todd has brought a new dimension to them, and now we can see the possibilities if they decide to develop Wraith characters instead of constantly killing them off.

HOWEVER...I DO want new villains. Michael's army of whatevers might be a good option. But I wouldn't mind seeing another threat enter the galaxy - something that I don't mind seeing killed off (right now, I hate seeing the Wraith falling like flies...mainly because I feel very sympathetic towards their situation). So - bring in a new enemy - YES - maybe more than one...and let THEM become the cannon fodder while the humans AND the Wraith figure out a way to defeat them.

I say this because there is no better alliance than Wraith with the humans, simply because of the whole 'I wanna eat you - I wanna kill you' thing going on. It takes great trust to be able to work with such an 'enemy', and can be an excellent way to continue to develop both Wraith and human characters. Nothing else is as good - even an ally among the Borg in Star Trek couldn't equal the threat of working alongside a Wraith.

So - bring in new enemies...make the Lanteans realize that the Wraith actually kept a balance in the galaxy, and now the new threats are worse than the old ones....and let's see these two (human/Wraith) continue to work together in on again-off again alliances.

das

kymeric
February 28th, 2008, 08:17 PM
Maybe it's just me, but it seems that TPTB will soon eliminate all Wraith from the Pegasus galaxy. Between their own civil war, the Replicators, a poisoned food supply, and now Michael's planned army, Wraith as we know them are unlikely to survive through next season, or two.

I would hate to see that happen. I would also hate to see a 'humanizing' of them in an attempt to give them an alternate food supply. One of the best things about these guys is their appearance - I love the long, white hair, the nasty teeth, the green skin - the great clothes. :) Physically, they are perfect as is. I also love how they feed on humans, and would hate to see that option taken away from them. Alternative food source? YES. Lose their taste for humans or their appearance? NO.

And I would really hate to see all Wraith - with their queens and hives and biotech and silky hair and black coats - exterminated from the Pegasus Galaxy like the Ori were in SG1.

If the Wraith were eliminated, would it affect your personal enjoyment of the show? I know it would for me because - despite my enjoyment of the other characters - I only got hooked on SGA because of the Wraith (similarly, I watched Star Trek mainly for the Klingons). I love an 'enemy' who is well-developed (as the Wraith are slowly becoming), and who can play on both teams (as Todd and his associates do). Instead of eliminating them, I'd really like to see these guys come into their own through a continued development of Wraith characters, instead of just being cannon fodder until another, more menacing, enemy comes along. And I certainly do NOT want to see them written out of the show.

So - your thoughts. I'm really not sure how much - if any - Wraith-love there is out there, so just trying to figure out how others feel about a possible elimination of the Wraith from the Stargate universe.

das

Not if they got to the milkyway and started culling some familliar worlds. How pissed would u b if they ate chulak or kelowna or abuncha jaffa worlds. If Todd got deep enough to find midway i bet he got the asgard intergalactic engine specs too.

Sparrow_hawk
February 28th, 2008, 08:20 PM
Not if they got to the milkyway and started culling some familliar worlds. How pissed would u b if they ate chulak or kelowna or abuncha jaffa worlds. If Todd got deep enough to find midway i bet he got the asgard intergalactic engine specs too.

What an interesting idea. There is no telling what he might have found in Rodney's files, is there? Mwahahahahahah!

dasNdanger
February 28th, 2008, 09:04 PM
Not if they got to the milkyway and started culling some familliar worlds. How pissed would u b if they ate chulak or kelowna or abuncha jaffa worlds. If Todd got deep enough to find midway i bet he got the asgard intergalactic engine specs too.

Since I have no idea who you're talking about, I say - feed away! (I didn't watch SG1 - so....yeah. The only reason I'm into this whole SGA thing is because of the hot dudes in black leather dusters. :p Call me shallow. ;) )


das

Mitchell82
February 28th, 2008, 09:24 PM
I am not concerned about 'defeat' - I am concerned about annihilation...much different. To lose power is one thing, to be wiped out of existence (or physically altered) would totally suck eggs.
Agreed. I don't want them completely wiped out.


