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GateWorld
November 19th, 2006, 09:52 PM
<DIV ALIGN="center"><TABLE WIDTH="450" BORDER="0" CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="7"><TR><TD STYLE="border:0;"><DIV ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Arial, san-serif" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s3/320.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/graphics/320.jpg" WIDTH="160" HEIGHT="120" ALIGN="right" HSPACE="10" VSPACE="2" BORDER="0" STYLE="border: 1px black solid" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888">ATLANTIS SEASON THREE</FONT>
<FONT SIZE="4"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s3/320.shtml" STYLE="text-decoration: none">FIRST STRIKE</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE="1">EPISODE NUMBER - 320</FONT>
<IMG SRC="/images/clear.gif" WIDTH="1" HEIGHT="10" ALT="">
An unstoppable energy weapon leaves Atlantis under seige after Earth launches a preemptive attack against the Replicator home world.

<FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888"><B><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s3/320.shtml">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE ></A></B>
SPOILERS! PHOTOS! AND MORE!</FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

kiwigater
February 6th, 2007, 01:59 AM
This episode has now aired in Canada, discuss away!

thetron
February 6th, 2007, 03:00 AM
Soft reset indeed

However, The ending had predictable outcome and you launch the city on one ZPM. What would you expect a failure someway after launch and what happens the city is trapped in "Dead-space"

Maybe Atlantis will be come "Stargate: Deep-space Night". Now it's a official space station and i don't see the likeliness of them relocating to a planet

Mckay will have to recalibrate the stargate to be able to dial out. To call for help

Agent_Dark
February 6th, 2007, 03:12 AM
Pretty awesome episode and that is very welcome after the mediocre episodes lately.

So Dr Keller aka Jewel Staite makes her first appearance here. Some people might be happy to know that Carson is mentioned by her and held in high regard by Keller as well. The background on her character so far is that she was just a 'normal' doctor who stepped up to temporarily assume the CMO position. She doesn't feel she's up to the task though, and is asking Weir when the IOA are going to approve a new CMO. Weir seemed to be quite OK with Keller staying in the role and was reassuring Keller that she's up to the task.

Colonel Ellis is a no-nonsense kinda military guy. Kinda similiar to what Colonel Everett was like when he first showed up in Siege pt2. He seems more 'hardline' I suppose than Caldwell does. He's kinda antagonistic towards Weir at the start, but soften up to her towards the end. He also seems to advocate a military leadership of Atlantis, commenting to Sheppard that he (Sheppard) should be in command of Atlantis.

The Apollo is just a Deadalus 304 class ship. Didn't seem to be any different to me. Though I noticed Ellis' badge said "U.S.S. Apollo"... Have they actually used the U.S.S. prefix on the Earth ships before?
Major Lorne is a fighter pilot now? Is that new or had it been mentioned before?

The CG was very cool in this episode. I remember Martin Wood talking about the 1min long, entirely CG scene in those interviews that kicked up the stir a little while back. The scene was where the MIRV was launched from the Apollo to nuke the replicator planet and was simply awesome. The Atlantis at night shots were pretty good too, especially when the "laser" (Dr. Evil quotes there ;)) was impacting the shield.

Not really much of Ronan or Teyla in this episode. Ronan himself said it with his "I need to learn some science", commenting on how he feels useless in this type of scenario. We've had a scene with Ronan trying to teach McKay some hand-to-hand so I wonder if there's gonna be a scene with McKay trying to teach Ronan some science in s4? :D Teyla was very 'serious' this episode... I don't think she smiled once lol. Dire circumstances means no smileys from Teyla ;)
There was some Zelenka in this episode (bad luck to the Shep/McKay slashers... Shep slashes Rodney/Radek...) and a bit of Lorne. Not very much Keller, really only a brief introduction to the character and a little snippet of her in action at the end. There was a fair bit of Ellis.

I'm not really sure what happened to Weir. She was injured at the end of the episode when the "laser" (Dr. Evil quotes again) 'grazed' the control tower as they were flying the city off the planet. She was being lifted onto a stretcher, covered in a blanket and had a neck brace and oxygen mask on when Shep got to the control room. Keller doesn't know if she'll be ok, since "she took quite a fall and her pupils are still sluggish. I'm gonna have to get her under a scanner - I'll know more in a bit". Obviously 'in a bit' is gonna mean the S4 opener....
There was also a fair bit of talk about Weir's command in this ep. Weir herself remarked to Teyla that she felt the IOA have been undermining her command of Atlantis by repeatedly going straight to a military solution to the big, pressing concerns. She even said that she 'may have to resign when this is all over'. Ellis was not coy about informing Shep of his opinion that Shep should be in command of Atlantis, though he did make a kind of peace with Weir when he said that he does respect her even if he may seem like he doesn't lol. I wonder where they're gonna take that in S4?

So Atlantis is adrift in an unknown location in space, with limited power (24 hours) and no way to call for help. I wonder if an 11th hour appearance by a ZPM carrying Odyssey is on the cards for the s4 opener?

Agent_Dark
February 6th, 2007, 03:15 AM
Soft reset indeed

However, The ending had predictable outcome and you launch the city on one ZPM. What would you expect a failure someway after launch and what happens the city is trapped in "Dead-space"

Maybe Atlantis will be come "Stargate: Deep-space Night". Now it's a official space station and i don't see the likeliness of them relocating to a planet

Mckay will have to recalibrate the stargate to be able to dial out. To call for help

Well I doubt that since a) they have a very limited amount of power available (no power means no shield, which means no atmosphere, which means no breathing...) and b) a stargate needs to be on or in orbit around a planet to function. It doesn't work in the middle of deep space.
Both of those were stated by McKay in the ep...

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 03:31 AM
Awesome ****ing finale. Beautiful visuals. The Apollo blowing up tech stuff was awesome. The beam hitting Atlantis was awesome. Atlantis sinking was awesome & Atlantis flying was awesome & the new doctor is hot :cool:

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 03:33 AM
Awesome ep! *SQUEE!* I had chills while watching which I only get from great episodes! Well and open windows, and doors too...
-Sinking the city!
-Flying the city!!!!
-Why do you get to be MR. Fantastic? :lol:
-Ronon admitting he needs to study science, priceless. :D
-Shep telling Mckay and Zelenka to "make out and get it over with." HAHAHA

TheReturnOfTheLantian
February 6th, 2007, 03:37 AM
can any1 please post some screencap's of this best moment's and worst cheer's i would thought alot of people would want to check it out ^^

zer0_1
February 6th, 2007, 03:38 AM
sounds like a cool episode, 5 weeks and it'll air in the uk

is there any caps available?


edit. thanks franklyn blaze, look forward to it :)

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 03:41 AM
Ill try and get a few caps up of the climax of the episode.

Karma
February 6th, 2007, 04:04 AM
I'm certainly no shipper, but Sheppard had to know that the Invisible Woman marries Mr. Fantastic.
Of course, one might argue that McKay makes more sense as Mr. Fantastic than Sheppard. Mr. Fantastic being the crazy scientist guy and all. :D

Still, that was one of the best-written sequences in, well, the history of Atlantis. I loved the way Teyla pointed out that she wasn't invisible.

duckedtapedemon
February 6th, 2007, 04:06 AM
Well I doubt that since a) they have a very limited amount of power available (no power means no shield, which means no atmosphere, which means no breathing...) and b) a stargate needs to be on or in orbit around a planet to function. It doesn't work in the middle of deep space.
Both of those were stated by McKay in the ep...
cough cough midway station / bridge

aAnubiSs
February 6th, 2007, 04:14 AM
72 screencaps on my FTP. Either download them individually or in a rar-file(39MB) no. 43 is a personal fav :)

ftp://gate:[email protected]:3993
http://www.teamswe.se/gateworld/s03e20.rar

rafy
February 6th, 2007, 04:19 AM
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/2143/vlcsnap2782506ed5.png
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Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:20 AM
cough cough midway station / bridge

He said the gate needs to be attenuated in order to function properly.

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 04:25 AM
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/2143/vlcsnap2782506ed5.png
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Thanks for the pics, can't wait to see this, only 8 hrs to go then i can watch it.

fammann
February 6th, 2007, 04:34 AM
Carson is finaly mentioned.

I hope you are all happy now.

aAnubiSs
February 6th, 2007, 04:35 AM
People seem to have problem connecting to the FTP, so I'll upload the pics somewhere else.

http://www.teamswe.se/gateworld/s03e20.rar

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:37 AM
Images are in reverse order. Start at the bottom :)
When photobucket kicks the bucket, and it will, you can download the caps here. (http://www.mediafire.com/?ahjkggmhmml)


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Astrofighter
February 6th, 2007, 04:38 AM
great episode, i think it will bring a lot of people back to the show for season 4 no doubt about it

the cgi sequence of the 'Horizon' had me on the edge of my seat giddy as a school girl

only shame i saw was that they didnt throw in a gfx about the underwater stations cord to the city or the station being destroyed

also...the city has doors...why does it need the shield to keep atmosphere stable? and why cant mckay figure out where they are exactly? hell i could bloody do it, all you have to know is how fast they were going and how long...come on too easy, but im sure thats what he will do within 30 seconds of 401 - Adrift (season opener), also why wasnt the apollo standing by and flying escort?

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:38 AM
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Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:39 AM
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Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:40 AM
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Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:42 AM
Got 10 gigs of bandwidth for these so use it or loose it. :D

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:45 AM
You guys already used a gig. Holy moly I'm not using photobucket anymore, even if they batch upload.

caty
February 6th, 2007, 04:45 AM
Uh, that was possibly one of the best SG-A eps ever! I can't believe how much I loved it!

The 'Fantastic Four' scene and the scene where Shep and McKay come up with the solution and Radek has no idea what they're talking about had me laughing out loud..

A great character ep for Weir... She seemed to be disappointed most of the episode to the point of her thinking about resigning... Disappointed by the IOA, the military and even Sheppard. I really felt sorry for her and Torri did a great job acting it out... I did understand both sides of the argument, though..

The CG was awesome and the 'To be continued' actually not as bad as usual.

quasarsky
February 6th, 2007, 04:48 AM
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quasarsky
February 6th, 2007, 04:48 AM
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Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:49 AM
The clifhanging wasn't as bad this time. It was just cool to see them fly! I kept thinking poor wales they are toast the next time there is a solar flare!

quasarsky
February 6th, 2007, 04:49 AM
sorry i was a bit late, it was awhile to upload all the images. but there's more there :D

http://s28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/quasarsky/sga/

80 screens total :)

aAnubiSs
February 6th, 2007, 04:51 AM
Feel free to download 72 screens from http://www.teamswe.se/gateworld/s03e20.rar

I have unlimited transfers ;)

HyperCaz
February 6th, 2007, 04:52 AM
Could you possiby spoiler cut those pics...they're chewing up my net connection lol...

Ok I can't not start this off with the fangirl report.

FINALLY someone says his name. But...much as I like Jewel Staite...I immediately hated the character beyond reason and wished her dead. She doesn't have the same connection to people that Carson did. I MIGHT just be ranty and upset because it finally sank in lol...but this is probably the last SGA episode I'll ever watch (unless there's some kind of descension/cloning/timte travelling).

...that aside :) I really liked this episode. Highlights include Weir saying "Chuck" (heee) and Rodney saying "eh". Oh and the groovy graphics with the city going under, going over...awesome...loved the idea of the city going wandering about.

Rodney = hero and Radek = sidekick love!! HEE :D

I of course felt indignant upon seeing John in Carson's chair...HA...

...I'm not a lemming, but maybe I should be :D

it would be interesting to see how they get out of this jam, but I find myself strangely not caring anymore o_O

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:53 AM
sorry i was a bit late, it was awhile to upload all the images. but there's more there :D

http://s28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/quasarsky/sga/

80 screens total :)

I see you used bucket too. My BW will be used up soon. How about yours?

quasarsky
February 6th, 2007, 04:55 AM
FINALLY someone says his name. But...much as I like Jewel Staite...I immediately hated the character beyond reason and wished her dead. She doesn't have the same connection to people that Carson did. I MIGHT just be ranty and upset because it finally sank in lol...but this is probably the last SGA episode I'll ever watch (unless there's some kind of descension/cloning/timte travelling).



uh?
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/quasarsky/sga/vlcsnap-6447065.pngwhy hasn't someone in the show edited the opening title out? its from episode 3x20

quasarsky
February 6th, 2007, 04:57 AM
I see you used bucket too. My BW will be used up soon. How about yours?

shows as 3% usage. i guess your photobucket account is like a ZPM :D

aAnubiSs
February 6th, 2007, 04:59 AM
uh?
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/quasarsky/sga/vlcsnap-6447065.pngwhy hasn't someone in the show edited the opening title out? its from episode 3x20
Because the actor probably has billing rights in his contract for 20 episodes this season.

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 04:59 AM
shows as 3% usage. i guess your photobucket account is like a ZPM :D

Ya for some reason there's hordes of replicators sucking all the powah. Well its free powah so I got what I paid for. :)

HyperCaz
February 6th, 2007, 05:04 AM
uh?
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/quasarsky/sga/vlcsnap-6447065.pngwhy hasn't someone in the show edited the opening title out? its from episode 3x20

I meant that finally the taboo of his name being spoken was put aside.

AutumnDream
February 6th, 2007, 05:06 AM
Well. That was impressive, wasn't it? Something interesting actually happened! And it happened with style and loads of nice dialogue. And a new character I like! I think this is the first episode this season that I actually really enjoyed without any hesitation or huge qualms! Let's hope Season 4 can carry the momentum!

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 05:09 AM
I didn't like the cocky military dude, they did that in the siege. Is it me or was that the first Black actor playing a Black earth military commander on stargate? About time!

HyperCaz
February 6th, 2007, 05:11 AM
I was amused by Teyla saying "I'm not invisible" (or something like that lol)...oh the irony... *chuckles to self* Fantastic 4 ;) hehe liked the reference.

the new military dude just felt like a black version of Caldwell. Even had the same UST with Weir ;) but I like him. Hope to see him a bit more.

Raj_2006
February 6th, 2007, 05:15 AM
thank you guys for the screen caps they are awesome :D

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 05:16 AM
I am about to upload a bunch of gifs now & I will make a new thread so they do not hog this one. Give me a few minutes :cool:

AmaterazuSan
February 6th, 2007, 05:21 AM
Took some screencaps and uploaded them to my domain..

http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/
http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/sga320caps.rar

Enjoy.

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 05:29 AM
Took some screencaps and uploaded them to my domain..

http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/
http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/sga320caps.rar

Enjoy.

SOME!? 480 is not some, thats the whole bloody episode. :lol:

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 05:36 AM
My gif thread is up ;)

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 05:38 AM
Took some screencaps and uploaded them to my domain..

http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/
http://n3rdyshare.org/caps/sga320caps.rar

Enjoy.

Quite a few there lol

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 05:39 AM
Quite a few there lol

I dare you to go see my gif thread they beat stills :cool:

huntress
February 6th, 2007, 05:40 AM
I think what detox is saying is that we ought be more constructive in our criticism of what we perceive to be the show's, or alternatively, the writer's errors. Saying an episode is 'crap' just because the story hasn't gone as we wanted isn't fair on TPTB (who are hard-working professionals, by the way).

Really? Are you sure.? Let's see Ken Cuperus who gave us the loathsome "Sunday" and is also in charge of "First Strike" wrote shows like:

Bigfoot Presents: Meteor and the Mighty Monster Trucks
Beyblade: The Movie - Fierce Battle
The Doodlebops
Marvin the Tap-Dancing Horse
Maggie and the Ferocious Beast

If you don't believe me you can look him up yourself.

Now tell me why do I feel like crying and wonder what the bloody hell Brad Cooper and Steven Wright were thinking to get a writer like THAT for the show. I think they hate us and Atlantis. That is my only logical assumption.


We need to be more appreciative of the work TPTB do, at least for the sake of the show. Try to look on the bright side a bit more. Even Irresponsible, which wasn't exactly my favourite episode, had some good parts.

Wow you are really optimistic. I wish I could say the same thing about myself but no I am not appreciative when third and fourth class writer dismember a show that I loved very much and "Irresponsible" was the worst television episode I have seen in years (ever since Fight Club in The X-Files....I think even that terrible episode was better)

AmaterazuSan
February 6th, 2007, 05:42 AM
SOME!? 480 is not some, thats the whole bloody episode. :lol:
Yea that was the point :)

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 05:43 AM
I dare you to go see my gif thread they beat stills :cool:

trying to load it now but the computers here at work are slow. :(

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 05:44 AM
trying to load it now but the computers here at work are slow. :(

Its worth it ;)

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 05:47 AM
Yea that was the point :)

A slide show would have been nice :D

GateLadyM
February 6th, 2007, 05:48 AM
I admit I haven't seen this yet, but with all the cast changes (done, and yet to come), and "resets" is this show changing its name from "Stargate-Atlantis" to "Deep Space Atlantis"?

Sure sounds like season 4 will be a totally different show, and I'm not sure all the changes are going to be an improvement.

female Wraith
February 6th, 2007, 05:49 AM
What amazing episode! Real clifhanger!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My fate in SGA returned after watching First Strike. I wonder where is Atlantis now?? In a Wraith teritory??
Weir was great!
The new doctor also left very good impression.

But ...the Collonel What was his name, the commander of Appolo was complete ass! He sucks! What was his character? A recycle version of Captain Sisko from DS9??? What a total looser. First speaking with Sheppard that he must be in charge of Atlantis and after that goes and begins to tell how much he appreciate Weir?!?! I hope the Asurans will blow up his ship.

I really hope Atlantis will be separate from Earth for a long time. With such military commanders like this one - the captain of Appolo - I seriously doubt there will be any use of them.

And why they were so sure the Asurans are building the Fleet to attack Earth?? In the same way they could speculate that the Asurans will attack the Wraith.

And when the damage was done Atlantis was left to survive or actually was left to death.

Anyway the episode was great!

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 05:51 AM
Its worth it ;)

Nice gifs can't wait to watch this, i will be watching it later tonight once i have taken my girlfriend home (non stargate fan).

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 05:54 AM
Nice gifs can't wait to watch this

It was a great episode I am definitely watching it again later once SG-1 airs & is released. At least now there is one less thing for the fans to whine about when it comes to Atlantis seeing it fly.

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 05:56 AM
It was a great episode I am definitely watching it again later once SG-1 airs & is released. At least now there is one less thing for the fans to whine about when it comes to Atlantis seeing it fly.

Thats true, and I will be watching SG1 1st then Atlantis.

sgeureka
February 6th, 2007, 05:56 AM
A lot of talking. A lot of CGI. All in all a good episode, but it only started to get interesting after two thirds.

Good:

- They're having new uniforms, similar to the on-base uniforms on SG-1, only black and dark grey here, with flag patches on their sleeves.
- The Apollo captain (Ellis) never came across like a jerk. Very good. Much better IMO than Caldwell and the colonel from The Siege.
- Yay Dr. Weir for mirroring Ellis' speech about who's right.
- The rocket thingie CGI sequence was long long long and wouldn't stop.
- The German flag upside down - again. That makes it, what, the third (edit: fourth) episode this season? Somebody should get fired. :)
- Good scene between Weir and Teyla in Weir's office shortly before the end. Knowing the capacity Weir will *not* be in in S4, the I-may-have-to-step-down speech suddenly didn't fall flat.
- The only real good character moment I thought was the Fantastic Four moment. Funny and embarrassing.
- Zelenka having an O'Neill moment and having no clue that he just came up with the ultimate solution/suggestion.
- Lorne in the F-302.
- Atlantis is leaving this planet... :) But what about the Athosians? Did I miss something?
- Very good introduction for the Dr. Keller character. Not too little, not too in-your-face. I want to keep her.

