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FallenAngelII
November 1st, 2007, 03:43 AM
Let's see what they knew about what John's current situation:
* Attacked and kidnapped by unknown enemies with a ship strong enough to take down a Jumper.
* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?
* Enemies possessed Hyperdrive technology.
* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.
* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are
* Distress signal could be a trap

Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?

P-90_177
November 1st, 2007, 03:46 AM
well she knew that sheppard had sent an SOS. So he obviously needed help and she probably also realised that sheppard would not asked to be rescued if there was too much danger. He wouldn't just put his people in harms way like that so she probably ok'd it based on that.

TheReturnOfTheLantian
November 1st, 2007, 04:00 AM
Let's see what they knew about what John's current situation:
* Attacked and kidnapped by unknown enemies with a ship strong enough to take down a Jumper.
* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?
* Enemies possessed Hyperdrive technology.
* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.
* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are
* Distress signal could be a trap

Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?

yet again your moaning about this episode. Wier is taken over by the repicator's and they cannot be trusted sheppard is human and trustable they didnt know that possess a Ancient Warship Aurora-class
i think sam did one right thing for once. but still cant w8 till she leave's but thats my point of view

Cautious Explorer
November 1st, 2007, 09:03 AM
We don't even have any evidence that she made the decision. I suppose she did, but it could have been all McKay in Carter's absence. Other than preview clips from next week's episode, we don't even know if Carter's dead or alive in this one. Not that I'm complaining. :)

Xaeden
November 1st, 2007, 09:16 AM
Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?

Atlantis knows that Sheppard wouldn't have sent the SOS if he thought they couldn't handle the situation. Where as she would not okay a mission to go after Weir because they didn't even have a plan as to how to fight his way through an entire replicator city. On the other hand they had a perfectly valid plan to get him back in this episode - Send 5 coaked jumpers over there and see what the situation is. This time they had the element of surprise so even if there was a large element of danger (which is what it turned into thanks to the Traveler's ships finding the Ancient warship which was impossible to predict) so they wouldn't have their weapons knocked out before they had time to do something which is what happened to Sheppard.


* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?

The Stargate was active and Atlantis' sensors picked up the radiation burst that the hyperspace window made.


* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.

Atlantis didn't know they had an Ancient warship. Rodney only discovered that after they were several hours away from the planet. At which point he also discovered that it didn't have shields so he could disable it and buy them some time.


* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are

They didn't know that at all. They could've had one bomber sized ship for all they knew, but worst case scenario their drones are usually extremely effective. And again, they were cloaked and knew that Sheppard wouldn't have called them in if he didn't think they could handle it.


* Distress signal could be a trap

It is extremely unlikely that the enemy would get Sheppard to explain morse code to them so they could lure Atlantis in and again cloaks are effective even against Ancient sensors so they had the element of surprise and could determine what the situation was in safety.

VSS
November 1st, 2007, 09:24 AM
We don't even have any evidence that she made the decision. I suppose she did, but it could have been all McKay in Carter's absence. Other than preview clips from next week's episode, we don't even know if Carter's dead or alive in this one. Not that I'm complaining. :)

Agreed. We have absolutely no idea where Carter is in this ep. Just another example of poor continuity. For all we know, she's gone to earth for blue Jell-O, or went out to have a look around and her transmitter's batteries are shot. I mean, a few seconds of a mention from McKay would have cleared it up, but no...

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 10:58 AM
There is no relation to the Elizabeth situation here. The Replicators have Elizabeth and they have no chance of finding her within the huge constructs that are the Replicator cities and no weapons that work on the Replicators anymore. If they got caught, the Replicators would do the hand-in-the-head thing and Atlantis would be compromised.

Sheppard sends an SOS so they can assume there is some chance of rescue. They know about where he is. They are pretty sure that he was not shot at by the Wraith or the replicators. They do not know about the Ancient warship. They go in cloaked to see what the situation is.

Considering everything they have done before, why wouldn’t a leader approve such a mission to ascertain the viability of rescuing a valued officer?


