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ykickamoocow
February 2nd, 2008, 05:27 AM
I really hope that in season 5 we get to see special forces of countries other than America. Atlantis is supposed to consist of a international contingent but only American special forces seem to go through the gate which seems really odd as some of the countries which are represented on Atlantis have got some of the best Special Forces units in the world.

Australia
4th (Commando) Battalion, Royal Australian Regiment (4RAR [Cdo])
Special Air Service Regiment (SASR)

Canada
Canadian Special Operations Regiment
Marine Commando Regiment

Czech Republic
SOG (Special Operations Group)
601st Special Forces Group

France
1st Marine Infantry Parachute Regiment (1er RPIMa)
ALAT detachment for Special Operations (DAOS)

Germany
Fallschirmspezialzüge (Pathfinder) of the Fallschirmjäger
Kommando Spezialkräfte (KSK)

New Zealand
Special Air Service of New Zealand (NZSAS)

United kindom
Special Air Service (SAS)
Special Reconnaissance Regiment (SRR)

I honestly dont know why it annoys me that only US Airmen or US Marines seem to go through the gate but for some reason it does.

titan_hq
February 2nd, 2008, 12:24 PM
United Kingdom
Special Boat Service (SBS)
Special Forces Support Group (SFSG)

I'm British, so i thought I'd point out that we have more than the SAS and SRR.

But ye, other countries should be more involved, especially Britain and Canada as were probably the closest allies of the US and are therefore most likely to be trusted with protecting the expedition, seeing as the US controls the Stargate program.

Uncle Tobias
February 2nd, 2008, 01:10 PM
It'd be sweet to see a large scale raid on somewhere like a wraith compound with all these special forces working together.

Jedi_Master_Bra'tac
February 2nd, 2008, 02:02 PM
If they do have the SAS/SRR/SBS/SFSG, they better have real british actors playing them, because Americans never ever get the accent right. Grodin was just terrible. They should have a Geordie, a Liverpudlian, a west countryman and a welshman, all with really strong regional accents :D That would confuse people who think there's only one british accent :P

kefke20
February 2nd, 2008, 04:44 PM
i like to see:
the dutch korps commandotroepen and the Air Assault Garderegiment Grenadiers en Jagers

thay also belong whit the best of the world

P-90_177
February 2nd, 2008, 04:47 PM
If they do have the SAS/SRR/SBS/SFSG, they better have real british actors playing them, because Americans never ever get the accent right. Grodin was just terrible. They should have a Geordie, a Liverpudlian, a west countryman and a welshman, all with really strong regional accents :D That would confuse people who think there's only one british accent :P

Well there are some great actors over here that could do the job.

ykickamoocow
February 2nd, 2008, 07:20 PM
i like to see:
the dutch korps commandotroepen and the Air Assault Garderegiment Grenadiers en Jagers

thay also belong whit the best of the world

My bad. My knowledge of Dutch special forces is limited at best. I also tried to find some Russian special force units but after 3 minutes of searching the net i gave up :)

Bagpuss
February 2nd, 2008, 08:46 PM
I really hope that in season 5 we get to see special forces of countries other than America. Atlantis is supposed to consist of a international contingent but only American special forces seem to go through the gate which seems really odd as some of the countries which are represented on Atlantis have got some of the best Special Forces units in the world.

<<<Snipped to make my post shorter,that's all ! :) FHB>>>

I honestly dont know why it annoys me that only US Airmen or US Marines seem to go through the gate but for some reason it does.

Hear ,hear ! :cool:
I know that production costs are a big factor ,and the focus of the show was always going to be on the main civilian characters and the US military, but it annoys me too, that the other Treaty countries' Special Forces never get so much as a hand wave.


It'd be sweet to see a large scale raid on somewhere like a wraith compound with all these special forces working together.
I would love to see that,if the cost wasn't too high for the writers to consider.:cool:

If they do have the SAS/SRR/SBS/SFSG, they better have real british actors playing them, because Americans never ever get the accent right. Grodin was just terrible. They should have a Geordie, a Liverpudlian, a west countryman and a welshman, all with really strong regional accents :D That would confuse people who think there's only one british accent :P
LOL ! I know what you mean.I really liked Grodin,but the upper-crust English accent bugged me a little.Very few Brits speak like that .:)

Col.Foley
February 2nd, 2008, 08:58 PM
It'd be sweet to see a large scale raid on somewhere like a wraith compound with all these special forces working together.
Starts thinking of fanfiction.

