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CalmStorm
September 21st, 2006, 07:07 PM
In regards to the comments on the main team taking death so lightly and be able to joke, I think it is only a coping mechanism. I think Shep was genuinely upset at the loss, at all the losses. His main priority was to get their dead back to Atlantis first. It was only when that was not an option were they stuck in their situation.

I think that the losses do affect the entire team. However, Teyla and Ronon have always been exposed to death with the wraith and the fight against them their entire lives. Shep has been exposed to death with his time in the military. Now, Shep, McKay, Carson and Weir have all been exposed to death and the situation they are in since their time in the SG program.

It is a risky venture everytime someone steps through the gate to explore something new. All are aware of the risks and have accepted them. I think the team recogonizes this and tries to move on the best they can. If they were to be completely solemn as most of us would be in that situation, their lives would be absolutely miserable. For most of us, this would be a shocking event and we would probably be stunned into silence and sorrow. For the team who faces death everyday, I think they take it in stride. Even when making the jokes, I think they still feel the pain of what happened, but realize they must go on. In the end, those events, and those deaths will always be with them.

ShadowMaat
September 21st, 2006, 07:09 PM
They weren't main characters, I don't even think they were recurring, so who the hell cares about 'em? :rolleyes: Just a couple more pieces of collateral damage in TPTB's Great Big Book of Dark and Edgy. ;) Their lives meant nothing. They WERE nothing. But their deaths provided a few moments of dramatic tension and set up the crux of the ep.

At least McKay showed some angst back in Defiant One when Nyan died. But that was a long time ago and even then it was quickly forgotten.

I wonder if Atlantis sent through some body bags to seal up the decaying remains of the dead plot devices.

Candy
September 21st, 2006, 08:39 PM
I love it when the wraith show up!:)

MarshAngel
September 22nd, 2006, 09:18 AM
It is a risky venture everytime someone steps through the gate to explore something new. All are aware of the risks and have accepted them. I think the team recogonizes this and tries to move on the best they can. If they were to be completely solemn as most of us would be in that situation, their lives would be absolutely miserable. For most of us, this would be a shocking event and we would probably be stunned into silence and sorrow. For the team who faces death everyday, I think they take it in stride. Even when making the jokes, I think they still feel the pain of what happened, but realize they must go on. In the end, those events, and those deaths will always be with them.

It's one thing to believe this because we know that they are supposed to be good people and they do experience these things but it's far more important that we see it on screen when it counts most. For one, it adds depth and meaning and balance. for those of us whose belief in their inherent goodness is not quite so strong it would be confirmation that it's not all fun and games. And the reason why the absence of it is so clear is because it really doesn't take that much time to establish, mere seconds.

prion
September 22nd, 2006, 09:52 AM
They weren't main characters, I don't even think they were recurring, so who the hell cares about 'em? :rolleyes: Just a couple more pieces of collateral damage in TPTB's Great Big Book of Dark and Edgy. ;) Their lives meant nothing. They WERE nothing. But their deaths provided a few moments of dramatic tension and set up the crux of the ep.

At least McKay showed some angst back in Defiant One when Nyan died. But that was a long time ago and even then it was quickly forgotten.

I wonder if Atlantis sent through some body bags to seal up the decaying remains of the dead plot devices.

They're called 'red shirts,' and they always die ;) Heck, actually, most viewers don't care about them as they rarely if ever speak a line and you know they're just there as canonfodder to move along the storyline. Alas, it's like reality. You see headlines. "24 dead in suicide bombing" and unless the press has a reason to identify them (nationality, importance, etc.) they'll remain just nasty little statistics... :(

I suspect that the Daedalus will do the cleanup/pickup. Knowing that virtually every team member is injured, I don't think bagging a corpse is high on the list, although, really, the bodies should at least be covered, before the crows find them...

prion
September 22nd, 2006, 09:55 AM
In regards to the comments on the main team taking death so lightly and be able to joke, I think it is only a coping mechanism. I think Shep was genuinely upset at the loss, at all the losses. His main priority was to get their dead back to Atlantis first. It was only when that was not an option were they stuck in their situation.

