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GateMan2000
April 26th, 2007, 10:01 AM
I read the Seer's spoiler article. Is there and episode that anyone knows of that leads the Wraith to disable the Replicators? I just found it odd and article pops up saying that Rodney reactivates them after the Wraith disable them.

marty2006
April 26th, 2007, 10:44 AM
Yea man click on the official seer speculation thread your answer will be there :)

ussrelativity
April 26th, 2007, 11:05 AM
What I'm wondering is how the Wraith were able to do it. Wouldn't they just try to attack them head-on, like with the Lanteans?

wise one
April 26th, 2007, 11:20 AM
What I'm wondering is how the Wraith were able to do it. Wouldn't they just try to attack them head-on, like with the Lanteans?

well, the wraith are fighting wach other and slowly the numbers are going down and instead of being destroyed they would rather deactivate them and have a full supply of zpm,s, ancient class ships with intergalactic hyperdrives and tonnes of advanced technology and all the wraith have to do is deactivate them!!!

would you rather do that then destoying them and losing a fair bit of wraiths and ships

headfirstforhalos00
April 26th, 2007, 11:25 AM
But the Wraith have learned a lot since the Atlantis team started fighting them. Like the fake alliance. Technology-wise, they did have Michael. He was a genius at pretty much anything scientific right? It doesn't seem far fetched that someone else amongst the Wraith could be as smart or smarter than him. Not to mention the telepathic link between them. Hell, it could have been Michael himself.

Wraith_Boy
April 26th, 2007, 01:20 PM
What I'm wondering is how the Wraith were able to do it. Wouldn't they just try to attack them head-on, like with the Lanteans?

The problem for me is that it seems so sudden & quick. As of yet, it doesn't look like the Wraith have ever encountered the Asurans. They slept for all these years because of a lack of food while Asurans flourished. Had they know about them back then, then they would have all went together & started pounding on them got the technology & went to a new feeding ground.

We didn't see or hear anything in S3 about it. So that means that it must be brought up in an early S4 episode as 'The Seer' as it's to be aired something like ep8. Really cannot see how the Wraith could suddenly encounter them then find a way to neutralise them so quickly. That for me makes it a little bit unbelieveable. Maybe if they went to war, the Asurans finally attacked them. Then in 2nd half of S4, Wraith find something that gives them the upper hand, before Asurans counter again.

So am definitely keeping my eyes focused on when we learn that the Wraith finally have enountered the Asurans. Maybe it's in the season premiere. Asurans track Atlantis, while Wraith catch something on sensors & go see what it is. Turns out to be a warships or whatever!

Hope they do it smart & not screw it up. Suddenly we find out in 'The Seer' that Wraith & Asurans have previously met, Wraith have now been able to get the advantage....Will be a huge, huge screw up in my book!

Buba uognarf
April 26th, 2007, 01:24 PM
The problem for me is that it seems so sudden & quick. As of yet, it doesn't look like the Wraith have ever encountered the Asurans. They slept for all these years because of a lack of food while Asurans flourished. Had they know about them back then, then they would have all went together & started pounding on them got the technology & went to a new feeding ground.

We didn't see or hear anything in S3 about it. So that means that it must be brought up in an early S4 episode as 'The Seer' as it's to be aired something like ep8. Really cannot see how the Wraith could suddenly encounter them then find a way to neutralise them so quickly. That for me makes it a little bit unbelieveable. Maybe if they went to war, the Asurans finally attacked them. Then in 2nd half of S4, Wraith find something that gives them the upper hand, before Asurans counter again.

So am definitely keeping my eyes focused on when we learn that the Wraith finally have enountered the Asurans. Maybe it's in the season premiere. Asurans track Atlantis, while Wraith catch something on sensors & go see what it is. Turns out to be a warships or whatever!

Hope they do it smart & not screw it up. Suddenly we find out in 'The Seer' that Wraith & Asurans have previously met, Wraith have now been able to get the advantage....Will be a huge, huge screw up in my book!

obviously it shouldn't be something sudden we should hear early in season 4 about the Wraith and the Asurans to provide background to this episode but we've seen the Wraith have some serious programming abilities i'm not surpirsed they've been able to freeze the Asurans like this.

fallenexile452
April 26th, 2007, 03:07 PM
i really want to know what there asuran plan for the wraith is, hopefully we may begin finding out, after all it's complexity and scope is beyond our understanding so it may take a while for it to be fully realised

jenks
April 26th, 2007, 03:14 PM
The problem for me is that it seems so sudden & quick. As of yet, it doesn't look like the Wraith have ever encountered the Asurans. They slept for all these years because of a lack of food while Asurans flourished. Had they know about them back then, then they would have all went together & started pounding on them got the technology & went to a new feeding ground.


