PDA

View Full Version : Nitpick - in regards to the ATA Gene



JackHarkness_Hot
November 1st, 2007, 09:08 AM
Now, remember that scene which features Laryn (sp?) tricking the Wraith so Sheppard can fire a squid drone to kill the Wraiths -- now back in Season 1, we were told that only people with the ATA Gene can use the lifesign detector, now 4th year and there in that scene Laryn managed to use the lifesign detector, however if she has the ATA Gene then why can't she used the Ancient tech i.e. the ship systems?

Hmm... LOL - a blunder?

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 09:15 AM
Sheppard in Siege II told Everett when he reached for the LSD, “Won't do you any good. You need the gene.”

They are going to tell us that they have since found the trick to making it stay on after it is activated by a gene carrier.

Cheating IMO. ;)

JackHarkness_Hot
November 1st, 2007, 09:33 AM
Ahh... sci-fi and cheating sure goes hand in hand! :D

Jill_Ion
November 1st, 2007, 09:37 AM
I noticed that too, but haven't heard any official explanation.

Redhooks
November 1st, 2007, 09:45 AM
Now, remember that scene which features Laryn (sp?) tricking the Wraith so Sheppard can fire a squid drone to kill the Wraiths -- now back in Season 1, we were told that only people with the ATA Gene can use the lifesign detector, now 4th year and there in that scene Laryn managed to use the lifesign detector, however if she has the ATA Gene then why can't she used the Ancient tech i.e. the ship systems?

Hmm... LOL - a blunder?


Sheppard in Siege II told Everett when he reached for the LSD, “Won't do you any good. You need the gene.”

They are going to tell us that they have since found the trick to making it stay on after it is activated by a gene carrier.

Cheating IMO. ;)


Ahh... sci-fi and cheating sure goes hand in hand! :D
I agree and it could have been dealt with with a one or two sentence exchange with Larrin saying to Sheppard she needed the LSD and Sheppard could have replied with the same comment he said to Everett. Then Larrin could have grabbed it and said, "it is still working" and then Sheppard could have said something like, well it is a different type then I am used to. This exchange could have deen done in the storage room and we could have lost the dumb "shoot too early" bit with Larrin and just had a scene with Sheppard getting in the chair then a cut to Larrin walking down the hallway. The next cut would be how it actually was shown when Larrin stopped walking and said, "I got 'em." To me that would have worked out much better than what actually was shown and would have omitted the poor attempt at humor.

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 09:46 AM
Of course, any explanation for the use of the LSD is going to be better than the tap dance of an explanation of Ford’s being able to fly the jumper.

Something about anyone being able to ferry one through the stargate. Anyone have the reference? Something JM said and I’ve seen it in one of the books: Entanglement or Exogenisis maybe. Pure hogwash! ;)

Redhooks
November 1st, 2007, 09:54 AM
Of course, any explanation for the use of the LSD is going to be better than the tap dance of an explanation of Ford’s being able to fly the jumper.

Something about anyone being able to ferry one through the stargate. Anyone have the reference? Something JM said and I’ve seen it in one of the books: Entanglement or Exogenisis maybe. Pure hogwash! ;)
Yeah the explanation about Ford in the jumper was that it was on auto-pilot once putting in a gate address on the jumper's DHD and that is why it was able to go through the gate but no further. Weak, but still not said in any episode and the explanation had to be given outside the show's "reality" by a producer.

Jill_Ion
November 1st, 2007, 10:02 AM
But it was implied in Siege III that's what happened (Ford not flying the PJ, just on autopilot), so I'm OK with it. Shep said Ford would abandon the jumper and dial out to another planet. He just didn't say "Because he can't fly the jumper" because Weir already knew that.

