PDA

View Full Version : They forgot about Jonas



Ghostrider
November 17th, 2007, 10:43 AM
My only big problem with this episode was that they made no mention of what happened to Jonas in "Prophecy". I mean Carter for one should have remembered, and not acted like it was impossible.

skydragon786
November 17th, 2007, 10:45 AM
Well, I'd swear that Jonas got it wrong once. Carter did ask Davos whether he had ever been wrong, and he replied: "No.", so there's more of a chance to take him seriously if he has never been wrong over his whole lifetime, as well as being born with these gifts, whereas Jonas was experimented on.

wkw427
November 17th, 2007, 11:00 AM
Agreed. I thought of Jonas when they were talking about it.

Jonas only predicted the PROBABLE future. When he saw the gateroom being blown up, that was what would of happened if he DIDN'T see it. Since he did, it didn't happen

This guy must be diffirent.. hm

jelgate
November 17th, 2007, 11:22 AM
Maybe they were going to mention Jonas but had to cut for time

desh
November 17th, 2007, 11:59 AM
Did anyone else pick up on the fact that the plot of this episode was reused? In SG-1 Season 6, Jonas experiences the same evolutionary anomaly (thanks to Nirtii), developing precognitive abilities. I was surprised that none of the characters, even Carter, made a connection with Jonas' mutation.

kirmit
November 17th, 2007, 12:00 PM
Or the Writers just want to forget Jonas ever existed :(.

jenks
November 17th, 2007, 12:15 PM
I was disappointed that Carter didn't make a reference, I don't know if it's because the writers think they'll piss people off if she keeps mentioning SG-1, or that they almost hate to acknowledge that Jonas ever existed... I wouldn't call it a reused plot though, beyond their being two characters who can see the future I think the two eps are totally different...

Major_Griff
November 17th, 2007, 12:54 PM
Yeah it was odd with all the SG-1 referencing being done by Carter in Doppleganger that she didn't say something here. But its not like I didn't expect this. In that scene when they were talking about it in the begining, There was one moment where I knew if she was gonna say something it would have been then, it didn't come and I was not shocked at all. They didn't even reference him when we found out his planet was taken over by the Ori, so I excprected this to happen.

desh
November 17th, 2007, 01:15 PM
Oh. I didn't see the other topic; guess I didn't remember the name of that episode.

prion
November 17th, 2007, 01:28 PM
I was disappointed that Carter didn't make a reference, I don't know if it's because the writers think they'll piss people off if she keeps mentioning SG-1, or that they almost hate to acknowledge that Jonas ever existed... I wouldn't call it a reused plot though, beyond their being two characters who can see the future I think the two eps are totally different...


Yup :):) there is a limit to "when I was at the SGC" type sentences that Carter can say.... ;) realistically, if you worked with somebody who always had quips like that, it would get old REAL fast, and on TV, it gets old faster. so, maybe carter remember, but face it, nothing she could say about what happened with jonas would help them in this situation. it would be like "oh, I had a black car too." type comment. nice, but doesn't help.

people who can see into the future are as common as people who see dead people *cough* on TV these days ;)

desh
November 17th, 2007, 01:28 PM
It was in the scene when Dr. Keller was telling Carter about the MRI and the increased synaptic activity in Davos's brain. This is exactly what happened to Jonas after being mutated by Nirtii's genetic experiments.

I think the episode would have been more interesting if the writers had included the connection with Jonas. The human evolution plot-line started during S6 of SG1 was never developed very extensively. The episodes dealing with genetic manipulation and evolution really added a biological aspect to ascension that complemented the more spiritual, philosophical side of it. So far, Atlantis has only focused on the latter.

gater101
November 17th, 2007, 01:37 PM
or that they almost hate to acknowledge that Jonas ever existed....


That's it, right there.

'Jonas, in Stargate? Huh? Oh yeah, Carter's crazy ex-fiance in s1'.

That type of reaction, perhaps? Lol.

Platschu
November 17th, 2007, 01:41 PM
Carter could tell stories about her adventures in every Atlantis episode, because she is the most experienced soldier in the city, but the TPTB won't ad more fuel to the fire, so she became a bit silent in this season. :(

kohar
November 17th, 2007, 03:43 PM
Did anyone else pick up on the fact that the plot of this episode was reused? In SG-1 Season 6, Jonas experiences the same evolutionary anomaly (thanks to Nirtii), developing precognitive abilities. I was surprised that none of the characters, even Carter, made a connection with Jonas' mutation.

Jonas didn't recieve precognative abilities thanks to Nirtii, what he got was a big tumor on his brain that was giving him the abilities, which imo was ripped off from that bad Travolta movie, without surgery Jonas would have visions but was a dead-man. So they removed the tumor and the visions stopped.

The seer on the other hand was a genetic fluke who just happened to have developed a type of lymphatic cancer which has nothing to do with the brain directly so wasn't the cause of the visions. If they had of been able to cure him he would still have the vision.
Cancer and visions are the only similarities.

kymeric
November 17th, 2007, 03:50 PM
except that there wasnt a huge ship over the sgc extorting them to help and then a second one showed up and blew them both up

otherwise, yes its the same episode

/eyeroll

Shan Bruce Lee
November 17th, 2007, 03:52 PM
That's it, right there.