Good quotes:

Apollo captain: Dr. McKay is ready to beam.
McKay: Well, he is not, actually... *gets beamed off*

McKay: We're in trouble.
Sheppard: Five minutes to figure that out? You're slipping, buddy.

Sheppard: That's why we're a team. Like the Fantastic Four. [Teyla and Ronan are like *huh?*] It's a comic book. Where superheroes fight crime and stuff? Yeah, see, I would be Mr. Fantastic, Ronon would be the Thing, McKay would be the Human Torch, and you [Teyla] would be the Invisible woman.
Teyla: I'm not invisible.
Sheppard: No. No, and McKay is not a human torch.
Teyla: How come you would be Mr. Fantastic?
Sheppard: Because he is the leader, and I am... They were a cool team, and we're a cool team, and they use their strength to, you know... [no reaction from Teyla and Ronon] I'm gonna check on McKay.

My favorite CGI shots:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_26.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_27.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_48.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_49.jpg

silence
February 6th, 2007, 06:04 AM
Lot's of CGI (beautiful) ... but other then that?
Pretty weak ... after being impressed by CGI and cooling off, there isn't that much in this ep. Cliffhanger? Not really ... whole ep was about not having enough time to do what they needed and 24 hours till shields fail was like rehashing rehashed part of same ep ....


Quick question - drilling platform gave them enough power to supplement TWO ZPMs, but they didn't think of using that power for shields?

Sorry, but that was part when all CGI just didn't work anymore ... at least for me.

silence
February 6th, 2007, 06:07 AM
Drilling platform gave them enough power to supplement 2 ZPMs so that city can fly and yet noone even thought to use it to boost shields?
Why not use drilling platform for shields when they submerged?

(i know, TPTB wanted "soft reset")

Dunno ...

FoolishPleasure
February 6th, 2007, 06:11 AM
So, now with all the "Fantastic Four" convo, and with only Sheppard's team now being regs, does this mean the title of this show becomes, "Deep Space Atlantis - Shep's Team"? Why call it Stargate-Atlantis when the writers only concentrate on a team that goes off-world (like Stargate - SG1). I kinda like the science POV, and concentrating on our guerrilla team brings only the military side. Seems the science is being pushed to the background now, for more shoot-em-ups and battles. I'd rather see the exploration side, but TPTB never seemed to get a grasp on that. They don't seem to think an episode is interesting without an explosion or gunfight or damsel in distress. :rolleyes:

Plus, going by SG1 canon, stargates cannot work in space as they need a point of origin (i.e., stable planet or ship in orbit), therefore, the stargate on Atlantis shouldn't be able to work with them bobbing around in the middle of nowhere - there is no way to establish a solid point of origin. My science may be iffy on this though.

IndianaJones00
February 6th, 2007, 06:16 AM
I was wondering the exact same thing, they have made it clear in the past that they need 3 zpm's to fly the city yet they managed it with the drilling platform and a single (almost depleted) zpm :confused:

redrama9
February 6th, 2007, 06:16 AM
i think that you would have to assume that the asurans can defend themselves against the energy wave. The ori are able to as seen in counterstrike where adria is unaffected by the disrupter technology becuase of her pendant. i think it would be very foolish to assume that you could go to the planet and wipe out an advanced race with technology they alreeady know about.

Even if thats not true are you saying that the asurans should sue the same technolgy against Atlantis and use the energy weapon to kill living cells so they can have atlantis?

There would be no show

silence
February 6th, 2007, 06:21 AM
Which would suggest that platform can give more power then single ZPM, thus letting them enjoy Asuran firework for pretty long time ...

KRiZ
February 6th, 2007, 06:23 AM
Brilliant finish, i want season 4!!

The stargate only needs to be stationary to be useable, the PoO can be determined by auto update, or a forced update, like hinted at in avenger, by ba'al and the whole midway station idea.

Atlantis wont stay in space tho, they'd need to find too much power for the shields from somewhere...

Franklyn Blaze
February 6th, 2007, 06:27 AM
But ...the Collonel What was his name, the commander of Appolo was complete ass! He sucks! What was his character? A recycle version of Captain Sisko from DS9??? What a total looser. First speaking with Sheppard that he must be in charge of Atlantis and after that goes and begins to tell how much he appreciate Weir?!?! I hope the Asurans will blow up his ship.



You're comparing colonel whatshisname to Avery brooks? They aren't even in the same league. How can the lead of a ST series compare to a guest star who may or may not be a red shirt in the series 4 opener. Oy vey!

silence
February 6th, 2007, 06:27 AM
So, now with all the "Fantastic Four" convo, and with only Sheppard's team now being regs, does this mean the title of this show becomes, "Deep Space Atlantis - Shep's Team"? Why call it Stargate-Atlantis when the writers only concentrate on a team that goes off-world (like Stargate - SG1). I kinda like the science POV, and concentrating on our guerrilla team brings only the military side. Seems the science is being pushed to the background now, for more shoot-em-ups and battles. I'd rather see the exploration side, but TPTB never seemed to get a grasp on that. They don't seem to think an episode is interesting without an explosion or gunfight or damsel in distress. :rolleyes:

Plus, going by SG1 canon, stargates cannot work in space as they need a point of origin (i.e., stable planet or ship in orbit), therefore, the stargate on Atlantis shouldn't be able to work with them bobbing around in the middle of nowhere - there is no way to establish a solid point of origin. My science may be iffy on this though.

After being REALLY impressed by CGI (it's impossible not to be), i started to think about this ep and if you remove fantastic CGI, there isn't much there ...
Now we also know why Weir won't be around for large part of S4 ... ok, new doctor isn't secure about being CMO, but why did they change doctors at all?

I am getting confused with all these changes.

Personally, i think this was last episode of Stargate:Atlantis ... whatever we will watch next year under that name will be completely new show ... new direction, changed cast .. even new planet as base ...


And don't get me started on power issue ...

g.o.d
February 6th, 2007, 06:31 AM
nice CGI.But I have bad feeling that TPTB spent the the most of time making CG.The rest...imho boring a predictable

I was hoping they will destroy Asurans once and for all and will head back to Wraith stories.Unfortunately, it didn't happen

IWKYZerocool
February 6th, 2007, 06:34 AM
how the hell did they get the power from the power station to Atlantis.

Linzi
February 6th, 2007, 06:36 AM
I absolutely loved this episode! It was everything I'd hoped for and more!
I'm thrilled with the soft reset and now can't wait for season 4!
Bits I enjoyed:
The Fantastic Four reference was so funny and so sweet. Joe and Rachel played their parts to perfection. Great character moments between the three team members!!! Rodney as the human torch...:lol:
Woo hoo. Shep flying the city! Wow! It just took my breath away... Shep was so wonderful in those scenes, the CGI fantastic, as was the nuclear attack on the Asuran homeworld.
Loved that Zelenka didn't know what Shep and McKay were doing when they thought of their plan, and later loved the little self-satisfied grin on Sheppard's face when Weir said that the two of them had come up with an igenious plan! :lol:
The wonderful Chuck has a name - Chuck. He'll be so pleased they left that piece of the footage intact. (It was a mistake that Torri made when they fiilmed we learned at P2). Chuck? You do have a name!!!!! Woo hoo!
Ok, new characters:
Jewel Staite's Dr Keller - loved her. I'm surprised I did, but, honestly, I thought she was great. My fears have been allayed. She isn't meant to be CMO, she's just filling in for Carson, and says she's not experienced enough etc. She does look older than her years though, so I don't have a problem with her at all. She was extremely professional and I can see her as Atlantis' new doctor. Thumbs up from me.
Col. Ellis - fantastic. Really realistic military man who actually respects Sheppard. Very profesional, not a jerk, and totally not like Caldwell. He even called Sheppard 'John', and thought Sheppard should be in charge! Loved him. Professional yet warm too. So he gets the thumbs up too!!!
Very exciting stuff.
I'm theorising Weir had some sort of head injury requiring an operation in the new season. I also thought it was a good send off. Weir said she wanted to resign, or was tempted to, and honestly, I think she's gone from the series now. Maybe she'll be back now and then, but her time is limited, IMO. It was sort of a full circle episode for her, IMO.
Great special effects. Some lovely Shep/McKay interaction.
Loved it when Shep said McKay and Zelenka should make out!
I suspect Atlantis will be militarised now, and surprisingly, after seeing this episode, I'm all for it. (Previously I've never really wanted it, even though it was unrealistic considering the potential threats to Earth).
Well, if this is what season 4 is going to be like, I'm thrilled. Yes, it's a soft reset, but if it continues like this, well I'm sure it will be wonderful. I'm excited now!!!
Sometimes change is a good thing. I was sceptical, won't deny it. But, for me, here, it certainly was a good thing. I'm converted. Roll on season 4.
Well done to Martin Gero for writing such an awesome eppie, to all the cast for their great performances, MW for the wonderful direction etc.
This episode totally blew me away. 10/10.

huntress
February 6th, 2007, 06:42 AM
Martin Gero wrote Sunday. Cuperus wrote Common Ground, The Arc, and Submersion.
That is true but Cuperus was story editor for Sunday, First strike, Vengence and The Ark (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0192551/ ). The fact that Gero wrote Sunday and First Strike doesn't make it better because that and SG-1 are his only writing credits.

I saw the season finale. I admit, they used really pretty and shiny effects but the story itself was weak to say the least. I don't like the fact that the science is pushed back in favour of the military...well at least we now know why there won't be much of Elizabeth around. I like Jewel. I really do. Her Kaylee is adorable but as far as I could see there is no chemistry between her and the crew but it might (or might not) get better. She won't have that many chances to proove herslf in the future the way it looks. I guess gating won't be an option anymore since the Gates don't work in outer space anymore. I don't know in which direction the show is heading and frankly I don't care. This was the last SGA episode for me :shrugs shoulders:

IndianaJones00
February 6th, 2007, 06:52 AM
how the hell did they get the power from the power station to Atlantis.

They said there was an umbilicale that would break and pretty much total the drilling station.

Also, I might have missed it but did the Apollo definitely head back to Earth or was it still nearby? because if it was still around then I would have used the Apollo to get to a planet with a stargate, use the intergalactic gate network to get back to Earth, get the ZPM's and take them back to Atlantis.

caty
February 6th, 2007, 06:56 AM
Really? Are you sure.? Let's see Ken Cuperus who gave us the loathsome "Sunday" and is also in charge of "First Strike" wrote shows like:

Bigfoot Presents: Meteor and the Mighty Monster Trucks
Beyblade: The Movie - Fierce Battle
The Doodlebops
Marvin the Tap-Dancing Horse
Maggie and the Ferocious Beast

If you don't believe me you can look him up yourself.

Now tell me why do I feel like crying and wonder what the bloody hell Brad Cooper and Steven Wright were thinking to get a writer like THAT for the show. I think they hate us and Atlantis. That is my only logical assumption.


There's nothing logical in your post ;)

As someone else has mentioned, Ken has written CG, The Ark and Submersion. Some of the best eps this season. CG was THE BEST ep to me...

And what someone has done in the past has nothing to do as to how good/bad they are right now.

'Frist Strike' also seems to be a very liked episode ;)

GateMan2000
February 6th, 2007, 06:57 AM
My guess is that they will drop off a ZPM.

StayingOccupied
February 6th, 2007, 06:57 AM
I liked this episode a lot. The beginning was great. I loved the horizon platform, though it looked a bit easy to destroy all the nukes at once if somebody isnt surprised by us being there. I thought Jewel did great, the little time she was there. She looked good too. Cant wait for the new season.

sgeureka
February 6th, 2007, 07:00 AM
Huntress, I can see where you're coming from with the rest of your post, I even agree in some points, but I need to get some facts straight.


That is true but Cuperus was story editor for Sunday, First strike, Vengence and The Ark (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0192551/ ). The fact that Gero wrote Sunday and First Strike doesn't make it better because that and SG-1 are his only writing credits.Gero does have more writing credits than that (see imdb - and what? He's Swiss? :D). And seeing that he's only four years older than me, and I haven't even finished my education, he sure has had some achievements. (If you think most of that has been terrible, which of course you can, then one could say he's still learning.)


I like Jewel. I really do. Her Kaylee is adorable but as far as I could see there is no chemistry between her and the crew but it might (or might not) get better. She won't have that many chances to proove herslf in the future the way it looks.Since she's only shared a scene with Weir, and another short scene with Sheppard, it should be quite obvious that she doesn't have chemistry with the other cast. Yet. How could she?

Linzi
February 6th, 2007, 07:02 AM
There's nothing logical in your post ;)

As someone else has mentioned, Ken has written CG, The Ark and Submersion. Some of the best eps this season. CG was THE BEST ep to me...

And what someone has done in the past has nothing to do as to how good/bad they are right now.

'Frist Strike' also seems to be a very liked episode ;)
Agreed. Ken C is story editor on SG1 too. The writing is very much a collaboration of ideas. I've liked all of Ken's episodes, personally.
I thought First Strike was wonderful, really. I'm surprised the reset was as good as it was, to be honest. But, I'm thrilled.

Lightbane
February 6th, 2007, 07:33 AM
A lot of talking. A lot of CGI. All in all a good episode, but it only started to get interesting after two thirds.

Good:

- They're having new uniforms, similar to the on-base uniforms on SG-1, only black and dark grey here, with flag patches on their sleeves.
- The Apollo captain (Ellis) never came across like a jerk. Very good. Much better IMO than Caldwell and the colonel from The Siege.
- Yay Dr. Weir for mirroring Ellis' speech about who's right.
- The rocket thingie CGI sequence was long long long and wouldn't stop.
- The German flag upside down - again. That makes it, what, the third episode this season? Somebody should get fired. :)
- Good scene between Weir and Teyla in Weir's office shortly before the end. Knowing the capacity Weir will *not* be in in S4, the I-may-have-to-step-down speech suddenly didn't fall flat.
- The only real good character moment I thought was the Fantastic Four moment. Funny and embarrassing.
- Zelenka having an O'Neill moment and having no clue that he just came up with the ultimate solution/suggestion.
- Lorne in the F-302.
- Atlantis is leaving this planet... :) But what about the Athosians? Did I miss something?
- Very good introduction for the Dr. Keller character. Not too little, not too in-your-face. I want to keep her.

Good quotes:

Apollo captain: Dr. McKay is ready to beam.
McKay: Well, he is not, actually... *gets beammed off*

McKay: We're in trouble.
Sheppard: Five minutes to figure that out? You're slipping, buddy.

Sheppard: That's why we're a team. Like the Fantastic Four. [Teyla and Ronan are like *huh?*] It's a comic book. Where superheroes fight crime and stuff? Yeah, see, I would be Mr. Fantastic, Ronon would be the Thing, McKay would be the Human Torch, and you [Teyla] would be the Invisible woman.
Teyla: I'm not invisible.
Sheppard: No. No, and McKay is not a human torch.
Teyla: How come you would be Mr. Fantastic?
Sheppard: Because he is the leader, and I am... They were a cool team, and we're a cool team, and they use their strength to, you know... [no reaction from Teyla and Ronon] I'm gonna check on McKay.

My favorite CGI shots:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_26.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_27.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_48.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_49.jpg

I was going to make a long post on how absoutely brillant this entire episode was but your post summed up pretty much everything that was good about that episode, the fantastic four comments have gotta go into the funniest stargate quotes thread, the crack at Teyla being the invisble woman was funny seeing as she does seem to be quite invisible in most eps

Rodney will find some way of saving atlantis, maybe it will be Anicents appearing out of nowhere to then be red shirts and get killed. Or the Odsessey will materialise itself with a spare ZPM.

By the end of episode 3 the new Atlantis commander Colonel Sheppard will have contacted Earth and 'soft reset' all that happened in the last 3 episodes would have been forgotten.

TheReturnOfTheLantian
February 6th, 2007, 07:34 AM
NOOOOOOoooooOOOOOO what they done with out sexeh city :(

ata_beckett
February 6th, 2007, 08:20 AM
I'm in AWE.

FANTASTIC episode.

The beginning bugged me a bit-- I felt almost like they were shoving two new characters in our faces too quickly, but that was probably my only gripe with the episode.

The CG was AMAZING.

I know some people were annoyed by the long shot on the nuke, but I was just...taken aback. Because it's beautiful and it's horrible and ugly all at the same time. That shot was brilliant. It's that same grey line that we've seen pop up again and again-- conveyed completely without dialogue or explanation. BRAVO to whoever came up with that.

And as for the city sinking, then flying? I can't help but think of Rising.

"It's a city, not a yo-yo."

But it IS a yo-yo! HAH!

I'm loving Col. Ellis. He's not annoying me like Caldwell used to, and I think I just love him.

Poor Weeeeiirrrr! Though now I'm wondering if they're gonna put Sheppard in charge of Atlantis.

If you'll excuse me, I'm still slightly incoherent. Because that was AMAZING. More than makes up for what I thought was a slightly sub-par grouping of episodes after "Sunday".

SaberBlade
February 6th, 2007, 08:25 AM
Just finished watching it, and overall I thought it was very enjoyable despite one annoying Stargate issue.

When they send the Stargate to the planet, it shouldn't have been able to work. Atlantis has the DHD making it the dominant gate so they should have dialled into Atlantis rather than the standalone gate.

You would think that even if they included a DHD, Atlantis would have still been the dominant address because of their DHD being better than others.

I have to say, I was surprised to see Jewel Straite. I hadn't expected her character to have already been a doctor under Beckett's command but rather someone new brought in.

The CGI was great, must have cost a lot. Ellis was OK, but the moustache has to go. He looked like Montel Williams for a few seconds. I look forward to seeing the conclusion and can't wait to see what happens next.

sailfindragon
February 6th, 2007, 08:40 AM
Really? Are you sure.? Let's see Ken Cuperus who gave us the loathsome "Sunday" and is also in charge of "First Strike" wrote shows like:

Bigfoot Presents: Meteor and the Mighty Monster Trucks
Beyblade: The Movie - Fierce Battle
The Doodlebops
Marvin the Tap-Dancing Horse
Maggie and the Ferocious Beast

If you don't believe me you can look him up yourself.

Now tell me why do I feel like crying and wonder what the bloody hell Brad Cooper and Steven Wright were thinking to get a writer like THAT for the show. I think they hate us and Atlantis. That is my only logical assumption.



Wow you are really optimistic. I wish I could say the same thing about myself but no I am not appreciative when third and fourth class writer dismember a show that I loved very much and "Irresponsible" was the worst television episode I have seen in years (ever since Fight Club in The X-Files....I think even that terrible episode was better)


If you are going to bad mouth the executive producers of the show for their choice in writers, you should at least get there names right....It is Brad Wright & Robert C. Cooper.
You cannot judge a writer based on a couple of episodes you didn't like or on his passed experience. Everyone has to start somewhere. Plus, you could say the same for every writer of ANY TV show. They all have made some bad episodes they have written at sometime in there life, it doesn't necessarily make them 3rd or 4th class writers......just human like the rest of us.

I personally loved this episode, it is one of the better ones this season. I even like "Sunday" even though it was the episode that killed Carson.
If you do not like the direction the show is going or the writers, there is a solution to that...............Don't watch it.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 10:25 AM
Uh, well......


I just saw all of the caps, and I must say that this is the fastest time I have seen such an extreme quality and quantity of screencaps.

