The Anti Season 4 Thread (Spoilers). For complaints and misgivings ONLY.

[parisindy]

Echoes!! I love Echoes, has my favorite character appearing again. *huggles her Kate-clone*

And yeah, I've seen all of season 3 already. Not that I matter anyway cause I'm Belgian.

yeah but you have good chocolate! that always counts hehe

[Anuna]

And we know Shep and Rodney love chocholate, and I love it too... okay OT. I always say, if you do a dacent show, and then suddenly start killing of and replacing characters people love, create a hideous dark atmosphere, bring new "cool" baddies, add Big Bad things and BIIIIIG Decisions to the mix, something is seriously off. Either it's the fans losing interest in the show, or maybe it's you're out of really good creative ideas. Either way, it sucks and caould turn out bad.

oh one more thing. it's so obivious that carter is brought to attract more SG - 1 fans to watch Atlantis. I'm from Croatia, there aren't so many Stargate fans here, but we have small forums and we do have fun discussing our fav show. Our fanbase prefers SG - 1 over Atlantis, and if you gather like 10 of SG fans in one place, 8 of them will say that:
1. they like SG - 1 better
2. they adore Jack
3. they wet their panties when Caretr even appears on the screen. (okay won't say that, but you should see Carter - related threads. *rolleyes*)

My point here is - tptb bring Carter so that SG - 1 devoted fans fall in love with their new and improved Atlantis. It's simple as that. For some reason they can't keep both ladies, so they decide in favor of Carter, no matter how loudly JM says the decision to get rid of Weir came first. That's load of cr**. Knowing something about group dynnamics in RL, here is my guess what will happen:
- the crew will need to re adjust to the changes, and there will be some kinf of on screen effect to that
- the group dynammics that was created by the end of S2 and during the S3 will be ticked off and ruined which leads to
- inevitable adjusting period and setting up new team/group dynammics (remember when Ronon first came on the show - he needed to adjust) - which leads me to this question:

With al those Big bad things, Big Important Decisions and show going darker, how would the things listed above develop? You have to do a very good job not to screw things up given the things above. You know, the art imitates RL, and these facts above still stand even though we're talking about TV show. Two major characters are written out - two very much loved caharcters.

Makes me wonder, will Atlantis sink - again, just like in the myth? (the great civilization that was punished for their moral misdeeds - see the irony here?)

[parisindy]

Makes me wonder, will Atlantis sink - again, just like in the myth? (the great civilization that was punished for their moral misdeeds - see the irony here?)

ooo excellent metaphor!

[nowvoyager908]

gotta agree there but i was just wondering, if there were any anti's who still had to watch the end and if they would

I haven't watched live since The Ark. I had seen Sunday, and parts of Submersion "unofficially" several months ago, so that doesn't really count. But I will not watch Vengeance or First Strike. You just have to make a stand somewhere. LOL.

[Anuna]

ooo excellent metaphor!

Allow me to be really evil and say this - it was enough to sink the first Atlantis (the one from the myth). But the second one has done soooo bad, that even sinking it wasn't enough. Okay, enough of my evil side.

[Ruined_puzzle]

gotta agree there but i was just wondering, if there were any anti's who still had to watch the end and if they would

I haven't watched SGA LIVE since The Return I, I did acquire the episodes and watched them up until Sunday. When I heard what happened in that episode I didn't even bother to watch the remaining episodes. I did however catch the scenes that I wanted to see in youtube, mostly shippy scenes. So yeah I haven't even bothered to tune into the scifi channel to see the episodes.

[Falcon Horus]

yeah but you have good chocolate! that always counts hehe

You sure you betcha!!

[mcbarr]

Allow me to be really evil and say this - it was enough to sink the first Atlantis (the one from the myth). But the second one has done soooo bad, that even sinking it wasn't enough. Okay, enough of my evil side.

No problem. We're all evil here!

[jerkface]

A friend sent me the link to that "please watch our show" video with M & M, which I (foolishly) watched. While I'll try to avoid spiraling into a complete rant, I will say what confuses me most is just who this video is for.

In part, it seems like they were trying to placate unhappy fans, by saying that Keller isn't replacing Beckett, and that they were doing all those character centered episodes.

But, for most of the time, it seemed like they were defending their past writing, not to happy or unhappy fans, but to some third party (the network? themselves? Santa?).

Their section on Carter didn't seem to be about her at all, it seemed to be about the writing problems they thought Weir introduced that they didn't know how to overcome without scapping the character. Similarly, they talked about the

Spoiler:

new group of space-faring PG people

as if they hadn't better developed the Athosians, or any other PG humans up to now, because there were just inherent problems with the Atlantis universe that couldn't be solved without wholly rewriting it.

Which all leaves me a bit puzzled. Maybe M & M are more anti- than any of us, because apparently there isn't much about the show they think is right. I haven't seen anyone here say "the show hasn't gelled." Is this a pro- argument I've just missed or misunderstood? If they're responding to someone, I don't know who.

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And on a side rant (I know, I can't stop myself, skip over if you want), why do they apparently assume their audience is made up of horny twelve-year-olds?