'Jonas, in Stargate? Huh? Oh yeah, Carter's crazy ex-fiance in s1'.

That type of reaction, perhaps? Lol.

Was his name Jonas? It's been so long since I've seen that episode I can't even remember.

Argosy
November 17th, 2007, 03:55 PM
Yup :):) there is a limit to "when I was at the SGC" type sentences that Carter can say.... ;) realistically,

Agreed.

She really needs to start relating everything to “one time at band camp” where she learned how to play the cello among other things… ;)

Shan Bruce Lee
November 17th, 2007, 04:10 PM
It was in the scene when Dr. Keller was telling Carter about the MRI and the increased synaptic activity in Davos's brain. This is exactly what happened to Jonas after being mutated by Nirtii's genetic experiments.

What did she say about this being the first time it had ever happened at birth? I think that was brought up after Kailey mentioned Meredith's near-ascention.

Heaven
November 17th, 2007, 06:02 PM
They forgot about Jonas
and Teer !!

Mitchell82
November 17th, 2007, 07:05 PM
Agreed.

She really needs to start relating everything to “one time at band camp” where she learned how to play the cello among other things… ;)

You are being sarcastic right? As per the topic it wasn't needed, and BTW your sig I like Cortana's better.;)

the fifth man
November 17th, 2007, 07:11 PM
Was his name Jonas? It's been so long since I've seen that episode I can't even remember.

Yep, Carter's ex-fiance was named Jonas.

As for Season 6 Jonas, sadly, I just don't see him ever being mentioned again.

Mitchell82
November 17th, 2007, 07:11 PM
Yep, Carter's ex-fiance was named Jonas.

Yup and one creepy guy.

the fifth man
November 17th, 2007, 07:13 PM
Yup and one creepy guy.

That's one way of describing him.:)

Mitchell82
November 17th, 2007, 07:14 PM
That's one way of describing him.:)

Yeah and many other not so nice words. I did actually like that ep though. It was the forst attempt in exploring Earth religions.

Argosy
November 17th, 2007, 07:16 PM
You are being sarcastic right? As per the topic it wasn't needed, and BTW your sig I like Cortana's better.;)

Yes I was being slightly sarcastic.;) She never learned how to the play the cello…the reset button on “Unending” took that away from her.:sam:

What else is she going to reference all the time other than her tenure at the SGC? It would have been nice if she referenced Jonas, but it wasn’t necessary.

How’s that for topic relevance LOL?

Mitchell82
November 17th, 2007, 07:17 PM
Yes I was being slightly sarcastic.;) She never learned how to the play the cello…the reset button on “Unending” took that away from her.:sam:

What else is she going to reference all the time other than her tenure at the SGC? It would have been nice if she referenced Jonas, but it wasn’t necessary.

How’s that for topic relevance LOL?

:lol: yeah it would have been nice but I can just imagine the flood of angry fans saying too much SG-1 references.

Argosy
November 17th, 2007, 07:44 PM
I was dreaming when I wrote this, so forgive me if I go astray…

You know since the title of this thread is “They forgot about Jonas” I’m going to throw this out there (even though it is in the Atlantis forum)…

Why the heck didn’t they bring JQ back for at least one episode, or preferably a two parter in season ten rather then some of the “filler” episodes?

The Ori subjugated his world…wouldn’t he have used what spec ops./gorilla warfare training he acquired on earth in order to form some kind of a resistance movement?

Here’s another wild idea…maybe with his advanced physiology (he is supposed to slightly higher on the evolutionary latter than us) he could actually fly an Ori mother ship like a Prior.

So the resistance could storm an Ori mother ship at an opportune moment, Jonas could make use of it to liberate his world (& keep it that way).

I guess we could add that to the wish list of thing I would have liked to see in season eleven LOL.

Any way that would have been cool because it would have opened the door to him making a guess apperance on Atlantis, & now it seems very unlikely that we will ever see or hear of him again.

Cool post#100!

garhkal
November 17th, 2007, 09:15 PM
It was in the scene when Dr. Keller was telling Carter about the MRI and the increased synaptic activity in Davos's brain. This is exactly what happened to Jonas after being mutated by Nirtii's genetic experiments.

I think the episode would have been more interesting if the writers had included the connection with Jonas. The human evolution plot-line started during S6 of SG1 was never developed very extensively. The episodes dealing with genetic manipulation and evolution really added a biological aspect to ascension that complemented the more spiritual, philosophical side of it. So far, Atlantis has only focused on the latter.

THat would have been a great point iMO to have mentioned johnas. ANd i do agree, there were paralleles with what Nerti was doing.

garhkal
November 17th, 2007, 09:25 PM
Jonas didn't recieve precognative abilities thanks to Nirtii, what he got was a big tumor on his brain that was giving him the abilities, which imo was ripped off from that bad Travolta movie, without surgery Jonas would have visions but was a dead-man. So they removed the tumor and the visions stopped.

