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    The Wraith: Evil or Just Misunderstood?

    Teyla: Previously on the 'Letters From Pegasus' Thread:

    Thek: I actually find that looking at the situation in Black/White a weakness. I agree with Kavanaugh in the fact that Weir should have allowed the Geneva Convention to apply to the Wraith.

    Cows eat grass, we eat cows, Wraith eat us.

    The only difference bettween us and the Wraith in this sense, is that we believe that cows are not intelligent life where Wraith know very well that we are.

    And we know that Wraith are intellifent life. (Thus going back to why I believe Weir should have followed the Geneva Convention.)

    Wraith, as a species, aren't evil, they are just living creatures who have to eat. Humans just happen to be on the food menu.

    The ones we've met have been sadistic, but its like judging that the human race is made up of entirely evil, sadistic creatures because of the percentage of humans who kill, rape, and torture others. (<----This is something I wish the writers would bring up with the Wraith)




    GatetheWay: But the Wraith are evil because they know that humans are intelligent. Do you think if humans found out that cows were self aware and intelligent that they would kill and eat them all the same? I don't think so.

    Yes, but we don't know if Wraith can eat anything else but humans.

    If we knew cows were intelligent and self-aware, but they were the only anything(one?) we could possibly eat to stay alive, humans would still eat them anyway.




    Thek: Yes, but we don't know if Wraith can eat anything else but humans.

    If we knew cows were intelligent and self-aware, but they were the only anything(one?) we could possibly eat to stay alive, humans would still eat them anyway.




    ShadowMaat: (Replying to GatetheWay) I think we'd find a way to rationalize it. "OMG, those poor cows. Such a horrible quality of life! We're really doing them a favor by slaughtering them and eating their flesh and turning their skins into boots."

    Teyla: Now for the rest of the discussion:
    *Insert something really cool here*

    #2
    Evil by our society standard. They Kill with no remorse. But our standard is based on our way of life. Your standards are just what you were taught and accepted. And these things are constantly changing.
    They are an alien race with their own society.
    IMO to be evil, you have to be breaking your OWN societies rules and regualtions. If you are doing what your race does, and is ok for them to do, you are just being you.

    Spoiler free since Jan 3 2005 (It's getting harder each day)
    DOOOOOOOM!

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      #3
      Agreed. By current human societal standards, the Wraith would probably be considered evil, but I'm not entirely convinced that such is the case. They eat to live. Do we have any cases of them killing merely for sport? I know there's stuff coming up next season, but I was under the impression that even that would still have an end result of someone being eaten.

      They don't casually wipe out whole villages or murder people and leave them, do they? Unless they perceive a threat, and even then I think the "threat" still gets turned into food.

      And as we saw in Hot Zone, it isn't as if they can just go suck a cow, they NEED humans. If they ONLY fed off each other, well, A) the species wouldn't last very long and B ) we'd still call them sick and evil because they're cannibals.

      I don't think the Wraith are any more "evil" than any other species, and probably less so than some. After all, they don't take a human host, do they?

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        #4
        I diagree, as uma said the only thing we have control over is if we are evil or good, look at the way the wraith act, do they look freindly? they are pure preditorial evil. they enjoy causing pain. if they only killed humans for food, then why do they play with them and torture them look at their expressions they enjoy what they do to their prey,
        The wraith are evil plain and simple its the way the writers have made them.....The only reason they dont kill people and leave them is it would be a waste of food to say that they are not evil because they do not do that is not accurate..
        Who cares if they dont take a host they treat ther prey worse than the gou'ald

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          #5
          I suppose... I just think of big game hunters who can spend weeks tracking and hunting down prey, sometimes wounding the animal in the process but continuing the chase. And I know I've seen people grinning when they eat something particularly tasty.

          Might be different if the Wraith were hunting me or my family, but I'm not convinced they're necesarily evil. You can be bad or mean without being evil...
          Last edited by ShadowMaat; 10 March 2005, 01:59 PM.

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            #6
            Originally posted by Gaterholic
            Evil by our society standard. They Kill with no remorse. But our standard is based on our way of life. Your standards are just what you were taught and accepted. And these things are constantly changing.
            They are an alien race with their own society.
            IMO to be evil, you have to be breaking your OWN societies rules and regualtions. If you are doing what your race does, and is ok for them to do, you are just being you.
            I agree. I'm not convinced that there is a strong enough arguement for them to be considered evil. If we are to see them as the predator and humans as the prey, then they are doing what comes naturally to them...feeding, something which they need to do to survive. The fact that they can take enjoyment out of this is irrespective, consider cats for example, they seem to enjoy the hunt...does that make them evil?

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              #7
              And humans hunt food for sport. Heck, many humans just hunt for sport and don't actually eat what they kill. They just watch it die.

              Or what about fishing?

              Fishers basically suffocate the poor fish to death and that really isn't a fun way to go. Oh, and the hook in the side of the mouth is probably painful.

              Not to mention most use living worms as bait.

              Yet, we don't define fishing as an evil thing.

              Oh, and cutting off heads aren't exactly the painless way to go. Animals can live up to...I believe 13 seconds...after there head is detached.
              *Insert something really cool here*

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                #8
                Originally posted by Thek
                And humans hunt food for sport. Heck, many humans just hunt for sport and don't actually eat what they kill. They just watch it die.

                Or what about fishing?

                Fishers basically suffocate the poor fish to death and that really isn't a fun way to go. Oh, and the hook in the side of the mouth is probably painful.

                Not to mention most use living worms as bait.

                Yet, we don't define fishing as an evil thing.