We have absolutely no idea where Carter is in this ep. Just another example of poor continuity. For all we know, she's gone to earth for blue Jell-O, or went out to have a look around and her transmitter's batteries are shot. I mean, a few seconds of a mention from McKay would have cleared it up, but no...
Who cares? I don’t think a leader needs to be present to okay a mission to know they have. Every episode does not need a leader presence. I certainly don’t think we need to hear “you have a go” before every mission.

VSS
November 1st, 2007, 11:33 AM
<snip>
[FONT=Verdana]Who cares? I don’t think a leader needs to be present to okay a mission to know they have. Every episode does not need a leader presence. I certainly don’t think we need to hear “you have a go” before every mission.

Perhaps in your world, but in the world of SGA, this would have been okayed by the person in charge. This is not an ordinary mission- this is the leader of their main off-world team in trouble. The commanding officer needs to be informed of it immediately. She might disagree with the plan, or not. But to think a rescue mission wouldn't need a high-level go-ahead is not very realistic.

And not that SGA bears any resemblance to SG-1, but how many times did Hammond nix a rescue mission O'Neill wanted to do? More than once. Things are not always as obvious as they seem. That's what CO's are for.

blue-skyz
November 1st, 2007, 11:58 AM
Perhaps in your world, but in the world of, this would have been okayed by the person in charge. This is not an ordinary mission- this is the leader of their main off-world team in trouble. The commanding officer needs to be informed of it immediately. She might disagree with the plan, or not. But to think a rescue mission wouldn't need a high-level go-ahead is not very realistic.
Read it again. I didn’t say a leader doesn’t need to okay a mission, I said we don’t need to hear it.

VSS
November 1st, 2007, 01:02 PM
Yup, you're right. I misread. :o
However, I still think it inserts a lack of continuity. We don't need to hear it, but it's better to hear it, because it just seems odd that there wouldn't be some kind of discussion. To me, it makes it look like Rodney came up with this on his own.

garhkal
November 1st, 2007, 02:24 PM
And what wouyld be wrong with that>?

VSS
November 1st, 2007, 05:23 PM
And what wouyld be wrong with that>?

Sarcasm? I can't tell.

KiLL3r
November 1st, 2007, 06:30 PM
Let's see what they knew about what John's current situation:
* Attacked and kidnapped by unknown enemies with a ship strong enough to take down a Jumper.

take down or shutdown a jumper? They scanned the planet so obviously they knew it wasnt destroyed and they also got the message proving he'd been captured



* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?

Yeah so their two worst enemys werent involved. Might have been the genii for all they knew and they have stealthed puddle jumpers so theya re undetectable. Also if you had watched the episode properly McKay said the hyper drive signature wasnt Wraith or asuran



* Enemies possessed Hyperdrive technology.

and this would affect their decision how?



* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.


They only found this out AFTER they got there



* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are


Once again they only foudn this out once they got there



* Distress signal could be a trap

Yep because aliens from another galaxy all know morse code :S



Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?


Even if they couldnt retrieve john they would at least have new intel on the new advanced race in the galaxy

Uber
November 1st, 2007, 08:19 PM
Let's see what they knew about what John's current situation:
* Attacked and kidnapped by unknown enemies with a ship strong enough to take down a Jumper.
* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?
* Enemies possessed Hyperdrive technology.
* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.
* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are
* Distress signal could be a trap

Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?Apples vs. oranges.

The situations aren't even close to being comparable and several of your "facts" are completely off-kilter.

So is Sam hypocritical for giving a rescue mission that had a plan that actually stood a chance of succeeding a go while rejecting a completely different mission which would have effectively been a suicide mission?

I'm going to have to say "no."

morjana
November 1st, 2007, 08:44 PM
Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?

Carter wasn't even IN the episode.

It's your supposition that Carter ok'd the rescue mission.

The writers are under no obligation to explain everything to the viewer.

Carter could have been on Earth, attending an IOA briefing, or a briefing with the President, or attending Cassie's University graduation, or any number of things.

Whoever made the decision, the circumstances were totally different.

They knew where Elizabeth was, and who she was being held captive by. The Asurans are a known threat.

In Shep's case, he was missing. The right call was to send a rescue mission.

Morjana

VSS
November 2nd, 2007, 04:50 AM
Carter wasn't even IN the episode.