If the latter were to happen, it would kill my enjoyment of the show. It would be like if Star Trek eliminated all Klingons (my favs in that universe) - it just wouldn't be the same for me. So, I'm wondering if other people feel the same way, and I see that many would be equally disappointed if the Wraith were eventually written out of the show. Good to know I'm not alone in this.

das

"Rejoice dasNdanger you are not alone!";)

LiquidSky
February 29th, 2008, 12:07 AM
I have been reading quite a few post on this thread. And It has been said time and time again. Many of us don't want an end to the wraith. NO! I'm another one who watches SGA b/c or the wraith. If the writers want to bring in another enemy do it, but no at the expence of the wraith. We don't need every episode centering around the wraith b/c some people will get tried of them. No Not me I LOVE them. What I mean is bring in other bad guys but, keep the wraith as contance reminder "That we are here and we are not going away". I may not be good a profound post. there are alot of posters that express the same thoughts as I do. Das is for one. It's almost like she is reading my mind.

About the wraith ok, what is it that attracts some of us? It's the way they look yes i think they are attractive and, sexy too.;) Maybe it's their beautiful long flowing white hair, the way they dress, or the way they talk, growl or even hiss. Or maybe it's their attitude. No it not maybe i change my mind about that. It is the way they do things they are confident about themselves. They don't need to apologize for their existence or their need to feed. They are who they are. I don't know how to discribe how i feel. It's something intangible. Something that touches the primitive part.

Maybe that why some people hate them. Yes I said hate or fear them. The wraith do represent the primitive in some of us. I would hate to see these beautiful mystifying beings eliminated from the story arc. Just to be replaced by a boring enemy.:S Many of you may think some of us who love the wraith are crazy may be, but we are not shallow. We just love a race that many feel should killed:( I have a lot more to say on the subject but I will hold off for no. I tend to think faster that I can type. So i get lost in my train of thought.

I'll be back

LS

BlueJay
February 29th, 2008, 03:50 AM
It's difficult to think what they could trade with. Fabrics could be one possibility although it depends on what they are made of. :D

Hair care products?:)

dasNdanger
February 29th, 2008, 11:05 AM
I have been reading quite a few post on this thread. And It has been said time and time again. Many of us don't want an end to the wraith. NO! I'm another one who watches SGA b/c or the wraith. If the writers want to bring in another enemy do it, but no at the expence of the wraith. We don't need every episode centering around the wraith b/c some people will get tried of them. No Not me I LOVE them. What I mean is bring in other bad guys but, keep the wraith as contance reminder "That we are here and we are not going away". I may not be good a profound post. there are alot of posters that express the same thoughts as I do. Das is for one. It's almost like she is reading my mind.

Maybe I'm Wraith... ;)

But I agree - I would enjoy Wraith in every episode, but for some people that would be too much. So a new enemy or two would be great, something to balance out the show. For Wraith, sometimes less is MORE. I would prefer FEWER Wraith 'cameos', if they would feature a re-occurring Wraith (Like Todd, and Michael before him) in more 'starring' (and 'co-starring') roles. When I say a 'starring' role, I mean the sort of role Todd had in Common Ground, or the guy in The Defiant One, where a single Wraith is the featured character. By co-starring, I think of episodes like The Seer, Miller's Crossing, BAMSR, SoW), and a cameo would be like the 'Shawn's' brief appearance in Condemned, or Bob, or that poor guy who got taken out by Ellia.


About the wraith ok, what is it that attracts some of us? It's the way they look yes i think they are attractive and, sexy too.;) Maybe it's their beautiful long flowing white hair, the way they dress, or the way they talk, growl or even hiss. Or maybe it's their attitude. No it not maybe i change my mind about that. It is the way they do things they are confident about themselves. They don't need to apologize for their existence or their need to feed. They are who they are. I don't know how to discribe how i feel. It's something intangible. Something that touches the primitive part.

Yes - it is the whole package. Their confidence, their vanity, their hair and their clothes, and certainly the fact that they make no apologies for what they are - it all comes together to create a well-defined, and intriguing character. The Wraith have an 'air' about them. Doesn't matter if you think they are ugly at first, if a Wraith walked into a room full of humans - his/her head held high, confident, smug - everyone in the room would be awed by their beauty, simply because...