P-90_177
February 2nd, 2008, 09:11 PM
Hear ,hear ! :cool:
I know that production costs are a big factor ,and the focus of the show was always going to be on the main civilian characters and the US military, but it annoys me too, that the other Treaty countries' Special Forces never get so much as a hand wave.


I would love to see that,if the cost wasn't too high for the writers to consider.:cool:

LOL ! I know what you mean.I really liked Grodin,but the upper-crust English accent bugged me a little.Very few Brits speak like that .:)

you'd be surprised.

TheGreatLordGeorge
February 2nd, 2008, 09:20 PM
i think the problem with a multinational force is that in the heat of battle if a communications problem should arise it would be dreadful.


Although i swear I have seen german forces in atlantis

Bagpuss
February 2nd, 2008, 09:42 PM
you'd be surprised.
Possibly,or possibly not.:)
Most British people I have encountered in an everyday manner in conversation ,tend not to enunciate every word,and their accents are wonderfully varied,imo.:cool:

In some professions though,it is very much preferred to try for accentless English,where at all possible.
One of my friends attended elocution classes during her time at University as she wanted to become a lawyer ,and she was strongly encouraged to lose her Welsh lilt.Another was urged to drop her Lancashire accent by a boss,and I had to work hard on my Highland Scottish accent during my own training to make sure clients and colleagues could clearly understand me .:)

P-90_177
February 2nd, 2008, 09:45 PM
Possibly,or possibly not.:)
Most British people I have encountered in an everyday manner in conversation ,tend not to enunciate every word,and their accents are wonderfully varied,imo.:cool:

In some professions though,it is very much preferred to try for accentless English,where at all possible.
One of my friends attended elocution classes during her time at University as she wanted to become a lawyer ,and she was strongly encouraged to lose her Welsh lilt.Another was urged to drop her Lancashire accent by a boss,and I had to work hard on my Highland Scottish accent during my own training to make sure clients and colleagues could clearly understand me .:)

That is true. But in the military people accents tend to fade away. Not completely but to a fair degree. Merely for ease of understanding between other soldiers and even people from other countries. I've known a fair number of people who joined the army and had quite a strong Derbyshire accent. Now though they speak quite close to RP.

Bagpuss
February 2nd, 2008, 10:00 PM
Fair point.I think that comes under the second paragraph in my post about professions,and the need for clear speech and understanding.:cool:

Uncle Tobias
February 2nd, 2008, 10:08 PM
i think the problem with a multinational force is that in the heat of battle if a communications problem should arise it would be dreadful.


Although i swear I have seen german forces in atlantis

There is at least one German guard in Atlantis, albiet with his flag patch sometimes upside down. I've seen a Briton in the gateroom aswell.

Jedi_Master_Bra'tac
February 3rd, 2008, 12:13 AM
LOL ! I know what you mean.I really liked Grodin,but the upper-crust English accent bugged me a little.Very few Brits speak like that .:)

And he couldn't even get the upper-crust English accent right, is it just me who thinks his "A"s were a little too American at times?

Bagpuss
February 3rd, 2008, 12:20 AM
Not sure,but this gives me a great opportunity to rewatch some of my dvds this afternoon.:D

2ndgenerationalteran
February 3rd, 2008, 01:28 AM
Germany
Fallschirmspezialzüge (Pathfinder) of the Fallschirmjäger

Now thats a mouthfull ;)

Honestly i think the SAS is probably going to make an appearance one day and maybe the first non-USA special forces shown assuming they haven't already been shown, because i could have sworn i saw soldiers with the brittish flag on their uniform in the siege

ykickamoocow
February 3rd, 2008, 04:15 AM
Now thats a mouthfull ;)

Honestly i think the SAS is probably going to make an appearance one day and maybe the first non-USA special forces shown assuming they haven't already been shown, because i could have sworn i saw soldiers with the brittish flag on their uniform in the siege

There are guards who come from different countries on Atlantis as i do remember seeing the British, Spainish and German flag on a couple of people on Atlantis though i have never seen any of those people go offworld and from what ive seen their primary duties seem to be security which means they probably never leave the base. The only soldiers who get to leave the base on offworld missions appear to be American.