Phenomenon.. And i loved that film. Though i hated it that he died in the end.

Amalthea
November 18th, 2007, 07:36 PM
Well, I forgot about Jonas too. But as someone else mentioned, his visions were done to him and were killing him, while the Seers were genetic.

I would have to imagine the writers thought about mentioning Jonas, but then it would have just been another episode with Carter talking about "Oh, this is like the time when we... " again. They already did that once. While the two shows are related, I think SGA is striving to pull away from SG1 and forge their own path, which is difficult in the face of 10 years and 200+ episodes! So, no need to keep rehashing old story lines to make that transition harder.

Sweetsong
November 18th, 2007, 07:41 PM
They didn't even reference him when we found out his planet was taken over by the Ori, so I excprected this to happen.

Which episode was it stated that Colona had been taken over by the Oria, I think I completely missed that.

jelgate
November 18th, 2007, 08:28 PM
Corin Nemec was angry at the producers when he was replaced by Micheal Shanks. Don't you think that may been an impact on why Jonas wasn't mentioned. Besides the conditions of their precognition abilities are very different

ColCaldwell
November 18th, 2007, 09:00 PM
TPTB have stated that Jonas Quinn has basically been forgotten in the Stargate Universe.

jenks
November 18th, 2007, 09:01 PM
Have you got a source?

Major_Griff
November 19th, 2007, 02:07 PM
Which episode was it stated that Colona had been taken over by the Oria, I think I completely missed that.

I think it was counterstrike, but I'm not sure.

jelgate
November 19th, 2007, 02:09 PM
Which episode was it stated that Colona had been taken over by the Oria, I think I completely missed that.
First its spelled Kelwona and Ori, Second Major Griff is right, it was Counterstrike

jenks
November 19th, 2007, 02:24 PM
Actually it's spelled Kelowna ;)

Atlantis1
November 19th, 2007, 03:57 PM
Maybe they didn't mention him because some of the viewers might not have seen that SG-1 episode. That could have confused some people.

P-90_177
November 19th, 2007, 04:07 PM
Jonas didn't recieve precognative abilities thanks to Nirtii, what he got was a big tumor on his brain that was giving him the abilities, which imo was ripped off from that bad Travolta movie, without surgery Jonas would have visions but was a dead-man. So they removed the tumor and the visions stopped.

The seer on the other hand was a genetic fluke who just happened to have developed a type of lymphatic cancer which has nothing to do with the brain directly so wasn't the cause of the visions. If they had of been able to cure him he would still have the vision.
Cancer and visions are the only similarities.

Actually in the episode they briefly mention that the tumour and the powers that came with it may have been caused by nirtis device.


Corin Nemec was angry at the producers when he was replaced by Micheal Shanks. Don't you think that may been an impact on why Jonas wasn't mentioned. Besides the conditions of their precognition abilities are very different

I don't recall hearing that. If he was mad then he wouldn't have returned in season 7 now would he?

Mitchell82
November 19th, 2007, 04:33 PM
Actually in the episode they briefly mention that the tumour and the powers that came with it may have been caused by nirtis device.



I don't recall hearing that. If he was mad then he wouldn't have returned in season 7 now would he?

Yup and neither do I.

Jumper_One
November 19th, 2007, 04:38 PM
I don't recall hearing that. If he was mad then he wouldn't have returned in season 7 now would he?

neither have I, we saw him in 3 more eps during s7. if he was that mad at TBTB he would've never agreed to return (reminds me of Claudia Christian in B5 after s4 - and she didn't return in s5 and was never heard of again)

Mitchell82
November 19th, 2007, 04:43 PM
neither have I, we saw him in 3 more eps during s7. if he was that mad at TBTB he would've never agreed to return (reminds me of Claudia Christian in B5 after s4 - and she didn't return in s5 and was never heard of again)

I think there was some tension between him and Michael but they dip part on friendly terms and I never heard of him being mad at the writers either. If things were that bad we would have had something like "Charmed Again" Parts 1 and 2 the season 4 premier. Shannon Doherty was a *itch to work with and they fired her and had to rewrite the script and all fans got was a mention that she died and lots of moaning and groaning from one of the characters about her death.

P-90_177
November 19th, 2007, 04:47 PM
neither have I, we saw him in 3 more eps during s7. if he was that mad at TBTB he would've never agreed to return (reminds me of Claudia Christian in B5 after s4 - and she didn't return in s5 and was never heard of again)

(well she was in the final episode but i think that was because it was filmed at the end of season 4 so she could be in it still.)

Anyway yeah as i remember corin nemic actually left volutarilly when Michael shanks returned.