Maybe that why some people hate them. Yes I said hate or fear them. The wraith do represent the primitive in some of us. I would hate to see these beautiful mystifying beings eliminated from the story arc. Just to be replaced by a boring enemy.:S Many of you may think some of us who love the wraith are crazy may be, but we are not shallow. We just love a race that many feel should killed:( I have a lot more to say on the subject but I will hold off for no. I tend to think faster that I can type. So i get lost in my train of thought.


Yeah, my train of thought gets away from me, too...

But I think people in general don't like things that are 'different'. The Wraith are different - they look and act and feed differently than we do, and it bothers most people. But those of us who like the Wraith are probably fairly accepting of differences in people in real life - we probably aren't prejudice, probably don't make fun of people who look different than we do, probably don't judge others too harshly. More accepting, I suppose. I know I am, and think that maybe that's the case with most of us, too.

das

LiquidSky
February 29th, 2008, 04:00 PM
Just another note. I said like "she is reading my mind" What I meant was we who love the wraith have very similar thoughts. And to having different wraiths for instances the one from "Condemend" we call him Shawn there is another name for him but I can't spell it so I won't try. He be a great reacurring role too.

Sheppard and Shawn sitting down at the dinner table negotiating term of an agreement what ever that may be. I can see Shep &co. looking stunned when Shawn shallows down his human type food or, even the expression on MacKay's face. Yes these may be tidbits of humor. I wished they didn't kill off Steve he would have made a good adverary. Ok I'm rambling on. The bottom line is don't kill off something has a good thing going. I may have not express this well but I get these thought in my head I try to get them out.then they ( thoughts) escapes me.


About diffenent people I live in a country that is very multicultal. Sorry about the spelling I got to depended on spell check now my brain has gotten to lazy:D

BlueJay
February 29th, 2008, 04:03 PM
This season we've seen Todd on the human's turf, we know how they are going to treat him - and any Wraith - that comes around as an ally. They will be kept in a cell, chained, and followed around by an armed guard. We got that. Now, let's see how the Wraith treat a human guest on their turf. I think this now could be done because 1. Not sure the Lanteans will allow Todd, or any other 'friendly' Wraith with hacking abilities, back on Atlantis for a while, and 2. Hopefully Todd will be able to keep his current hive alive and well, thus moving some of the human/Wraith interaction back onto a hive ship.

If a solution to their feeding problem is found, then yes - there will still be major problems. Will someone like Ronon EVER forgive the Wraith for what they've done, even if it was in the name of their own survival? Doubt it. Will the Wraith ever be able to see humans as equals, worthy of respect and of the freedom to build their societies? Hard to say...it won't happen overnight.

The thing that needs to be determined is WHY the Wraith wanted dominance of the galaxy. If it was to protect their food supplies, then - with that need removed - will they still be determined to remain the top dogs in the PG? If they can feed on anything they want, their needs will change - they may need to find a way to become traders...but what do the Wraith have to trade? Technology. Will they part with it? Hard to say.

das

Yes, lets see the team spend some time on todds ship for some mission they're on. Todd should be smart enough to realise that Rodney can also not be trusted to do a little snooping around inside a hive ships computer and can keep him away from temptation.
Would they stick Todd back in a cell? It would be nice if they gave him a room, just post guards outside the door and keep him away from computers. Don't think they're going to allow him back for a while though.

The wraith have been described as teritorial, so they would stake claim to an area and defend it against rivals, this was their hunting ground. If they no longer needed to feed on humans, no longer needed to protect their food supply, they would probably still find it difficult to allow wraith from different factions into their territory.
Being used to power they may feel threatened by human civilisations advancing technologically, remember, their society has been stagnant in this area as there has been no need for them to change, they have not been challanged in thousands of years. People are cattle to them, wraith won't like being overtaken by them technologically.

Wraith may feel they are above trading with humans. They have the ships, they are superior, they may just fly in and take whatever supplies the want.
They do not seem to have much to trade besides technology. Doubt they'd be willing to help advance lowly humans.
Although wraith silk would be nice!:)

As they are hunters now it would be easy for them to switch to hunting animals, but i can not ever see them as farmers. They would have to make arrangements with humans for this. If they used their worshippers this could work, but, would they still have worshippers if they were changed and could no longer extend life or heal etc. It was mentioned somewhere that having life restored felt good and was addictive. Take that away and some people may not wish to serve the wraith anymore.