It's black humor, which is prevalent in occupations where you deal with life and death on a daily basis. It doesn't mean you're any less sensitive or compassionate, but it is a coping mechanism for those who survive situations like that. Otherwise, you'd probably go nuts if you kept it all in...

CalmStorm
September 22nd, 2006, 11:36 AM
It's one thing to believe this because we know that they are supposed to be good people and they do experience these things but it's far more important that we see it on screen when it counts most. For one, it adds depth and meaning and balance. for those of us whose belief in their inherent goodness is not quite so strong it would be confirmation that it's not all fun and games. And the reason why the absence of it is so clear is because it really doesn't take that much time to establish, mere seconds.

To me, it did not seem like all fun and games. Shep seemed upset at the loss and his top priority was to get the dead back to Atlantis. I think we have seen each of the main casts serious, hurt reactions at death in episodes past, and I am sure we will see it in episodes in the future.

We saw Shep's reaction to seeing one of his own put a grenade to his chest, we saw Shep's reaction and how strongly he felt about getting his men back to Atlantis, and we saw his hurt when he told Teyla that he was not able to save Holland. I think the effect of the death on him was well established.

This is why I believe that they are affected by death. Each character, to me, has shown that they are not unaffected by the death of friends, and even those team members they might not have known. So making this a focus each and everytime a death occurs is not that important to me. Yes, I choose to believe they are good people who are affected when bad things happen and can enjoy the show without the need for it to be shown each time and/or reconfirmed.

Linzi
September 22nd, 2006, 01:59 PM
It's black humor, which is prevalent in occupations where you deal with life and death on a daily basis. It doesn't mean you're any less sensitive or compassionate, but it is a coping mechanism for those who survive situations like that. Otherwise, you'd probably go nuts if you kept it all in...
Agreed. Having several doctors in my family...boy, do they have weird senses of humour and views on death! They tell me if you can't joke about nasty, depressing things you'd commit suicide. Thus - joking around and behaviour that some see as inappropriate is actually a self-defense mechanism which helps these kind of people survive life. I'd imagine the same goes for anyone in life or death situations...

Linzi
September 22nd, 2006, 02:00 PM
To me, it did not seem like all fun and games. Shep seemed upset at the loss and his top priority was to get the dead back to Atlantis. I think we have seen each of the main casts serious, hurt reactions at death in episodes past, and I am sure we will see it in episodes in the future.

We saw Shep's reaction to seeing one of his own put a grenade to his chest, we saw Shep's reaction and how strongly he felt about getting his men back to Atlantis, and we saw his hurt when he told Teyla that he was not able to save Holland. I think the effect of the death on him was well established.

This is why I believe that they are affected by death. Each character, to me, has shown that they are not unaffected by the death of friends, and even those team members they might not have known. So making this a focus each and everytime a death occurs is not that important to me. Yes, I choose to believe they are good people who are affected when bad things happen and can enjoy the show without the need for it to be shown each time and/or reconfirmed.
Agreed.

A.L.
September 22nd, 2006, 10:27 PM
I realize it may seem that I love every episode of Atlantis to death. This is not true. I just happen to think the last few epi's in a row have been great so that's the kind of reviews you'll see from me for now.

FINALLY! Details on the elusive black mark mission. I know some people were disappointed with this Shep background info but I thought it was great. Not that we haven't seen it before but this reaffirms the lengths Shep will go to, to save someone, and that he'll still do it even though that time, his efforts were in vain. Perhaps that's why he tries so hard now as well; that solider died despite Shep's attempts to rescue him so now Shep tries even harder to make sure everyone comes back alive.

I liked that Teyla was the only one not affected by it. Good continuity. They never said it but I think it's safe to assume her Wraith DNA was the reason and it was nice to have one of them in the real world while all the insanity was going on.