Do we need another alien chick forcing (*wink, wink*) Sheppard into smooches? Sheesh.
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I can't see why I would tell my friends to watch Atlantis when they insist on reworking it into a tacky, kids' show.

[KadeCarrion]

I'm coming out of lurkdom to say a huge "thank you" to jerkface for expressing my thoughts on Atlantis better than I could have! (This ended up being much longer than I expected. You've been warned!)

I couldn't bring myself to watch the interview though I did read a transcript.

In part, it seems like they were trying to placate unhappy fans, by saying that Keller isn't replacing Beckett, and that they were doing all those character centered episodes.

What good are character episodes if A) our favorite characters are all dead and gone?! [grrr] and B) any character growth or repercussions on the show's universe are wiped away next week by that oh-so-handy reset button?

Their section on Carter didn't seem to be about her at all, it seemed to be about the writing problems they thought Weir introduced that they didn't know how to overcome without scapping the character. Similarly, they talked about the

Spoiler:

new group of space-faring PG people

as if they hadn't better developed the Athosians, or any other PG humans up to now, because there were just inherent problems with the Atlantis universe that couldn't be solved without wholly rewriting it.

EXACTLY! I recently rewatched a good portion of season 1. ALL of the pieces for a great show were in place. But these elements were never expanded. Is it too much work to properly develop a world? Flesh out a character? Illuminate an alien species. Apparently so. Which begs the question: if these writers cannot or will not write, then why were they employed as writers in the first place?

I haven't seen anyone here say "the show hasn't gelled."

My take? The show was not ALLOWED to gel. Ford doesn't quite work? Dump him, get a new one! Wraith becoming a little cartoony? Dump them, get some new villains! Elizabeth a little flat? Dump her, bring in Sam! And I STILL can't figure out what possesed them to get rid of Carson. He was perfect! *sobs in the corner*

I can't see why I would tell my friends to watch Atlantis when they insist on reworking it into a tacky, kids' show.

I couldn't agree more! I seriously don't know how much time I'll end up investing in S4. I watch tv for two things: compelling, three-dimensional characters and entertaining stories. Well, the compelling characters have been killed off or flattened. And the stories haven't entertained me in a long time. Infuriated, yes, but not entertained me. So I guess I'll have to fall back on the eye candy factor (generally way down the list of priorites for me, but what else is really left?) Jason Momoa

[kimaken]

And I STILL can't figure out what possesed them to get rid of Carson. He was perfect! *sobs in the corner*

I think the reason they decided to dump Carson is because he's a male and TPTB were getting desperate to bring in the young male viewers; how best to do that then with the charming assests of a pretty young gal. They couldn't replace any of the main team, and I believe they planned all along to bring Carter over once she was free from SG1, so Carson was the one who had to be sacrificed in order to bring on the eye candy for the young guys.

Since I'm neither young nor male, this plan only served to drive me totally away from SGA.

[Killdeer]

I think the reason they decided to dump Carson is because he's a male and TPTB were getting desperate to bring in the young male viewers; how best to do that then with the charming assests of a pretty young gal. They couldn't replace any of the main team, and I believe they planned all along to bring Carter over once she was free from SG1, so Carson was the one who had to be sacrificed in order to bring on the eye candy for the young guys.

Since I'm neither young nor male, this plan only served to drive me totally away from SGA.

It's a problem - yeah. What I don't get is...it's not like JS is that drop dead gorgeous. At least to me. But then...I'm not a guy, so probably I don't get it. She's cute, yeah. But...she doesn't strike me as the "eye-candy" type.

And you know, I wouldn't have such a problem with her if she just wasn't so young! PM is 38. JS is 25. How are we supposed to take her seriously as Head of Medicine at 25? Maybe they'll make the character a little older....I certainly hope so.

[poundpuppy29]

They decided to bring in Blondes for the boys too. All American Girls blonde hair blue eyes they seems to be their preference.

[KadeCarrion]

And you know, I wouldn't have such a problem with her if she just wasn't so young! PM is 38. JS is 25. How are we supposed to take her seriously as Head of Medicine at 25? Maybe they'll make the character a little older....I certainly hope so.

The only other way to explain the age thing is if they Doogiefy her... but that wouldn't necessarily be a good thing either.

Problem is, I like JS & AT both a lot. I'm just sorry they're going to get dragged into this mess (ie Atlantis), and most likely receive blame & resentment that they, as actors only doing what they're told, don't deserve.

[poundpuppy29]

I agree it's not AT nor JS fault it's TPTB fault. I do remember an old article with JS about hoping the fans don't hate her it was quite awhile ago the article. I willing to bet AT is probably sick of Carter and wants to be done with her I do remember reading in an interview she felt the character has had a full arc so that's why I think she wants to do other things besides Sam. I think MS and CJ probably feel the same way. Ten years is a long time to play the same character. Do the TPTB really think fans will accept SGA blindly I still don't see why Carter is needed there. In my perfect world Beckett is still alive Weir is still the leader and JS could be Daniel Jackson of SGA the's what they are missing an ancient culture expert.