Flyboy
February 3rd, 2008, 05:48 AM
United Kingdom
Special Boat Service (SBS)
Special Forces Support Group (SFSG)

I'm British, so i thought I'd point out that we have more than the SAS and SRR.

But ye, other countries should be more involved, especially Britain and Canada as were probably the closest allies of the US and are therefore most likely to be trusted with protecting the expedition, seeing as the US controls the Stargate program.
SFSG are not Special Forces. They're what you'd call Special Operations Forces. A little more elite than regular units, but not SF by any stretch of the imagination.

SRR, SAS and SBS are the only SF we have. We need no others.

The Majority of American "Special Forces" are in fact SOF. It's a common misconception, but they are VERY different and should NOT be confused.

I don't think the gate needs that many SF personell, the only missions that would require them would be ones like the final episode of SG1. Mostly I think SOF or regular infantry units are more suited to general gate travel, especially if it's a first contact mission or diplomatic. SF should only ever be used for major crisis situations when you need to infiltrate the enemy strong hold. Actually an ideal example of SF operations in SG1 is The Fourth Horseman, wehen the SG unit was undercover. SF would do that.

There's such a tendancy to misuse SF, especially on the US's front. The USMC is ideal to go through the gate, just as the British Paras are. But they're not SF. Nor are they SOF.

g.o.d
February 3rd, 2008, 05:58 AM
the only US unit called "Special Forces" are the US Army "Green Berets".

Other units like CAG, SEAL, etc. are called in the US "Special operation forces"

Flyboy
February 3rd, 2008, 06:03 AM
the only US unit called "Special Forces" are the US Army "Green Berets".

Other units like CAG, SEAL, etc. are called in the US "Special operation forces"
Ah, but SEAL Team 6 IS Special Forces, where as the rest of SEAL is merely SOF.

I believe Delta Force is also SF is it not?

g.o.d
February 3rd, 2008, 06:08 AM
Ah, but SEAL Team 6 IS Special Forces, where as the rest of SEAL is merely SOF.

I believe Delta Force is also SF is it not?


Those two units are CT units and SOF.

SF are "Green berets"

I believe what I call SF is called SOF in the USA

Flyboy
February 3rd, 2008, 06:14 AM
Well, I'm referring to the actual definitions, I've just completed a module on Special Forces in the degree that I'm doing, and there was a whole lecture about the difference between SF and SOF, so I'm positive that SEAL Team 6 is SF. Delta Force I BELIEVE to be SF, but I'd have to check to confirm.

The difference is usually in how they operate, numbers, and types of mission engaged in.

g.o.d
February 3rd, 2008, 06:18 AM
I agree, but In the US, Special Forces refers to a specific unit, the United States Army Special Forces or "Green Berets" and the term Special Operations Forces (SOF) is used in its place to refer to the aforementioned units.

Flyboy
February 3rd, 2008, 06:36 AM
Not sure I follow.

kefke20
February 3rd, 2008, 08:10 AM
My bad. My knowledge of Dutch special forces is limited at best. I also tried to find some Russian special force units but after 3 minutes of searching the net i gave up :)

the russians are stil in progres of training tham (mony trobel and s**t)

but the dutch armd forcee in general are considerd one of the world best armys. its small so we got extra funding for alot more training (than the rest including the US) and stat of the art equipment

ykickamoocow
February 3rd, 2008, 08:18 AM
the russians are stil in progres of training tham (mony trobel and s**t)

but the dutch armd forcee in general are considerd one of the world best armys. its small so we got extra funding for alot more training (than the rest including the US) and stat of the art equipment

The Australian Armed Forces are similar. Due to the fact we are a small country we dont have as many troops as alot of other nations which makes it even more important that each one of our soldiers is very well trained. The Australian government spends alot more money training each individual soldier than most other countries in the world.

SP90
February 3rd, 2008, 03:45 PM
Atlantis offworld teams should be like RAINBOW. It would be cool to see a mix team made up of individuals drawn from the militaries of the various countries represented on Atlantis. In a sense they already do with Col. Sheppard's team. He has himself (USAF), McKay (Canadian), Telya (Ethosian) and Ronan (Satedan). Just imagine the team dynamic and character interactions on a team made up of US, German, Russian and Chinese. :)

kefke20
February 3rd, 2008, 05:03 PM
The Australian Armed Forces are similar. Due to the fact we are a small country we dont have as many troops as alot of other nations which makes it even more important that each one of our soldiers is very well trained. The Australian government spends alot more money training each individual soldier than most other countries in the world.