It's your supposition that Carter ok'd the rescue mission.

The writers are under no obligation to explain everything to the viewer.

Carter could have been on Earth, attending an IOA briefing, or a briefing with the President, or attending Cassie's University graduation, or any number of things.

Whoever made the decision, the circumstances were totally different.

They knew where Elizabeth was, and who she was being held captive by. The Asurans are a known threat.

In Shep's case, he was missing. The right call was to send a rescue mission.

Morjana

Right. No one knows where Carter was. In fact, what's the chain of command there, if she's gone and Shep's out of commision? Is it McKay? He'd think so, but is that, in fact, the case?

Mattathias2.0
November 2nd, 2007, 05:05 AM
Of course Cater OK'd the mission. Just because we didn't see her ok the mission, doesn't mean she didn't. Frankly, I wouldn't care to see her OK the mission out of 'continuity' sake because it's a pointless way to use the character.

We know she OK'd the mission, and we have access to the reasons why she approved it.

And yes, it was right for Carter to approve the mission based on the information we did have, and the circumstances surrounding the situation we are discussing.

prion
November 2nd, 2007, 05:42 AM
Where Sam was, who knows? The writers obviously didn't feel the need to explain it (as they've done far too often before) but I didnt' even notice her missing until I rewatched it and went, oh, Carter.... one line of dialogue goes a long way...

She's... who knows?

Apparently though McKay is perfectly capable of being in command, although with Lorne on the mission (and lots of others), we do have to ask, once again, who's minding the store? Hmm, Chuck is overall in charge, while Zelenka runs the science. Yup, it's the Chuck and Radek hour! :D

Atlantis1
November 2nd, 2007, 05:42 AM
Of course Cater OK'd the mission. Just because we didn't see her ok the mission, doesn't mean she didn't. Frankly, I wouldn't care to see her OK the mission out of 'continuity' sake because it's a pointless way to use the character.

We know she OK'd the mission, and we have access to the reasons why she approved it.

And yes, it was right for Carter to approve the mission based on the information we did have, and the circumstances surrounding the situation we are discussing.

I agree! Plus if they only have a limited time to show the plot line so a little detail like not seeing Carter ok the mission doesn't need to be shown in every episode.

prion
November 2nd, 2007, 05:45 AM
Right. No one knows where Carter was. In fact, what's the chain of command there, if she's gone and Shep's out of commision? Is it McKay? He'd think so, but is that, in fact, the case?

believe so. In that ep where Weir and Shep were taken over by aliens, had Caldwell not called it as a military situation, McKay was the next ranking 'officer'/whatever, so ... yeah, he's it.

prion
November 2nd, 2007, 05:49 AM
I agree! Plus if they only have a limited time to show the plot line so a little detail like not seeing Carter ok the mission doesn't need to be shown in every episode.

nononononooooo. i want to see her rubber stamp every single mission, have mckay file a report on how much it will cost and see if zelenka comes in with a lower bid :p

vaberella
November 2nd, 2007, 05:56 AM
{snip}

Let's see what they knew about what John's current situation:
* Attacked and kidnapped by unknown enemies with a ship strong enough to take down a Jumper.
* Not the Wraith or Asurans (at least not the ship that attacked the jumper) and how the Hell did they get the readings for what attacked John if the Travelers brought the Jumper with them, anyway?
* Enemies possessed Hyperdrive technology.
* Enemies possess an Ancient warship, Aurora-class, as such, they're obviously. not Ancients stuck in time like in "The Return" since they shot at John's Jumper.
* Enemies have unknown fleet of ships and are
* Distress signal could be a trap

Yet, Sam OK:ed the rescue mission. Was it a right call and was it hypocritical in comparison to when she didn't want to go after Elizabeth?


I don't think code could be a trap and I think that was the clincher for the entire mission ---and I strongly believe Sam okay'd it, there was no way she wouldn't be aware of the situation first off espcially since John is her second in Command. Morse code I can see being probably deciphered but we have no idea if John was trained or studied a bit of "Code Talking"---that would be a specific specialty and if he used that in his coding well then that makes it totally John and I would okay a mission based on that knowledge.

