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4x05 - The Most Immature Episode Ever ~the Episode that Ruined Atlantis~

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    4x05 - The Most Immature Episode Ever ~the Episode that Ruined Atlantis~

    Apparently Paul Mullie wrote this episode. No offense to Paul Mullie, but that explains a few things (he was also responsible for Suckfests "The Tower" and "Irresponsible".

    I just knew I was in for a piece of (crappy) work when the episode starts with Rodney taking a shot at John volunteering to go on a boring mission because the indigenous people (and I quote) "had little to no social inhibitions" to which John responds that they were "very friendly". Oh yes, PTB, very mature.

    And then, he gets taken captive and who should pop up as the leader of said captors? While all of the male captors are clad in brown possible mocha leather, she lone female (who, in according to Stargate practice is "hot") is clad in black leather... with deep cleavage. Yes, let's not just make the alien hot, but because she's got big breasts, she must have a deep cleavage.

    What's next, I thought? The obvious answer (and what I immediately assumed upon seeing her) was lots of 'UST' and sexual innuendo. It starts out pretty innocently with "Be a shame to have to do too much damage" - Not bad, but you just knew it'd go downhill from there (like the line about "not shooting too fast" and how "that was probably not John's first time hearing that from a woman"). And the sexual innuendo aren't even said in a "humurous" way a la Vala where there's a twinkle in her eye and her flirting doesn't actually lead anywhere.

    Highly Speculative (and possibly wrong: Then Joe Flanigan himself gave us a very shameful moment. What was said moment? I believe it was The Jamie Kennedy Experiment that once featured an experiment where a woman wore a baggy shirt and went out with a fake petition, trying to get random men on the street to stop and talk to her. Almost no one did. But once she switched into one with a big cleavage, they did. And they kept staring down at it, exposing themselves to the hidden camera in her broach or whatever. Note that this is speculation, however. Maybe he did find said chalice very interesting. Or maybe the writers called for the character of John Sheppard to ogle her boobs.

    So what did Joe Flanigan do? At 06:43, his gaze inexplicably drifts from her eye-level down to her chest-level and then quickly back up again. Either he suddenly found the chalice she was holding extremely interesting in the middle of her speech or he just wanted to "sneak a peek". However, as the Jamie Kennedy Experiment proved, it's a very heterosexual male thing to do, what with breast being indoctrined as one of the most important parts of a woman's body and all, so we can't completely blame him.

    This was followed by Laryn saying "There's all kinds of useful things you could do for me" followed by "goofy music". And since we know the bar's set pretty low, of course it's a double entendre.

    And then I won't bore you, or myself, with the details because I'm currently too mad at the writers to view the entire episode again, but was anyone surprised they'd eventually be locked up in "close quarters" together. It's one of the ultimate clichés, The UST in the Closet-moment.

    And then she was fed on. Of course, we all assumed she'd die and we'd finally get rid of the immature theme, but nooooooo. The moment the Wraith said he hadn't completely killed her (at first I was so glad, I was elated), we all knew the Gift of Life was coming (and what a sucky episode to reintroduce something so great in, much like how Kolya appeared briefly in Irresponsible only to die at the end of it). Then he bent down to "help her get up" and what the Hell was the man doing?! Who the Hell helps someone get up from the floor by putting one arm around their waist?! You do it by taking her hand(s) and pulling them up! That was soooo copping a feel.

    This was, of course followed by a "his face close to hers" moment (complete with heavy breathing), followed by her stumbling and even more close-face-time (as cliché dictates). And then they kissed. We all knew it was gonna happen. By the way, see my companion thread, "Why Colonel Space Slut Should Not Be In Command", for my reaction on this.

    I really thought the writers, producers and everyone involved in this show would have learned by now.

    For those who don't know, which three episodes do you think got voted in as Worst Episodes in Stargate Atlantis History for seasons 1-2? Yes, that's right, Sanctuary (John x Chaya), The Tower (John x Space Slut Bimbo Princess Whose Name I Can Never Remember) and Epiphany (John x Delusional Teer). And which two episodes were the by far most hated episodes of season three (if not Stargate history)? That's right, Irresistible (by far more hated) followed by Irresponsible.