Compared with seeing the end of SG-1 Season 9 last year, and from just the screencaps alone for "First Strike", I just have this cold, silent feeling at the sight of Atlantis in space after being attacked.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 10:46 AM
107 people viewing this thread... anyone else going to post?

--------------
134 now??!!! Everyone's probably still stunned from what has happened.

Freek
February 6th, 2007, 10:55 AM
Must say this episode was pretty amazing... but like the Shroud did, this episode left a very rushed impression on me. Pretty good nonetheless, but conversations, action, character developments etc. all come across as very short to me. This may just be because this episode was so damned exiting!

So, I think it would be interesting to see how this "lost in space" thing develops. IMO this leaves two possibilities:

1. Rodney figures out how to dial out the stargate AND finds a power source to keep the shield up
2. Rodney figures out how to dial out the stargate AND finds an alternate way (beside the shields) to keep the atmosphere.
3. Rodney figures out how to get the city to enter hyperspace again, and they return to >some< planet.

Mio
February 6th, 2007, 10:55 AM
Wow. That was, amazing....

Up down, up down, up down? What happened the city not being a yo-yo, McKay? In any case, The CG was among the best we've seen yet. The city going up and down was beautiful. The VFX guys do amazing work.

Now we have to wait 5 months......

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 10:57 AM
Wow. That was, amazing....

Up down, up down, up down? What happened the city not being a yo-yo, McKay? In any case, The CG was among the best we've seen yet. The city going up and down was beautiful. The VFX guys do amazing work.

Now we have to wait 5 months......

Perhaps even 5 1/2.

xfkirsten
February 6th, 2007, 10:58 AM
Gotta say, this episode was fan-freakin'-tastic.

I did love Jewel's character, from what I saw of her. I thought she did look much older, which was important for her position. I like that she didn't feel she was ready for the position, and that she was anxious for someone else to take over - it's not like she's coming in with any sort of "I deserve this position" attitude. :) And to be honest, her discussion with Dr. Weir at the start was kind of cute.

On a side note, after she pleaded with Weir to find someone else for the job, anyone else find it interesting that she may be the one to save Weir's life after that? :)

Not a fan of Col. Ellis. Why? He seems like just another rehash of Col. Everett, right down to the "later gives in and suddenly respects Weir so much" routine. Couldn't they find a new way to antagonize the Atlantis team? The hard-ass colonel routine is getting old.

Some awesome dialogue in this one. I loved the whole Fantastic Four conversation - that was absolutely hilarious! And Sheppard's comment to McKay and Zelenka: "Why don't you guys just make out and get it over with!" Love it! :D

I loved that they left us with a more unique dilemma at the end. Not just another "oh, noes, we're about to be blown up for the eleventy bajillionth time!11!1" Our city is lost in the middle of nowhere in space with only enough power for 24 hours! Pretty creative, really.

As far as the Weir storyline goes, I was kinda disappointed at where they left it. We know that she'd taken the fall and seemed to be hurt pretty bad, but there was no hint at all as to what her future is going to be. Season 4 in a coma? A slow recovery? Not-a-death? She'll be okay but needs to recover? It was left a bit too open for me, and didn't really leave much of a sense of drama about it.

And I can't forget the CGI here. Hats off to Rainmaker for some spectacular effects here. Every one of them was gorgeous!

All in all, one of the better episodes they've done to date. Being a big Weir fan, I certainly have my doubts about next season, but I'm definitely willing to go along with it and see where they take this storyline. Bring on Season 4!

sgeureka
February 6th, 2007, 11:02 AM
107 people viewing this thread... anyone else going to post?

--------------
134 now??!!! Everyone's probably still stunned from what has happened.Well, most about this episode has been said. Great CGI (with enough high quality screen shots in this thread), a lot of talking in the usual sets to get the point/plot across, a little of Dr. Keller, and the Fantastic Four scene. What else is there? :)

I'm gonna post some more low-res screen shots from mostly early in the episode without CGI.


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_00.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_01.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_02.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_03.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_04.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_05.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_06.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_07.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_08.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_09.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_10.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_19.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_20.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_25.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_32.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_33.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_34.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_36.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g36/sgeureka/sga_eps/sga_320_57.jpg

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:02 AM
I'd be greening everyone who was kind enough to take all of these amazing screencaps, but I still have to wait until the system will allow me to do it again. I happened to notice that the stargate in the satellite only had 8 chevrons, just like the ones at the midway station. Has anyone noticed this as well???

Killdeer
February 6th, 2007, 11:03 AM
Is it me or was that the first Black actor playing a Black earth military commander on stargate? About time!

General Vidrine, who appeared on SG-1, was black.

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:03 AM
Oh, fun. Season four will be "Atlantis: Lost in Space/SG1". I can hardly contain my joy.

The good:

Awesome CGI, yes.

Teyla's "I am not invisible" comment.

Sheppard's "Oh, why don't you two just make out and get it over with" comment and Radek's face afterwards.

Elizabeth trying to negotiate but, being the savvy negotiator that she is, realizing immediately that it's not working.

Rodney's deference to Elizabeth when the new Colonel tells him to "get to it."

Sheppard's "Then I'd be the man and who would I rage against?" (though slightly TOO reminiscent of Jack's "I've been sticking it to 'the Man' all my life...." comments in Season 8 of SGA.)

Again, lots of good character moments here.

Jewel Staite looked at least 24, instead of 20. (Though comments on this thread about her "hawtness" have already proven previous claims as to which head TPTB were thinking with when they decided to dump PM for her.)

Military gungho rushing in and creating a far larger problem than there was to begin with.

The Bad:

Lots of good character moments do not a coherent plot make. I think the actual plot in this show took about 10 minutes. New Colonel runs roughshod over Elizabeth. Nukes the Asurans. Weapon shows up, sink the city. The oh-so-conveniently-discovered drilling platform reveals the reason for its existence, and is used up and discarded, just like all the other plot devices aka Ancient ships, Hive ships, and so on. Fly the asteroid, jump the city, oh, noes! City is now "Lost in Space!" Okay, fine, fifteen minutes. The rest was filler--pretty filler, funny filler, but filler.

As was pointed out in a previous post, repetition of way too many themes from previous SG1 episodes. This is the Pegasus Galaxy, isn't it? Couldn't there be some new ideas? New threats?

While I will grant that Jewel played the scene well, can't the SGA writers write a doctor for the show who isn't all "WOES!" and handwringing over being underqualified? They played that note with Carson, and he did a damned good job of it. Retreading it with Jewel was lazy writing.

Nor did Jewel's final scene work. Sorry, flat flat, flat. She still doesn't look old enough to be a CMO, let alone a doctor who's been on the expedition long enough to have the mojo to step up and be a CMO, however temporary.

Elizabeth's "I may have to leave" speech. While I liked her complaints about the military always shoving her aside and never letting a woman actually be in charge when there was danger, it seemed like a huge red flag. Now the obvious solution given the history of writing for this show is bringing Sam in to be in charge because she's a) a woman and b) military.

Oh, and I really wish TPTB would figure out which Jack O'Neill they're writing for SGA. Jack #1 who sent Weir off with a bon voyage and trust in her abilities and who told her "of course you can stay" in Return 2; or Jack #2 who seems to simply be a convenient name to drop every time the writers need to shove Elizabeth aside for some macho military posturing.

All in all, a very pretty episode, again with the nice character moments, but not nearly as good a season ender as the first season, or even "Allies" last season. And the "soft reset" of Atlantis lost in space doesn't work, because it won't work. They can't go anywhere or do anything at this point, being trapped in their city, so it's going to be resolved in the first episode or two of next season and then we'll be right back to Starsky & Hutch, Atlantis style.

Or....

So, now with all the "Fantastic Four" convo, and with only Sheppard's team now being regs, does this mean the title of this show becomes, "Deep Space Atlantis - Shep's Team"? Why call it Stargate-Atlantis when the writers only concentrate on a team that goes off-world (like Stargate - SG1). I kinda like the science POV, and concentrating on our guerrilla team brings only the military side. Seems the science is being pushed to the background now, for more shoot-em-ups and battles. I'd rather see the exploration side, but TPTB never seemed to get a grasp on that. They don't seem to think an episode is interesting without an explosion or gunfight or damsel in distress. :rolleyes:

Word. What you said, totally. I guess we know where they're going with the soft reset now?

I still love these characters, but this is NOT the show I fell in love with first season.

5/10

g.o.d
February 6th, 2007, 11:04 AM
I wonder what happen to Athosians on the mainland...

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:05 AM
also...the city has doors...why does it need the shield to keep atmosphere stable?

What happened to the city that sealed itself up tight in Hot Zone to prevent the spread of the nanovirus? They weren't worried about generating atmosphere in that episode. Everything McKay said about needing the shield for atmosphere can be contradicted by previous episodes.

Lazy writing. Again.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:05 AM
We could eventually see the city get back on the ground, since it cannot stay there indefinetely, unless it had more than one ZPM.

ata_beckett
February 6th, 2007, 11:06 AM
Nor did Jewel's final scene work. Sorry, flat flat, flat. She still doesn't look old enough to be a CMO, let alone a doctor who's been on the expedition long enough to have the mojo to step up and be a CMO, however temporary.


Notice that Weir called her "Chief of Medicine" and not CMO (Chief Medical Officer).

...I wonder if that's somehow different, implying that she doesn't have as much to do with medical research as just the infirmary in general.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:06 AM
I wonder what happen to Athosians on the mainland...

I almost forgot about them! I don't know if they were on the mainland, in the city, or on another planet altogether, given the events of "The Return".

ata_beckett
February 6th, 2007, 11:07 AM
I almost forgot about them! I don't know if they were on the mainland, in the city, or on another planet altogether, given the events of "The Return".

I would assume that they didn't come back to the planet after The Return. Otherwise, they would have at least been mentioned...

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:11 AM
I would assume that they didn't come back to the planet after The Return. Otherwise, they would have at least been mentioned...

They probably would prefer to have their own Stargate for easy access to other worlds. On another point, would the Asurans menace them over their contact with the Atlantis expedition? Has the Asurans main target been only Atlantis so far, or will they branch out and go after other targets?

There is of course, the Wraith, of which the Asurans have been planning to erradicate them.

Trialia
February 6th, 2007, 11:11 AM
Haven't seen the episode in full yet, just the last handful of scenes.

I don't think I even care about seeing it in full, now. My passion over this show is just... drowned. *sighs*

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:16 AM
Feel free to download 72 screens from http://www.teamswe.se/gateworld/s03e20.rar

I have unlimited transfers ;)

There is one screencap that everyone might really really REALLY want to see!

Screencap #42 of this pack stunned me probably even more than the sight of Atlantis adrift!


------------------
Whoo-hoo! 900 Posts!

Phil
February 6th, 2007, 11:16 AM
OMG, I have finished watching it a few minutes from now .. and .. oh, it was FANTASTIC! Everything! Great effects.. city submerging and rising again and flying to space.. oh, crap I love that!

There was allmost everything in this episode! ACTION, CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT and so much more!!!

Old bad-guy Oberoth showing himself again, new colonel, finally a Jewel Staite with a cute blond hair :cameron:

I cant even think of everything what was there right now but I loved that!

And well there's probably a reason why Elizabeth goes reccuring this season... I guess she will be seriously injured (well she actually already is) and it's possible she will return to Earth for the fourth season. And Sheppard will be probably in command of Atlantis. Yeah I can see that .. the last eps. of s4 ... Elizabeth: I am back and taking over the control of Atlantis again! :cool:

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:20 AM
OMG, I have finished watching it a few minutes from now .. and .. oh, it was FANTASTIC! Everything! Great effects.. city submerging and rising again and flying to space.. oh, crap I love that!

There was allmost everything in this episode! ACTION, CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT and so much more!!!

Old bad-guy Oberoth showing himself again, new colonel, finally a Jewel Staite with a cute blond hair :cameron:

I cant even think of everything what was there right now but I loved that!

And well there's probably a reason why Elizabeth goes reccuring this season... I guess she will be seriously injured (well she actually already is) and it's possible she will return to Earth for the fourth season. And Sheppard will be probably in command of Atlantis. Yeah I can see that .. the last eps. of s4 ... Elizabeth: I am back and taking over the control of Atlantis again! :cool:

I wouldn't mind Sheppard being in command of the facility. He has excellent experience, and has the respect of the entire expedition.

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:21 AM
Notice that Weir called her "Chief of Medicine" and not CMO (Chief Medical Officer).

...I wonder if that's somehow different, implying that she doesn't have as much to do with medical research as just the infirmary in general.

I would imagine it's just semantics. But there was NO chemistry between her and Weir in that first scene, and while it was short, there was none in that last scene. She didn't sell it, and I don't care how tiny her scene is, as an actor that's her job. There was always chemistry between PM and the rest of the cast, even from the very beginning. But no connection here, no spark. Just a "hawt young thang" for the fanboys who write and run the show to drool over. And if it makes a few fans happy, well goody for them, too. :mckay:

Colonel Eriksen
February 6th, 2007, 11:23 AM
welll Elizabeth is possible goging to die

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:24 AM
welll Elizabeth is possible goging to die

I don't think she will die at all. The fan base would revolt like nothing else.

dispader
February 6th, 2007, 11:25 AM
I would imagine it's just semantics. But there was NO chemistry between her and Weir in that first scene, and while it was short, there was none in that last scene. She didn't sell it, and I don't care how tiny her scene is, as an actor that's her job. There was always chemistry between PM and the rest of the cast, even from the very beginning. But no connection here, no spark. Just a "hawt young thang" for the fanboys who write and run the show to drool over. And if it makes a few fans happy, well goody for them, too. :mckay:

I thought there was plenty chemistry and that she sold it well.

Atlanis
February 6th, 2007, 11:29 AM
About time, three years what am I talking about We saw the city flying

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:30 AM
I thought there was plenty chemistry and that she sold it well.

*checks dispader's profile*

Yup, young male.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:31 AM
About time, three years what am I talking about We saw the city flying

Not just any city ship, but our Atlantis. I still can't shake the cold, silent feeling I got from the sight of Atlantis drifting, with it's shield active. I just feel an aura of trouble around it. Compared with when I saw the Asuran city ship fly, things are much different.

silence
February 6th, 2007, 11:31 AM
I wonder what happen to Athosians on the mainland...

<speaking in TPTB voice>

WHO?????????

</speaking in TPTB voice>


casaulties of war .. or long forgotten ... that's my problem.
awesome CGI got our attention, but when you remove CGI and start thinking if this is shape of thing to come, it leaves bad taste in your mouth ....

they won't be able to cover lousy plots with CGI every time ... i am thinking S4 SGA == S9 SG-1 == blah ...

caty
February 6th, 2007, 11:31 AM
Haven't seen the episode in full yet, just the last handful of scenes.

I don't think I even care about seeing it in full, now. My passion over this show is just... drowned. *sighs*

I understand where you're coming from. I really do...

But do yourself a favor and give this ep a chance, it's a great Weir-episode!!

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:34 AM
<speaking in TPTB voice>

WHO?????????

</speaking in TPTB voice>


casaulties of war .. or long forgotten ... that's my problem.
awesome CGI got our attention, but when you remove CGI and start thinking if this is shape of thing to come, it leaves bad taste in your mouth ....

they won't be able to cover lousy plots with CGI every time ... i am thinking S4 SGA == S9 SG-1 == blah ...

I'd green you, but I'm out for now. So a hearty YES! to everything you're saying here.

ussrelativity
February 6th, 2007, 11:36 AM
The producers do listen to us, as well as the writers, so they know what we are looking for in a good story. Evidence of this is shown in the character-centric episodes. I think that McKay and Sheppard have the best development, so that leaves Ronan, Teyla, and Weir.

I did see something about in the first half of Season 4, that each character will have an episode dedicated towards them.

FoolishPleasure
February 6th, 2007, 11:37 AM
I wonder what happen to Athosians on the mainland...
I wondered that too. One would think Teyla would be all upset about it. . her "people" and all. She should be incredibly frustrated, and the writers should capitalize on it. Maybe the "soft reset" made her forget she was even Athosian. ;)


I wouldn't mind Sheppard being in command of the facility. He has excellent experience, and has the respect of the entire expedition.
Maybe. But some fans don't have respect for him. My husband hasn't watched this show since season 2 because he didn't like Sheppard, and I'm close to it now. I just can't see the unshaven, rumpled clothed, bed headed, Babe Magnet as a military commander. I still know nothing more about Sheppard than I did from the first episode, except he was married. He is the same week after week. Once you get used to the "pretty", its all *Yawn*

Sorry, but incredible CGI and the fact that it was so STUNNING - "OMG, Atlantis flew!" and all, but special effects, dumping regs for hawt new young doctors, and hokey jokes ("make out and get it over with") do not a good episode make. Some of us peons still prefer good, solid writing, and I haven't seen much of that lately.

Celcool
February 6th, 2007, 11:47 AM
This episode was pretty good I guess. Lots of Elizabeth, Torri did a marvelous job once again. Also loved Rodney, Radek, John in this one. Don't care much for the explosions, the visual, I see lots of folks are interested in that. Okay, I liked seeing the city being submerged and flying but that's about it. I prefer seeing the characters interact than things exploding. But that's just me. What else? Yes, I'm not the biggest fan of the new doctor and colonel yet, I doubt I'll ever be. Thanks to Elizabeth, Chuck now has a name! :D That was nice. Also loved McKay saying "I don't think that's your call" to the new colonel and looking at Elizabeth to give permission to continue with the plan. :)

And a final note to say that seeing what happened to Elizabeth and not knowing what "recurring" means for Torri, I can't say that I'm looking forward to the continuation...

Stoko
February 6th, 2007, 05:11 PM
Not just any city ship, but our Atlantis. I still can't shake the cold, silent feeling I got from the sight of Atlantis drifting, with it's shield active. I just feel an aura of trouble around it. Compared with when I saw the Asuran city ship fly, things are much different.
Could that be because the Asuran city ship flew with the central spire facing forwards, rather than vertically? :P

I loved it, thought it was an excellent epsiode. And what was up with the Asurans having a custom Stargate, eh? 8 chevrons instead of 9, coloured white instead of blue, using embossed symbols instead of lit dots? Looked cool.

ToasterOnFire
February 6th, 2007, 05:19 PM
I thought it was a decent way to end the season. The story was fast-paced, the CGI was great, the new characters were introduced well, and the ending set up some interesting problems outside of “Oh noes, the wraith/Asurans are going to get to Earth!” used in the last two finales. Finally, a season finale that makes me look forward to the resolution next season!


-Okay, the Atlantis shield has the worst design flaw ever. :S The control room, the most important area of the city hands-down, is the LAST section of the city to be covered when the shield is activated? Man, that's dumb.

-I thought it was a nice introduction to the new doc - she wasn't arrogant or bratty or coy or immediately placed with any of the male cast. I'm looking forward to more from her.

-The new col. was an okay character, it was nice to see a military man that disagreed with Weir but didn't come across like a total arrogant ass like Sumner and Everett. Not so sure why we had to have a new character do this instead of Caldwell though.

-I really enjoyed all the conflict in this ep - I think Atlantis has been sorely lacking disagreements. So I liked seeing the new col. override Weir, Weir later overriding the new col., and Weir and Shep finally disagreeing over a plan. I was tired of seeing everyone agree with each other all the time and any conflicts brushed under the rug. It may set up a feeling of "team" but it rang false with me.

-Not so sure why Weir is all gung-ho about negotiating with the Asurans now when she was peachy keen with implementing a virus on them earlier in the season. I know she's the main negotiator and therefore in TPTB's mind she must default to "negotiate" instead of "fight" but I don't think the circumstances were set up well.