Redhooks
November 1st, 2007, 10:13 AM
But it was implied in Siege III that's what happened (Ford not flying the PJ, just on autopilot), so I'm OK with it. Shep said Ford would abandon the jumper and dial out to another planet. He just didn't say "Because he can't fly the jumper" because Weir already knew that.
From that perspective, do you see it implied in the episode that the LSD that Larrin used was one that just had to be initialized and not like all the other ones we have see? I would definitely say the stretch of Ford in the PJ is much more plausible than Larrin using the LSD. As said before, a brief one or sentences and it would have been explained.

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 10:29 AM
The jumper is the bigger problem for me. They won’t even start up for someone without the gene. How did he get the autopilot on, was there someone around to initialize it? And bigger still is the question of why would a jumper have that capability? What would the Ancients use it for?

On topic: Sheppard was there, the LSD was on. They could have found a way to keep any Ancient scanning device on. That would explain Zelenka’s using one in Reunion, too. A function the Ancients might have actually had some use for. And a much simpler explanation than the jumper.

The.Road.Not.Taken
November 1st, 2007, 10:32 AM
they keeping changing the rules and its really hard to decide what is and whats not

JackHarkness_Hot
November 1st, 2007, 10:54 AM
I agree with the above post ^^, it keeps changing and it really is difficult to understand why it was done the way it was done. It's times like these I wish the writers asks themselves the following questions: "Why did I do that? What use is it for? Is this right?"

Oh well, another plothole

Mitchell82
November 1st, 2007, 10:56 AM
I agree with the above post ^^, it keeps changing and it really is difficult to understand why it was done the way it was done. It's times like these I wish the writers asks themselves the following questions: "Why did I do that? What use is it for? Is this right?"

Oh well, another plothole

Not really, the LSD was already on and had been initalzied by Shep.

JackHarkness_Hot
November 1st, 2007, 11:36 AM
And we know the LSD is one of those tech that could be maintained once activated?

Mitchell82
November 1st, 2007, 12:56 PM
And we know the LSD is one of those tech that could be maintained once activated?

If I remember correctly as long asa it's not switched off.

Redhooks
November 1st, 2007, 01:31 PM
If I remember correctly as long asa it's not switched off.
But do you remember where that information was given? I don't recall anything being said about a LSD after Sheppard's comment to Col. Everett in The Siege, Pt. II as was mentioned previously. Something that I just thought of too was JM and PM are credited as writing (not sure which one actually wrote it) The Siege, Pt. II, so it seems strange that this plot hole/mistake, whatever you want to call it, happened to them. :S

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 02:13 PM
But do you remember where that information was given? I don't recall anything being said about a LSD after Sheppard's comment to Col. Everett in The Siege, Pt. II as was mentioned previously. Something that I just thought of too was JM and PM are credited as writing (not sure which one actually wrote it) The Siege, Pt. II, so it seems strange that this plot hole/mistake, whatever you want to call it, happened to them. :S
I don’t believe that it’s ever been said that there is a way for an LSD to work for a non gene carrier. I was just postulating a little asphalt to fill in the hole.

Ltcolshepjumper
November 1st, 2007, 02:25 PM
It's just the same plothole with that dreaded Lucius being able to activate and reactivate the Ancient personal shield.

Redhooks
November 1st, 2007, 03:10 PM
It's just the same plothole with that dreaded Lucius being able to activate and reactivate the Ancient personal shield.
I disagree because at least Lucius mentioned he found a guy with the ATA gene to activate it and that it must be a different type then the prototype found by McKay in a lab on Atlantis which he had read about in the mission reports. He also used at least one if not more of the mission report scenarios to use in his made up stories of bravery.

P-90_177
November 1st, 2007, 03:14 PM
Sorry. i would have typed something relevent but i couldn't take this thread serriously anymore once i saw you'd shortend lifesigns detector to 'LSD'. lol.

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 03:18 PM
They've called it an LSD on the show before. So not just another fandom acronym.

And I’m so used to it, it took me a minute to see the more common use. :o

sparky
November 2nd, 2007, 05:18 AM
Does anyone remember that guy Otho from 'The Tower' in season 2? I seem to remember him using the life signs detector before he was given the ATA gene therapy.