Warning: Shippy comments ahead. If you don't want to know, move along. ;)

Not a lot of Sparky (Shep/Weir) but enough to keep me satisfied. Lizzie worrying over Team Sheppard is always fun to watch. And I loved how in Ronon's vision, he still saw Teyla being dragged away. Say what you will, that perhaps no ship was to be implied by that, but since they didn't specify I feel like I'm allowed to interpret as I will. ;)

I thought it a little unbelievable that the one soldier (sorry forgot his name) with the arm wound died when the one shot in the chest/gut (forgot his name as well) not only survived but would be fine to wait until the Deadalus arrived. I realize the first soldier was moving about when he shouldn't have but still. That seemed a little off to me.

But, overall, another great team epi. I enjoyed it very much.

AL

maxbo
September 24th, 2006, 06:13 AM
Interesting episode. I had expected everyone affected to have violent, *must kill now reactions* and was pleased to see that each character's delusion was more or less character-specific.

Ronon - was the first affected and it was interesting to note that he didn't see his team as the enemy... at first. In fact, when Leonard started shooting at them, his delusions focused on Leonard as the enemy (Wraith) even though Teyla and Shep were closer to him. I expected the Wraith to be a part of his delusions, I just wish TPTB had delved a bit more into his fears.

Teyla - it was good to see her have a meaty role for the first time this season and I loved seeing the deterioration of her team through her eyes. After Major Leonard shot her, her job of trying to keep keep Shep and Ronon from killing each other became more difficult and Rachel did a great job of showing Teyla's determination to fight through her pain and try to get through to Shep before it was too late.

John - as we saw with Ronon, the generator seemed to cause delusions that got worse over time because we got to see him see Holland, instead of Teyla, and then come back to his senses before he completely lost it later. I enjoyed his flashbacks because they gave us just enough to confirm what we had heard about his backgound, but not so much that there's nothing left to be told. I found his delusions interesting because they reinforced a combination of his greatest fears - leaving a friend behind and his fear of being abandoned.

Rodney - seemed to be the least affected and I wonder if his close proximity to the generator cancelled out some of the more immediate damaging effects. Or, maybe Rodney was correct about how different brain chemistry could cause some to be more susceptible than others.

Elizabeth and Zelenka - it was good to see them, on Atlantis, actively trying to help the SGA teams throughout the episode.

Carson - it was also good to see Carson in this episode although his delusions creeped me out more than the others because I didn't realize how extensive his delusions were until he told Rodney that Barraso had helped him with Hagan and then we discovered that Barraso was sitting against the wall, dead. Before that, I thought that Hagan had either been unconscious or had died and that Barraso was unconscious the entire time.

What also made this episode enjoyable was that I loved the guest characters, as a result, I cared about the fates of Barraso and Hagan.

Carson, and the rest of the team, went through several gut wrenching emotions in this episode and I look forward to fanfic to delve into them. Unfortunately, I don't expect TPTB to treat this as more than a one-shot episode so I now look to fanfic to fill in the gaps.

Matt G
December 15th, 2006, 05:05 AM
OK...

1. Interesting to throw the Genii into the mixer.

2. Fairly wierd hallucinations but nothing to really freak me out.

3. Liked Sheppard in Afghanistan.

Overall though, I have to file this week's Gate as two 7/10s or as someone else said "go into the forests of BC and shoot a cheap one".

obsessed1
December 15th, 2006, 06:21 AM
this was a wonderfully dark episode and quite disturbing too!! especially Carson's delusions.

Madeleine
December 15th, 2006, 11:32 PM
I was surprised to find at the end of that ep that I'd enjoyed it quite a lot. Half way through I was thinking how slow and pointless it all was. It ended up being quite atmospheric and good. Nice how everyone saw whatever was going to make them most paranoid and on-edge. Especially for poor Beckett to see that his companion had been a corpse for quite some time - and not even the sort of dignified lain-on-a-table with a cloth over him corpse that doctors usually encounter, but a slumped awkward corpse.

And Yay for Teyla saving the day!

obsessed1
January 3rd, 2007, 01:11 PM
I was surprised to find at the end of that ep that I'd enjoyed it quite a lot. Half way through I was thinking how slow and pointless it all was. It ended up being quite atmospheric and good. Nice how everyone saw whatever was going to make them most paranoid and on-edge. Especially for poor Beckett to see that his companion had been a corpse for quite some time - and not even the sort of dignified lain-on-a-table with a cloth over him corpse that doctors usually encounter, but a slumped awkward corpse.