-Hmmm…scenes in this ep point to Weir either being severely injured next season, stepping down or losing command of Atlantis, or both.

-McKay had a great line with Weir and "coming full circle" when they resubmerged the city. A nice moment, and possibly an indicator that TPTB is stepping away from the story told in s1-3 and starting with new stories in s4. Whether this is a good thing or bad will remain to be seen.

-Shep's comment about McKay and Zelenka making out felt out of place, obvious nod to slashers aside.

-"I am not invisible." Oh my poor Teyla, TPTB obviously think differently. :(

-Along those lines, Ronon's comments about having nothing to do almost felt like a confession from TPTB. "He's rough and tough, but when science rolls around we can't think of anything for him to do. So let's have him comment about it on it in the show! Oh, the irony!!"

-Nice Teyla/Weir scene in Weir's office, especially since it dealt with leadership, the major thing both women have in common, and it was nice to see Weir show her worries and Teyla try to remove them.

-Is that a new black button-up shirt for McKay? I like! :D

coolove
February 6th, 2007, 06:10 PM
I enjoyed this episode more then I thought I would. It was a nice pace though I would have loved to have seen more of Ronan and Teyla and I think Jewel makes an excellent addition to the show. I can't wait for season 4.

LoveConquers
February 6th, 2007, 06:17 PM
I wondered that too. One would think Teyla would be all upset about it. . her "people" and all. She should be incredibly frustrated, and the writers should capitalize on it. Maybe the "soft reset" made her forget she was even Athosian. ;)



Well, her people are tucked safely away on New Athos and are doing just fine . She has nothing to worry about other than being able to contact them with her new location once she herself and the city are safe. I think it's safe to assume letting them know the city is flying thorugh space isn't as foremost in her mind as their basic survivial would be. And besides, they can't dial the gate. What exactly is she supposed to do? Logic assumes she will contact them once they are safe and once she is able.

Trialia
February 6th, 2007, 06:18 PM
I don't think she will die at all. The fan base would revolt like nothing else.
*coughs* I think we already are. Some of us, anyway. I think I just lost my ability to care about this show. I'm getting a migraine now I've actually watched the episode, which is exactly what happened after I watched Conversion, but the latter was because I wound up heartsick for Elizabeth because Torri managed to sell the emotional whump of her watching John change like that, etc., so well, not because the character was physically hurt like this.

No, don't tell me I get too involved with the characters I love the most, I already know that. (From crying so hard I gave myself a headache the first thirty-seven times I saw the last Matrix movie.)

Lightbane
February 6th, 2007, 06:29 PM
2. Lorne's a pilot, who knew? Nice plan too, with the asteroid.


Well being an Air Force Major you would assume he'd be able to fly just like Sheppard

Trialia
February 6th, 2007, 06:31 PM
Well being an Air Force Major you would assume he'd be able to fly just like Sheppard
Also, we knew from Condemned.

LoveConquers
February 6th, 2007, 06:53 PM
Blargh! That was amazing!! We had the 1-minute CGI scene that Martin Wood promised, and boy, it did NOT disappoint. Joel Goldsmith did a (obviously) phenomenal job with the music as we followed Horizon into the atmosphere and watching it detonate. In fact, going off topic for a moment, there was a LOT of great music cues in this episode. When the f**k are we going to get a freaking soundtrack?!

Back to the SFX. Of course, there was more to this episode than that scene alone. We had the city sinking (with all new CGI), and actually rising again, and flying (still, with a lot of new CGI). The music once again made their mark; we heard the familiar notes of the “Rising theme” from Rising, but they were transformed to fit the new situations, and they didn’t loose one bit of their…awesomeness (I think this is the longest review I’ve ever did, and I’m really using up my vocabulary words for “good” here). Unless someone else has done it, I’ll be posting some of the best CGI shots from this episode soon…maybe. ;)

Finally, we have the ending. Just when you thought it was all going to be alright, that damn asteroid pussed out on us. Even though I knew it was coming (yeah, my anti-spoiler shield dropped with this episode), it was still shocking to see the beam wash over the windows and blowing Elizabeth backwards. Martin Wood didn’t lie when he said they blew out all the glass. Wow. It’ll be interesting to see where Weir goes from here. I know some of you think I don’t like her, but that’s wrong. If anything, this episode made me like her even more (I mean, come on, the 12 rounds speech? It was like watching a kneeing in action). I hope she’ll be alright and kicking, and can’t wait to see what happens!

And that goes with pretty much everything else too. The city is loosing power, they’re lost, and then…to be continued. Ack! Waiting until July(?) will be excruciatingly hard, but I don’t think the full brunt of that has hit yet. Right now, I’m still basking in the euphoria caused by First Strike.

Score: Googolplex/10 :D

EDIT: I knew I forgot something; I'll just list them:

1. Chuck! :D

2. Lorne's a pilot, who knew? Nice plan too, with the asteroid.

3. There were two lines in this episode that just made the whole thing so much bigger for me. They were:

"We've come full circle eh?" - Rodney. So true.

"Atlantis is leaving this planet" - Weir. Never thought I hear it. :D

Great review, PG15! I too thought it was an excellent ep overall!!! Amazing CG in this one, I really loved it! It's definitely one of the best finales I think!

I loved the mix of character moments with Elizabeth and Dr. Keller, Elizabeth and Ellis, Teyla and Elizabeth, the team's "Fantastic Four" moment (LOL!), and even Rodney and Radek moments. Great mix of characters and little moments sprinkled throughout the action and drama!

There were also some great lines in this one. Very nice humor mixed in. I so much prefer when we get mixes of humor like this as opposed to a full-blown attempt at a humorous ep. Such a nice balance I thought.

Overall, a great finale I thought!!! I love their end situation, very dire and very unique from previous seasons!

fuchsia
February 6th, 2007, 06:56 PM
Quick question...
Was Radek in the control room when it blew up?
I kinda lost track of him somewhere...
Hope he's not lying under a plank injured!

PG15
February 6th, 2007, 07:00 PM
Just finished watching it, and overall I thought it was very enjoyable despite one annoying Stargate issue.

When they send the Stargate to the planet, it shouldn't have been able to work. Atlantis has the DHD making it the dominant gate so they should have dialled into Atlantis rather than the standalone gate.

You would think that even if they included a DHD, Atlantis would have still been the dominant address because of their DHD being better than others.


Yeah, but don't forget, we're talking about a device made by the guys who pretty much know the same stuff as the Ancients, who built the Stargates in the first place. I would think they know more about it than us.

In other words, they found a way around that DHD problem.

Korean_Turtle87
February 6th, 2007, 07:17 PM
5.5 months til S4

Sweetsong
February 6th, 2007, 07:19 PM
Well this was probably already posted in the 10 pages this thing shot up to over night. But is it possible the reason Weir is going to recurring in season 4 due to whatever injuries she may have sustained when the beam grazed the control room?

Also, perhaps Col. Carter will be the one to rescue them on the Odessy with their ZPM? All very interesting and exciting ideas to think about. Season 4 airs in July correct me if I'm wrong. I am very anxious to see how this turns out. Btw 11/10 for this episode.

algir
February 6th, 2007, 07:25 PM
Quick question...
Was Radek in the control room when it blew up?
I kinda lost track of him somewhere...
Hope he's not lying under a plank injured!


as rodney said he was in the ZPM room looking at the power usage.

Merlin7
February 6th, 2007, 07:51 PM
Loved the ep. Love that Shep will be in charge, at least for a little while and he flew the city. YAY, Shep got to use his gene. About time. Loved all the exchanges between various characters. Like Jewel so far. Liked Colonel Ellis and that he likes Shep. Yay.

Elizabeth was the weak point. I thought everyone was spot on and just brought the game, Torri didn't pull it off for me. Have to admit, won't really miss her.

AutumnDream
February 6th, 2007, 08:09 PM
-Along those lines, Ronon's comments about having nothing to do almost felt like a confession from TPTB. "He's rough and tough, but when science rolls around we can't think of anything for him to do. So let's have him comment about it on it in the show! Oh, the irony!!"

They really do "hang lanterns" on everything. :rolleyes:

Ripple in Space
February 6th, 2007, 08:14 PM
Col. Ellis was too natural, lol. Seriously, the actor is very good, but he played the character too real. Stargate does well with quirky, idiosyncratic characters, and he ain't one. Just like Cliff Simon (Baal) knew, you have to go a little over the top to become a fan-favorite & in response recurring.

Jewel Staite looked good, and acted well, but the chemistry wasn't even comparable with Paul McGillion's. Carson had a great presence and chemistry that stood out from the first few minutes of the series throughout the show's run. What a mistake replacing Carson w/ her....

The episode was okay, a solid 7.5/10, but I think it just "flew over the shark." Major show changes never bode well for its future (of any genre). We lost 3 primary stars, and changed the show's location.

S4 is bringing in a new scifi celeb (Jewel) and are porting over SG-1's most consistent lead (Carter). It's like they're trying to kill the show.

Btw, where was the "soft reset"? Submerging, and then moving the city? Is that a reset at all?

Agent_Dark
February 6th, 2007, 08:19 PM
No, don't tell me I get too involved with the characters I love the most, I already know that. (From crying so hard I gave myself a headache the first thirty-seven times I saw the last Matrix movie.)
I cried when I saw The Matrix Reloaded too... it was such a crap movie :(

Spooks99
February 6th, 2007, 08:29 PM
I thought this was a fantastic episode. I'm not sure what else people want in a season finale. I mean, a season finale has to be more tense and action-packed, has to up the ante over previous seasons, pretty much by definition. I thought the writers did a very good job of that. This wasn't going to be an exploration episode (although I agree we need more of those--especially city exploration episodes).

Also, for those complaining about the need for shields in space--remember, space is a whole different ballgame. You not only need to generate atmosphere, but you need whatever structure you're in to withstand the pressure of hard vacuum. Now, Atlantis may be a pretty impressive city, but it's obviously not designed for that--remember, the earliest shots we have of Atlantis flying are in Rising, and the city has the shield up. Maybe people could still survive in sections of the city, sealed behind air-tight bulkheads, but then they couldn't access the control room (even if hadn't been blown up, I highly doubt glass would withstand the sudden exposure to the vacuum of space) and probably other essential areas of the city. They would just be waiting to die. So yeah, time is critical.

Also, as for the Asuran threat...as someone mentioned above, given that the PWAR satellite wasn't ready yet, they could either take the chance that the ships would go to Earth or Atlantis when completed (at which time they would be very hard to defeat), or destroy them. It's not very likely they were going after the wraith. I mean, why now, after 10,000 years? The wraith aren't a threat to them. We sort of are, plus they probably resent us for being the Ancients' "favorite" children. And we are occupying Atlantis now--we see ourselves as the Ancients' successors, why shouldn't they?

And the plot was no more "filler" than any other episode. Any episode can be boiled down to ten minutes--the team goes through the gate, makes enemies, and either a) comes running back, tails between legs, or b) blows up the enemy. This was much more original than some episodes--e.g., the Ark (which I liked, but which was a blatant rip off of SG-1's Lifeboat, and even of The Long Goodbye).

Killdeer
February 6th, 2007, 08:32 PM
I have to say I loved it. This episode reminded me of why I love Stargate. I own every episode of Stargate (both SG-1 and Atlantis) available for purchase, and I think this episode, just on first viewing, ranks up there with the best of them. I tend to rate an episode based on whether I would watch it again, and how soon. I think I'll be rewatching this one pretty quickly.

Most of the episode seemed to click very well, IMO. I'm sure any episode can be cited for logic and continuity issues at one level or another, but this one seemed to have less holes than some I might name (and won't). I know some disagree, and that's fine, but for me it worked. I liked the Colonel Ellis character, and I hope we see more of him next season. Also, we saw Lorne! Yay!

I think the scene with Elizabeth and Teyla was helping build the basis for the direction that the show is going next year. It was interesting to me that Teyla was the one that Elizabeth chose to share her frustrations with, and I think she was the most logical one in this case.

Sheppard's comments about not wanting to be the man echoed O'Neill's comments right before he became General. Does this foreshadow Sheppard taking over complete control of Atlantis in Weir's absence, possibly getting a promotion? Or are we being given a reason for someone else to be in command, since Sheppard doesn't want it? Are we heading toward Atlantis being militarized? (Is that the right word?) I think I'm leaning toward Sheppard being in command of Atlantis at this point, although he may have to fight Rodney for it. <grin> We'll see.

It was also interesting to see that Rodney's loyalties were very firmly with Elizabeth. He shared her misgivings from the beginning, and when it came time to make the call about sinking the city, he was pretty clear about who he considered his boss.

Ronan's comment about needing to learn about science was great. I also enjoyed Teyla's look of disapproval at being called the Invisible Woman, and Sheppard's gradual realization that his audience just wasn't getting it. One of the reasons I've grown to love Atlantis so much is the character interactions, the little things the actors put into their performances.

If I had complaints (and they're small ones), it would be there were a few scenes that Sheppard seemed a little off somehow. I'm not sure I can put my finger on it. Just..some of his reactions seemed a little flat, maybe, a little bit? But I was having a little problem with the audio, so that could have been it. His "make-out" comment threw me a little too. It seemed a little odd in the context of the scene. The other scene that seemed off was Weir's echoing of the "12 rounds" comment back to Ellis. I understand what they were trying to do here, but it didn't quite work for me.

One other comment-in the scene where Oberoth says that those that exist within the collective can be replicated many times - did anyone else hear that and think "Cylons"?

A few weeks ago, I was feeling a little overwhelmed and depressed by the wave of news that hit us. This episode helped restore my excitement about Stargate's future, and eased a lot of my misgivings. For one thing, I admit I was envisioning Dr Keller as a bubbly bouncy Kaylee character, and she presented herself more professionally than I expected. I haven't seen enough of her to make a judgement yet, but so far, so good! And on that note, I'll sign off. Here's to Season 4 - may it come quickly! Also, here's to breaking my Gateworld silence, after three years of anonymous lurking! <gulp> <deep breath> Posting now....

Starxgate
February 6th, 2007, 08:35 PM
Am I the only one that can not picture Atlantis going back to its original Planet ? They have the perfect opportunity to find a new just as good planet & get away from the Replicators & they can always go back by ship to pick up the Athosians. I just can not see them going back to Atlantis's original planet. They have a very good opportunity here. The Wraith is in a civil war. The Replicators in Pegasus wouldnt be able to find them. The Wraith will eventually kill each other. This is definitely one hell of a reset button. I am excited about Season 4.

Ruined_puzzle
February 6th, 2007, 08:40 PM
*pets SGA* Aside from the special effects it was an okay episode, and better than last years finale, still I think its a little too late. We all know that the writers can do great but its usually just a couple of episodes and then the rest are well, crap. I will miss Elizabeth and what used to be SGA. I guess s4 will be completely different. Blah. SG1 Atlantis or something, no thanks. They even started to change the uniforms. *lol* I'll be watching something else.

Callie
February 6th, 2007, 09:02 PM
Transcript is done if anyone's interested:

http://www.brundle.free-online.co.uk/320_First_Strike.html

lelaidd
February 6th, 2007, 09:31 PM
Don't we say "A picture worth 2000 words"!?

Check that spoiler :D

http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/3397/atlantisflyingsn2.jpg
Atlantis Flying WOOOOT WOOOOT!

Btw, I know my screen is super wide ^^ Got a 20" Widescreen :D

vitchek
February 6th, 2007, 09:41 PM
Nice gifs can't wait to watch this, i will be watching it later tonight once i have taken my girlfriend home (non stargate fan).

....dump her

Belamel
February 6th, 2007, 09:46 PM
I liked a lot that went on in this episode. Unfortunately, what overshadows all that I still like about this show is the loss of Carson. I may give Atlantis a couple more chances next season, but as it stands right now I feel that the loss of such a great, interesting character that had so much more potential to explore really was pointless. The replacement held no interest for me whatsoever. Between this episode and Vengence I am just completely baffled that TPTB could get it so wrong by killing off such a vital character. I am just too annoyed at Carson's death to enjoy the rest of it. <sigh>

unruhbrady
February 6th, 2007, 09:53 PM
IF the Pegasus Gates mirror the Milky Way Gates in that the ENTIRE NETWORK has to be recalibrated with the new database to allow for stellar drift, then McKay is gonna have his work cut out for him. If they can simply relaclulate THEIR address then Smooth-Sailing (Take Earths ZPM and make that :sam:'s Problem)

sparkygate
February 6th, 2007, 09:58 PM
oooooo!!!!!!!!

Seeeing Atlantis sink and fly into space is so MAD!!!! you know they did call it the lost city and now they are really lost... -> just something i thought of

Though i get a feeling they probably might use a blackhole nearby or something to power the shields until help arrives!!! I cant wait till season 4!!! (if you are those people who post these videos up PLEASE post up season 4 as soon as possible)

BTW: does anyone know when season 4 is airing?

Lizabeth
February 6th, 2007, 10:13 PM
I have this thing against too much analyzation, especially now, cause I've gotten so frustrated with myself from doing it before. So I'll be brief, but I wanted to say that I loved this episode. Possibly the best season finale I have ever seen. I am super excited for season 4. But for the record, this didn't "bring me back" for next season, I was never leaving! Anyway, great episode, not going into why as almost every scene was awesome, so excited to see what comes next!

DaCk
February 6th, 2007, 10:33 PM
Great episode!!! I loved it! Wish i didnt have to wait so long for season 4 though to see the conclusion! :cameron: Atlantis sinking and then flying off was awesome! And the shepard/mckay scene where they are walking to the chair room talking about the drilling platform was very funny.

What happened to the Wraith Cruiser found on the ocean floor? Did they recover it and move it somewhere else? Or just leave it down there? It would be stupid to leave it down there.

Oh and hopefully the mention of Carson will make everyone stop bickering.

Easter Lily
February 6th, 2007, 11:02 PM
Atlantis submerges and Atlantis flies... yay...
Nice to see Sheppard back on that chair. It's about time.

A surprisingly lowkey episode for a season finale... none of the usual frenetic feeling until the end.

dispader
February 6th, 2007, 11:07 PM
*checks dispader's profile*

Yup, young male.


Sweet! Thanks for the stereotype. Yeah, try as I might I just cant see past tits and a pretty smile;)

travis
February 6th, 2007, 11:09 PM
This was just an amazing ep one of the best this season.
The CGI in this was just stunning and beautiful. I actually like the new doctor and the Apllo captian, nice addition. After seeing this ep season 4 is going to be very interesting. I also like the tone of this ep as it gave us a different feel to the last two season finale.

lord-anubis
February 6th, 2007, 11:20 PM
wow just wow is all i can say this ep had every thing in it asdords,engey beem attacking atlanits. atlantis going underwater atlantis going of water. altantis flying. just aswsome and now there lost in space but they won't be lost for every long cuz they ether found out were they are or they run out of air in 24 hours. atlanits looked like it took a lot of danmge thou and once again it looked like there going to use up all the power from there zpm.

metabog
February 6th, 2007, 11:22 PM
No freaking way!!! If this is how atlantis is going to be in s4, then I say to hell with sg-1's cancellation, bring on the budget, lol. AWESOME EPISODE. Can't wait... for... s4... :(

drayco
February 6th, 2007, 11:22 PM
Ok, I really wanted to reply to something that had to do with this episode, never posted before, so it may not work

But, oh my, that was an awesome episode, I was having a heart attack watching it.


While watching, and when i was calming down my heart I had an idea that why wouldnt they pull of a Carter and blow up the sun of that system, taking out the replicators totally, instead of nuking only parts of that planet. That would have solved everything.