What new feeding ground? They never knew one existed until they came across the Tau'ri, and even then, they didn't know where it was.

rising-solid
April 26th, 2007, 03:16 PM
wow if the Wraith menage to jamme are asgard beaming technologie and deactive the Asurans/PG Replicators i wonder what esle they capable of programing ?;)

Wraith_Boy
April 26th, 2007, 05:15 PM
What new feeding ground? They never knew one existed until they came across the Tau'ri, and even then, they didn't know where it was.

Where exactly is it stated that they were stupid enough to not know that there were other galaxies in the universe that contained life?

The Wraith Keeper in 'Rising II' said: "It is not among our stars."

Therefore they had to know that there was other stars out there besides their own.

Asurans for all intensive purposes are Lanteans, they have the same tech, knowledge etc. So if Wraith got access to their database, then I'm fairly sure other galaxies would be in there somewhere for them to find. As well as the way to modify their hyperdrives to get there.

CYBEREAGLE19
April 26th, 2007, 05:54 PM
imagine shutting down all the replicators, then we dock atlantis on asuras and bam theres are PG base of operations, build a few langarian point satellites in orbit and just blast away as the wraith come, its wishful thinking

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 27th, 2007, 05:14 AM
I would not be surprised about the Wraith managing to shut down the Asurans. I mean if McKay can alter their base code then the Wraith should have the ability to do more considering they developed a potent AI virus that took control of an Earth ship.

What the real question is whether the Wraith encounter Humans onscreen or offscreen. I mean the Asurans became a lot more active after meeting the Atlantis Expedition so its concievable that the Wraith noticed the Asurans. Especially after the whole Asuras thing that happened at the end of the last season.

Guess we will have to wait and see.

Wraith_Boy
April 27th, 2007, 06:34 AM
I think that's part of the problem with I personally have with it. The main part is that it's far too soon, maybe even they run an arc, the Wraith suddenly find a way to do it. Say 3/4 dedicated episodes to the whole warc arc beginning, that they ran from early S4, then could allow the Wraith to develop it in the 2nd half of the season & shut them down. Maybe even do 1/2 early, then dedicate the mid-season 2 parter to it.

The other part is that they'll just introduce them suddenly, perhaps making references to stuff that happened off-screen & 'The Seer' is the 1st time we hear of anything to do with it. The Asurans - Wraith going at it, is probably the most important part of the show ever. The 2 biggest powers, 1 already decimated the galaxy & wiped out the Lanteans, while the other was to be the saviours, the last big chance the Ancients had of regaining their grip on the galaxy. However it failed, then after 10,000 years they finally get off their asses & decide it's time to act on their original intentions.

The way they disposed of the Lanteans in 'TR I & II' was criminal. Returning real life Ancients going home to Atlantis after 10,000 years. Yet they were not even shown in II at all & we were just told about it. I just hope they handle this one properly. :Fingers Crossed

wise one
April 27th, 2007, 11:15 AM
well in the pegasus project when they detonated the nuke behing the gate, a wraith hive ship detected the blast and came to investigate.....

maybe at some point after first strike some wraith hives or criusers encounted them and something happened and they engaged in battle and then sometime when the seer comes on they will eloborate more on this subject

???? we just have to wait and find out

GateMan2000
April 27th, 2007, 12:24 PM
well in the pegasus project when they detonated the nuke behing the gate, a wraith hive ship detected the blast and came to investigate.....

maybe at some point after first strike some wraith hives or criusers encounted them and something happened and they engaged in battle and then sometime when the seer comes on they will eloborate more on this subject

???? we just have to wait and find out

I was thinking the same thing as you. They may have detected the nukes set off and seen that it was an Atlantian type of society and got hungry. Only to find out that these aren't food. I would imagine that they will have an episode dealing with this. If they don't, I think a lot of people will be very angry they left a major loop whole in the story arc.

rarocks24
April 27th, 2007, 02:05 PM
Right, but Atlantis left that planet? How would they know where to look?