As for DW---Those who took DW are an established enemy. Further more, you're fully aware that DW can not be trusted at all until Rodney can figure out a way to shut down her nanites---and that won't happen until he's able to understand how strong the nanites are...at the moment DW is an ASURAN. She is no longer human, so essentially the DW we all know is dead and we have an ASURAN in her place---keep in mind she will probably be reprogrammed rather than destroyed by Oberoth. She is a threat and dangerous on all levels.

While alternatively speaking of John's situation the enemy is still unknown and John was still able to send out coded messages to us which are understanable by us humans. I don't think this has been fully established by those in the Peggy---the only other people who might have this or something similar is probably the Genii. Lastly, plus Navajo and Morse are completely different and not many people are trained in Navajo; Morse also rare now a days (although I find to be functional). I would think the Genii would have a variation based on their langauge base which has different worse for plants and fruits and such so the coding would be structurally different and so...again as leader I'd totally believe this is Shep and go for him if we had a functional plan.

Mattathias2.0
November 2nd, 2007, 11:48 AM
nononononooooo. i want to see her rubber stamp every single mission, have mckay file a report on how much it will cost and see if zelenka comes in with a lower bid :p

Ummm... considering all they did was take a fleet of puddle jumpers out to where the ship was, I'd love to know what could be any lower bid than that?

Send McKay in one of those stasis chambers from The Long Goodbye out into the solar system? LOL

Mitchell82
November 2nd, 2007, 05:52 PM
Of course Cater OK'd the mission. Just because we didn't see her ok the mission, doesn't mean she didn't. Frankly, I wouldn't care to see her OK the mission out of 'continuity' sake because it's a pointless way to use the character.

We know she OK'd the mission, and we have access to the reasons why she approved it.

And yes, it was right for Carter to approve the mission based on the information we did have, and the circumstances surrounding the situation we are discussing.

Agreed, I would have made the same call.

FallenAngelII
November 6th, 2007, 03:44 PM
We don't even have any evidence that she made the decision. I suppose she did, but it could have been all McKay in Carter's absence. Other than preview clips from next week's episode, we don't even know if Carter's dead or alive in this one. Not that I'm complaining. :)
Rodney does not have the authority to mount a rescue mission. Sam must've given the OK.

{snip}

FallenAngelII
November 6th, 2007, 03:54 PM
Sam must've been on Atlantis because if Sam was off-world for blue jell-o or whatever, there was no way they'd let John off Atlantis to go to some sex-crazed planet for secondary contact (as in: a very unimportant mission). And then once John got captured, they woudn't let Rodney and Lorne run off to rescue him. It's like the whole "Reunion" nightmare all over again. Had they all been snuffed, Radek would suddenly have been burdened with the command.

You just don't let the entire chain in command run off to do dangerous stuff.


take down or shutdown a jumper? They scanned the planet so obviously they knew it wasnt destroyed and they also got the message proving he'd been captured
This has what to do with what?


Yeah so their two worst enemys werent involved. Might have been the genii for all they knew and they have stealthed puddle jumpers so theya re undetectable. Also if you had watched the episode properly McKay said the hyper drive signature wasnt Wraith or asuran
The Genii don't even have spacetravelling capabilities, nevertheless hyperdrive technology. All they knew was that it wasn't the Wraith or the Asurans. So the logical conclusion would be: Brand new enemy.


Yep because aliens from another galaxy all know morse code :S
Hey, they speak English, use terms like "days, weeks, years" and use the Imperial System. But there's also torture, mind probing, hypnotism, whatever. They couldn't be sure that John had really sent that and that he hadn't been coersed into sending it.


Even if they couldnt retrieve john they would at least have new intel on the new advanced race in the galaxy
Yes, because sending off 5 puddle jumpers (of which you have a scarce number left) into unknown territory for recon against an unknown new enemy possibly as advanced as you or even moreso is so smart.


In Shep's case, he was missing. The right call was to send a rescue mission.
No it's not. The right call is to get some intel before rushing off into the unknown.

Remember all those times SG-1 wasn't allowed to go on rescue missions because they were either too dangerous or lacked intel?