Now of course that takes out all the fun that the episode had, the greatness it was, and the massive cliff hanger.

h4mx0r
February 6th, 2007, 11:37 PM
One more obstacle is the fact that they are running on a skeleton crew. All non essential personnel were evacuated onto the Apollo.

I'm still waiting for a "The Zeus"

hehe.

PG15
February 6th, 2007, 11:38 PM
Why can't she be hawt and talented at the same time?

Why can't we guys be entertained by her beauty and her acting talent at the same time?

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:40 PM
No chemistry? That's interesting, because IMO, Torri's one of only two actors who has great chemistry with the enitre cast (the other being David Hewlett)

I think TH does a great job, actually. It's got to be hard to take a HAWT young thang seriously as a CMO, though. JS is the one who didn't work for me in either scene. And you're absolutely right that she's there because she's HAWT. Not fair to Jewel, but that's the way it is.

dispader
February 6th, 2007, 11:44 PM
This was just an amazing ep one of the best this season.
The CGI in this was just stunning and beautiful. I actually like the new doctor and the Apllo captian, nice addition. After seeing this ep season 4 is going to be very interesting. I also like the tone of this ep as it gave us a different feel to the last two season finale.


I agree completely. It was definitely different from that previous finales and I enjoyed them as well. I really like how the show is evolving.

This season was really good for Ronon. I know that some folks saw is science lines as hokey but I saw it as a manifestation of his frustration at being so ineffective in such a dire circumstance. Tayla didn't say anything but I saw her as feeling similar.

Sheppard's make out line with Zelinka and McKay was great for me because I've used that and similar phrases to get people to quit bickering and focus on whatever the issue is. Being in the USAF only made it more funny.

I really liked Col Ellis as well. I hope we get to see much more of him. The tension between Wier and him was great. I also enjoyed the new doctor. I liked how she went from timid/unsure of her position to all business when it mattered. It's good to see her pushing her boundaries in her first ep.

The CG was brilliant. I hope it wins some sort of award.

Great ep, I'm excited for S4.

Linzi
February 6th, 2007, 11:49 PM
I think TH does a great job, actually. It's got to be hard to take a HAWT young thang seriously as a CMO, though. JS is the one who didn't work for me in either scene. And you're absolutely right that she's there because she's HAWT. Not fair to Jewel, but that's the way it is.
I was very sceptical about JS being the CMO, but I didn't think she was all 'hawtness'. She's very pretty, sure, but she wasn't dressed inappropriately, or acted as if she's some ditzy blonde. She looked like a young doctor who was very doubtful she was qualified for the role she's been given. I personally think she'll be great, and I say that as somone who really liked Carson as SGA's doctor. I've accepted Carson's gone, and strangely, I haven't personally missed him in the episodes he's not been in.
I really liked both of the new characters introduced here. I'm really enjoying the changes so far. As to whether I enjoy other characters coming over to SGA? Well, if TPTB do as good a job settling them in to the show as they did here, then quite honestly, I think it may be a good thing.

nonniemous
February 6th, 2007, 11:49 PM
Why can't she be hawt and talented at the same time?

Why can't we guys be entertained by her beauty and her acting talent at the same time?

Who said she wasn't talented? She was fantastic in Firefly, which is the only other thing I've seen her in.

As for the rest, it goes back to pointlessly dumping a wonderful established character and a talented actor, all so you guys could be entertained by a hawt young thang. Why should I be happy about that?

Agent_Dark
February 6th, 2007, 11:52 PM
No chemistry? That's interesting, because IMO, Torri's one of only two actors who has great chemistry with the enitre cast (the other being David Hewlett)

I've only seen "the scene" involving Weir. You know which one I mean. But if they kill her off, have her in a coma, have Sam taking over her city, just as a way of dragging in SG1 viewers (which personally I don't think will work. Most Sam fans are Sam/Jack fans! They weren't happy with her not being with Jack on SG1, how are they going to feel once the character's in another galaxy with no hope of their ship coming to fruition) then it's crap.

As for Jewel -- obvious bid to get the teenage boys watching. Not very smart, either. They're not the majority of viewers (I've been to many cons -- the majority there are women over 25, and a huge number are well over 40. I don't think a 24 year old playing a doctor is terribly convincing to someone with that sort of life experience) and they're not the ones with the disposable income to drag the advertisers in. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to work that out.
:| :|

I'm a big Sam fan and am definitely not a Sam/Jack fan. And I know quite a few Sam fans who are not Sam/Jack fans too. I don't appreciate the generalisation.

I also don't agree about Jewel - you seem to be implying that an actress under 25 is only good for attracting male attention and that's the only reason why she got the job? Not because, you know, she's actually a pretty good actor?

dispader
February 6th, 2007, 11:52 PM
snip
But when so many of the male reviewers here mention how HAWT Jewel is? If the stereotype fits...


I didn't...

I know that many stereotypes have at leat a hint of truth to them, but going down the "if the stereotype fits..." road can get real ugly. I prefer not to.

I do however appreciate the fact that you must think 31 is young, I usually don't feel it.

PG15
February 6th, 2007, 11:52 PM
Oh no, you should feel whatever you feel like feeling...well, you know what I mean.

My point is, as dispader said, the stereotyping is not welcomed. Just because she's hawt doesn't mean she's put there just for "male pandering". TPTB has worked with her before in "Instinct", so they could very well want her back because they know she's a proven actor.

Both are valid conclusions, no?

Agent_Dark
February 6th, 2007, 11:58 PM
Oh no, you should feel whatever you feel like feeling...well, you know what I mean.

My point is, as dispader said, the stereotyping is not welcomed. Just because she's hawt doesn't mean she's put there just for "male pandering". TPTB has worked with her before in "Instinct", so they could very well want her back because they know she's a proven actor.

Both are valid conclusions, no?

Funny how there's no claims about how the attractive male actors are only there to pander for the women hey? ;)

nonniemous
February 7th, 2007, 12:02 AM
I didn't...

I know that many stereotypes have at leat a hint of truth to them, but going down the "if the stereotype fits..." road can get real ugly. I prefer not to.

I do however appreciate the fact that you must think 31 is young, I usually don't feel it.

My apologies; you mentioned "chemistry" and I didn't see there being any.

Stereotypes can get ugly fast, but when TPTB dump a damned fine actor for a much younger, pretty actress who isn't old enough to play the role realistically? Stereotypes in action.

That same stereotype will bite back, though, because once JS hits 30 or so, she'll have a damned hard time finding any work in television or movies.

I've not got many years on you; but if you want to feel "old", go right ahead. You never know how young you are until you do get past your thirties.

Vala_M
February 7th, 2007, 12:02 AM
Ok, I don't know how everyone managed to miss this bit in "First Strike", but when McKay, Zelenka and Sheppard were all talking in the lab about options once they were submerged, McKay mentions that The stardrive was fixed by the Asurans after the drones that Dr. Beckett fired! so wonder no more everyone, that is how it was fixed.

EDIT: Sorry, I think this should have gone in the science and tech thread, can a mod please move it? Thanks!

AGT58

dispader
February 7th, 2007, 12:02 AM
Funny how there's no claims about how the attractive male actors are only there to pander for the women hey? ;)

Hey, there's always Dr. Lee...

Agent_Dark
February 7th, 2007, 12:05 AM
Hey, there's always Dr. Lee...

Cleo model of the year imo.

Willow'sCat
February 7th, 2007, 12:06 AM
Well I LOVED!!!! This. Episode.

I don't care if it did do a reset for the last 2 seasons in fact that is why I really loved it, the last 2 years wiped clean. *more or less* Now maybe we can get back to the show I know and love. ;)

I loved Jewel from the second she appeared, I may have squeed even. She will be a great addition I have no doubts now.

I liked Weir in this episode, that didn't surprise me as this is the Weir I always wanted but sadly we never really saw after the first half of season one. I am not saying I want her in season 4 (I know she will be there) but at least this was a good reset for her character if we can get some follow through, some bite to the character then I may even stop my ff aproach to watching her.

I thought it was a nicely paced episode, not as hurried as some of the other finales or mid season break episodes, I am grateful for that as I hate it when all we get is a whole heap of babble from McKay and cut shots and well me left wondering WTF is going on. :p Here I got it, I understood what was happening without having to pause the episode, and really I think the "rush" that is normally there gave way for more Team and interpersonal moments and for me that is a huge plus.

Cute stuff:

Sheppard's little Mr Fantastic thing, but sorry Sheppard, an AU McKay owns that title. *and shirt* :p

Teyla's I am not invisible *sweet* it was so deadpan who knew Rachel could go there. :)

Sheppard telling Radek & Rodney to make out already *man I really loved that* :D

Chuck getting a name and it being the actors real name. Yay!

Sheppard flying the city, 'bout time!

Not so cute:

So now they will be what? Rescued by a certain blond Lt Col? :cool:

Weir being injured *although this could be good for Sheppard's development* is a lame way to oust a character if that is indeed what tptb are planing, I would rather her role just be made more like Hammond and be done with it, instead it feels like I am being manipulated into feeling for her... not that, that is ever going to happen. :cool: Oh well, I can live with it.

The actual way they went about getting to the heart of nowhere was a little beyond belief... "lasers" :p ? Satellite Stargates? Moving *moving* asteroids!!!!! Oh well it is scifi, I keep telling myself that.

Over all I do stand by my love of this episode. No not perfect, no even close but it at least shows the promise of something great for season 4 and for me that is the most important thing at the moment, I really am only a handful of episodes away from not watching anymore. Please give me something worth watching next season. Please!

Oh, and yeah McKay/Hewlett was great, as always. :mckayanime03:

Mitchell82
February 7th, 2007, 12:07 AM
This was a great ep. I loved every last second and wasa on the edge of my seat the entire time. Am I the only one that was glued to their seat when the glass exploaded and Weir got injured? I was OMG! I know they won't kill her as she is in season 4 but I saw the pretense of her reduced role. She isnt trusted by the IOA when a cirisis arrises, big surprise Men are so insicure when it comes to Women in Command. loved the new comander of the Apollo and so far like Dr. Keller. She seems like a nice character. Great action fast paced story and suspense that i've come to expect and always recieved from SG. Going to be a long 5 months but it will be worth it I'm sure. It was a great ending to a great season. Still it's odd to see some still dooming the show after a great ep and smoothly intergrate JS character. Can't wait for season 4. Singing off time to go to bed. Work tomorow.:mckay:

dispader
February 7th, 2007, 12:09 AM
My apologies; you mentioned "chemistry" and I didn't see there being any.

Stereotypes can get ugly fast, but when TPTB dump a damned fine actor for a much younger, pretty actress who isn't old enough to play the role realistically? Stereotypes in action.

That same stereotype will bite back, though, because once JS hits 30 or so, she'll have a damned hard time finding any work in television or movies.

I've not got many years on you; but if you want to feel "old", go right ahead. You never know how young you are until you do get past your thirties.

No worries, I'm the last person who will ever "get bent" on an online forum.

As for the Carson debacle, I'm still reserving judgement until some facts come to light on the subject. I truely hope it doesn't turn out to be for the reasons you feel, I enjoyed his character too.

It's not so much wanting to feel old as things aching and such that never used to:(

nonniemous
February 7th, 2007, 12:10 AM
Oh no, you should feel whatever you feel like feeling...well, you know what I mean.

My point is, as dispader said, the stereotyping is not welcomed. Just because she's hawt doesn't mean she's put there just for "male pandering". TPTB has worked with her before in "Instinct", so they could very well want her back because they know she's a proven actor.

Both are valid conclusions, no?

They're both conclusions, anyway.

I'm sure they went back to Jewel in part because they'd worked with her before and knew her; I'm also sure that a large if not major part of bringing her new character in was "male pandering." If they'd brought in a more realistic actress for the part, aka an older actress in her late thirties who might actually be the sort to be included in such an expedition? I'd not be so vocal. But when every extra female scientist looks like she's barely out of high school, let alone grad school and more? And yet the guys all seem to be much more realistically at least in their late 30s? Pandering. (Just look at the girl who played the doctor iwth the "perfect little..." whatsits in "Tao of Rodney." )

This kind of skewed casting for women is a fact of life in tv and movies, and it's one reason I don't watch much at all on tv or go to many movies. And that just makes it that much harder to swallow when it happens to the one show I do enjoy watching, let alone my favorite character on that show.

Tukka
February 7th, 2007, 12:15 AM
Somehow I'm not so satisfied as I was after watching SG-1 The Shroud -ep, but after all, this was huge ep!

Show is going in a good way now, reset was nice and not too big. Few hilarious moments too! Fantastic 4 example :cool:

New characters also brings fresh feeling in the show, new doctor was quite hot! and Col. Ellis was in the beginning a bit annoying, but in the end he impressed me really.

CGI were nice but the truth is, that CGI should not carry whole ep forward, but managed in this quite well.
Ending was cool, I'm thrilled to see season 4 opening, at least what now:
- Weir?
- Solution
- Replicators?

nonniemous
February 7th, 2007, 12:17 AM
No worries, I'm the last person who will ever "get bent" on an online forum.

As for the Carson debacle, I'm still reserving judgement until some facts come to light on the subject. I truely hope it doesn't turn out to be for the reasons you feel, I enjoyed his character too.

It's not so much wanting to feel old as things aching and such that never used to:(

Good. I don't get bent, either; it's an online forum and I do have a real life. Passionate, yes. But that's not the same as "bent".

I don't think we'll ever get the straight dope on the Carson debacle. Too much fur has flown in the fandom for anyone to step and take responsibility now. But PM certainly seems to have been unhappy to have been pushed out for any reason, and the general consensus from other cast comments only confirms that it was not a happy departure.

Aches and pains, those you're stuck with. But there are other benefits.

PG15
February 7th, 2007, 12:18 AM
Ok, can we please stop bandying the "24 years old" thing around? It's a fact that we don't know how old Dr. Keller is, and nowhere does it say that the characters must have the same age as the actors.

Maybe it's just me (but again, I'm a horrible judge of age), but she looked mature enough.

nonniemous
February 7th, 2007, 12:28 AM
Hmmm. Kind of brings to mind Teryl talking about how she got a phone call from someone saying "we want to shake things up. How do you feel if we kill you off?" It's the same thing all over again, and OMG! With a Doctor! And what's Elizabeth's title? Doctor! Being a doctor is not good for career longevity in the Stargate franchise. (Unless you're a Lieutenant Colonel Doctor ;) )

And your real life initials are AT and your character's SC. Yup.

I see we're on the same wavelength about a realistic actress being brought in, too. Me, I liked Dr. Pulaski on ST:TNG. But someone like that wouldn't get the stereotypical reaction TPTB were hoping for.

dispader
February 7th, 2007, 12:35 AM
I thought that was mentioned at the same time they said the control room was fixed by the Asurans in that episode...

I didn't realize there was confusion...

Mefusta
February 7th, 2007, 12:37 AM
Solid, above-average ep. Excellent CG, reasonably solid story, and some great ingenuity regarding both technology and continuity. Capped off with a suspenseful but not over-the-top cliffhanger, this was definitely one of the best finales we've seen to date.

On the subject of Dr. Keller: I find it amazing that some of you have been able to pass judgement on her character after merely a minute-and-a-half of screentime, interacting with only one other cast member. Honestly, to completely suss-out the character after such a short time is simply incredible! Her age, backstory, and even her interaction and chemistry with the entire cast from less than two minutes of one-on-one screentime? Unbelievable! For those of you able to conduct such a feat, I truly envy you. More than that, I thank you.

Willow'sCat
February 7th, 2007, 12:42 AM
That was an ad-lib from Torri, which they left in the scene...
If true it doesn't suprise me ;) it seemed very odd the way it was delivered like she was half laughing as she said it and I didn't think that was quite right for that moment but then the look on Chuck's face made it all good. Well at least it wasn't a what? 7 year wait like Walter. :)

Ronnikins
February 7th, 2007, 01:06 AM
Well, didn't think it was possible but I watched this episode twice in one sitting picking out stuff I missed on first viewing ....THAT'S HOW FREAKIN' GOOD IT WAS!
I only watch most episodes once and some, like last week's Vengeance, only the first 10 minutes since my enthusiasm for SGA diminished somewhat with all the cast changes.

The CG effects were incredibly well done but I went more for the plot and character interactions. You did it again Martin Gero. :D

Highlights:

*CG effects and seeing Atlantis fly. Finally!

*I had no pre-conceived ideas about Dr Keller so I was pleasantly surprised at how JS played it. The writers were very clever in making her character insecure about her promotion. The first scene alone would have dissipated some of the unhappiness of a young, hawt, female gung-ho brilliant doctor stepping into some very big shoes. TPTB are not dumb (sometimes). :p

*Enjoyed the "Mr Fantastic" scene. The back-pedalling by Shep to Teyla's glare of "I'm not invisible" and both Ronon's and Teyla's non-reactions to the references were priceless. Likewise with Rodney's remark about Zelenka's "infallibility". Hee!

*Also thought Col. Ellis was well acted by Michael Beach. He was a military hard-a$$ type who had his orders and underestimated the respect the rest of the expedition had for Weir. The way Rodney deferred to Weir for permission was well done.
I loved McKay in this episode, esp. his scenes with Zelenka.

*And Lorne! Ah, Lorne......nuff said. :)

*Finally we had more than one scene of Weir waving Team!Shep byebyes through the stargate. She was in full leadership mode here and paradoxically we saw her toughness as well as her vulnerability. I felt empathy for her.
The Weir/Teyla scene was especially poignant for setting up the arc for Season 4 and showing the close bond between the two leaders in such a way that Weir would open up her innermost thoughts to her friend.

All in all, I thoroughly enjoyed First Strike, maybe because I didn't really have any high expectations.

I've been pondering on TPTB's remark (forgot who) that Weir would be "a significant player in a major arc" (?). I really hope she won't go recurring like Ford did, a couple of episodes and then never to be seen again but more like Zelenka or Beckett but with meatier storylines in the few episodes she would be in and then back to regular cast further down the line. Would hate for the reset button be pushed again.

Question....just a wacky theory...let's say Weir is recurring. With her (I presume) life-threatening injuries and Atlantis being cut off from outside help, is it possible, in a desperate attempt to save Weir's life, she gets injected with nanites, nanocells, whatever, in order to repair the injuries sustained by the explosion?
Would she then become Dark!Weir or Replicator!Weir, thus providing a new nemesis and a new challenge for the expedition to get the old Weir back?
My knowledge of Stargate science and technology is seriously flawed about the possibilities. It would be an interesting story arc if it's feasible. Far better than having Weir in a coma or going back to Earth to heal or have her resigning.

Vala_M
February 7th, 2007, 01:08 AM
Well, I thought there was. No one mentioned how it was fixed, in fact, in the big thread for "First Strike" that everyone was waiting online for the info, several people asked and the only answer given was that it wasn't mentioned and that the writers didn't care to explain how.

AGT58

Linzi
February 7th, 2007, 01:16 AM
Ok, can we please stop bandying the "24 years old" thing around? It's a fact that we don't know how old Dr. Keller is, and nowhere does it say that the characters must have the same age as the actors.