And the Wraith showing up, is that really anything to be worried about? I mean, we do have Merlin's dimensional technology, we can just use that thing to prevent the city from being attacked. :P

chaos_master123
April 27th, 2007, 02:20 PM
personally from the spoiler, it mentions that the wraith fleet is coming to Atlantis maybe the Atlantis team will make a deal early in the season while they are afloat in space. The Atlantis team could be attacked by the Asurans and the wraith help us against them, some sort of unholy alliance between the wraith and the expedition because they both see the Asurans as the bigger threat. we have had alliances with the wraith before, they always double cross us. maybe that’s how they help us with the power requirements to get to a planet. Then they promise to leave us alone if we help them stop the Asurans but they will come back when they know the Asurans are destroyed

i think McKay will just deactivate them so its some sort of leverage, if you attack us we will turn them back on

it could be a totally wacky plot but "my enemy of my enemy and everything"

What do people think?
Oh, this is my first post sorry if it doesn’t make any sense

rarocks24
April 27th, 2007, 05:20 PM
Actually, the Wraith find a way to disable them and Mckay flips the switch back on so to speak.

Really, I don't know why but I can just picture Sheppard and some random Wraith flipping a light switch on and off for eternity.

Ouroboros
April 27th, 2007, 05:59 PM
This is probably something the Wraith could do all along but only actually put into motion now.

It doesn't make sense that the Wraith and Asurans lived side by side like that for so many centuries without discovering each other. What likely happened is that some sort of deal was reached. The Wraith had no reason to attack the Asurans because they weren't edible, and the Asurans had no reason to attack the Wraith being that they hated their old masters just as much as the Wraith did.

So basically it looks like both sides decided on some sort of "we won't mess with you if you don't mess with us" deal and now eventually someone broke it, there was a conflict of some kind and the Wraith hit the "off" switch on the reps.

This also explains why the reps have been contained to one planet for so long. Like everything else in pegasus they continue to live at the whim of the Wraith. The "plan" to deal with them Oberoth talked about was likely either, completely non existant like Ronon thought, or represented them finally figuring out some way to defend themselves from the Wraith hacking attacks that would stop them cold if they tried anything agressive.

What doesn't make sense is why the Wraith didn't just use the threat of the offswitch to blackmail the Asurans into building them an intergalactic hyperdrive. Maybe that was the point of conflict that caused the Wraith to shut them off, they asked for the drive and the Asurans refused, enraging them?

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 28th, 2007, 05:03 AM
This is probably something the Wraith could do all along but only actually put into motion now.

It doesn't make sense that the Wraith and Asurans lived side by side like that for so many centuries without discovering each other. What likely happened is that some sort of deal was reached. The Wraith had no reason to attack the Asurans because they weren't edible, and the Asurans had no reason to attack the Wraith being that they hated their old masters just as much as the Wraith did.

So basically it looks like both sides decided on some sort of "we won't mess with you if you don't mess with us" deal and now eventually someone broke it, there was a conflict of some kind and the Wraith hit the "off" switch on the reps.

This also explains why the reps have been contained to one planet for so long. Like everything else in pegasus they continue to live at the whim of the Wraith. The "plan" to deal with them Oberoth talked about was likely either, completely non existant like Ronon thought, or represented them finally figuring out some way to defend themselves from the Wraith hacking attacks that would stop them cold if they tried anything agressive.

What doesn't make sense is why the Wraith didn't just use the threat of the offswitch to blackmail the Asurans into building them an intergalactic hyperdrive. Maybe that was the point of conflict that caused the Wraith to shut them off, they asked for the drive and the Asurans refused, enraging them?

My thoughts on this:
*The Wraith don't tolerate rivals that could challenge them so if they had such an ability, they would have done so long ago to defeat the Asurans. Not a definate but something to consider because remember that they destroyed any Human civilization that would rise technologically because they don't want to be threatened by something that could end up like the Lanteans which the Asurans represent in some way.

*The Asurans have no need to expand beyond Asuras. They don't appear to want some form of empire to govern or slaves to rule plus they seem very isolationist so they could perfectly be happy on their little world without any need to leave. I mean they have perfect power requirements, 'food' requirements and everything so there is no reason to leave beyond expansion.

*Every single part of the Asurans are programmed to attack the Wraith so, while not stated, their plan may consist of active deployment of their very own nanites on the Wraith to kill them. We have seen the nanites actively and aggressively target and exterminate Wraith tissue already so it wouldnt be that bad a plan depending on whether they can actually deploy the nano virus on Wraith ships and worlds. Alternatively, they could just kill all Humans and starve the Wraith.

*Its not that inconceivable that the Asurans remained undetected for so long. As we know, Wraith hyperdrives are kind of poor in terms of speed and depending on where Asuras is located, the planet could very well have been too far for a Wraith ship to actively stumble upon it but thats just conjecture at this point.

Buba uognarf
April 28th, 2007, 05:22 AM
I think Wraith hyperdrives are more limited by having to stop between jumps to recover from hyperspace radiation then because they're actually really slow...We know when they pause it's generally about 14 hours (No Mans Land) so that would really build up over long distances.