Or am I just imagining things?

Perhaps the detectors require someone with the ATA gene to power them up every time but can then be operated by anyone? Kind of like how a login password to a computer, it has to be re-entered every time the computer is switched on but you don't need to know the password once its up and running.

blue-skyz
November 2nd, 2007, 05:29 AM
Does anyone remember that guy Otho from 'The Tower' in season 2? I seem to remember him using the life signs detector before he was given the ATA gene therapy.
In the Tower he had some gadget that could tell him if a person had the gene. Only time we’ve seen one?

vaberella
November 2nd, 2007, 05:35 AM
Does anyone remember that guy Otho from 'The Tower' in season 2? I seem to remember him using the life signs detector before he was given the ATA gene therapy.

Or am I just imagining things?
You're not necessarily "imagining" things. What Otho had was I believe a device that looked similar but was used to detect the ATA gene in humans. He scanned Teyla, Ronon, as well as John until finally focusing on John---apparently finding out that John had the gene. Keep in mind that Otho needed the gene and was probably able to develop such an equipment during his time of studying the function of the ATA gene and how it worked but not being able to develop one for himself.


Perhaps the detectors require someone with the ATA gene to power them up every time but can then be operated by anyone? Kind of like how a login password to a computer, it has to be re-entered every time the computer is switched on but you don't need to know the password once its up and running.

They really can't be powered up by "anyone" that would screw with continuity. Going back to The Siege II, it was clear that you needed the ATA gene to use the detectors. Like when this conversation took place between Colonel Everett and Shep:


SHEPPARD: How many Darts crashed?

EVERETT: Between twenty and thirty. And internal sensors are still down.

SHEPPARD: Well, we have this. (He reaches into his jacket, takes out a lifesigns detector and shows it to Everett, who looks at the many dots blinking on its screen.) It can't differentiate between Wraith and human but if we confine all base personnel to designated areas, the blips that show up out of bounds will be the likely targets.

EVERETT: Let me see that.

SHEPPARD (handing him the detector): Won't do you any good. You need the gene.

(Everett holds up the detector to show that it's still working.)

EVERETT: I got the gene therapy too.

http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/transcripts/120.shtml

But continuity is always being retconned...I say blame it on Scarlet Witch and call it a day. :S

jonos101
December 20th, 2007, 02:02 AM
In ep 1x20 the seige pt2 col. shepard told that other col. that to use the ancient scanner you had to have the ATA gene but in travelers when shepard is in the control chair and larrin is tracking the wraith she is using a ancient scanner

Myles
December 20th, 2007, 04:21 PM
I believe you must have to Ancient gene to activate certain devices like the scanner. Once it's activated it can be used by anyone unless it requires thought control like a control chair or puddle jumper.

s09119
December 20th, 2007, 04:33 PM
In ep 1x20 the seige pt2 col. shepard told that other col. that to use the ancient scanner you had to have the ATA gene but in travelers when shepard is in the control chair and larrin is tracking the wraith she is using a ancient scanner

Not really a "big" plothole, but...

I think Myles is right. And even if he's not, for all we know Larrin has the gene...

Redhooks
December 20th, 2007, 05:08 PM
In ep 1x20 the seige pt2 col. shepard told that other col. that to use the ancient scanner you had to have the ATA gene but in travelers when shepard is in the control chair and larrin is tracking the wraith she is using a ancient scanner


I believe you must have to Ancient gene to activate certain devices like the scanner. Once it's activated it can be used by anyone unless it requires thought control like a control chair or puddle jumper.


Not really a "big" plothole, but...

I think Myles is right. And even if he's not, for all we know Larrin has the gene...