Maybe it's just me (but again, I'm a horrible judge of age), but she looked mature enough.
She did to me too. I thought she looked as though she could be in her early thirties. Let's be honest, many tv actors look waaaay younger than their actual ages, just look at JF. To me, JS looked good in the role. I liked her character. She wasn't wooden, seemed incredibly professional, and my fears about casting such a relatively young actress as a doctor have been allayed. Incidentally, I know several female doctors. They are not only very pretty, but are considered to be sexy and fun too. They also look many years younger than they are. Just because you're smart and educated doesn't mean you can't be sexy and beautiful. :)

Linzi
February 7th, 2007, 01:22 AM
If true it doesn't suprise me ;) it seemed very odd the way it was delivered like she was half laughing as she said it and I didn't think that was quite right for that moment but then the look on Chuck's face made it all good. Well at least it wasn't a what? 7 year wait like Walter. :)
Actually, it wasn't an ad lib from Torri. Chuck told us she made a mistake with her dialogue and MW left it in because he liked it :)

Trialia
February 7th, 2007, 01:47 AM
Mefusta -- Meh. Don't get things wrong, I and many other people here love Jewel, she's a sweetheart, and Kaylee was a wonderful character. So far though, Keller doesn't set me up or anything, and seeing Elizabeth hurt that badly in the same episode that a new character's being introduced, doesn't make me happy at ALL.

Celcool
February 7th, 2007, 03:51 AM
Actually, it wasn't an ad lib from Torri. Chuck told us she made a mistake with her dialogue and MW left it in because he liked it :)
Chuck can't know if Torri did on purpose or not. ;)

Linzi
February 7th, 2007, 03:56 AM
Chuck can't know if Torri did on purpose or not. ;)
Well, I'd imagine he discussed with her afterwards... he even said she was very professional after her mistake and carried on the scene anyway. So I'd presume he'd know what he was talking about, seeing as how he was there and involved in the scene... Of course, he could have been mistaken, and it may have been deliberate, but that's certainly not what he thought. The important thing is he's got the name he wanted, how he got it hardly matters in the scheme of things, I'm sure. ;)

True!Ancient
February 7th, 2007, 03:57 AM
When sheppard and the new colonel was talking he said he and others think john should be in charge of atlantis....so if wier dies or steps down does this mean he will take over?if he does will that make major lorne the new team commander?

Celcool
February 7th, 2007, 04:04 AM
The important thing is he's got the name he wanted, how he got it hardly matters in the scheme of things, I'm sure. ;)
Even if it was a mistake by Torri, I'm glad she made it, it was cute! Yay Chuck!

Linzi
February 7th, 2007, 04:12 AM
Even if it was a mistake by Torri, I'm glad she made it, it was cute! Yay Chuck!
It is cute, and I'm really glad he's got a name!!! Go Chuck! He's sooooo sweet! :)

kirkeastmetn
February 7th, 2007, 04:37 AM
theres no way in hell would the IOA allow a colonel to be incharge of an expedition of such importance, they would have a 304 if possibel fly a new commander out to atlantis, and even if sheppard di take over for a period of time, lorne would never be made team leader, becasue shep enjoys off-world travels too much

Alipeeps
February 7th, 2007, 05:10 AM
I loved this episode. I loved the mix of action and character moments, the sense of tension mixed with a kind of despair that they're not going to find a way out of it.. and the knowledge that to a certain extent they brought this on themselves.

I enjoyed Weir's conflict and her concern about her position - and her turning to Teyla for support and counsel. It was nice to see Weir being a leader in this ep and I quite enjoyed how the story was quite focused on her. The action was dramatic and the FX incredible - everything from following the Horizon missile down through atmo to the shock and awe of the planet-wide nuke attack, to the city sinking and flying and the Asuran beam weapon etc. Amazing.

I also enjoyed seeing John be a leader and once again being involved in finding the solution to their predicament - a nice touch seeing him and Rodney work the idea out between them; it was a nice indicator of their close friendship that they know how the other thinks and can bounce ideas off each other. Finally seeing Sheppard do something with his ATA gene was also wonderful - loved seeing him in the chair and controlling the city.

I thoroughly enjoyed the little character moments (the Fantastic 4 conversation, Chuck getting a name (Chuck was all excited about this possibility at P2 - wasn't sure if the blooper would be left in but it was!) and Sheppard's "Make out already" comment! :D) and the portrayal once again of the close family relationship between the teams - Sheppard kind of caught between his military responsibilities (and I quite liked Ellis, though found him perhaps a little condescending to Sheppard, calling him John when Sheppard was calling him Sir...) but still concerned for Weir and her position and trying to justify/explain the military reasoning to her etc - McKay and Zelenka and their very low-key, subdued conversation when signing off on Horizon.. I enjoyed McKay's rather more low-key, almost kinda depressed/despairing snarking in this ep.

I also quite liked Keller in this ep and how she was introduced. Am glad to find she is not some wunderkind who has been brought in to replace Carson.. instead she is a member of his team who misses him and who stepped up to help out in the interim but is uncertain of her ability to fill his shoes. I think Jewel did a good job of making her sympathetic and credible and this all gives me a little more faith in the writers/TPTB going forward into Season 4.

I got a real sense of melancholy from this episode, almost like we were looking at the end of an era (interesting given all the changes planned for Season 4) and, all in all, it was a damn good, exciting, entertaining episode and it makes me feel a lot more positive about the prospects for Season 4 (though I'd still rather *not* have Carter!! :lol:)

ItsDan
February 7th, 2007, 05:14 AM
That's one of the issues I have with the plot. The Atlantis expedition was designed primarily as a research and exploration team with a military escort. They very quickly went from that to actually waging a war against the Wraith, and now the Asurans. I think it's highly unlikely they'd leave Atlantis under civilian command in those kinds of situations. Then again we don't have an IOA in real life, and they may consider Weir more 'controllable' than a military leader.

Øsiris øf the Øri
February 7th, 2007, 05:21 AM
Very good episode...but I think they forgot about the athosians didn't they? Or are tehy still on that backwater rock where the ancients left them? My faorite scenes had to be the beam hitting the shield, the city rising, and the Apollo burning half of Asuras...shouldn't have stopped there though. if they had truely wished to slow th asurans down there should have been at least 10 of those fancy planet killers.

Nightgod
February 7th, 2007, 05:26 AM
That's one of the issues I have with the plot. The Atlantis expedition was designed primarily as a research and exploration team with a military escort. They very quickly went from that to actually waging a war against the Wraith, and now the Asurans. I think it's highly unlikely they'd leave Atlantis under civilian command in those kinds of situations. Then again we don't have an IOA in real life, and they may consider Weir more 'controllable' than a military leader.

That is true.
When things go to hell the military has the right to take control of Atlantis.

Pitry
February 7th, 2007, 05:29 AM
Yay! Excellent, fantastic episode! Almost worth the crapfest of the two previous episodes.

Best line - Teyla's "I'm not invisible". That entire exchange was brilliant, especially teh "why do you get to be Mr Fantastic?" bit, but really. "I'm not invisible". Nope, she isn't, and let's hopecome season 4 the writers for the show would remember this, as well.
Chuck has a name! And it's.... Chuck. First Dr Lee gets named "Bill" after the actor and now Chuck... LoL.
Speaking of Teyla, I loved her conversation with Weir about Elles coming in, the military and everyting. It's really ncie to see they did bother to creat ecome connection between Weir and Teyla in the last couple of episodes.
Not to mention Elizabeth. This was completely adn utterly her episode. Loved every second of her. All the frstration over the IOA and the military, her dealign with Elles and the Replicators... she was fantastic. All the more annoying when I know she's reduced to recurring next season. And TBH, witht he way they ended it for her and the claims Carson would be reduced to recurring when, in fact, they killed him off.... I really, really don't like the implications of this. If they kill Weir... Grrr. I've so compeltely and utterly grown to love Weir this season, and First Strike is a great example of why.
Loved the banter between Rodney and Zelenka... as always. But it even came more to show how much Rodney gerw this season. It wasn't the seaosn 1 or 2 Rodney, his entire behaviour this episode, so much more mature - still snarkastic, but mature snarkastic. Major kudos both for David Hewlett and Martin Gero who brought him this far, through Grace Under PRessure, McKay and Mrs Miller, Sunday and now this (well, adn some credit is definitely due to Damian Kindler with Trinity and Tao of Rodney) . I also think I officially like Ronon now and even Sheppard wasn;t as intolerable as he usually is. Elles seems like a good character too - in one way they kept the dynamics of Coldwall, military vs. civilian operation, and on the other it did feel less dismissive and... I dunno, nicer. And hey, a black actor in Stargate who isn't a Jaffa!... ;) Keller was nice too - well I love Jewel Staite, she's so sweet, so obviously it would translate to the hcaracter... but they did the right thing by automatically addressing the Carson issue, too, in the first moments of the episode. Nice to hear him mentioned in an episode, too, cough. Plus! She doesn't look that young, so that's okay.

SFX departent continues to amaze me, they really outdone themsevles, and I didn't think this was possible after what they've already done prior to this. Granted, teh episode could have concentrated less on SFX, but it still looks damn cool.

All in all, marvelous. Yup, I said at some earlier point that if they end up continuing on that level I'd run out of praise words, which I guess I did. So, why am I both annpyed at the long wait til seaosn 4 and dreading what it will bring? :(

psychofilly
February 7th, 2007, 06:08 AM
I was actually going to start a thread with a similar question, which is this. If Weir is severely incapacitated or steps down, technically, wouldn't Rodney be the next highest ranking civilian and actually be the one who is supposed to step into Weir's position? I realize that John might feel the need to exert military control given the situation, but as head of science, Rodney would be over all the civilians until if/when IOA appointed a new civilian head. We've seen Teyla take over at times, but technically it seems like Rodney should be next in line of sucession.

I wonder if that will come up at all next season.

Alipeeps
February 7th, 2007, 06:09 AM
Stargate Atlantis was airing on Movie Central in Canada. And asking for download information is not permitted on Gateworld. I would suggest you edit your post before the Mods do it for you...

kaffra
February 7th, 2007, 06:19 AM
whos this 'chuck' being mentioned? which scence was it at?

MechaThor
February 7th, 2007, 06:22 AM
Great episode and cliffhanger

Good pionts:
-CGI. the bomb falling was a great scene.
-Talking about the fantastic four to Ronan and Teyla "i am not invisible" lol.
-The City both sinking and flying in one episode was sweet.
-The replicator Weapon concept was cool.
-The New Doc seems cool and has to prove herself.
-The End!

Bad Points:
-Could the Apollo not have towed the astiriod as it would have been a bit more beliveable.
-No Asgaurd on Board?
The Apollo could have looked a bit more diffrent.

8/10

vorador
February 7th, 2007, 06:23 AM
And don't get me started on power issue ...
Yeh, right. If they used the drilling station to power shields indefinitely you would be complaining about "hey, if the ancients had such a great power supply, why would they be relying on zpm's to power the city?" or "why didn't that ancient tell alternate Elizabeth about the station instead giving her 5 zpm locations, that probably wouldn't be in the same place after 10000 years" or "if ancients had the capability to power city shields indefinitely, why did they submerged the city and ran to earth when fighting the wraith?". You're just complaining for the sake of complaining. The station, as stated in Submersion, probably wasn't much reliable or safe, for the ancients to have abandoned it in the first place. What would have been more risky, giving the city, a small boost to fly and get out of there or sitting there indefinitely, relying on the station to power shields and waiting for everything to blow up in one second?

The episode was great.

Pitry
February 7th, 2007, 06:29 AM
whos this 'chuck' being mentioned? which scence was it at?

The technician - in the beginning of the episode, when Rodneya dn Sheppard are ranting over the evaluations, the gate technician walks in and informs Weir (adn teh audiecne) the Apollo has arrived... Weir refers to him as "Chuck". ;)

... does this mean that Siler's official first name is.. Dan? :)

KerMcG90
February 7th, 2007, 06:43 AM
I have to say this was a pretty good ep :) Apart from the fact that i wanted to kick Ellis a few time :P As for Jewl...as much as it kills me I can handle her. She seems like a good person to add in and fully capable of doing the job so once things settle down it'll interesting to see how it plays out with her. I say give it a chance. She could suprise us :)

freetoken
February 7th, 2007, 06:43 AM
If you go back to SG-1 and watch the episode where President Hayes picks Weir to "lead" the SGC, the reason given was that if the SG program was made public there would be a pretty and friendly (i.e., non-military) face "in charge". That is how the then VP interpreted it, and it came to quite a suprise to him when Weir immediately exerted her own autonomy.

Then, when the decision was made to send a team to Atlantis, it was made pretty clear that the choice of Weir was a compromise solution, so the that US could help the IOA save face.

It should have been made clear in the SGA season 3 midseason cliffhanger that Weir is not on the inside of the real decisions. O'Neill was calling the shots in the negotiations with the Lanteans and the IOA, and remember Weir was *not* chosen to remain behind as the Earth human rep.

So yes, there have always been people above Weir who make the really big decisions regarding Atlantis.

Also, both Carter and JS are not senior (in rank) enough to be installed as anything more than an Acting Commander, and neither have the experience that would even make it reasonable. The leader of the expedition, if military, would be a full Col. (unless Navy in which case it would be a Capt.) and have experience as commander of a major facility.

For the purpose of the show I suspect they will not kill Weir but just have her incapacitated, so that the decision doesn't have to be made on an official replacement.

Commander Ivanova
February 7th, 2007, 06:44 AM
Now that's what I call a season finale. Can't wait to see what happens next. Great episode all round, TPTB really pulled out all the stops, in fact they almost tried to cram too many fantastic ideas into one ep.

Oka
February 7th, 2007, 06:54 AM
Pretty good episode and here's why:

Good:
+ Awesome CGI probably the best in Stargate history.
+ Sweet, Atlantis can fly..............
+ Decent cliffhanger, will make people return to watch season 4, for sure.
+ It's nice to see Kayleigh, uh I mean Jewel Staite on Stargate. I can't really pass judgement on her character yet though. He was perfect on Firefly and she'll probably be great on Stargate as well, as long as they don't make her character bland.
+ I liked the plan to nuke the replicators, at last they're willing to do what is necessary to win the war.


Bad:
- Weir. Boring, whiney. Think she's always right. Think she has the authority to make the big decisions. Glad she's getting less screen time in season 4.
- While I liked the plan they should've executed it better, more nukes - whatever. It was pretty naive to think that they could completely wipe out the replicators like that.
- Still don't like the replicators.
- Kind of predictable - you knew they weren't going to be successful in their plan to wipe out the replicators.
- Cliffhanger :(
- Like the last SG-1 episode I got some "war on terror" vibes when they're portraying the armed forces as belligerent as they did in this episode. I don't know where the writers are going with that.

Was a good episode. Looking forward to Season 4 (less filler episodes though, please). And yeah, the replicators suck.

psychofilly
February 7th, 2007, 07:03 AM
So yes, there have always been people above Weir who make the really big decisions regarding Atlantis.

Of course, good point, and at the same time, with Atlantis temporarily cut off, we could see a power struggle between John/Military and the civillian scientists who have become accostumed to the split leadership and expect it to continue. I haven't seen the episode yet, but it sounds like your point that Weir isn't in charge when the military wants something really sunk in for her this time. We've seen her fight against that system more than once, so if she were to make Rodney step up and continue, it might be interesting. The civilians do need a voice, and I can't imagine the IOA would want to just hand over the Atlantis project completely.

bcfc
February 7th, 2007, 07:22 AM
I liked this alot, Very good scenes with Ellis and Weir (Glad shes going though cant stand her). Enjoyed the City flying, shows how far they've come in three years and a fantastic climax at the end with the city stranded in space

Role on Season Four

:weir: Hopefully shes gone for good.

Starxgate
February 7th, 2007, 07:33 AM
I liked seeing Johns military side. Normally he usually agrees with Weir with what to do but this time he was all for attacking the Replicators first. Hes growing up ;)

Unamed
February 7th, 2007, 07:49 AM
anyone notice the new uniforms rodney and sheppard were sporting? they're just like sg1's bdu's but instead they're blacky grey

Ruffles
February 7th, 2007, 08:10 AM
One scene I found interesting was Zelenka and McKay verifying that the nukes were ready to be launched. No snark or arguing - just some moving dialogue on how to do what was right - lie, sabotage - with Rodney sadly admitting that he had seen the ships and knew the danger. He didn't necessarily think the nukes were right, but he didn't know what else to do.

BJX
February 7th, 2007, 08:11 AM
Phenomenal episode. I loved everything about it. The Asurans proving again to be a formidable enemy, I so prefer them to the Wraith. I loved Col. Ellis. He brought that great stoic military flavour which has been missing since we haven't seen Col. Caldwell and I though Michael Beach was superb in the role. Jewel Staite as Dr. Keller impressed my very much. The character seems very interesting and very likeable. The visual effects in this episode were spectacular. The story was equally spectacular and so nice to see the Stargate as a certal story-point. There were alot of great individual character moments and great team interaction and a really great cliffhanger. I was impressed that it wasn't another "Sheppard is dead" cliffhanger.

Brilliant end to a brilliant season. Good going folks!

Vala_M
February 7th, 2007, 08:14 AM
Man! This episode was amazing! One of the best, if not the best yet! Anyway, it had everything, Atlantis sinking, flying and such! Col. Ellis is pretty good, I don't know why many people said he was an a**. He reminded me of Col. Everett except not as reckless. Anyway, am I the only one who remembered that Col. Everett put 6 nukes in orbit of Lantea to defend against the Wraith and Col. Ellis used Horizon (6 nukes) to destroy the Asuran armada? Sounds like a pattern to me.

AGT58

Haliyah
February 7th, 2007, 08:39 AM
anyone notice the new uniforms rodney and sheppard were sporting? they're just like sg1's bdu's but instead they're blacky grey


AUGH! I hate them so much!

They're not Atlantis, they're SG-1!

I suppose the more frequent sightings of those horrid things is in some way foreshadowing the increased militarization of Atlantis, and the fact that it's now the "main show" and has to look like it.

:(

Jeyla4ever
February 7th, 2007, 08:39 AM
I liked this episode a lot..it was kind of slow at the beginning....but the visual effects were fantastic....and the city at night! LOVED IT!

I have to say, I liked Weir in this episode a lot.... I hope that the writers do her characters some justice for whatever they have plan for her. I was with her the entire time, I didn't like how Earth handled the whole situation and basically ignored Atlantis and finally used them to protect themselves and risking the lives and the city in its place....if they had informed Atlantis from the beginning...they would have a least come up with other alternate solutions...but then, we wouldn't have First Strike...my point, I sympathize with Weir on this one..and I liked how she handled the situation....

Ronon and Teyla...my goodness....they do need to learn some science if they want to be more useful....I loved that balcony scene between these three..they have such great chemistry...and Ronon smirking the entire time John was trying to explain to Teyla about the Fantastic Four....Wonderful moment.....there is a true sense of family there...it's like John could have been in so many other places at that moment....and yet he was with them...very nice!

Rodney and Radek...I love those two....that was fantastic work between them...and this time, Zelenka was actually right! LOL

Rodney telling Ellis off...loved it!

The scene with Weir and the explosion....very nice effects...nicely done!

Finally, we see John not going on his own to save the city....this cliffie has them together facing the odds as one...as a team...love that concept, it goes with the continuity of the season that they are indeed a team and that they stand together.....

Keller...I liked how they introduced her character...she had more screentime than Carson had at the beginning....but I liked her approach...still, she's no Carson.....sorry.....I"m going to miss him tremendously....

overall, with the exception of the Return part 1, I never liked the other cliffies, but this one is good and I can't wait till see where it all takes them in Season 4.....

btw, I really miss the Wraith!

dispader
February 7th, 2007, 08:42 AM
One scene I found interesting was Zelenka and McKay verifying that the nukes were ready to be launched. No snark or arguing - just some moving dialogue on how to do what was right - lie, sabotage - with Rodney sadly admitting that he had seen the ships and knew the danger. He didn't necessarily think the nukes were right, but he didn't know what else to do.