Sauron18
April 28th, 2007, 05:33 AM
Um, I think I should mention that we already know what the Asuran plan which you are all talking about is.

Their plan is the same plan they had thousands of years ago, and the same plan which the Ancients feared so much that they decided to destroy the Asurans. In fact, the first we ever saw of the Asurans was a part of the plan.

The Asuran plan was to make a nanovirus that would kill all humans, eliminating the Wraith food supply and killing them. This is the virus we saw in "Hot Zone", and it was made by the Asurans to kill humans to kill wraith.

Yes, the Asurans were a nanovirus originally, but they weren't the Hot Zone nanovirus, since the objective of both "strains" is entirely different, and the Asurans have been described on and off the show as the creators of the Hot Zone Virus.


These villains were introduced as the makers of the Hot Zone virus, that's mainly how the writers thought about them before season 3 (before we got more story), and the Hot Zone virus' purpose was already discussed in the episode it appeared in.

So yeah, as far as their plan goes, we already know what it is.

jenks
April 28th, 2007, 06:57 AM
Where exactly is it stated that they were stupid enough to not know that there were other galaxies in the universe that contained life?


Human life?


The Wraith Keeper in 'Rising II' said: "It is not among our stars."

Therefore they had to know that there was other stars out there besides their own.

I'm not sure what you're getting at, that doesn't mean there is any reason for them to think other stars are out there with their food source on them.


Asurans for all intensive purposes are Lanteans, they have the same tech, knowledge etc. So if Wraith got access to their database, then I'm fairly sure other galaxies would be in there somewhere for them to find. As well as the way to modify their hyperdrives to get there.

Doubtful, or they'd have followed them to Earth, wouldn't they?

marty2006
April 28th, 2007, 09:01 AM
Human life?



I'm not sure what you're getting at, that doesn't mean there is any reason for them to think other stars are out there with their food source on them.



Doubtful, or they'd have followed them to Earth, wouldn't they?

Well yea they would have followed them to earth if they had been on good terms with the ancients.

jenks
April 28th, 2007, 10:52 AM
Good point, I forgot that they weren't able to harm them at that point. Even so, I still aren't convinced that they had all of the knowledge that the Ancients had.

Ouroboros
April 28th, 2007, 09:08 PM
My thoughts on this:
*The Wraith don't tolerate rivals that could challenge them so if they had such an ability, they would have done so long ago to defeat the Asurans. Not a definate but something to consider because remember that they destroyed any Human civilization that would rise technologically because they don't want to be threatened by something that could end up like the Lanteans which the Asurans represent in some way.

I'm wondering if it's possible that the Wraith don't even look at the Asurans as a people/rival so much as another piece of technology. They've certainly left plenty of other dangerous ancient tech lying around.


*Every single part of the Asurans are programmed to attack the Wraith so, while not stated, their plan may consist of active deployment of their very own nanites on the Wraith to kill them. We have seen the nanites actively and aggressively target and exterminate Wraith tissue already so it wouldnt be that bad a plan depending on whether they can actually deploy the nano virus on Wraith ships and worlds. Alternatively, they could just kill all Humans and starve the Wraith.

The Asurans can't even kill Weir with the nanobots. As far as I'm concerned it's because the ancients never finished them or they were a failure in this sense. Until i actually see them kill a Wraith with nanobots I'm not buying it. And if I do I'm going to ***** to high heaven about how stupid it is given that they couldn't kill Weir, who as you may have noticed, hasn't spontaniously regenerated many otherwise fatal gunshot wounds lately.

All attacking nanobots would do would be damage cells, likely 1 or a few at a time. We already know that Wraith cells can multiply/regenerate so fast that they can seal up macroscopic holes in seconds. Attacking them with nanomachines would probably represent the single stupidest most ineffectual way you could ever possibly go about attacking them.


*Its not that inconceivable that the Asurans remained undetected for so long. As we know, Wraith hyperdrives are kind of poor in terms of speed and depending on where Asuras is located, the planet could very well have been too far for a Wraith ship to actively stumble upon it but thats just conjecture at this point.

The thing about the Wraith having slow drives is largely a myth. They're slow in the sense that they're not Asguard or intergalactic level but they're still more than fast enough to explore their own small galaxy over the course of 10,000 years.

As human predators they would scour every possible corner of their domain in search of humans to eat. It simply doesn't make sense that they didn't know about the Asurans.

sparkygate
April 28th, 2007, 10:56 PM
Find the wraith and our allies have something in common.
(Refers to a season four episode and a revelation to come)

Seems like will we be pairing up with the wraith again BUT THIS time to fight probably against the asurans


One of our own the enemy courts.
(Refers a season four episode - maybe a little harder to figure out).