Jumper_One
November 19th, 2007, 04:50 PM
(well she was in the final episode but i think that was because it was filmed at the end of season 4 so she could be in it still.)

yup they shot it prior to s5, about the time when everybody thought s4 would be the last B5 season but when the show got renewed they just shot another finale and the original last ep became the s5 finale


I think there was some tension between him and Michael but they dip part on friendly terms and I never heard of him being mad at the writers either. If things were that bad we would have had something like "Charmed Again" Parts 1 and 2 the season 4 premier. Shannon Doherty was a *itch to work with and they fired her and had to rewrite the script and all fans got was a mention that she died and lots of moaning and groaning from one of the characters about her death.

well I don't know much about Charmed but it's another example of how TBTB would've dealt with the Jonas character in s7 - but they didn't! as for the tension, all I heard was that CN obviously wasn't happy about the decision but apparently he talked to MS about their situation and everything seemed to be ok

P-90_177
November 19th, 2007, 05:27 PM
i'm sure nemic would actually come back if they ever asked but it seems like they've just forgotten about him for whatever reason.

Mitchell82
November 19th, 2007, 06:12 PM
yup they shot it prior to s5, about the time when everybody thought s4 would be the last B5 season but when the show got renewed they just shot another finale and the original last ep became the s5 finale



well I don't know much about Charmed but it's another example of how TBTB would've dealt with the Jonas character in s7 - but they didn't! as for the tension, all I heard was that CN obviously wasn't happy about the decision but apparently he talked to MS about their situation and everything seemed to be ok
Exactly. Even without knowing about the example I used that's what they do when actors get pissy at them.

Jill_Ion
November 19th, 2007, 06:23 PM
Is it about actually "forgetting," as in a deliberate attempt to not bring up the character? I don't think so.

Even though we'd like to believe the writers are as devoted, dedicated, heck, obsessive about a show as the fans are, they aren't. We know the *extreme details*, as in who wore what on what ep and how a story is similar to another from five years back, because we are fans. It's what we do. :)

I don't think Jonas was forgotten. I really don't see a similarity between The Seer and Prophecy, except there's precog in it. If we were going to draw some parallels, then I'd go for Prototype for the advanced human thingy. But it isn't similar to that ep either because Davos was born that way, and Khalek was created.

FallenAngelII
November 22nd, 2007, 09:28 AM
Yes I was being slightly sarcastic.;) She never learned how to the play the cello…the reset button on “Unending” took that away from her.:sam:

What else is she going to reference all the time other than her tenure at the SGC? It would have been nice if she referenced Jonas, but it wasn’t necessary.

How’s that for topic relevance LOL?
As opposed to those, what, four refenceres to four different episodes and incidents she and Keller made in that one single episode ("Doppelganger")?

At first, she seemed slightly skeptic to the Seer's powers. Then, when Keller discovered the source of it, she didn't even mention how Jonas once had the exact same thing happen to him (and just like with Rodney, it was through an Ancient DNA-manipulating device).

If they can reference four different episodes in a single episode, they sure as Hell should reference what happened with Jonas. But we all know that the PTB hate Jonas for whatever reason.

I mean, look at what happened in Season 10. When Langara fell to the Ori, not a single peep was said about Jonas.

PG15
November 22nd, 2007, 06:50 PM
Wasn't there a few complaints about Carter's references in Doppleganger?

If she references, some fans will whine.
If she doesn't reference, some other fans will whine.

Seriously, what's the difference?

FallenAngelII
November 23rd, 2007, 03:15 AM
Wasn't there a few complaints about Carter's references in Doppleganger?

If she references, some fans will whine.
If she doesn't reference, some other fans will whine.

Seriously, what's the difference?
The complaint was the number (for a single episode) of reference. The complaint here is the lack of a reference (especially considering their track record for referencing, hey, they even referenced "Tao...") when it was obvious there should've been one.

If they're gonna reference four different SG-1 episodes in a single episode, they sure as Hell could reference a single one in another.

beale947
November 23rd, 2007, 03:57 AM
The reference to Jonas in The seer, should have been put in, because it is extremely relevant. Even if it was only in passing and she apologised about not believeing jonas or something.

But quite frankly TPTB, don't care about Jonas and want to shove him under a rug. Which I hate with a passion. He was a great charater, and derversed more than 'Langara has fallen to the Ori (Obvious lack of a jonas meantion because we hate him.)'

chobit
November 24th, 2007, 10:15 AM
Sorry if this has already been mentioned, I only skimmed the comments, but the writers DO reference the situation with Jonas, albeit indirectly. McKay says what sam said about predicting the future almost word for word.

Sam: "It doesn't work that way. According to Newtonian physics, yes...if you could know the position and velocity of every particle in the universe at any given moment, you could accurately predict all of their interactions for the rest of time."

Jonas: "So then, the future is predetermined. It's just a matter of having enough information to figure it out."

Sam: "Yes, but quantum mechanics blows that out of the water. According to the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, it is impossible to look at a sub-atomic particle and know both where it is and where it's going at the same time. The more accurately you fix its position, the more uncertain you make its velocity and vice versa. The best we can do is calculate probabilities."

chobit
November 24th, 2007, 10:24 AM
Here's what mckay says in the seer

McKay: "Look, in a mechanical, uh, Newtonian universe, not a problem. You know enough variables you can predict the outcome. But quantum physics blows that out of the water."

The Maneuver
November 24th, 2007, 09:41 PM
Even if they didn't want to make a specific reference, all they had to do was have an "I've seen something like this before" line from Carter, that would have been enough.
BTW, does anyone have any evidence that TPTB hate Jonas? Cos this is the first I've heard of it.