Mattathias2.0
November 6th, 2007, 04:05 PM
OK, so if we start leaving our folks behind.

Reunion: Rodney and Ronon would be captured by the Wraith (or Asurans).
Travelers: Sheppard would be done and stuck with the Travelers.

I suppose by next weeks episode, Keller and Teyla would be done for somehow.

That's 5 members of the Senior Staff right there.

FallenAngelII
November 7th, 2007, 02:14 AM
OK, so if we start leaving our folks behind.

Reunion: Rodney and Ronon would be captured by the Wraith (or Asurans).
Travelers: Sheppard would be done and stuck with the Travelers.

I suppose by next weeks episode, Keller and Teyla would be done for somehow.

That's 5 members of the Senior Staff right there.
We don't leave people behind. But we don't run off half-cocked against an unknown powerful enemy.

Mattathias2.0
November 7th, 2007, 07:12 AM
Actually, we do.

We did so in Children Of The Gods, Moebius, Rising, among others.

FallenAngelII
November 7th, 2007, 07:49 AM
Actually, we do.

We did so in Children Of The Gods, Moebius, Rising, among others.
CotG: Foremost recognissanse. The president OK:ed a foremost recognaissance mission. And when they did go for the rescue mission, they screwed up and the Goa'uld immediately knew the Tau'ri were a threat. Major screw-up.
Moebius: That was an alternate "us" consisting of a bitter old man, a geeky woman and a yet geekier man. Besides, according to the tape, it would be pretty easy. But, yet again, untrained alt!SG-1.
Rising: John sweet-talked Elizabeth into going along with a rescue mission without any information. And we all know how well that ended. So it's hardly a good example. In fact, it's a good example of why the expedition shouldn't be mounting rescue missions half-cocked anymore since the past, it's give nthem so much grief.

So you see, going off half-cocked has gotten them in serious trouble before. They should know better by now.

Mattathias2.0
November 7th, 2007, 08:09 AM
CotG: Foremost recognissanse. The president OK:ed a foremost recognaissance mission. And when they did go for the rescue mission, they screwed up and the Goa'uld immediately knew the Tau'ri were a threat. Major screw-up.
Moebius: That was an alternate "us" consisting of a bitter old man, a geeky woman and a yet geekier man. Besides, according to the tape, it would be pretty easy. But, yet again, untrained alt!SG-1.
Rising: John sweet-talked Elizabeth into going along with a rescue mission without any information. And we all know how well that ended. So it's hardly a good example. In fact, it's a good example of why the expedition shouldn't be mounting rescue missions half-cocked anymore since the past, it's give nthem so much grief.

So you see, going off half-cocked has gotten them in serious trouble before. They should know better by now.

I never said it didn't get us into trouble. In fact, I'd say we met all of our main off-world villains in this manner.

Considering the circumstances surrounding Travelers, it was far less a threat compared to those in Children Of The Gods and Rising.

FallenAngelII
November 7th, 2007, 08:11 AM
I never said it didn't get us into trouble. In fact, I'd say we met all of our main off-world villains in this manner.

Considering the circumstances surrounding Travelers, it was far less a threat compared to those in Children Of The Gods and Rising.
Not really. All they knew when they mounted the rescue mission was:
* Not Wraith or Asuran
* Spaceships capable of taking down a puddle jumper
* Spaceships with hyperdrive technology

So they knew it was a race advanced enough to have all that, yet they had never encountered them before. It was huge unknown. For all they knew, they could've turned out to be a new great enemy.

Mattathias2.0
November 7th, 2007, 08:28 AM
Not really. All they knew when they mounted the rescue mission was:
* Not Wraith or Asuran
* Spaceships capable of taking down a puddle jumper
* Spaceships with hyperdrive technology

So they knew it was a race advanced enough to have all that, yet they had never encountered them before. It was huge unknown. For all they knew, they could've turned out to be a new great enemy.

*Correct
*We knew there was one hyperspace window, so 'spaceships' we weren't even sure of, and I would imagine it doesn't take a lot to take down a puddle jumper

Prior to mounting the rescue mission, we did know there was one Lantian ship involved. We also knew he had accessed there communications array to send it, and it was probably damaged (meaning a damaged Lantian ship).