Maybe refering to the travellers where they end up battling the wraith/asurans??



Isolation imposed and a grand battle looms,
(Refers to an early season four episode).

Probably referring to adrift but maybe micheal comes around and help out with the power requirements and gives us a warning of what is to come??



While an alien contact this player dooms.
(Refers to another early season four episode).

Againa maybe something to do with the travellers helping or not helping out with the battle against the wraith and asurans??

BTW: POEM is From Joe's Blog:D

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 29th, 2007, 05:27 AM
I'm wondering if it's possible that the Wraith don't even look at the Asurans as a people/rival so much as another piece of technology. They've certainly left plenty of other dangerous ancient tech lying around.

True but none that could actively go and attack them like the Asurans could. The other pieces of Ancient technology left behind were practically relics that could do nothing without an operator while the Asurans are an intelligent foe that could be a very dangerous menace to them. Its the difference between leaving a gun behind in an empty room and leaving a gun behind with something that could pick it up and turn it against you. Would be very foolish of the Wraith to have ignored the Asurans if they met them long ago unless of course a more valid explanation was given.


The Asurans can't even kill Weir with the nanobots. As far as I'm concerned it's because the ancients never finished them or they were a failure in this sense. Until i actually see them kill a Wraith with nanobots I'm not buying it. And if I do I'm going to ***** to high heaven about how stupid it is given that they couldn't kill Weir, who as you may have noticed, hasn't spontaniously regenerated many otherwise fatal gunshot wounds lately.

All attacking nanobots would do would be damage cells, likely 1 or a few at a time. We already know that Wraith cells can multiply/regenerate so fast that they can seal up macroscopic holes in seconds. Attacking them with nanomachines would probably represent the single stupidest most ineffectual way you could ever possibly go about attacking them.

Remember that the nanites were created to kill Wraith. Not Human. The fact that it works easily against Humans might be an interesting 'side effect'. We do know that the Wraith share some qualities similar to Humans so its possible that those qualities that relate them to Humans allow the nano virus to do what it does on when it infected people in the Hotzone episode and when Weir was infected.

Also, the regenerative abilities of the Wraith are proportional to their feeding so technically speaking if the nanites worked to damage the cells which the Wraith was forced to heal then eventually it would die because it would need to regenerate more then feeding. Besides, we have no idea about the limits of Wraith healing ability since, if the above was the case, then the gunshots they faced dozens of times in the show shouldnt have managed to kill them. Its perfectly possible that a tiny machine can circumvent a Wraiths healing ability since it is working to destroy an enemy from the inside. Not something I would consider ineffectual personally.


The thing about the Wraith having slow drives is largely a myth. They're slow in the sense that they're not Asguard or intergalactic level but they're still more than fast enough to explore their own small galaxy over the course of 10,000 years.

As human predators they would scour every possible corner of their domain in search of humans to eat. It simply doesn't make sense that they didn't know about the Asurans.

I can't really say more on this really beyond the possibility that Asuras is located in an insignicant corner of the Pegasus galaxy but nothing confirms that so meh. Since, if the Wraith did discover the Asurans, then I think they would have fought straight away with no deals being made. The Goa'uld tended to shy away from things that were much more advanced then them while the Wraith don't appear to give up as such and tend to crush whatever resistance they find. So either the Wraith and Asurans don't know each other yet or have met one another and been fighting for hundreds of years already but this doesnt make sense since the Asurans have shown to have no ships or anything so their world would have been bombarded by Wraith Hiveships for ages while their shield protected them. Simply put, the Wraith would have done to the Asurans what they did to Atlantis and constantly attack it until it was destroyed.

Sauron18
April 29th, 2007, 10:03 AM
The plan they have and had was to use the virus they made, the one from "Hot Zone", to kill the Wraith food supply.

A popular misconception in the fandom is that the Asurans and the Hot Zone virus were one and the same or part of the same experiment, but that's not so, the episode and the comments of TPTB tell us otherwise, the Asurans made the virus, who's purpose was already explained in the episode it appeared in.

GateMan2000
April 30th, 2007, 06:30 AM
I think that they both didn't know of each other and somehow to come find out. I guess we will learn in the first half of the season.

Ouroboros
April 30th, 2007, 07:05 PM
True but none that could actively go and attack them like the Asurans could. The other pieces of Ancient technology left behind were practically relics that could do nothing without an operator while the Asurans are an intelligent foe that could be a very dangerous menace to them. Its the difference between leaving a gun behind in an empty room and leaving a gun behind with something that could pick it up and turn it against you. Would be very foolish of the Wraith to have ignored the Asurans if they met them long ago unless of course a more valid explanation was given.