FallenAngelII
November 25th, 2007, 03:26 AM
Sorry if this has already been mentioned, I only skimmed the comments, but the writers DO reference the situation with Jonas, albeit indirectly. McKay says what sam said about predicting the future almost word for word.

Sam: "It doesn't work that way. According to Newtonian physics, yes...if you could know the position and velocity of every particle in the universe at any given moment, you could accurately predict all of their interactions for the rest of time."

Jonas: "So then, the future is predetermined. It's just a matter of having enough information to figure it out."

Sam: "Yes, but quantum mechanics blows that out of the water. According to the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, it is impossible to look at a sub-atomic particle and know both where it is and where it's going at the same time. The more accurately you fix its position, the more uncertain you make its velocity and vice versa. The best we can do is calculate probabilities."
And this has what to do with Jonas?! The little reference to quantum mechanics?

"Quantum mechanics makes it only possible to calculate probabilities" -> Reference to that episode when Jonas was able to do the same thing? Hardly. I could argue he's actually referencing Teer.

Jumper_One
November 25th, 2007, 05:58 AM
Even if they didn't want to make a specific reference, all they had to do was have an "I've seen something like this before" line from Carter, that would have been enough.
BTW, does anyone have any evidence that TPTB hate Jonas? Cos this is the first I've heard of it.

check out the posts of Mitchell82 and myself on page 2 and 3 of this thread

FallenAngelII
November 25th, 2007, 08:09 AM
The PTB's convoluted history with Jonas/Corin Nemec:
* He was brought in to replace Daniel/Michael Shanks
* Then, when Michael decided to come back, they wrote his character out.
* It was, however, in his contract that he be allowed to write an episode (I think), so this is why we eventually got "Fallout".
* They originally intended to spin Jonas off to Atlantis. For whatever reason, this never happened.
* There has never been a single mention or even a reference to the character ever since.
* In season 10 (9?), it's stated that "Kelowna has fallen to the Ori". If the PTB didn't hate Jonas, they'd have had a character say something like "I hope Jonas is OK" or have the team look at each other in a meaningful way. Instead, it was treated like another "Oh well, an ally planet has fallen"-moment and then it was gone.
* No reference to Jonas in "The Seer" despite the same episode referencing "Tao of Rodney" (while that was slightly similar, "Prophecy" was much more similar) and the fact that the PTB just love to have Sam or Keller reference SG-1 episodes (like that time in "Doppelganger" where they collectively referenced four different episodes).

Yeah. The PTB just looooooove Jonas.

Mitchell82
November 25th, 2007, 04:50 PM
Is it about actually "forgetting," as in a deliberate attempt to not bring up the character? I don't think so.

Even though we'd like to believe the writers are as devoted, dedicated, heck, obsessive about a show as the fans are, they aren't. We know the *extreme details*, as in who wore what on what ep and how a story is similar to another from five years back, because we are fans. It's what we do. :)

I don't think Jonas was forgotten. I really don't see a similarity between The Seer and Prophecy, except there's precog in it. If we were going to draw some parallels, then I'd go for Prototype for the advanced human thingy. But it isn't similar to that ep either because Davos was born that way, and Khalek was created.
Agreed. Prototype is what I thought of not Prophecy.

Mitchell82
November 25th, 2007, 04:57 PM
The PTB's convoluted history with Jonas/Corin Nemec:
* He was brought in to replace Daniel/Michael Shanks
Fact. Quite obvious.

* Then, when Michael decided to come back, they wrote his character out.
Incorrect. When Michael's dispute with TPTB whatever it was was resolved and agreed to come back the orriginal intent was to keep both on but it was too awkward for the two of them so it was decided to write the character out with the possibility of coming back.

* It was, however, in his contract that he be allowed to write an episode (I think), so this is why we eventually got "Fallout".
He had pitched an idea but it wasn't set in stone but they decided to do it anyway.

* They originally intended to spin Jonas off to Atlantis. For whatever reason, this never happened.
Not as far as I can remember.

* There has never been a single mention or even a reference to the character ever since.
* In season 10 (9?), it's stated that "Kelowna has fallen to the Ori". If the PTB didn't hate Jonas, they'd have had a character say something like "I hope Jonas is OK" or have the team look at each other in a meaningful way. Instead, it was treated like another "Oh well, an ally planet has fallen"-moment and then it was gone.
* No reference to Jonas in "The Seer" despite the same episode referencing "Tao of Rodney" (while that was slightly similar, "Prophecy" was much more similar) and the fact that the PTB just love to have Sam or Keller reference SG-1 episodes (like that time in "Doppelganger" where they collectively referenced four different episodes).

Yeah. The PTB just looooooove Jonas.

This proves they hate Corin(Jonas) how? Mention of Jonas was not necesary in Counterstrike. SImply saying they hadn't heard form their allies was enough. As far as the Seer it was not necesary as it wasn't really relevant. How did they mention Tao? Oh yeah the machine that was necesary but not Jonas.