    "Goofy" and "Funny" little episodes based on double entendres, sexual tension and general immatureness are not popular among Stargate fans. Maybe they assumed the fans here on Gateworld are just part of some snooty little "No Immature Boy Humour"-club, but really?

    Of course, John didn't tell Rodney the entire story (good job at lying, man!), but Rodney knew right away and had to point it out. At least we didn't hear the word "Kirk".

    Please tell me I'm not going insane. Please tell me that you straight guys didn't find the episode really, really entertaining and well written. As a gay man who has absolutely no sexual interest in the episode, I found it insulting. Not just to women (by how they're treated as sexual objects on Stargate) and to John (by how detrimental this episode was to his character) but to us viewers as well, that they'd resort to this adolescent boy-girl-sex-humour!

    This episode will be one of the Big Six (Major Suckfests of Stargate Atlantis), Atlantis-episodes which I probably won't watch more than once.

    Omigod, omigod you guys. I'm, like, gonna cry. I've got tears coming out of my nose. This is like Titanic, only no one dies.
    Last edited by FallenAngelII; 29 October 2007, 06:50 AM.




    #2
    What, no "riots"?

    Oh, and Joe Mallozzi wrote Irresponsible. Just correcting a little fact there.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by PG15 View Post
      What, no "riots"?

      Oh, and Joe Mallozzi wrote Irresponsible. Just correcting a little fact there.
      I just assumed Imdb got it right.



      Comment


        #4
        That's a false assumption.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by PG15 View Post
          That's a false assumption.
          How come Gateworld (and also Imdb) states that they both wrote it together?



          Comment


            #6
            Because they rely on the credits and not what the writers actually say themselves.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by PG15 View Post
              Because they rely on the credits and not what the writers actually say themselves.
              You're missing the obvious point here. Why, if both Gateworld and Imdb, state that Paul Mullie and Joe Malozzi wrote the episode together, do you contest this?



              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by FallenAngelII View Post
                Apparently Paul Mullie wrote this episode. No offense to Paul Mullie, but that explains a few things (he was also responsible for Suckfests "The Tower" and "Irresponsible".

                I just knew I was in for a piece of (crappy) work when the episode starts with Rodney taking a shot at John volunteering to go on a boring mission because the indigenous people (and I quote) "had little to no social inhibitions" to which John responds that they were "very friendly". Oh yes, PTB, very mature.

                And then, he gets taken captive and who should pop up as the leader of said captors? While all of the male captors are clad in brown possible mocha leather, she lone female (who, in according to Stargate practice is "hot") is clad in black leather... with deep cleavage. Yes, let's not just make the alien hot, but because she's got big breasts, she must have a deep cleavage.

                What's next, I thought? The obvious answer (and what I immediately assumed upon seeing her) was lots of 'UST' and sexual innuendo. It starts out pretty innocently with "Be a shame to have to do too much damage" - Not bad, but you just knew it'd go downhill from there.

                Then Joe Flanigan himself gave us a very shameful moment. What was said moment? I believe it was The Jamie Kennedy Experiment that once featured an experiment where a woman wore a baggy shirt and went out with a fake petition, trying to get random men on the street to stop and talk to her. Almost no one did. But once she switched into one with a big cleavage, they did. And they kept staring down at it, exposing themselves to the hidden camera in her broach or whatever.

                So what did Joe Flanigan do? At 06:43, his gaze inexplicably drifts from her eye-level down to her chest-level and then quickly back up again. Either he suddenly found the chalice she was holding extremely interesting in the middle of her speech or he just wanted to "sneak a peek". However, as the Jamie Kennedy Experiment proved, it's a very heterosexual male thing to do, what with breast being indoctrined as one of the most important parts of a woman's body and all, so we can't completely blame him.

                This was followed by Laryn saying "There's all kinds of useful things you could do for me" followed by "goofy music". And since we know the bar's set pretty low, of course it's a double entendre.

                And then I won't bore you, or myself, with the details because I'm currently too mad at the writers to view the entire episode again, but was anyone surprised they'd eventually be locked up in "close quarters" together. It's one of the ultimate clichés, The UST in the Closet-moment.