I still think my original explanation is probably the best one. They both know about each other but they leave each other alone because there's no reason for them to fight. The Wraith can't eat the Asurans and the last thing the Asurans would want to do now is fight the Wraith like their hated masters wanted them to.


Remember that the nanites were created to kill Wraith. Not Human. The fact that it works easily against Humans might be an interesting 'side effect'. We do know that the Wraith share some qualities similar to Humans so its possible that those qualities that relate them to Humans allow the nano virus to do what it does on when it infected people in the Hotzone episode and when Weir was infected.

The nanites being designed to kill Wraith is largely irrelevant. It might be important in the case of something like a poison that relied on chemical reactions with Wraith biology or a virus but nanites attack by causing microscopic physical damage. If they were up to destroying a regenerative Wraith body in this manner then they should absolutely devestate a normal human one which can't repair itself even a fraction as fast.


Also, the regenerative abilities of the Wraith are proportional to their feeding so technically speaking if the nanites worked to damage the cells which the Wraith was forced to heal then eventually it would die because it would need to regenerate more then feeding. Besides, we have no idea about the limits of Wraith healing ability since, if the above was the case, then the gunshots they faced dozens of times in the show shouldnt have managed to kill them. Its perfectly possible that a tiny machine can circumvent a Wraiths healing ability since it is working to destroy an enemy from the inside. Not something I would consider ineffectual personally.

The only thing that seems to put a Wraith down conclusively is massive head or chest trauma sustained in a short span of time. IE you dump a whole clip into them and ruin their biological functions so badly and so quickly that the body can't repair itself before the wraith expires. I'll reinterate that if the nanomachines were actually capable of causing this level of damage in this sort of timeframe they would have killed Weir in seconds. However what actually happened was they got owned by white blood cells. That means that they're so pathetic they can't even destroy attacking white blood cells to defend themselves. They need to rely on masking their pressence so that the meger immune system of an ordinary human woman does not destroy them wholesale. One wonders how they cause any damage at all if destroying cells is something they find so challenging.


I can't really say more on this really beyond the possibility that Asuras is located in an insignicant corner of the Pegasus galaxy but nothing confirms that so meh. Since, if the Wraith did discover the Asurans, then I think they would have fought straight away with no deals being made. The Goa'uld tended to shy away from things that were much more advanced then them while the Wraith don't appear to give up as such and tend to crush whatever resistance they find. So either the Wraith and Asurans don't know each other yet or have met one another and been fighting for hundreds of years already but this doesnt make sense since the Asurans have shown to have no ships or anything so their world would have been bombarded by Wraith Hiveships for ages while their shield protected them. Simply put, the Wraith would have done to the Asurans what they did to Atlantis and constantly attack it until it was destroyed.

Like I say above I think the only reasonable conclusion is that they do know about each other but don't fight because neither of them really has a motive to.

Prior_of_the_Ori
May 1st, 2007, 01:45 AM
The nanites being designed to kill Wraith is largely irrelevant. It might be important in the case of something like a poison that relied on chemical reactions with Wraith biology or a virus but nanites attack by causing microscopic physical damage. If they were up to destroying a regenerative Wraith body in this manner then they should absolutely devestate a normal human one which can't repair itself even a fraction as fast.

The only thing that seems to put a Wraith down conclusively is massive head or chest trauma sustained in a short span of time. IE you dump a whole clip into them and ruin their biological functions so badly and so quickly that the body can't repair itself before the wraith expires. I'll reinterate that if the nanomachines were actually capable of causing this level of damage in this sort of timeframe they would have killed Weir in seconds. However what actually happened was they got owned by white blood cells. That means that they're so pathetic they can't even destroy attacking white blood cells to defend themselves. They need to rely on masking their pressence so that the meger immune system of an ordinary human woman does not destroy them wholesale. One wonders how they cause any damage at all if destroying cells is something they find so challenging.

The point being that perhaps its Asuran programming that makes them less effective against Humans then the Wraith. I mean the ATA gene prevented them from going against the Ancients so perhaps, similarly, their programming did not include to harm Humans so they go about it a different way.

Also, we have no idea on how the nanites work against the Wraith either beyond that one tissue sample they introduced into Weir which they reacted violently to. Perhaps, they work on a slower pace which would allow the Wraith to walk back into its Hive and unknowingly which would make sense when introducing such a weapon into the enemy.

Anyway, this is all speculation really until the episode airs.