FallenAngelII
November 25th, 2007, 07:43 PM
Incorrect. When Michael's dispute with TPTB whatever it was was resolved and agreed to come back the orriginal intent was to keep both on but it was too awkward for the two of them so it was decided to write the character out with the possibility of coming back.
He was written out after only two episodes. I doubt they went "Let's keep both characters on the show" and then, after two episodes had been shot, decided to rewrite every single script after that to write Jonas out of them especially since they'd probably even started shooting a lot of those then. If this were the case, season 6 might've been delayed slightly because reshoots and rewrites.


He had pitched an idea but it wasn't set in stone but they decided to do it anyway.
I read that it was in his contract.


Not as far as I can remember.
Well known fact.


This proves they hate Corin(Jonas) how? Mention of Jonas was not necesary in Counterstrike.
Yes it was. Jonas was a main character for over a year (he appeared in three seasons). Not tertiary, not secondary but a main character. Corin Nemec had a starring role. I'm too lazy to check, but did he maybe even get the coveted "Corin Nemec as Jonas Quinn"-bit? The PTB love to reference past episodes and characters. As soon as the opportunity arises, they jump at it.

There is absolutely no logical reason for them to not reference Jonas should an opportunity like that arise.

* Main character
* Appeared in 3 seasons, 22+ episodes
* They love to reference

And they'd choose not to all of a sudden because?

Not a single time has Jonas been mentioned of referenced in the 4 years since he was last seen on the show, despite at least two glaring opportunities to do so.

[QUOTE=Mitchell82;7364376]SImply saying they hadn't heard form their allies was enough. As far as the Seer it was not necesary as it wasn't really relevant. How did they mention Tao? Oh yeah the machine that was necesary but not Jonas.
They referenced "The Tao", which really was less relevant than "Prophecy". In fact, it's almost irrelevant.

Much more relevant references are:
* People on the path to Ascension. Who knows, maybe he's the missing link, but Keller just naturally assumes he's a "genetic lotto win".
* The Ancients themselves (on the path to Ascension).
* And finally, "Prophecy", the one where a member of SG-1 became precogniscent through genetic manipulation of his DNA structure.

Mitchell82
November 29th, 2007, 01:35 PM
He was written out after only two episodes. I doubt they went "Let's keep both characters on the show" and then, after two episodes had been shot, decided to rewrite every single script after that to write Jonas out of them especially since they'd probably even started shooting a lot of those then. If this were the case, season 6 might've been delayed slightly because reshoots and rewrites.
Again wrong. When the contracts were being signed it was decided that it was very awkward for the two of them so no need for them to rewrite season 7.



I read that it was in his contract.


Well known fact.
Source?


Yes it was. Jonas was a main character for over a year (he appeared in three seasons). Not tertiary, not secondary but a main character. Corin Nemec had a starring role. I'm too lazy to check, but did he maybe even get the coveted "Corin Nemec as Jonas Quinn"-bit? The PTB love to reference past episodes and characters. As soon as the opportunity arises, they jump at it.
Sorry I disagree.





Not a single time has Jonas been mentioned of referenced in the 4 years since he was last seen on the show, despite at least two glaring opportunities to do so.
There was no need to.



They referenced "The Tao", which really was less relevant than "Prophecy". In fact, it's almost irrelevant.
Sorry it was. In Tao we saw just what the brain goes through at an advanced stage his brain looked the same so not irrelevent.


Much more relevant references are:
* People on the path to Ascension. Who knows, maybe he's the missing link, but Keller just naturally assumes he's a "genetic lotto win".
* The Ancients themselves (on the path to Ascension).
* And finally, "Prophecy", the one where a member of SG-1 became precogniscent through genetic manipulation of his DNA structure.

Sorry those are irrelevent.

The Maneuver
November 30th, 2007, 03:41 PM
FallenAngel: You've been putting forward an argument, but thus far it's been pure speculation. I know you'd be hard pressed to find a quote from TPTB comprehensively explaining negative intentions towards JQ, but don't use terms like "Well known fact" to back up your arguments when it's clearly not well known.


Sorry it was. In Tao we saw just what the brain goes through at an advanced stage his brain looked the same so not irrelevent.



Sorry those are irrelevent.

I don't know how you can say that Tao is relevant yet Prophecy isn't. Both episodes have a similar premise involving one of our regulars developing advanced mental abilities, the main difference being that in Prophecy, the mental abilities are precognitive, and as far as I remember, none of McKay's abilities were. So based on that, when the other characters were doubting The Seer's abilities, it would have made sense for Carter to speak up and say "I've seen these abilities before", but she didn't. Why? I don't know. If it is due to some TPTB conspiracy to forget Jonas, well I'm not entirely convinced of that. Of course, if someone were to display conclusive evidence, then I'm happy to admit that I'm wrong.

Btw, JQ was only a "regular" character for season 6. He was a guest star in S5's Meridian, and a recurring/guest character in his S7 appearances.