Yeah, that was a great scene. The camera angles were really good and I don't remember any music playing either, very solem. It was a good preamble to the long CGI shot of the Horizon.

ata_beckett
February 7th, 2007, 08:45 AM
Keller...I liked how they introduced her character...she had more screentime than Carson had at the beginning....but I liked her approach...still, she's no Carson.....sorry.....I"m going to miss him tremendously....



Really? I thought he was all over the frakking place in "Rising" pt 1.


Gah! Sorry! Offtopic!

Ripple in Space
February 7th, 2007, 08:57 AM
It depends on the age of the person who's looking at her. Several of us who've looked at her and said she looks too young for the part are over 30. We've been 24. We know what it looks like. It's a fact of life. It's like them trying to pass Scully off as 30 when Gillian Anderson was 24 on XF. There was no way she was realistically 30 plus until she actually hit about that age in real life.

@ 24 she can't even have a degree in internal medicine....
You can't even get an M.D. before you're 21, so that leaves 3 years, minus the few months she's been on Atlantis. It's basically impossible for her to be a surgeon, or have virtually any specialization.

Linzi
February 7th, 2007, 09:14 AM
@ 24 she can't even have a degree in internal medicine....
You can't even get an M.D. before you're 21, so that leaves 3 years, minus the few months she's been on Atlantis. It's basically impossible for her to be a surgeon, or have virtually any specialization.
Well. Jewel is 24, but that doesn't mean her character is that age. We have no idea what age she's supposed to be on the show, therefore I don't see how being 24 is relevent here. I'm amazed when I find out the ages of some actors, as their characters look either older or younger than the actors who play them. I thought Jewel looked and certainly acted older than her years, and as she's meant to be a junior doctor, I didn't see her as being unrealistic. To me, she could have been anything between 25-32. It's really difficult to tell how old some people are.

Lt.Colonel John Sheppard
February 7th, 2007, 09:15 AM
i rerad the transcript for this episode and it reminded me of exodus and enemies.

akbar56
February 7th, 2007, 09:16 AM
@ 24 she can't even have a degree in internal medicine....
You can't even get an M.D. before you're 21, so that leaves 3 years, minus the few months she's been on Atlantis. It's basically impossible for her to be a surgeon, or have virtually any specialization.

So therefore by your logic to be a surgeon (as her character is) she must be older.

I do miss Carson (especially after meeting the actor in a bar, totally nice guy) but characters dying is never easy to deal with but is a step forward in story and realism for the show. I accept it. I watch it. I enjoy the show.

[SGC_ReplicÅtors]
February 7th, 2007, 09:41 AM
the horizon was dam sweet and the missiles going from it was hela cool....it was awe aspering

especially when the planet blow with the nukes man the replis must be pissed if some1 droped like 6 nukes onto ur planet...atlantis got what it deserved

vaberella
February 7th, 2007, 10:04 AM
Well. Jewel is 24, but that doesn't mean her character is that age. We have no idea what age she's supposed to be on the show, therefore I don't see how being 24 is relevent here. I'm amazed when I find out the ages of some actors, as their characters look either older or younger than the actors who play them. I thought Jewel looked and certainly acted older than her years, and as she's meant to be a junior doctor, I didn't see her as being unrealistic. To me, she could have been anything between 25-32. It's really difficult to tell how old some people are.

Thank you Linzi. I don't understand this talk of age and looks. It's impossible to really tell who someone is by age, you can guess that doesn't mean you're right...age and looks is as subjective as ethnicity and looks.

Do people not take into consideration models for example?! When I was first saw pictures of Cindy Crawford or Nikki Taylor when they were around 16 or 17, I could have sworn they were 26-28. It wouldn't even cross my mind that they still had to follow a curfew and haven't graduated from college. This doesn't count for the women I've seen who are 27 (a friend of mine) with three kids and she's married and I thought she was 16 and her retail job was her summer job. So looks mean nothing in regards to her age and if she's qualified or not.

She looked realistic in her role to be junior to head, she could be passed as a 32 year old in my book (so I'm way off), although I would see her as someone in her late 20s not even 24. Much like I see the Weir to be in her early 40s, such as 42/43, not late 30s which the actress in real life might be.

I totally and wholeheartedly agree with that statement in bold. I remember watching Buffy for the first season and when I found out that the girl who played Cordelia was in her mid 30s and older than David Boreanz or that James Marsten (?) was in his 40s; I almost had an apoplectic fit. Shoot just finding out that Alyson Hannigan(which was extremely realistic, because I was that age and girls looked like that in my high school) was 28 and playing a viriginal 15 year old made me have a bit of drama.


All in all matching looks to age is impossible and I also agree that Jewel played it successfully and I like Dr. Keller, alot.

VB

prion
February 7th, 2007, 10:12 AM
Overall, a good episode. hope part 2 continues it and doesn't fall flat.

Dr. Keller - I like her, but more when she's in doctor mode than 'I really don't want this job' mode. So she's been a doctor on base we've not yet seen before, and is just getting a promotion of sorts. The medical promotions on SG shows is always a bit boggling - Carson was genetic research, yet he was also the chief surgeon and CMO? Considering what goes on with Atlantis, they'd do very well to get some battle-seasoned docs or ER trauma docs to patch up people from explosions, etc.

I could see the DOOM above WEir's hear when she talked about quitting/resigning/whatever, which seemed odd for a woman who has spent a LOT of time fighting the bureaucracy. Quite honestly I'd expect they'd have to fire her and drag her off the city before she'd quit. Where did this 'woe is me?' attitude suddenly come from?

The surgical strike against the Asurans? One word came to mind, and I can't post it here but it's not kind. Basically, the military idiots seemed to have NO backup plan (shades of current US war mentality) as to what would happen if things didn't go precisely their way. I mean, this is throwing a rock at a hornet's nest. They WILL follow you. Rodney should have pointed out that unless you bump off every single Asuran, they'll just rebuild their army and launch a counteract.

The balcony scene with Ronon feeling useless in situations like that (but his remarks about 'if you need someone killed,' ha!)

Good personal interaction with the characters, and Shep actually looking worried about having to fly the CITY.

Poor Weir. I daresay the windows can't be made of standard glass as realistically, she'd look like she'd been through a cheesegrater from a blast like that - massive cuts, burns. I suspect in part 2 she'll have one bruise and one bandage.

Sadly, the writers never truly explored the planet and now it's gone for good (well, we doubt they'll go back for a visit). I hope that wherever they end up will mean they'll actually do some exploration.

Questions: why did the control chair swivel around? It never did that before...

Hopes for part 2 include:

Shep and McKay don't find it easy to run the city (as they're next in line to do it).
They don't leave Weir in a coma too long (come on, i'm sure she'll be in a coma - it's standard!)
We don't see Ronon bounce back hunky-dory after getting speared with a hunk of glass.
We still get wraith in season 4. The Asurans... well, they shouldn't be able to find the city now.

Willow'sCat
February 7th, 2007, 10:12 AM
Thank you Linzi. I don't understand this talk of age. Oh come on really you do not understand "fans" not being happy with Jewel taking over from a certain Scottish doctor and using this "age thing" as an excuse to attack the character of Dr Keller? *I feel a Mod snip coming on but it is worth it* :cool: I am sick of certain parts of this fandom jumping all over her just because she isn't Carson. :rolleyes:

I don't personally think Weir is old enough, never mind experienced enough to be the over all leader of SGA, and given it was her decision to make Dr Keller the new head *temporarily or not* then what the heck does that say about her decision making if Dr Keller is too young? :cool:

Also I feel Sheppard is too young to lead the military but hey he is a guy and Sumner didn't have an already established fanbase when Sheppard killed him. :rolleyes:

Sicktem
February 7th, 2007, 10:29 AM
Hmm, I missed that, but still I think the reason for the confusion was because whenever people asked why they didn't move the city when they had 3 ZPMs (and then turn 2 over to Earth) they were told that the hyperdrive was ruined. I guess it would've been nice for them to at least mention why they thought it was a good idea to stay on a planet that the Asurans knew about when they had the chance to escape a future attack that they knew would come. I don't mind if they can come up with a valid explaination, but to just ignore the whole idea until after the damage is done is annoying.

talyn2k1
February 7th, 2007, 10:33 AM
Pretty good episode and here's why:

Good:
+ Awesome CGI probably the best in Stargate history.
+ Sweet, Atlantis can fly..............
+ Decent cliffhanger, will make people return to watch season 4, for sure.
+ It's nice to see Kayleigh, uh I mean Jewel Staite on Stargate. I can't really pass judgement on her character yet though. He was perfect on Firefly and she'll probably be great on Stargate as well, as long as they don't make her character bland.
+ I liked the plan to nuke the replicators, at last they're willing to do what is necessary to win the war.


Bad:
- Weir. Boring, whiney. Think she's always right. Think she has the authority to make the big decisions. Glad she's getting less screen time in season 4.
- While I liked the plan they should've executed it better, more nukes - whatever. It was pretty naive to think that they could completely wipe out the replicators like that.
- Still don't like the replicators.
- Kind of predictable - you knew they weren't going to be successful in their plan to wipe out the replicators.
- Cliffhanger :(
- Like the last SG-1 episode I got some "war on terror" vibes when they're portraying the armed forces as belligerent as they did in this episode. I don't know where the writers are going with that.

Was a good episode. Looking forward to Season 4 (less filler episodes though, please). And yeah, the replicators suck.


I agree with everything you`ve said.

But I don't think it was their intention to completely wipe out the Replicators. They were just trying to disable them until the PWARWs that are being developed at Area 51 get finished.

Especially agree with what you said about Weir, the character just annoys me and I will be glad to see less of her in S4, they can instead devote that screentime to characters I am actually interested in.

prion
February 7th, 2007, 10:46 AM
Oh come on really you do not understand "fans" not being happy with Jewel taking over from a certain Scottish doctor and using this "age thing" as an excuse to attack the character of Dr Keller? *I feel a Mod snip coming on but it is worth it* :cool: I am sick of certain parts of this fandom jumping all over her just because she isn't Carson. :rolleyes:

I don't personally think Weir is old enough, never mind experienced enough to be the over all leader of SGA, and given it was her decision to make Dr Keller the new head *temporarily or not* then what the heck does that say about her decision making if Dr Keller is too young? :cool:

Also I feel Sheppard is too young to lead the military but hey he is a guy and Sumner didn't have an already established fanbase when Sheppard killed him. :rolleyes:

Shep's 40 while Kellar is in her 20s. In the field of medicine, experience does count for a lot. We'd need more input on her background (and I sure hope we don't see "genius," and "top of class" and has 20 degrees. Now the thing is, what is her specialty? Internist? Surgeon? What? Trouble with TV writers is that they see the word 'doctor' and suddenly those doctors are experts in EVERYTHING (sorta like CSI) ;) I'll just wait and see but so far have nothing against the character.

Meanwhile, just realized. We've probably lost every established characters from the previous seasons. After all, Ladon and the Genii won't be able to find Atlantis unless Shep and team run across them. Let's see, volcanco rescued folk are dead, no problem there.... and the Athosians - Halling, etc. - I would hope they'd mourn the loss of Teyla nad the city of the Ancestors or that our guys (once they can) would contact them.

Hypochondriac
February 7th, 2007, 10:46 AM
Didn't like this episode, it was too predictable. Easiest way to extend the 24h limit it to reduce the coverage of the shield.

Remember the pilot episode? The city was sacrificing sections to maintain the command center. So why can't they do the same?

prion
February 7th, 2007, 10:51 AM
I agree with everything you`ve said.

But I don't think it was their intention to completely wipe out the Replicators. They were just trying to disable them until the PWARWs that are being developed at Area 51 get finished.



The trouble with that strategy is, like in throwing a rock at the hornet's nest, they didn't have that can of bug spray ready for the retaliatory attack. Instead, it was still at the store. Strategically, not the smartest move they've done.

ata_beckett
February 7th, 2007, 10:52 AM
Meanwhile, just realized. We've probably lost every established characters from the previous seasons. After all, Ladon and the Genii won't be able to find Atlantis unless Shep and team run across them. Let's see, volcanco rescued folk are dead, no problem there.... and the Athosians - Halling, etc. - I would hope they'd mourn the loss of Teyla nad the city of the Ancestors or that our guys (once they can) would contact them.

You know, I think they're really trying to pull a 180 on Atlantis.

We've essentially gotten rid of our link to the whole "studying wraith physiology" part of the show (what with Carson gone and a new doctor who I'm assuming is NOT any kind of geneticist or medical researcher)...

Kolya's dead, which probably means no more Genii as a recurring enemy.

It's looks like the writers are cutting their losses here. Closing off several storylines all at one time so that they can, essentially, start the series fresh.

Now they can do whatever the heck they want.

pittsburghgirl
February 7th, 2007, 10:58 AM
I don't think she will die at all. The fan base would revolt like nothing else.
Tori Higgins is going to recurring status.

parisindy
February 7th, 2007, 11:05 AM
until Sunday i have never complained about an episode of atlantis before....

Okay so I watched First Strike cause I promised I would give it a try. So i watched it late last night...



Okay maybe I’m just being closed minded but I didn’t care for this episode at all.

First the new doctor…yuck. She seems flakey, okay I didn’t have much time to form a proper opinion, but she seems a lot like Heightmeyer, another character they could have developed. And what happened to Dr. Biro? Wasn’t she next in line? Maybe I have just resolved to dislike her but I miss Carson and I’m sorry I may never like her for that reason alone.

That takes us to the rest of the story…which was completely annoying.

Okay first Colonel Ellis…erg! Where’s Caldwell? This guy is a jerk. Why did they send this new guy and not Caldwell? He says he doesn’t like Weir but says he respects her…baloney! If he respected her he would have asked before beaming down…its called being polite. …. Mission or military or whatever, its still a civilian run operation, and his mission was outside of Atlantis he has no authority on atlantis. This was her base not his.

Second, I know Ellis asked shep to go but did he really or was it an order? He is obviously trying to get shep on his side by saying that shep should run Atlantis and not weir and by asking him to come on the mission etc.

Shep did defend Weir a bit but I am disappointed in him for not saying more in her defense...have they not been working closely together for 3 years? And really aren’t they supposed to be friends?

This takes me to my next point… okay I know shep is the main star of Atlantis… and the military leader, but I don’t want him in charge. I love the underdog and shep, with his record and everything was the underdog. And now they are taking that away from him. What does he have to rise above now?

To me it seemed really Shep was playing the part of Ellis’ puppet and that didn’t sit well with me at all. Where was my firey pissy Shep?

Next the explosion and the flying of Atlantis.

Loved the sinking of Atlantis and I loved Elizabeth watching it. Loved Rodney’s comment about coming full circle. But really that made the fact that she was watching it alone all the more sad.

The flying of Atlantis… was totally ..nothing… I was like 'who cares'… one shot unimpressive shot of it flying with the shield. I expected more from that.

I did like shep’s nervousness about flying it …I wish they would have shown more of the strain it was taking on him…it couldn’t have been easy.
Then the beam hitting the gate room. Oh look the blew up Elizabeth… let me see where I have I seen this before…let me think… oh yeah... WHEN THEY BLEW UP CARSON!
Sheesh couldn’t they have at least made it different? And was that to be her swan song,... sadly i think they've done her an injustice.. now will she will as reoccurring as ford i think... two episodes in 2 years.

Then after the exsplosion three seconds of shep looking slightly concerned then that’s it. Man I got to say I’m disappointed. Elizabeth deserved better

And so they are moving to a new planet…what about the Athosians?… and why wasn’t Teyla concerned about them, and oh man I love Telya but they mad her seem so snippy over the fantastic four comment. Rodney is much more Mr fantastic anyways… shep is totally the human torch.

So are they going to a new planet then? I’ll miss the beautiful waterscapes. But that’s one change I can except.

The highlights of this episode…. Chuck getting a name ( I gotta say I’m smitten with Chuck) and shep being nervous about flying Atlantis...and looking hot in the black uniform.

Other then that… two big thumbs down.

all the characters just seemed off...

and we all know whats going to happen in the next episode...

sam carter with swoop in with her nice new shiney ship and save the day... swell i can't wait http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d142/mercurys_winter/bored.gif

man i'm so depressed now :(

starfox
February 7th, 2007, 11:14 AM
I'll open with my one nitpick, then get on to the many things I found fantastic about this episode.

Nitpick: Athosians? C'mon, it would've taken one line to tell us where they were. Are they still on the planet the Anciets found for them? Are they in the city? One line, guys. It's not that hard.


But, I suppose an episode can't be perfect in every way, and this was a fantastic episode. It's everything I want and have come to expect from Atlantis. There were multiple levels of conflict, great character moments (serious as well as amusing), real danger, and great effects. I approve.


Conflict

Atlantis is a secondary concern to those on Earth. This episode pretty much spelled that out. Any one with an ounce of common sense would have known that provoking the Asurans could only lead to trouble for Atlantis. They just didn't care. It was made even more evident with the conversation between John and Colonel Ellis when Ellis insisted that if they had assured the saftey of Earth, then they had done the right thing. Nothing about risking the safety of the city or the people in it; it's all about Earth. Which is perfectly understandable from the SGC standpoint, but I think what we're going to be looking at in the future is that the people on the Atlantis base are coming to identify themselves more as Atlanteans, and aren't going to be as quick to risk their lives and their home for the SGC's short-sighted decisions in the future. Because, really, the IOA and the SGC had to know that any Asurans who survive would launch a retaliatory strike on Atlantis. There was no acknowledgement of that fact from Ellis. I think that this episode was a big step in Atlantis moving towards independence from Earth, as it seems obvious in this episode that the political figures on Earth see Atlantis more as a weapon than a base worthy of protection.

While the effects of the strike against the Asuran homeworld and the weapon and the sinking of the city and the shield were all phenomenal, I think the Asuran attack was less important than the conflict it's setting up, which is less between Earth/Atlantis and the Asurans than it is between Atlantis and Earth.


Character

This episode introduced new characters and reminded us of who the old ones really are, so I'm just going to go through them and the most memorable moments.

Ellis: Less his own character and more of a figurehead for Earth's feelings about Atlantis. Important because of what he represents, and the character was very well-acted, but as a person, he's not that important.

Dr. Keller: She was well-introduced. It showed respect for Carson, and her uncertainty and unwillingness to keep the position make her a character audience members can identify with. She's been thrown into this. She's not Carson, and what's interesting and important is that she knows that. She doesn't want to be there any more than the audience wants her there. But things have turned out the way they've turned out, and she's gonna end up staying. She'll learn to deal with it, and I think I can learn to deal with her being there. I wasn't struck by Jewel's brilliance in her second scene, but then again, I've had moments with all of the regulars (with the exception of Jason) where I was less than impressed with how they played a scene, so I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt. I think I can come to like her, and I hope other people will, too.

And to those complaining because Jewel's young and pretty? Yes, I think she's absolutely gorgeous. But as far as eye-candy goes, I would have preferred Carson. And I like her anyway. The scene between Keller and Weir was well-done. So, you know, we're not all in it 'cause she's pretty.

Sheppard: "Well, then I'd be the man, and who would I have to rage against?" It seems like he's joking here, but I think that line tells us exactly why Sheppard isn't in charge. He doesn't want to have to make all the big decisions by himself. This is a guy who doesn't even take his personnel reviews seriously, though I think he's the type of person who knows every soldier under his command. He's a good military commander, but not all of the situations they find themselves in have a military solution. And besides, putting Shep in charge would be trapping him in the box he's so good at thinking outside of.