Sauron18
May 1st, 2007, 11:55 AM
I think that they both didn't know of each other and somehow to come find out. I guess we will learn in the first half of the season.
The Asurans certainly knew about the Wraith, they were made to kill the Wraith, and they formed a plan to kill the Wraith. The Ancients thought it was a bit bloodthirsty and that's why it wasn't fullfilled, but the plan could certainly be completed if they wanted to.

As for the Wraith knowing about the Asurans.....they might, but I think the Wraith don't want the Asurans to suddenly want to kill them again, especially since they can take steps the Ancients couldn't, steps that would assure the destruction of the Wraith.

fallenexile452
May 1st, 2007, 12:11 PM
i'm having thoughts of an asuran jumping into a wraith matrix style to kill it.

sparkygate
May 2nd, 2007, 04:19 AM
My Theroy
You know i think the hot zone virus back fired...

like the anicents sent it out to kill the wraith which it probably did but the wraith were smart enough to get around it or get rid of it in which it caused the creation of the asurans and when the anicents found out they destoryed the asurans because there experiment went out of control...

Also remember the wraith were a formable race in which they actually ended up defeating the anicents/ pusshing them back to the MW galaxy


Just a theroy

Sauron18
May 2nd, 2007, 01:39 PM
The Hot Zone Virus wasn't created by the Ancients, it was created by the Asurans to eliminate the humans in the pegasus galaxy (and therefore kill the wraith), and is the reason why the ancients decided the Asurans were dangerous.

GateMan2000
May 3rd, 2007, 05:57 AM
The Hot Zone Virus wasn't created by the Ancients, it was created by the Asurans to eliminate the humans in the pegasus galaxy (and therefore kill the wraith), and is the reason why the ancients decided the Asurans were dangerous.

It makes a lot of sense if they did want to kill the Wraith by killing all of the humans. No food no Wraith. I think this storyline might be a decent one if done right.

Sauron18
May 3rd, 2007, 02:23 PM
It makes a lot of sense if they did want to kill the Wraith by killing all of the humans. No food no Wraith. I think this storyline might be a decent one if done right.
Well, the show tells us this was basically their original plan, because that's the explanation given for the "Hot Zone" virus in the episode.

However, the rest we didn't learn until "Progeny"

jenks
May 3rd, 2007, 02:29 PM
I'm still not entirely sure why they want to destroy the Wraith at all.

rarocks24
May 3rd, 2007, 02:36 PM
I'm still not entirely sure why they want to destroy the Wraith at all.

The Asurans? I'd imagine they were programmed too...I also don't see the Asurans trusting the Wraith and vice versa (the Wraith trusting the Asurans). And given the events of Progeny and The Return, I'd say any attempts to disable or threaten the Asurans is tantamount to an act of aggression in their eyes.

The presence of the Tau'ri has thrown a wrench in the peace between these two that would otherwise wipe each other out.

Vala_M
May 4th, 2007, 10:22 AM
The problem for me is that it seems so sudden & quick. As of yet, it doesn't look like the Wraith have ever encountered the Asurans. They slept for all these years because of a lack of food while Asurans flourished. Had they know about them back then, then they would have all went together & started pounding on them got the technology & went to a new feeding ground.

We didn't see or hear anything in S3 about it. So that means that it must be brought up in an early S4 episode as 'The Seer' as it's to be aired something like ep8. Really cannot see how the Wraith could suddenly encounter them then find a way to neutralise them so quickly. That for me makes it a little bit unbelieveable. Maybe if they went to war, the Asurans finally attacked them. Then in 2nd half of S4, Wraith find something that gives them the upper hand, before Asurans counter again.

So am definitely keeping my eyes focused on when we learn that the Wraith finally have enountered the Asurans. Maybe it's in the season premiere. Asurans track Atlantis, while Wraith catch something on sensors & go see what it is. Turns out to be a warships or whatever!


I agree. There is something missing in this picture. They probably deal with their encounter in an earlier episode. Remember, the writers often do this to confuse people. Release certain parts from episodes that is.


wow if the Wraith menage to jamme are asgard beaming technologie and deactive the Asurans/PG Replicators i wonder what esle they capable of programing ?;)

I agree with that statement as well. But why would the Ancients have considered the Asurans as a weapon to use against the Wraith if they could do this?


It makes a lot of sense if they did want to kill the Wraith by killing all of the humans. No food no Wraith. I think this storyline might be a decent one if done right.

Actually, it doesn't. Because the Wraith will eat eachother if there are no humans.

Vala,

rarocks24
May 4th, 2007, 03:22 PM
The Wraith would eventually die out or try and find a new food source (genetic manipulation).

The Wraith will do ANYTHING to survive...all the more reason to send them to the Ori galaxy.