And Yay for Teyla saving the day!
yeah the whole Carson scenario for me made it so good. It was just so dark and unexpected and really added to the whole episode. I loved how I never guessed what was going on with him until the end where Rodney realises it too. Very cool. And for a Doctor, completely terrifying.

placid
July 22nd, 2007, 02:03 PM
I found this episode as boring as it was predictable.

Trek_Girl42
September 22nd, 2007, 05:09 PM
For the first part of this ep I expected it to be pretty average, but as it went on I really liked it- the stuff with Shep in Afganistan was unexpected and really well done, the whole Carson story.....That poor guy. I guess he just sat there the whole time bleeding to death and Carson never knew. That was pretty horrible. :S Plus, nearly everyone got shot. And I liked that Teyla saved the day. I'm actually already liking her a fair bit more this season than I have in the past.

Overall a dark ep, with a lot of really good stuff in it. I am impressed. :)

MmmmMcKAy
September 22nd, 2007, 06:47 PM
This episode I really enjoyed. It's a real team story. Poor Carson indeed!:( He's such a sweetheart. How traumatic for him.

Teyla is a smart cookie. She absorbs a lot of information, recalls it and knows how to use it. She's always so damn cool too....good person to have around.

And John shot Rodney!!!! How could he?????;);););) "You shot me. You SHOT me!".

Trek_Girl42
September 22nd, 2007, 06:51 PM
This episode I really enjoyed. It's a real team story. Poor Carson indeed!:( He's such a sweetheart. How traumatic for him.

Teyla is a smart cookie. She absorbs a lot of information, recalls it and knows how to use it. She's always so damn cool too....good person to have around.

And John shot Rodney!!!! How could he?????;);););) "You shot me. You SHOT me!".
Hehe, that was priceless. Though I think he said it one too many times at the end. :P I was actually really shocked when he got shot- I wasn't expecting that. I figured they'd leave it at Shep grazing Ronon.

Can't think of any other eps when this many main characters get shot. :P

garhkal
September 23rd, 2007, 02:15 PM
it makes me wonder if Mccay is a random bullet/arrow magnet..

Trek_Girl42
September 24th, 2007, 12:18 AM
it makes me wonder if Mccay is a random bullet/arrow magnet..
I think the writers think so. :P

MechaThor
October 30th, 2007, 03:22 AM
Guys I love this episode! It definatly one of my all time fav Atlantsi eps and one of my favs this series.

The IDEA IS GOOD AS well as the little SG-1 hints. That was a nice touch showing that alot of the other military staff have come from the SGC and have been around for a bit. (well atleast till this ep lol)

My fav bit was the BECKETT/MCKAY stuff wehn they did not kwo they where effected by the device. Especailly Beckett. HIS WAS VERY CLEVER WITH A GREAT TWIST, with how they guy you thought was ok was infact dead.

WingedPegasus
October 30th, 2007, 01:35 PM
This episode I really enjoyed. It's a real team story. Poor Carson indeed!:( He's such a sweetheart. How traumatic for him.

Teyla is a smart cookie. She absorbs a lot of information, recalls it and knows how to use it. She's always so damn cool too....good person to have around.

And John shot Rodney!!!! How could he?????;);););) "You shot me. You SHOT me!".

I totally agree. I was so glad to see Teyla being useful. I loved this ep!

John W
November 1st, 2007, 12:53 PM
I too loved the backstory this episode gave Sheppard. I know there have been slight hints as to this event in previous episodes, but this is the first time we've actually seen something to do with it. I like episodes that give some backstory to the characters, they help flesh them out more.

As for the "You shot me!" bits, they were hilarious and typical Rodney. Although it was made extra funny when Ronon chimed in and said it too, to which Sheppard cried, "I'm sorry I shot everyone!" I also liked Rodney's earlier line about him getting shot in the ass a few episodes ago and it still having some sort of effect on him. LOL!