Bellageth
December 1st, 2007, 11:18 AM
I dunno, I'd get annoyed if Sam kept talking about any little thing from SG1 that is somewhat elated to what they're doing. I want Atlantis to be less reliant on SG1. Honestly, I don't think bringing Sam over was a good idea. Although I love her, she's just not right... Sam doesn't do her thing any more. She asked Rodney if he could do something (I can't remember what), while she should've known full well whether he could do it or not. She probably could've done it herself! She as, if not more, smart that McKay! I miss her doing the technical stuff and trying to explain it to other people... I miss Weir, and on a somewhat related topic, I miss Carson!

The Maneuver
December 3rd, 2007, 08:25 PM
I dunno, I'd get annoyed if Sam kept talking about any little thing from SG1 that is somewhat elated to what they're doing. I want Atlantis to be less reliant on SG1. Honestly, I don't think bringing Sam over was a good idea. Although I love her, she's just not right... Sam doesn't do her thing any more. She asked Rodney if he could do something (I can't remember what), while she should've known full well whether he could do it or not. She probably could've done it herself! She as, if not more, smart that McKay! I miss her doing the technical stuff and trying to explain it to other people... I miss Weir, and on a somewhat related topic, I miss Carson!

That's a good point. She's gone from being the scientist character to being the General Hammond character.

It is an interesting dynamic, though, considering she's been doing the SG thing for a lot longer than either McKay or Sheppard, and now she has to sit at the sidelines watching them go out into the field like she used to.

Serebii
December 7th, 2007, 12:59 PM
Ok heres the reason

This is Stargate Atlantis. If they were to reference Jonas they would need to have a big reference as to who Jonas was due to them being different shows with different audiences and so forth and that would waste time that could be better spent

So they referenced a Season 3 Atlantis ep. That is logical as its expected that the audience has seen that episode

If it was an SG1 episode that had a Seer in, then yes...there probably should have been a reference. Atlantis, no...it would be far too convuluted.

from_orion
December 7th, 2007, 01:09 PM
Yeah it was odd with all the SG-1 referencing being done by Carter in Doppleganger that she didn't say something here. But its not like I didn't expect this. In that scene when they were talking about it in the begining, There was one moment where I knew if she was gonna say something it would have been then, it didn't come and I was not shocked at all. They didn't even reference him when we found out his planet was taken over by the Ori, so I excprected this to happen.
Maybe they thought it a good idea not to revelate in the past too much.

Emilieheidel
December 8th, 2007, 10:21 PM
I was gonna come on and talk about how they'd practically quoted Prophecy, but Chobit did that already...
"Quantum physics/mechanics blows that out of the water" was the phrase, though, just in case people don't want to read back.

I agree that it would be awkward for Sam to mention Jonas: "This guy who was once my teammate, but not for a terribly long time, he had this tumor..." It would be very confusing, I think. And to SOMEBODY'S credit, in that scene where McKay is arguing that it's impossible to tell the future... Carter keeps looking like she's going to say something, and then people interrupt her. I know when I saw her doing that, I was like, "She's going to talk about Prophecy now! I just know it!" But McKay wouldn't LET her! So that's why Jonas isn't mentioned, in my opinion. Blame McKay.

The Maneuver
December 10th, 2007, 05:20 PM
Ok heres the reason

This is Stargate Atlantis. If they were to reference Jonas they would need to have a big reference as to who Jonas was due to them being different shows with different audiences and so forth and that would waste time that could be better spent

So they referenced a Season 3 Atlantis ep. That is logical as its expected that the audience has seen that episode

If it was an SG1 episode that had a Seer in, then yes...there probably should have been a reference. Atlantis, no...it would be far too convuluted.

At no point did I expect them to go into a long explanation recapping the events of "Prophecy". A simple "I've seen this before" from Carter would have sufficed.

captain jake
December 10th, 2007, 07:26 PM
At no point did I expect them to go into a long explanation recapping the events of "Prophecy". A simple "I've seen this before" from Carter would have sufficed.

We do have to remember that most of the audience has not seen that episode. Mentioning Prophecy would simply be confusing, I agree one line of text would have been appropriate.

squeakytoad
January 24th, 2008, 03:42 AM
Ok. Three things I hate about both Stargate series that are all pretty similar.

a) Atlantis and SG1 barely ever refer to each other. Which is ridiculous, as half the situations in Atlantis have already been visited by SG1 in one form or another and drawing upon each other's experiences would solve a lot of problems.

b) They are constantly forgetting about past episodes (ie, Rodney states that seeing into the future is impossible even though it's been done three times in SG1 through various means).

c) Both series have completely forgotten about Jonas.