Yes that is the adventis of a small army and a high GDP we can’t occupy a nation but we haven’t trouble in wiping out 95% of the current world armed forces ((including Russia and china) and 2 years ago in a war-game with the US 2 Dutch subs defeated a entire US carrier group)

Another example (not exaterated ) in the US if you finish boot camp you can be sende out to Iraq of Afghanistan but with us you needed a 2 year training before you can go to Afghanistan. It`s not strange that the Dutch gov was very very upset and disappointing by the US defset by calling the EU Allis not adequate trained for Afghanistan and demanded a apologue ore we will pull back or forces in urusgan.

So I think we can go to Atlantis.

kefke20
February 3rd, 2008, 05:19 PM
i like to see:
the dutch korps commandotroepen and the Air Assault Garderegiment Grenadiers en Jagers

thay also belong whit the best of the world

Ow ja I forgot the much fared Dutch korps mariners (see wiki) they can be deployed every ware in the world they don’t care of it is in het artic, jungle, desert or wood lands.

Reiko
February 3rd, 2008, 05:47 PM
While most of the soldiers are American, there's a few German and Russian guys wandering around.


I really hope that in season 5 we get to see special forces of countries other than America. Atlantis is supposed to consist of a international contingent but only American special forces seem to go through the gate which seems really odd as some of the countries which are represented on Atlantis have got some of the best Special Forces units in the world.


Despite being American I get annoyed by this too; it seems as if throughout the seasons the American military has gotten a stronger hold over Atlantis, especially with putting Carter in charge. (But I won't go there.) I would really like to see some more internationality over in Atlantis, whether scientists or soldiers. But preferably soldiers, as they all seem American now ;)


Atlantis offworld teams should be like RAINBOW. It would be cool to see a mix team made up of individuals drawn from the militaries of the various countries represented on Atlantis. In a sense they already do with Col. Sheppard's team. He has himself (USAF), McKay (Canadian), Telya (Ethosian) and Ronan (Satedan). Just imagine the team dynamic and character interactions on a team made up of US, German, Russian and Chinese. :)

I was considering the same thing, comparing to the multinational RAINBOW team. I wish they had done it that way; it was the impression I got when they were all in the gate room in 'Rising'. While it wouldn't be the focus, snippets of interactions like in the first episode would be lovely.



but the dutch armd forcee in general are considerd one of the world best armys. its small so we got extra funding for alot more training (than the rest including the US) and stat of the art equipment

I would like to see Dutch forces/scientists in Atlantis. I'm only a first gen American; my mum was born in the Nederlands and I have family there.

Actionhank
February 3rd, 2008, 07:03 PM
Yes, would be nice to see some other forces. Preferably Kommando Spezialkräfte - a German Special Unit. But there are so many others out there...

Maybe for Atlantis internal operations we could see some police-based forces like SWAT or GSG9, meaning CT-Units in general.

Maybe they give it one episode but I don't think they'll turn this show into a military show like "The Unit".

RepliVeggie
February 4th, 2008, 12:45 AM
As far as we know Delta Force and SEAL doesn't even have a presence in SG World.

zoislk
February 4th, 2008, 03:40 AM
Another example (not exaterated ) in the US if you finish boot camp you can be sende out to Iraq of Afghanistan but with us you needed a 2 year training before you can go to Afghanistan.

Depends on the service you go into.

Most jobs in the Army, you can get sent out quick after boot camp, because there is a big enough need (significant numbers overseas) and the US is trying to rotate it's troops.

Any specialized jobs takes significant training.

You won't see any Air Force overseas without any training beyond boot camp. And you won't see any technical jobs sending people overseas without a lot of training.

p.i.c., my friend joined the Navy after graduation (almost 3 years now), and he doesn't ship out for another 4 months -- he had boot camp, then two different schools to get properly trained and certified. And now he's going to be getting on-site training in a couple weeks for his ship appointment.

It all depends on what you sign up for, and the direct need they have. With the US sending so many soldiers overseas right now, of course new "grunts" are going to be shipped over pretty quick. That's a huge downside to the current situation we're in.