Butlersgate
March 6th, 2009, 10:47 AM
I too loved the backstory this episode gave Sheppard. I know there have been slight hints as to this event in previous episodes, but this is the first time we've actually seen something to do with it. I like episodes that give some backstory to the characters, they help flesh them out more.

i loved that about this episode too :D this is one of my favourite season 3 episodes.

major davis
May 15th, 2009, 01:58 PM
AMAZING AMAZING episode. Enjoyed seeing some Shepherd backstory.

9.999/10

escyos
June 5th, 2009, 01:26 AM
"you shot me!" haha reminded me of SG-1 Lockdown, Daniel: "Who shot me?" carter movees her eyes to O'Neill - "Dont change the subject"

rushy
November 25th, 2009, 01:36 PM
I totally love this episode except that McKay for some reason almost didn't see any hallucinations at all

ktebid
March 11th, 2010, 01:37 AM
I think McKay was seeing halucinations ...the power that kept spiking.

I thought this was a great episode. I got more out of it the second time around. I loved seeing Shep's history.

Martina Magnus
July 13th, 2010, 06:34 AM
This ep was hilarious :D Expecially the end :D

mrscopterdoc
September 3rd, 2010, 09:35 PM
Love this episode, how everyone had such different hallucinations. I wonder why Teyla wasn't affected? I love Sheppard's line at the end, "I am sorry for shooting everyone!" :P

maneth
January 17th, 2011, 11:03 AM
Phantoms indeed. What a creepy ep. My guess is that Teyla wasn't affected because she has some Wraith genes. The Wraith wouldn't want to risk being affected by the generator themselves.

mathpiglet
May 31st, 2011, 03:36 PM
Meh. Not one of my favourites.

Lunaeclipse
January 10th, 2012, 04:43 PM
I liked this episode. They each had a different way of being effected by the generator. The warrior types had fighting hallucinations, while the more thinking/academic types had thinking ones, so it seemed to be playing with their minds by effecting what was important to them or their fears, so to speak.. This was interesting. Both Sheppard and Ronin saw each other as the enemy, but Carson and Rodney seemed to see everyone else as their normal selves...



Rodney's "You shot me." followed by the "You shot me too."(with that smile) and "I'm sorry for shooting everyone" added humour to the episode.

Lythisrose
August 10th, 2012, 08:17 PM
Joe Mallozzi's Blog (http://josephmallozzi.wordpress.com/2012/08/10/august-10-2012-days-of-stargate-atlantis-past-phantoms-our-supermovie-of-the-week-club-cookie-monster-film-reviews/):
PHANTOMS (309)

For some reason, at some point in his Stargate career, Carl Binder got pegged as “the ghost writer”, possibly because it seemed that very second episode he wrote happened to involve otherworld apparitions or a variation thereof. Aurora. Echoes. Pain. In Phantoms, the ghosts are hallucinations that, beside offering the usual serving of suspense and high adventure, also allow us some insight into Sheppard’s past (specifically regarding his time in Afghanistan and the actions that resulted in charges of misconduct) AND gives us a nice little twist in Beckett’s story (one which I thought was pretty damn well executed).

Longtime Stargate mainstay Martin Wood directed Phantoms, the type of episode we termed a “run and jump” for its heavy action and movement, elements that played to Martin’s strength as a visually dynamic storyteller.

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
August 13th, 2012, 04:31 PM
Good episode, "You shot Me!!!," Shep shot Rodney, awesome. Rodney's having a bad year, getting shot in the ass in Sateda and getting shot in this ep by Shep, damn does that suck for him.

Good to see the Kull Warriors again.

I really can't wait for next week's Summer Finale
It was nice to see Shep have some backstory.

Not much else to say.

Tomorrow, more Ancients, maybe.

Krisz
August 13th, 2012, 07:56 PM
Another episode I like, it's those hallucination ones, I just really like what they come up with the variations on a theme. This one is an episode I've re-watched a few times.

I really liked the different hallucinations they each had. How they focused on everyone's worst fears of failure. Sheppard not saving a friend, McKay unsuccessful in deactivating the Wraith device, Carson losing a life. Ronon just goes off and is Ronon killing things, feeling he has to kill every Wraith.