I do recount you stating earlier that maybe whoever captured and manipulated him into sending the message by a technological device or something. Due to the Wraith, it has given little room for any races to advance technologically that far. The only races we know who were capable of possibly doing what you stated are the Wraith, Asurans, and the Misty Aliens from Home. All of those races don't require any exra technological means to accomplish that.

FallenAngelII
November 7th, 2007, 09:58 AM
*We knew there was one hyperspace window, so 'spaceships' we weren't even sure of, and I would imagine it doesn't take a lot to take down a puddle jumper
Of course it was a spaceship. What else would open up a hyperspace window? And John's PJ wasn't the modified one with the hyperspace generator, as far as we know.


Prior to mounting the rescue mission, we did know there was one Lantian ship involved. We also knew he had accessed there communications array to send it, and it was probably damaged (meaning a damaged Lantian ship).
Yes, but we knew that the ship that opened the hyperspace window wasn't Lantean, meaning our enemies were in posession of other ships as well.


I do recount you stating earlier that maybe whoever captured and manipulated him into sending the message by a technological device or something. Due to the Wraith, it has given little room for any races to advance technologically that far. The only races we know who were capable of possibly doing what you stated are the Wraith, Asurans, and the Misty Aliens from Home. All of those races don't require any exra technological means to accomplish that.
And here we're back with the unknown part. We know they have spaceships capable of hyperspace travel... and nothing else.

PG15
November 7th, 2007, 01:54 PM
How do you suggest we gather said intel?

FallenAngelII
November 8th, 2007, 06:34 AM
How do you suggest we gather said intel?
At least try gathering said intel? Instead of rushing off headfirst after, what, few hours, a day, tops without knowing a single thing (almost) about these new potential überenemies of ours... because it went so well the last couple of times!

The point is that you can't just rush off on rescue missions without at least a smidgeon of knowledge about what you'll be facing. For all they knew, these could be some other failed Ancient experiment a la the Asurans just waiting to be awoken a la the Wraith and then they'd be facing three extremely dangerous enemies.

Xaeden
November 8th, 2007, 09:42 AM
Hey, they speak English, use terms like "days, weeks, years" and use the Imperial System. But there's also torture, mind probing, hypnotism, whatever. They couldn't be sure that John had really sent that and that he hadn't been coersed into sending it.

Technically they don't speak English within the plot. The writers just have the characters ignore the language issue and dive right into things. So you really can't use that as an example - Mckay knew that morse code could only come from Sheppard so that's all we need to know.


Yes, because sending off 5 puddle jumpers (of which you have a scarce number left) into unknown territory for recon against an unknown new enemy possibly as advanced as you or even moreso is so smart.

No it's not. The right call is to get some intel before rushing off into the unknown.

They did have intel and they were in the process of collecting more. When they went the system Sheppard was broadcasting from Mckay expanded the sensors and detected something that appeared to be a ship. Which means that they knew they were not up against multiple ships at that point. Of course you think that they should've been more careful incase it was a trap, but they were very careful - They approached the target while cloaked and we all know that Ancient cloaks are so good that neither the Wraith nor the Asurans can detect a cloaked jumper. Hell, a Goa'uld cloak was good enough to hide a cargo ship from an Ori ship (they were worried that expanding the cloak as Teal'c was doing could give him away, but otherwise they were fine with him being there). That was the perfect way of gathering intel in a situation like that so I don't see your problem. Once they had full intel they decided it was worth the risk to attack, but since they didn't get around to it we don't know if they intended to split their jumpers up so the one firing is the only one who gives away their position or what.

PG15
November 8th, 2007, 06:26 PM
At least try gathering said intel? Instead of rushing off headfirst after, what, few hours, a day, tops without knowing a single thing (almost) about these new potential überenemies of ours... because it went so well the last couple of times!

Sometimes there is just no intel to get. Even McKay said so, that outside of scanning near the planet, there is no way to know where Shep was and thus no extra intel to be gathered until they got the SOS, which in this case would be a lead.

And following leads are good, especially when you have nothing else to grab onto.