GateMan2000
May 7th, 2007, 03:50 AM
Actually, it doesn't. Because the Wraith will eat eachother if there are no humans.


Yes and?.... If the Wraith eat each other that leads to war and the destruction of the Wraith. If there were no more humans in the galaxy and most of the Wraith were dead from war and consumption, chances are the ones surviving would die off because of no more food. You can only eat your kind for so long before there aren't anymore left.

Ouroboros
May 7th, 2007, 03:58 PM
If they were willing to turn to canibalism and put most of their species into hibernation again starving the Wraith could prove extremely impractical.

They could just keep a small number of their best hivekeepers and scientists awake to work on an alternate foodsource or faster drive system or something. It would likely take thousands or tens of thousands of years for the starvation to actually kill them off as a species. With that much time they're bound to come up with something to save their necks, and probably a lot sooner than that.

It's even probable that forcing them to do this in this type of way might actually end up making them a bigger threat in the long run.

Right now they more or less contain themselves to Pegasus and limit their own numbers to fall in line with the limited food available to them.

Giving them an alternate food source would remove those limitations and without the accompaniying diplomacy that collaberating with Earth/Asguard/Jaffa on an alternate foodsource would create, could potentially lead them into an age of ruthless expansionism.

With the Asguard being as they are post unending now there's really no one who could come close to containing them either. Especially not when they don't need to worry about rare and finite food sources anymore. Their need for rare and finite human food is their biggest limitation. It keeps them near worlds that can support human life and discourages them from striking out to far into the galaxy or building up to massive numbers again. Forcing them to adapt beyond it is bad news in the long run if you intend to keep them as enemies.

Not having to worry about where their next meal will come from will basically make them as nasty as they were when the ancients faced them, worse even.

garhkal
May 7th, 2007, 07:47 PM
This is probably something the Wraith could do all along but only actually put into motion now.


Perhaps this was the 'weakness; that was mentioned back in Aurora... That the wraith had some tech of the asurans that could conseavable turn them all off, but if triggered with XYZ, would act like a calling beacon and bring the asurans right down on the wraith..

vaberella
June 21st, 2007, 10:32 PM
Wraith spoilers as of JM's Blog June 21st, 2007,


Boy, nothing quite turns your appetite like watching a wraith birthing scene. We were caught completely off-guard, munching away on pasta, pizza and wings when, suddenly, the sequence flashed up on screen. “Oooooooh,”moaned Alan. “Aaawwww!”screamed Alex. Carl made no noise, silently turning his head and vomiting back into his container of creamy tortellini. “Cool,”muttered Martin, eyes fixed, munching away unfazed. After lunch, I ran into Will Waring, the director responsible for bringing this horror to the screen along with Todd Masters of MastersFX. “Oh, yeah,”he enthused, “We almost drowned poor Morris (Chapdelaine who plays the birthing wraith) in methycil.” Methycil, for those who don’t know (like me until I asked) is used by productions looking to capture that disquietingly goopy je ne sais quoi. Just add a little water to its powdered form and you have oodles of movie slime, just the thing for salivating aliens, ectoplasmic explosions, and ooziferous wraith birthing sequences.

So this isn't Teyla related and we're getting our first Wraith birth on screen. When they mentioned goop, I just keep picturing episodes of X-Files, well really the movie version and the way the aliens fed off of a human host. Could you believe that baby's ravage a woman's body in the same parasitic form---except for the fact that they don't sort of pop out and kill you. Althoug in some cases of birthing scenes it can also been equated between the battle between the parasite (the child) and the host (the mother).

In any event, let's just say I can't wait to see this, because I guess she gives birth. I wonder who many they give birth too at a time...

Yuck! Maybe there is a chance that Ford could come back the father of a half wraith baby. Okay, let me rest my brain. Knock yourselves out on how this is worked in...eww!!

Mitchell82
June 22nd, 2007, 11:38 AM
Wraith spoilers as of JM's Blog June 21st, 2007,



So this isn't Teyla related and we're getting our first Wraith birth on screen. When they mentioned goop, I just keep picturing episodes of X-Files, well really the movie version and the way the aliens fed off of a human host. Could you believe that baby's ravage a woman's body in the same parasitic form---except for the fact that they don't sort of pop out and kill you. Althoug in some cases of birthing scenes it can also been equated between the battle between the parasite (the child) and the host (the mother).

In any event, let's just say I can't wait to see this, because I guess she gives birth. I wonder who many they give birth too at a time...

Yuck! Maybe there is a chance that Ford could come back the father of a half wraith baby. Okay, let me rest my brain. Knock yourselves out on how this is worked in...eww!!

Ewww indeed but it sounds interesting, curious to see how they pull this off.