As for questioning of the US Military breakdown...

Army:

Top 3 units are Green Berets, Delta Force and Rangers.

Rangers are simply the elite of the "normal" Army.
Delta Force is mainly counter-terrorism and is modeled after the British SAS.
Green Berets are the best of the best, the top of the SF in America and do pretty much everything.

Navy:

SEALs, probably the best-known by the common American, is pretty much the Navy version of the Delta Force.

Air Force:

Doesn't really have anything on the same level, as close as they get is the STG (Special Tactics Group), but it's really nothing worth writing home about.

Marines:

They are under re-organization right now after some things that happened lately... but Marine Force Recon is pretty much the common SEALs unit, and I think they have one similar to the Army's Rangers as well. No SF exactly. But it is considered essentially the most "elite" (as in best trained and toughest soldiers) branch.



As far as we know Delta Force and SEAL doesn't even have a presence in SG World.

And they shouldn't, or at least very little if they ever were to pop up, because it is considered Air Force territory.

SG13-NightOps
February 4th, 2008, 04:48 AM
That would confuse people who think there's only one british accent :P

Glad you mention that. They need to ensure that the Aussie flag on the Australian is in CLEAR view on screen. Some very strange people keep thinking that the Australian accent is a British one. (Probably the same people who think AC/DC is an American band, LOL)

ykickamoocow
February 4th, 2008, 05:04 AM
Glad you mention that. They need to ensure that the Aussie flag on the Australian is in CLEAR view on screen. Some very strange people keep thinking that the Australian accent is a British one. (Probably the same people who think AC/DC is an American band, LOL)

I hate that. Though it did noticed it only seems to be either Americans or Canadians who make the mistake.

SG13-NightOps
February 4th, 2008, 05:12 AM
Knowing our luck, the scene will be tightened and all you will see is the union jack in the corner, further justifying their claims. :(

Stewart5
March 25th, 2008, 04:06 AM
I really hope that in season 5 we get to see special forces of countries other than America. Atlantis is supposed to consist of a international contingent but only American special forces seem to go through the gate which seems really odd as some of the countries which are represented on Atlantis have got some of the best Special Forces units in the world.

Australia
4th (Commando) Battalion, Royal Australian Regiment (4RAR [Cdo])
Special Air Service Regiment (SASR)

Canada
Canadian Special Operations Regiment
Marine Commando Regiment

Czech Republic
SOG (Special Operations Group)
601st Special Forces Group

France
1st Marine Infantry Parachute Regiment (1er RPIMa)
ALAT detachment for Special Operations (DAOS)

Germany
Fallschirmspezialzüge (Pathfinder) of the Fallschirmjäger
Kommando Spezialkräfte (KSK)

New Zealand
Special Air Service of New Zealand (NZSAS)

United kindom
Special Air Service (SAS)
Special Reconnaissance Regiment (SRR)

I honestly dont know why it annoys me that only US Airmen or US Marines seem to go through the gate but for some reason it does.


Dude, u made the mistake everyone makes!!
Royal Marines Commando!! They'd be perfect for SGA, or SG1! The whole concept of 'ship soldier' turned SF makes them ideal!

g.o.d
March 26th, 2008, 02:02 AM
Spetznaz? (Spetsnaz?) Or is that the Communist era designation?


Or am I just wrong?


you're right;) but there other russian SOF units

Lauriel
March 26th, 2008, 05:29 AM
Glad you mention that. They need to ensure that the Aussie flag on the Australian is in CLEAR view on screen. Some very strange people keep thinking that the Australian accent is a British one. (Probably the same people who think AC/DC is an American band, LOL)

:lol: It would be great to see an Aussie have an active role on SGA, that's for sure. Although, as the others have mentioned with British accents, I'd hope for a real Australian accent. No offense to the Americans here, but I've yet to see an American carry off an Australian accent.

Off topic-I've been watching Torchwood, and I'm falling in love with the Welsh accent. It's gorgeous.

kefke20
April 4th, 2008, 06:39 AM
The British Gurkhas are they any good??
They have augmented owe (dutch) solders in Afghanistan for some time now.

ykickamoocow
May 19th, 2008, 04:13 PM
This was from Joseph Mallozzi blog 2 days ago.

flingslass writes: “Would Australians be there as military personnel or would they be there as part of the scientific contingent.”