                And then she was fed on. Of course, we all assumed she'd die and we'd finally get rid of the immature theme, but nooooooo. The moment the Wraith said he hadn't completely killed her (at first I was so glad, I was elated), we all knew the Gift of Life was coming (and what a sucky episode to reintroduce something so great in, much like how Kolya appeared briefly in Irresponsible only to die at the end of it). Then he bent down to "help her get up" and what the Hell was the man doing?! Who the Hell helps someone get up from the floor by putting one arm around their waist?! You do it by taking her hand(s) and pulling them up! That was soooo copping a feel.

                This was, of course followed by a "his face close to hers" moment (complete with heavy breathing), followed by her stumbling and even more close-face-time (as cliché dictates). And then they kissed. We all knew it was gonna happen. By the way, see my companion thread, "Why Colonel Space Slut Should Not Be In Command", for my reaction on this.

                I really thought the writers, producers and everyone involved in this show would have learned by now.

                For those who don't know, which three episodes do you think got voted in as Worst Episodes in Stargate Atlantis History for seasons 1-2? Yes, that's right, Sanctuary (John x Chaya), The Tower (John x Space Slut Bimbo Princess Whose Name I Can Never Remember) and Epiphany (John x Delusional Teer). And which two episodes were the by far most hated episodes of season three (if not Stargate history)? That's right, Irresistible (by far more hated) followed by Irresponsible.

                "Goofy" and "Funny" little episodes based on double entendres, sexual tension and general immatureness are not popular among Stargate fans. Maybe they assumed the fans here on Gateworld are just part of some snooty little "No Immature Boy Humour"-club, but really?

                Of course, John didn't tell Rodney the entire story (good job at lying, man!), but Rodney knew right away and had to point it out. At least we didn't hear the word "Kirk".

                Please tell me I'm not going insane. Please tell me that you straight guys didn't find the episode really, really entertaining and well written. As a gay man who has absolutely no sexual interest in the episode, I found it insulting. Not just to women (by how they're treated as sexual objects on Stargate) and to John (by how detrimental this episode was to his character) but to us viewers as well, that they'd resort to this adolescent boy-girl-sex-humour!

                This episode will be one of the Big Six (Major Suckfests of Stargate Atlantis), Atlantis-episodes which I probably won't watch more than once.

                [i]Omigod, omigod you guys[i]. I'm, like, gonna cry. I've got tears coming out of my nose. This is like Titanic, only no one dies.
                Yeah, I totally disagree with everything you say. Nothing new there.

                I liked Travelers and thought it was a fun episode.

                Also, leave Joe Flanigan out of it. You think he looked at Larrin's cleavage? Fine. You don't KNOW he did you think he did. Let's leave the actors out of it, please.

                As for Larrin's outfit? It wasn't low cut and didn't show ANYTHING. Not that there's anything wrong if it did.

                As for the Kirk thing? Oh for goodness sake, give it a rest. Yawn...

                You know Fallen, heterosexual men do find attractive women appealing. That's a fact of life. There's nothing wrong with that, it's not shameful or sinful, it's human nature. It's nothing to scoff at, it is the natural order of things. A lot of people like seeing chemistry between male and female characters. That's a fact. You're not one of them, fine. But others are.
                sigpic

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by FallenAngelII View Post
                  You're missing the obvious point here. Why, if both Gateworld and Imdb, state that Paul Mullie and Joe Malozzi wrote the episode together, do you contest this?
                  I contest, because Joe Mallozzi himself said that he wrote Irresponsible.

                  Now, if it was a toss up between trusting a fansite, IMDB (LOL!), or the showrunner of the show...it's kind of easy to pick which one I'll trust.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by PG15 View Post
                    I contest, because Joe Mallozzi himself said that he wrote Irresponsible.

                    Now, if it was a toss up between trusting a fansite, IMDB (LOL!), or the showrunner of the show...it's kind of easy to pick which one I'll trust.
                    Do you have the episode? Could you go back and check the writing credits? Also, did Malozzi say "I, and only I wrote this episode"? Or is it a habit of his to always also credit co-writers, the omission of which would automatically indicate he had no such co-writer?



                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Linzi View Post
                      Also, leave Joe Flanigan out of it. You think he looked at Larrin's cleavage? Fine. You don't KNOW he did you think he did. Let's leave the actors out of it, please.
                      I thought long and hard on whether that section should have been included. I'll add a speculation-alert to it.