I watched this for the re-watch with the commentary, it gave some interesting insights into the process of bringing this episode to the screen. The use of a different camera to give the distorted faces the more far gone the characters became. As everyone loses their grip on reality they no longer walk along neat paths through the forest but through more undergrowth to indicate them losing their way. The shot up trees were not real but made of rubber. When Sheppard shoots McKay thinking he's a Taliban, the guy is actually saying "You shot me" in Pashto with the same bewildered response that McKay was doing in actuality.

Great switching from the hallucinations to reality. Poor Teyla, trying to get Sheppard to keep focus by trying to understand what he was acting out. It was so sad when the poor soldier died and Beckett wasn't even aware of it, but kept imagining he was alive. At least the other guy who looked to be more severely injured survived.

Lieutenant Sparrow
August 14th, 2012, 01:32 AM
Not a bad ep.

Some of the hallucinations were creepy. Especially Beckett thinking that guy was still alive.

I really liked how Shep saw the UAV as a jet. And Ronon saw it as a Wraith Dart.

Poor McKay in shock about being shot by Shep haha.

jelgate
August 18th, 2012, 06:12 PM
I liked Phantoms because their was a little something for everyone. Sure Sheppherd got the major focus but I think everyone got some character moments (except Teyla). The Wraith device showed what ther various character fear the most which to me. Sheppherd fears being responsible for a team mate's death as shown how he was responsible for that soldier/friend dieing in Afghanstan. Ronon fears the Wraith most likely due to being a Runner for 7 years. Being a doctor to me it make sense that Beckett's greatest fear would be losing a patient. A fear that is probably a reality a lot of times. That is why I liked these two red shirts in the episode. It was interesting seeing their status as dead or alive really tore at Beckett. McKay's ego I think really affected his fear. McKay holds himself to such a high standard that he doesn't like to failure (look at Trinity). The fear of not shutting off the Wraith machine was McKay's fear. Speaking of the Wraith machine the plot is kind of weak. The machine is obvioulsy a plot device to explore the machine and when the climax comes Rodney was magically close to turning it off. But it is not something I am going to heavily criticized as it was obvious that was an episode to explore the characters (except Teyla sadly). Although I have to wonder why at the end Weir had them wait for the Daedalus. The area around the Stargate was big enough for a Puddle Jumper

big will
August 18th, 2012, 08:09 PM
i like phantoms it's a good episode. and john's line im sorry for shooting everyone is classic.

Matt G
August 19th, 2012, 03:45 PM
Midweek...another ep of Atlantis...

1. Well I sort of knew all the highlights of this ep...was sort of waiting for the next moment...

2. Forgot about 'Brasso' dragging Beckett away...

3. Sheppard thought he was in the Afghan desert...what did he think he was looking for...?

OK ep.

Jae'a
September 3rd, 2012, 03:05 PM
My LiveJournal post (http://jo-r-lee.livejournal.com/69772.html)
Wow, good Shep ep. :)

Baron Of Hell
August 28th, 2013, 06:13 AM
Really liked this one. Beckett’s story was creepy and got to me the most. Ronin vs Shep was predictable but still good to watch. Nice seeing the super soldiers from SG1.

We always get a few of these things aint what they seem episodes. This was one of the better ones.

Lunaeclipse
September 2nd, 2013, 02:44 PM
Rodney: [third time] "You shot me."
Sheppard: [exasperated] "Yes, Rodney, I shot you, and I said I was sorry."
Ronon: "You shot me, too."
Sheppard: "I'm sorry for shooting everyone!"

This quote is one of my favs of the show... This ep has suspense, humour and action all cohabiting nicely. One of my favourites. :)

mrscopterdoc
August 20th, 2014, 06:02 PM
Rodney: [third time] "You shot me."
Sheppard: [exasperated] "Yes, Rodney, I shot you, and I said I was sorry."
Ronon: "You shot me, too."
Sheppard: "I'm sorry for shooting everyone!"

This quote is one of my favs of the show... This ep has suspense, humour and action all cohabiting nicely. One of my favourites. :)
That is a very good [and funny] quote!