Answer: Both.


I am hoping that that means we will atleast see some Australian Special Forces in season 5 of Atlantis.

RowenaR
May 19th, 2008, 04:37 PM
i think the problem with a multinational force is that in the heat of battle if a communications problem should arise it would be dreadful.

You'll be awfully surprised, but yes... they do teach us Germans English at school... in fact, today's schoolchildren start around class three. And yes, we do have special English classes for our soldiers if they are going to serve in places where English is the main language.


Although i swear I have seen german forces in atlantis

Frequently, yes. First time I noticed them was in "Conversion" when two of them were placed outside Sheppard's quarters.


but the dutch armd forcee in general are considerd one of the world best armys.

After reading Armin Wohlgethan's accounts about his missions with the KCT in Afghanistan, I wholeheartedly agree ;)

BTW, I'm not sure if you could count the Feldnachrichtentruppe (reconnaissance unit) in as another German Special Force.

Anyway, I'd love to see and hear more Germans in general (that's why I asked Joe about the possibility of having a team consisting only of non-English speaking people... I hope he'll answer the question ;)), not only soldiers.

ykickamoocow
May 19th, 2008, 04:42 PM
Frequently, yes. First time I noticed them was in "Conversion" when two of them were placed outside Sheppard's quarters.


Yes but did you also notice in that episode that Weir breifly spoke to him and he replied with a American accent. It was a big mistake by the director as traditionally German soldiers do not speak with American accents.

RowenaR
May 19th, 2008, 04:59 PM
Yes but did you also notice in that episode that Weir breifly spoke to him and he replied with a American accent. It was a big mistake by the director as traditionally German soldiers do not speak with American accents.

I can't remember that (just another reason why I just have to find my season 2 DVDs...), but you may be right. On the other hand, it doesn't have to be such a mistake... my sister went to an US-American highschool for a year and when I visited her there, her English was heavily American accented. Two years later I was an intern at the British Embassy in Berlin, and about every second one of my colleagues (the Britons as well) asked me if I ever passed some time in the US because my English sounded very much like it (the reason for that was simple: my sister's English still sounded like it and I pick up accents very easily). Picking up English accents is not as hard as you might think, especially if you're surrounded by them 24/7.

On a side note: Funny enough, though, there was a German scientist in "Duet" which spoke flawless German...

Metonic
May 25th, 2008, 09:20 PM
It'd be sweet to see a large scale raid on somewhere like a wraith compound with all these special forces working together.

And then only the American ones come home??


The reason why they aren't seen going through the gate is because, EVEN THOUGH, the SGC and the U.S. Government lets the IOA think they are in charge... THEY AREN'T, the writers are haha.

serious though. Who cares, extras always die. And you know if they did send in a multinational team, they'd have to make sure certain countries weren't wiped out, one didn;t die more than the other, ect. Because people throw fits over this sort of thing. "Oh so the polish team all died and the Germans didn't die at all!" or "Oh so the French came in behind the Japanese and were the first to RETREAT? WHATS UP WITH THAT!" "Oh so the Jamaican troops were sent in first and all died?" It just keeps most people quiet, because everyone is the same, so they can't say the killed him for being this or she died cause her country sucks. blah blah blah.

Infinatus
May 25th, 2008, 09:42 PM
And then only the American ones come home??


The reason why they aren't seen going through the gate is because, EVEN THOUGH, the SGC and the U.S. Government lets the IOA think they are in charge... THEY AREN'T, the writers are haha.

serious though. Who cares, extras always die. And you know if they did send in a multinational team, they'd have to make sure certain countries weren't wiped out, one didn;t die more than the other, ect. Because people throw fits over this sort of thing. "Oh so the polish team all died and the Germans didn't die at all!" or "Oh so the French came in behind the Japanese and were the first to RETREAT? WHATS UP WITH THAT!" "Oh so the Jamaican troops were sent in first and all died?" It just keeps most people quiet, because everyone is the same, so they can't say the killed him for being this or she died cause her country sucks. blah blah blah.

I might be wrong but I believe Atlantis personnel take off their flag patches when they go off world, in which case this wouldn't be a problem because it would be impossible for the audience to know how many casualties were suffered by each respective country.

ykickamoocow
May 25th, 2008, 09:44 PM
And then only the American ones come home??