This topic already has its own thread here: http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=48339
As far as Larrin having the ATA Gene, if she did why would Sheppard be needed? It is an oversight by the writer(s) and, in my opinion, it was done because they couldn't come up with a different way to make the scene work without mentioning this LSD was different. Why they didn't just tell us it was different than the ones we are used to, I don't know? Then we could move on and it wouldn't be brought up again. It is telling to me that on Joe Mallozzi's blog, this question was asked numerous times after Travelers aired and not once did JM answer or acknowledge the question, because he knew no one had a good answer. Better to ignore an error than admit it seems to be the way these writers operate a lot of the time, at least to me.

TheReturnOfTheLantian
December 21st, 2007, 02:15 AM
Can anyone remember The Tower? that chamblem guy was using the same scanner and he didnt have the ATA Gene untill carson gave him it. unless he already had but i recon he didnt. i recon if there activated anyone can use them.

Fenrir Foxz
December 21st, 2007, 05:50 AM
Can anyone remember The Tower? that chamblem guy was using the same scanner and he didnt have the ATA Gene untill carson gave him it. unless he already had but i recon he didnt. i recon if there activated anyone can use them.

I always excused that to myself that the protector or a family member with the gene must have activated it... alot or ancient tech once activated can be used by anyone (some tech only limited use) I wouldn't think the L.S.D. is any different...

TheReturnOfTheLantian
December 21st, 2007, 06:57 AM
I always excused that to myself that the protector or a family member with the gene must have activated it... alot or ancient tech once activated can be used by anyone (some tech only limited use) I wouldn't think the L.S.D. is any different...

yes i agree. With the Controll Chair you need the ATA gene to activate it because of the brain funcation same with the Sheild which mckay used in season 1 episode 3 and the Puddle jumpers . its like the controll's in the tower you have to activate it but anyone can use them as has been proven.

Redhooks
December 21st, 2007, 07:37 AM
Can anyone remember The Tower? that chamblem guy was using the same scanner and he didnt have the ATA Gene untill carson gave him it. unless he already had but i recon he didnt. i recon if there activated anyone can use them.


I always excused that to myself that the protector or a family member with the gene must have activated it... alot or ancient tech once activated can be used by anyone (some tech only limited use) I wouldn't think the L.S.D. is any different...


yes i agree. With the Controll Chair you need the ATA gene to activate it because of the brain funcation same with the Sheild which mckay used in season 1 episode 3 and the Puddle jumpers . its like the controll's in the tower you have to activate it but anyone can use them as has been proven.
AGAIN, this has been discussed already in this thread: http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=48339
The scanner Otho had in The Tower WAS NOT a LSD, but one that determined if a person had the ATA gene and how strong it was. The LSD can ONLY be used by someone with the ATA gene as told by Sheppard to Col. Everett in The Siege, Pt. 2!

Mitchell82
December 22nd, 2007, 06:41 PM
I believe you must have to Ancient gene to activate certain devices like the scanner. Once it's activated it can be used by anyone unless it requires thought control like a control chair or puddle jumper.

Exactly.

Redhooks
December 22nd, 2007, 07:14 PM
I believe you must have to Ancient gene to activate certain devices like the scanner. Once it's activated it can be used by anyone unless it requires thought control like a control chair or puddle jumper.


Exactly.
Except it has been stated within the show in The Siege, Pt. 2 that the LSD REQUIRES the ATA gene to operate. If you find another reference within the show that says that the ATA gene is not required, please point it out to me. It doesn't matter if you believe or I believe the LSD only needs to be activated, within the show itself it has been said that the ATA gene is needed to operate it. This is an oversight by the writers/producers/PTB whomever that has not been explained.

Orion25
December 25th, 2008, 06:08 AM
Maybe that particular unit, has a 'memory in' function similar to what we find our calculator. The LSD stores the last initialization by a ATA gene carrier, so if a non-carrier uses it, it'll still work for them. Then, unless certain key buttons are tabbed on unit's little touch screen to disable the the 'memory in' function, the unit will continue to be used by non-carriers. Oh, how I wish they tell us something straight.