                Oh, and cutting off heads aren't exactly the painless way to go. Animals can live up to...I believe 13 seconds...after there head is detached.

                I was just thinking about the fishing thing. To a lot of people hunting is fun, does that make them evil? At the the moment here in the UK hunting is a very emotive topic at the moment what with the recent hunting ban.

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                  #9
                  well when the wraith feed they enjoy it way to much there is a difference when you grin while you are eating a really good burger but the wraith dont just grin they cant think of the word but thier happiness is much more sinister, also when thier prey beg to be let go or for mercy you dont hear a cow go please dont kill me I want ot live, you dont see a cow cry whena a cow or other animal is set for slaughter or to be killed it does not know what awaits it.
                  The wraiths prey do, you cant tell me they are not evil and hear those crys for mercy or thescreams of terror and they still smile with glee as they feed,

                  I had a savanna monitor lizard and gave if live mice one day it got a mouse from behind and the mouse screams sucha a pitiful scream I almost started crying...I still feed him mice while I had him but I wore headpghones so if they did scream I couldnt hear them.
                  I hated feeding him from that point to where I started feeding him defrosted rats.
                  Now if the wraith can listen to the screams and mercy plea's and still feed with such glee and sadistic abandon then they are evil plain and simple...

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                    #10
                    Besides I want them to be evil cause they are awesome...I rooted for Sauron to win after all evil is more fun...

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                      #11
                      lol

                      Evil is fun.

                      But, honestly, I think the writers need to explore the path of the Wraith not-evilness.

                      It is an interesting concept. The situation shouldn't be black n' white 'cause nothing ever is.

                      Besides that: well, if the cow could speak English, I'm pretty sure it might beg for its life before the butcher butchered it. Heck, it probably begs for its life now. "MOOO! MOOO! MOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" If it realizes what is going on.

                      Besides, fish flop around franatically when they are out of water...and that's probably their version of begging for their lives.

                      Okay, so it is entirely possible that the sole reason the characters on Atlantis think the Wraith are evil is because they do what humans pretty much do, except to humans?

                      ...
                      *Insert something really cool here*

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by Darkdreams
                        well when the wraith feed they enjoy it way to much there is a difference when you grin while you are eating a really good burger but the wraith dont just grin they cant think of the word but thier happiness is much more sinister, also when thier prey beg to be let go or for mercy you dont hear a cow go please dont kill me I want ot live, you dont see a cow cry whena a cow or other animal is set for slaughter or to be killed it does not know what awaits it.
                        The wraiths prey do, you cant tell me they are not evil and hear those crys for mercy or thescreams of terror and they still smile with glee as they feed,

                        I had a savanna monitor lizard and gave if live mice one day it got a mouse from behind and the mouse screams sucha a pitiful scream I almost started crying...I still feed him mice while I had him but I wore headpghones so if they did scream I couldnt hear them.
                        I hated feeding him from that point to where I started feeding him defrosted rats.
                        Now if the wraith can listen to the screams and mercy plea's and still feed with such glee and sadistic abandon then they are evil plain and simple...
                        What if every time we ate animal produce we heard screams, would it stop us eating them? Maybe...I don't know. The fact is that those of us that do eat meat know full well that the animal in question didn't want to die. The point is does the knowledge of that, even though we're not witness to it, make us evil?? Killing for fun is totally different to killing for food, at the end of the day the wraith kill humans for food. OK they get pleasure out of the killing in a sport-like way, I'm still not convinced that makes them evil.

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                          #13
                          If my burger screamed when I took a bite I would record it heh heh, Dont know I might stop then and go vegan, OMG maybe there are Vegan Wraiths so I guess they would CULtivate vegies heh heh, bet they would have a pet Bunnicula. ok yeah its a bad joke.
                          But yeah I would really love for them to explore a wraith that hates how thier people feed, someone that would come over tot he good side like the tokra. that would be pretty cool. I am sure there would be rogue aspects in the wraith society.
                          Maybe the Atlatis team could design a drug using the Atlatis computers that would enable them to feed without killing thier prey or no absorb other types of energy instead of living energy, but I dont think that will happen.
                          The friendly wraith aspect maybe but that woule be problematic after all it would have to feed.

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                            #14
                            Liking the idea of rogue-wraiths ...interesting.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by Darkdreams
                              If my burger screamed when I took a bite I would record it heh heh, Dont know I might stop then and go vegan, OMG maybe there are Vegan Wraiths so I guess they would CULtivate vegies heh heh, bet they would have a pet Bunnicula. ok yeah its a bad joke.
                              But yeah I would really love for them to explore a wraith that hates how thier people feed, someone that would come over tot he good side like the tokra. that would be pretty cool. I am sure there would be rogue aspects in the wraith society.
                              Maybe the Atlatis team could design a drug using the Atlatis computers that would enable them to feed without killing thier prey or no absorb other types of energy instead of living energy, but I dont think that will happen.
                              The friendly wraith aspect maybe but that woule be problematic after all it would have to feed.
                              If they can't eat anything besides humans that is. If Wraith can suck the life out of...I don't know, rodents or something...they might have an easier time.

                              However, if they could only eat humans..then that would be a problem

                              I'm thinking if they ever have a....eeeer....humane Wraith(s) they should be some how different from the Tok'ra.

                              Maybe could still be our enemies since they still have to feed off of humans, but just...not sadistic.

                              How can the Wraith not be sadistic, by the way? If they feed off of life-force, its not like they can kill the human before hand.

                              Maybe they only eat really old people or possibly take only a few years off instead of all. I mean, how many years do they need to suck to be healthy full?
                              *Insert something really cool here*

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