Also? Second character in this episode who doesn't want the responsibilit people are trying to shove upon him. We may be edging towards a theme, here.

Ronon: The "I need to learn some science" line was both consistent with what we already know about him (he feels the need to be useful), and opened up another side to him. He's not averse to academic pursuits, if he finds them useful. If Atlantis does end up going independent and everyone has to develop multiple skill sets, we could see him doing a much wider range of things than what we're used to.

*crosses fingers and hopes so, 'cause Jason Momoa? Is awesome and underused in this show*

*Teyla: Scene with Elizabeth! They talk to each other and stuff. Yeah, that's all I have to say about her in this ep. Hey, she got more than 3 lines last week, I guess the writers decided they'd hit Teyla-quota for the season.

*Elizabeth: If Keller and Sheppard are trying to avoid responsibility, Elizabeth is trying to keep hers. Ladies and gentlemen, we have achieved theme recognition. People are maneuvered towards positions they don't want, against their will (Sheppard and Keller), while Elizabeth is being pushed out of a position she does want and does well in. It's interesting, this episode's theme is also a continuation of last week's. Ronon and John had that scene in the tunnels where John had to recognize that this was a huge problem they'd started, and that they couldn't fight in the same way they're used to. Elizabeth realized the same thing here, and was largely ignored. Did anyone else notice that her plan pretty much amounted to stabbing the Replicators in the back? It was completely amoral and completely justifiable. She wanted to get the Asurans on their side until they had a weapon great enough to destroy all of them. A far cry from the idealistic, moral woman we saw in Season 1. Yes, the Replicators needed to be stopped before they reached Earth, but Elizabeth realized immediately how negatively the move was going to affect Atlantis, and was the only one with a plan ready to counteract that. And she was shoved aside. Her statement that she may have to step down was ominous, but I think it just follows the plot of shoving Atlantis' needs aside for Earth's goals. Because I think Elizabeth will always put Atlantis first.

*Rodney: As usual, had the best moments in this episode. The personnel reviews moment was completely believable and fitting. Rodney's not one of those modern managers who believes in fostering team spirit. He wants to get the job done (and maybe get a Nobel in the process). He doesn't have time to play the petty political games everyone else is playing. And that comes back later.
The scene where Rodney and Radek were standing in front of the nuke, discussing whether or not to tamper with it? Telling and chilling. I love the fact that Radek suggested tampering with it. He is sneaky and willing to do things that are sketchy and a good guy to have on your side. But Rodney didn't do it. It would have interfered with doing what needed to get done. At this point, he was unsure of what the best route to protecting the city was, and so went with what he thought was best, which was probably the moral right thing to do. Don't you just love it when Rodney ends up being the one with the halo?
And then he backs Elizabeth! The "Yeah, don't think that's your call" moment made me So. Happy. He sticks with his team and is so good at dismissing people. Ellis wasn't worthy of his notice, and he just flicked the guy aside. It says a lot about solidarity and his faith in Elizabeth's leadership. And also, that he doesn't always let himself get pushed around.

Radek: Mentioned in the Rodney section, but I just want to reiterate how serious that scene with the nuke was. He doesn't mind being the voice of the morally dubious, which is interesting.

Also? The bickering scene in the lab, and Shep's "why don't you just make out and get it over with"? Amazing.

Lorne: Loved his lines in this. Mainly 'cause "Son of a b*tch, this may actually work" is something I would say.

All in all, this was a fantastic episode, an important episode, and one that I think will take Atlantis in a new direction.



Favorite Scenes:

*McKay-Zelenka nuke scene
*McKay sticking up for Elizabeth
*McKay-Zelenka bickering in the lab and John telling them to make out. Someone's been paying attention to fandom.


Fantastic episode.

prion
February 7th, 2007, 11:17 AM
parisindy said

First the new doctor…yuck. She seems flakey, okay I didn’t have much time to form a proper opinion, but she seems a lot like Heightmeyer, another character they could have developed. And what happened to Dr. Biro? Wasn’t she next in line? Maybe I have just resolved to dislike her but I miss Carson and I’m sorry I may never like her for that reason alone.

I'm pretty sure Biro's a pathologist, and works more with the dead than the living, and although perhaps she should have been next in line, I dare say TPTB would go, uh uh. Yeah, wonder if Heightmeyer is still around....

Okay first Colonel Ellis…erg! Where’s Caldwell? This guy is a jerk. Why did they send this new guy and not Caldwell? He says he doesn’t like Weir but says he respects her…baloney! If he respected her he would have asked before beaming down…its called being polite. …. Mission or military or whatever, its still a civilian run operation, and his mission was outside of Atlantis he has no authority on atlantis. This was her base not his.

Probably because Mitch PIleggi (Caldwell) was busy on the soon-to-be-cancelled DAYBREAK show on ABC. Meanwhile, Ellis did come in like a stormtrooper. Just beamed Rodney up without so much as a by your leave. Sheesh!

Second, I know Ellis asked shep to go but did he really or was it an order? He is obviously trying to get shep on his side by saying that shep should run Atlantis and not weir and by asking him to come on the mission etc.

hard to tell, but I believe an order was in there. I don't think SHep had a choice.

Shep did defend Weir a bit but I am disappointed in him for not saying more in her defense...have they not been working closely together for 3 years? And really aren’t they supposed to be friends?

yeah.... but Shep also believed in the military strategy that Weir didn't believe in (and in some respects, she was right!) I think a disagreement there on tactics is realistic.

This takes me to my next point… okay I know shep is the main star of Atlantis… and the military leader, but I don’t want him in charge. I love the underdog and shep, with his record and everything was the underdog. And now they are taking that away from him. What does he have to rise above now?

I honestly don't think they'll put Shep in charge - maybe while the city floats around 'lost in space' until they land and Weir is back on her feet, or something near it. My hope is that they DON'T bring in Carter for that purpose.


I did like shep’s nervousness about flying it …I wish they would have shown more of the strain it was taking on him…it couldn’t have been easy.
Then the beam hitting the gate room. Oh look the blew up Elizabeth… let me see where I have I seen this before…let me think… oh yeah... WHEN THEY BLEW UP CARSON!

Well, have the title 'doctor' and you die, so McKay had better get a Kevlar vest!

The highlights of this episode…. Chuck getting a name ( I gotta say I’m smitten with Chuck) and shep being nervous about flying Atlantis...and looking hot in the black uniform.

Yeah, Chuck's got a name! ;)


sam carter with swoop in with her nice new shiney ship and save the day...

I really hope NOT.

Ruffles
February 7th, 2007, 11:18 AM
I could see the DOOM above WEir's hear when she talked about quitting/resigning/whatever, which seemed odd for a woman who has spent a LOT of time fighting the bureaucracy. Quite honestly I'd expect they'd have to fire her and drag her off the city before she'd quit. Where did this 'woe is me?' attitude suddenly come from?

I actually took that as a moment of doubt expressed to someone (Teyla) who would understand. Just a second of blowing off steam before getting it back together and doing what she needed to do. I think she really would fight tooth and nail to stay.

starfox
February 7th, 2007, 11:19 AM
Also, forgot to mention this in my really massive post.

The shield and power issues when trying to launch the city prove to me that Atlantis isn't so much a flying city as it is a city that happens to fly. It can fly, but I think that's just a perk/backup plan; it wasn't ever meant to be a floating space station. So, I'm of the opinion they'll either find somewhere to park her, or have lots of fun dangerous plots with things going wrong with the city because she wasn't really meant to be a space station.

[/two cents]

ata_beckett
February 7th, 2007, 11:20 AM
I actually took that as a moment of doubt expressed to someone (Teyla) who would understand. Just a second of blowing off steam before getting it back together and doing what she needed to do. I think she really would fight tooth and nail to stay.

But how did she go from being depressed for six weeks in Return 1 about having to leave Atlantis to even MENTIONING leaving voluntarily???

Pitry
February 7th, 2007, 11:25 AM
Oh. Good thing about them moving to a enw planet - no more need for a ZPM deus ex machina every three episodes. Wraith/ Asurans not knowing where they are = they don't need the city shield = th ZPM can be depleted and over with. ;)

starfox
February 7th, 2007, 11:25 AM
But how did she go from being depressed for six weeks in Return 1 about having to leave Atlantis to even MENTIONING leaving voluntarily???

Just 'cause it would be voluntary on paper doesn't mean it would be easy. After all, leaving kicking and screaming would be bad for the city and guarantee that she never got the chance to return. Stepping out gracefully would give her the opportunity to return when the IOA realized how wrong, wrong, wrong they were.

Or maybe it wouldn't be voluntary. "I may have to step down" doesn't necessarily mean, "I may leave", in this instance it more likely means "They're going to make me leave."

Or maybe she was just stressing and fretting. We often mention possibilities of actions we have no intention of taking when venting to our friends. Why can't Elizabeth be the same way?

The Ascended One
February 7th, 2007, 11:26 AM
Wier feels that the IOA no longer have confidence in her abilities and as a result she is depressed and feels that other people in Atlantis are begining to second jedge her as a result she feels that she must leave. In return 1 she felt like she was being forced out by the ancients, however in first strike she is leaving of her own volition and she has control of her new situation (her leaving)

nonniemous
February 7th, 2007, 11:26 AM
But how did she go from being depressed for six weeks in Return 1 about having to leave Atlantis to even MENTIONING leaving voluntarily???

Because the show is written by folks who can't be bothered to keep their characters straight or understand that characterization is what ultimately drives a story forward, putting characters into situations and then seeing how they react, not twisting their characters to fit the reactions they want. Even their beloved McKay doesn't escape. It's sloppy, lazy storytelling and one of the many holes in their sinking ship--holes that perky bumps aren't going to plug.

Mitchell82
February 7th, 2007, 11:31 AM
Ok, can we please stop bandying the "24 years old" thing around? It's a fact that we don't know how old Dr. Keller is, and nowhere does it say that the characters must have the same age as the actors.

Maybe it's just me (but again, I'm a horrible judge of age), but she looked mature enough.

Agree she more than looked the part IMO. I was interested in her at the start. She didnt make me want to go screaming to TPTB. So far she's a great choice.

ata_beckett
February 7th, 2007, 11:34 AM
Just 'cause it would be voluntary on paper doesn't mean it would be easy. After all, leaving kicking and screaming would be bad for the city and guarantee that she never got the chance to return. Stepping out gracefully would give her the opportunity to return when the IOA realized how wrong, wrong, wrong they were.

Or maybe it wouldn't be voluntary. "I may have to step down" doesn't necessarily mean, "I may leave", in this instance it more likely means "They're going to make me leave."

Or maybe she was just stressing and fretting. We often mention possibilities of actions we have no intention of taking when venting to our friends. Why can't Elizabeth be the same way?


To me, the whole thing just trivializes how completely in love with that city Elizabeth is. Considering how much she fought when Woosley showed up to "review" her, it seems odd that "stepping down" would even enter her mind.

This isn't the Elizabeth that I've seen for 3 seasons now.

bluealien
February 7th, 2007, 12:18 PM
Excellent ep - loved it. The new Colonel was fantastic and had great chemisty with Shep. Very fast paced and kept me on the edge of my seat until the end - and what a cliffe!!

Jewel was fine and she did a good job - I was worried about her being so young but she was quite believable. Great to see Carson get a mention too.

I loved the whole military feel and it gave the episode quite an edge to it. Didnt like Weir's complaining about not being consulted in a military matter, and she came across as kinda petulant. What could she have done, and as Ellis said they saved Earth from an Armada of Asuran ships, so not sure what her problem was. Did she really think she could negotiate and they would just back down, especially after her last disasterous attempt to negotiate with them. Her threat to resign and her consequent injury would seem to indicate her departure from the show.



McKay was great and I loved the scenes with him and Radek. Almost spit out my coffee at Shep telling them just to make out. Loved the scene between Shep/Ronan and Teyla and the Mr Fantastic comment and watching him stumbling over trying to explain what he ment. Lovely character moments and great team dynamic. The city sinking and the city flying were awesome. Great to see Shep using his ATA gene - FINALLY. Shep rushing to the gateroom and then up the gate steps to see if everyone was Ok. Nice character moments and the ending has me eagerly awaiting season four.

10/10

Celcool
February 7th, 2007, 12:20 PM
But how did she go from being depressed for six weeks in Return 1 about having to leave Atlantis to even MENTIONING leaving voluntarily???


To me, the whole thing just trivializes how completely in love with that city Elizabeth is. Considering how much she fought when Woosley showed up to "review" her, it seems odd that "stepping down" would even enter her mind.

This isn't the Elizabeth that I've seen for 3 seasons now.
I agree. she wouldn't want to leave Atlantis, she loves the city and the people she's working with too much for leaving them just like that, voluntarily. It was a momentary thing when she talked about resigning, the way I see it, she wouldn't actually go through with it (if she'd give it time likeTeyla advised her to).

Platschu
February 7th, 2007, 12:37 PM
I have found 3 mistakes:

1. The Asuran satellite's stargate has only 8 chevron as the Gatebridge in "Return". The different CGI teams should speak about that the Pegasus gates have 8 or 9 chevron.

2. McKay mentioned that the six warhead exploded succefully. Than why have we seen 10 rockets in the animation?

3. They reused Baal's lamps from Abyss again. :)

grasshopper64
February 7th, 2007, 12:41 PM
Overall a good episode, they actually got Atlantis flying:) and I can't wait until July to see what happens.

However, totally unimpresed by Dr Keller, nothing again Jewel Staite but I think they made a mistake in casting her and I don't just say they because of Carson. I just can't take someone seriously who looks like they are barely
21, let alone supposedly chief of medicine or whatever the title is. As has been mentioned there are plenty of talented 30 something actresses out there.

I wasn't impressed by Col Ellis either, just felt a tad predictable the way he came in and acted like he was running the place. He might grow on me, who knows but I miss Caldwell.

To be the most noticeable thing was the absense of Weir at the end. We don't know if she is ok, what happened to her, or if this somehow ties into her reduced/recurring role whatever that is, I thought she was good in this ep and will miss her as a regular.

BJX
February 7th, 2007, 12:43 PM
2. McKay mentioned that the six warhead exploded succefully. Than why have we seen 10 rockets in the animation?


4 decoys.

Luz
February 7th, 2007, 12:45 PM
until Sunday i have never complained about an episode of atlantis before....

Okay so I watched First Strike cause I promised I would give it a try. So i watched it late last night...



Okay maybe I’m just being closed minded but I didn’t care for this episode at all.

First the new doctor…yuck. She seems flakey, okay I didn’t have much time to form a proper opinion, but she seems a lot like Heightmeyer, another character they could have developed. And what happened to Dr. Biro? Wasn’t she next in line? Maybe I have just resolved to dislike her but I miss Carson and I’m sorry I may never like her for that reason alone.

That takes us to the rest of the story…which was completely annoying.

Okay first Colonel Ellis…erg! Where’s Caldwell? This guy is a jerk. Why did they send this new guy and not Caldwell? He says he doesn’t like Weir but says he respects her…baloney! If he respected her he would have asked before beaming down…its called being polite. …. Mission or military or whatever, its still a civilian run operation, and his mission was outside of Atlantis he has no authority on atlantis. This was her base not his.

Second, I know Ellis asked shep to go but did he really or was it an order? He is obviously trying to get shep on his side by saying that shep should run Atlantis and not weir and by asking him to come on the mission etc.

Shep did defend Weir a bit but I am disappointed in him for not saying more in her defense...have they not been working closely together for 3 years? And really aren’t they supposed to be friends?

This takes me to my next point… okay I know shep is the main star of Atlantis… and the military leader, but I don’t want him in charge. I love the underdog and shep, with his record and everything was the underdog. And now they are taking that away from him. What does he have to rise above now?

To me it seemed really Shep was playing the part of Ellis’ puppet and that didn’t sit well with me at all. Where was my firey pissy Shep?

Next the explosion and the flying of Atlantis.

Loved the sinking of Atlantis and I loved Elizabeth watching it. Loved Rodney’s comment about coming full circle. But really that made the fact that she was watching it alone all the more sad.

The flying of Atlantis… was totally ..nothing… I was like 'who cares'… one shot unimpressive shot of it flying with the shield. I expected more from that.

I did like shep’s nervousness about flying it …I wish they would have shown more of the strain it was taking on him…it couldn’t have been easy.
Then the beam hitting the gate room. Oh look the blew up Elizabeth… let me see where I have I seen this before…let me think… oh yeah... WHEN THEY BLEW UP CARSON!
Sheesh couldn’t they have at least made it different? And was that to be her swan song,... sadly i think they've done her an injustice.. now will she will as reoccurring as ford i think... two episodes in 2 years.

Then after the exsplosion three seconds of shep looking slightly concerned then that’s it. Man I got to say I’m disappointed. Elizabeth deserved better

And so they are moving to a new planet…what about the Athosians?… and why wasn’t Teyla concerned about them, and oh man I love Telya but they mad her seem so snippy over the fantastic four comment. Rodney is much more Mr fantastic anyways… shep is totally the human torch.

So are they going to a new planet then? I’ll miss the beautiful waterscapes. But that’s one change I can except.

The highlights of this episode…. Chuck getting a name ( I gotta say I’m smitten with Chuck) and shep being nervous about flying Atlantis...and looking hot in the black uniform.

Other then that… two big thumbs down.

all the characters just seemed off...

and we all know whats going to happen in the next episode...

sam carter with swoop in with her nice new shiney ship and save the day... swell i can't wait http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d142/mercurys_winter/bored.gif

man i'm so depressed now :(

I've gotta say, thank you for saving me a post, I absolutely agree with everything. Specially the way they wrote Elizabeth's accident, they've lacked so much originality later, but this takes the cake, not only was it dumb, but also a rip off of a previous episode. And yeah that doctor, they could have saved all that "woobie me I've been forced to take Carson's place, don't hate me", I hate her nonetheless, she's just bland, and not Carson, that seems like a good enough reason for me.
I was expecting some great episode (I mean from what we'd heard about the grandiosity of it), but it felt rather BLEH!, like Siege 2 (just nowhere near the awesomeness of it) but with the replicators instead of the wraith.

Ruffles
February 7th, 2007, 12:59 PM
I agree. she wouldn't want to leave Atlantis, she loves the city and the people she's working with too much for leaving them just like that, voluntarily. It was a momentary thing when she talked about resigning, the way I see it, she wouldn't actually go through with it (if she'd give it time likeTeyla advised her to).

Exactly. I think she was feeling the pressure of having yet another military leader completely dismissed her and was just venting to a friend - a momentary of "Why am I putting up with this garbage?". From her exchange with Ellis leading to her conversation with Oberoth, she had no intention of losing Atlantis without a fight.

Trialia
February 7th, 2007, 01:07 PM
To me, the whole thing just trivializes how completely in love with that city Elizabeth is. Considering how much she fought when Woosley showed up to "review" her, it seems odd that "stepping down" would even enter her mind.

This isn't the Elizabeth that I've seen for 3 seasons now.
I thoroughly agree. It's not like the character we know.

darkrose
February 7th, 2007, 01:30 PM
I agree with everything you`ve said.

But I don't think it was their intention to completely wipe out the Replicators. They were just trying to disable them until the PWARWs that are being developed at Area 51 get finished.


And that was just stupid. Seriously: if you're going to make a pre-emptive strike, then you have to be prepared to use overwhelming force and cripple the enemy's ability to respond. You don't go in, drop six nukes and leave. That was my biggest problem with this episode: the idea that the U.S. military, post-Iraq, would think that going in half-a***** once again would be a good idea.