                      Originally posted by Linzi View Post
                      As for Larrin's outfit? It wasn't low cut and didn't show ANYTHING. Not that there's anything wrong if it did.
                      It had cleavage. And was made out of black leather...

                      Originally posted by Linzi View Post
                      As for the Kirk thing? Oh for goodness sake, give it a rest. Yawn...
                      Why? Can you give me any reasoning besides "Because"?

                      Originally posted by Linzi View Post
                      You know Fallen, heterosexual men do find attractive women appealing. That's a fact of life. There's nothing wrong with that, it's not shameful or sinful, it's human nature. It's nothing to scoff at, it is the natural order of things. A lot of people like seeing chemistry between male and female characters. That's a fact. You're not one of them, fine. But others are.
                      Would you be equally not-unnerved if the show suddenly started doing this to male characters? Hot scantily clad men appearing time and time again to romance Teyla with Teyla responding? While she's on dangerous missions and being captive prisoner or attacked by the Wraith?

                      I have no problems seeing chemistry between male and female characters. I, however, have a problem with such chemistry when it's illogical to plot or pure fanservice (and other reasons). I have never once complained about chemistry between people when, say, they go out on a date on Atlantis or when being overly-friendly with the local populace.

                      However, when John does it, it's in an illogical and Atlantis-endagering way (see my companion thread for more on this subject). In this episode in particular, he starts making out of his Would-Be-Killer (threats to jetison him into space, exposure to deadly radiation and repeated torture for, instance) when a Wraith had been in the same room just a minute earlier (it could've come back at any minute and killed them both).

                      Not only was this endangering himself and Laryn, it was endangering the entire galaxy. Imagine the damage the Wraith could do if they ever came in possession of an Aurora-class ship!



                      Comment


                        #12
                        Once again, as I mentioned, the credits aren't as accurate as you might think. It's based on money and contracts, after all, and not creative decisions.

                        Anonymous #3 writes: “Of the scripts you've written, which in your opinion was the bigger disappointment The Tower or Irresponsible?”

                        Answer: 1) Paul wrote The Tower. 2) Far from being a disappointment, I actually liked The Tower. Granted, it was an atypical episode, but I thought Paul did a great job creating some very entertaining guest characters. 3) Irresponsible.
                        So Paul wrote Tower, and he wrote Irresponsible.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          While I'm sure many Men enjoy checking out cleavage, at the same time, it's common for someone to look over who they're talking to if confronted within their personal bubble (safety procaution, usually). Many people have looked me over at work (I've noticed) and of course, I've done it myself... But when someone wears something abit too revealing that may surprise someone or stand out alittle too much, isn't staring expected? (How does the cliche go? Car crash? Can't look away?)

                          Her outfit, however, wasn't low cut and was rather modest by Sci Fi's standards.

                          As for your comment regarding the female antagonist being hot or not, that's entirely based on opinion. Personally, I believe she was.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Not only was this endangering himself and Laryn, it was endangering the entire galaxy. Imagine the damage the Wraith could do if they ever came in possession of an Aurora-class ship!
                            It was actually endangering two galaxies, because if the Wraith were able to backwards engineer those engines, they could be having chinese, indian or even french for dinner. Stupid of John to leave the systems running knowing Wraith were onboard and are drooling for intergalactic hyperspace. But hey, a hot alien chick was in danger. Can't expect him to think clearly on that.

                            I have to agree that chemistry between characters is good, but if you have a character who keeps going after the hot alien chick who will never return again, you sort of just keep providing fanservice, especially when they are walking around in black leather and have a big chest.

                            FAII, You also forgot to include Norina from "Inferno". Sheppard was putting on all his charm to make sure he wooed her instead of McKay, acting like two school kids trying to chat up the first girl in their class to develop.

                            sigpic

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by PG15 View Post
                              Once again, as I mentioned, the credits aren't as accurate as you might think. It's based on money and contracts, after all, and not creative decisions.
                              So you're saying Mullie had nothing to do with the writing of "Irresponsible"? However, Imdb does state that Malozzi wrote "The Tower" despite him contesting it...



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