The reason why they aren't seen going through the gate is because, EVEN THOUGH, the SGC and the U.S. Government lets the IOA think they are in charge... THEY AREN'T, the writers are haha.

serious though. Who cares, extras always die. And you know if they did send in a multinational team, they'd have to make sure certain countries weren't wiped out, one didn;t die more than the other, ect. Because people throw fits over this sort of thing. "Oh so the polish team all died and the Germans didn't die at all!" or "Oh so the French came in behind the Japanese and were the first to RETREAT? WHATS UP WITH THAT!" "Oh so the Jamaican troops were sent in first and all died?" It just keeps most people quiet, because everyone is the same, so they can't say the killed him for being this or she died cause her country sucks. blah blah blah.

Send in the Australian and New Zealand troops first as they are used too it. The British liked using us as cannon fodder :)

jenks
May 26th, 2008, 02:50 AM
If you pay attention to Australian nationalist propaganda films they did, yes.

ykickamoocow
May 26th, 2008, 02:54 AM
If you pay attention to Australian nationalist propaganda films they did, yes.

If you research the Africa Campaign you will see that the Australian and New Zealand troops were given the toughest assignments in the most important battles.

Lauriel
May 26th, 2008, 03:01 AM
Also, in the WW1, Australian & New Zealand troops were volunteers, and had little to no military training. They were sent in first simply to reserve the experienced troops- the British, since we are still in the Commonwealth, even though we'd become a nation in our own right by that stage. That's how we ended up going into ANZAC Cove at Gallipoli.

jenks
May 26th, 2008, 03:07 AM
If you research the Africa Campaign you will see that the Australian and New Zealand troops were given the toughest assignments in the most important battles.

Yes, and in every case they were fighting alongside British troops. Commonwealth troops made up the majority of the men in the Africa campaign, the Aussies making up a large part in that, so it makes sense they'd be fighting in every major battle, especially given the fact that their homeland wasn't under constant attack and threat of invasion like the UK was. Unfortunately some poeple watch films like Gallipoli and think they're historically accurate...


Also, in the WW1, Australian & New Zealand troops were volunteers, and had little to no military training. They were sent in first simply to reserve the experienced troops- the British, since we are still in the Commonwealth, even though we'd become a nation in our own right by that stage. That's how we ended up going into ANZAC Cove at Gallipoli.

The Australian attack was a diversion for a Newzealander attack, not a British one. Gallipoli is a blatant propaganda film, in reality British forces sustained heavy losses trying to support the Aussie troops.

ykickamoocow
May 26th, 2008, 03:18 AM
Yes, and in every case they were fighting alongside British troops. Commonwealth troops made up the majority of the men in the Africa campaign, the Aussies making up a large part in that, so it makes sense they'd be fighting in every major battle

Not just every battle but for the first major battle under Bernard Montgomery the Australian and New Zealand troops were the ones who were chosen to take the brunt of the German attack. Also the "Siege of Tubruk" is very a very well known battle in Australia.



especially given the fact that their homeland wasn't under constant attack and threat of invasion like the UK was

No that came later against the Japanese where they got very close to Australia. It is now known that the japanese couldnt invade Australia but back in WW2 it was a real concern. It is also a little known fact that Australian troops were the first to actually stop a Japanese advance on the Kokoda track which was a very nasty place to wage war.

jenks
May 26th, 2008, 03:20 AM
Not just every battle but for the first major battle under Bernard Montgomery the Australian and New Zealand troops were the ones who were chosen to take the brunt of the German attack. Also the "Siege of Tubruk" is very a very well known battle in Australia.

No that came later against the Japanese where they got very close to Australia. It is now known that the japanese couldnt invade Australia but back in WW2 it was a real concern. It is also a little known fact that Australian troops were the first to actually stop a Japanese advance on the Kokoda track which was a very nasty place to wage war.

Hey, I'm not trying to downplay the Australian or Kiwi contribution, but the idea that they were just used as fodder just isn't true.

Lauriel
May 26th, 2008, 03:32 AM
Yes, and in every case they were fighting alongside British troops. Commonwealth troops made up the majority of the men in the Africa campaign, the Aussies making up a large part in that, so it makes sense they'd be fighting in every major battle, especially given the fact that their homeland wasn't under constant attack and threat of invasion like the UK was. Unfortunately some poeple watch films like Gallipoli and think they're historically accurate...

The Australian attack was a diversion for a Newzealander attack, not a British one. Gallipoli is a blatant propaganda film, in reality British forces sustained heavy losses trying to support the Aussie troops.

A couple of points there:

1- No one is denying that the British troops fought and sacrificed. They certainly did.

2- Regardless of any other concern, it was a valid military tactic. We were untrained troops, essentially extra numbers. I doubt very much that many decisions made in war are palatable, but they are necessary in most cases. In this case, it made tactical sense to send those troops in first. I would suspect that nationality was a minor consideration.

3- Yes, Gallipoli the film was idealised in some regard. The battles at Gallipoli and the Dardenelles were instrumental in shaping Australia's national identity. It is inevitably tied to British nationalism, because it was the first sense Australia has, as a nation, of independent accomplishment and pride in Australia and its people in our own right, not as a colony. You have to realise that this was only 14 years after Federation. Unlike any other country, Australia didn't attain nationalism in its own right through war of seperation from its mother country. Quite the opposite, the Prime Minister at the time, Joseph Cook, was quoted as saying to "remember that we are Britons" and that "if the old country is at war, so are we." So regardless of idealised accounts, the historical fact is that at the time, we were a forming nation, and this was our first sense of Australian national pride. That doesn't diminish the British involvement, it simply means that we attach more meaning to those battles than others did.

Merlin1701
May 26th, 2008, 11:28 AM
Can this topic be moved more into the relms of stargate, lets think of ways to bring in more visible multi-national personell

ykickamoocow
May 26th, 2008, 04:15 PM
Can this topic be moved more into the relms of stargate, lets think of ways to bring in more visible multi-national personell

It wouldnt be hard for the writers to write in multi-national special forces as it has already been establised that Atlantis is suppose to be a international exhibition.

g.o.d
May 27th, 2008, 08:01 AM
It wouldnt be hard for the writers to write in multi-national special forces as it has already been establised that Atlantis is suppose to be a international exhibition.

they already have problems with writing the main characters. You can't expect they will begin to write international SOF units.

ykickamoocow
May 28th, 2008, 12:11 AM
they already have problems with writing the main characters. You can't expect they will begin to write international SOF units.

Why? It shouldnt be that hard.

g.o.d
May 28th, 2008, 12:51 AM
Why? It shouldnt be that hard.

for current SGA TPTB, it's impossible

jenks
May 28th, 2008, 07:07 AM
Why? It shouldnt be that hard.

It is. I'd say Lost has some of the best writing on TV, but they can't do it...

ykickamoocow
May 28th, 2008, 05:12 PM
It is. I'd say Lost has some of the best writing on TV, but they can't do it...

Lost was painful to watch sometimes from a Australians point of view. A large portion of the flashbacks were set in Australia and i dont think i heard a proper Australia accent in the first 3 seasons (though Claire's wasnt too bad). Some of the others were truely cringe worthy.

Some accents are easier to do than others and for the countries where accents are hard to copy (Australian, New Zealand, South African, English) they should use actors who grew up in those countries to make sure that what they are getting is a accurate depiction of a countries accent.

From my perspective i have NEVER EVER heard a American (or Canadian) pull of a Australian accent which even sounded remotely realistic. They just cant do it and they shouldnt even try. They should just hire actors who actually have the accent they want.

Bray
May 29th, 2008, 06:28 AM
Oh I don't know, I often hear pre pubescent yanks on xbox live trying to do the English accent (because it's obviously so offensive to us if they ask would we like some tea and crumpets in a british accent) and they often manage to accidentally do an Australian accent :D

g.o.d
May 29th, 2008, 07:13 AM
Oh I don't know, I often hear pre pubescent yanks on xbox live trying to do the English accent (because it's obviously so offensive to us if they ask would we like some tea and crumpets in a british accent) and they often manage to accidentally do an Australian accent :D

sorry, but :lol: :lol:

Merlin1701
May 29th, 2008, 07:40 AM
Some accents are easier to do than others and for the countries where accents are hard to copy (Australian, New Zealand, South African, English) they should use actors who grew up in those countries to make sure that what they are getting is a accurate depiction of a countries accent.

I fully agree