Jonas' tumor. Remember? Part of his advanced alien genes in combination with possible mutation from Nierte's device?
He could see visions with that.
When they started scanning this guy's brain, I thought that would be the first thing mentioned.

methosivanhoe
January 24th, 2008, 03:58 AM
good point...

didn't actually think about that lol

nicely spotted

M

Raven56
January 28th, 2008, 10:44 AM
a) Atlantis and SG1 barely ever refer to each other. Which is ridiculous, as half the situations in Atlantis have already been visited by SG1 in one form or another and drawing upon each other's experiences would solve a lot of problems.
Partly IMO because they're trying to make sure that those who haven't seen SG-1 aren't left behind by references to the other series, and also I noticed a LOT of squalling on the forums whenever reference was made to SG-1 about how SG:A is a different series and why are they constantly referencing SG-1??? ;):) Personally, I don't really mind either way :D


b) They are constantly forgetting about past episodes (ie, Rodney states that seeing into the future is impossible even though it's been done three times in SG1 through various means).
Can't really answer that one, except it's the same thing - separation of series. Although there's also the fact that McKay might not accept that it can be done, simply because he hasn't done it himself? :D


c) Both series have completely forgotten about Jonas.Jonas' tumor. Remember? Part of his advanced alien genes in combination with possible mutation from Nierte's device? He could see visions with that. When they started scanning this guy's brain, I thought that would be the first thing mentioned.
In a way, they did. Didn't the Doctor mention that there was no organic cause? So IMO there wasn't any reason to say anything specifically about Jonas' tumor. If a tumor had been found in the Seer's scans, then, yes, definitely bring up Jonas.

Crazedwraith
November 24th, 2008, 03:53 AM
Bit of an old topic but I only recently saw the episode.

Now, I was annoyed with the excessive SG-1 quoting in episodes like Doppleganger. Which referenced a first season SG-1 episode; 'Lazarus' when the only similarity was: I touched a crystal and it zapped me.

However, I was also annoyed at this episode for not referencing Prophecy. :D You just can't win with me.

While I'd admit having Carter go: "Back on when I was with SG-1..." every episode would have got annoying quickly, This episode really, really, needed a Prophecy reference.

Why? Because all the tension in this episode rested on The Seer's visions being perfect and infallible and so forth but Carter's already seen Jonas go through the same thing. Already knows visions of the future aren't perfect by physics theory and by an actual example from her past: Jonas.

So her behaviour in this episode: worrying about future visions like she's never experienced before, is completely out of character and very aggravating.

JadedWraith
November 24th, 2008, 04:09 AM
Since we're ranting generally about Jonas omissions through out SG1 and SGA, I'd like to add this one:
In Season 8 when Daniel was taken by RepliCarter, he says something like:
-" I'd prefer to go without the hand through my head thing". The odd part was that happened to Jonas in Unatural Selection, and not Daniel, who hadn't deel with a Human Form replicator untill that exact moment. You may argue he witnessed it in his ascended form, but it still is a strecht.
I wonder who really had a problem with Jonas, the hard core fans or the TPTB?
And I'd love to see him back in SG1 after Season 7 or, why not SGA, since he studied the Lost City for so long. Maybe in Universe. One can dream.

kache
December 29th, 2008, 03:32 AM
It's different.
Jonas had a tumour that gave him that powers.
Davos had them because he was on the path for the ascension.
The comparison can be made with the Teer in Epiphany, which was able to see through the eyes of others and was also able to see the future.

The Mastage Kidd
April 3rd, 2009, 04:11 PM
We do have to remember that most of the audience has not seen that episode. Mentioning Prophecy would simply be confusing, I agree one line of text would have been appropriate.

They referenced "Cold Lazarus" in "Doppelganger" are you saying they thought it was more likely that a core Atlantis fan who didn't watch SG1 had seen a season one episode than a season six ep? My experience while flipping through the channels tells me that it's much more likely to come across "Prophecy" than Cold Lazarus because they air more recent eps more frequently in syndication.

This episode has more in common with "prophecy" than "Doppelganger" had with "Cold Lazarus."

Mckay giving the speech that Carter did in "prophecy" just makes it worse because Carter shouldn't have needed to be convinced.

BTW (and this is just speculation) I think the reason Jonas isn't referenced even when it makes sense to, is that TPTB thinks the whole fanbase hates Jonas. The save Daniel Jackson crowd was a very loud voice in the fanbase when Jonas was on and they focused their hate on Jonas instead of MS for leaving. As a result TPTB thinks we all hate him and don't want to remember him, so they just act like he was never around to appease us. Unfortunately they don't get that the loudest part of the fanbase isn't the whole fanbase. RIP Jonas.

raduzhok
April 9th, 2009, 08:59 AM
Are we talking SG1 or SGA? I was thinking, there's no Jonas in SGA.

WishIwasJoes
April 9th, 2009, 09:15 AM
TPTB have stated that Jonas Quinn has basically been forgotten in the Stargate Universe.

Well they may want us to forget but he was great in the show. My husband and I bought the box set of DVD's and I have never seen the show at all before. As we made our way thru the seasons I started getting nervous as it got closer for Dr. jackson to leave. But honestly the show didn't miss a beat. Not to put down Mr. Shanks (I know he has Die hard fans), I love him as well. But really Joans was always so happy! Jonas and Teal'c kinda had an outsider bond. It was nice to have new team emotions to explore. I wish they had kept him around longer when Dr. Jackson came back.

But for Sam not to recall what happend to Jonas is just silly. Rodney mentions "oh this happened once time at the SGC" alot in season 2 of SGA. And in the cases he did that it REALLY threw a light that the writers were just reusing stuff.

:jonas: :tealc::jonas::tealc::jonas: