Unforgivable settings - Spoilers galore -

[Furling God]

Hi, since it was confirmed that the great semi-god Ancients were defeated by those incredibly stupid wraith, I am losing hope in this show now. I really loved Rising 1, but I have been waiting for a good episode since. Only Torri Higginson's acting kept me interested.

I wish to talk about something really unacceptable.

The settings are generally poor. Atlantis is great, but the same and only environment, clothes, behaviour, is used for the Athosians and the Children' planets, and also for the mainland. But, if they lack money and time, I say that's ok.

But the settings of the Underground planet and the Genii planet are the same, and unforgivably earthlike. I mean it shouldn't be allowed to make a sci-fi show with soldiers dressed like ww1 soldiers on earth. No, it doesn't fit. I don't call that a sci-fi episode. Even if you put a jumper or a Wraith in the episode, the settings have destroyed the credibility.

You can make an environment with little money and time, but don't make it EXACTLY the same environment as a ww1 movie!

The most repellent scenes are those in the laboratory in Underground. The whole equipment is earth-like, and, with the female doctor character, we are taken into a BBC show relating the efforts of the first female doctors in the early 1900's. It doesn't look as if they could only rent that, it looks as if they purposedly decided to make a romantic historical England movie. Yep, in the Pegasus galaxy, dude, a whole dusty lab of the time of tuberculosis in England, even the woman's hair and acting, all was perfectly thought and cared for... for a non sci-fi movie !!!!!!!!!!!!!

You almost expected Beckett to say: "I'm sorry Love but we cannot marry, I must go back to Edimburgh now".

I can't believe they did that. I need explanations.

[puddlejumper747]

Hi, since it was confirmed that the great semi-god Ancients were defeated by those incredibly stupid wraith, I am losing hope in this show now. I really loved Rising 1, but I have been waiting for a good episode since. Only Torri Higginson's acting kept me interested.

Wait until you see the Ancients and Wraith fighting each other before you decide how stupid it is. Remember: the wraith usually attempt to stun/incapacitate their prey and take them home for dinner, not kill them immediately. And the Ancients admitted to being over-confident in their abilities. The wraith can probably attack and win by sheer overwhelming amounts of ships and soldiers, and can also re-generate. But the Wraith hate the Ancients, because the Ancients have all their special technology and shields that the Wraith can't easily defeat. So basically it's going to come down to Ancients being on the defensive and over-confident about their abilities, and Wraiths attacking ruthlessly in overwhelming numbers on the offensive. And you know the rest...

[lionel_pendergast_rocks]

i agree with furling god that the sets are kind of getting old. they look just like the ones from sg1, and they all remind be of canadian forests, say, in manning park b.c. i think it would be kind of cool for them to gate to some planets that are like completely deserts, or water planets, kind of make it a bit more interesting.

[spg_1983]

you know people go back and watch the first season of SG-1 again and look at those sets and locations, with the exception of the episode with the living crystal that replicates jack, all the off world sets are...dun dun dun canadian forests!!!! give it a chance people, SG-1 took a while to develop and get its legs under it sop to speak, give atlantis time to do the same, if you gave SG-1 a chance why not atlantis? and as far as the costumes they wear, how is that any different from what some of the non earth humans wear in our galaxy? the genii are human and have advanced to about the technology level of ww1 earth so whose to say that their current fashion vogue wouldnt be similar to ours?

[VirtualCLD]

Hi, since it was confirmed that the great semi-god Ancients were defeated by those incredibly stupid wraith, I am losing hope in this show now.

Ok, since when was it confirmed that the Wraith are the ones who defeated the Ancients, or is this a spoiler about an episode that hasn't aired yet?

[puddlejumper747]

Ok, since when was it confirmed that the Wraith are the ones who defeated the Ancients, or is this a spoiler about an episode that hasn't aired yet?

It's a spoiler about an episode that hasn't aired yet.
Here you go: http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/1x5.shtml

And just for the record:
The Ancients were NOT "semi-god" when they were living in Atlantis. That only happens later...

[Ugly Pig]

Ok, since when was it confirmed that the Wraith are the ones who defeated the Ancients, or is this a spoiler about an episode that hasn't aired yet?

Yes. We were foolish to doubt it in the first place. Erm... "we".

[Furling God]

i agree with furling god that the sets are kind of getting old. they look just like the ones from sg1, and they all remind be of canadian forests, say, in manning park b.c. i think it would be kind of cool for them to gate to some planets that are like completely deserts, or water planets, kind of make it a bit more interesting.

I agree that always seeing BC forest landscape is a bit boring, especially given the fact that we're supposed to visit other planets But I think that comes from a lack of time and money, and we must forgive them for that. Lack of money is understandable for everybody, but I must insist on lack of time: I've read interviews, and I can tell you it is hardly imaginable how much they lack time.

I say if the landscape is a BC forest, but the acting is good and the plot well designed, that's ok. It is other things that I don't forgive. The costumes of the soldiers in Underground planet and Genii planet, they're not acceptable as "costumes of civilizations that reached a WW1 level". First "WW1 level" does make little sense in the Pegasus galaxy. Then, they are meaningful, they are not a passive generic environment like a BC forest spot. They mean that you are in a historical movie about British troops in the first half of the 20th century.

The scenes in the underground laboratory are the worse. I'm sorry to say that, but it's not a cheap set they could manage to rent in emergency. It's a good sophisticated set... for a historical movie about Britain in the same period. Not only that, but the acting of the female doctor and her relationship to Beckett is elaborated and satisfying for a sentimental movie about the first female doctors in Britain. SHE WAS DIRECTED AS SUCH.

There is definitely someone who is in charge and who does not want to make a sci-fi show. When you make a samurai movie, you don't add costumes, objects AND acting of Paris students revolts in 1968. Sorry about that, but a movie with costumes, objects and acting of 1968 students revolts in Paris is a historical movie about France, not a medieval Japan movie, and even less a movie about the Pegasus galaxy.

[spg_1983]

I agree that always seeing BC forest landscape is a bit boring, especially given the fact that we're supposed to visit other planets But I think that comes from a lack of time and money, and we must forgive them for that. Lack of money is understandable for everybody, but I must insist on lack of time: I've read interviews, and I can tell you it is hardly imaginable how much they lack time.

I say if the landscape is a BC forest, but the acting is good and the plot well designed, that's ok. It is other things that I don't forgive. The costumes of the soldiers in Underground planet and Genii planet, they're not acceptable as "costumes of civilizations that reached a WW1 level". First "WW1 level" does make little sense in the Pegasus galaxy. Then, they are meaningful, they are not a passive generic environment like a BC forest spot. They mean that you are in a historical movie about British troops in the first half of the 20th century.

The scenes in the underground laboratory are the worse. I'm sorry to say that, but it's not a cheap set they could manage to rent in emergency. It's a good sophisticated set... for a historical movie about Britain in the same period. Not only that, but the acting of the female doctor and her relationship to Beckett is elaborated and satisfying for a sentimental movie about the first female doctors in Britain. SHE WAS DIRECTED AS SUCH.

There is definitely someone who is in charge and who does not want to make a sci-fi show. When you make a samurai movie, you don't add costumes, objects AND acting of Paris students revolts in 1968. Sorry about that, but a movie with costumes, objects and acting of 1968 students revolts in Paris is a historical movie about France, not a medieval Japan movie, and even less a movie about the Pegasus galaxy.

how is any of what you are sayiong different from the way things were during the first season of SG-1? the settings were cheap and the costumes and cookie cutter bad guys were cheesy at best. but SG-1 was given a chance to figure out where it was going and get its feet under it. SGA just needs to be given the same chance as we all gave SG-1

[alaskannut]

i agree with furling god that the sets are kind of getting old. they look just like the ones from sg1, and they all remind be of canadian forests, say, in manning park b.c. i think it would be kind of cool for them to gate to some planets that are like completely deserts, or water planets, kind of make it a bit more interesting.

Just once I'd love to see an ep with a set in the alaskan Interior or the North slope...that would be quite the nice break from tradition

[Furling God]

how is any of what you are sayiong different from the way things were during the first season of SG-1? the settings were cheap and the costumes and cookie cutter bad guys were cheesy at best. but SG-1 was given a chance to figure out where it was going and get its feet under it. SGA just needs to be given the same chance as we all gave SG-1

Oh I'm ready to give SGA all the chances possible. I think for this year it's already down and under, because they will try to make us believe in the finale that Earth can do better than the Ancients, that Wraiths really defeated Ancients, that Atlantis only had a shield whereas outposts can destroy a whole fleet, etc. So, maybe next year.

Now to come back to what you said, the settings and costumes of other planets in SG1 were copied on Earth settings and costumes if and only if it had a meaning. Usually it meant that people from that precise country had been moved by Gulds, and things like that. It was even one of the main interests of the show, that arceological/mythical relationship to Earth. I loved it.

Budget or no budget, it would not have occurred to SG1 directors to show a Japanese dojo, with exactly copied objects, colors and atmosphere, with actors displaying Tokugawa period samurai manners and physical type, in an episode that had nothing to do with Japan. Can I make you believe it is an Italian comedy, with all that stuff?

Or, to give another example, if you show me soldiers of the Napoleon army, with costumes carefully designed as only collectors can do, with ALL FURNITURE exactly corresponding as if it had been the intention of an artist to make that set, and manners that are corresponding, and IF you tell me that that is the Zork army on planet Zboing, which never had any relationship with Earth, I say you have a problem of professionalism.

[spg_1983]

Oh I'm ready to give SGA all the chances possible. I think for this year it's already down and under, because they will try to make us believe in the finale that Earth can do better than the Ancients, that Wraiths really defeated Ancients, that Atlantis only had a shield whereas outposts can destroy a whole fleet, etc. So, maybe next year.

Now to come back to what you said, the settings and costumes of other planets in SG1 were copied on Earth settings and costumes if and only if it had a meaning. Usually it meant that people from that precise country had been moved by Gulds, and things like that. It was even one of the main interests of the show, that arceological/mythical relationship to Earth. I loved it.

Budget or no budget, it would not have occurred to SG1 directors to show a Japanese dojo, with exactly copied objects, colors and atmosphere, with actors displaying Tokugawa period samurai manners and physical type, in an episode that had nothing to do with Japan. Can I make you believe it is an Italian comedy, with all that stuff?

Or, to give another example, if you show me soldiers of the Napoleon army, with costumes carefully designed as only collectors can do, with ALL FURNITURE exactly corresponding as if it had been the intention of an artist to make that set, and manners that are corresponding, and IF you tell me that that is the Zork army on planet Zboing, which never had any relationship with Earth, I say you have a problem of professionalism.

ok im willing to acknowledge your point that making them exact copies of different earth period clothing was perhaps a mistake, they could have made them similar but changed them enough easily to make them alien and distinct.

[Sicarius]

Hm, maybe because I grew up watching Star Trek (TOS) in syndication, I'm not bothered by cheap sets. If you can watch that episode with the mime girl without puking, you can watch anything. I just accept that budget and time limitations make it hard for shows to do anything spectacular. They probably used most of the season's set budget building Atlantis.

I'm not saying I totally disagree with the lack of creativity in the sets, though... at least when Star Trek swiped Nazi uniforms from the show next door they worked the story out so that it made sense.

I just turn to books when I want cool worlds--no budgetary limits on the imagination there. Try a Neal Stephenson novel if you haven't. Awesome world building. Nothing Hollywood does competes.

[Manic]

What you have to keep in mind is that there is no set template as for what a sci-fi setting should look like, on a planet we've never seen before.

Reusing the Canadian wilderness? I'm just gonna have to completely let that one slide. Everyone reuses shooting locations. Firefly used the same North American desert. Star Trek used the same backlot. Xena/Hercules used the same corner of New Zealand. And let's be honest; New Zealand looks nothing like Greece.

I'd say that, on the whole, human beings all think similarly. We have varying opinions and ideals, but we more-or-less conform to the same way of thinking. Look at the Americas, which had little to no contact with the Eastern Hemisphere before the 15th century. Several Native American cultures, before their fall, were incredibly similar to some European and African cultures. Hell, the Aztec had the only lunar calender on Earth that never needed a leap year. The last time humans from the Americas met humans from the Old World (not counting brief encounters with Vikings) was before the Ice Age. And look how similar some of those cultures ended up. The Anasazi built Community Housing, for goodness sake.

So who's to say humans genetically similar to ourselves wouldn't build civilizations drastically similar to our own?

I have to admit, though-- the lack of imagination in the costumes bothers me. Even the Kelownans of Langara had unique clothing, and they were essentially space-Canadians.

[KayMan2k]

Even the Kelownans of Langara had unique clothing, and they were essentially space-Canadians.

LOL!!!!!!!!